# How do you approach a breeder?



## Lex16 (Sep 2, 2016)

I have been on the hunt to find a standard poodle breeder for a couple of months now and I need to know: how do you approach them? I have the packet from VIP and am aware of what to look for (in theory) so I am going straight to the meat when speaking with them (medical history, temperament, etc). 

I had one breeder tell me that I am asking to many questions not to be buying now and to call back when I was actually ready to buy. Another laughed hysterically when I told her I was only researching and trying to build a connection with a breeder so when I am ready to buy at the end of the year I know who I would like to deal with. She has some beautiful phantom poodles and I really wanted one but I was so embarrassed I hung up. 

I thought reputable breeders only had a few litters a year so it would be best to find one before I am ready to buy, build a relationship, get on their waiting list and provide the deposit and wait until puppies come. 

What am I doing wrong?


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## ArreauStandardPoodle (Sep 1, 2009)

Start with an email with not too many questions, offering to call at a convenient time to them to get to know one another. While on the phone, ask if they have time to answer some questions. Then ask.


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## King Louie (May 27, 2016)

Lex16 said:


> I have been on the hunt to find a standard poodle breeder for a couple of months now and I need to know: how do you approach them? I have the packet from VIP and am aware of what to look for (in theory) so I am going straight to the meat when speaking with them (medical history, temperament, etc).
> 
> I had one breeder tell me that I am asking to many questions not to be buying now and to call back when I was actually ready to buy. Another laughed hysterically when I told her I was only researching and trying to build a connection with a breeder so when I am ready to buy at the end of the year I know who I would like to deal with. She has some beautiful phantom poodles and I really wanted one but I was so embarrassed I hung up.
> 
> ...


Maybe going straight to the meat as you call it isn't ideal it can come off as integrating them. Maybe start up a nice conversation and during that conversation bring up your questions so it gives off a more friendly vibe and makes them want to work with you it's hard to build a bond or even get a correct perspective of someone if they start right out the gate integrating you. Also to the questions you're asking is it a chance the information is already on their site clear as day and you didn't notice. Nothing bothers me more as a breeder than someone calling asking questions that are answered on my site and all they had to do was take 5-10 minutes to go over all the information I willingly provide and if you still have questions I'm more than happy to answer them. It seems people don't even read anymore they look at the pictures and will email or call me and it is obvious they didn't read anything not even size information which is the most basic thing ever. If you can't take the time to read the information then I almost certainly don't want to sell a puppy to you.


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## Lex16 (Sep 2, 2016)

Thank you! Well I have not tried emailing first so I may do that. I just introduce myself and make sure I have the correct person than ask if they have time to talk or would they like to set up a more convenient time. As a breeder, what is your take on someone inquiring about your dogs months before they are buying? Is that offensive?


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## Mysticrealm (Jan 31, 2016)

Health testing can be viewed online so the only thing you really need to ask about it is if it gets done and maybe what they would do if one of their breeding stock didn't pass a test.
Ask just enough questions initially to know if this is a breeder that you would be interested in. Then you can work more questions in over time as you get to know the breeder.
I can understand the breeder not wanting to answer a billion questions right off the bat without knowing you, if you will in the end ACTUALLY buy a puppy, and if THEY want to sell you a puppy. A breeder of a popular breed (poodles are fairly popular) will deal with a lot of inquiries and probably 75% of them will never get a puppy from the breeder so answering a million questions right off the bat would take a lot of time and effort and may result in nothing. Especially if it's months, or years, out from actually wanting a puppy.
Make sure to really READ through the website so you already know as much about the breeder as possible so you don't ask things you don't need to.


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## Lex16 (Sep 2, 2016)

King Louie said:


> Maybe going straight to the meat as you call it isn't ideal it can come off as integrating them. Maybe start up a nice conversation and during that conversation bring up your questions so it gives off a more friendly vibe and makes them want to work with you it's hard to build a bond or even get a correct perspective of someone if they start right out the gate integrating you. Also to the questions you're asking is it a chance the information is already on their site clear as day and you didn't notice. Nothing bothers me more as a breeder than someone calling asking questions that are answered on my site and all they had to do was take 5-10 minutes to go over all the information I willingly provide and if you still have questions I'm more than happy to answer them. It seems people don't even read anymore they look at the pictures and will email or call me and it is obvious they didn't read anything not even size information which is the most basic thing ever. If you can't take the time to read the information then I almost certainly don't want to sell a puppy to you.


