# Please HELP serious behavior problem



## Karma'sACat

You can check craigslist, freecycle and kajiji/ebay classifieds for cheap crates. I really think crate training would help.
How much exercise is Guido getting? Mental stimulation? I woud step up both. You can make puzzle toys to feed out of, work on training new tricks, puppy push ups on walks (down, sit, down, sit), etc
When he chews, redirect him to things he can chew on: bully sticks, nylabones, antlers, etc
You can also do a potty training refresher. Treat him like an 8 week old puppy and take him out at least once an hour, after eating, drinking, playing, sleeping, etc. I think it has less to do with spite and more to do with a strange (to him) dog being brought in to his territory.
Remember, his routine has been totally disrupted and you brought in a dog he barely knows to his house. He only had a month with Goomba. Did you do an introduction on neutral turf before bringing Goomba back in? I would start walking them together if you can get someone to help you.


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## fjm

It is not "defiance" OR "spite" - this is a dog that is used to having his home territory to himself, who is suddenly expected to share it with another male. Stop thinking of this as behaviour that is designed and intended to upset you, and start thinking of it from the dog's point of view. Why should he happily accept a strange dog into his home with no preparation? Would you accept a rival without complaint? Dogs mark their territory when they feel threatened, and it sounds as if that is what is happening here.

I would put a lot of effort into making the two of them comfortable with each other, and also accept the fact that the problem lay far more with my expectations that they should cheerfully accept my bizarre expectations than the with the dogs themselves! I would most certainly not scold or punish them for finding the situation more than they could easily cope with.


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## msminnamouse

I wouldn't let him get away with this. Despite what he may or may not be feeling, these behaviors are not allowed. He knows this.

Treat him like a untrained dog. Keep a leash on him at all times. Put a bell on it. Every time you hear the bell stop, it'll alert you to the fact that he's not moving and he may be chewing something or marking something.

The point of the leash is so that you can quickly grab him if you see him about to mark or in the process of marking. If you see this, grab the leash and immediately take him outside. Reinforce that urinating does NOT happen in the house and that outside is the place to do it. 

Take him outside to go potty about 15-30 minutes after you see him eat, drink, sleep, or play. If his bladder is emptied outside, he won't have the opportunity to empty it inside. 

The leash is also handy for time outs. If he is barking non-stop and the spray bottle method isn't working. Put him in time out. His time out should be in a room that he normally don't go with no toys or rawhides. This shows him that barking non-stop puts him in this time out, therefor he should put two and two together and stop barking non-stop. This kind of barking is done for attention. You can show him that this barking gets him the exact opposite of what he is trying to get. You don't want to create a negative association with a crate. A crate should be a place to be enjoyed and to feel safe since if he has to be in one when you can't be there, you don't want to turn it into a negative experience or punishment for him. Try Freecycle or Craigslist for a cheap one.

Fill the crate with a very comfortable bed that he loves. Don't have a bed anywhere else except for his crate. Fill the crate with stuffed Kongs and his favorite toys. Turn it into a place that he _wants_ to be. Most likely he will stop whining at night. If not, invest in some earplugs. They're cheap. He will soon learn that this is his new sleeping arrangement and come to accept it.

When he chews on something that he isn't supposed to, replace it with something that is acceptable to chew on. Don't reward him though with a new chew, give him one that he already has lying around. Buy really tough chews for big dogs if he is prone to finishing chews and not leaving them around for later. Watch however that they don't become a source of possession guarding towards the other dog.

If that doesn't work, you can fill a can with coins and shake it whenever he chews on something bad. It's loud and distracting and will take his mind off of chewing on whatever he is chewing on. 

You can also try bitter lemon, or one of those other chew deterrents. Whatever he is chewing, walk up to and simply spray and tell him firmly, "No".


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## HiSocietyPoodle

The chewing has stopped. 

The peeing and pooping on my sofa is totally out of control. I walk the dog, I take him out. I walk him with the other dog. He is friends with the other dog.

The real problem is Guido pees and poops on the sofa when we aren't looking.

I have him confined in the dog pen when we can't watch his every move, but the barking and whining is driving me crazy!


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## Karma'sACat

Don't leave him alone. I would use the umbilical cord method and always have him with you on a leash. If you can't have him with you, put him up. When he whines, ignore him totally. You can leave something like a stuffed Kong in his crate or pen so he enjoys the area (you can stuff the Kong with treats/kibble/bananas/etc and peanut butter/yogurt/etc then freeze it for and extra challenge). You can also use the crate/pen fairy to help him enjoy his area. Randomly leave treats in there for him to find. And don't use it for punishment. You want your dog to enjoy their crate and other crates they are in (like at the vet).
Also, what are you cleaning the messes with? You want to use an enzymatic cleaner to totally remove the scent so he can't smell it. Some brands are Nature's Miracle and Simple Solution.


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## HiSocietyPoodle

*Non-Stop-Barking!*

I'm not sure how much more I can take. This is no way to live!

Ear plugs aren't an option. The barking is causing a problem with the neighbors now. I can't have that.

The spray bottle is no longer working and time out in the doggie pen/crate accelerates the barking and whining.

I will try shaking the can with coins or rocks in it when he barks. Maybe that might work.

The umbilical cord method is just what he wants, to be tethered to me every moment.

The only way Guido will stop the bad behavior is if I spend every waking moment with him, and I can not do that. 

Will a muzzle work to stop the barking? Any other suggestion to stop the barking?


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## cbrand

It sounds like your dog has separation anxiety. I would read up on this condition. It can be very hard to manage. Have you considered medication? 

As far as the peeing and pooping go, this is what I would do. I would put a belly band on him to keep him from peeing. I would also put a scat mat on the couch to keep him off of it (you can make one by cutting an office chair plastic mat and turning it upside down with spikes up.) You can try getting a bark collar for him, but those collars often only work for dogs that have a pause between barks. If your dog is stress barking like: Yite, Yite, Yite, Yite then the collar does not have time to react. 

You must get a crate for him.


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## fjm

It sounds to me as if it is time to find a good behaviourist (not a trainer - someone with recognised qualifications and experience in animal behaviour modification). Things are obviously seriously awry, and it is time to get professional help.


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## msminnamouse

The point I tried to make is that if you make him eliminate outside often enough, there won't be anything left in his digestive tract for him to leave on the sofa or else where inside.

If he's not dog aggressive, day care sounds like a good option. It would help him gain some independence from you and keep him supervised when you can't be with him.

But I also agree with other things that have been said. Find a trainer. A good one. I do not recommend ones that use that Cesar Millan nonsense. I'm not turning this into a debate but I personally don't feel that his methods are any good or get results.


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## Feathersprings

It sure doesnt soundl like you are having fun  I have not had all of the problems you are having, no peeing or pooping in the house..but hoolie was not allowed any freedom in the house until I SAW he had taken care of business and then he could be out for a couple hours and then back out.. He also like being tethered to me lol! It was hard for me at first but got used to it. It was ok for him to like it  The seperation anxiety might be hard.. a little rescue remedy used to help one of my Pekes ? Karmas suggestion of the Stuffed Kong was something i have done when i need to leave Hoolie for a few hours kenneled. He loves peanut butter! I stuff the knog with treats fill the hole with peanutbutter and freeze it. He is only kenneled for eating and at bedtime and if i have to leave the house for errands.. hopefully soon he wil outgrow the need to chew up things and will be able to sleep out of the kennel though he doesnt mind.


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## georgiapeach

msminnamouse said:


> The point I tried to make is that if you make him eliminate outside often enough, there won't be anything left in his digestive tract for him to leave on the sofa or else where inside.


