# HELP! Overwhelmed Stay-at-Home Mom



## poolann (Jan 31, 2013)

So sorry you are feeling overwhelmed. Puppies are certainly hard work & it is difficult to get everyone on the same page. Are there specific reasons you are opposed to crate training & feeding on a schedule?


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## twyla (Apr 28, 2010)

schedules and the crate are your friend, I didn't do it for my first puppy but I am for my second puppy so much easier


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## twyla (Apr 28, 2010)

P.S. You should check out Learning to live with Wrex, there was alot of helpful advice there in coping with new puppy

http://www.poodleforum.com/2-member-introductions/120754-learning-live-wrex.html


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## Carley's Mom (Oct 30, 2011)

Puppies are very much like human babies. You need to use a crate and feed at the same time each day. It is hard ! I have not had a puppy for over 25 years for that very reason. . . but hang in there and you will be so happy later.

I know this is not going to be popular, but when I did have a puppy years ago. I did not get up with it. I put it in a room with tile floor and just cleaned up with no words said each morning. They all stopped using the bathroom at night as they matured. I have to have my sleep and that was more important to me. 

Don't expect too much from your pup right now, it is very young. Just watch it, or crate it when you can't and try to get it potty trained. Keep it lots of things to chew on and try to catch it chewing things that are not his. Make sure it gets lots of outside play time, It will need and continue to need lots of exercise . It will get easier and lots of people here to help you. Good Luck!


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## nataly (Jul 31, 2014)

My pup is 11 weeks old and when kids get to be too much for him often goes to his crate to wait out until the hiatus subsides. To me a crate is a must in a household with multiple children. In fact, when I was preparing for my puppy a lot of people suggested I put his crate in kitchen, so he is with us when he is crated. I gave it a lot of thought but put it in the laundry. My laundry is connected to the kitchen. Even when he is not crated he often goes for a nap/quiet time either to his crate or to the laundry. I am so glad I put it there. In my household I often feel the need to go to my quiet spot where nobody would get to me, but unfortunately I don't have the luxury, my pup however can do that. 
So, whether you decide to get a crate or not, I find it helpful to separate the puppy and the kids when I know the kids are very excited. You just can't control the kids and the puppy at times like these. When my kids come home from school the puppy goes to his crate for a little bit until they calm down. At first kids resisted this (not pup), but now they are used to it. It works so much better! And I'd say it is safer too for everyone involved. How old are your kids? 
Also, right before kids come home I try to give Chaplin some extra attention and exercise, so when they do get home, he is eager to take some rest.
The pup needs piece and quiet at times, too much attention can be detrimental for him and trying to provide it is overwhelming for you. 
I also find crate helpful when Chaplin gets overstimulated (crazy eyes, zoomies, biting everyone's clothes and ankles). It seems the most humane and effective to put him in crate to chill out. Usually in a minute or two he falls asleep and that way I know he needed a break...


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

I am not sure what you don't like about crates. We used wire crates for them as puppies through the time they were teething at about 7 months. After that, we did not need them so much. Dogs like dens and crates can be a place of comfort to them ONCE they get use to them. Having a crate means if you do have to leave the house, then they have a safe place to be while you are gone. Puppies will eat ANYTHING and could end up in surgery if not watched carefully.

Crates mean you can sleep through the night (after the first few nights of adjustment) and you don't have to worry about stepping in a mess in the morning or having the dog tear up something while you are sleeping.

While adult dogs do not NEED crates, I keep some in our finished basement for when the weather is bad and I have to leave the house. My dogs are afraid of thunderstorms and would run all over. They are safer in their crates in the basement and they act less fearful.

Crates really are your friends and can be a place of safety and comfort to your dog.
http://www.humanesociety.org/animals/dogs/tips/crate_training.html

If you really can't stand the idea of crates, try baby gates and x-pens to put your dog in a safe place when you can't watch him. Because those are your best two choices: watch him all the time or put him in a safe, confined area. These are the best way to train a puppy.

A food schedule is also a good housetraining aid. And making up rules for caring for your dog and maybe posting them for your children to see might also help bring order out of chaos.

Good luck!