I completely agree with the interrogation aspect. I normally introduce myself and see where they led the convo. I am very diligent about reading everything on a website and social media as well but sometimes there just isn't much there. One breeder only had the commercials and activities her poodles were in on her site, not anything that was useful so I had to ask nearly every question in the book, which was like pulling teeth and she didn't want to speak with me if I wasn't buying within the month. 

If their website answers all the basic questions I am normally inquiring about if they have bred their poodles with the intention of being service dogs or if they feel the dog would make a good SD, etc. 

I am going to take a step back and most likely just communicate via email, being laughed off of the phone just threw me off. :afraid: I thought breeders would want you to get in contact with them ahead of time to make sure we are a good fit for their puppy as well.


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## Lex16 (Sep 2, 2016)

Mysticrealm said:


> Health testing can be viewed online so the only thing you really need to ask about it is if it gets done and maybe what they would do if one of their breeding stock didn't pass a test.
> Ask just enough questions initially to know if this is a breeder that you would be interested in. Then you can work more questions in over time as you get to know the breeder.
> I can understand the breeder not wanting to answer a billion questions right off the bat without knowing you, if you will in the end ACTUALLY buy a puppy, and if THEY want to sell you a puppy. A breeder of a popular breed (poodles are fairly popular) will deal with a lot of inquiries and probably 75% of them will never get a puppy from the breeder so answering a million questions right off the bat would take a lot of time and effort and may result in nothing. Especially if it's months, or years, out from actually wanting a puppy.
> Make sure to really READ through the website so you already know as much about the breeder as possible so you don't ask things you don't need to.


How would you recommend building a relationship with a breeder? Should I do several calls over a longer period of time? How do I get to know the breeder without asking a ton of questions? Most breeders have their bio and why they are breeding on their site so I don't want to make them repeat themselves but I need to make conversation..

Right now I only have a few breeders I am interested in (haven't contacted them!), I have scoured the website, looked at the health info (if they have the names and numbers listed) so the next step, to me, would be to call and speak with them. 
[/I]

I say I am buying at the end of the year because some breeders that I am interested in say that is when their next litter is expected, get on their waiting list, etc. It is really not them waiting on me but the other way around. 

Any advice on if the website is bare or full of useless information? There have been a few sites I have passed up because of that?


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Lex16 said:


> I thought reputable breeders only had a few litters a year so it would be best to find one before I am ready to buy, build a relationship, get on their waiting list and provide the deposit and wait until puppies come.
> 
> What am I doing wrong?


Sounds like not much, just approaching the wrong breeders!

I do agree with arreau about avoiding asking excessive questions. But a nice introduction about yourself, what you're looking for, and a reasonable number questions should start you off on the right foot with a good breeder.


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## King Louie (May 27, 2016)

Sometimes it's a lot especially if they're currently taking care of litter so you have to think about the time it takes to care for their dogs and then care for a litter then on top of that if the litter isn't all sold they're screening potential families and constantly observing which puppies will be better off with with what home. Then to have someone call asking a lot of questions and taking the time to answer each and everyone only to find out they're not looking to buy for months and might not even get a puppy from you doesn't make a lot of people eager. I like to only deal with people a month maybe 2 in advance for an upcoming litter which is why I'll post litter announcements while the breeding is happening I can go through the people who only give you the run around or not fit for a puppy straight to the people who are serious. By the time puppies are born my litters are sold out because of this. I definitely prefer emails and people who don't will usually put they prefer phone calls by their contact information. Try the emailing first if they still give off a rude vibe you probably don't want to deal with them anyway some breeders are really strict and have tons of attitude and getting a puppy from them means dealing with them and their rules and attitude long after the puppy is living with you.


