# Setting the pattern



## Leooonie (May 30, 2009)

Hi... I've started cording Harleys coat, and its going well... however, I was going to have it in the coninental trim (or is it the lion? the one with no saddle pack/leg packs) 
However, I ran into difficulty... I have some questions:

where does the coat finish on the foreles, is it equal to the elbow, or below/above the elbow? 

does the back of the jacket fall ON the last rib, or behind it? 

and how far should the kidney pack pompomy bits be from the jacketys finish? ...

Harley is 18" long, so I was wondering.. would a 3" kidney patch be a good size?...

I cut it totally wrong so have to grow some bum and rib hair back before I repattern him!!!I have shirleys poodle book, but following it was difficult, having not groomed a pattern before.. and I dont feel it explained the elbow bit very well..so any diagrams or detailed explainations would be much appreciated! thank you!


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## lavillerose (Feb 16, 2011)

You might be confusing your terminology on different cuts, since it's confusing me a bit! The Continental clip does not have a "pack" or "kidney patches". That's the English Saddle, or since you're in the UK you might call it the English Lion.

The Continental does have the "rosettes", those are the two round poofs on the top of the butt, which is otherwise shaved. They go directly over the points of the hipbones, you should be able to feel the hipbones and use that as the center of the circle pattern.

The jacket usually stops right at the elbow joint, although I have seen people shave above it.

The rest is hard to tell you how to set without seeing the dog's full conformation. Whether the jacket ends at the last rib or significantly behind it has everything to do with balancing the cut. If the dog is longer than tall, the line has to be considerably behind the last rib to make up for it. The size of the rosettes also depends on the dog's build. Some dogs look better with smaller ones, some with bigger.

It's a very difficult trim to get right on each individual dog.


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## Anntig (Jun 9, 2010)

I prefer to clip the leg marginally above the elbow as the long jacket covers them anyway 
as for the back of the jacket it normally goes slightly past the last rib on a long bodied dog and the rosettes start a fingerwidth back from it on minis two fingerwidths on standards.
But as lavillerose said it varies depending on your dogs shape, you adjust it to cover any flaws and make your dog look 'correct'


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## Leooonie (May 30, 2009)

Ah yeah okay its definitely the continental then...
I think I'll leave his elbows where they are......but now I know where to start the rosettes I can give them a go in a week or so's time
Harley is very square and so I think finishing behind the rib will be good....but thanks for the advice


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## roulette (Feb 18, 2011)

Hi, I started cording my girl last year (ended up shaving her down just before she whelped a litter) but I thought that it looked more "balanced" if you shortened all your body lines, because the cords hung OVER the lines..like move the rib line forward a notch. I just thought that it looked better.. you can always start at the proper place and trim a little more from there. Hope that makes some sense..


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## spoofly (Jan 20, 2010)

I am doing the same with Fly! How long should I let her coat get before I put her into pattern? You guys should post pictures of your dogs put into a Continental pattern with a shorter coat. I'm going to attempt this myself. I just got a new set of clippers.


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## vtomblin (Jul 18, 2010)

here are some pictures for you. Nina is an inch comb all over, she is a bit long so I have set her jacket back a bit from the last rib and keep the rosettes close to the jacket. Space makes the dog look longer. Also her front poms are about an inch too low. She is Mom's dog and I'm teaching her to do the clipping between big groomings. I think its a case of a bit lower each time. 

There is also some pics of Sookie in show coat. She is nicely balanced and had a 'normal' pattern. I am still tweaking her rosettes before the show next week so might bring them up a bit from the tuck up. Hope that helps.


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## Ms Stella (Aug 16, 2010)

vtomblin said:


> here are some pictures for you. Nina is an inch comb all over, she is a bit long so I have set her jacket back a bit from the last rib and keep the rosettes close to the jacket. Space makes the dog look longer. Also her front poms are about an inch too low. She is Mom's dog and I'm teaching her to do the clipping between big groomings. I think its a case of a bit lower each time.
> 
> There is also some pics of Sookie in show coat. She is nicely balanced and had a 'normal' pattern. I am still tweaking her rosettes before the show next week so might bring them up a bit from the tuck up. Hope that helps.


I love the 4th photo...she has such a great tuck up  That is one area where Stella seems to show her age..lol Just like me  But Sookie is gorgeous.


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## spoofly (Jan 20, 2010)

Just what I was looking for. Thanks vtomblin!


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