Sorry, but that's not necessarily true. We just had to rehome a Boston Terrier that only peed in the house (large crate, small crate, crate with divider, laundry room, with or without the other dogs in the same room to keep him company, stuffed Kong, bed taken away, etc. - you get the idea) when we left him. It had NOTHING to do with how many times he'd already been outside, or for how long he was left - an hour or all day. There was always a "reserve" of pee to flood the floor when we'd leave. We luckily found him a great home with a stay at home artist who lives on 10 acres with 5 other dogs and 3 horses. He should now be in BT heaven! Not all dogs and owners are a good fit! At the age of 53, I've finally figured that out, and I've quit beating myself up over it!!


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## Feathersprings

Not all dogs and owners are a good fit! At the age of 53 said:


> I wish more people understood this. Of course they need to try and find the dog the proper person or family so they dont get bounced around from person to person. You and the dog can be miserable and even with lots of work never be a good match. I took lots of dogs into rescue that coundnt be housebroken, chewed things up.. and they were quickly housebroken in my home and became wonderful companions for a new family. I dont believe that the people werent trying.. just that for some reason they and the dog just werent connecting on some level. I think sometimes it was the dog not be in right for the family, the breed not being right for the circumstances etc. I was in pretty over my head at first with my puppy, I went from an adult Greyhound couch potato and an elderly almost comatose Pekingese to a poodle puppy , yikes!!! We have it pretty well worked out now but I am at home with him all the time


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## JE-UK

HiSocietyPoodle said:


> The real problem is Guido pees and poops on the sofa when we aren't looking.
> 
> I have him confined in the dog pen when we can't watch his every move, but the barking and whining is driving me crazy!


Regardless of the reason, every time he gets away with it, he is reinforcing the behaviour.

I'd either tether the dog to me, or confine him. 

If he has something in his mouth while confined, he won't be able to bark. Kong toys can be your saviour! Fill a Kong with something super yummy .... cream cheese, peanut butter, scrambled eggs, hamburger ... something the dog really really likes. Put him in the pen with the Kong and walk away. You can turn this into a training exercise very easily, and train the dog to be quiet while confined. I would make sure the dog is hungry (i.e. hasn't been fed for 8 hours) and:

- fill two or three Kongs (MUST be super yummy stuff)
- put the dog in the pen with a Kong and walk away
- after 10 minutes, go back in, let the dog out and TAKE AWAY THE KONG

Dog says: "Huh?? Gimme back the yummy stuff"

- put the dog back in the pen with the Kong and walk away
- again, come back before the dog has finished the Kong
- let the dog out and take away the Kong

Dog says: "Hey, why can't I have that yummy Kong?"

- Repeat, using Kong #2 if the first is close to empty

Dog says: "I get it .... good stuff for poodles happens when I'm in the pen!!"

If you start slow and for short periods and lots of repetition, you can train the dog in a few days to be quiet in the pen. I would fill the pen up with everything the dog wants, chews, toys, Kongs, and make sure he ONLY gets those things when in the pen.


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## HiSocietyPoodle

Thank you all for your help.

*I'm still wondering if a muzzle with stop them from being able to bark?*

Filling the doggie crate/pen with toys and treats isn't working either. And my feeling on it is much like rewarding a prisoner with HBO, gourmet meals, rock star music and a private room/suite. Not much like being punished! They have no motivating to get the hell out. Why would they/prisoner want to be on the outside world with consequences for their acting and responsibilities when they have fun right where they are... :ballchain:

I haven't tried shaking a can filled with rocks yet. I'm not a soda drinker so next time I go to the store I will remember to buy a can to use.

*cbrand* -- I think you are right its *separation anxiety*. Later this week I'm going to pick up some medication. A friend also suggested a belly band. But will it stop the pooping as well? I have doggie heat panties I used when my Spoo was in heat. I made a couple spare pairs I still have. I made them adjustable with velcro and I can adjust them for Guido & Goomba. If they pee or poop it will stay in the pantie and these little guys won't like the feeling. Great idea how to make a scat mat for the sofa. And, in the future I might create one. I have found an alternative solution. Thanks for the great idea.

To avoid Guido from relieving himself on the sofa I turned the sofa and love seat around and the furniture faces the wall. I know what you're thinking. By doing this they can't crawl up on the furniture and it solves that problem. I don't use the living room so it doesn't bother me at all. 

*Feathersprings *-- I'm going to look into the rescue remedy you suggested also. That's another good idea.

*georgiapeach* -- I agree with you when you said, "It had NOTHING to do with how many times he'd already been outside, or for how long he was left - an hour or all day. There was always a "reserve" of pee to flood the floor when we'd leave." You are so right. I found that out. I can walk them forever, or they are out in the yard all day and they come in and still go in the house. That's what has me so unset about these dogs. They go out and go and come back in and go.

I'm with you -- I love my little Guido, but if I can't get him in check I will have to resort to extreme measures. And, I'm even wondering if that is why he was in the dog pound to being with. I understand rescue dogs have issues, but I've had many in my life time and this situation is totally unmanageable. :frusty:

Two nights ago Goomba got in to a super sized chocolate bar my father had hidden, half and hour later Goomba threw up all over and ruined the carpet the the guest bedroom. It now needs to be replaced. What a mess! Then the next morning Guido must have gotten into it as well and he threw up all over too. uke: I don't believe the old tale that chocolate will kill a dog. Goomba had a huge 1/4 lb of chocolate and it only made him puke. The only thing it did to these dogs was make them wired and puke.

Tonight I went out for a few hours and there was someone home with the dogs. I left the door to my office open and was eating a large mint chocolate bar, I had maybe two bites out of it when I left it on my desk. When I got home I found an empty rapper under my desk on the floor. So, we all know what happened to it. I've never had a dog crawl up on my desk. I guess I've learned another lesson. :brick:

As of right now they are going to be confined to the garage (the weather here in Florida this time of year is very nice; not hot and not cold). It is my only solution. They are not allowed in the house anymore. I'm done! I just went out and made them two nice beds for them to sleep in and I'll put some water out there for them. The neighbors can hear them bark but not as bad as when they are outside. Tomorrow is another day and perhaps little by little they will learn what I am trying to teach them. Thank you all for your help and suggestions and welcome any other thoughts or ideas.


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## Karma'sACat

No, a muzzle will no stop barking and it is a really bad idea to leave one on a dog unattended.

A crate is not for punishment. It was said before, I'll say it again: A CRATE IS NOT FOR PUNISHMENT. you want it to be a safe place your dog can relax in when you can't watch him. Things like stuffed Kongs occupy his mind as well as hep him associate good things with his crate so he won't bark. Trust me, your vet and vet techs will not like you for teaching your dog that a crate is a bad place. Dogs who have learned this are very hard to get in kennels at the vet, are extremely stressed and can become fear aggressive when strangers are trying to put them in one.

This didn't start until his routine was totally disrupted with a dog he doesn't remember being brought back in. Then he has been stuck in a place he isn't happy in, and thus his routine is further disrupted. Remember this before you send him back to the shelter.

You didn't learn much of a lesson if you are punishing your dogs by sticking them in the garage for YOUR mistake. They have no idea they shouldn't eat chocolate and to them it smells and tastes great. And for the record, YES, chocolate IS toxic (the chemical theobromide to be exact) and it CAN kill your dog if they eat enough. Chocolate Toxicity and Pets - What Makes Chocolate Toxic To Dogs - Learn about Chocolate Toxcity and Pets ) Instead of punishing them, punish yourself and make yourself clean and dog proof your home. No different than a puppy chewing on something left where they can reach it.

Again, mental and physical stimulation together can be a huge help. G on walks, feed out of puzzle feeders (you can make your own out of an empty soda bottle by cutting kibble sized holes in it), each him new tricks, do doggy push-ups (sit, down, sit, down, etc), do obedience while walking.

