# Switching foods to reduce scratching



## star (Feb 20, 2011)

Often chicken can be the cause of allergies but it might take more than a month to see the results. Have you tried switching shampoo? Often they can get itchy once the heat is turned on in the house. You could try a different shampoo with a moisturizing conditioner to see if that helps her. It might be a combination of things causing the itch.


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## Basil_the_Spoo (Sep 1, 2020)

We've been fortunate enough to not have any food allergies, but I've learned over time that that when I see Basil itch her ears then I need to take action and get in there with the ear solution and cotton balls. Then, her behavior stops.

I'm hoping the solution for Kali is as simple as the solution fo Basil.

She looks adorable.


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## Wooster Tim (Nov 11, 2021)

Not an expert by any measure, but the filler; grain, potatoe or rice, could actually be the culprit. Diet changes usually seem to result in changes in frequency and consistency in evacuating the bowel. Outdoor allergens could easily be the culprit or even indoor allergens. I'd probably try allergen testing. I have a neighbor that has gone through allergies with her Dalmatian. The poor dog just couldn't even rest peacefully.


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

I have a scratcher and was not able to fix things by changing diets, as much as I tried to. I really wanted to avoid the elimination diet, as I felt it was a pain (and it is, really). In the end I had to go the official route and went to see a dermatologist. We did the elimination diet and found that she was reacting to just about everything except this very specialized dog food. The one that the most allergic dogs need.

You’ll never see the end of it if your dog keeps eating stuff on the floor or other. Take your time, but eventually this will probably have to stop. Beckie can only eat a handful of foods. It breaks my heart but it is what it is.

Here is her story if you want to read it : Beckie’s allergy testing (through raw food ) journal


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Changing foods might help, especially if they have different fillers. I’d give it 6 weeks and be sure to keep daily notes.

Have you addressed possible environmental culprits like shampoos? That was Peggy’s biggest trigger, but it took months of detailed note-taking for the pattern to emerge. Our memories are just too unreliable.


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## kuriooo (Feb 17, 2010)

star said:


> Often chicken can be the cause of allergies but it might take more than a month to see the results. Have you tried switching shampoo? Often they can get itchy once the heat is turned on in the house. You could try a different shampoo with a moisturizing conditioner to see if that helps her. It might be a combination of things causing the itch.


Thanks - she is a “new to me” dog & has had ongoing ear infections for the past 4-6 weeks. The scratching doesn’t appear connected with the past grooming cycle. I’m feeding her salmon and venison liver 1-2 times a week to hopefully help with nutrition, coat. We’ve had heat on for a while since I’m originally from So Cal and like being warm. 🤣😅


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## Deere (Jun 25, 2021)

Wooster Tim said:


> Not an expert by any measure, but the filler; grain, potatoe or rice, could actually be the culprit. Diet changes usually seem to result in changes in frequency and consistency in evacuating the bowel. Outdoor allergens could easily be the culprit or even indoor allergens. I'd probably try allergen testing. I have a neighbor that has gone through allergies with her Dalmatian. The poor dog just couldn't even rest peacefully.


Yes, my girlfriend had a Cairn Terrier with severe allergies; food and environmental (Sophie was tested) also IBD. She fed Zignature variety with Kangaroo Meat.The change in Sophie after being on this brand was phenomenal. Unfortunately the company often had trouble with sourcing the kangaroo so that variety often was out for several months(without notice) at a time. She also used Royal Canine KO as a back up brand.My last Cairn Terrier had terrible allergies(food and environment) and was on Apoquel year round(whole life) when I lived in PA regardless of a hard freeze or the cold winters with day time temps below zero. I had him allergy tested then worked from the list of foods he could tolerate. I found that the Fromm brand has several different varieties of dry and the Fromm with Pork working the best for us. Their canned food comes in several varieties but is sold as a case only. The dog food is expensive but it's cheaper to buy direct from them than any other source. They used to provide a dry sample and they do sell their dry in a 5# bag. I also fed venison fresh and a dry brand after the fresh was depleted until Chronic Wasting Disease entered our area. These dog food brands are very expensive and my personal opinion is that you should have your dog tested for allergies so you know what proteins, grains and vegetables your dog is allergic to. My Cairn was very allergic to fish, corn, wheat and sweet potatoes to name a few and changing his diet was time consuming but the positive difference it made in him was worth it. I hope you can find relief for Kali and that she feels better.


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## kuriooo (Feb 17, 2010)

Thanks all, we will see if just a simple diet change helps. It sounds like elimination may not be a realistic goal for some dogs, more like management.


