# First Heat - Not prepared!



## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

Definitely cancel the class. Plan exercise to avoid meeting off leash entire male dogs, and be prepared for any local ones to follow you home or turn up and camp on your doorstep (this was more of a problem back in the days when dogs roamed free, but can still happen). Keep her on leash - everyone knows males roam to find a mate, but females will too - as I discovered as I pursued a very young, very determined Sophy when she set off down the road to call on the terrier at the farm.

The blood stained discharge will gradually turn more straw coloured. Typically the most fertile time is around day 9, counting the first day of bleeding as day 1, and she should be through the whole thing around day 20. Dogs vary, however, so err on the side of caution. Panties and pads can be a great help in avoiding drips and stains, but don't rely on them to prevent mating.

Pseudopregnancy is extremely common in dogs - their hormones will tell them they are pregnant following a season whether or not they have mated. Don't be surprised if after six or seven weeks she makes a nest of toys and protects them, and even produces milk. It is generally considered inadvisable to spay during a false pregnancy as it can extend the time it takes to go away, so you may want to talk to your vet about the best timing a little later on.

This is a reasonably complete and sensible article: Female Dogs in Heat - zooplus Magazine


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Thank you so much, fjm! This is all so helpful. 

I guess that means we should cancel next week's class, too? It would fall on day 10.

(Love picturing Sophy trotting off to meet her suitor!)


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

Best to cancel the next two, I would say, just to be safe.


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## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

Good luck! You will get through it! I would cancel classes for the next two weeks for sure, and maybe three weeks. I went through a first heat cycle with a foster dog that I had before Misha. It was worse than expected in some ways, as I found out that a first heat cycle can be very atypical. Definitely get her some good panties that fit well as the discharge will probably get worse. It starts out thicker with more blood, but then will get much more watery in consistency and turn pale in color. It will also smell horrendous, which for me is a big reason to keep the panties on!

They do have mood swings and they do feel more anxious than normal. The dog I had was already a nervous dog, and the mood swings were really bad. You may want to avoid anything that Peggy feels very uncomfortable about, as she will likely feel more anxious than normal. I did not experience any neighborhood dogs coming by or following, but there generally aren't off leash dogs where I live. Discharge and swelling can last up to four weeks, but the receptive window is much shorter.

As far as scheduling the spay, how old is she? Generally you want to wait a bit after the heat for the spay from what I've heard.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Thank you for that helpful input! For now, I'll cancel this week's class, as well as next week's, which is unfortunately the first of a new session. Hoping she'll be ready to jump in the week after.

What sort of smell should I expect?? The blood right now is bright red. I thought she was injured.

She was definitely acting funny last night, bringing out her "babies" which are two stuffed toys and a pillow. They ALWAYS stay in her pen or crate, and she's been very gentle with them since she was a puppy. But then last night she was whipping them all around and insisting they go with her everywhere. It was so strange. I'd put them back and she'd race to grab them again.

And then this morning she launched into full-blown hysterics when the FedEx man came to the door. She's never done that before. Eeeeesh. Teenagers!



Raindrops said:


> As far as scheduling the spay, how old is she?


She's 8.5 months old. 

We'll be travelling in early June so that's a factor now. I'd prefer she not be in heat during an extended stay with a dogsitter. Unfortunately she's being watched by one this weekend, but only for one night. And it'll be at our house, so (hoping) not too traumatic.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

"Tell me again why I must wear this silly diaper? I am NOT a baby."


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## Streetcar (Apr 13, 2014)

She may be more touchy and...bitchy right now. It's hormones. My Annabelle got a bit defiant (in a nice way) and needed to stay on leash for even the briefest outings.

I could tell she didn't feel right, but heck. I totally understand and sympathize about PMS.

Keep things easy as possible for her for a few weeks. You'll be fine. I never had issues with other dogs, but we don't have loose ones around.

Someone here wrote about spay timing and heat one time. I seem to recall something about spacing it about 3 months after a heat cycle concludes.


