# base narrow canine, second part



## outwest (May 1, 2011)

The right side looks fine, like you said, but the left side does seem to be cutting it close. Maybe you should take her to the vet. There could be things you can do over the next month to guide it into the right place as it grows, although I am not sure what that would be. I would think her jaw should be able to divert it.


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## tintlet (Nov 24, 2009)

I would just leave her alone..quit looking at that mouth and let her grow up


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## Hektor (Apr 16, 2011)

tintlet said:


> I would just leave her alone..quit looking at that mouth and let her grow up


What does that mean? 
That she will be ok, or that this problem should not bother me?

I am worried if the canine will not grow from the outside part, will end up hurting her....


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## tintlet (Nov 24, 2009)

growing in Adult teeth does hurt...just like when human babies cut teeth. I find that the lower canines will start out to far in, but then work their way out to normal position. The only times I have seen a problem is when the baby teeth have been pulled.


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## outwest (May 1, 2011)

Yes, it seems like the jaw bone would be hard enough to divert the tooth to the right place. It isn't that far off, just a little.


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## neVar (Dec 25, 2009)

i've had a few experiences with base narrow- all have turned out AOK in the end (one has a fabulous bite and has numerous championships internationally at the Terrier shows) That same dog the first vet went OMG it's a show dog and it's base narrow off to the vet college. .. owner bit her nails all week gets there the specialist looks at it and went "it's puppy teeth- your fine stop looking at her teeth and only worry if it's adult teeth and she's totally done growing" And sent her on home.


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## Rayah-QualitySPs (Aug 31, 2010)

Hektor said:


> So, Naomi's adult teeth are on their way, and the left canine from the lower jaw is not in the right position. It is not very inside the mouth either (or am I, that I don't want to see the problem?...)
> 
> So I was wondering if this left canine, as it grows up, if there is a posibility to come almost in a good position (not perfect), or will we have a big problem here??? The right canine is ok.
> 
> Thanks in advance!


If this was my poodle I would be pushing the canine teeth out with my fingers twice a day. You sort of grab the bottom jaw with your thumbs and then put your first finger in and push. Not really hard and not longer than 30 seconds. Do three or four repetitions of pushing and repeat twice a day. This usually puts the adult teeth in the correct place.

In a dog *not* used for *breeding* I do not usually find narrow base canines a problem but I certainly would not use a dog or bitch as a breeding dog that I knew had narrow base canines as a puppy.

Problems can happen with holes in the upper palate and food getting stuck. 

Here is one persons perspective on teeth and poodles; Isabella's overshot and base narrow teeth


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## Fluffyspoos (Aug 11, 2009)

Vegas's teeth did this as a puppy. I put my thumbs on them and pushed outward a couple times a day for a good minute, he actually didn't really struggle for it, but I did have a good hold on it. Luckily for you, and a few other people that have had this problem, I took a picture once a week to show the progress.

Hoping for your pups teeth to come out fully too!


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## Hektor (Apr 16, 2011)

Rayah-QualitySPs said:


> If this was my poodle I would be pushing the canine teeth out with my fingers twice a day.


I did this until the tooth reached the gams. Now I let it just to grow.


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## outwest (May 1, 2011)

Rayah, I think Hektor was planning to show (breed?). I remember he or she was concerned because Hektor was supposed to be a show dog and had this problem.


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## Hektor (Apr 16, 2011)

outwest said:


> Rayah, I think Hektor was planning to show (breed?). I remember he or she was concerned because Hektor was supposed to be a show dog and had this problem.



The canine is doing quite well, I will post some pic later....

Yes, I wanted to show, but not for breeding. I am a new dog trainer in my area, so I wanted to go to dog shows to show my job. Actually, I am more interested in basic obedience and dog tricks and why not in dog dancing....

From the whole litter I know that only Naomi had this problem, and talking with some breeders in europe (sweden), they told me that this is more an american's pedigree problem, as they never had this problem before. 

From all the posts here and the pics posted of base narrow canine cases, I think that Naomi's was the less severe case. 
Are diferent levels of base narrow canine cases?


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## outwest (May 1, 2011)

From the little I have learned, European poodles are generally healthier dogs and smaller than American ones. That isn't to say there are not some fantastic, healthy American poodles, but we kind of messed them up going for purely looks. I believe you when you say the issue can be with American pedigree's, but it isn't a common problem in standards here.


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## Keithsomething (Oct 31, 2009)

outwest said:


> From the little I have learned, European poodles are generally healthier dogs and smaller than American ones. That isn't to say there are not some fantastic, healthy American poodles, but we kind of messed them up going for purely looks. I believe you when you say the issue can be with American pedigree's, but it isn't a common problem in standards here.


...I hate to go off topic, but that really isn't true v.v;

Most "European" lines originate from dogs here in the states (in fact I know one breeder in particular that was hounded relentlessly by a woman in France trying to get ahold of one of his dogs...). And about them being healthier...if only a hand full of breeders follow the same testing regiment that American and Canadian breeders follow how are we to judge what is healthier? Most of the breeders in Europe are not testing for everything that a standard SHOULD be tested for, so we can't say that they're healthier in general when they aren't putting forth the effort to test...

Though there are breeders in Europe that are doing admirable things by fully health testing their dogs prior to breeding.

Back on topic XD I think Base narrow canine has an easy remedy like Tintlet, Fluffy, and Rayah pointed out


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## Rayah-QualitySPs (Aug 31, 2010)

Hektor said:


> The canine is doing quite well, I will post some pic later....
> 
> Yes, I wanted to show, but not for breeding. I am a new dog trainer in my area, so I wanted to go to dog shows to show my job. Actually, I am more interested in basic obedience and dog tricks and why not in dog dancing....


Dear Hektor;

I am so sorry that Naomi had this problem. I am sure her teeth will grow in fine with the pushing of them. She will make a fine show dog. 

The previous post about not breeding was my opinion only on my breeding stategies.

I do not feel throwing the baby out with the bathwater is the best way.

Breeding of poodle is a game of chance. A reputable breeder bases her/his plans on more than just teeth. 

I am very anal about health testing and good temperament. If I had a poodle that has very nice adult teeth, passes all health testing per Versatility in Poodles and had a fantastic poodle temperament I may breed her. I would attempt to make sure I used a stud that did not have base narrow canines as a puppy. This is often hard to find out as many breeder do not want to admit such in their stud dog. I would not keep a puppy out of this breeding that had base narrow canines.

Teeth are important for good nutrition and if we all breed narrow base teeth to narrow based teeth eventually the teeth problems with become insurmountable. 

I send wishes for a good show career for Gracie in all things - obedience, dog dancing, conformation and agility.


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## nayus (Jul 12, 2021)

Rayah-QualitySPs said:


> Dear Hektor;
> 
> I am so sorry that Naomi had this problem. I am sure her teeth will grow in fine with the pushing of them. She will make a fine show dog.
> 
> ...


Just want to say I totally agree with you. As base narrow is a genetic condition, unless breeders intentionally choose not to breed base narrow dogs, we won’t eradicate it.


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