I would highly recommend you consult a behaviorist (not a trainer). The International Association of Animal Behavior Consultants can be a great resource for finding one International Association of Animal Behavior Consultants (IAABC) You can also look in to the book I;ll Be home Soon by Patricia McConnell, a fantastic behaviorist. Actually, all of her books are worth the read and I think every dog owner should. Amazon.com: I'll be Home Soon: How to Prevent and Treat Separation Anxiety. (9781891767050): Patricia B. McConnell Ph.D.: Books


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## JE-UK

*What she said!!*

Karma'sACat is absolutely spot on.

I'll say it again too ... a crate should never be used as a punishment spot.

If you must have a punishment spot, pick somewhere safe and tether the dog there for short periods, as a time out.

Try some of the articles on DogStar Daily. There is one here specifically on housesoiling (which reiterates much of the advice you've been given already): Housesoiling | Dog Star Daily.


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## fjm

I agree - you need a behaviourist (NOT a trainer). You and the dogs are winding each other up to the point of no return - it worries me that you are seeing separation anxiety and vomiting after being poisoned by chocolate as matters that should be punished (be grateful they vomited - it could have been far, far worse had they not). It is time to get professional help.


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## Feathersprings

Can I suggest you read the book "The Culture Clash" by Jean Donaldson. I think it would be of some use to you to have more and understanding of dog behavior. I think you are expecting Guido to respond as a human would and not a as dog. Most likely he doesnt know why he is being punished.. they dont make that connection unless caught in the act and the proper correctin is given. As to the Belly band ( or panties) the purpose again isnt punishent ( If they pee or poop it will stay in the pantie and these little guys won't like the feeling.) it is just to protect you furniture and such until he learns what to do. The Chocolate!!! My friends dog died from eating a whole large bar of Dark Chocolate!!!!! Please dont leave it aound! You need to dog proof things like he was a child. My home has never been so "picked up" in years!!! Hoolie is a thief  He will get things off the tables, counters , buffet under beds , out of trash cans etc. I am now giving him soo many toys to play with and keeping hm occupied we are having less of this  

Try and remember that dogs arent "spiteful" they dont do things because the are trying to get even for something, we so often try and put them in the "Lassie" mold and expect them to be able to make moral decisions about what is right and wrong. He is a dog being a dog and needing some appropriate help in learning what you want of him. Im afraid right now he probably mostly knows you are mad at hm a lot  and doesnt understand why...


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## HiSocietyPoodle

So if everything is wrong that I am doing, what do I do for punishment?

I did not punish my dog for puking. I'm not an abusive idiot I would never punish a dog for that. I put the dog in a place that he wouldn't have a run of the house so he wouldn't vomit everywhere.

I did tether the dog to a spot and he peed in it when I wasn't looking.

And again, how do I stop a dog from barking? Maybe I'm missing something.

I can't afford a behaviorist so I'll look for the books at the library that *Feathersprings *and *Karma'sACat* suggested.

Thank you again.


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## PaddleAddict

HiSocietyPoodle said:


> I don't believe the old tale that chocolate will kill a dog. Goomba had a huge 1/4 lb of chocolate and it only made him puke. The only thing it did to these dogs was make them wired and puke.


It is not an "old tale." Chocolate can and does kill dogs. I have seen it personally from the time I worked at a vet hospital. Milk chocolate is less toxic because it has less theobromine (the toxic component in chocolate). Dark chocolate has a higher concentration of theobromine and is more dangerous. Baker's chocolate and cocoa powder are even more toxic than dark chocolate.


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## Feathersprings

I dont really use punishment for Hoolie... I DO use time outs.. mostly when he is just uncontroalble running around grabbing things he shouldnt have.. that sort of thing... I just have a tether right next to my computer and when he is acting up i just put him there for a few minutes and them let him go.. if he does it agion he goes right back until he settles. I also use lots of distraction and games.. IM afraid that sometimes dog ownership is very intensive for a time.. I dont mean to sound like I am thinking you are abusive.. just that you are subscribing to methods that are outdated that dont work. I did Pekingese rescue for years and the major reasons they came to rescue were for the same things you are having problems with. It may be that Guido is just not ever going to be a fit for you. You may not have the time or patience for the work he needs  it happens! I questioned wether i had the patience for a puppy ... I thought maybe not but have really had to dedicate myself to working with him. I can do that.. i have the time and actually find I DO have the patience though it can wear thin at times  I am starting to reap the benifits of my work now.. he is becoming the wonderful boy I knew he would be but I have been working hard at it for 6 mos.! 

Another thing about the tethering.. you just cant tether him and leave...you need to be watching so he doesnt pee  I know, I know... you cant be with him 24/7 but this is just for a few minutes, also i used the tether when i was cooking or doing things I couldnt watch him while doing but he was in the room with me. As far as barking there are lots of recommendations in training books.. I dont have that problem so dont know what to do really.. When Hoolie barks in the yard I bring him in. When he barks in the house at the door ( we are very rural so there is no one at the door ) We investigate it together and then I tell him it is ok and it is done.. Probably not good training methods but it works for us LOL!

OH... I found a copy ( used) of the Culture clash on Amazon when I got mine for under $5. always check ther if you cant find one at the library!


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## Beach girl

> So if everything is wrong that I am doing, what do I do for punishment?


Punishment is not the answer. You need to be thinking more about "What can I do to reward this dog when he is doing something right?" And you want to give him as many opportunities as possible to be right. 

So when he pees and poops outside, you give him a treat and lots and lots of praise. When he walks nicely with the other dog, you give them both treats and praise. 

IF you happen to see Guido beginning to pee in the house, you can scoop him up quickly and say "NO" and immediately take him outside, then treats and praise for finishing the job outside. But no more punishment than that one verbal "No" at the moment of the deed. If you punish him for peeing, what he will learn is that he shouldn't pee or poop in front of you, and that is just going to set the cycle for lots of problems. As in, he will continue to pee and poop in the house, in secret, when you can't see him, and that's going to drive you crazy.

I'm very worried about the idea of locking the dogs in the garage. For one thing, it's a confined space, and if Guido is worried about Goomba, the worst thing you can do is put both of them in a confined space together where Guido has no safe place to get away.

Worse, most people have things in their garage that dogs absolutely should not get into. Locking your dogs into a place with no mental stimulation, with dangerous liquids maybe or tools or things of that nature just can't be a good idea.

See if you can get the DVR "Crate Games" and teach Guido how good a crate can be. Crate training will help so much with nearly all your problems with him.


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## HiSocietyPoodle

*Update and a cry for more help...*

I'd like to post an update of where I'm at with all of this.

I spoke with a dog counselor that gave me some insight to why Guido is acting the way he is. She said he has anxiety from abandonment. She suggested I buy a couple of things. At the pet store I picked up -- rescue remedy, a whistle, and some no-go (to stop re urination). 

I spray the floor with NO-GO to stop the urination. It really did the trick. 

But the barking is still out of control. Shaking a can with rocks, doesn't work. The no bark collar doesn't work. The rescue remedy doesn't work to calm him. Timeout doesn't work. Nothing works to stop the barking.

If these other things have not worked, *how do you stop a dog from barking?* I have tried everything.

I have been keeping both dogs in the doggie pen every night it had helped modify the bad behavior. But last night Guido started barking at 4 a.m. and woke me up. I took him out to pee and put him back in the dog pen and I went back to bed. It wasn't 20 minutes and the barking resumed and was relentless until 8 am. I'm sleep deprived and frustrated. 

I have become very vigilant about keeping the doors closed to all the rooms so the dogs can't get on the carpet or get on the furniture. Today a family member when in the bedroom for less then a minute and Guido went in behind them and took two poops on the bed. He had just been taken for a walk and was outside for quite some time. 

Does anyone else have any experience or luck with barking dogs?

The last 2 months have been a living hell.


