# Ear infection - Vet stumped



## OriginalUsername (Apr 22, 2011)

Hi guys, 

This is my first post on the forum so apologies if it's not in the right place.

I have an 8 month old Standard who has had an ear problem since we got her at 4months. The infection was treated by our vet and seemed to go away but in the last 2 months, she's gotten it again. 

The vet has put her on medication and ear drops, flushed her ears about 7 or 8 times and done a swab. The results from the swab came back negative for any problems. Yet she still has this problem. And neither vet in the practice has a clue why! They are completely stumped as to why such a young dog would have this problem with her ears. 

Has anyone here had similar problems and if so, did you ever find the root of the issue? 

Thanks


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## ArreauStandardPoodle (Sep 1, 2009)

Sounds like a food issue to me. Maybe try changing to grain free, corn free, chicken free food and see if this helps. I have heard of lots of Poos with food sensitivities having ear problems. In the meantime, you can make this yourself.
Blue Power Homemade Dog Ear Cleaner | eHow.com
The gentian violet is what they use to treat thrush, and if you clean the ears out a couple of times a week with this, you may be able to keep the problems at bay.


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## OriginalUsername (Apr 22, 2011)

Thanks for the reply

I asked him if it could be a food related problem and he said it more than likely isn't. He said at her age, she shouldn't have allergies yet, that allergies only show up when the dog is older. He said I can buy a prescription food from them if I want but it would take 4 months to know for sure if the food was the problem, and it's unlikely according to him. (She's on science plan puppy at the moment)

She's up there at the moment getting her ears flushed again because they were fairly grubby and smelly again. (only been 4 days since they were last flushed!!) The poor thing hates going up there now (I have to drag her into the examination room) and doesn't like us petting her head anymore


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## ArreauStandardPoodle (Sep 1, 2009)

The age thing is simply not true. Plumcrazy, our moderator here has one of my puppies and her ears have always been an issue. She has changed the food several times and is seeing a naturopath for dogs. If you PM her, I am sure she'd be happy to give you info on what she has learned through all of this. But Lucy's issues began when she was younger than your dog.


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## LEUllman (Feb 1, 2010)

Sorry, but anything a vet tells you about food should be taken with huge grain of salt. "Prescription food," indeed! If you hang out on this forum for a while, you will read many stories about vets recommending food that, well, shouldn't be fed to a dog. Why? Because they get paid to sell it! You'll also read many stories about how changing to a quality, grain-free diet -- or better yet, to a raw diet -- results in major improvements in a dog's health, particularly where mysterious skin and ear issues just like your pup's are involved. You really have nothing to lose by trying it, and a lot to gain.


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## spoowhisperer (Apr 26, 2010)

When your continuing to have issues, vet bills pile up, please try another food as others have said. My female has had ear issues from puppy on, MEGA hard core drugs, specialists, prescription food, coat turned to crap from all the steroids,... I had had it and quit the drugs (I did let my vet know). I took her off the hills prescription food and started her on Taste of the Wild Roasted Bison & Roasted Venison. I also requested (demanded) that her thyroid be tested. Was told that she was to young to have thyroid issues, but guess what, she did. So thyroid meds for 4 months, then went off of them. Took her back to the vet and said she is off meds, was appropriately questioned about it, had her levels checked and ta dah... her levels were normal!
My point in sharing this is not to bash vets, but to know that sometimes you do have to do some research on your own, and at times have to push for better answers when your not getting them. Try a good grain free food, whats to lose except maybe those ear infections! : )


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## CelticKitti (Jul 1, 2010)

Kodi had ear problems from the time he was a few months old that were food allergy related. I'd bite the bullet and get her off grains and chicken which are the most common allergen and see what happens. I buy my food from a locally owned holistic pet store. I went in 2 years ago and told them what I was looking for and the staff was more than happy to give me options.

Here are two websites that I like and used when researching Kodi's last food change. I try to stick to 4 star foods or better. 

Dry Dog Food Reviews | Dog Food Advisor
Dog Food Reviews - Main Index - Powered by ReviewPost

Make sure everything is grain and chicken free. Treats and everything. It has made a big difference in Kodi's ears. Once you get them clean if you want to determine exactly what the allergy is you can add food back. But I have decided it's easier to just stick with what is working.


