# Raw Diet



## CurlyDog (Aug 20, 2008)

Raleigh was in for booster shots today. We saw one of the vets, but not my first choice vet. She really frowned on the raw diet. Why is it that so many vets don't agree with it? What has your experience been?


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

You really have to find a vet who has taken it upon themselves to do additional research (outside of what little is included in vet school) on canine nutrition. Most vets simply don't know enough about it. Additionally, there are a lot of people who feed an incorrect raw diet, which YES can be unbalanced and then their will be issues.

Like I said in another thread, the only issues that occur in a raw diet are human error.

I am so happy I have my new integrative vet (holistic integrated with western medicine). She couldn't have been happier when I said I was feeding homemade raw.

ETA: Among the raw feeders that I know (real life friends and acquaintances on forums), a good portion have learned not to disclose their diet to their vet. Which is a BUMMER because knowledge of diet is an aspect of the overall health of any animal. It takes years of seeing how wonderfully healthy raw fed dogs are from clients before some vets begin to lighten up to the idea.

It's the same reason why some vets (ie the vet I just left) claim that your dog is not adequately protected if you get the 3 year rabies instead of the 1 year rabies. Or vets who insist that yearly DHLPPV cocktail vaccine must be given. Etc. Etc.


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## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

My experience has been 100% positive. 

I am ecstatic about their health, behavior (yes behavior), teeth, enjoyment to eat and reduced shedding with the Poms. 

Dislike - their nails grow so fast!! LOL

Oh, and my vet knows I feed one of my dogs Raw...:alberteinstein:


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## CurlyDog (Aug 20, 2008)

I did find a holistic vet that I like that supports feeding raw. He has even written two books. I decided not to keep going because it is too far and a lot more expensive. The guy that owns the practice I go to supports it but not all his employees do. I just need to make appointments further in advance so I get the vet I want to see.


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

The makers of dog food are very involved with the education of vets. I'm sure that's a factor.

My vet's not wild about the raw food diet, either, but I respect him greatly in all other ways, so I keep going. One of the young technicians, fresh from school I'm sure, gave me a big, long spiel one day on how the therapy dog places won't allow therapy dogs to be raw fed, and shouldn't I realize that that must mean the diet is nasty dirty icky? (It's true about therapy dogs, and I think the organizations are wrong, but that's not up to me.) I just laughed and said, "Hey, Hobbit, good thing you're not a therapy dog, huh?"

All animals (and that includes humans!) have better health if they eat the food which they evolved to eat. The closer to nature that food is, the better it is. Dogs, domesticated from wolves, evolved to eat meat. Real meat is as close to nature as I can get without raising and slaughtering the animals myself. (If I lived on a farm and could raise rabbits and / or chickens...)

All that said, I do keep some high-quality kibble around for "emergencies" (forgot to thaw something) and the occasional meal for other various reasons, but for the most part, it's meat, organs, fish, and sometimes a bit of veggies or fruit as a treat. Dogs have no need for grains. 

Speaking of kibble...while we were away on vacation, my mom was taking care of the dogs, and I didn't want her to have to mess with raw, so, once what was in fridge was out, I told her to feed kibble. When we came back, Flame's gumline was *caked* with it! :ahhhhh: Got her some pork neck bones tout suite! 

--Q


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Quossom - that's why I chose TDI (therapy dogs international) for therapy - they allow raw fed dogs unlike Delta.

Millie is a raw fed therapy dog and proud of it!


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

Oh! I did not know that! Thanks for the info. Good for TDI!!!

--Q


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## caboodles (Jan 7, 2011)

Let's be REAL. Vets don't promote the RAW diet for one reason, and one reason only... $$$.

Same reason why they are always on top of their "reminders" for annual vaccinations. Like really, do my indoor cats desperately NEED to be vaccinated against rabies EVERY single year and kept up-to-date? THEY NEVER LEAVE THE HOUSE!! 

OK, but back onto the subject of RAW diets. I think we need to all keep in mind that vets operate similar to our own family doctors. Every prescription THEY write, THEY get a cut from it. And so the SAME thing goes with the "great" food they promote. Every sale = bonus in their pocket. YES, they DO care about your animals so they aren't trying to shove canine potato chips down their throats, but at the end of the day, I'm sure they believe that "if it don't make dollars, it don't make sense".