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## Marian

I don't believe in punishing my dog for anything he does. It is best to teach them what you want them to do and praise them when they do it. Ignore the behavior when they don't, and redirect them to something that it's okay for them to be doing. I would never spray my dog with water and I would not startle him by shaking a can of coins. I think that would only end up making him a nervous wreck.

Your dogs can sense your frustration, and that is probably why the behavior is not improving. De-stress. Meditate. Breathe. Relax. And never try to work with your dog while you're frustrated, because it simply won't have a happy ending.


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## fjm

It is interesting that the dog counsellor diagnosed anxiety - but that many of the methods you describe (coin can, anti-bark collar, etc) are tailor made to actually increase anxiety. 

I can understand your stress - it leaps from your words! - but I think you need to address the stress and anxiety first (both yours and Guido's), and then the rest will follow. Get the very largest size of Simple Solution, so that you are prepared for when things go wrong. Try to remember the things that you and Guido used to have fun doing together, or what you did when you relaxed together, and make a conscious effort to spend time with him again. If he is more relaxed when he is close to you, think about putting the crate in your bedroom (may help to stop him messing in there, as well). Try a DAP diffuser - it works for some dogs - or a Thunder shirt. Just really, really concentrate on keeping him calm, relaxed and unstressed (difficult when you are exhausted from sleep deprivation and wound up to screaming pitch yourself, I know).

How long is Goomba with you for? And is the pattern of some months with you, some months elsewhere likely to continue? Because if so, it may be time to think about whether the two dogs are really able to share a home happily ....


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## msminnamouse

Shaking a can of coins doesn't always increase anxiety. The purpose of the exercise is to distract the dog from the undesirable behavior long enough to praise them for stopping it. If a command or food doesn't work, a sharp noise usually will. The dog barks, you shake the can or blow a sharp whistle, the dog stops barking to investigate the noise and you praise the silence. Obviously you wouldn't do this with a dog prone to certain types of anxiety. It's up to the owner to decide if the modification technique is correct for their dog.

I especially like the distraction technique for dog aggressive dogs at adoption events to take their mind off of aggressing. You're the handler for a dog and some one else walks another dog a little too close and your dog starts focusing in on the other dog, tensing and you feel him about to lunge violently at the other dog so you offer treats until the other dog passes or if the dog won't take treats, you use whatever you can. The loud, unusual noise of the can of coins cuts through the dog's aggressive fixation on the other dog and he focuses on finding out the source of the noise instead of the other dog. THAT's the way it's supposed to work. You distract the dog from the unwanted behavior and praise them for stopping it.

When you say that you put him in time out, are you sure that you really did that? Did you shut him in a room that you're not in where he can't see you or hear you? Being near you is his goal. It's his prize. It's what he wants. If he doesn't act according to the rules, there's no reason for you to reward him with what he wants. Putting him in time out teaches him that excessive barking means his separation from you until he calms down and stops. 

Those shock collars are trash. They may work in the short run but the dog usually just starts barking again once the collar is off. Plus I don't believe in shocking an animal into submission. 

Another option you have is this: 




You might give it a try. It's more treatment than a cure but who knows? You might get lucky and the outcome might stick and you might not have to use it for the rest of his life.


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## HiSocietyPoodle

*msminnamouse* - Yes, I tried the Pet Agree Ultrasonic Trainer. We call it the BLUE BOX. It doesn't work. It worked in the beginning for a short while but no longer. 

Your idea of "You distract the dog from the unwanted behavior and praise them for stopping it." is a great idea, I'll try that.

You asked "Did you shut him in a room that you're not in where he can't see you or hear you?" Yes, I put him in the bathroom as a time out. But, I put him in there because the barking is so out of control I'm afraid my neighbors will hear the noise he makes and be up set and complain. I realize being near me is his goal but I can't be with him every minute of the day. He has to get use to being alone sometimes too.

His bad behavior comes and goes. Right now he is in the living room laying in the dog pen with his toys, by his choice. Goomba and other people are in the living room too. I did as someone suggested and make the doggie pen a play area when not being used for time out. What I do is tip it on its side (it's bottomless) so he can crawl into it. 

*fjm *- I agree all of these things are adding to his anxiety. Is this the Simple Solution you mentioned? I see they have male doggie dippers. I'll try them. Thanks.

As far as doing the things with Guido I use to do... he would lay on my bed with me. But now I'm breaking him and Goomba of being on the furniture, the bed included. Since peeing and pooping on the furniture he has lost his privilege, and I'm not sure I will go back to it allowing either of them on the furniture again. The doggie pen is bottomless so I can't put it in my bedroom, it's carpeted. But perhaps what will work is having a heart-to-heart talk with him sitting on my lap. I did it with him this afternoon and he looked at me and then looked away and at the floor, like he knew what I was saying... I'm going to try that is a form of reinforcement. Poodles are smart dogs, this little guy know how to push buttons. I might look into a doggie bed for him and put it at the foot of my bed.

Thank you all for your thoughts and ideas. Little by little I'm sure I'll get through this will help from all of you. Thanks again!


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## msminnamouse

You have to be consistent in everything you do. If you put him in the bathroom for continuous barking, you have to do it all the time, not just some of the time he barks continuously. And you can't let him out until he stops barking. Or he won't ever learn that barking is what lands him in time out and silence is what gets him freedom.

Good luck! Little yippy dogs can be stubborn.


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## fjm

I use the Simple Solution odour and stain remover - it came out very well in a Good Housekeeping style test, and helps me be far more relaxed in case of any incidents.


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## JE-UK

It sounds miserable for you.

Sometimes it helps to step back a bit, and realise that the dog doesn't KNOW he's being 'bad' .... he's just reacting to the world around him.

If he's already anxious, and he feels you are angry at him, he will sense that, which may be making him more anxious, which leads to more barking, which makes you angrier, which makes him more anxious, etc. etc. in a vicious circle!

Just like you would with a toddler, try and show him what you DO want, and see what you can do to make him less anxious. Find things that you can praise him for.

General rule is that a dog with something appropriate in his mouth can neither bark nor chew your sofa. Super appealing chew toys ... pigs ears, bull pizzles, real bones ... can help with this. Or stuff his dinner into a Kong and let him spend an hour working on that.

Dogs with excess energy are also likely to bark more. Try and get him out for a good hour of vigorous exercise, running with another dog or chasing a ball, and see if that helps.

I've heard of people having good luck with the DAP sprays; might be worthwhile trying that.

If the little guy is a rescue, he may just be more prone to anxiety because of his background. The more he has a stable calm routine, the more he'll be able to deal with things and be less anxious, and therefore show fewer behaviours that annoy you.


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## HiSocietyPoodle

Last night my dad attempted to take both dogs for a walk. They are small dogs. Some how they pulled him down and my dad hit his head on a tree. That the last straw. No more walks! Guido need to learn how to poop in his own yard.

We keep all the doors closed so the dogs are kept on the tile floor. Today my dad walked in his room and Guido followed behind him. He jumped on the bed, and took a huge pee and poop.

I realize dogs are a lot of work, but this dog had beat us down to a pulp. I'm not one for drama. I now know why he ended up in the dog pound.

But, I'm still unsure how to stop the barking.


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## msminnamouse

Your dogs NEED walks. Not just for exercise but for mental stimulation. Imagine being cooped up in your home all day, occasionally being allowed into the yard and that's it. No wonder your dog barks and acts out! 

Wear him out with exercise and he'll have less energy to put into barking and other ways of acting out.


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## fjm

I think you need help - you and your family are very understandably getting to the end of your tether with him, and that is bad for all of you. I would be looking for a really good behaviourist - someone with qualifications and professional affiliations - who would help me plan a way through it. And I do agree about exercise - is there a safe space you can take them to where they can really run and play? It would help enormously, especially with the barking. Even regular on-leash walks will help to reduce stress and tire your dog out. 