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## King Louie (May 27, 2016)

Lex16 said:


> Mysticrealm said:
> 
> 
> > Health testing can be viewed online so the only thing you really need to ask about it is if it gets done and maybe what they would do if one of their breeding stock didn't pass a test.
> ...


 If the litters aren't due until the end of the year say you're interested in their upcoming litter in such and such month explain to them if everything meets you're requirements then you have no problem giving a deposit when the time comes so it doesn't look like you're giving them the run around and that you're serious. In my experience if the websites don't have a lot of information or they used a bunch of "fillers" like who they sold to etc. It usually means they don't do health testing or anything important. Most breeders are very pound of health clearances and show titles they get and spend too much money on it not to advertise it.


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## zooeysmom (Jan 3, 2014)

I'm sorry those breeders were rude to you. Every poodle breeder I have spoken with on the phone has been very nice and generous with their time, although I once had a bad experience with a Maltese breeder, so I know how it feels. 

I think you're doing an excellent thing by building a relationship with a breeder first, and you're being honest and upfront about it. Nothing wrong with that, and some breeders will appreciate it. 

Like Mysticrealm said, read the website thoroughly so you don't have to ask any questions that you can easily find yourself (e.g., health testing results, show results). I like to ask how the puppies are raised, and if the adult dogs are kept in the home as pets. This is super important to me. I like a breeder to be very loving and caring toward their dogs and easy for me to work with (friendly, good on communication, helpful). I can find these things out in a pretty short conversation. You will click with the breeder that's right for you, so don't lose heart.


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## Lex16 (Sep 2, 2016)

Oh that makes alot of sense KingLouie! Is there a way to establish yourself as a serious prospect? At what stage of the process do you let people meet the parents or get to know the personalities of the puppies. All my research shows that SD need to have a certain temperament and that breeders know all their dogs personalities and can match you up correctly.


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## King Louie (May 27, 2016)

Lex16 said:


> Oh that makes alot of sense KingLouie! Is there a way to establish yourself as a serious prospect? At what stage of the process do you let people meet the parents or get to know the personalities of the puppies. All my research shows that SD need to have a certain temperament and that breeders know all their dogs personalities and can match you up correctly.


My dogs are always up for viewing it's a little suspicious if someone doesn't let you meet the parent/s on site. The only time I wouldn't let someone view is if I suspect the dog is in labor I have had someone come to me and have to tell them she's just went into labor and have them come back a week later and for the inconvenience I'll let them get a sneak peek of the puppies. But I've had heavily pregnant moms meet people no problems they're actually way more cuddly and demand belly rubs so people get to feel the puppies kicks and rolls. My large dogs I let people come and meet at 6 weeks but I don't pick homes until 8-9 weeks old. Little dogs I'll let their families come out and view and play with them as much as they want my last litter 2 of the families lived close by and came by every other week to interact with their puppy and sometimes even brought friends and family along with them. I had a blast the puppies all got extra attention and great socializing skills by the time everyone left the puppies were exhausted and would sleep for hours.


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

In the UK most breeders have a website, but very few update it, so it is of limited use when it comes to current test information, etc. I found the best way is to start with an email explaining briefly why I am looking for a puppy, the sort of home I am offering, and whether the breeder considers it would be suitable for one of their pups - something that can be answered in a few lines. The reply may not be instant (as KL says breeders can be very busy people) but that's not a problem when you are planning ahead. An exchange of a few emails is enough to establish if there is a possible fit (including a question along the lines of "Have the parents been health tested?" rather than a request for a long list of documented evidence at this stage), and then we can schedule a long phone call, or not, as the case might be. Relationships are built in small, incremental steps, after all!


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

CharismaticMillie said:


> Sounds like not much, just approaching the wrong breeders!
> 
> I do agree with arreau about avoiding asking excessive questions. But a nice introduction about yourself, what you're looking for, and a reasonable number questions should start you off on the right foot with a good breeder.