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## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

She is so cute in her diaper! Just keep telling her how pretty she is and I'm sure she'll be fine  The barking at Fedex guy sounds like what I'd expect though.

The smell was kind of a fishy smell. The intensity may vary from dog to dog though. It didn't smell bad until the consistency changed.

I think most dogs have two heats a year, so my guess is she's more likely to go back into heat around August, but if you want to avoid any chance of it occurring in June you could schedule spay for May and then she'd be close to a year and likely fully grown.


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## Asta's Mom (Aug 20, 2014)

Peggy's pantis are so cute. No information, but hope that the next few weeks go well for you both.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Asta's Mom said:


> Peggy's pantis are so cute. No information, but hope that the next few weeks go well for you both.


Thank you! They're toddler's pull-ups with a hole cut out for her tail. ?

They have Minnie Mouse on them, which seemed fitting. (I wanted very badly to call her Minnie when we brought her home, but couldn't convince my husband.)


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Well this has been unexpectedly very pleasant so far! We even took a 2-hour nap together yesterday, which is a rare and special thing. Peggy pressed close to me the whole time.

What's mystifying, though, is she has no interest in her beloved tennis balls. She's not initiated a single game of indoor fetch in 24 hours. Unheard of! It's like she's suddenly too grown up. All she really wants to do is lay with her head in my lap, _unless_ I bring out the flirt pole. That still gets her attention.


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## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

PeggyTheParti said:


> Well this has been unexpectedly very pleasant so far! We even took a 2-hour nap together yesterday, which is a rare and special thing. Peggy pressed close to me the whole time.
> 
> What's mystifying, though, is she has no interest in her beloved tennis balls. She's not initiated a single game of indoor fetch in 24 hours. Unheard of! It's like she's suddenly too grown up. All she really wants to do is lay with her head in my lap, _unless_ I bring out the flirt pole. That still gets her attention.


Don't worry, I found her fetch drive. It has transferred to Misha who must have brought me his alligator toy to throw a hundred times last night.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Raindrops said:


> Don't worry, I found her fetch drive. It has transferred to Misha who must have brought me his alligator toy to throw a hundred times last night.


Oh good! Glad it's being put to good use. ?

Our very first flirt pole arrived this week, so we've at least been able to exercise her somewhat. Except she's trying out a new technique today, in which she just casually carries her frisbee around, doing the doggy equivalent of whistling at the sky, until the poor critter at the end of the pole let its guard down and she can pounce.

A lazy dog's guide to the flirt pole!


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## susan Davis (Jan 28, 2020)

I would wait until late April or May to spay her. That gives her time to heal and you won't have to worry on your vacation. She does look so cute in her 'panties'!


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## kontiki (Apr 6, 2013)

Do not even let her out in a fenced yard off leash!! Many male neutered dogs will do anything to get to a female in heat. Yikes, I have some horrible stories. Dogs leaping up at the windows, chasing my car, pouncing on her while I was taking her to the car, etc.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

kontiki said:


> Do not even let her out in a fenced yard off leash!! Many male neutered dogs will do anything to get to a female in heat. Yikes, I have some horrible stories. Dogs leaping up at the windows, chasing my car, pouncing on her while I was taking her to the car, etc.


That's scary! We've not had any encounters yet, but we're being vigilant.


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## Vee (Mar 2, 2018)

Aww Peggy's little nappy how cute! Next week will be when shes approaching ovulation and will except a male so definitely cancel her plans that involves other dogs. If possible walk her where dogs are on leads. I've had a dog appear from nowhere out of trees in a quiet place I thought was 'safe' and dog free. Luckily I could lift my girl up but I've heard of similar incidents and it's ended not so well


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

Things are much, much easier here in the UK now than they were when I was a child, more than 50 years ago. I remember coming back from walking our family poodle carrying her, with one suitor vigorously humping my leg while three others jumped around us trying to reach her. Her best friend, the collie cross from the farm, camped out in the front garden even in the depths of winter - he would lie there covered in snow, only his nose and eyes showing as he gazed fixedly at the front door. These days most of the dogs we meet are either neutered or have very little idea what it is all about, and the few that do know that there is no point getting enthusiastic until the right few days. But I still think better safe than sorry!