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## Michigan Gal (Jun 4, 2019)

I went to the Zignature website. They write that they have meat first in their formulas but don't actually list the ingredients or percentages. It is not on the dogfoodanalysis website. However, Iams is not a top dog food and I wouldn't feed it to any of my dogs, so good for switching. Giving a small bag a try is a good idea, but be open to switching again.


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## star (Feb 20, 2011)

Acana has limited ingredient foods. I've used the lamb and apple when Reuben has a upset stomach and he does well with it.


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## twyla (Apr 28, 2010)

I fed my Pia novel proteins, no chicken, beef or lamb. We tried a lot of food Pia hated kangaroo, fish worked best but only one food, Health Extension White and Buffalo a kibble eliminated her belching, belly pain, gas and diarrhea, Apoquel and bi monthly bathing helped with environmental allergies. 
For treats I use Nature's Balance limited ingredient dog biscuits, Blue Buffalo Salmon treats, for chews Himalayan yak chews and cod skins.


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## Starvt (Nov 5, 2019)

If elimination is not realistic, then you might be better off with a food that supports skin health. I've heard of lots of dogs who did really well on Hill's Derm Complete. It's egg-based, so avoids all common proteins (has some chicken flavour but it's hydrolyzed, which means broken down so much that it does not cause reactions). The carb source is rice, which is not a usual allergen. (The most common allergens are proteins, but some dogs are allergic to whole lists. One dog I remember had tomatoes on the list (was tested via dermatologist). Who knew, but tomato pomace is a common ingredient for the lycopene content.)
The food also contains ingredients to support skin health and reduce itching and inflammation.


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## star (Feb 20, 2011)

Being a dog groomer by trade I recommend bathing, it does help soothe and calm the itching.


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## kuriooo (Feb 17, 2010)

Case in point, Kali walked into the house before me, and while I was distracted, she snatched a loaf of bread from the counter and started tearing into the bag. I heard the noise if her gulping down the bread heel ASAP. I scolded her, and I can tell she’s thinking “fine, you caught me…I know I was naughty…but of course I’m going to do this again as soon as I get the chance.” 🤣🤣🤣 if it’s food related, it’s going to be management, not cure with this little naughty pants! See the look of unrepentant guilt?! 🤣


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## star (Feb 20, 2011)

Have you thought about buying a allergy testing kit? Much like the DNA kits. I am not sure accuracy but it might be worth looking into.


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## kuriooo (Feb 17, 2010)

star said:


> Have you thought about buying a allergy testing kit? Much like the DNA kits. I am not sure accuracy but it might be worth looking into.


I have a little, but it sounds like it’s not super easy to use, per the vet. Possible, but not pleasant for her to chew sufficiently on a sponge or whatever. If it’s environmental- ie pollen - I can’t do anything about that, but that seems less likely at this point. Food is probably the biggest suspect, but hard to completely control, so I might end up in the same place as now - on a limited food diet, but trying to not actively buy products that will make her itch. She dug out and ate what I suspect were rabbit poops in the grass this morning at a neighbor dog play date, ran up to the neighbor dogs deck and help lick a spatula clean before anyone noticed. I might consider it in the future, but I’m not sure we are there yet. Picture of freshly bathed spoo included!


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## Deere (Jun 25, 2021)

kuriooo said:


> I have a little, but it sounds like it’s not super easy to use, per the vet. Possible, but not pleasant for her to chew sufficiently on a sponge or whatever. If it’s environmental- ie pollen - I can’t do anything about that, but that seems less likely at this point. Food is probably the biggest suspect, but hard to completely control, so I might end up in the same place as now - on a limited food diet, but trying to not actively buy products that will make her itch. She dug out and ate what I suspect were rabbit poops in the grass this morning at a neighbor dog play date, ran up to the neighbor dogs deck and help lick a spatula clean before anyone noticed. I might consider it in the future, but I’m not sure we are there yet. Picture of freshly bathed spoo included!
> View attachment 484025


Why do you not want to try allergy testing; it will save you money in the long run and is healthier than switching around dog food brands??


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Unless she has a serious allergy, varied snacks here and there aren’t really the same as eating the same trigger for _every_ single meal, _every_ single day. So don’t feel too defeated by those stolen nibbles.

But if it seems like she’s compulsively stealing food, it might be worth considering that she could be lacking something in her diet.

As far as environmental allergies go, there are indeed some steps you can take to manage them. If she’s allergic to grass pollen, for example, you can give her an antihistamine when levels are expected to be high, or be extra careful to wipe down her feet after play sessions. And there are even more manageable environmental triggers out there, like fragrances in shampoo, etc.


