# yet another thread on allergies.



## lunamarz_31 (Nov 15, 2010)

Well, I'm not saying I'm an expert in this, since I am having the same issue myself with tear stains, but I found out that allergy cause can be environmental too. Muffin has been having tear stain issue since the beginning of this year, still doing elimination process to figure it out, but she tears more when I have fragrance around the house (candles, plug-ins). Perhaps it's something to consider too, it can be beyond food allergy. Consider your environment, pesticides, pollen factor, vegetation around the yard, household cleaning liquid, carpet fiber, all sorts of stuff. You might start off with identifying a pattern, and hopefully can close in on one culprit.
I heard that one dog was allergic to down comforter, and as soon as he was removed from it, his scratching stopped. 

Just throwing ideas to you, good luck with that issue.


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## fracturedcircle (Aug 19, 2010)

lunamarz_31 said:


> Well, I'm not saying I'm an expert in this, since I am having the same issue myself with tear stains, but I found out that allergy cause can be environmental too. Muffin has been having tear stain issue since the beginning of this year, still doing elimination process to figure it out, but she tears more when I have fragrance around the house (candles, plug-ins). Perhaps it's something to consider too, it can be beyond food allergy. Consider your environment, pesticides, pollen factor, vegetation around the yard, household cleaning liquid, carpet fiber, all sorts of stuff. You might start off with identifying a pattern, and hopefully can close in on one culprit.
> I heard that one dog was allergic to down comforter, and as soon as he was removed from it, his scratching stopped.
> 
> Just throwing ideas to you, good luck with that issue.


it's not environmental, since we've been traveling for two weeks (different climate, mattresses, etc, etc) and no changes. I am allergic to scents myself (not life-threatening, but I try to avoid them).

poor Llama.


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## Yaddaluvpoodles (Mar 20, 2010)

Some general thoughts, don't know if there is anything here that will help, hope there is!

Not saying that Llama doesn't have allergies, just wanted to mention that sometimes itching can be behavioral.

Regarding allergies/chicken.... animals/humans can develop allergies at any time in their lives, to just about anything. If Llama doesn't have a known food allergy to something, I don't know whether or not you should avoid it. You could avoid every type of food out there as they all can cause allergies in dogs somewhere.

The there tends to be an inherited tendancy towards allergies. Medical professionals have been aware of this for years.... and with more and more discoveries related to the MHC (Major Histocompatibility Complex), it explains why this is so. Based on that, it may be of benefit to speak with everyone you can find with related dogs to see if their dogs are expressing allergies, towards what and how are they managing them?

For humans, here is a link that explains a bit of the relationship between MHC and allergies.. works the same in our poodles: The Allergic Reaction

Food allergies are one of the conditions that can be registered on PHR and I would encourage anyone with a poodle with food allergies to do so.

How often is she being bathed and do you use a dryer for her?
You may want to give a different type of shampoo a try..... I used a pretty smelling coconut one years ago on Riley (figures, now I have fragrance allergies!) about two days later, the itching would start and by day five post shampoo.. he smelled like he was rancid. Only time it ever happened was with that particular shampoo. She did chew her paws pre Addison's diagnosis, but... it was only her paws. That stopped once we treated her AD.
Different folks have different shampoos they love, I use a very dilute solution (1/3 to 1/2 cup) of the old fashioned, green Palmolive dish soap in water (1 gallon), I love the way it works, Cleans well, moisturizes, rinses out easily. I don't need a conditioner with it, possibly due to the high palm and olive oil content. 

Occasionally thyroid problems can cause itchy skin.

There are some supplements which may help, vitamin e as well as omega fatty acids.

Just some thoughts, good luck!


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## fracturedcircle (Aug 19, 2010)

Yaddaluvpoodles said:


> Some general thoughts, don't know if there is anything here that will help, hope there is!
> 
> Not saying that Llama doesn't have allergies, just wanted to mention that sometimes itching can be behavioral.
> 
> ...


could you tell me about behavioral itching? you mean psychosomatic? she'd be prone to behavioral issues...

it's not the shampoo--she had a different one (for puppies), but I switched to Earthbath. the groomer also washed her with a different shampoo. she is not washed too often--maybe once a month, so far no hair-dryer. I don't think it's dry skin, since we also use a humidifier.


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## neVar (Dec 25, 2009)

i'd zip out the beef. t's one of the top allergins in kibble. (beef chicken, wheat)


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## fracturedcircle (Aug 19, 2010)

neVar said:


> i'd zip out the beef. t's one of the top allergins in kibble. (beef chicken, wheat)


she is not on kibble. Primal is pre-made raw food.


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## cbrand (Aug 9, 2009)

fracturedcircle said:


> could you tell me about behavioral itching? you mean psychosomatic? she'd be prone to behavioral issues...


Scratching can become a habit. When dogs scratch, I think endorphins are released. It can start a cycle of scratching. I'm dealing with this with Delilah right now. We have had the driest fall on record in Colorado (and we are already a really dry place to begin with). All of us, people and dogs, have been itchy.

Delilah started scratching after I shaved her face last time. The more she scratched, the more she irritated the area around her eye, which made her scratch more. She literally scratched her eye lid raw and in the process, ripped huge chunks out of her topknot (one point to go and she decides to destroy her coat!). She doesn't have allergies. She just got into the habit of scratching.

So.... I got some eye cortisone cream from the vet and I took away her ability to scratch. I put a sock on her back foot and carefully wrapped it with tape. I sprayed the sock with bitter apple to keep her from pulling it off.

We are into day 2 with the sock on the foot and she has not been scratching. I will keep the sock on as long as I need to. I only wish I had done it sooner. I might have saved more show coat.


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## neVar (Dec 25, 2009)

Hmmmmmm i'd still probably take it out to see. but less chance with it being the issue being it's raw (nice food btw wish that was available up here!)


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## Yaddaluvpoodles (Mar 20, 2010)

[She did chew her paws pre Addison's diagnosis, but... it was only her paws. That stopped once we treated her AD.
]

Oops, I deleted part of a paragraph! That should have read, "the only other dog I've had itching issues with is my Vic. She did chew her paws, pre Addison's diagnosis, but it was only her paws. That stopped once we treated her AD"

Behavioral itching is.... tough. Since "itching" is subjective, and our dogs tend to be truthful with what they are telling us with their body language, I think some things to think about are:

Are you scratching because you itch? Are you scratching because something is making you feel uncomfortable? Are you scratching because it makes you feel good? When you get anxious do you itch? 

If you (the human) keeps a journal of itching can it be correlated to events in the dogs life (a visitor, a long day alone... etc). 

I would look really hard for a physical cause or allergy before deciding it was behavioral. Regardless of what causes it, I suspect that the dog really does feel the sensation of itching.


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## fracturedcircle (Aug 19, 2010)

Llama did have the rash just recently and it subsided after we removed the yams. the rash was on her tk spot (well, she doesn't have a tk, but it's that area), so it wasn't from scratching. she never scratches there.


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