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## sparkyjoe (Oct 26, 2011)

Some great advice here...
Dog Star Daily

It helped us a lot when we were planning for our new puppy.


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## Beaches (Jan 25, 2014)

You must be thinking of "caging" your pup and that is so not the case. 
Crating is the pups security and safe place. It is in fact a kindness to offer this. 
Our pup is just turning a year and Decided just last week that she didn't want to sleep in her crate at night anymore. Fine with us, she's 100% reliable and there is no need to crate her. 
Don't have too many expectations for an 8 week old pup, relax and treat her like a baby, regular eat, sleep and toilet. You'll both be fine.


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## NH10023 (Oct 16, 2014)

Thanks so much for all of the replies! 

I am not opposed to crate training or feeding schedules, I would just prefer not to use either method. I would never cage my puppy and, I agree, there is a major difference. I have read many threads on both topics and I am torn. 

I would love some resources for daily schedules with a puppy and any good books


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## Lou (Sep 22, 2012)

My 2 LOVE their crates! They're 2.5 years old. 
there are a lot of great videos on crate training . (Hope someone knows of a good one to post here)
The crate is their safe spot , like a little cave.

My 2 need a daily nap in their crates! Just like kids, they get cranky and start acting silly and being pushy to be petted like crawl on my recliner over and over like competing for attention. Sometimes they'll even walk up the stairs and look at me like: "mom!! It's nap time, let's go!" 

And when they wake up after an hour or 2 they are calm and well behaved and act lazy the rest of the day


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## poolann (Jan 31, 2013)

One other thing I have to add about crates....should your dog ever (God forbid) need surgery or be injured they WILL be crated at the vet's office & possibly will require crate rest at home. If they are not trained & comfortable in a crate it is just one more stressor in an already stressful situation. I would rather my dogs view it as a safe place.


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## Lou (Sep 22, 2012)

I would look at the crate as a crib. 
????
Just like babies , puppies put everything in their mouths until trained not to..


A puppy is a ton of work! That's why it took me 5 years to agree to get one. I even took kinda like a "maternity leave LOL" hubby tried for 5 years to convince me to get a poodle! When I agreed to it, I knew I was ready to commit to it. Here it's just hubby and I, but if I had a big family there would be posters all over the house with the strict rules, and everyone would have to help watch the puppy. 

It's too much for 1 person to try and train the puppy and the others "untraining" by not being consistent .
Here is sleepy Lou when she was a puppy









Here my 2 were about 1.5 years old  
Them going in their crate ?
http://youtu.be/1PXGhOgTr9g


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## Beaches (Jan 25, 2014)

Excellent point Poolann!


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## NH10023 (Oct 16, 2014)

Thank you all, again, for your thoughtful replies and sharing of wisdom. I am feeling much better and more empowered this afternoon. This reminds a little bit of becoming a mother (of human babies) for the first time!


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

do try the dogstardaily site mentioned above. it has downloadable material by ian dunbar, a well-known member of the dog training and behavior community, on raising puppies as well as lots of videos and podcasts on specific issues.


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## Lou (Sep 22, 2012)

( Great advice Patk! )
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Wishing you all the best dear!  

hopefully it will get easier very soon and become way more fun other than just hard work hehehehe
and Im sure you already know this.. But... It does get better. 

Eventually they learn! and become very very reliable. But Just as an example: I didn't trust Lou to sleep out of her crate at night until she was like a year old I think... Even though I puppy-proofed the entire house! (There was nothing on the floors for her to mess with etc) 
sometimes it was very frustrating, 
but now... IT'S PURE JOY!! ?

Keep us posted! ??


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## Feelingdoc (Feb 18, 2014)

8 weeks is still a very young puppy...many breeders wait 10 weeks to take home...so sleeping and everything will be that much more immature. Missing the litter and mom. Many have already replied with advantages of a crate but With a pup that young I would think that feeding schedule would be a MUST...it also helps with the schedule for going potty. 

Many here have potty schedules...my poodles go at 6am, 3pm, 5pm, and 9pm...on command/walks. (walks after breakfast at 6 and after supper at 5). I have a busy life and I don't want my dogs interfering with my work to go "in" and "out" (except of course if they are having issues.) There are links to potty suggestions for a schedule depending on the age of the dog...perhaps someone can send that information? 