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## Jessie's Mom (Mar 23, 2010)

jessie has had ear problems since i got her @ 10 weeks old, so like arreau said, forget that point the vet made. secondly, about it being food related, not necessarily so. my vet told me if it were food related, there would be other issues like scratching, hot spots, etc. i worked for a vet for many years as a tech and i can tell you spoowhisperer is 100% in saying the food they recommend is mostly because they make money on it - it's not because it is your only alternative. try the grain free, maybe it will work for your spoo. 

in jessie's case, it's not the food, it's not a bacteria, they believe it could be a yeast type infection which makes sense since the inside of the ear is a perfect breeding place for it. plumcrazy did share some of what she learned about lucy's ears with me and one thing stands out to me quite a bit. she had lucy evaluated and was told she was a "warm" dog as opposed to a "cool dog" and she shared with me how they decipher that. i believe in my dog's case she is a "warm" dog, several things are evident that point in that direction. just like some people feel warmer than other because of their body chemistry, so the same with dogs. 

i have accepted there is no cure for jessie's ear and that could be the same for pup. now i clean them at least twice a week, alternating between an ear wash that i massage into her ears, let her shake her head, then dry out what i can with cotton balls and swabs and using mineral oil which will soften some of the gunk so it comes out easier and is less uncomfortable for them. i do not pour the mineral oil into the ear - i apply it onto the cotton swab.

i guess the bottom line suggestion is don't make yourself crazy. if you can get it under control with the help of some topical medication and ear cleaning, then just stay on top of it.


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## Siskojan (Mar 13, 2011)

Sisko has had troublesome ears since he was tiny. He has environmental allergies we think- gets red spots on his belly after going through the bushes, but everything has been better since being off all chicken. He gets Evo salmon and herring kibble + some canned salmon and herring (or venison as well now) and is doing really well with his skin and ears. The vet said to go on to an "unusual protein" - one his system wasn't already familiar with and stick to it religiously for 3 months with no deviation to give him a chance to clear up. We were really strict and he did get much better. He loves this stinky fishy food so it worked out well and his poop is great too. 
That warm dog thing is interesting as I have noted what a hot dog he is, hated being confined in a crate, likes to spread out, needs to go lie on the frosty grass etc. He is also hard to keep weight on and just seems to have a revved up metabolism.


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## Jessie's Mom (Mar 23, 2010)

Siskojan said:


> That warm dog thing is interesting as I have noted what a hot dog he is, hated being confined in a crate, likes to spread out, needs to go lie on the frosty grass etc. He is also hard to keep weight on and just seems to have a revved up metabolism.


i don't want to misquote plumcrazy, but i remember some of the things she mentioned i really felt pertain to jessie, too. for instance, she can't sleep in a warm area unless the weather is REALLY cold, i notice that she seems hotter, harder to cool down, than other dogs after exercising almost like she started out body temp warmer than them to start with. who knows, it could all be a part of what causes the problem, like i said, we just have to be in tune with our spoos and do the best we can for them.


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## FozziesMom (Jun 23, 2010)

Hi, my mini poo Fozzie has not had ear problems, but my cat has had them off and on for over a decade. Couple thoughts:

1. The raw food in my experience helped a lot, slowed down the intensity
2. make sure your dog is tested for yeast as well as fungus and bacteria. any one or a combination can cause the problem. 
3. My cat had huge wax plugs in her ears (the vet said the consistency of hard candle wax) that were only found when she was sedated for a teeth cleaning. For two weeks I had to dissolve the plugs with this stuff every night (which as you can imagine itched her like crazy--poor thing). But then early this week my vet was able to remove the plugs by lightly sedating her and flushing it all out. She's now on a post treatment antibiotic nightly for 10 days-2 weeks then in for a recheck. The vet had no doubt the plugs were causing a recurring infection. Because each treatment would improve the situation then it would come back.
4. don't give up!

maybe we'll have to go to a nightly flushing of the ears to prevent future build up, not sure. just wanted to tell you another story that might help.


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## Sookster (Apr 11, 2011)

OriginalUsername said:


> Thanks for the reply
> 
> I asked him if it could be a food related problem and he said it more than likely isn't. He said at her age, she shouldn't have allergies yet, that allergies only show up when the dog is older. He said I can buy a prescription food from them if I want but it would take 4 months to know for sure if the food was the problem, and it's unlikely according to him. (She's on science plan puppy at the moment)


We got my bf's lab at 10 weeks old, and even at that age he was showing signs of food allergies. The vets insisted for 9 months that it wasn't the food, there was no way it could be the food (he was eating IAMS puppy food). Well, it was the food. At 9 months we switched him to a corn-free food and VIOLA! All his problems went away. After 9 months of constant ear and skin infections couple with vomiting and diarrhea, what seemed like dozens of trips to the vet and rounds of meds and antibiotics didn't work. A food change did. You have NOTHING to loose by trying a better food (as mentioned before, corn-free, grain-free, chicken-free as these are the number one causes of food allergies). Steer clear of the veterinary diets. As someone who has worked in the veterinary field I can vouch for how under-educated veterinarians are when it comes to food. 

