# Yet another potty training thread



## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

Still a baby  I wouldn't expect complete control for another month or so. Just like a human infant doesn't have control of those muscles, and they develop at different rates, so do puppies. It sounds like you are doing everything right, just give it time.


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

Jazz was five months old when we brought her home. Seems like it was five or six weeks before she was reliable. Blue was not quite ten weeks old, and he was ten months old before he was dependable. Both of them, though, once they understood, never made a mistake in the house.


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## snmim (Sep 7, 2015)

I have my first spoo and I gave her free roam since she was pretty well behaved but it definitely took longer to house train because of that. I'd say she was completely accident free by 5-6 months and I crated her every night until 5 months. If she is in a very excited mode and someone pets her (like a neighbor or my brother lol) she will still pee a little and is 7 months old now. She doesn't do that if she empties her bladder beforehand. My neighbors dog is over 8 months and pees EVERYWHERE when he gets excited. Mira's not even close to that bad.

It all depends really. I wouldn't say they would _never_ be house trained, you are doing a great job... keep it up. Your puppy is still very young to be expected to hold it and show you where to go.


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## robby69 (Apr 29, 2012)

The "excited" pee is some better that she is now emptying her bladder more fully. It used to be squat, oh there is a leaf.....

Hopefully another month she will be more reliable for 2-3 hours so we don't have to tether her everywhere we have carpet (which is most of the house) 

It just seem sometimes that she is good about squatting immediately when she goes outside, but still thinks its OK to go inside too.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

be sure to use something like nature's miracle to clean up after her mistakes. otherwise the odor humans can't detect but dogs can is an open invitation to keep on doing it indoors.


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

robby69 said:


> It just seem sometimes that she is good about squatting immediately when she goes outside, but still thinks its OK to go inside too.


I think you're right. Blue understood it was good to go outside, but he didn't realize it was bad to go inside, maybe because nothing more unpleasant than a quick trip outside happened when he did. I finally lost patience one day when I caught him in the act, picked him up, raised my voice, and gently (truly, very gently) shook him as I took him outside. I caught him again the next day, repeated the correction, and he never made another mistake. I wouldn't do that to a younger dog, but at ten months...


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## snmim (Sep 7, 2015)

This is so true. When you catch your dog doing going in the house, straight go and pick up your dog and carry him outside!! You can only do this if you truly catch him in the act, a few minutes or even seconds later is too late. I caught Mira going #2 on my kitchen floor and just straight away picked her up and took her outside, even while she was still doing it.. there are no more accidents now.


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

Lots of good advice given!
Rule out a urinary tract infection with your vet.
Links to useful sites:

http://www.poodleforum.com/23-gener...842-how-train-your-new-puppy.html#post1615058

Best of luck.
Eric


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## robby69 (Apr 29, 2012)

JudyD said:


> I finally lost patience one day when I caught him in the act, picked him up, raised my voice, and gently (truly, very gently) shook him as I took him outside. I caught him again the next day, repeated the correction, and he never made another mistake. I wouldn't do that to a younger dog, but at ten months...


Agree, if it persists when she is older. It does work with older spoos.

Our older spoo was playing a little too rough last night with puppy and the puppy yelped. I was within 2 feet of both of them and reprimanded our older spoo. Funny how sensitive they are, she then came back to the puppy and licked her and even let HER take the toys and win at tug o war for awhile at least.


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## Gossamerpink (Oct 27, 2015)

My tpoos are 19 weeks old. Been accident-free for a week. They either go to the door or stare at me when they need to potty. During daytime, I take them out every 30-45 minutes still since I still don't trust them. Sometimes they go, sometimes the don't). I don't watch them as diligently as I did before, but I make sure I'm in the same room with them. They are crated at night and can go for 10 hours without needing to potty. Since last night, we have allowed Phoenix to sleep on the bed with us.

A few weeks ago, I also had the same questions you have. I get a bit distressed when accident happened, worrying that they will never be potty trained. I'm unsure if they are potty trained now, but seeing their progress gives me hope.


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## mom2Zoe (Jun 17, 2014)

I think your pup is still so young.
My tpoo was pretty solid by 5 months. However, she would have the occasional accident here and there.