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## Starvt (Nov 5, 2019)

Those allergy testing lists are not accurate for food allergies. For that, it needs to be specific testing done by a dermatologist.
If I recall correctly, she is a rescue from a difficult situation? If I've got that right, her food stealing is likely connected- especially if she had to compete with other dogs for food, or was not fed enough. Hopefully she can eventually feel more secure when she has lived with you longer, and then maybe you will be more able to pin down her issues.


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## kuriooo (Feb 17, 2010)

Deere said:


> Why do you not want to try allergy testing; it will save you money in the long run and is healthier than switching around dog food brands??


It’s too much right now - I’m working with her on grooming daily, paw touching, getting used to going to the groomers. She has to have some dental work done and I’m holding off on anything that has to do with her mouth (tooth brushing, etc) til that is over. She has some teeth that need to get pulled and I don’t know how much she is affected Day to day.
The food I picked is good quality, better than what she was getting, so I don’t think this is hurting her at all.


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## kuriooo (Feb 17, 2010)

Starvt said:


> Those allergy testing lists are not accurate for food allergies. For that, it needs to be specific testing done by a dermatologist.
> If I recall correctly, she is a rescue from a difficult situation? If I've got that right, her food stealing is likely connected- especially if she had to compete with other dogs for food, or was not fed enough. Hopefully she can eventually feel more secure when she has lived with you longer, and then maybe you will be more able to pin down her issues.


She’s not a rescue in the typical sense of the word. She was loved and cared for in some ways, but the family clearly handled things differently ( needed a dental visit, stated she didn’t have any allergies but i now know the luck stains on her coat indicated licking, she was probably groomed at home more than at a groomers so needs some training, and I can tell she was bred at least once). But she has clearly been an inside dog, knows some basic commands, walks on a leash, and has the absolute sweetest cuddly personality ever. She is great with kids of all ages, needs a bit of time to warm up to dogs, but now has neighbor doggie friends and playmates. She is our first dog and we all love her dearly!


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## Deere (Jun 25, 2021)

PeggyTheParti said:


> Unless she has a serious allergy, varied snacks here and there aren’t really the same as eating the same trigger for _every_ single meal, _every_ single day. So don’t feel too defeated by those stolen nibbles.
> 
> But if it seems like she’s compulsively stealing food, it might be worth considering that she could be lacking something in her diet.
> 
> As far as environmental allergies go, there are indeed some steps you can take to manage them. If she’s allergic to grass pollen, for example, you can give her an antihistamine when levels are expected to be high, or be extra careful to wipe down her feet after play sessions. And there are even more manageable environmental triggers out there, like fragrances in shampoo, etc.





kuriooo said:


> It’s too much right now - I’m working with her on grooming daily, paw touching, getting used to going to the groomers. She has to have some dental work done and I’m holding off on anything that has to do with her mouth (tooth brushing, etc) til that is over. She has some teeth that need to get pulled and I don’t know how much she is affected Day to day.
> The food I picked is good quality, better than what she was getting, so I don’t think this is hurting her at all.


It's not a question of "hurting " her; it's about keeping her healthy and "happy" when her body(at this point) is under stress. I understand the need to work with her and the cost that will occur with the dermatologist but you can have a blood test "screen" that will give you some basics ie, corn or wheat etc. Those 2 ingredients are some the most common that produce an allergic reaction; constant paw licking, scratching etc. and until that is addressed just changing dog food will not be enough. What does your Vet recommend?


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## kuriooo (Feb 17, 2010)

Deere said:


> It's not a question of "hurting " her; it's about keeping her healthy and "happy" when her body(at this point) is under stress. I understand the need to work with her and the cost that will occur with the dermatologist but you can have a blood test "screen" that will give you some basics ie, corn or wheat etc. Those 2 ingredients are some the most common that produce an allergic reaction; constant paw licking, scratching etc. and until that is addressed just changing dog food will not be enough. What does your Vet recommend?


The vet is monitoring it at this point, mentioned that the saliva test existed, but seemed to have other priorities she wanted addressed (bloodwork, teeth, ears). I’ve communicated with the vets office about the diet change, which is going well. We just ran out of Apoquel so I will see what happens. She isn’t scratching or licking as much as previously- but it’s not 0 % either, which is why I’m staying in top of it.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

kuriooo said:


> She has to have some dental work done and I’m holding off on anything that has to do with her mouth (tooth brushing, etc) til that is over. She has some teeth that need to get pulled and I don’t know how much she is affected Day to day.


