# Rethinking prices and contracts



## bigpoodleperson (Jul 14, 2009)

Hmmm. As a pet puppy buyer i expect to pay anywhere from 1200-2000$. But for that price i would expect a health guarentee! I personally would not go to a breeder (no matter how nice) without one. Even some BYBs are doing health guarentees (although crappy ones). It means alot to a buyer to know that just incase something were to happen that the breeder "has your back". 

Lowering prices would probably be a very good idea in this economy if you are having multiple litters soon and need to "move" the puppies. I am suspect of a breeder that charges too little though personally. 
I think the refunds are nice, but it would not make or break me on a breeder. I think to save yourself some money you could stop them and not be worse for wear. I know you are picky about which homes your puppies go to, so im sure they will spay/neuter them and create a good home without the refunds. I consider refunds an added bonus, but i would do everything (like s/n, classes, etc) regardless of the refunds anyways. 

I do think that not giving health guarentees is a bad idea. It will turn so many people off to you before they have even had a chance to know you and your dogs. Since you do do all health testing, researching, etc im sure you dont have many that you actually have to pay out on or replace anyways. Do you?


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## tintlet (Nov 24, 2009)

can't seem to attach contract...email me if anyone wants it
[email protected]


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## Locket (Jun 21, 2009)

I agree with bigpoodleperson. At that price, I want a health guarantee. I think most buyers are aware that nothing can be 100% guaranteed, but knowing that your breeder "has your back" as bigpoodleperson said is something I look for in a breeder.


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## tintlet (Nov 24, 2009)

I don't have a problem with placing dogs..but I do get too picky and am sure I overlook some great homes. and Some great homes just are not in this price range.

Have lowered prices and given no refunds in the past. and have also refunded( titles earned) for the complete cost of the dog...lol

no, have not yet refunded any $$ or replaced a puppy for health issues


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## Dogsinstyle (Sep 6, 2009)

As a breeder I give a lifetime guarantee. That is one way I can get feedback on my pups as they get older. I think it is imperative that I track their health as they age- 5, 6, 7, 8 and so on. 
If you intend to stay in poodles long term, you should really get a feel as to how your pups do as they age.
If they all keel over at 7, might be good to find out.
Carole


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## KalaMama (Nov 20, 2009)

I really see where you are coming from Tintlet. The puppies are living breathing animals and there is no way you can assure that every puppy is going to be perfectly healthy. If you do everything you possibly can health-wise to ensure you are producing healthy puppies, then that is all you can do. There is a chance in any purchase and that is a chance that puppy buyers have to make when getting a puppy. Flyingduster and I had a forum discussion about this a few weeks ago. I learned from her point of view about full guaratee or no guarantee,I still think that the buyer should be responsible for the puppy but on their own terms. On the other hand, I would have a clause in the contract (I haven't read yours yet) that asks for the buyer to let you know of any health problems and I would also be prepared to help a buyer or replace a puppy if something happened in the first couple of years, but only because you would choose to and not because it is in the contract. I don't know if any of that made sense but I understand where you are coming from I believe.


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## Harley_chik (Nov 7, 2008)

I'm probably in the minority but a written health guarantee doesn't mean much to me. All a breeder can do is test their adults and research pedigrees. Nothing is 100% guaranteed. I'm just of the mindset that a breeder will do what they think is fair should something crop up. It would be difficult to make a breeder adhere to their guarantee and I would have a very hard time sending a puppy I had bonded w/ back in exchange for a refund or replacement either one. If they help w/ vet bills, then awesome but I wouldn't take advantage of other options. Many guarantees I've seen have so many exceptions, that they aren't worth it anyway. The guarantee only covers "life threatening" defects, what ever that means. I've seen breeders claim that HD is b/c of tile, linoleum and hardwood floors. I've seen them blame LP on jumping off furniture. I'm satisfied w/ health testing, pedigree research and hoping for the best.


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## wishpoo (Sep 12, 2009)

To me a warranty means only one thing - dedication of a breeder to his /her program and ALL puppies produced.

As much as I look into a warranty part , I also look at "taking dog back any time with no questions asked (without a refund, of course) . To me, as a buyer, it means that breeder "cares about puppy" for life - no matter what. That only can come from real love and complete dedication to the breeding program and very selective and limited breeding :rolffleyes:

We all understand that only "genetic" health issues can be "covered" and should be. 

