# Red Poodle Breeding



## petitpie (Nov 16, 2011)

Hawker's Magical Red Standard poodles

"It is my experience that if you find a deep dark red standard poodle that has a low COI chances are that it will fade out to a lighter color This I have seen many times with many reds that I have come across. Although it is good to have a low COI when it comes to your very common colors like white, cream, black silver blues and so on it is found that in the deep dark reds with lower COI like I said chances are it will fade out as the dog gets older. This sometimes happens however not in all cases so if yours hasn't faded you are one of the lucky ones. In my experience the Shangri la, majestic and Palmares lines actually get darker as they get older and tend to hold their deep dark red coloring."

Is anyone familiar with this breeder/website and this "history" on the website? I would appreciate comments, since I have been trying to understand more about poodle breeding and how the red standard poodle came to be.


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## ArreauStandardPoodle (Sep 1, 2009)

WHAT???!!! I wonder where the science of this came from! From everything I have experienced, heard, seen and read, COI has zippo to do with colour fading or holding. The things that decide this are the dilute/non dilute gene and the graying gene. Good for us...there is a test available for the dilute gene, but no test is available for the graying gene. how would this individual explain litters from the same gene pool, with the same COI where ten puppies are born and half fade and half do not...


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## Keithsomething (Oct 31, 2009)

All red standards come from some off shoot of Shangrila or Palmares (usually both)...so saying that they tend to darken doesn't make sense either...when in my experience I haven't seen a single red NOT fade to some degree


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## zyrcona (Jan 9, 2011)

petitpie said:


> "It is my experience that if you find a deep dark red standard poodle that has a low COI chances are that it will fade out to a lighter color This I have seen many times with many reds that I have come across. Although it is good to have a low COI when it comes to your very common colors like white, cream, black silver blues and so on it is found that in the deep dark reds with lower COI like I said chances are it will fade out as the dog gets older. This sometimes happens however not in all cases so if yours hasn't faded you are one of the lucky ones. In my experience the Shangri la, majestic and Palmares lines actually get darker as they get older and tend to hold their deep dark red coloring."


This is anecdotal information (i.e. someone's opinion). It is worth what you paid for it.  I am not aware of any such link between high COI and depth of colour and have never heard a breeder claim this before.

Keithsomething's comment about all red standards originating from Shangri-La and Palmares is correct.


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