# Never brush dry hair huh!



## shellygroomer (Oct 18, 2010)

Alright I must be doing something wrong. I went to a dog show this past weekend and bought the isle of dogs products for Sophia. By the way thanks all of you for contributing to this site and all of the great info your are sharing with us. "HUGS" Well I have been misting and line brushing but it makes her hair curly and then when it air dries she looks messy to me. She seems to tangle quicker than when I hand dry her with the dryer. PLease what am I doing wrong? I have to brush her too much now that I have been misting. I tried usung less mist but it feels like I'm brushing dry hair and I'm afraid I might be doing damage by doing that. I am using a pin brush. Also another problem, I am known for a wonderful fluff dry but I am a pet groomer and usually use a slicker for those but when tring to use the pin bush on this show coat it just doesnt do the job. The ends get straight but the hair at the skin just doesn't get all that straight. I am also not using the higher heat settings like I would with pet hair. Which I know does the job. GRRR I have tried flipping my wrist up and pulling the hair taught from the roots to end but it seems to time consuming on th cool setting with all this hair. I know I must be missing something here. I am at a loss. I want to learn to maintain this coat. It's falmost 4 inches now if I can;t get a grip on this now I will be in trouble. I can't stand even tangles. I love to cuddle with my babe and like her to be tangle free But I also don't want her to have lay there for grooming for so long. Sorry this so long.... I really value your input..
Thanks,
Shelly


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## 4theLOVEofPOODLES (May 13, 2010)

Hi there,

Sorry no one has responded yet so I will try to help. Okay so if I understand correctly you are trying to grow/maintain a show coat? Your drying method is extremely important. Most people use a high powered force dryer to blast most the water off and then finish with a stand dryer. However, if your dryer is strong enough (mine has 2 4.0 hsp motors) you can dry your dog completely with that as well. Stand dryers are preffered as you can brush and dry and typically get the most straight coat. Edemco makes a great stand dryer. You must NOT move onto another section until where you are drying is completely dry! Heat does damage hair...the less heat the better. Ater drying your dog then needs to be combed from the roots out all over. Any pin mat left will cause matting. Then they need to be banded/wrapped. You mentioned too time consuming with the drying...yep, that is exactly what it is. Very time consuming. You can turn up the heat to a warm setting and yes of course it will dry faster just don't let it get hot. Heat will always dry and damage.

Anyhow, for mid-week brushing in between baths yes, you want to line brush and you should be using either a VERY light mist of water or something else when you brush. I like using water but you can use a number of products. Two I really like are OMG by plush puppy(highly diluted 20:1 or less) or Show Sheen (horse product) but water works just fine. Make sure you are using a high quality spray bottle that gives you a nice even light mist. Sounds like you are spraying too much or too close. Try holding the spray bottle farther away. I would even say that when I spray it more towards the center/ends. It will feel somewhat dry. All you are doing is adding the slightest amount of moisture to the coat so that it is does not snap while brushing. Use your pin brush-then your comb.
Do NOT flip your wrist! This will break the ends of the coat! Especially on the "Holy Grail" (the precious neck hair)of the poodle! Train yourself to keep your hand flat as you comb/brush. Slickers are not a good idea imo for you to use until you get the hang of what you are doing. I do not think slickers should be used on the neck hair or anywhere you need the hair long. Some say slickers can be but they can be very damaging and you must make sure you are using a good quality "soft" slicker. Some I like are the DoggyMan (white) by Millers Forge, All Systems has a decent one, and CC makes an okay one but expensive. I happen to have one I can carefully use a slicker on and the other can't as her hair is very delicate. Every dog is different and you need to do what works for YOUR dog. Use a good pin brush. Madan (soft, green/orange), CC, All Systems etc make great pin brushes. You have to think though...any time a comb/brush goes through that coat...it is going to wear down the hair shafts causing breakage. Best bets....bathe once a week and use good products (IOD's Stand up with 51 conditioner is amazing), comb/line brush BEFORE your dog mats (only you will know how long this takes to happen), keep your dog properly banded and wrapped, and do not go using a ton of different finishing products in the hair...if you do you will run the risk of clogging pores and creating a cement in the hair (from combined products) which will cause breakage. 

If you are going to maintain a show coat...grooming IS something your dog will need to get used to. It takes an enormous amount of time to do and your dog will need to learn to be patient and lie down while being brushed. Every show dog goes through this. Mine actually like being brushed and the one on one time spent.

Hope this helps.


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## NOLA Standards (Apr 11, 2010)

When I'm worried that I'm overspraying I'll mist the brush.
Find a good pillow, too.