She will be two in February and yet still just a few months ago she had an accident because it was raining and she refused to go poop.

Sounds like your spoo in doing great , so just be patient and soon enough you will be rewarded.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Mithy said:


> This is so true. When you catch your dog doing going in the house, straight go and pick up your dog and carry him outside!! You can only do this if you truly catch him in the act, a few minutes or even seconds later is too late. I caught Mira going #2 on my kitchen floor and just straight away picked her up and took her outside, even while she was still doing it.. there are no more accidents now.



I agree with you a thousand percent! Teaching puppies to go in the correct place is something that most people do well, but teaching them where going potty is unacceptable is where they fail.
And although I do all other training positive reinforcement only, I strongly believe that as soon as you have done plenty of positive reinforcement for potty in the correct place, correction (specifically geared for the temperament of the particular dog) is essential in teaching them what the incorrect place is.
Typically it does not take more than a handful of corrections, and although I don't love doing it, I think that it is a small price to pay for a lifetime of worry free freedom for you and your dog.
Timi has not had an accident since her first week home. She still gets a treat maybe once a day for doing the right thing because why not remind her that it pleases me?


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## sophie anne (Feb 17, 2015)

Ari understood that going outside was the "better option" at about four months old and started reliably holding her bladder to go out by 5 months old. Poo control came a little earlier but I don't remember exactly when.

The more clearly you communicate to your puppy that going outside is the bees' knees, the more quickly they will get the idea. That means lots of treats/praise when s/he gets it right... And a good supply of Nature's Miracle on hand for when YOU make a mistake and don't get your pup outside in time.

I never scolded Ari for going inside beyond saying, firmly but not loudly, "Uh-uh, outside!" if I caught her in the act. I give her lots of praise every time she goes outside (still, to this day) so that it is reflexive for her to go when I say "get busy" now.

As many of you know Ari was recently pretty sick and she was urinating all over the place inside my apartment, in her crate, and in my bed because she had no control over it. I was glad that I had never harshly reprimanded her for going inside because I didn't want fear of retribution for her numerous accidents to add to her stress!

Also, it was a blessing that she wasn't nervous about me approaching her while she peed because I started sticking a little tupperware cup underneath her to catch it.... you don't even want to know how many paper towels I've gone through in the past week alone!

She immediately got back on track once things calmed down—no more accidents since her most recent episode resolved.

It *is* possible to potty train a puppy to be completely reliable without negative reinforcement. Hopefully you never end up with a pup in Ari's situation, but if you do, you'll be glad that you were careful about how you handled mistakes.


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

JudyD said:


> I think you're right. Blue understood it was good to go outside, but he didn't realize it was bad to go inside, maybe because nothing more unpleasant than a quick trip outside happened when he did. I finally lost patience one day when I caught him in the act, picked him up, raised my voice, and gently (truly, very gently) shook him as I took him outside. I caught him again the next day, repeated the correction, and he never made another mistake. I wouldn't do that to a younger dog, but at ten months...


JudyD that is what I did with all my girls, and I was loud when I done it, and that stopped it quickly. They know they are not to do that, when they are put out regularly or have a potty patch


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

sophie anne said:


> Ari understood that going outside was the "better option" at about four months old and started reliably holding her bladder to go out by 5 months old. Poo control came a little earlier but I don't remember exactly when.
> 
> The more clearly you communicate to your puppy that going outside is the bees' knees, the more quickly they will get the idea. That means lots of treats/praise when s/he gets it right... And a good supply of Nature's Miracle on hand for when YOU make a mistake and don't get your pup outside in time.
> 
> ...


I totally agree with you if they are sick, and my girls have gotten lose bowels, and had an accident. I never scold then when that is the case, only if there was no excuse for it. Cayenne was potty patch trained, then my sister come with 2 dogs (who did nothing in the house) and Cayenne started, I stopped that quite quickly. I guess she was marking her area, but not at my carpets expense, and she was 18 months, took to vets no problem,


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## snmim (Sep 7, 2015)

I agree that you don't need or should not even use negative reinforcement for potty training. I still give Mira a little cheerio every now and then when I tell her to go potty and she does it on command. I want to make clear that all you need is a slight stern voice and the physical act of carrying them outside when you *catch them going in the house*. It is merely showing them the proper place to go. No need to yell, or hit, or say "WHAT IS THAT??" and shove their noses in it. If you do that you create a dog that will pee/poo in areas where they know you can't catch them! And if you reprimand say 10 minutes after they had an accident, you are just scaring your dog. My breeder once told me all you need in potty training is a happy voice, and a sad voice. That's all 

I also think because of those times I picked her up and showed her where to go she now asks to go outside. She will sit/stand in front of the door and just stare at me!