Dogs pee and poop on absorbent surfaces - like grass. I doubt he is doing it on the bed to deliberately annoy you - it is the only absorbent spot he can find. Horrible and infuriating, but not vindictive.

In your shoes I would be walking the dogs for at least 45 minutes twice a day, and going out with them - if necessary on leash and out of the yard - first thing, last thing, and every hour on the hour in between, until a pattern was established. I would set an alarm, and carry it with me, if that's what it took. Then every two hours, or whatever was necessary. Back to puppy basics, in fact. And I would also enroll in a good, reward based class, for help with loose leash walking, recall, and general support and advice.


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## Olie

I have no words of wisdom. I feel terrible for your dogs and family. I was feeling anxiety reading this! Its very hard to control your emotions when your exuasted and stressed out. I would be reaching outside of my home -somehow. I could NOT live with the constant barking and not able to figure out why.

Sorry I lack patience with things that get too out of control.


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## Feathersprings

HiSocietyPoodle said:


> Last night my dad attempted to take both dogs for a walk. They are small dogs. Some how they pulled him down and my dad hit his head on a tree. That the last straw. No more walks! Guido need to learn how to poop in his own yard.
> 
> We keep all the doors closed so the dogs are kept on the tile floor. Today my dad walked in his room and Guido followed behind him. He jumped on the bed, and took a huge pee and poop.
> 
> I realize dogs are a lot of work, but this dog had beat us down to a pulp. I'm not one for drama. I now know why he ended up in the dog pound.
> 
> But, I'm still unsure how to stop the barking.


I hope your Dad is ok.. I understand that you feel that way about the walks but that is only going to make things worse.. I also can see whaer even 2 small dogs could make someone lose balance and fall. I would say one at a time. 

Just a question.. are you looking for some sort of permission to give up on this situation?? I am meaning this in a nice way. This cant be an enjoyable situation for either you or the dogs. I know not everyone can go to a behaviorist or has time for all it takes to deal with a "problem" situation. You dont need permission to do what you think would be best for all of you. Right now it doesnt sound like you even like the dog enough to work thing out. Im sure that is getting through to him as well.. i may be reading all this wrong but you should be seeing positive results with all the advice you have been given and it doesnt sound like you are  It would be great if you could find him a place with someone with lots of home time and patience . I would hate to see him go back to the pound.. I think if he were mine.. and i am home all day , he would be with me every second, poor thing, LOL! unless he wanted to walk around tethered to me barking he would be quiet , unless he was going to pee on my foot he would be waiting to go outside LOL! I know he would require a lot of time and work. I read I think this started after another dog moving in the house.. is tha tright ? How was he before that if that was the case.. how long have you had him?


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## HiSocietyPoodle

*Todays Update...*

Today my dad strung a long doggie run in the backyard for Guido.

I did go to see someone/professional for help with Guido. She said he barks at the door to come in cause he has anxiety being away from me. She suggested the doggie run so he will play in the grass it will stimulate him to pee and poop outside. And he won't be able to sit and sulk at the front door as a constant reminder he wants to come in. I'm going to give him things to play with outside. Goomba doesn't have a problem outside he enjoys playing in the yard. So, we are going to give this a try. Guido was outside on the run today and no non-stop barking. So that's a good start.

Another thing that I'm finding helps is keeping both dogs in the doggie pen at night to sleep with all their toys and blankets and etc... I think on some level it puts them both on the same dog pack level. And neither dog is getting special privilege sleeping on the bed anymore. Last night there was no all night barking. That was a good thing. I am finding it takes a while of repeated patterns of what we are doing. And when we fall out of the pattern that's when things fall apart. 


*Feathersprings* -- I can't give the dog away. I discussed it with my dad. He told me that if I do he will never give me anything again. (Guido was a gift from him). So, placing him in another home isn't an option. And, I know that when my house guests leave in the spring and Goomba isn't here then Guido will not act out. He will feel like he's the big dog and the issues with be minimized.

*fjm* -- I respect your thoughts. I'm not sure I feel as you do about the absorbent surfaces. Why does he go on the furniture when he can go on the carpet? I believe he is acting out. Maybe vindictive isn't the right word for me to use but the dog is telling me/us something by climbing on the furniture to poop. There is not reason to go when the dog was outside all day. The professional I spoke with said it is not normal to climb on the furniture to releave them-self. Walks are now out of the question with my elderly dad taking a fall and hitting his head on the tree yesterday. I will take them for a walk when I can. You are right about setting up a routine. I'm noticing it makes a difference like I mentioned about their new sleeping arrangements. Thanks for the idea about the reward based lessons.

*msminnamouse* -- The profession said the same thing mental stimulation goes a long way... Thanks for the idea.

*Thank you all for taking the time to read this thread and make suggestions, give ideas and lend me much needed support. *


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## msminnamouse

Your welcome. I hope it gets better for you. But some dogs need daily walks. And not just once a day but multiple times a day. If you can't do it, then please see about hiring a dog walker. If you don't have funds to support this, then try getting a neighborhood kid to walk them for a lower rate.

My dog has separation anxiety, even when other people are home but I'm not. This is the only time that she destroys things. So I give her stuffed Kongs and chews to keep her occupied and out of trouble when I have to be away. It works for her. She's very food motivated. But if I go some place that is dog friendly, I'm sure to bring her along. It stimulates her mind and it's exciting for her, even if she lays down everywhere we go. Most importantly, it gets her out of the house, it's something out of the ordinary, and drains some of her excess energy so if I have to leave her alone, she'll most likely spend it napping instead of fretting. A walk would work the same way for your dogs.

Please note that I don't leave her in the car. I mean places that she can go in with me. I would never suggest leaving animals alone in unattended cars for more than a few seconds.


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## HiSocietyPoodle

*Anti barking air collar?*

Just wanted to report back in and update all of you to the progress we are making.

The run in the back yard is good, but he still feels the need to bark from time to time.

I've been taking them to the dog park for exercise and mental stimulation. Guido hasn't peed or pooped in the house since then. I hope I'm not talking too soon.

I'm also working on training new tricks.

But he still barks... Has anymore had any luck with the collar that blows a blast of air in their face to stop the barking?


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## fjm

I think you need to look at why he is barking, rather than just a quick fix to stop the barking. Squash one thing, and it may emerge as something worse - there are far more difficult behaviours to fix than barking.


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## ziggylu

We went through an incessant barking phase with Cosmo a few months ago. I thought I was going to lose my mind actually as it seemed like for a bit he was barking all day long. In the end, our efforts to stop the barking were making it worse actually....we've since learned he barks either when overstimulated or for attention. It was pretty easy to stop the barking for attention once we figured that out(remember negative attention IS attention so we were reinforcing his barking when we were trying to stop it by some of the methods you've tried. )

Ignoring him has worked to stopped the attention seeking barking. We did have to live through a period where it intensified before it got better. we'd turn our back or close a door when he barked at us, the second he'd stop we'd turn around or open the door, praise and play, repeat as needed(at first many times as he'd typically start barking right away again)

The attention barking has stopped for the most part. We were at my mom's house last night and I was playing tug with him. At one point he got a bit rough and went after my sweater instead of the the tug toy so I took it away and stoppped playing. he started barking at me, I said "too bad, we're done" and sat down on the sofa. He quit barking and walked away to the kitchen to see what my sister was doing. My dad thought it was hilarious how quickly he gave up. 

He still barks when overstimulated and this is different than the attention so we handle it differently(for us it's easy to tell the difference as his bark changes vocally - gets much more high pitched - when he's overstimulated) I typically will start doing some eye contact exercises to get him focused on me again(I use a clicker for this. he makes eye contact, click, and treat). I do these until he looks like he's starting to relax, ask him for a down-stay, have him hold it a bit, praise, pet, release and then divert him to something else. Sometimes he'll stay focused on whatever overstimulated him(around the house, typically a shadow) so I might have to do this a couple times. 

