# Impulse Control



## TeamPoodle (Aug 10, 2015)

That's awesome! what good doggies indeed! (and what a great trainer/mama they have!)


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

Good work!! Bravo Javi-pups
Eric


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## FireStorm (Nov 9, 2013)

Such good puppies! I have to say, Hans is the first dog that I've really worked on practicing impulse control with, and it has made such a big difference.


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## Axeldog (Aug 29, 2014)

Everybody is so attentive to mom! I love how Peeves is in the background so intently watching and waiting. Good doggies!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

My triangle of training these days is impulse control, focused attention (with strong positive markers for that behavior) and informative correction. Corrections are not harsh, just a clear message that what just happened was not what was asked for. With Lily and Peeves it is just a clear verbal negative marker (like uh oh or oopsie). If Javelin breaks a sit or down I touch him lightly on the back end to remind him his butt was supposed to be planted on the floor or at the back of his neck to remind him he was on a down. As he gets to really be solid on knowing new behaviors I move him to verbal markers of correction as well. 

I think everything else I require of them will grow out of or be easily reinforced using this general strategy.

This morning was particularly good. Peeves went to get up before being released and Javelin held his sit stay!


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

I expect Lily and Peeves are old hands at this, but very impressive for Javelin!


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

That is just great!!
Timi has already progressed to where I can put down her dinner, I say "wait", she sits, and I can leave the room for a minute or two, come back, putter around, and she waits for her release.
And that reminds me - you know how I always say that dogs respond better to hand signals than verbal commands - she will NOT release and eat when I just say "OK" - she looks excited, she almost reaches for the food, and then she stops herself, and looks at me like "ha, you can't fool me" not until I actually point to the dish will she release and eat. And I did not teach her this, I always said the word and pointed at the same time - it is her choice to only trust hand signals. She clearly knows what OK means, but she is not comfortable doing it without the hand signal - isn't that interesting?


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Buck's lack of impulse control is behind his sole, unacceptable behavior. That darn jumping! Sorry, I forgot "leave the opossum" and counter surfing. Impulse control is such an underpinning. I'll just keep working on it. Sigh.

My last dog was deaf or nearly so in his last years, so I keep up the hand signals for further on down the road.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Mfmst said:


> Buck's lack of impulse control is behind his sole, unacceptable behavior. That darn jumping! Sorry, I forgot "leave the opossum" and counter surfing. Impulse control is such an underpinning. I'll just keep working on it. Sigh.
> 
> My last dog was deaf or nearly so in his last years, so I keep up the hand signals for further on down the road.



Young or old, they always respond to the hand signals better. A trainer once pointed out to me that dogs use body language much more than sound to communicate with one another - their brains are just wired that way. Makes sense I think.
Teaka can hear me just fine, but I get no response whatsoever to verbal commands, but hand signals are still instant response!


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

Impulse control? Can someone tell me how to curb _*my*_ impulses? Grace is fine but I have obsessive *impulsive* MPS. 
Eric


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

ericwd9 said:


> Impulse control? Can someone tell me how to curb _*my*_ impulses? Grace is fine but I have obsessive *impulsive* MPS.
> Eric



Eric, sorry about that MPS. The only way to alleviate your suffering is to give in when you find the right one.

Mfmst, keep at it. Also work on the focused attention. That goes hand in hand with the impulse control. And Tiny you have hinted at the attention part by talking about signals vs. verbals. If you don't have focused attention then you can't use signals reliably. 

The attention is built into that impulse control exercise since all three of my crew have to not just check in and then go back to staring at the treat, they have to offer and hold the eye contact on their own for a few seconds. Lily will hold eye contact for more than a minute even with distractions if I set her up to understand that is what is expected. Peeves somewhat shorter, but improving. Javelin very short held eye contacts, but frequently offered and improving.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

lily cd re said:


> Eric, sorry about that MPS. The only way to alleviate your suffering is to give in when you find the right one.
> 
> Mfmst, keep at it. Also work on the focused attention. That goes hand in hand with the impulse control. And Tiny you have hinted at the attention part by talking about signals vs. verbals. If you don't have focused attention then you can't use signals reliably.
> 
> The attention is built into that impulse control exercise since all three of my crew have to not just check in and then go back to staring at the treat, they have to offer and hold the eye contact on their own for a few seconds. Lily will hold eye contact for more than a minute even with distractions if I set her up to understand that is what is expected. Peeves somewhat shorter, but improving. Javelin very short held eye contacts, but frequently offered and improving.



