# I feel like a novice



## John J (May 14, 2020)

I come to you with my tail between my legs. I've been bragging about how my puppy is quick in picking up the basic commands so soon. She's now 10 weeks old. We've migrated through the crate training process. We take her out to the dog run about every three hours or less. We try to get her to speak when we head to the run. She follows our lead quite well. However, she still, quite irregularly just squats and pees. Usually on something soft. We spend hours with her everyday watching and trying to stay ahead of her needs, but I don't see any signs from her to tell us she has to go out. I think I'm missing a link here. 

Any thoughts????

John


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## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

Puppies often have a natural urge to pee on soft things. When Misha was young I had to be careful with towels. As soon as his paws made contact you could bet it would be wet. The best solution tends to be to just remove any triggering items from their free space and then reintroduce after they are fully reliable (at least after 6 mo old).


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## FloofyPoodle (May 12, 2020)

Some dogs just don’t show obvious signs. Try tracking in a notebook when and how much she pees. This helped with my sudden pee puppy, and once you know her schedule, it becomes easier to prevent accidents. I think PeggyTheParti has a wonderful template for it. Remember that a puppy bladder is a tiny thing, too—3 hours may be too much time at this age.
You could also try taking away the soft things, as Raindrops said. I remember Fluffy had a tendency to try and pee on curtains—we had to tie them up until we could trust him around them.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

We had to remove all soft things. She even peed down a vent once, I think because she was aiming for the curtain.

As mentioned, we just removed them all (and I mean all) and waited a few months. We had no problem after that. We also kept her living space very small at first. She was either tethered or in her exercise pen for much of those first few months. A baby gate was helpful, too.

And yep, another thing that helped immensely was keeping detailed notes on all potty, meal, and snooze times. You may quickly see her accidents aren't so irregular after all.

Here's the template my husband made for us:











I should really upload a better quality version somewhere After almost a year, it's still super valuable. We've even used it to identify allergies.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

P.S. With Peggy, at any given moment I either feel like a total novice or a master of all things dog. Poodles are a real trip.


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

It took Beckie at least 8 months to give me signs, and they were very subtle (she would sit 5-6 feet away from me, her body slightly pointing toward the door. And she would just look at me.

Then, she started sittng on my lap (she’s a toy), her paws on my shoulders. But this is also the position she takes when she wants a massage, so I have to guess which one it is, even now that she’s 3...

So basically, don’t expect signals, she’s too young. Take her out every 2 hours, after eating, after drinking, after playing and after a nap. So that’s basically all you do all day, lol !


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## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

I had similar problems with my boy Galen. I wouldn't even see him setting up, and there would be a wet spot. Something I noticed is that he tends to pee or poop right after he has the zoomies. Now as soon as I see him racing around the house I shoo him outside.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

cowpony said:


> I had similar problems with my boy Galen. I wouldn't even see him setting up, and there would be a wet spot. Something I noticed is that he tends to pee or poop right after he has the zoomies. Now as soon as I see him racing around the house I shoo him outside.


Yes! Peggy still often gets the zoomies before a backyard poop.

The poopies.


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## Fenris-wolf (Apr 17, 2018)

PeggyTheParti said:


> P.S. With Peggy, at any given moment I either feel like a total novice or a master of all things dog. Poodles are a real trip.


Same here! Right now I feel like a total novice ☹


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

You may already be doing this, just not mentioned, but a Potty Party is a good marker for them (sorry sorta punnishing there).

Once you get her out and the second she starts whichever elimination it is, in a very happy voice instantly announce "Go *__*" (wording your choice), and when she's done, enthusiastic praise, a treat, a jig, whatever you think will help her associate and work for. You'll appreciate the potty on command training down the road.

Rule of thumb is that they can hold their eliminations for about 1 hour per month/4 weeks of age. They will understand the concept far sooner than their system will be mature enough to deliberately hold them. They may not recognize themselves that they have to go, so look for toddleresque tells. It's around 6 months old, when their systems start maturing to where they can not only recognize that they need to go but to hold it for a while til the human catches on.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Rose n Poos said:


> so look for toddleresque tells


Good one! Our breeder told us to watch for restlessness, but it can also manifest as being just plain annoying. The only time puppy Peggy had a poop accident, she was driving us NUTS. So....we put her in her exercise pen to chill out.

A minute later she was indeed able to chill out....because she'd pressed herself as far to the edge of the pen as she could possibly get, and relieved herself.

Lesson learned!

(Still sorry about that, Peggy.)