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

fjm, what a picture your words paint! And vee, Peggy says thank you. Her crinkling around the house cracks me up.

My worry right now is that we have our first ever dogsitter staying over this weekend. Between the mess and the worries about romancing... 

Plus the very odd temperament!

I'm going to be a nervous wreck. 

At least our sitter reassured us it's not a problem. I'm hoping Peggy really lays the hormonal affection on thick so she falls in love with her and forgives the inconvenience. 

Peggy also has a grooming scheduled for next Saturday. I guess I need to cancel that? I read that bacteria can pass up into the uterus and cause dangerous infection, so bathing's not advised.


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## Newport (Jul 16, 2014)

PeggyTheParti said:


> Peggy also has a grooming scheduled for next Saturday. I guess I need to cancel that? I read that bacteria can pass up into the uterus and cause dangerous infection, so bathing's not advised.


PeggyTP, I've learned a lot from this whole thread. Thanks for being point man on this crazy girl dog journey! I'm making a note to avoid bathing...


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Newport said:


> PeggyTP, I've learned a lot from this whole thread. Thanks for being point man on this crazy girl dog journey! I'm making a note to avoid bathing...


Ha! Happy to help. It's not been too bad so far.

But to complicate things, our groomer said it's no problem to groom Peggy while she's in heat, and that she does it all the time. Always hard to know who to listen to.


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## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

I can see why you are concerned. I can also see why your groomer says not to worry. Immersing the dog in water, like you would do if you were bathing in a wash tub or something, would be a very easy way to introduce dirty water into the vulva. However, most groomers dont soak dogs in laundry tubs. They use hoses and can control where the water goes.

My concern would be a bitch in heat stressing out the other dogs in the shop. I think it would be very impolite to surprise an unsuspecting groomer with a birch in heat. However, since your groomer knows what she's getting and is cool with it, I think you are fine.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

cowpony said:


> I can see why you are concerned. I can also see why your groomer says not to worry. Immersing the dog in water, like you would do if you were bathing in a wash tub or something, would be a very easy way to introduce dirty water into the vulva. However, most groomers dont soak dogs in laundry tubs. They use hoses and can control where the water goes.
> 
> My concern would be a bitch in heat stressing out the other dogs in the shop. I think it would be very impolite to surprise an unsuspecting groomer with a birch in heat. However, since your groomer knows what she's getting and is cool with it, I think you are fine.


Very good points! Thanks for putting my mind at ease.


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## susan Davis (Jan 28, 2020)

I'd wait until she is fully OUT^ of heat. Just for sanitary reasons. Why leave a lingering 'interesting to males' scent on her?? jmo


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

Wow, I didn’t know that baths might be risky! The bright spot is that you now know she’s sexually mature and can confidently spay her.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

susan Davis said:


> I'd wait until she is fully OUT^ of heat. Just for sanitary reasons. Why leave a lingering 'interesting to males' scent on her?? jmo


Very true. I'll be sure to thoroughly bathe her myself once she's done.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Carolinek said:


> Wow, I didn’t know that baths might be risky! The bright spot is that you now know she’s sexually mature and can confidently spay her.


Yes! Will be happy to get that over with. I get so nervous when my dogs are put under anaesthesia.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Update: Peggy's bloody discharge has turned watery, but she's still being a cuddly, slightly sleepy, very grown-up seeming poodle. I hope this lasts!

Aside from an escalation in her jumpy protectiveness while at home, she's really been quite the dream dog.

I'm considering letting her go through a second heat to ensure she's fully matured before spaying.