I have to admit - I think that you are very right that one should work upon focused attention, but I really never have - basically my greatest accomplishment has been making Timi into a great eater - as long as there is a possibility of a treat involved, I have Timi's undivided attention!
I really admire the focused attention that your crew has in heeling - I so wish that I could do that with Timi, as this is her Achilles Heel in being the perfect dog, but the problem is that in our environment we both have to focus much more on what might get in our way than upon one another. Even in Long Island City, which is still way more crowded than most will ever face, we walk so much better than in Manhattan!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Tiny Poodles said:


> I have to admit - I think that you are very right that one should work upon focused attention, but I really never have - basically my greatest accomplishment has been making Timi into a great eater - as long as there is a possibility of a treat involved, I have Timi's undivided attention!
> I really admire the focused attention that your crew has in heeling - I so wish that I could do that with Timi, as this is her Achilles Heel in being the perfect dog, but the problem is that in our environment we both have to focus much more on what might get in our way than upon one another. Even in Long Island City, which is still way more crowded than most will ever face, we walk so much better than in Manhattan!


Eventually though what will you do if your pocket full of treats runs dry? This is why although the focused attention when taught relies on food rewards, the real world use of it for me does not rely on food, but instead on verbal markers when allowed. For the utility heeling and signal exercise there are no verbals, let alone food rewards. 

For people who have a hard time fading food rewards look up variable reinforcement schedules for rewards. I think sophie anne even found an app for how to do it.

So here is today's set of impulse control pictures. I alternate between buffalo ears and West Paw toppl toys with salmon skins and other goodies. I think all of my dogs like the salmon skins better than ears, so this is the harder thing to have to wait for.

First dogs in various states of attention or obsession over the treat balls.

















For those interested in the treat balls here is a close up. I used a smaller one of these with kibble in it with Javelin when he was small to introduce him to appropriate chewable objects.


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

I have had to admit that I am a haphazard trainer. I do train my dogs to do the regular stuff like sit, down, stay, shake, backup. With multiple dogs you have to have those things down pat. But after that I do not concentrate on training. That is why my hubby will be taking over formal training later this summer.

I do agree with Tiny Poodles that the dogs watch you more than listen to you. I have a baby gate on the basement stairs (so Phoenix will not fall down), and when I take Dakota down there to throw a ball or training or groom, I have him sit at the top while I move the baby gate over to block the other dogs from coming. Then I look at him while he is sitting waiting (if he starts to move I made a "no" noise like ACK!). Then I put my finger to my nose and hold his attention, then I wave my hand towards the basement stairs and he takes off. So I do train for attention a little, just probably not enough.

I also put my 3 dogs in a sit and put kibble on the floor in front of them, then release them with an OK. What is important to me is that they stay when I need them to so that I can manage them when I have to.


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## TeamPoodle (Aug 10, 2015)

I tried something today inspired by you, Lily cd re. I let Riley sniff a dried chicken breast strip (high value for Riley) and then put him in a down-stay and put the treat 3 feet in front of him. I stood off to the side. The entire time in the stay, Riley kept eye contact on me, waiting for the release, and didn't so much as blink in the direction of the treat. I was so proud of him. 

We've got a lot to work on with Riley, but he's really good at both impulse control and stays, so with this exercise he was totally in his element. (I think all "stays" require some amount of impulse control for dogs, whether the distraction is right under their nose or not, so they kind-of go hand-in-hand in my mind).

Now, if only polite leash walking and polite greetings were this easy...


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

That's marvelous about how well Riley did with that exercise. To get the loose leash issues under control will become easier as his focused attention becomes more and more developed.

What I have done with Lily and am working on with Javelin quite heavily now is attention without having to ask for it. When I go to matches I bring Lily near people having a conversation. As they talk and move their hands and shift their feet she is to remain sitting at heel and to look at me and hold eye contact. She will now maintain that eye contact with strangers moving their hands right over her head or with me holding her favorite tug toy in my raised outstretched hand. Once that level of attention is in place you now make sure that before you tell the dog to start moving you get that eye contact offered to you. Once you start moving if the dog looks away you can either give an order (look or eyes up for examples) to regain the focus or you can stop moving. When you stop moving the dog should sit at heel and again offer attention. Start moving once the dog has kept focused for several seconds. Gradually you will be able to keep moving, make pace or direction changes or stop without saying anything because the dog's attention is centered on you and not the cat on the lawn across the street or the kid who just went by on a bicycle. The ultimate expression of that is the head's up heeling that you see in the top level competitive obedience dogs.

Javelin is still at the point where I mark his attention to me on sit at heel and while on loose leash walking. I am working to get him to correlate looking at me with a positive verbal marker and not just using food as a lure for the attention. He is starting to be better at it.