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## Mufar42 (Jan 1, 2017)

At 10 weeks your puppy has little control over her bladder, when the urge strikes she goes, and that is usually when she is moving about. 
She will give subtle signs maybe sniffing or slowing down for half a second. I feed all my pups on a schedule and I take them outside always on a lThen back inside no playing outdoors until they get the idea that outside is for potty. When we come in I give them either their meal or a little playtime and usually wishing 20 minutes they have the need to go potty again so out we go. This time when we come in they get only a few minutes of playtime and then to their crate for a nap. I basically repeat this process every hour to hour and a half week one. I usually don't get accidents. I increase the time that they have not had accidents, by week 3 they are usually good up to 2 hours unless they are free in the house playing, then I will scoop them up, leash them and take them to their spot, usually they will go and then I bring them in for more freedom. I do this over months...and seldom if ever do I get accidents in the house. And as with "Peggy" if they act nuts, its probably because the have the need to poo. Renn when come up to me and start barking or he would act totally unruly. When he has the need to poo, it was like let me out get out of the way.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I would amend Mufar's comment to say that at 10 weeks the pup has no ability to resist the pressure of a full bladder or bowel. Neuromuscular development for that doesn't really happen until about 6 months of age (maybe a little sooner, maybe a little later). Younger pups often understand the idea that they should only eliminate outside, but that doesn't mean they are really housebroken. It generally really bothers me when I see ads for house training methods guaranteed to work on baby dogs in just a few days. This is just not developmentally possible. The human analogy would be to expect a 6 month old human infant to tell us if you don't sit them on the toilet right now they will soil their diaper.

Encouraging a bark as a I need to go sign is good. Javelin never did that and still doesn't. In the morning when he is ready to go out he comes and gives me a persistent bit of nudging. When he was a pup his sign was to just go stand near the back door. That of course only worked if I could see him standing there. Lily will bark and Peeves whines to tell us it is potty time. All puppies/dogs are different in communicating their needs.


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## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

lily cd re said:


> I would amend Mufar's comment to say that at 10 weeks the pup has no ability to resist the pressure of a full bladder or bowel. Neuromuscular development for that doesn't really happen until about 6 months of age (maybe a little sooner, maybe a little later). Younger pups often understand the idea that they should only eliminate outside, but that doesn't mean they are really housebroken. It generally really bothers me when I see ads for house training methods guaranteed to work on baby dogs in just a few days. This is just not developmentally possible. The human analogy would be to expect a 6 month old human infant to tell us if you don't sit them on the toilet right now they will soil their diaper.
> 
> Encouraging a bark as a I need to go sign is good. Javelin never did that and still doesn't. In the morning when he is ready to go out he comes and gives me a persistent bit of nudging. When he was a pup his sign was to just go stand near the back door. That of course only worked if I could see him standing there. Lily will bark and Peeves whines to tell us it is potty time. All puppies/dogs are different in communicating their needs.


Snarky would stand by the door and wuff if he needed out. Pogo gets restless and paces, but he only rarely barks.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

I'm not sure how it was physically possible, but puppy Peggy definitely demonstrated an early ability to hold it, at least for a little while. The need to poop made her go nuts, but she would patiently stand at the front door when she had to pee.

Of course, we were always watching her when she wasn't confined, so we could respond fairly quickly.

When she urinated on soft things, it seemed like more of an instinct: She wasn't seeking out soft things because she had to pee; she suddenly had to pee when she found herself on something soft.

That's why removing these items (or in the case of the curtains, tying them up) did the trick. Literally no more accidents. But that's a lot to expect of a pup unless you're watching them closely. 

With Peggy, her easy housebreaking probably also had a lot to do with her breeder. When we were sitting in the breeder's huge fenced yard, playing with Peggy for the first time, she abruptly left the group and went as far away as she could to pee. It was adorable watching her toddle away like that and then come racing back.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

cowpony said:


> Snarky would stand by the door and wuff if he needed out. Pogo gets restless and paces, but he only rarely barks.


This reminds me that I should start rewarding Peggy's muffled woofs more. I've taken a zero-tolerance approach to barking, which isn't especially effective. A low woof is probably their least offensive method of communicating a need and maybe should be encouraged.


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## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

PeggyTheParti said:


> This reminds me that I should start rewarding Peggy's muffled woofs more. I've taken a zero-tolerance approach to barking, which isn't especially effective. A low woof is probably their least offensive method of communicating a need and maybe should be encouraged.


I think it depends on the dog. Snarky could be rather vocal, so it took a while for us to figure out the cue. Sometimes he was wuffing at an owl, or a neighbor coming home late, or any other thing a watchful dog felt the need to warn us about. We eventually figured out that quiet wuffs repeated 30 seconds apart coming from the vicinity of the back door meant he wanted out.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

cowpony said:


> I think it depends on the dog. Snarky could be rather vocal, so it took a while for us to figure out the cue. Sometimes he was wuffing at an owl, or a neighbor coming home late, or any other thing a watchful dog felt the need to warn us about. We eventually figured out that quiet wuffs repeated 30 seconds apart coming from the vicinity of the back door meant he wanted out.


