# Jealous Dogs?



## Rachel76 (Feb 3, 2014)

I admit right away I am no scientist. I read the article and to me it sounds like resource guarding and not actual proof of jealousy.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

i also read the article. good point, rachel76. i am open to the possibility that resource guarding and jealousy are labels created by humans that may or may not accurately describe what could be the same phenomenon. 

of course, extrapolating from dogs to humans is also interesting. would we label that canidomorphizing?


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

It darn well could be. Why not? I think dogs have a rich emotional life. Their emotions may be somewhat different from ours on account of the fact that they're dogs and the way they experience life is from a little different angle. But we see love, sadness, depression, grief, anger and so many emotions in them. It could be splitting hairs to think of this as resource guarding or jealousy. Maybe it's one in the same? Almost?

When I want to play with or pay attention to Maurice and Matisse is happily playing with a toy, he'll stop what he's doing and rush over and get in my face, try to be the center of attention. I pretty much have to pick Maurice up if I want to love on him without Matisse honing in on the action. I need to teach Matisse that it's not always about him. lol. He's never aggressive in an ornery way. He's just pushy and excitable, sure that the world wants to play with him always, his tail is going like a blur and he's just ecstatic about any prospect of a new game where he's very involved. So, he has to learn that the pushiness will get him nowhere. It just hasn't sunken in yet. lol.

There's one emotion I have a hard time thinking they feel and that is guilt. Guilt requires a pretty high level of cognition and awareness....in that they have to think about what the other is feeling and thinking in logical terms...an empathy like ours...something I don't think dogs do to a detailed extent. I think they have empathy at some kind of rudimentary level. So, I'm not sure about that one.


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## Rachel76 (Feb 3, 2014)

Countryboy, thanks for posting this and getting an interesting thread going.

Patk, I love the idea of candiomorphizing.

Poodlebeguiled, I can see your point about splitting hairs....now that I'm thinking about examples of jealousy and resource guarding there seem to be more similarities than differences.


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## Countryboy (May 16, 2011)

When I posted yesterday, I went to check the look of the link in the OP and clicked on Submit by accident. But I did want to go on to say that Tonka shows no jealousy at all. He doesn't seem to care what people are doing. 

And, considering we're dealing with the minds of a two-year old, I wonder if their feelings are much more general than 'jealousy' or 'guarding'. My bet it would be more of a fuzzy I-don't-like-what's-going-on-here.

I don't necessarily subscribe to the simple hierarchical model of dogs in a pack. In a hierarchical model there's a Top Dog and a Bottom Dog, and everyone else lies between. In my model, it may be more of a sense of 'place'... who gets to associate with whom... or what relationships are 'normal' within the pack, and what relationships are 'out of line'. 

And definitely, in a dog's mind, there must be a certain association with people and dogs that they do know, and a different attitude to 'strangers'.

So it may be that they're simply reacting to situations that they judge, within the normal interactions of the pack, to be wrong. Who knows, eh?


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

cb, i hope i'm not mischaracterizing her point of view, but patricia mcconnell speaks of status rather than hierarchy among dogs - and points out that it may vary in given situations. she also has an interesting story about how her lowest status dog managed to beg a pork chop away from her highest status dog via total obsequious, pleading behavior. there's a lot we don't know about ourselves and i suspect we know even less about our dogs. but it seems to be human nature to assume that every time we slap a label on a behavior that means we understand it. well i guess we have to have some way to communicate - but it's a lot cruder than we think it is. probably our dogs are better than we are at understanding humans because they don't get fooled by words - they pick up tone of voice, body language, facial stress signals. if dogs could write articles on jealousy in humans...


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## PoodlePaws (May 28, 2013)

My tpoos get jealous of each other. And they don't like my 5 year old sitting in my lap either. 


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## Bellesdad0417 (May 18, 2014)

Just today there is a article on CNN about this 

Study: Dogs can feel jealous, too - CNN.com


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

I can't speak to exactly what my dogs are feeling, but it sure looks to me like Jazz's panties, if she wore panties, would be in a wad over the puppy. She won't sit on my lap anymore. (Blue, on the other hand, will struggle to get into my lap if I'm encouraging Jazz to hop up.) She isn't obeying commands with alacrity, although she does eventually get around to it. When Blue is crated, she delights in finding one of his favorite toys, usually a Nylabone, and lying down right next to the crate while she chews on it and he grumbles. When we play Frisbee, it's been her practice to alternate taking it to me and then to Rich. If we point or tell her to "take it to (whoever)," she'll break her routine and take it to the same person twice. No more. She will hardly bring it to me at all, even if Rich tells her to, even if I'm calling her to bring it to me.

On the bright side, they don't fight at all, and they are playing together nicely most of the time. Blue's finally big enough to keep up with her, so they enjoy playing chase. I need to spend more time with Jazz, who has, truth be told, been somewhat ignored in the past couple of months.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

judy d, thanks for sharing. i'm sure you and jazz will get back on track. but there is a reason dog people say having a dog is like having a two year old for the life of the dog. this just proves poodles are people, too!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

The paper is very interesting. 

If I had a dollar for every time that Lily gave me the poodle snoot or otherwise tried to get between me and Peeves when I do things with him I would have a nice pile of money (at least enough to take a couple of friends out for nice steak dinners). She definitely shows the behaviors that were interpreted as showing jealousy. Peeves does not. In terms of social status in our household, she is "top dog."


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## Countryboy (May 16, 2011)

Now here's a funny one... a little experiment at the park yesterday. 

Tonka paid no attention to me having Champ in a gentle headlock, in my lap, and rubbing his ears. But then Champ was lying under his owners chair, in the shade, when I did the same to Tonka. The reaction was immediate. He came out from under the chair and straight at Tonka. And the chase was on. 

It's gonna take me a while to suss that out. :confused3: lol


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