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## TeamPoodle (Aug 10, 2015)

lily cd re said:


> That's marvelous about how well Riley did with that exercise. To get the loose leash issues under control will become easier as his focused attention becomes more and more developed.
> 
> What I have done with Lily and am working on with Javelin quite heavily now is attention without having to ask for it. When I go to matches I bring Lily near people having a conversation. As they talk and move their hands and shift their feet she is to remain sitting at heel and to look at me and hold eye contact. She will now maintain that eye contact with strangers moving their hands right over her head or with me holding her favorite tug toy in my raised outstretched hand. Once that level of attention is in place you now make sure that before you tell the dog to start moving you get that eye contact offered to you. Once you start moving if the dog looks away you can either give an order (look or eyes up for examples) to regain the focus or you can stop moving. When you stop moving the dog should sit at heel and again offer attention. Start moving once the dog has kept focused for several seconds. Gradually you will be able to keep moving, make pace or direction changes or stop without saying anything because the dog's attention is centered on you and not the cat on the lawn across the street or the kid who just went by on a bicycle. The ultimate expression of that is the head's up heeling that you see in the top level competitive obedience dogs.
> 
> Javelin is still at the point where I mark his attention to me on sit at heel and while on loose leash walking. I am working to get him to correlate looking at me with a positive verbal marker and not just using food as a lure for the attention. He is starting to be better at it.


Thank you for the advice! It makes sense now that if his attention is on me, it will be easier for him to stay by my side. I'm going to start implementing what you suggest. We're also taking a training class starting in June and one of the focuses is loose-leash walking. So, hopefully if we work hard on this by then I can get to class with a dog somewhere in-between full-out spaz and well-behaved.


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## StormeeK (Aug 3, 2015)

I noticed you said that before Jav you could release Lily and Peeves separately. This is what I need help with. Dewey and Rex will wait, look at me and release to the treats together but I need a plan on how to get them to understand one at a time. Thanks!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

StormeeK said:


> I noticed you said that before Jav you could release Lily and Peeves separately. This is what I need help with. Dewey and Rex will wait, look at me and release to the treats together but I need a plan on how to get them to understand one at a time. Thanks!


And I am working on getting back to separate releases for each of them now. When I had just two I used to make Lily wait and release Peeves first since Lily was more reliable. Once I thought they both understood the concept I would have Peeves on a down and Lily on a sit and release Lily first. I made sure I was standing close enough to Peeves to put a hand on his shoulder if I saw an intention move to break before the release for him came. Once he was reliable waiting for it on a down then I switched him to wait on a sit. Lily is the only one who will wait on a stand. I am now working on getting Javelin to wait on the down while I release Lily or Peeves then him and then the last dog.


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## StormeeK (Aug 3, 2015)

So as I am working on it now, one more question, what is the best way to let that specific dog know that you are releasing him and not the other. Are you using hand signals or specific words for that dog? Thanks again!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I say the appropriate dog's name and OK which is the release marker for all of them. So the name cues the right dog to listen for what is coming next and OK is the release to take the treat. I will tell the other two to stay before I cue the release if I think I need to remind them that the release is just for the dog that heard its name. None of them needs an order for the taking of the treat. If I use any hand signal it is a stay signal for the dogs who are to remain as they are.


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

I was also inspired to work more than I usually do on focused attention and longer down stays. I had Buck on a leash in the yard last night and managed to get him to look at me instead of the rabbit that was running away under the hedges. I don't think I would have been successful if he was off leash. Without distractions, he does very well. With distractions, a continual work in progress.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Mfmst said:


> I was also inspired to work more than I usually do on focused attention and longer down stays. I had Buck on a leash in the yard last night and managed to get him to look at me instead of the rabbit that was running away under the hedges. I don't think I would have been successful if he was off leash. Without distractions, he does very well. With distractions, a continual work in progress.


It is all always a work in progress Mfmst. I think that looking at you instead of a rabbit is huge, even on leash. Right now I have no doubt that if Javvy saw a rabbit he would have no hesitation to try to pull me off my feet to get to it.


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## StormeeK (Aug 3, 2015)

Ok I feel that I have the plan and we will be working on this. I didn't know if it would be expecting too much that could they recognize their name when I said it and be expected to follow. I was hoping that was the case but not too sure. Thanks so much for your help!

Mfmst, I have no doubt that Rex and Dewey would be enjoying a raw dinner if a rabbit ran past no matter what I was doing. It has happened before. Yay Buck for listening!


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

lily cd re said:


> I say the appropriate dog's name and OK which is the release marker for all of them. So the name cues the right dog to listen for what is coming next and OK is the release to take the treat. I will tell the other two to stay before I cue the release if I think I need to remind them that the release is just for the dog that heard its name. None of them needs an order for the taking of the treat. If I use any hand signal it is a stay signal for the dogs who are to remain as they are.



Having a pack, don't you always use a name before you give a command? I sure do - so I get completely ignored if I don't use a name, and I am sure that would hold true for a release as well.