There are many variations "of the contract" and I always look at a specific wording . If I have a feeling that a breeder is "washing his hands off" of any possible problem that can arise - I run from that place since, to me, it gives a message - "I am here to sell, make money and do not give damn what will happen to you or your puppy" !


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## Reesmom (Feb 4, 2010)

I agree with Harley Chic. I've been in that situation with my BC. He came up with bad hips and the breeder wanted him back. Rather than give me my money back even though both were stated in the contract. He was 2 years and competing in agility by then. I was not about to give him up. She agreed to refund my money but I never got it. 

Genetics can't be 100% guaranteed. I think it's up to the buyer to do the best research they can and hope for the best. I didn't get a guarantee with Glader or Reece, but I did get copies of all testing on the parents and Reece herself since she was an adult. That means more to me that a contract that may or may not be relevant.


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## wishpoo (Sep 12, 2009)

Oh - I agree with that 100 % !!!!! All testing has to be done and clear for genetic diseases and eyes and hips clear !!!!! No warranty in this world has any meaning without those done  - no question about that : ) !!!

I just like to see that breeder stands behind the program 100 %, that is all...Some would obviously "pretend" but than references come handy in that respect ; ).


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## Cdnjennga (Jul 30, 2009)

wishpoo said:


> As much as I look into a warranty part , I also look at "taking dog back any time with no questions asked (without a refund, of course) . To me, as a buyer, it means that breeder "cares about puppy" for life - no matter what. That only can come from real love and complete dedication to the breeding program and very selective and limited breeding :rolffleyes:


Agreed. The most important part to me is that breeder's do their due diligence before breeding, and that they stand behind their puppy after breeding. My breeder currently has a dog living with her who was returned at the age of 7 for whatever reason. It comforts me to know that she has stood by him and given him a great home years after placing him. It just shows me that she cares about the dogs she produces.


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## tintlet (Nov 24, 2009)

Always take back a dog, no matter the age or the reason. I feel responsible for them for their whole lives. My hubby will drive across the country to get a dog back!!

Its just that as a breeder it almost feels unethical to offer a guarantee when its not possible to do that. I'm guessing the general public sees 'guarantee' and feels their dog will never be sick for any reason. 

very difficult to protect both the buyer and seller. What are things that you would like to see in a contract? or NOT see?

(I'm talking about pet dogs, not show prospects, etc.)


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## partial2poodles (Feb 11, 2010)

I have heard from 2 breeders that they werent even going to breed their standards this year due to people wanting a much smaller dog (they said due to the economy, feeding and vetting larger dogs is too pricey for some). SO I didn't breed my intended and tested female. The other litter was the accidental one.

In my area, I do see the tendancy for breeding these little designer dogs and selling them for as much as show quality standard poodles....$1-2000. Heck, it takes no testing, no showing no championship titles to make as much money as a reputable breeder these days.

I feel that different litters may require different contracts. No longer a "one size fits all my dogs" contract. The ones that you really put the most money into for showing and getting points on is going to command a higher price and should have a better guarantee than a good solid pet. 

It was everyone's comments on here that made me sell my puppies for $300. This way there were no guarantees, no questions on health or tests or titles...it IS WHAT IT IS! Here you go, one 8 week old puppy, food etc. 
And I see tons of other breeders selling purebred poodles for triple that amount. But I can see everyones point that if you are paying well over a thousand dollars, you would expect a lot in return. On my next litter, I will be doing the contract and guaranteeing.


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## partial2poodles (Feb 11, 2010)

I want to see a contract that ensures an indoor home, grooming a minimum of 4 times a year, no junk food EVER and obedience training is mandatory. Well trained, well groomed healthy dogs will never be returned to the breeder. It unrealistic but its what I want to ask for.


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## neVar (Dec 25, 2009)

personally- i wouldn't work with a breeder who won't gaurentee. I also dont' like breeders who's guarentees aren't well written out (Ie what is covered what's not) 

as to refunds for titles etc- it's an incentive for the breeder IMO more then the puppy purchaser. it wouldn't sway me towards a breeder- the cost vs what it costs to get a title i so little. 

refunds for spaying- i think is rediculous- set the price the contract says spay it- and you follow up because you care about the puppies. vs the purchasers hounding you because they want the money. if it's a home you worry won't spay- then t's a home i wouldn't be placing pups.