Dental pain can cause all sorts of self-soothing behaviours/expressions of pain, including scratching and licking. Hoping the dental work does the trick.  At the very least, she’s going to feel a whole lot better.


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## Deere (Jun 25, 2021)

I am glad the Vet knows what's going on & has the priorities scheduled.My dog was a Puppy Mill [email protected] 1.5 years(he was used as a stud)&came to me a itchy and scratchy mess with a thin patchy coat along with behavior and mental issues. After his allergy testing & his results he was put on a anti- depression medication which made slow/sleepy but did stop the licking and scratching. When Apoquel was released to the Veterinarian community & we received it the results after 1day were amazing. Nathan stopped licking and stratching and was able to relax for the first time in his entire life. His allergies were both food & environmental. I learned to wipe him off(body and feet) with baby wipes everytime he came in from outside. I don't have any fragrance in my home; detergent, candles, cleaning/ polish products, no lawn/chemical products, no smoking inside and no fragrance in the grooming products. Nathan was on Apoquel for his whole life which allowed him(and me) to be happy and confident. I am sharing this with you because I first tired different dry and canned dog foods that were expensive and sometimes actually worked for awhile. Nathan was miserable during this process and when Apoquel was released & we began treatment our lives changed for the Better! I hope Kali's allergies aren't as bad as Nathan's and you can find relief for her and yourself.​


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## kuriooo (Feb 17, 2010)

Deere said:


> I am glad the Vet knows what's going on & has the priorities scheduled.My dog was a Puppy Mill [email protected] 1.5 years(he was used as a stud)&came to me a itchy and scratchy mess with a thin patchy coat along with behavior and mental issues. After his allergy testing & his results he was put on a anti- depression medication which made slow/sleepy but did stop the licking and scratching. When Apoquel was released to the Veterinarian community & we received it the results after 1day were amazing. Nathan stopped licking and stratching and was able to relax for the first time in his entire life. His allergies were both food & environmental. I learned to wipe him off(body and feet) with baby wipes everytime he came in from outside. I don't have any fragrance in my home; detergent, candles, cleaning/ polish products, no lawn/chemical products, no smoking inside and no fragrance in the grooming products. Nathan was on Apoquel for his whole life which allowed him(and me) to be happy and confident. I am sharing this with you because I first tired different dry and canned dog foods that were expensive and sometimes actually worked for awhile. Nathan was miserable during this process and when Apoquel was released & we began treatment our lives changed for the Better! I hope Kali's allergies aren't as bad as Nathan's and you can find relief for her and yourself.​


Wow, what a story! I’m so glad for the Apoquel, for you & Nathan! That sounds like it was a game-changer, what a relief! 
i also have my own sensitivities and don’t use scented products either. I had a family member with a medical condition with severe reactions to any kind of smell, so developed avoiding airborne chemical smells as a habit. I think it’s generally healthier, too!


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## kuriooo (Feb 17, 2010)

Deere said:


> I am glad the Vet knows what's going on & has the priorities scheduled.My dog was a Puppy Mill [email protected] 1.5 years(he was used as a stud)&came to me a itchy and scratchy mess with a thin patchy coat along with behavior and mental issues. After his allergy testing & his results he was put on a anti- depression medication which made slow/sleepy but did stop the licking and scratching. When Apoquel was released to the Veterinarian community & we received it the results after 1day were amazing. Nathan stopped licking and stratching and was able to relax for the first time in his entire life. His allergies were both food & environmental. I learned to wipe him off(body and feet) with baby wipes everytime he came in from outside. I don't have any fragrance in my home; detergent, candles, cleaning/ polish products, no lawn/chemical products, no smoking inside and no fragrance in the grooming products. Nathan was on Apoquel for his whole life which allowed him(and me) to be happy and confident. I am sharing this with you because I first tired different dry and canned dog foods that were expensive and sometimes actually worked for awhile. Nathan was miserable during this process and when Apoquel was released & we began treatment our lives changed for the Better! I hope Kali's allergies aren't as bad as Nathan's and you can find relief for her and yourself.​


Your comment about the anti depressant makes me wonder if some of her I risk symptoms were related to anxiety? She changed households at least once before I got her, due to prior owner’s health.


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## Basil_the_Spoo (Sep 1, 2020)

You're doing great and she's lucky to have found a mom who is as caring as you.


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

See a vet dermatologist. One and done. Apoquel just masks the underlying problem. I had a Scottish Terrier allergic to everything and the specialist’s program of diet, shampoos and shots cured him and us from a long non scratching soundtrack for his entire life. They know the best shampoos, foods. So worth it and a course I will always recommend on PF.


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