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## zooeysmom (Jan 3, 2014)

I had to check Maizie's 52 Weeks thread because I'd already forgotten, but she was 18 or 19 weeks when she stopped having accidents. Being a Poodle, I expected her to be housebroken on the early side, but my fellow Poodle lovers reminded me that they don't even have control until at least 4 months, and they all mature at their own rate


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

Gracie came to my home at 8 weeks. 1st night in crate, she sang the song of her ancestors. I could not handle it! She has since slept beside me on her own bed. 1st night was in a motel. No mess. Took her out early next morning and she peed and pooed. Next day on the ferry to our Island home. No Mess. Peed at the ferry terminal grounds before leaving and at a beach on arrival. Home that night pooed on news paper left outside her crate (never used since) Not one poo has been left inside my home since! She was taken out to pee and rewarded for doing so after meals and in the early morning. Accidents did occur for 1 month. I left a door open to her yard. Then I put in a doggie door. From that night on there have been no accidents. It did take a year to teach her not to vomit inside. Dogs do vomit on occasion due to a variety of reasons. Now she comes to me (day or night) and nose bumps me and says ooorh I get up quick and accompany her though the door. She can go by herself but wants me to hold her when she vomits. (about every two months or so unless she is very morning hungry)
I believe she house trained herself with a little help and encouragement.
I have had more difficult dogs!
Eric


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## dogs123 (Jun 14, 2012)

Today my spoo is 7 months old and housetrained.... I got her when she was 10 weeks old. She would pee then when I would turn her out, but she didn't understand that it is a no-no in the house!

I also kept her gated off in the kitchen, or IF she both pooed and peed outside, she got to be gated in my office with me for 30 minutes, then crated with me, and turned out every hour. Only once I caught her peeing in the living room, and I literally screamed, "NO", and scared the life out of her....I immediately turned her outside....and while she was out (we have a fenced in backyard), I cleaned up the mess with my Green Machine, and put a dog sanitizer on the spot....she never pottied in the the house after that...however, I did turn her out every hour until she was around 4-5 months, and then every 1-2 hours after that, and praise, praise, praise....Now she is 7 months and very good.

She was ALWAYS good in her crate, and sleeps all night long in there (it is in my bedroom) and has since she was a little pup.

I think the important thing is to keep them 'drained'. Now, at 7 months, I would say she is housetrained, but still doesn't ask to go out....I just turn her out every couple of hours, or if I catch her standing by the door to go outside. 

So...I would say they should have their bladders and bowels under control by 5 months old....then it is that they only go "outside".....not "inside"...and I really think it helps if you catch them in the act, and react very negatively about it....NO HITTING! , just a very loud voice to show your displeasure. I find the spoos are very sensitive, and it doesn't take a lot to correct them....that's what worked for me....


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## Naira (Jan 9, 2015)

Potty training is one of the most important things for me to get out of the way with a new puppy. 

I think the best principle to abide by is never let the puppy fail. They are so cute, and we want to give them more freedom...but in reality, an extra month or so of diligence could prevent a lifetime of mistakes. 

The concept of pottying inside to Naira is as foreign as me pottying outside because she has never done it or was allowed to it. Letting your pup have accidents sends the message "Pottying outside is better, but if I really have to go then pottying inside is OK too". A lot of owners develop a really great rhythm with their puppies but then start slacking off when the pup gets it and that's when accidents happen. 

Stay diligent! I would say I knew in my head that Naira was "potty trained" 2 weeks after I brought her home (so around 14 weeks) but I didn't change my routine at all. I just gradually lengthened times to test her. I was working nights at the time and she was around 20 weeks. I would leave her out of the crate and she would just sleep on the floor, with access to half of the house for about 8 hours. 

