# I found a wonderful breeder



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

I knew I forgot somethins LOL here is the link to Crabapple Downs Puppies | Crabapple Poodles


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## oshagcj914 (Jun 12, 2016)

Pamela, you may want to do a search here on the forum for Crabapple Downs. Sounds likes they're up to no good. I found this on another older thread, and copied this comment from June of this year. 

"Just in case anyone stumbles upon this old post while researching breeders, do not use Crabapple. She's notorious in the poodle world. Over-breeds and dumps what she can't sell on rescues. She's done this so much over the years that no rescue in the entire northeast region of the US will take her dogs. So very sad."

You probably don't want to support someone like this. You could try asking some other reputable breeders about this person as well to get more information. Maybe you could look up some poodle rescues who are near this breeder to verify this claim that she dumps them in rescues.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Read this thread. http://www.poodleforum.com/3-poodle-pictures/142770-puppy-intro-post-meet-lena.html Weigh all sides and think about your own capabilities and health.


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## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

oshagcj914 said:


> Pamela, you may want to do a search here on the forum for Crabapple Downs. Sounds likes they're up to no good. I found this on another older thread, and copied this comment from June of this year.
> 
> "Just in case anyone stumbles upon this old post while researching breeders, do not use Crabapple. She's notorious in the poodle world. Over-breeds and dumps what she can't sell on rescues. She's done this so much over the years that no rescue in the entire northeast region of the US will take her dogs. So very sad."
> 
> You probably don't want to support someone like this. You could try asking some other reputable breeders about this person as well to get more information. Maybe you could look up some poodle rescues who are near this breeder to verify this claim that she dumps them in rescues.



Wow! my heart is broken - she sounded so good on her website and the guy who (supposedly) did her site has a 12 year old from her - she has so many testimonials too - do you think they could be fake? did you check out her site? she states that she used to breed a certain way and doesnt anymore. I will ask Amanda from New England Poodle Rescue - she would know. thanks


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I did look at her website and see lots of pretty looking stuff, but not much substance, no testing, no involvement in dog sports and the like. I am also not impressed by the idea that a real standard costs one thing and a "moyen" costs something else. In the US there really aren't many good moyen breeders since it isn't a recognized size here.

And seriously, fake testimonials, of course there are fake testimonials all over the internet. There is a heavily advertised web site building company that says they will create a professional looking FB page and then write posts to promote the business. They aren't customers!


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## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

lily cd re said:


> Read this thread. http://www.poodleforum.com/3-poodle-pictures/142770-puppy-intro-post-meet-lena.html Weigh all sides and think about your own capabilities and health.


Its so hard to believe but you I said the same thing when I picked up Patches - that the conditions were bad there too. boy if you look at her website you woudl think she is a poodles best friend! 

Puppies | Crabapple Poodles


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## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

lily cd re said:


> Read this thread. http://www.poodleforum.com/3-poodle-pictures/142770-puppy-intro-post-meet-lena.html Weigh all sides and think about your own capabilities and health.


Its so hard to believe but I said the same thing when I picked up Patches - that the conditions were bad there too. boy if you look at her website you woudl think she is a poodles best friend! 

Puppies | Crabapple Poodles


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## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

lily cd re said:


> I did look at her website and see lots of pretty looking stuff, but not much substance, no testing, no involvement in dog sports and the like. I am also not impressed by the idea that a real standard costs one thing and a "moyen" costs something else. In the US there really aren't many good moyen breeders since it isn't a recognized size here.
> 
> And seriously, fake testimonials, of course there are fake testimonials all over the internet. There is a heavily advertised web site building company that says they will create a professional looking FB page and then write posts to promote the business. They aren't customers!


wow thats what my daughter said - I guess I am just gullible. Its too far to go to just visit - I really loved the picture of the little blue girl. oh well.


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## oshagcj914 (Jun 12, 2016)

That's why it is so important to develop a good relationship with a breeder before even getting a puppy or adult from them. Obviously that's harder to do when you're getting an adult and when they're far away. Here's my experience. I got Asaah at age 2 from a breeder in Florida, and I live in Indiana. Before even talking to her, I checked out her website to see that she shows her dogs and got health testing information. I looked at lots of pictures of her dogs and dogs of her breeding on her website and other places online and could tell they were bred to the standard. I looked up as many of her dogs as I could find on the OFA website (Orthopedic Foundation for Animals) to verify their health testing results. Then I contacted her by email and then spent a lot of time on the phone with her. I knew some other reputable breeders and some owners of well-bred dogs who live in Florida. I contacted several people and they were able to vouch for her as well. Finally, I drove to Florida to pick up Asaah, and even after all that, I was still fully prepared to leave sans dog if anything looked amiss when I got there. 