My dogs are not crate trained...but don't object to one at the groomers...The are "BED" trained...they have beds in multiple rooms and have been trained to "go to bed" and "stay." A dog does need a "place" that is his to go to. I would think the younger the pup is the more secure the environment is...would be easier for YOU.


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## hopetocurl (Jan 8, 2014)

I cannot see how you will be able to train your dog at all without schedules.... Like I told cmarrie.... It also helps to crate hrm when you need a break.


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## Mahlon (Jun 8, 2014)

I'm a bit late to the party but figured I'd copy/paste this from my 365 Days of Quinn thread as I think at the very least it gives a good basis for creating a schedule. Of note things change, and there's room in the schedule to keep adjust.  Also feel free to check out my threads (link in signature) as I've tried to document almost daily my journey with Quinn from getting her at 9 weeks to now at 4.5 months.



> 8-9 AM Wake up & Potty Break
> 9-10 AM Breakfast!
> 10 AM ~30 mins downtime in her crate after eating, followed up with potty.
> 10-Noon Out for walk, errands, some exercise, and some fun!
> ...


As well, if crate isn't your cup of tea, maybe try an exercise pen instead in a common area, I'd still go with the crate myself (it took me awhile to get comfortable with crate training too, but they LOVE it if you do it right and its great for both your sanity and the puppies!). Also I highly recommend timed/schedule feedings, mainly for knowing when to expect the need to potty and adjust. Dogs and puppies are like humans, they need consistency and to know their boundaries, and even though they might not like it at the time they are enforced, they love it in the long run and thrive with it!

Dan & Quinn


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## NH10023 (Oct 16, 2014)

Dan… Thank you so much for sharing your thread with me! I will be following it from now on! I'm at your 10-week marker right now, but will be caught up in no time. I love your schedule. I noticed that you were able to take her out and about from the time you brought her home. My breeder told me not to take her to public places until she's had her last parvo shot at 4 months, which will be December :O This has been very difficult for me to swallow as we're a very active family and I had visions of taking her to some local trails and beaches while it's still warm fall weather in New England  Any thoughts on this? I may post a separate thread about this.


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## Mahlon (Jun 8, 2014)

Glad you found the schedule and thread interesting! 

And my personal take on the parvo shot and being dog social before the last round, is that in the case of a pet, wait and do the small things like socializing with dogs that are well taken care of and with good temperments that are owned by friends or family, and leave the dog parks, wildlife areas, and high traffic areas for later. I really thought long and hard about what to do with Quinn, but started at 11.5-12 weeks when she got her third round of shots because of her future work as a service dog. I felt that the risk was worth the reward in this case, but I would have been absolutely devastated if she had gotten sick and I would have beat myself up terribly about it.

Be patient, find places that work, like dog friendly inside stores, and such. That's my suggestion and I'd suggest posting a thread and letting others weigh in on it. But my thoughts are if there isn't a very good strong reason (and even then put lots of thought into it and the consequences) go with the recommendation by the vet and find creative ways to start socialization in public places that are safe, and with dogs and people that are great role models and know how to interact healthily with puppies.

-Dan & Quinn


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## hopetocurl (Jan 8, 2014)

They do start to love their crate...Willow (7mos) will go get in or on top of hers just to relax. If I leave her out while I am gone, she gets in it....even if other family members are there. It is not a bad thing at all if you do not abuse it.


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## Mahlon (Jun 8, 2014)

hopetocurl said:


> They do start to love their crate...Willow (7mos) will go get in or on top of hers just to relax. If I leave her out while I am gone, she gets in it....even if other family members are there. It is not a bad thing at all if you do not abuse it.


That's a great point, and also it makes it SOOOO much easier to transition to bed training, or a "safe" and mellow spot. Being up in Canada, Quinn has found a spot in our bedroom that acts like her crate in California. She goes there when unsure, to pout, or just to have alone time. Its her little refuge and I usually leave a few items of clothing with my smell and my wifes to help her feel comforted. 