One day I got trapped in a snow storm and was gone for like 16 hours. She had every opportunity to go inside, but held it until I got home to let her out. That's what I consider potty trained vs. preventing accidents from happening. 

Now, every dog is different. With my toy and mini poodle....I would say that throughout their lives I was more on the "preventing accidents from happening" spectrum. I used the same house breaking techniques and was much stricter for much longer. My mini got to the point where he wouldn't go inside in a gated area of the house if it was a certain texture (not carpet). He was never a dog I could give run of the house because if I didn't let him out soon enough, he thought it was OK to still pee in the house. He also forgot all potty training at other people's houses. 

My toy, who I was the most diligent with, never really got the potty training concept. She got better, but she would still have accidents occasionally like my mini. If you're having more than 2-3 accidents a year (medical reasons excluded) I don't really consider that potty trained...and she was having more than that. 

Before I got Naira, I never believed a dog could be infallibly potty trained and signal when they wanted to go out. I thought it was a fairytale


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## mom2Zoe (Jun 17, 2014)

Naira said:


> Potty training is one of the most important things for me to get out of the way with a new puppy.
> 
> I think the best principle to abide by is never let the puppy fail. They are so cute, and we want to give them more freedom...but in reality, an extra month or so of diligence could prevent a lifetime of mistakes.
> 
> ...



I have to totally disagree. If you leave a dog 16 hours and don't have an accident then they are potty trained, that is expecting way too much. I could not go that long without an accident and I think i am potty trained . I would not expect Zoe to not have an accident with 16 hours of holding. I know you meant that example to prove that Naira was trained, but even if she didn't succeed I am fairly sure she was still trained.

Also, I think when they are younger dogs they can be potty trained and still have the occasional accident. It does not mean they are not trained.
If the weather does not suit Zoe and its been raining all day she will hold her poop. It can lead to the occasional accident. I have heard this with many dogs. Maybe when they are older they can hold a poop for more than a day ?? don't know I still believe they are trained.
a dog who is pad trained doesn't have to ever deal with inclement weather so maybe once they are trained will never have an accident again.


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## Naira (Jan 9, 2015)

That's fine for you to disagree. I was simply saying "That was the moment I knew she was potty trained." 

I think the average dog can hold it longer than the average human. Naira regularly holds it for 13 or so hours while I'm at work, and when she goes outside she doesn't have an immediate need to potty.

Any large breed dog should be able to comfortably hold it for 12 solid hours. I know many dogs that hold it for almost double that time, even when given the chance to go outside, because they don't like the weather.

I hardly think that's expecting too much from a large breed dog.


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## mom2Zoe (Jun 17, 2014)

Naira said:


> That's fine for you to disagree. I was simply saying "That was the moment I knew she was potty trained."
> 
> I think the average dog can hold it longer than the average human. Naira regularly holds it for 13 or so hours while I'm at work, and when she goes outside she doesn't have an immediate need to potty.
> 
> ...



I knew what you were saying and explained that. I do not know anything about larger breeds and admit that I am a first time dog owner, so I do not know a lot.
Perhaps Zoe can hold it longer than the 5 1/2 -6 I ask of her. I am too afraid to find out. 
I do have a friend with a large dog and small , she leaves them for 9 hours.

I guess I think too human and it still seems unfair to to ask for more than the 6 hours. In the past if it would be more I sent to a dog sitter. Maybe one time I will just chance it, who knows.


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## dogs123 (Jun 14, 2012)

Not to interfere with you guys, but my 7 month spoo holds her bowels/bladder all night long....from 11 pm to 7 am with no problems. That would be 8 hours. She is, however, in her crate in my bedroom, so if she cried out, I would hear her. She started out at 10 weeks going from 11 pm to around 3 am (she would whine) and gradually it became longer to 7 am. Actually, she may go longer, it is that at 7 am, I am up anyway. 
Some people who work an 8 hr. day, leave their dogs all day long. I am retired, so I don't have that situation. I think I would have someone come over to turn my dog out at noon, or go home to turn them out, but then, that's me.