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## spoospirit (Mar 10, 2009)

partial2poodles said:


> I want to see a contract that ensures an indoor home, grooming a minimum of 4 times a year, no junk food EVER and obedience training is mandatory. Well trained, well groomed healthy dogs will never be returned to the breeder. It unrealistic but its what I want to ask for.


_
I agree with what you would like to see; but, I am wondering how a breeder will enforce the 'no junk food EVER' clause. People just being what they are are going to stray from this part of the agreement occasionally. It's easy for a buyer to gush over how healthy the puppy will eat but eventually start to offer a bit of junk food here and there because it is so cute, etc. _


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## cbrand (Aug 9, 2009)

Although many guarantees are hollow, I think they have become an industry standard for breeders at a certain level. I completely understand your reasoning, but I don't think you can go down that road and still attract the right type of buyer.


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## Skye (Feb 19, 2010)

I will be looking for a puppy sometime over the next year or two. As a prospective buyer, to me there are two categories. One would be inexpensive with no health testing or guarantees, and the other in the price range listed with testing and guarantees. It sounds like you have invested a lot in the testing; I would keep it as is. I know when I begin my search for a reputable breeder, health testing is on my list!


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## Desiree (Feb 14, 2010)

I beginning to see that the damage to the breed has already been done by breeders; show, puppy mills, BYB's, environmental pollutants, vets, and food marketers etc. Every puppy is born with 5 or more defective genes. I think it time to be honest with folks about all these guarantees/ market positioning strategies. No one can be responsible for everything. All breeders need to test their dogs for the prominent health problems in their breed and breed for health first. There are no guarantees in life.


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## Winnow (Jan 2, 2010)

Can someone tell me what a health guarantee is ?

I sold my pups with a health and life insurance for the first year. 
But there is no way I can guarantee there health.
Although there parents are healthy and the grand parents and there great grand parents. 

What do you do if a pup gets sick with a health guarantee, do you put the dog down and offer them a new one ?


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## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

Winnow said:


> Can someone tell me what a health guarantee is ?
> 
> I sold my pups with a health and life insurance for the first year.
> But there is no way I can guarantee there health.
> ...


I've seen different situations

1 - the breeder takes the pup back at the buyers expense. Most buyers do not want to give their new pups back because they have grown attached.
2 -the breeder replaces with one from a future litter.
3 - some monies are refunded.

A lot of times this depends on what is in the contract as guaranteed. Some only guarantee on what the dogs are tested for. 

I think tinlet has some valid points. The industry does seem to expect to have a guarantee on health.


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## Winnow (Jan 2, 2010)

Olie said:


> I've seen different situations
> 
> 1 - the breeder takes the pup back at the buyers expense. Most buyers do not want to give their new pups back because they have grown attached.
> 2 -the breeder replaces with one from a future litter.
> ...


We don't have this in Iceland.

Just the life and health insurance from an insurance company so you only have to pay a small fee every year to keep the insurance valid. 
And if the dog dies then you get the money you paid for the dog back. 
Or if the dog gets sicke you will only page a small precent for the hospital fees.


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## Desiree (Feb 14, 2010)

Here's a bit from a British Retriever breeder's (judge) sample contract.

" The Buyer having examined certificates in respect of Hereditary Eye Diseases, Hip Dysplasia and other such documents as may be available applicable to the parents of the above puppy, as issued by a qualified veterinary surgeon, accepts that such certificates do not in any way constitute a Warranty, but are purely the opinion given at the time of examination by the veterinary surgeon, *as the said puppy, being a living creature, cannot carry a guarantee that could be applicable to an inanimate object.*" (my bold face here)


Yadda, yadda, yadda....Then it says........

"The Seller agrees that, on being notified of any problem, the Buyer may return the puppy within one calender month from the date of purchase, providing the Buyer presents a veterinary surgeon's certificate stating that the puppy was suffering from a condition that was to the detriment at the time of purchase. Given such circumstances the Seller will be responsible for the vet's fee."


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## Desiree (Feb 14, 2010)

I think selling pups with prepaid healthy insurance for the first year is an excellent way to help new puppy owners deal with first health issues should they arise. I'll look into it for the future pups. Unfortunately in this country, certain animal political groups want to make breeders responsible for everything that could possibly happen to the dog for the rest of its life instead of objectively looking at the many of factors effecting health of our dogs in a very polluted environment. 

For example, active hunting dogs have a high rate of seizures and researchers are beginning to suspect that inhaling the residue of chemicals used in the fields where the dog's hunt in the fall may be the cause.