Good luck with your baby, and I hope that you can find something that offers her some relief.


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## Curlydogs (Jun 28, 2010)

Cosmo had recurring ear problems for the first few years of his life. We started keeping his ear hair on the shorter side (shaved inside and maybe 2" long outer ear hair) and it made all the difference in the world. The increased air-flow, plus a fish-based (chicken, corn, and wheat free) diet has seemed to solve the problem.

Good luck with your girl's ears.


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## OriginalUsername (Apr 22, 2011)

Hi everyone, 

Thanks so much for your replies. It's really interesting to hear that lots of your spoos have had ear problem when they were younger than Baliw. 

I've switched her onto a new food, Real Nature-Black Angus. I chose this food after speaking to a few people who work in the pet shop, one breeds and shows Boxers, and they all swear by it. Her general health seems to be much better on that food, for example she's gone from needing be let outside every two hours to every four or five hours, and she seems much brighter in herself. She also seems to eat her food gradually through the day rather than wolfing it down and doesn't seem as hungry. Interestingly, when I was switching from Hill's and mixing the two for a few days, she would only eat the new food and left the Hill's in her bowl!  I'm not sure what the grain content of this food is but it seems to suit her so far. 

I'm not sure where we stand on the ear problem. She's on new ear drops and the vet said her ears are much better than before, but they're still not 100% better. She's much happier allowing us to touch her ears now so I don't think they're as painful as before. They do seem really hot though - is this normal for spoos (we had a border collie before) ? Luckily we bought pet insurance for her as soon as we got her so most of the costs are going to be covered thank god because I feel like I'm living up in the vets these days!

I'm thinking about getting a second opinion elsewhere but he has been our vet for the last 10 years and was amazing with our last dog, couldn't have treated him better when he was PTS so I'd feel a bit guilty going to another clinic. That said, I don't want to compromise Baliw's health because of loyalties. 

One major concern of mine is that this could cause hearing problems. She seems to have issues working out where sounds are coming from. I'm not sure if this is just because of her age and she needs to learn that kind of thing. She also is slow to respond to calling or whistling, but I'm hoping this is just because she's found something more interesting that her owner! She has no trouble hearing us up close. 

Thanks again for the replies!


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## Rowan (May 27, 2011)

I just saw this and figured I'd add my two cents. Both the senior poodles I adopted had ear infections and both cleared up not long after I adopted them. My vet was certain it was dietary (I fed them a home cooked diet and premium, organic dog foods). One was a diabetic so his diet was strictly regulated, and the other had 'red' patches on his fur from whatever food colorings were in his previous diet. 

So I second ArreauStandardPoodle--these things are often food-related. On a side note, my sister's mini has a protein issue (can't eat chicken). They're just like people in many ways.


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## Aidan (Mar 4, 2009)

Would you go to your normal family doctor if you have specific questions about diet or nutrition? No.. you would go to someone qualified in diet and nutrition or a nutritionist.

The same should apply to your pets. Vets know jack about dog food..and if they do know better they aren't going to say anything. Brands like Science Diet often pay vet companies to sell their product..in fact science diet pays for/sponsors many vet training hospitals...so it's no surprise that the first thing a vet wants to put most dogs on is science diet. It's a crap food. Don't waste your money. 

I don't know specifically what you're feeding..but switching to a grain free really can help with ears and other skin issues. It can also change several problems..bad breath, tear stains, smelly feces..yes all poop smells but a dog on a grain free diet it doesn't smell nearly as bad. You can also help eliminate or reduce gas by switching to a better diet.

I hope the problem goes away! I know those ear issues can be hard on dogs. If someone hasn't already mentioned you can also add yogurt or put your dog on probiotics. It's supposed to help.


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## Aidan (Mar 4, 2009)

Also I just want to show these photos of a foster dog. Since he was 5 months old he had severe skin issues. His previous owners tried vet after vet. they had him on expensive science diet food.. they tried skin scrapings looking for mange and all came back negative. He ended up getting tossed in a shelter. Well, I happened to be at the shelter doing some volunteer dog grooming.. I saw him and brought him home. I have a soft spot in my heart for German Shepherds. I figured I could front the money to get him fixed up and find him a great forever home. The shelter had all his vet and medical records and said his previous family just "gave up" and were tired of spending money on him.

I spent... 1 vet visit to pick up some antibiotics
a few bags of taste of the wild from a local pet supply store...
some fish oil... the ingredients to make "satin balls" to help him gain weight..

and this took place over 3 months. He was almost a year when I got him..so for most of his life he had severe skin issues and 3 months on good food and it all went away.