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## mom2Zoe (Jun 17, 2014)

dogs123 said:


> Not to interfere with you guys, but my 7 month spoo holds her bowels/bladder all night long....from 11 pm to 7 am with no problems. That would be 8 hours. She is, however, in her crate in my bedroom, so if she cried out, I would hear her. She started out at 10 weeks going from 11 pm to around 3 am (she would whine) and gradually it became longer to 7 am. Actually, she may go longer, it is that at 7 am, I am up anyway.
> Some people who work an 8 hr. day, leave their dogs all day long. I am retired, so I don't have that situation. I think I would have someone come over to turn my dog out at noon, or go home to turn them out, but then, that's me.


I wasn't talking about when they are sleeping, but rather awake. Zoe often goes ten hours in crate at night. I was referring to during the day.


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## Naira (Jan 9, 2015)

dogs123 said:


> Not to interfere with you guys, but my 7 month spoo holds her bowels/bladder all night long....from 11 pm to 7 am with no problems. That would be 8 hours. She is, however, in her crate in my bedroom, so if she cried out, I would hear her. She started out at 10 weeks going from 11 pm to around 3 am (she would whine) and gradually it became longer to 7 am. Actually, she may go longer, it is that at 7 am, I am up anyway.
> 
> Some people who work an 8 hr. day, leave their dogs all day long. I am retired, so I don't have that situation. I think I would have someone come over to turn my dog out at noon, or go home to turn them out, but then, that's me.



Im going to go to leave Naira with a friend a couple days a week when I start my new job in January, mainly so she won't be bored. She will have more bathroom breaks too. 

I used to watch her on camera when I would leave for about 10-12 hours. When I left she would climb on the couch and fall asleep and barely stir until I returned. She wouldn't eat or drink much during the day. I think if I saw her pacing anxiously like she had to go, I would definitely change my tune. But when I come back after a 13 hour day, she wants to play fetch and run around before she ever thinks of peeing lol. 

I work long days but only a few days a week.


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## Mikey'sMom (Feb 21, 2012)

I don't recall exactly when my spoo was 100% reliable, but it sounds to me like you are doing everything right, and are probably right on track. 

We had the benefit of already having another dog in the house when we got our spoo, which I think helped...ours only ever had a small handful of accidents in the house because our older dog kind of modeled the correct behavior for him. But he did do the excited peeing thing when he met new people until he was about a year old...lol, totally forgot about that! It was annoying, but as you said, they do outgrow it.


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## robby69 (Apr 29, 2012)

Mikey'sMom said:


> behavior for him. But he did do the excited peeing thing when he met new people until he was about a year old...lol, totally forgot about that! It was annoying, but as you said, they do outgrow it.


Yikes, a year for the excited peeing? We have started taking the spoo puppy outside right when people pull in the driveway before they come inside. Some regular visitors have said, it seems like every time I come over you are taking the dog out at the same time! If they only knew...


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## sophie anne (Feb 17, 2015)

robby69 said:


> Yikes, a year for the excited peeing?


The age where they stop doing this varies from dog to dog. Ari did it until about six months old. I had a lab and a spoo that both did it for over a year. If you work to manage their level of arousal at having guests arrive and with greeting people (which is when Ari would "leak") you can speed up the process.

Some people are, unfortunately, less than understanding when a puppy leaks. I had a coworker nastily say, "You should train her not to do that!" when Ari leaked a few drops on the sidewalk over the summer. Meanwhile this coworker was down on all fours with Ari, growling at her and talking in a high squeaky voice. Sometimes, it's not the dog that needs to be trained!!! :argh:


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## snmim (Sep 7, 2015)

robby69 said:


> Yikes, a year for the excited peeing? We have started taking the spoo puppy outside right when people pull in the driveway before they come inside. Some regular visitors have said, it seems like every time I come over you are taking the dog out at the same time! If they only knew...


My spoo is 7 months and still does the excited peeing and I do exactly this. Always remember to empty the bladder whenever they meet someone new  You are doing everything right. And make sure they're actually doing it.. my dog tricks me sometimes because she knows there's a reward after!


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## Mikey'sMom (Feb 21, 2012)

robby69 said:


> Yikes, a year for the excited peeing? We have started taking the spoo puppy outside right when people pull in the driveway before they come inside. Some regular visitors have said, it seems like every time I come over you are taking the dog out at the same time! If they only knew...