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## Winnow (Jan 2, 2010)

Desiree said:


> I think selling pups with prepaid healthy insurance for the first year is an excellent way to help new puppy owners deal with first health issues should they arise. I'll look into it for the future pups. Unfortunately in this country, certain animal political groups want to make breeders responsible for everything that could possibly happen to the dog for the rest of its life instead of objectively looking at the many of factors effecting health of our dogs in a very polluted environment.
> 
> For example, active hunting dogs have a high rate of seizures and researchers are beginning to suspect that inhaling the residue of chemicals used in the fields where the dog's hunt in the fall may be the cause.


it is impossible to put a guarantee on a dog just like it was a TV or something!
I would go with the insurance if that is possible.


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## poodleholic (Jan 6, 2010)

> =tintlet;90577]I don't have a problem with placing dogs..but I do get too picky and am sure I overlook some great homes. and *Some great homes just are not in this price range.[/*QUOTE]
> 
> 
> Have you considered either offering a payment plan for those great homes, or even lowering the price for them? Is there a reason why this wouldn't be feasable?


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## RILabradoodles (Apr 7, 2010)

wishpoo said:


> To me a warranty means only one thing - dedication of a breeder to his /her program and ALL puppies produced.
> 
> As much as I look into a warranty part , I also look at "taking dog back any time with no questions asked (without a refund, of course) . To me, as a buyer, it means that breeder "cares about puppy" for life - no matter what. That only can come from real love and complete dedication to the breeding program and very selective and limited breeding


VERY NICELY PUT...If you are proud of Breeding Poodles and you seem to be doing it right, why wouldnt you want to continue offering a great waranty, no matter what you are charging. Being responsible for your offspring is what any breeder should have in mind. Getting feedback is what keeps us breeding.

Wouldn't you want to assist those with one of your pups? In any way you could if issues arise?


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## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

RILabradoodles said:


> VERY NICELY PUT...If you are proud of Breeding Poodles and you seem to be doing it right, why wouldnt you want to continue offering a great waranty, no matter what you are charging. Being responsible for your offspring is what any breeder should have in mind. Getting feedback is what keeps us breeding.
> 
> Wouldn't you want to assist those with one of your pups? In any way you could if issues arise?


Too know Gloria is to love her dedication to this breed. She has much pride and stays in close contact with her poodle family. I dont think that is the question here. She is considering the perspective buyers based off of a lot of information provided here and weighing out what is most important.

Money is clearly not the motivation factor here either as she is considering lowering the price - all testing remains the same. She has never refunded for a sick puppy so her statistics allowed her to look at other options to meet the needs of the average buyer. I am sure this is still on the table.


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## cbrand (Aug 9, 2009)

poodleholic said:


> > Have you considered either offering a payment plan for those great homes, or even lowering the price for them? Is there a reason why this wouldn't be feasable?
> 
> 
> 
> I sold a puppy on payment once and it was nothing but heartache. Payments stopped almost right away and I had to go and get the puppy back. Never again!


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## spoowhisperer (Apr 26, 2010)

Olie said:


> Too know Gloria is to love her dedication to this breed. She has much pride and stays in close contact with her poodle family. I dont think that is the question here. She is considering the perspective buyers based off of a lot of information provided here and weighing out what is most important."
> 
> I would agree with this. She is extremely conscientious.


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## neVar (Dec 25, 2009)

cbrand said:


> poodleholic said:
> 
> 
> > I sold a puppy on payment once and it was nothing but heartache. Payments stopped almost right away and I had to go and get the puppy back. Never again!
> ...


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## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

Health guarantees are so common now among good breeders that I'd wonder what was up if a breeder didn't offer one. Things that would cross my mind are: breeder knows something is wrong with the line, breeder is out of the loop on standard business practices (and if so, is the breeder out of the loop on standard vet care practices and standard training practices as well?) breeder isn't planning on being around long term, etc. I


Regarding payment plans, if I were a breeder I wouldn't sell a puppy on payment. The fact is, dogs will continue to run up bills their entire lives. They need food, they need grooming, they need training. They sometimes destroy things which need replacing. They sometimes ingest socks and need expensive surgery to get their innards put back in working order. If someone's budgeting ability and/or disposable income are too limited to manage to save $1200 before the dog is in their lives, are they in a position to handle these other expenses of dog ownership, especially the catastrophic ones?