You will probably see improvement as well if you can keep him really well-exercised(though remember the fitter he gets, the more exercise he will need!). We see a real difference in barking(and everything else) if we haven't given him ample time to really romp during the week. Too many days of just leash walking - even if we're doing 4-6 miles a day - he gets really antsy.


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## HiSocietyPoodle

*PetSafe Deluxe Little-Dog Bark Control Collar*

Hi All!

I'm back with an update with the good progress we've made and etc... by keeping both dogs together in a doggie pen at night to sleep together it is a really good thing. At night around bed time they go out and do their thing outside then they come in and run over to the doggie pen with their tails wagging to go in. All their toys are in there and a comfy blanket. In the day time we tip it on its side and Guido lays on the blanket and plays with his toys. Goomba could care less about it, but again, he's not the problem, Guido is.

The peeing and pooping in the house is still happening, no matter what I do. It's not as bad, but its still an issue. I don't understand why Guido won't pee and poop in his own yard. Millions of other dogs do their business in their yard. Why can't he?

The barking is still out of control. Goomba will bark when there is reason to bark. But Guido is out of control still. I have tried everything. And complaints are coming from everyone from every direction that he is a public nuisance. I'm embarrassed to admit this. They are right.

So today I took a ride to the pet store and bought a electric shock device. I'm sorry for those who think it cruel, but I don't. I'm at my wits end and have no other option. It's called ]PetSafe Deluxe Little-Dog Bark Control Collar. It was about $100- I read the directions there are a few tricks to it working right, you have to be sure its tight enough to make contact, yet not too tight around their neck. And the little devise must stay centered on their voice box in order for it to work properly. As I'm now reading on different sites it has mixed reviews, some people love it and others don't. I'm going to keep a positive mind set and pray it works. The directions say it takes 2 weeks to become effective. The store has a 30 day return policy so its well worth a try.

Has anyone here in Poodle-land had any luck with this device? 

Anyone else have any other ideas that have works with an excessive nuisance toy poodle barker? :alien2:

Maybe this will save his tail from going back to doggie jail.


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## JE-UK

Sorry, no advice other than I wouldn't use a shock collar. They are cruel, they can lead to all sorts of other problems, and for a dog that is already anxious, it can be like throwing petrol on a fire.

I'd return it and spend the money on some time with a good behaviourist.


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## JE-UK

Shock collars have been banned in Wales, and are likely to be banned in the rest of the UK.

If you want another view, try http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/download/9460/ESC-Evidence-Paper.pdf and http://www.rspca.org.uk/ImageLocator/LocateAsset?asset=document&assetId=1232713013325&mode=prd.

Quote:
_Schilder and colleagues (2004) compared the behaviour of dogs trained using shock collars with a control group of dogs, during both free walking in a park and training sessions. They found that in both situations the dogs previously trained using shock collars showed more behaviours associated with stress than dogs trained in similar way, but without shock collars. They concluded that the dogs associated the presence of the handler with the aversive shock, as they were showing fearful behaviour even when free walked in a different context._


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## HiSocietyPoodle

*Schizophrenic Barking*

The shock collar was short lived. It cost me $100 and he chewed it off. What a waste of money that was... 

I can't take the barking anymore, neither can my neighbors. I really believe he is Schizophrenic he hears things that aren't there. The other dog doesn't bark, Goomba looks at Guido like he has lost his mind. 

The behaviorist said DRUG THE DOG.

*PLEASE help me -- any other ideas how to STOP THE BARKING!* I really don't want to bring him to the dog pound, but something has to stop him.


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## Feathersprings

You had a time when he wasnt like this , right.. Maybe you should talk to your vet.. do you think it is a kind of anxiety disorder ? You might try a thunderhirt.. 
Thundershirt | The Best Dog Anxiety Treatment

This was recommended to us for our dog with severe anxiety. They really work. Sort of like Swaddling a baby.. it is very soothing.. really you can give it sort of a try with a t-shirt or something wrapped snugly ( not so tight it cuts off circulation) around the dog..but the thunder shirt work much better.


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## 2719

It appears that a lot of people have suggested any number of things to you and Guido just continues to be a barking poodle. I am so glad some things have turned around for you and him and he sleeps quietly at night.

I will will just add my suggestion..I really like NILIF. Maybe you could try it?http://www.westwinddogtraining.com/NILIF.pdf

I wish you the best with this little guy.


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## robin

Your vet can supply you with anti-anxiety and/or doggie prozac as a last-chance idea. both are cheap. I think it's important right now to break the cycle -- it sounds as if he's getting more and more wound up.

I'd try that Thundershirt too.

And I'm reallyreallyreally glad that shock collar broke. ^_^ I hate those things.


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## JE-UK

It's a real pity that dogs don't come with a remote control :smile:.

If I understand correctly ... 

A behaviourist has said the dog is anxious. The dog is limited to exercise in the back yard, i.e. doesn't routinely get walked. There are housetraining issues. The dog barks "too much". 

When? With what stimulus? When he wants attention from you? When he hears someone outside?

Any change in his behaviour is going to require an investment of time on your part. There is no quick fix. If there were, there would be fewer dogs in shelters.

If it were my dog, there are tons of things I would do .... 

First, I'd get the dog good and tired each and every day, long walks, time at the dog park, games of fetch. 

Then, I start some organised activity with him ... flyball, obedience training, agility, nose work, anything to engage his brain.

THEN, I would start working on the barking and reward the heck out of him whenever he's not barking and is quiet and calm. I'd invest in Kongs and feeder toys to engage him. I'd get Susan Garrett's crate games dvd and work through that. I'd do all I could to make him feel calm and secure and entertained when I can't be paying attention to him. I'd close all curtains, or use baby gates to fence him off from glass doors, to reduce the barking stimulus. 

There are loads of things to do, but there is no quick fix. If you can't invest the time to help him through this, and the dog is a nuisance, there are some really good poodle rescue groups that can help you rehome him.


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## fjm

Absolutely agree with JE - and remember behaviour change can take months, rather than hours or days. Drugs may help to break the cycle, but they are not going to solve the problem of a highly stressed dog that has become so reactive. More exercise, less stress, would be my starting point. Does Goomba not go home soon?


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## neVar

It takes time. I'm on year two and still dealing with issues with one dog. 

1- have you tried a husher muzzle? It's an elastic muzzle muffles the barking bu they can breath/pant. IT tires them out when barking. IT was a godsend on one barker rescue dog of mine (RIP TIgger) 

2- spray collar- however if he chews off the collar you have to find a way to stop that tobasco sauce the hell out of it

3- if he's still showing signs of seperation anxiety i would talk to your vet about medications to help over this lump. Also there are some good herbal suppliments out there. I had huge success with Alpha Omega Easy rest (Think that's the name) with my seperation anxiety riddled dog. 

4- makes ure he's getting LOTS Of mental exercise. Maybe it's time to go get into some agility classes? Obedience? NO it doesn't always work to stop things like barking etc- but at least you know he'll be being met mentally for his stimulation needs.


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## HiSocietyPoodle

*Tourette Syndrome?*

Has anyone heard of Tourette Syndrome in dogs?

I'm wondering if Tourette Syndrome is what he has.

I contacted BARK BUSTERS. $700.00 for a lifetime guarantee, or $500- for 6 months. My chin hit the floor when they told me the price.


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## Feathersprings

Why would you think that ?? I think you need to go back and try and remember what at what point things changed with him and how things were before that time. I remember you said things changed when you brought another dog into the home. How was he before that? Any barking problem? Any peeing and pooping in the house ? I just cant imagine the amount of stress all of you are under but your solutions need to be reasonable. You never need to take him to the pound... you can always contact a good rescue that would assess him and get him into a proper placement. I am so sorry there have been all these problems for him and you... there have been lots of really great suggestions thrown out there and I dont know which if any you have implemented but if you cant , dont have time or dont want to it could be time to move him along to someone that has the time and patience to turn him back into a happy poodle friend  Wish there was an easy fix!