He now lives with a wonderful family about an hour away. They often send me updates on him. His name is Tyson.


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## Rowan (May 27, 2011)

Aidan said:


> Also I just want to show these photos of a foster dog. Since he was 5 months old he had severe skin issues. His previous owners tried vet after vet. they had him on expensive science diet food.. they tried skin scrapings looking for mange and all came back negative. He ended up getting tossed in a shelter. Well, I happened to be at the shelter doing some volunteer dog grooming.. I saw him and brought him home. I have a soft spot in my heart for German Shepherds. I figured I could front the money to get him fixed up and find him a great forever home. The shelter had all his vet and medical records and said his previous family just "gave up" and were tired of spending money on him.
> 
> I spent... 1 vet visit to pick up some antibiotics
> a few bags of taste of the wild from a local pet supply store...
> ...


My rescue experience was similar--poodles in horrific condition due to eating 'garbage' dog food full of fillers, dyes and other waste (JUNK). Switching to a home-cooked diet with supplements worked wonders, and in a relatively short time. The transformations were nothing short of amazing. I'm also very fortunate in that I have a vet who specializes in holistic medicine and is very supportive of the home-cooked / holistic diets.


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## Apres Argent (Aug 9, 2010)

*Hemopet/Dr. Dodds*

Allergy testing.

Dr. Jean Dodds - Canine Thyroid Testing | Hemopet.org


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## littlestitches (Dec 28, 2009)

Aidan said:


> Also I just want to show these photos of a foster dog. Since he was 5 months old he had severe skin issues. His previous owners tried vet after vet. they had him on expensive science diet food.. they tried skin scrapings looking for mange and all came back negative. He ended up getting tossed in a shelter. Well, I happened to be at the shelter doing some volunteer dog grooming.. I saw him and brought him home. I have a soft spot in my heart for German Shepherds. I figured I could front the money to get him fixed up and find him a great forever home. The shelter had all his vet and medical records and said his previous family just "gave up" and were tired of spending money on him.
> 
> I spent... 1 vet visit to pick up some antibiotics
> a few bags of taste of the wild from a local pet supply store...
> ...


Those pictures made me cry, the poor, poor boy! You certainly are his angel to have taken him in and helped him. :angel:

I am taking notes about food for when we get our spoo.

Paula


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## Kloliver (Jan 17, 2012)

> The age thing is simply not true. Plumcrazy, our moderator here has one of my puppies and her ears have always been an issue. She has changed the food several times and is seeing a naturopath for dogs. If you PM her, I am sure she'd be happy to give you info on what she has learned through all of this. But Lucy's issues began when she was younger than your dog.


I agree!!! Rango's one ear started showing symptoms as early as 6 months, so no cheese down that tunnel. He went to the regular vet (love them but.....) they gave me Mometamax & Epi-Otic flush. Not bad results for 3-4 weeks..... then his WORST flareup yet. Went back, was charged _*another*_ $90 for the exact same advice/ course of treatment. :banghead:

Fool me once, same on you, fool me twice.... you get the idea? I saw how this was going- not well. I booked him immediately with the local guru (NaturaVet) of diets & allergic reactions. One session with her & not one full week later, he is improved 100%. All by removing foods from his diet.

If you wld like to speak via PM or phone I'd be happy to discuss this in depth.

BTW, Rango had already been on _uber_ high quality foods so its the ingredient profile more than anything else. Doesn't matter if it's expensive or organic [insert whatever ingredient here]; a food sensitivity is a food sensitivity.


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## Kloliver (Jan 17, 2012)

*Update*

Rango's ears are absolutely beautiful; a healthy creamy pink- no odour, discharge or itchiness. His groomer was amazed at the difference. Rango goes in for his 6 wk allergy re-test at month end &, regardless if his sensitivities have diminished, I will continue to feed a ground raw diet. I am looking into purchasing a commercial grinder as commercial raw is wayyyyy more expensive in the long run. That will mean the additional purchase of a chest freezer but since we plan on getting a second Spoo in the next coupla, it just makes sense. 

How are you making out?


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## CT Girl (Nov 17, 2010)

Aiden, to see the transformation that GSD had was amazing. The poor dog must have been in such misery and now he is happy, healthy and in a good home all thanks to you. When I first got Swizzle he was on horrible puppy food and he had a brown discharge in his ears. The vet examined him and he did not have an infection and she gave him cleaner. I changed him to raw and the groomer plucks his ears and they have stayed clean as a whistle.


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