# AKC Obedience Advisory Recommendations



## spindledreams (Aug 7, 2012)

We talked about these a bit in class last night. One member has a dog with 2 legs and are chasing that elusive third leg for her CD. She and I were both like wow that could almost be a totally different title then the current CD plus of course she was concerned if the old legs would still count if these changes went into effect before she got that last one on her dog. 

To me it was interesting how many things were followed by "like in Rally"


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I think those earned legs would have to stand. I also think that if your classmate and her dog finish before the end of 2014 they will do the old routine. I don't think there is any way that those changes would be implemented before January. I am relieved that there aren't big changes in utility. It would really set me back if there were. I think I will have much more fun training the next dog for novice.

So I know I mentioned "think as in rally" a couple of times in my original post, but you also had the same frame of reference in talking about some of those things in your class? I know lots of strictly traditional obedience people who look down on rally, but since they made the changes in rally in 2012 it really is very challenging. I also think for younger dogs and newer handlers rally is really a great way to transition in to the sport.


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## HerdingStdPoodle (Oct 17, 2012)

*Pre-CD Title Alternative*

Lily cd re:

Perhaps there is a solution in achieving the CD Title without lowering the standards. In academia, pre-algebra is a an alternative. Perhaps the Pre-CD Title is a viable alternative in the dog world.

A few weeks ago, I attended a three-day dog show and there were numerous participants in the Rally Ring. Very few participants participated in the Obedience Ring (except Shelties & Shelties & Belgians & Schnauzers) and a while back---my Spoo!

My Spoo worked very hard to get his CD!! 

Yes, I believe in encouraging other Poodle Folks to get into Obedience or other sports with their dogs.... But please do not lower the existing standards--- but make a "pre-obedience" category.

Respectfully,
HerdingStdPoodle


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## spindledreams (Aug 7, 2012)

They actually have a pre class it is called Beginner Novice all work is done on lead. 

The changes aren't making it easier to get a CD the only thing that is easier is the long sit group exercise is replaced with an individual sit stay. The on lead heel pattern is being reduced to the figure 8 only, and they are adding a heel, drop and recall. Yes there would be TWO recalls, two chances for the dog to mess up that front then finish (this is my girls weakness she tends to go directly to heel as do many dogs)

The is a paste from the actual pdf 
REVISED Novice Class Exercises:
1. Figure Eight on Leash – 20 points
2. Stand for Exam – 30 points
3. Heel Free – 40 points – Regular heeling pattern
*4. Heel, Drop & Recall *– Heel forward, down dog, leave dog, call dog - 30 points.
(Judge will order team to heel, down dog, leave dog, handler goes to other end of the ring, Judge will order call dog as in the Novice Recall)
5. Recall – 30 points
6. *Stay – Handler gets Leash – 20 points*
7. Group Stay 1 minute (on leash) – 30 points


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## spindledreams (Aug 7, 2012)

I didn't mention it our instructor kept saying like in rally. wry grin it was almost like they are possibly in the process of merging the two forms of obedience... 

I really don't have a lot of experience with the current obedience world most of my experience is from back in the mid 80s. Ya know about the time they actually created the OTCH. 

I had thought about getting into it again but then well problems came up with me and plans changed. Not sure we will get into now that I am doing better. Just doesn't seem as much fun ...


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

The CD won't be easier, just different in my thinking. In addition to beginner novice though there is also what has been called pre-novice (along with per open and pre utility) that will lead to a separate championship title.

Spindledreams, I think the fun is in your own making. There are some people who are super serious and others who are just happy to build the bond with their dog more deeply through the preparation and performance. I think of myself somewhere in the middle. I really like nice scores and have a big collection of rosettes, but I treat every trial as a learning opportunity and some quality time with my dogs.

As to the idea of merging those events, no way IMO. They just established a Rally National Championship. They won't make that disappear. They like having as many different kinds of events as possible. This is a big revenue stream for them. Think about it they get $3 per entry for doing very little other than recording the scoring info that the secretaries and superintendents send them and periodically mailing out title certificates. There are some people who are just addicted to getting title who will do rally, the pre classes towards the new POC championship title and will try for UDXs, OM and OTCh all with the same dog. I know because I know a couple of them....

I do think that they used that concept of the rally excellent sit stay-get leash to good effect to replace the removed group stay in novice and open.


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## HerdingStdPoodle (Oct 17, 2012)

*AKC Obedience*

Is a pre-novice "optional title" offered at every show or only at the larger shows? 

I think that the long stay is one of the more difficult requirements of the traditional CD Title. Also---for my Spoo, one heeling pattern was easy. It was the second heeling pattern that was more difficult....not that it was off-leash...but that he had already "been-there & done-that!" and was bored, which raised the difficulty of the traditional CD Title. [plus...wow! ...all those baby gates and cute kids and squeaky chairs!]

How about the Finish? Will that stay as a requirement? 

HerdingStdPoodle


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

The optional title classes are more likely to run at larger shows since there are requirements about if you offer "this class" then you have to offer "those classes." I think having the only heeling pattern be an off leash makes it challenging for most novice dogs since they won't have had a chance to learn the pattern on leash first. I also think that the heel drop call will be a challenge for many. I assume that all exercises that normally end with front then finish will still end that way.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

The changes do seem to make Novice seem...different. But I agree, not easier. Now, I personally don't like the removal of the group sits and downs. I've seem some dogs have a really hard time with it but I feel that its an important minimum behavior to train. Also, it's been one of the easier exercises for the two I've trained toward Novice titles, so naturally I would like it to stay.

A dog that attended novice training class with Tiger and me all of last year has repeatedly flunked in trials because he can NOT stay! When Tiger earned his last 2 CD legs I was nervous only because that damn dog from class got right up during every sit and down exercise all weekend. He was in class with us for about 10 months and now, I'm bringing up my _next_ dog and have been in weekly class with them again and the dog still can't stay!


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## HerdingStdPoodle (Oct 17, 2012)

*Relate*



CharismaticMillie said:


> "....A dog that attended novice training class with Tiger and me all of last year has repeatedly flunked in trials because he can NOT stay!


Great fun! I can certainly relate because Louie had a dog close to him in the lineup that looked like Louie's best friend from doggie daycare.... Challenging!
:ahhhhh:

HerdingStdPoodle


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

CM there will still be one group stay in novice (1 min) and the stay handler gets leash. I can see a lot of novice dogs getting up and following the handler when they go to get the leash just like they do in beginner novice for the sit stay walk around the ring.

The only reason I haven't gotten a CD with Peeves is the group stays. He is fine if I can talk to him and remind him not to look at any other dogs. He was fine for the beginner novice sit stay walk around, but as soon as I am silent and there are other dogs his herding desire to look at other animals kicks in and as soon as he gets eye contact he gets up to say hello. He is a sweet dog and means no harm, but I don't want someone with a small dog saying he attacked their dog because he stepped on it by mistake and it complained.


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