4 The Love of Poodles gave you a great post!


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## shellygroomer (Oct 18, 2010)

Thanks I was looking for just that kind of info. Yes i am tring to grow show coat and yes I do use a force dryer to blow most of the water off then use oster high velocity stand dryer to finish. I use an all systems brush right now. From what you descibe I guess my spray bottle sucks, wetting the hair more than need be. OK check "get a new spray bottle, don't even think about that slicker.. check,check,". So far I have only been bathing once a week. You said every time I brush the hair it damages it, right but technically where is that line? Would once or twice a day be too much and now that I think about it what do you guys do after it rains? Is there a save coat protacol? lol. OMg I thought I knew a lot about coat I feel like a idiot. The last few nights I have been tring to make her get really comfi while I brush and band her. Tonight she did really good letting me do anything just laying there so I guess we are getting there. She really does have a great personality. I put extra bands in and she pranced around all happy not the slightest scratching.Yeahh! I think she likes wraps better than just plain banding. Yes I agree Nola 4 The Love of Poodles did din't she! Thanks LUV.
Shelly& Sophia


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## NOLA Standards (Apr 11, 2010)

If you want, look up Standard Pics and Videos from the Memphis Show - I wrote a pretty extensive post on Annie's topknot and how to grow it.

Good Luck!

Tabatha

PS Helps if you can turn it into "relaxation" too. It's the only time I don't run for the phone, allow people stick their heads in/drop by, etc. so I really enjoy "grooming time".


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## cbrand (Aug 9, 2009)

It also might be your product. Just because it is Isle of Dogs does not mean that it is right for your dog's coat. I've been using a human product as my grooming spray. It is made by Matrix and it is called Instacure. As a bonus, the bottle it comes in sprays a very fine mist. You can get it beauty supply stores.

If you don't already have a head rest, you need to get one.


Also, I think you need to turn DOWN the heat on your stand dryer. I think that when it is set to HOT, it drys the hair before you get a chance to pull it straight. Note.... I do all my show grooming with forced air dryer that I stick in the crook of my neck. I'm sure that this is not an ergonomically sound idea, but it works for me.


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## 4theLOVEofPOODLES (May 13, 2010)

Don't in any way feel like an idiot. At one point or another we were all completely new at this. If you don't ask you can't learn. Don't be afraid to try new things too as I love hearing still what others use. Never know..you may like something better. You will find that different people have different ways of doing things or different products they suggest. There are more ways than one to get the job done and as always you just need to find what works for you and you dog 

Brushing...like I had said..it IS damaging. I brush ONLY when I have to. Meaning shortly before the time they tend to start matting. Again, only you will be able to determine when matting starts so brush before it happens. Both my girls I brush once mid week before their bath. So, they get a bath say Sunday and are brushed Wed and then bathed on Sunday again. However, when they were going through coat change brushing was almost an every other day thing. Its horrible to say the least.

Now, I don't really let my girls outside during rainy days except to potty. However, I have found that during yucky weather and particularly if you live somewhere like I do in a giant ice box half the year...that the Absorbine Show Sheen works really good keeping snow, dirt, whatever out of the coat. It also helped me during coat change. You can spray it in damp or dry. It helps to get mats out as well. Warning though..this stuff makes the hair slick as well as the floor if you get any overspray on it. My husband learned that first hand so be careful. 

Like several have mentioned here already...get a chin rest and a good pillow. I used a wonderful little bone shaped pillow like the kind for your neck in the car. It's a good idea to train your dog to place their head on these early and not move it so when you are trying to do that perfect topknot someday they will hold still for you. I use my chin rest on the table and a pillow if we are feeling lazy and want to brush on the floor which I do more often than not


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## Jillian (Jan 26, 2010)

*Don't make it harder than it has to be*

Big handlers cart strings of dogs across the country in show coat all the time. I guarantee they aren't spending hours and hours in in between maintenance and you don't have to either. Use a good leave in conditioner or even a light oil. The top enemies of growing hair are heat and brushing. You do not have to keep the coat absolutely tangle free every minute of the day. Brushing once a day is too much. If you have a problem with matting during the coat change, most likely it is in certain areas. If you have to brush these out, then do that but don't brush the entire dog for the sake of brushing. Crown Royal has an excellent grooming spray. If you can get by with a once a week bath with no brushing or only brushing key areas once a week all the better. A lot of tangling will blow out with the HV after conditioning in the bath tub. Dematting a wet dog is easier on the hair than dematting dry hair. Less breakage and the hair untangles better. Much better than brushing dry hair. Use the HV on all the coat and finish the head and neck hair with the stand dryer.


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