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## CurlyDog (Aug 20, 2008)

I think you are right about money, but in a less direct manner in a lot of cases. The vets that I have known don't sell food. I think what they learn in vet school is influenced heavily by the big companies that make kibble, so they learn that kibble is best. Also, who is giving research money to the vet schools, but the big manufacturers. I just wonder how it is that they don't stay connected after school. What bothers me is that I don't come close to the knowledge that a veterinarian has, so why should I know better? Yet, I constantly wonder, how can they think that Purina is adequate? Why don't we have veterinarians in forums? There seems to be a big disconnect. 

We have a neat dog food store here in Pittsburgh. They sell all kinds of high quality kibbles and pre made raw. The owner feeds her dog raw meat and bones and actively promotes that despite the fact that she is in business to sell kibble. I think she is smart. She realizes that most people won't go to the extent of feeding meat and bones but that the trend is in the direction of feeding higher quality foods to our pets.


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## Rowan (May 27, 2011)

I chose 'other' because I feed my poodles mostly cooked meats (_very _rare beef/buffalo, jack mackerel, but cooked poultry/fish and ground meats). I mix in a small amount of "pulverized" vegetables, and on rare occasions some fruit, but no grains. I supplement with EFAs, probiotics and digestive enzymes, bone meal and vit/minerals (just to be safe). The vet I see specializes in holistic medicine but frowns upon the raw diet (but that didn't impact my decision).

So far I've had no health problems in the two I raised from puppies. The rescues all showed 180-degree turns in health after starting the diet (I don't even want to know what they were eating previously). Interestingly enough, my latest rescue was allegedly eating a raw diet and had a mouthful of rotting teeth and a yeast infection in both ears. At 5.5 years of age, this threw me for a loop. He was also missing a number of teeth (congenital or ??). The remaining upper teeth were extracted, except for his canines, and he has a few molars, pre-molars, incisors and both lower canines. 

Now I'm just doing my best to ensure he keeps his remaining teeth with daily brushing, etc.


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## Princess Dollie (Jan 15, 2011)

CurlyDog said:


> Raleigh was in for booster shots today. We saw one of the vets, but not my first choice vet. She really frowned on the raw diet. Why is it that so many vets don't agree with it? What has your experience been?


I chose mixed raw because I'm feeding a combo of pre-packaged and real raw right now.

I have not had any issues with my vets (there's three in the office), because I never gave them the option. One of the vet techs (who is also Dollie's groomer) has GSDs and is very holistic and will ask ME what I think of raw. Like I know without your guy's knowledge...hah, hah.


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## schnauzerpoodle (Apr 21, 2010)

There are 2 vets in the clinic that we usually go. One is strongly against raw. One is okay with it. Neither of them has tried to stop me from what I am doing. Both are very impressed with Nickel's health and his dental condition.

We also go to a holistic vet, when needed. And of course, he's super happy with what I'm feeding Nickel.

We go to 2 different schools and all the trainers from the 2 schools are pro-raw.

Now I need to find a boarding facility that will administer the raw diet. I give kibbles to Nickel as treat so I think he can have kibbles as his meals for a few days, if needed.


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## CurlyDog (Aug 20, 2008)

Wow! I'm impressed that the vast majority are feeding raw or a combination. I realize that the poll is biased in that the forum members are likely to have a greater than normal interest in their pets' nutrition. The average pet owner buys Iams if the vet says to and feeds it for the duration. I know that's what I did for years. And all along, I was proud of that fact that I was feeding a "premium brand". Blech! I wish I'd known better. It was only about 4 years ago that I opened my eyes.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Curlydog - before I bought Millie - I had just graduated college and moved home. My mom was switching Henry from Purina One to Wellness. I remember thinking to myself, "when I get my dog, there's no way I am feeding that expensive, holistic crap!"

Ha. Look at me now. I got Millie, she was on Eukanuba. I fed her that for a few weeks. Then I started researching better kibbles. I was suddenly determined to feed the best kibble possible. Meanwhile, my mom was giving Henry Nature's Variety premade raw with his kibble. I thought my mom was nuts. Then, as I researched top kibbles, I became more and more determined to do the BEST for Millie. Then, I added pre-made raw to her food. THEN, I learned about homemade raw, and here we are!  I'm as nuts as they come.