I'm sure every dog is different, and by the end he was only excited peeing in really exciting situations...we tried to mitigate it by telling everyone to ignore him for 30 minutes or so when they came over, but our friends all love dogs, and invariably after 5 minutes one of them would say "oh, he's met me already, it's fine!" ....and then he'd pee. Lol, training a dog is easier than training your friends by a long shot!


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## lisasgirl (May 27, 2010)

I had a Cocker Spaniel mix when I was growing up who did excited peeing until she was about 3 years old. We just always greeted her outside on the grass when we got home from school... :laugh:


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## robby69 (Apr 29, 2012)

Went 5 days without any accidents in the house, (3+ hours between going outside) and she pees twice in the house this morning 15 mins apart.....
Grrrrr ! 
4.5 months old today.


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## Naira (Jan 9, 2015)

robby69 said:


> Went 5 days without any accidents in the house, (3+ hours between going outside) and she pees twice in the house this morning 15 mins apart.....
> 
> Grrrrr !
> 
> 4.5 months old today.



Is there a pattern or spot where she "fails", or is it ransom? 

For example, my mini used to always sneak off to a certain area to have an accident. I blocked off access to that area completely for a month and he stopped doing it. He was also in such a small area, he got the concept of "this door leads me to outside" very quickly.


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## TrixieTreasure (May 24, 2015)

I've always had just Toy Poodles, and they all were potty trained by about 20 to 21 weeks of age ( with the exception of one who has seizures). So I think your baby is pretty much on time. It sounds like you're doing great with her!


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## Gossamerpink (Oct 27, 2015)

robby69 said:


> Went 5 days without any accidents in the house, (3+ hours between going outside) and she pees twice in the house this morning 15 mins apart.....
> Grrrrr !
> 4.5 months old today.


Lol I feel your pain


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

Honestly, they often don't have total control till 5 or 6 months, your puppy is only 4.5 months. It would be like expecting a human infant to be totally, reliably potty trained at 18 months old. You're obviously on the right track and you have made great progress. Just give it time!


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## snmim (Sep 7, 2015)

robby69 said:


> Went 5 days without any accidents in the house, (3+ hours between going outside) and she pees twice in the house this morning 15 mins apart.....
> Grrrrr !
> 4.5 months old today.


How long are you waiting to take her out? I used to take Mira out every hour on the dot.. I didn't trust her. Not only because of accidents but excited peeing as well. I don't think she was fully reliable until 5-6 months. And only recently began asking to go out. There's still plenty of time to mature


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## kayla_baxter (Jul 17, 2015)

I got Fletcher at 6 months and he was pretty well house trained. The only time he has accidents is when I run out of raw as have to feed him kibble. He generally doesn't drink much because of the moisture in the raw, but on kibble he feels that thirst and drinks to excess. If I don't catch him and stop him from drinking he'll drink so much that he just pees everywhere without being able to control it. Same with pooping. If he eats kibble it's like his body can't handle that much waste so he'll go outside and poop and then come back inside and poop more because he's used to such a small amount of waste. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## robby69 (Apr 29, 2012)

Thanks everyone, we potty trained 2 standards, this is our 3rd. You tend to forget how the "puppy" stage is in between, especially with house breaking. 

Just pulled a bread tie out of the puppies mouth..


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## robby69 (Apr 29, 2012)

Well 2 months later. Spoo is now 6-months old.
Getting more roam of the house.

Never any soiling in the crate, except for the first night we had her
No more issues peeing in the house. We have been taking her out every 3 hours. Hoping to try and extend the times.

Pooping.. Thought we had it mastered. Right out after breakfast, or any meal and not free roam if she hadn't just relieved herself both ways.

Today she pooped in the house, 2 hours after she pooped outside. Guess she still doesn't know not to do it in the house.

Guess a few setbacks are common, but thought we would be past this, but night and day difference at 6 months old, since I started this thread when she was 4 months.

Seems the puppy chewing stage is well over as she likes her toys but no longer wants to chew on everything she sees.


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## marialydia (Nov 23, 2013)

Just checked Pericles' records, and he was pretty reliable from the get-go, although he had occasional accidents until he was 5 months old. The only exception was when we moved, and I think he did not realise that some of the rooms we we don't use as much (like the guest room) were part of his "den".


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