# How Big Are "Moyen" Poodles?



## peccan (Aug 26, 2014)

In case you mean the official size category under the FCI, the size limits for Medium size Poodles are 35–45 cm / 14–18 in, and breeders will aim for the lower and middle range because oversized Mediums are not transferrable to Standard but undersized ones can be transferred to Miniature.

Dulcie is actually closer to the upper limit of the FCI Standard height since dogs over 60 cm (24 in) high are disqualified in shows under FCI.

(Last time I checked, by purely homebrew method, Sulo was about 40 cm tall.)


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## peppersb (Jun 5, 2011)

The term "moyen" seems to be used to refer to either: (a) poodles that have been bred for generations as moyen (aka medium or klein) in countries that follow FCI standards, or (b) poodles in non-FCI countries that are bred to be medium sized by using some combination of standard x mini crosses and/or small standards or large minis. Most of the poodle puppies that are being marketed in the US as moyens fall into the latter category, and sadly a lot of them are very poorly bred. I'd love to see more responsible breeders developing healthy and structurally correct lines of poodles in this medium size.

Your pup definitely sounds like a small standard -- and not even all that small! My Cammie is about 21.5 inches and 35 pounds. She's a small standard -- no minis or moyens in her pedigree. Her mother is about the same size, maybe even a little bit smaller than Camme, and her dad is more of an average sized standard -- about 50 pounds, I think.

Here's a summary of the AKC and FCI sizes:

The breed standard of the American Kennel Club (AKC) defines three sizes of poodles: toys are under 10 inches, miniatures are 10 to 15 inches and standards are over 15 inches (no maximum height). Height is measured at the withers (shoulders). While the breed standard specifies that standard poodles are over 15 inches, there are in practice very few standard poodles in the 15 to 20 inch range. A 15 to 17 inch poodle would most likely be an over-sized mini, from mini parents. The Fédération Cynologique Internationale (FCI) is an international federation of kennel clubs based in Belgium with 91 member countries. Its breed standard defines four sizes of poodles, and establishes a maximum size for the standard poodle. The four sizes are: toys 24 to 28 cm (9.4 to 11 inches), miniatures are over 28 to 35 cm (11 to 14 inches), mediums (or moyen or klein) are over 35 cm to 45 cm (14 to 18 in) and a Standard is over 45 cm to 60 cm with a tolerance of +2cm. (18 to 23.6 in or an absolute maximum of 24.4 in with the 2 cm tolerance).

PS. Thanks to peccan for her post. I love having the perspective of someone from an FCI country.


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## Naira (Jan 9, 2015)

I find that American "moyens" are too small and their size is too variable. 

I'll take a small standard if I'm looking for that size (in America) any day. 

Naira is 23 in and 45 lbs and not big at all IMO.


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## Naira (Jan 9, 2015)

From the member "outwest", an 18 inch/30 lb European moyen and a 22 in/40 lbs standard.


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## LindaR (May 3, 2009)

My Lilly is a "small" standard also (about 20 inches at the shoulder) and I find that to be a perfect size for us!!!


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