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## tintlet (Nov 24, 2009)

Thank you everyone for the comments...and for standing up for me <VBG>.

I don't like to do payments, as most said, it never works out. Would rather place a dog for less $$ and then make sure they care for it. or let them pay it out before they pick up the puppy.

Just trying to feel out if buyer wants a limited warranty..or a bumper to bumper extended warranty. as with all warranty's, it also comes with a higher price tag. Plus its not like I can just fix or replace the broken part like it was an automoble

All our dogs have health testing on the parents. But as stated before, unless its a DNA then you can't guarantee. We do a limited 3 year for hips, blindness, deafness, addison,SA. basically anything that will make the dog unsuitable as a pet. 



I would go to the ends of the earth to get back one of my puppies, and if one was sick, then want to know how to get it well and the reason it became sick, etc. 

Do like the suggestion of the health insurance....just need to figure out if the company's will give a prepaid coverage etc.


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## puppylove (Aug 9, 2009)

As a puppy 'consumer', I feel that health guarantees are not really useful. Very few dog lovers are going to give back their beloved pet because of health reasons...they are generally too bonded to their dog to do such a heartless thing. So the breeder has done the right thing by offering but rarely has to step up.

I do like Winnow's plan. Actually paying for vet bills of an unhealthy dog (via insurance or right out of their pockets) is a better practice for the buyer AND FOR THE PUPPY. It certainly isn't for the breeder. 

But dogs are living things with complicated systems. Even the most diligent and competent breeder cannot completely control nature. It's still a gamble and someone has to take the risk. 

I'm enough of a pragmatist to take that risk myself. Dogs (particularly spoos) are ridiculously expensive (I think too many breeders expect pet owners to support their hobby). To expect breeders to be responsible for the life-long health of every dog they sell would raise the cost of quality pets needlessly and still not necessarily get you that problem-free companion.


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## wishpoo (Sep 12, 2009)

Yes, warranty can be done with certainty only for genetic things and it should be stated in the contract. Expecting a warranty for unforeseen and rare disorders is unrealistic and I do not think that buyers would assume those are covered :rolffleyes:. That is why the contract should be written in very clear terms. 

Although there is no "genetic testing" for eyes and hips - it is also genetic issue and if dogs are bred with care and knowing the pedigree for many generations and test results of siblings and ancestors , than yes - it can be warranted with great certainty that puppy will have healthy eyes and hips also.

I never heard or two dogs with excellent hips who also had a grandparents with excellent hips producing a diplastic pup - if anybody knows - please let me know :rolffleyes:

Not all contracts are the same and not all breeders ask for "puppy back" - actually most reputable breeders do not ask for it at all !!!! They offer new puppy or "money-equivalent" of a new puppy that can be used as a "compensation" for the given health issue.

For me , again, warranty means just one thing - that breeder DID all testing necessary and did go through pedigrees diligently and is breeding only the best stock available and not for a profit and that is all...


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## poodleholic (Jan 6, 2010)

cbrand said:


> poodleholic said:
> 
> 
> > I sold a puppy on payment once and it was nothing but heartache. Payments stopped almost right away and I had to go and get the puppy back. Never again!
> ...


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## wishpoo (Sep 12, 2009)

You were sooo lucky Pooldleholic !!!!!! Wow !!!! And , of course a Mandy too


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## passion4poodles (Apr 11, 2009)

This thread has been very informative to me as a future breeder. I am happy to see more of what people are looking for in a breeder not just what my opinion of what should be offered. I am planning on breeding Kiara after her hips and eyes are done, everything else is done so I just have to wait for the last 2 tests!! I am excited, although I know it is going to be difficult here on the Island and I am taking advise from others on this forum and looking in to AI.


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## jonny cash (May 11, 2010)

gloria is one of the most conscientious breeders i know. she devotes so much of her time and energy for the breed. she is all about the health and betterment of the breed. you will not find a better breeder or person!


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## spoospirit (Mar 10, 2009)

_I am wondering who Gloria is. So many good things are being said about her that I would like to familiarize myself with here.
_


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## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

SS - I got Suri from her. You can visit her website also at www.tintlet.com 

She is a great breeder to work with and has lovely dogs and a diehard passion for the breed and partis. She is also an excellent groomer.


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## kuriooo (Feb 17, 2010)

So Tintlet, I checked out your website. Beautiful dogs!!