I agree with you completely I do not get puppies, I get retired dogs, or ones they do not use for breeding. I explain my lifestyle, my experience with toys, and the number I have had. I have never been turned down for one, I do have to travel somewhat. A good breeder wants to know where they are sending their dogs. I always use e-mail


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Since Poodles were a new breed for me, I didn't expect the breeder to give me a Poodle 101 discourse. Did as much Googling and checking online, so I didn't embarrass myself or waste the breeder's time. Always asked if it was a convenient time to talk and generally opened the conversation by stating that this was a serious inquiry and that I would be ready to send a deposit. I got such slow to no responses from emails, that I always called.


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## ArreauStandardPoodle (Sep 1, 2009)

Lex16 said:


> Thank you! Well I have not tried emailing first so I may do that. I just introduce myself and make sure I have the correct person than ask if they have time to talk or would they like to set up a more convenient time. As a breeder, what is your take on someone inquiring about your dogs months before they are buying? Is that offensive?


Breeders can be extremely busy if they have puppies on the ground or if they are showing. Shows are generally on weekends, so if a show begins Friday, they will be grooming and packing Wednesday to Thursday. If they have a show that runs through to Sunday, Monday they are travelling or unpacking. I find Tuesdays or Wednesday morning are the best times to call. But much better to open the door with an email and let them tell you when is the most convenient time for a phone call. 

I wish more people would contact me quite in advance of litters arriving, because generally our litters are spoken for one or two litters in advance, so if we have a planned litter someone is interested in, if they wait until they arrive, it is usually too late. I WANT to sell my puppies to people who have done their homework and ask questions and aren't just interested because they see a pretty, red puppy. Keep up the good work! It will fall into place.


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## Kassie (Apr 7, 2016)

It's also the potential purchaser who is being interviewed. Beyond all the surface talk, which is important, there is humanity and I find the best way, the only way, is to connect with the heart of the breeder and vice versa. If there is no connection, it's a pass for me. In my crazy search for the "right pup" after Mister Hobbs passed away last Easter, I wasn't sure of the size of poodle and I was intense. I filled out so many application for dogs from several breeders and I talked to a lot of people. Just when I was about to say yes to a particular breeder, I spoke to a groomer who shared some experiences with me. I would have been able to pick up on some information earlier had the breeder been available by phone to chat. All this emailing it's the beginning of the conversation, but a conversation must happen and more than one or two. Somehow, I floated around, creating lists of referrals for all sizes of poodles and once again, I was about to select a breeder for a miniature when I spoke to my father and others and realized I was needing two dogs. One was the immediate need and that was a toy but a larger toy and the other was down the road a bit, and that was a standard. So that had me begin new contacts and searches. I was specific on color and sex and size. But another referral led to an initial email. And that breeder wanted to interview by phone. She was a long way from me and it took several attempts to create the actual phone call. Now with toys, there is usually only one or two pups. The conversation begins a bit awkward. Initially it appears on the surface as a sales transaction, but it is much deeper and the human connection is what we seek. Once that is made, questions flow back and forth with ease over several conversations. Once a pup is born, the breeder and client should be in regular contact with sharing of photos etc. If there is no connection with the breeder, I would find another. There are so many. When you see awesome dogs that appeal, ask the owner for the name of their breeder. A referral is a great way and saves time and potential heartbreak and disappointment. I highly encourage you to pay attention to the "tone" of the email and the quality of the phone call. It's relationship building. That's where your search begins. Good luck!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Lex16 said:


> Oh that makes alot of sense KingLouie! Is there a way to establish yourself as a serious prospect? At what stage of the process do you let people meet the parents or get to know the personalities of the puppies. All my research shows that SD need to have a certain temperament and that breeders know all their dogs personalities and can match you up correctly.


Not KL, but I encourage prospective buyers to come meet my dogs anytime, ideally to puppies being born. I don't accept deposits until I have a confirmed pregnancy, but I always appreciate earlier inquiries and let them know that I will contact them when things get a little closer to actually happening. What I've found is that often people who contact me well before a breeding is planned to occur often have life events happen several months down the road when puppies are born that keep them from being able to get a puppy and/or they end up getting a puppy a bit sooner. So, that's why a few months before a breeding, I am happy to establish a relationship with a prospective puppy buyer but I really do wait until things start rolling before I expect or even want any type of commitment.