-Dan


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## mom2Zoe (Jun 17, 2014)

The crate was my best friend. I have 6 kids and would not have survived without one.
a schedule is also important as with babies who crave a routine.
Zoe never minded her crate and still sleeps in there at night.

It was a bit overwhelming , but with a schedule and crate you will find life much calmer.


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## Streetcar (Apr 13, 2014)

NH10023 said:


> Thanks so much for all of the replies!
> 
> I am not opposed to crate training or feeding schedules, I would just prefer not to use either method. I would never cage my puppy and, I agree, there is a major difference. I have read many threads on both topics and I am torn.
> 
> I would love some resources for daily schedules with a puppy and any good books


If your dog ever needs to be hospitalized, having been crate trained could greatly improve his recovery. I didn't know about crate training back in 1991 so didn't, and it was to the great detriment of my last girl when she got pancreatitis and had to stay in the hospital. Her lack of comfort with a crate/hospital cage whatever you want to call it interfered with her ability to heal to a certain extent. She just didn't relax like she needed to .

Perhaps my mistake can help a bit.

My Tpoo came to me crate trained at four years of age, and even though he is housetrained, he seems to have something of a death wish to eat things he shouldn't. And he's not shy about climbing or jumping to try and get to something he wants. So he's crated while I'm at work. He gets all his meals in the crate and has a comfy bed in there. Last night we started playing in and out games with it so he doesn't start to hate it. There's a DVD called Crate Games that is brilliant. I got it years ago after my last dog died with the intent to use it with my next one. It's somewhere around here....


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## Streetcar (Apr 13, 2014)

NH10023, the Dog Star Daily site includes the free downloadable Before and After You Get Your Puppy books Dr. Dunbar wrote. Both are very worthwhile, even though you already have your sweet new puppy . I like what he has to say about socialization and exposure prior to 14 or so weeks.

Lily_cd_re has a great thread in the Training forum that is an accounting of an Ian Dunbar seminar she attended not long ago, and her whole thread is well worth reading, especially with your pup still being such a young 'un .


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Here is a link to that Ian Dunbar thread (which I wish someone would suggest to be a sticky so I don't have to keep digging it out). There is information about two of your concerns fairly close to the beginning. Housebreaking with a short and long term confinement area is something you might like to try (look at page 2). Also Dr. Dunbar thinks puppies should go out before they finish their shots. You just don't want to take a partially immunized pup to a dog park or have them in the faces of dogs whose health status is unknown.

http://www.poodleforum.com/23-general-training-obedience/100970-ian-dunbar-seminar-workshop.html


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## Asta's Mom (Aug 20, 2014)

Thanks for posting the Ian Dunbar thread. I learned a lot reading through it - although there were some places I disagreed with Dunbar. I do think you are right this should be a STICKY.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

There are a few things I also disagree with Ian about. I think that one will do best with their dog(s) if they read widely and balance their efforts according to their needs. For example if you live in an apartment with space at a premium the long term and short term confinement area won't be for you, etc.

I'm not sure what to do to make a thread a sticky, since that one is my thread I don't think I can do it.


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## Mahlon (Jun 8, 2014)

lily cd re said:


> There are a few things I also disagree with Ian about. I think that one will do best with their dog(s) if they read widely and balance their efforts according to their needs. For example if you live in an apartment with space at a premium the long term and short term confinement area won't be for you, etc.
> 
> I'm not sure what to do to make a thread a sticky, since that one is my thread I don't think I can do it.


Sent PoodleLead a private message requesting they review the thread for sticky status  Hopefully we hear back from them and see some action. One thing I might suggest though would be a change to the Thread title, as its more than just a report, its a great accumulation of ideas learned in the Ian Dunbar school and philosophy of training. A better thread title might also help people find it on their own (even with being stickied). 

Hope it helps, and thanks again Catherine for all the help you've given me and others, in that thread and all over PF, its much appreciated!

Dan & Quinn


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## Mahlon (Jun 8, 2014)

Mission Accomplished! Catherine's Ian Dunbar thread was stickied by PoodleAdmin and one of our moderators this morning.  Hope that helps!

-Dan


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