Ahhhh yes. Peggy does think it's very important that we know every time one neighbour in particular opens their garage door. 

I'll have to study her a little longer, to identify the nuances.


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## alwayson (Dec 24, 2013)

John J said:


> I come to you with my tail between my legs. I've been bragging about how my puppy is quick in picking up the basic commands so soon. She's now 10 weeks old. We've migrated through the crate training process. We take her out to the dog run about every three hours or less. We try to get her to speak when we head to the run. She follows our lead quite well. However, she still, quite irregularly just squats and pees. Usually on something soft. We spend hours with her everyday watching and trying to stay ahead of her needs, but I don't see any signs from her to tell us she has to go out. I think I'm missing a link here.
> 
> Any thoughts????
> 
> John


 you get a crate and that is where she will stay and you pick her up and take her out side and give her a treat and tell her how great she is . You didn't say how old , the younger take her out every 3 or 4 hours and you carry her so she can't find that soft spot . and if she goes in her crate you need to take her out sooner .


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## Raven's Mom (Mar 18, 2014)

I trained Raven with bells from the beginning. I thought she wasn’t getting the meaning but suddenly it clicked. She took a very long time to be reliably potty trained in the house. She had her last accident at 11 mo old during the holidays. I ran to a store and did not put her in the crate thinking it will just be a few minutes. That hour enough...she pooped in the family room. We had been crating anytime we were gone. It took another few months after that before I could leave her out if we were not home or asleep. On the positive side she was a not a bad chewer. She got a decorative pillow, the edge of a coffee table, and the woodwork at the top of the stairs but nothing like some of the spoos I’ve read about here Who end up in surgery for things they ate.


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

Raven's Mom said:


> I trained Raven with bells from the beginning. I thought she wasn’t getting the meaning but suddenly it clicked.


Bells were a tool for me too. I strung some inexpensive bells from the back door handle and every time we went to the door to go out I'd say "Ring the bell go outside" then take their little paws and brush the bell til it sounded. I also thought they weren't ever going to get it, but I stayed consistent and then got quite a surprise one afternoon when I didn't hear the puppy go to the door, but I did hear the bell ring!


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## Raven's Mom (Mar 18, 2014)

That is exactly what I did. I rang them as I opened the door and said let’s go potty. It was great to be able to hear her from another room and know what she wanted. She still uses them. I ha been hoping my male got as a rehome would pick it up. So far he hasn’t copied her but still hoping.


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## kontiki (Apr 6, 2013)

10 weeks is a baby  Take her out every hour or hour and a half. And yes to training pee on command. Make sure there is nothing at all inside that would have a pee scent on it too.
If it still happens make sure she doesn't have a bladder infection.


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## Puca pu (Mar 31, 2018)

I also used bells for Puca. But then he started abusing them. Ringing the bells every 5 secs because he heard a cat or a person in the backyard lol. Eventually I was able to take the bells down and now he just stops whatever he's doing and stares at me to let me know he wants to go out.


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## Phoebe’sMom (Mar 15, 2020)

I trained Phoebe with the bells as well, I bought a set from chewy that fits and works great for my door handle. I trained by saying "Go Potty" and ringing the bells as we dashed outside, once she had more control I slowly taught her to ring the bell. Then like someone else mentioned "potty party" which is highly effective for Phoebe, I also left special high reward treats near the door so they were a quick grab. Currently at one year my Phoebe still uses it just to communicate she needs to go and will bark if she just wants outside, my GSD will ring the bell however she desires. If I don't hear the bells Phoebe will pull them off the door and run to me shaking the bells it's quite cute.


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Buck was also a bell abuser. His tells were sometimes subtle and sometimes overt and annoying. I also asked myself, does this digestive timing make sense? Made a point of a HUGE potty party and making potty on command a goal. TREATS! Good ones, and all fault on me, if there was an accident.


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## kontiki (Apr 6, 2013)

I too have a spoo that simply comes and stares at me when he wants to go out!


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

kontiki said:


> I too have a spoo that simply comes and stares at me when he wants to go out!


This is Peggy's typical move, then a nose pressed firmly into me if I still don't get it. Gracie was also a master of the "gotta go!" stare. She would stare so intently, eyes narrowing, she looked a little like she was about to cry.


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## Mufar42 (Jan 1, 2017)

LOL my dogs mostly will go to the door and nose it and if I don't pay attention will come to me and get my attention then run back to the door. Our little cairn terrier will do that and once you pay attention she runs to the door stands on her hind legs and paws the air, like praying (kinda saying yeah let me out already Please).


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