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## EVpoodle (Sep 25, 2018)

That sounds lovely, when Evie was in heat she turned not cuddly at all just watchful. 
That is what we are doing with Evie.


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## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

PeggyTheParti said:


> Update: Peggy's bloody discharge has turned watery, but she's still being a cuddly, slightly sleepy, very grown-up seeming poodle. I hope this lasts!
> 
> Aside from an escalation in her jumpy protectiveness while at home, she's really been quite the dream dog.
> 
> I'm considering letting her go through a second heat to ensure she's fully matured before spaying.


Good to hear! Poodle cuddles are the best. I think that could be a good idea for a larger dog like a spoo. Especially since her first heat was pretty early.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

EVpoodle said:


> That sounds lovely, when Evie was in heat she turned not cuddly at all just watchful.
> That is what we are doing with Evie.


Peggy got _super_ barky in the couple of weeks before her heat cycle started. I was going nuts! So I feel like I really deserve the reward of this cuddly time. ?


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Raindrops said:


> Good to hear! Poodle cuddles are the best. I think that could be a good idea for a larger dog like a spoo. Especially since her first heat was pretty early.


It just makes it tricky to make plans. And while it's not worth compromising her health, I do hate that she's missing her weekly classes. But we just go without her so we don't fall behind and then we practise at home. 

Last week I considered just dragging her leash with me in class and seeing how long it took before someone gently pointed out that Peggy wasn't there.


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## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

PeggyTheParti said:


> Last week I considered just dragging her leash with me in class and seeing how long it took before someone gently pointed out that Peggy wasn't there.


Lol. You need one of those "invisible dog" leashes they used to sell in carnival midways.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

cowpony said:


> Lol. You need one of those "invisible dog" leashes they used to sell in carnival midways.


Yes!! I tried to explain those things to my husband and he was NOT getting it. ?


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## For Want of Poodle (Feb 25, 2019)

Got any wire - like maybe a wire coat hangar, unrolled ? Then 5 min with a needle and some thread and you could have a credible invisible-dog-on-a-leash. I'd do it  

Also - Annie's been super sucky lately. Writing this with her head on my knee, resting on my forearm as I type. I'm REALLY hoping she's not heading into her first heat.


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## susan Davis (Jan 28, 2020)

I never heard of this!! I used a string attached to the collar after I took off the regular leash. I had an Irish Setter and it worked on her. Only used it at dog obedience class.


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## For Want of Poodle (Feb 25, 2019)

susan Davis said:


> I never heard of this!! I used a string attached to the collar after I took off the regular leash. I had an Irish Setter and it worked on her. Only used it at dog obedience class.


 Susan - I think we're talking about two different things. Yours is to teach the dog to behave when it thinks it's off leash, I think? And the "invisible dog on leash" is a gag where you pretend you are walking a dog that isn't there, and make the leash stand out as if there's a dog there. You can have great fun and pretend like the invisible dog is pulling you down the street or whatever.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Haha! Yes! I'm talking about not actually having a dog with me in class, as she's in heat and unable to attend. 

Just being silly.


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## susan Davis (Jan 28, 2020)

LOL!!!! I sure 'bit' on that, didn't I??!! That would look funny, and hilarious!


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

We're 2.5 weeks in and Peggy's tail is soaked with what smells like urine. The base is shaved, but the end, which is usually fluffy, was looking quite scraggly for a few day. And then I kept thinking I smelled urine. And today I pieced it together.

I can't figure out when she'd be peeing on it. Her crate isn't wet. Maybe just very small amounts are leaking out and the tail's catching it?

Anyone else see incontinence during heat?


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

Sophy always needs to pee more often and more urgently when she is in season - it could be Peggy is dribbling a little if she is trying to hold it too long. I try to remember to let Sophy out more often, and to insist on a late trip out even if she says she doesn't need it.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Thank you, fjm. She does go quite a long time between her late-night and morning pees. I'll have my husband let her out first thing tomorrow morning rather than sneaking out quietly like he usually does.


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