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## HiSocietyPoodle

Hi All!

I wanted to report back and let you all know that things are better. 

Using the shock collar is working. I don't know if its a psychological thing or if the little zaps he gets stop him but it has cut back the barking about 85-90%. I'm so happy!

The two dogs love, love, love sleeping in their doggie pen together at night. They are all happy tails wagging when it's bed time and they run into the pen and find a spot and lay down. They stay there until the morning. 

Then in the morning Guido wears the collar during the day. If he's been good and doesn't attempt to start barking, like the crazy dog he was, I it take it off. And like another poster mentioned in an earlier post, all I have to do is shake it at him or show it to him and he stops. And on a rare occasion when he wouldn't we put the collar on him and shortly there after he stops. The directions did say that it might take 2 week in order for it to work.

I have been working with them doing tricks for treats. They do sit, down, roll over, and the new trick are they now give kisses, and high fives. 

The peeing and pooping in the house isn't as bad as it was. But Guido really has issues with not pooping in his own yard. They are spending more time outside in the yard as my dad does yard work all day so the dogs are with him and not outside by themselves. So that's better.

I still wonder why a dog doesn't want to poop in their own yard? 

Thank you all for your ideas, suggestions, support and encouragement. You helped me through a difficult time. Thanks!


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## Rayah-QualitySPs

HiSocietyPoodle said:


> Hi All!
> 
> 
> Then in the morning Guido wears the collar during the day. If he's been good and doesn't attempt to start barking, like the crazy dog he was, I it take it off.
> 
> The peeing and pooping in the house isn't as bad as it was. But Guido really has issues with not pooping in his own yard.
> 
> I still wonder why a dog doesn't want to poop in their own yard?


Poodle are very smart. They do not take punishment well. To a poodle *any* attention whether _positive or negative_ is attention.

Poodle thrive with _consistency_. If you are going to try something give it a decent amount of time before saying it does not work. Throwing things at toy poodles is not always safe. The cans with coins inside are meant to startle a dog but I think your boy it barking for *attention*. Throwing things at him or shaking a collar at him are *attention*. When you do this you are reinforcing his barking.

If you could stop paying so much attention to the barking it would not happen as much. Put the shock collar on all day and_ leave_ it on. Why are you taking it off? It should fit properly and not bother the dog unless he barks. Of course, continue to take it off for the night.

There are many reason why poodles will not poop in certain places. Sometimes it is because something scared them when they were pooping or someone yelled at them. Often they are embarrassed. Sometimes they just do not want to go with people watching. One of my boys would only poop if he had something to lean his bum on. It was like he was always trying to hide his poop in a bush.

One of the ways I would deal with the pooping is to teach both dogs to go poop on command.

Generally I do this with puppies so you may need to tweak my method a bit.

First make sure you are feeding on a schedule. With puppies it would be three times a day but you could probably just feed twice a day. This is for both dogs. Feed at the _same_ time everyday - even weekends. Only give them the food for 10 or 15 minutes. Then take away the bowl.

I watch the dog to see him need to go the bathroom. Try and figure out the dogs elimination schedule. As soon as you see him start to poop or sniffing around like he is going to poop pick a word to say so he associates the word with going poop. My dogs run back and forth before they go.

Try to use a word you do not use at any other time.. maybe Hurry Up, Do Your Duty or even Go Poop. Reward with a small treat after the dog has finished. Make sure he is really done because you do not want to stop him in the middle. Some poodles are smart enough to figure out how to get more than one treat this way.

Within 2 weeks if *you* are _consistent_ he should be figuring out the command and you should have his elimination schedule figured out. Then you can tell him to go when you want.

Having two poodles makes this a little easier because if you do this with both poodles Guido will learn from Gomba.

Good luck.


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## HiSocietyPoodle

*Update*

Hi All!

I wanted to post an update. Guido hasn't pee'd or pooped in the house in months. I can't remember that last time he has. He is the sweet nice, playful, little dog he was when I got him, now that Goomba isn't here... 

Guido sleeps in the doggie pen at night, he has his bed in there and his toys. He goes in the the doggie pen when I'm not home and he's okay with it. So no more destructive behavior in the garbage can, peeing or pooping on the furniture.

His barking has reduced considerably with the zap collar. He still barks when the garbage truck or a truck drives by. He also has something that makes him bark for no reason at all; no noise or sounds provokes it, its something imaginary in his head that is causing it. If something starts his day off early and he barks, he is on high alert and will be vocal during the day. --- I've also noticed he doesn't very bark at night. I don't know why. But, when his day time barking gets to me I put the zap collar on, or show it to him and it reduces the barking considerably.

I take him out and walk him almost every day or every other day, even if it's to the end of the driveway. He now pee's and poops in the yard now.

*Rayah-QualitySPs* -- You are right consistency is the key. 

I wanted to thank everyone for their support and help through the difficult time trying to cope.


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## Feathersprings

Im so glad to hear progress has been made!


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## Rowan

Yay, another happy ending! They say you don't pick dogs but they pick you. Perhaps this little guy was meant to teach you something about yourself, and he's taught you that you're determined, committed and don't give up no matter what the odds. (And you're also incredibly patient!)  

Congrats!


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## HiSocietyPoodle

It wasn't easy but he's much better. My next door neighbor has little kids that play out doors and Guido barks when they scream. As a result I put the collar on him and he stops.

But the true test is when Goomba returns in a few weeks for the winter.


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## msminnamouse

Shock collars are a bandaid for barking, not a cure. Which is why the better trainers don't use them or recommend them. They're an easier alternative to actual training.


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## minipoodlelover

Hello HiSocietyPoodle,

I wasn't a member here when you first started this thread, but I have read through it and I'm so happy you have experienced improvement. It must have been extremely difficult for you and your family to live through such a stressful time, and I empathize. A lot of people would have called it quits, especially after your father fell and got hurt. Instead, you didn't give up, and you helped a needy dog in the process. I sincerely hope there is no regression when Goomba returns. Rooting for you and Guido!


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## HiSocietyPoodle

minipoodlelover -- Thank you. I'm so happy that Guido had learned to poop in his own yard. It took quite a while but he finally learned. I think part of it is he senses when I'm sick and not well and can't walk him, he goes in the yard. 

msminnamouse -- You have no idea what my neighbors, family I have been through. I had no other alternative but use the zap collar. If you read this thread I tried everything. The zap collars aren't banded cause I bought one in my local pet store. *Please post the easier alternatives you are speaking of. *


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## msminnamouse

I did read through this whole thread. Using a shock collar IS the easier alternative to training.


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## fjm

I am glad things are better for you, although I too dislike shock collars - they repress the behaviour but don't teach the dog an alternative, and repressed behaviour can rebound in unexpected and unpleasant ways. I do suspect that you may quickly find yourself back at square one when Goomba is back in the house, though - it always sounded as if most of the problems came from Guido's anxiety at sharing his home with Goomba, and I'm not sure that anxiety has really been addressed. I do hope I am wrong, though!


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## JE-UK

Yes, fjm and msminnamouse have said it ... shock collars are cruel, they are a lazy way to manage (not cure) a problem, and did I say they were cruel?

When I imagine using such a device on my dog, it makes me feel quite ill ... my dog who trusts me, works for me, tolerates all sorts of inexplicable (to him) weirdnesses for me, makes me laugh every day, makes coming home a joy ... it would be a very poor repayment for me to then scare and hurt him by shocking, especially for a normal dog behaviour that I had never bothered to understand or to explain to him (in a way he can understand) that I'd really prefer he not do.