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Believe me, I was afraid if he didn't make eye contact he might pull my arm out of its socket. Whew! We had two encounters early AM and last call with another opossum, the previous day which was why he was on a leash. Very hard to do a collar grab with these faux battles when every bit of training is forgotten Major distraction/drama which I don't need!


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## West U (Jul 30, 2014)

Cute pictures, especially the one in the middle.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Tiny Poodles said:


> Having a pack, don't you always use a name before you give a command? I sure do - so I get completely ignored if I don't use a name, and I am sure that would hold true for a release as well.



Yes always a name first unless they are all supposed to do the same thing, then it is everbody drop or everybody sit.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

lily cd re said:


> Yes always a name first unless they are all supposed to do the same thing, then it is everbody drop or everybody sit.



That I expect will be my challenge when I get a new puppy - getting them to do things simultaneously - individual to me is easy!


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## sarahebeth (Feb 16, 2016)

That is so impressive. I'm working on down with Teddy and we are struggling. I've tried several methods for getting him down, but nothing seems to work. And I think the fact that he's so close to the ground actually makes it trickier. He got sit in about 2 seconds, but down hasn't clicked yet. Any tips?


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Have Teddy learn down from sit. With him on a sit use a treat that you bring down to the floor just in front of him. He should follow it down. Move it to between his front feet with him remaining down and then let him take the treat while still down. Once he understands the position then name it as down and work on fading the treats. After he gets doing from a sit you can work on getting him to do it from a stand.


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

Impulse control work is foundational to all we do, as well. It's essential for an Agility dog. There's a fine line, though, between the need to keep the dog moving forward and the need to have the dog take the handler's direction!

We, too, do the "no food until released" thing and other such activities, but one twist is that, for my purposes, I usually release on "focus forward" rather than on eye contact. For the most part, I want the dog looking ahead to the goal (obstacle) and taking direction from my motion and body position as to where to go next, rather than looking up at my face, except, of course, when actually heeling. (He has a command for attentive, eye contact heeling as well, and even that can come in handy on the course at times.)

I did a lot of having him sit, going out and putting down his food bowl and returning to him, then releasing him only when he focused on the bowl. Same principle with a jump or other obstacle--release to get to run out and do it when he's focused on it. I imagine this is sort of like the directed retrieve in Obedience, where you have to orient the dog to a specific glove? Only more challenging in Obedience since you can't also make a dash in the correct direction!

Oh, and we have one of those "treat balls," too! Sugarfoot loves his.

Great post, thanks for sharing!

--Q


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Q yes it all translates to foundations for all sorts of activities from nice loose leash and polite manners in a big box store to a run towards an OTCh or a MACh! 

For utility obedience you really do require the focus to be on you for essentially everything except the go out in directed jumping. That is the only exercise for which I have been told not to look for eye contact but rather forward focus during the set up. I actually used Lily's go out forward focus to reinforce a run on command for agility. In the middle of the course Stef had set for this week there was a sequence of jumps followed by a tunnel and the table. Since the tunnel was straight it was inevitable that Lily was going to come out of it ahead of me. The first couple of times we worked through that sequence she ended up doing spins between the tunnel and the table. To show her that she was supposed to continue without me to the table I sat her next to me at the exit of the tunnel and showed her the table like a go out. She aced it.

Even for gloves you want the dog to give handler focus so they read the pivot correctly to know which glove to go to. So that exercise is eyes up until you are ready to send the dog at which time they follow the line you indicate to the glove, but you've already really told them which glove with how you have turned for it.

And yes aren't those Toppl balls the best? I love all their stuff. The regular balls and all the other rubbery toys float and can go in the dishwasher. The fuzzy ones are almost completely unstuffed, but even so are really durable. Even Peeves has not managed to kill the fuzzies yet and not for lack of trying.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

lily cd re said:


> Eventually though what will you do if your pocket full of treats runs dry? This is why although the focused attention when taught relies on food rewards, the real world use of it for me does not rely on food, but instead on verbal markers when allowed. For the utility heeling and signal exercise there are no verbals, let alone food rewards.
> 
> For people who have a hard time fading food rewards look up variable reinforcement schedules for rewards. I think sophie anne even found an app for how to do it.QUOTE]
> 
> ...


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## TeamPoodle (Aug 10, 2015)

lily cd re said:


> For people who have a hard time fading food rewards look up variable reinforcement schedules for rewards. I think sophie anne even found an app for how to do it.


You don't by chance remember the name of the app, do you? It sounds like it would be great to keep on hand.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

TeamPoodle said:


> You don't by chance remember the name of the app, do you? It sounds like it would be great to keep on hand.


I don't but if you send a PM to sophie anne I am sure she can steer you in the right direction. I haven't used it myself, but can certainly see that it would be a good way to get an understanding of the process.


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