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## Lex16 (Sep 2, 2016)

Thank you so much everyone, your replies have been most helpful! I know what mistakes I need to correct and I understand it more from a breeder's prospective! I don't know if I am replying correctly but I did give you all a thank you to acknowledge your help!


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## vegas (Jul 5, 2014)

Although not every breeder uses email, for those that do I think it's a great way to introduce yourself. You are not really taking up their time, at least not in the same way as a phone call. And you can control your narrative, make sure that everything you say comes out exactly the way you want it to, etc.

Because I have never owned a dog, I figured I needed to persuade breeders to consider me as a serious prospect. So that's what I did in my introductory emails. I told them all about myself. I also explained why I wanted a toy poodle, and what I was looking for specifically. I also told them about the breeders I had already met, and the dog shows and poodle gatherings I had attended. Then I indicated that I would like to follow up with a phone call in a few weeks (or months, for my earliest inquiries).

I found it EXTREMELY helpful to go to poodle shows and other poodle events at the very beginning of my search, because I was able to meet breeders in person on a very casual, no-pressure basis, and I also got to meet owners and find out which breeders they were happy with, and what kinds of questions to ask. Several good breeders specifically told me that they were impressed simply by the fact that I had attended these events to do my research. I learned a lot from just talking to people at these events.

By the time I was actually ready to purchase my puppy, I had established relationships with several breeders, and even a friendship with one of them (who was not the one I eventually got my puppy from). When a breeder actually had a litter on the way, that is when I started asking lots of questions. I didn't really need to ask my questions earlier than that, because I only contacted Breeders of Merit or others that had excellent reputations. And the breeder I became friends with gave me good advice when it got down to making my final decision.

I guess I approached it like a job interview: Make the breeders want to sell to me first, do lots of research, and then figure out which one I wanted to buy from. In the end, it worked out really well for me. But I started the whole process about 2 years before I was ready to bring my puppy home. I think that my drawn-out approach made breeders feel more comfortable with my inexperience.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I built my relationship with Javelin's breeder through emails. After it was clear that we had "clicked" we had a couple of phone calls, but I asked most of my questions by email so they could be answered at her convenience.

As to websites, I think there are many very good breeders around who don't necessarily keep their web sites super up to date since they are likely very busy with showing or with puppy raising. For some people I think they tend to update on FB since posting there is perhaps easier to do than to rebuild aspects of their web sites.


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## jouhan (Feb 18, 2016)

Love this thread & seeing the different points of views and approaches. I started reaching out to breeders for my first time recently, it was scary jumping into the unknown, so thought I'd share what ended up working for me. 

I started out by emailing my top ~5 choices based on research. I sent a pretty long-winded but easily-skimmable introductory email, including my background, why I want the breed, my living situation, what I'm looking for, timeline, even a photo of me. Maybe overkill and kind of weird, but my goal was to just show I've done my homework and (all while being super friendly) am serious about next steps -- getting to know you (the breeder) and the dog fam. To keep momentum on the process going, I shared my upcoming availability and ended the email by asking for a convenient time & date to get to know each other better. 

I found some people wanted to start with a phone call, others were ready to invite me over. Before the phone call or visit, I made sure to go over their website a few times and note anything I had more detailed questions on. Otherwise, it was a super light and casual in-person meeting for a few hours and playing with their dogs. I think you'll know pretty quickly if you 'click' with someone or not -- that was really important for me at least.

The entire time I was like, wow this is freakishly like a job interview. Haha, hope this helps. Trust your gut! And best of luck


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## zooeysmom (Jan 3, 2014)

Jouhan, how much longer do you have to wait? Do you know which baby will be yours?


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## jouhan (Feb 18, 2016)

zooeysmom said:


> Jouhan, how much longer do you have to wait? Do you know which baby will be yours?


9/25 is the date! I feel like the puppy stars really aligned for me for this to happen so quickly. I don't know which pup is mine yet and the wait is killing me! I was afraid of jinxing it with an announcement thread haha, but I guess it's time. I will share more details there


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