There are some good resources here for a) understanding why your dog is barking and b) helping him find other ways to express himself. Worth a read.


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## msminnamouse

I scanned back over this thread. Several things stand out. 



> It started with Guido peeing on the furniture out of defiance. I scolded him but it did little good. I walked him and the other dog daily. And now Guido is jumping on the sofa and peeing and pooping on it. So at night I confined him in a a doggie pen. Guido is spring loaded and able to jump out in the middle of the night when no one is watching and pee's and poops on the sofa out of spite.
Click to expand...

You need to get this kind of thinking out of your head. It doesn't make sense. Dogs don't do things out of spite or out of defiance. When they do something, they have a perfectly logical reason, to them, for why they are doing it. Your dog isn't "out to get you or to get back at you". You're setting yourself up to be angry at your dog and that doesn't accomplish anything and often makes things worse.

In regards to chewing on furniture, if redirecting his chewing to something that he CAN chew on doesn't work, grab his leash and take him away from what he's chewing on. Then bring him right back to try again. Take him away every time he starts to chew and bring him back to try again. Praise and reward when he stops the chewing.

You also said that you discipline him. How exactly did you accomplish this? This may be the stem of the reason why he's not responding to what you did to try to correct his behaviors.

Squirting him when he barks is worthless. A lot of dogs even enjoy biting at streams of water. You made barking either a fun game or you caused him more stress and alarm by doing it which would increase his barking.

And I take back when I said this


> If that doesn't work, you can fill a can with coins and shake it whenever he chews on something bad. It's loud and distracting and will take his mind off of chewing on whatever he is chewing on.


That was bad advice. 



> The spray bottle is no longer working and time out in the doggie pen/crate accelerates the barking and whining.


You didn't follow directions at all. You were told by multiple people not to put him in a time out in his crate/pen because it will cause his crate/pen to become a negative place for him. You were told to put him in a time out in an enclosed room that he often doesn't go into with no chews or toys. Put him in there every time that he barks. Take him out when he stops. Putting him in there in there is the consequence for barking, taking him out is the reward for stopping the barking. 

Yes, it requires more work, time, commitment and thinking than a spray bottle or shock collar but it works if you commit to it. 



> I did tether the dog to a spot and he peed in it when I wasn't looking.


You tether the dog to YOU. Tie the leash around your waist. He may like being tethered to you but it will enable you to keep a constant eye on him. He won't have a chance to potty inside because you will always be there to catch him. All you have to do is interrupt him each time and rush him outside to finish, then reward him for going outside, never inside. 

Later, when he no longer is going potty in the house, you can stop the tethering and work on his gaining some independence. AFTER he has earned the privilege to have free reign of the house. Going potty inside is abusing that privilege and he should lose the privilege until he earns it. 

A muzzle will NOT stop him from barking and is a really bad idea for him to wear all the time, the only dogs that are suitable for wearing a muzzle all the time is one that has to wear an E-collar but won't tolerate it and the muzzle has to be a basket muzzle so they can eat, drink, and pant while wearing it, which other muzzles don't allow. It is a last resort to muzzle a dog all the time and barking won't stop with a muzzle and it's not a good reason for a muzzle.

If his crate/pen is now a negative place for him, you need to do your best to make it a positive place again. Besides what I said earlier, start feeding him in his crate/pen, give him treats and chews in his crate/pen and don't only put him in it when you have to leave or when he has to go to sleep. Make it a fun and calming retreat for him, his very own place. Leave the door open all the time when he's not in it for him to go to it for naps and such.

It just seems kind of pointless to continue reading the rest of this thread again. You _sound_ like all you want to try is the easiest and quickest thing. You never enlisted the help of a trainer, let alone a qualified trainer. You don't seem committed to anything that requires real work, which is what real training is. But real training gets real results. I doubt that you need a veterinary behaviorist if you find a QUALIFIED and GOOD trainer and follow to the letter what they advise you. 

If you don't know where to find one, ask your local dog rescues who they use and recommend. Rescues often have problem dogs, the trainers they work with should be experienced, properly educated and qualified. Again, NO Cesar Millan type trainers who rely on dominance and force. Experts at the top of their fields when it comes to dog behavior and dog psychology don't condone him and his methods. 

If you're not willing to put in the effort and time to training your dog, then it's pretty safe to assume that most things won't get better on their own.

Easy, quick "fixes" like a shock collar usually achieve quick, non-lasting results, if they don't make things worse first.


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## Rowan

HiSocietyPoodle said:


> It wasn't easy but he's much better. My next door neighbor has little kids that play out doors and Guido barks when they scream. As a result I put the collar on him and he stops.
> 
> But the true test is when Goomba returns in a few weeks for the winter.


Okay, if my three MPOOs are outside and they hear the neighborhood children shriek and squeal, they bark too, but I would never put a shock collar on them. _Ever_. I agree with the above sentiments about shock collars--they don't change a behaviour but merely mask or bury it. 

(Personally, I feel like _screaming _when I hear children shrieking & squealing so I understand the barking.) 

I prefer redirection and positive reinforcement. It takes longer to accomplish, but it's well worth it. For instance, if we're outside and the kids squeal, Pippin will often bark. I immediately get his attention, call him to me, put him in a sit and use Victoria Stilwell's "watch me" command. Once I have his attention and he's quiet, I praise him* and he goes wild, running in circles. If he barks again, I repeat the exercise only this time I ask him to do something (down, stay, heel, etc.). Poodles are incredibly intelligent and they love to please you--above all they enjoy a challenge. *If your poo is food motivated, use food and praise. 

If Pippin is really riled up and continues to bark, I quietly put the poos inside with little or no reaction/emotion. They want to be outside with me and they soon learn they can only join me if they're quiet. Dog wants something, dog soon learns what he must do to get it.  Dog does 'A' and is praised, dog wants to repeat said behaviour for more praise. 

So, lots of praise when you get the behaviour you desire, and calm, redirection when you don't. It's not an instant fix, but it will _stop _the unwanted behaviour and will help you bond with your dog.

Someone mentioned earlier that dogs don't do things out of spite. They don't do things in retaliation or out of anger or jealousy either. It's not in their nature and it's what makes them special, at least to me. To attribute human form, emotions or personality to a dog is anthropomorphizing them, and it's the biggest obstacle most dog owners face when trying to understand their canine friends.


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## fjm

To tell a story:

Sam is not quite 4 years old, and lives with his guardian. She tries to be kind, she gives him regular meals and sometimes takes him to the swings to play, but she is often unwell, and does not understand small boys very well. Sam's absolutely favourite games are running around the garden pretending to be a fire engine, talking to the children across the street, and painting pictures. His guardian worries about the neighbours, and smacks him when he makes a noise in the garden. She doesn't like the mess his painting makes, and smacks him if he touches anything with painty fingers. She doesn't approve of the children across the street, and smacks him if he calls to them. Sam doesn't understand why these things are naughty, but after a while he sits quietly in a corner, rocking backwards and forwards. His guardian is pleased because he is quiet.

Sometimes his guardian's stepson, Harry, comes to visit. Sam is a bit frightened of him, and deep down is worried his guardian likes the other boy better, and may not want to look after Sam anymore. He squabbles with Harry, and is scolded for it. After a few days he starts wetting the bed, and his guardian gets even crosser. She talks to some people at church, who say he is doing it to get back at her - now Sam is also smacked for wetting the bed ...


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## minipoodlelover

HiSocietyPoodle - I think you have been given some excellent concrete advice here; positive actions that you can implement on a consistent basis. I had never heard of shock collars until I read this thread, and I don't like to judge when I'm not the one living with the situation that you are. However, the collar does sound awful  I really hope you don't use it, and find your way through without it. You have my utmost sympathy!


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