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## Yaddaluvpoodles (Mar 20, 2010)

caboodles said:


> Let's be REAL. Vets don't promote the RAW diet for one reason, and one reason only... $$$.
> 
> .


Agreed, 100%.. but I'd like to let a few vets off of the hook. Most vets really do care what happens with animals that's one of the reasons they chose their profession. But while being educated for that profession, they had a bunch of propaganda forcefed to them and shoved into their brains by the people who do benefit financially. When I first started feeding raw, my vet (newly licensed and just out of school), ripped me apart for it. Felt that people who fed raw didn't care about their dogs and that it was so damaging to the dogs that it bordered on cruelty. She told me about studies she had participated in and how most raw fed dogs had a heavy load of parasites and that by the time they were 8 or 9 years old, had broken teeth. As she promoted her bags of Science Diet to me, she was passionate. This woman truly does care about animals. She just believes what she was taught by the experts.. and doesn't have much room left in her mind for anything else. She really thinks that what she is doing is in the dogs best interests. 

There in lies a lesson for each of us. Over and over again, I see lack of tolerance and condemnation.. and even bigger problem, a basic lack of respect for others. 

It's tragic, that people can't be open and honest with their vets, that there isn't a basic respect with the best interests of the dog at heart.


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## Spencer (Oct 7, 2009)

I chose other because I have fed Tate high quality kibble, soft food, home made and raw.

I would love to switch completely to raw to Tate and TQ - the month Tate was completely on raw cleaned who knows how many years of tartar off of his teeth to where they were WHITE and looked brand new - but I'm still quite intimidated by it. I've done the math and research, and between the two of them they would eat nothing and it would be so much cheaper and healthier than kibble. But like I said, still intimidated.

I told my mom that I needed a Raw for Dummies coach to tell me everything to put in every meal, every day. Perhaps like a "raw feeding" parrot to just sit on my shoulder and tell me everything, lol, which days to put organs, liver, etc.

Kudos to you that are already feeding your dogs complete raw, and I hope I can get there within the year!


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Spencer said:


> I chose other because I have fed Tate high quality kibble, soft food, home made and raw.
> 
> I would love to switch completely to raw to Tate and TQ - the month Tate was completely on raw cleaned who knows how many years of tartar off of his teeth to where they were WHITE and looked brand new - but I'm still quite intimidated by it. I've done the math and research, and between the two of them they would eat nothing and it would be so much cheaper and healthier than kibble. But like I said, still intimidated.
> 
> ...


You can do it! I promise, after a few weeks of feeling like you don't know what you are doing, you will GET it. It will feel natural.


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

One of my favorite sites of raw food recipes is this one: Raw Fed Dogs.

Seriously, there's nothing to it. Just remember that balance comes over time; not every single meal has to be "complete and balanced." Not to mention, there are so many forums and email lists full of helpful guidance that anyone can do it. Read the Lonsdale site and book for some great rationale and advice and you'll be on your way!

Good luck!

--Q


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## papoodles (Jun 27, 2011)

*http://www.parrishill.com/rawfood.html*

I feed Wellness Core Ocean and raw, because I am not yet at the point where I could go raw entirely..but I am working on it.I did read somewhere that dogs being fed a raw diet should not be allowed anywhere near small children for fear of passing the salmonella germ on to them..
C.M.any truth to that? I have a 5 month old grandson so this is too worrisome for me and is another reason for not going totally raw.
But I just wanted to give a link to Marion Banta's Parrish Hill Standards site because he has an excellent post on how he feeds his poodles raw, including exact instructions with ingredients, quantities, etc. He makes it sound soo easy. And he has GORGEOUS poodles.I might have to contact him 
Is it ok to post this info here?
How to Prepare the Raw Food Diet


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## bigpoodleperson (Jul 14, 2009)

> Let's be REAL. Vets don't promote the RAW diet for one reason, and one reason only... $$$.



Wow, I find that grossly unfair, and in Most cases Not the truth! Most vets just dont understand the raw diet, and have been told through school (and just as an average pet owner growing up) that raw meat is bad. I would actually say that if money was the reason, then most vets would be For a raw diet. In their minds they will get a ton of revenue from x-rays, labwork and medications to "fix" the dogs that they think will get sick on raw.


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