Don't get discouraged. You're doing the right thing by looking into different breeders and asking questions before you get a dog. If you can befriend some reputable breeders, even if they don't have anything for you, they can help network for you. The right dog is out there for you somewhere. You have some pretty specific requirements though - you need a mature adult dog who is well-mannered and relatively low energy so you can safely and comfortable handle the dog. That kind of dog isn't exactly a dime a dozen, so you just need to be patient and do your homework. You will find the right one for you some day!


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

have you contacted sophie anne's breeder at amity kennels? she advertises on her site that she has breeder friends with champions to place. i suspect that means she has/knows of retired show dogs as well. since she runs a kennel, she has no problems shipping dogs of her own breeding.


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## Viking Queen (Nov 12, 2014)

patk said:


> have you contacted sophie anne's breeder at amity kennels? she advertises on her site that she has breeder friends with champions to place. i suspect that means she has/knows of retired show dogs as well. since she runs a kennel, she has no problems shipping dogs of her own breeding.


Very good idea!

VQ


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Thank goodness you checked in and avoided supporting that breeder in any way! I am highly skeptical of "Moyen" claims. Apparently there are only a handful of legitimate breeders of that size in the U.S. If you are patient and do the networking, contacting breeders, I think you can find a good Poodle 3+ years.


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## BrooklynBonnie (Jan 16, 2015)

*I have a Crabapple Poodle*

If you read the Intro post for Lena, you'll see my comments on what we experienced when we went there. I still wish I knew what I know now back then, but I have to say, other than some conformation issues, their dogs seem decent if you are looking to rescue. That said I would definitely consider insurance for Bluebell. They breed standards and moyens which she gets from crossing mostly standards or "moyened"standards with miniatures. Mochi came out of a 14in mpoo sire and a moyened standard.

I would not get a dog from Crabapple again, but Arlene demonstrated a real concern for the dogs and their health when we were there for a couple hours and I know from Lena's mom, whose family were old friends of Arlene's, that Arlene had some health problems a while ago which had a negative effect on her breeding program in that she stopped testing and started breeding more to try and bring in more money. This is all 3rd person hearsay but I believe it.

If you have any concerns about your or the dogs health I would perhaps pass on this one. I hope Arlene is trying to decrease the size of her program though as it is really too big. I think the majority of the reviews are real though. She has a Poodle Picnic or something every year at her place in September and many many people go, and from the facebook pictures and videos I've found on youtube (not from crabapple), seems like they have lots of games and demonstrations and some educational talks each year.

Good luck with your search!


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Crabapple or bad apple? Hold out for a Gala Apple


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## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

yes all the ones I spoke to that had no dogs available were kind enough to call me and will look out for me.


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## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

patk said:


> have you contacted sophie anne's breeder at amity kennels? she advertises on her site that she has breeder friends with champions to place. i suspect that means she has/knows of retired show dogs as well. since she runs a kennel, she has no problems shipping dogs of her own breeding.


is that Anita? if so she has none but will keep eyes out. otherwise I am not sure where Amity Kennels is.


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## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

BrooklynBonnie said:


> If you read the Intro post for Lena, you'll see my comments on what we experienced when we went there. I still wish I knew what I know now back then, but I have to say, other than some conformation issues, their dogs seem decent if you are looking to rescue. That said I would definitely consider insurance for Bluebell. They breed standards and moyens which she gets from crossing mostly standards or "moyened"standards with miniatures. Mochi came out of a 14in mpoo sire and a moyened standard.
> 
> I would not get a dog from Crabapple again, but Arlene demonstrated a real concern for the dogs and their health when we were there for a couple hours and I know from Lena's mom, whose family were old friends of Arlene's, that Arlene had some health problems a while ago which had a negative effect on her breeding program in that she stopped testing and started breeding more to try and bring in more money. This is all 3rd person hearsay but I believe it.
> 
> ...


I think she mya be breeding too much - she has awful lot of litters right now that were born this year.


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## zooeysmom (Jan 3, 2014)

Pamela said:


> I am not sure where Amity Kennels is.


Minnesota. She breeds toys and minis, but she may be a good contact to find an adult standard.


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

Pamela said:


> yes all the ones I spoke to that had no dogs available were kind enough to call me and will look out for me.


Pamela
As I mentioned I got my last 4 toys from breeders by writing and describing my lifestyle.2 were 15 months Still puppies, 1 was 3, still a lot of puppy, and the last one 5 might be 6 my now is very settled, loves to cuddle, and I trained her to potty patch at night, outside during the day with in 15 to 30 days. Sleeps in her crate at night (tried the bed but she wants to cuddle and get attention), I cannot get to sleep. I confined her to the kitchen during the day until house broken, now she runs free with the others. Trained to follow me out the door not go in front, she sits and she stays, leaves other dog's food bowls alone, takes her turn getting her treats and I got her the 23 of June. She is skittish, as she was used for breeding and was not around strange noises although she is 100% better then when I got her. Now she is terrified of thunder and lightening and needs held


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