As I've been waiting for my kids to get a bit older, I've had plenty of time to research breeders, look at websites, go to a couple of shows and talk to breeders. 

As long as a breeder has done the proper testing, I don't really care about health guarantees for the purpose of a refund. Similar to other posters, I really want to know that the breeder cares about what happens to the dog they give me (as opposed to just taking my money and wishing me luck), and there is definitely something about the guarantee that implies "I care about what happens to my dogs."

As a buyer, I can't imagine I'd ever ask for a refund, although if a health issue came up I'd like to know that the breeder wants to get as much info as possible about the condition to benefit their future breeding program. No one can *guarantee* health, just make educated decisions with the info available. 

Finally, I just want to comment that I bought a Pomeranian puppy on a payment plan when I was 16. It worked out for me, and as I recall I made all the payments on time and received the AKC papers and a nice note from the breeder at the end!


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## spoospirit (Mar 10, 2009)

Olie said:


> SS - I got Suri from her. You can visit her website also at www.tintlet.com
> 
> She is a great breeder to work with and has lovely dogs and a diehard passion for the breed and partis. She is also an excellent groomer.


_

Ok...so I'm a little embarrassed now! I know Tintlet but I didn't put Marian with Tintlet Poodles! LOL DUH!

Her poodles are gorgeous and I love the two that are expecting a litter in June. Sin is simply stunning!_


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## tintlet (Nov 24, 2009)

I find that being a breeder is really tough. We can only breed from what other have done before us. And with so many of the partis having very little testing, its such a crap shoot.
My daughter is revamping the website for me, and she has been using a direct link to OFA to show health testing. I love it when you can go back several generations and find some form of health testing. Even tho the testing is no guarantee, at least you can say the parents ( at that time) were not affected.

We each pick the battles to fight, and hope the winners will be healthier poodles in the future. Its seems that each year there are more DNA tests available, and more understanding of issues. I used to get all hung up over OFA hips, until it finally clicked to me that breeding "good hips" is like breeding a 'good head". the head is made up of a lot of different components. eyes, muzzle, ears, planes, teeth, etc. if you breed poor to poor, it will never improve. and even with generations of good, you will still get an occasional poor. You can lose type in 2-3 generations, and it can take 5+ to get it back.

This could go on and make a book, so I better stop...LOL


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## spoospirit (Mar 10, 2009)

tintlet said:


> I find that being a breeder is really tough. We can only breed from what other have done before us. And with so many of the partis having very little testing, its such a crap shoot.
> My daughter is revamping the website for me, and she has been using a direct link to OFA to show health testing. I love it when you can go back several generations and find some form of health testing. Even tho the testing is no guarantee, at least you can say the parents ( at that time) were not affected.
> 
> We each pick the battles to fight, and hope the winners will be healthier poodles in the future. Its seems that each year there are more DNA tests available, and more understanding of issues. I used to get all hung up over OFA hips, until it finally clicked to me that breeding "good hips" is like breeding a 'good head". the head is made up of a lot of different components. eyes, muzzle, ears, planes, teeth, etc. if you breed poor to poor, it will never improve. and even with generations of good, you will still get an occasional poor. You can lose type in 2-3 generations, and it can take 5+ to get it back.
> ...


_
Very well put, Tintet!_


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## Phyrra (Jun 11, 2010)

tintlet said:


> After joining this forum, I've spent time reading some older posts.
> 
> With a new litter coming ( Sin X Madonna) and possibly another breeding later, Ive been toying with some changes.
> 
> ...


I went to a wonderful breeder to get my standard poodle Phaedra. I paid $1500, because I wanted only pet rights and signed a contract to get her spayed. If I'd wanted breeding rights, it would have been $2500. Since I don't ever plan to breed, I just wanted a healthy pet, I thought this was fair. I did get my dog spayed as promised.

Now, my breeder did have extensive testing on her dogs and there was no history of Addison's Disease in any of her dogs. However, My dog ended up being diagnosed with Addison's in January of this year, but there was no way I would give her back to get a replacement dog. It seems like for some things, like Addison's, you just can't always anticipate it.

I would probably consider anything from $800 to $2000, depending on the dog, to be fair.


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## Indiana (Sep 11, 2011)

I would buy a puppy from you with no health guarantee. Once I knew how rigorously you health test and saw your dedication to the breed, that would be enough for me. Being able to keep in contact with a caring breeder for support and the odd question is worth more than a health guarantee anyway.


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