# Coat Change?



## Carley's Mom (Oct 30, 2011)

Stella's coat is not anything like Carley's. I have heard that the cream poodles are not as curly. I don't know, I guess they are all differant. I like the wavy coats.


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## mom24doggies (Mar 28, 2011)

As Carley's mom said, creams don't usually have as good of a coat unfortunately. I'd say that if he is almost two he is probably almost finished with coat change. Another member, tokipoke, also has a cream standard and she has the same issues with him that you do...soft, wavy hair with very few guard hairs.


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## Sawyersmomma (May 28, 2012)

Thanks, I actually kind of like how fluffy he is, but some real "poodly" hair would be nice too :aetsch:


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## tokipoke (Sep 3, 2011)

He may be done with coat change, but who knows, maybe before 3, it can be the last one? I'm hoping three's the charm for me. I'll be shaving down Leroy one more time this year, this time with a #10 all over. He only has a couple of curly spots on his body too, his topknot is okay, but nothing like what a real poodle coat should be. The hair on his legs look like if you crimped your hair, then went outside on a humid day, and at the end of the day, you have this limp, loosely crimped, and wavy mess.... I'm trying to grow out his legs to bell bottoms but the matting is horrendous. It's so bad, if he was a client's dog that showed up for grooming, I'd call the owner and tell them I'd have to shave their dog. I always curse myself, why I bother dematting him all the time. I am growing his hair for a pet event in April, and then do another hairstyle for July, and then trim him into a terrier style haircut, and then shave him.... and then get his teeth cleaned (waiting until I shave him down before letting the vet shave him). His hair is weird because he has apricot hairs that spring out on his back (I think they are guard hairs?), they are coarser than the other hairs but even that doesn't improve his hair texture, it just makes him look scraggly after a few weeks of a haircut


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## 3dogs (Nov 3, 2010)

I can be of no help. My cream Spoo has fantastic hair. Dense, coarser but like a sheep. Everybody loves to pet him & just comment on how great his coat is. I love it, hardly mats without brushing him for 2-3 weeks. My OT had very wavy hair & it literally has taken 2 years for her hair to go from wavy to denser curly hair. In stages her head 1st then her back & finally her legs. My newest pup is 6 months old so I don't know how her coat will be but it is easy to maintain her show coat. Time will tell.


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## Sawyersmomma (May 28, 2012)

tokipoke said:


> The hair on his legs look like if you crimped your hair, then went outside on a humid day, and at the end of the day, you have this limp, loosely crimped, and wavy mess.... I'm trying to grow out his legs to bell bottoms but the matting is horrendous.


I never knew how to describe his hair! But that is TOTALLY what it's like on his body! I actually don't mind it when he's got quite a bit of hair since I can brush it and it just looks fluffy, but if I don't brush it it just looks like crap!
I've already grown out some bell bottoms on Sawyer, luckily for me he doesn't matt too much there. It definitely gets knotted just because of where it is, but I'm able to get the knots out without too much trouble


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## Indiana (Sep 11, 2011)

Oh my goodness I'd waaaaay rather switch with you two with the cream poodles instead of Indy's coat...she has SO much coat! It's crisp, dense and it's matting like nobody's business, so every day I brush and comb, but still it's a huge pain in the rear. She's also almost 2 and I have been saying lately, can she STILL be in coat change??? The poor thing is never going to be a show dog so having a thick heavy coat is just a curse for her. Maddy's coat is far softer and finer, so MUCH easier to deal with, although she's a silver. It's getting warmer here now so I think I'm just going to scissor Indy down quite short on the rump and back and taper slightly into fluffier legs.


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## hunny518 (Jun 5, 2012)

3dogs said:


> I can be of no help. My cream Spoo has fantastic hair. Dense, coarser but like a sheep. Everybody loves to pet him & just comment on how great his coat is. I love it, hardly mats without brushing him for 2-3 weeks. My OT had very wavy hair & it literally has taken 2 years for her hair to go from wavy to denser curly hair. In stages her head 1st then her back & finally her legs. My newest pup is 6 months old so I don't know how her coat will be but it is easy to maintain her show coat. Time will tell.


Aria is also a cream with fantastic hair! Even her soft straight puppy coat was thick enough and is great to scissor. She is right in the middle of her coat change and her adult coat is thick and bouncy and holds a perfect shape. As a groomer who specializes in poodle clients, I've seen so many different coats, from nightmares to great, so I when I was researching for my own spoo, the coat was one of my number 1 priorities. I knew if I got a breeder who bred for perfection I would have a better chance to get a quality coat. I couldn't have imagined how amazing Aria's coat would turn out. I've never met a spoo of any color with such a great coat. She is getting pretty thick, which at first scared me because of drying time, but it doesn't really take a terrible amount of time since I started using Isle of Dogs products


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## Indiana (Sep 11, 2011)

What does Isle of Dog products do? I'm thinking I need a really, really good conditioner for Indy.


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## mom24doggies (Mar 28, 2011)

Well 3dogs and hunny518, I know who to ask if I am ever looking for a cream with nice hair! Almost every one I've met had softish coat at the best, total crap at the worst. Sometimes I wonder if a lot of creams I've met were maybe light apricots...another color that tends towards having very poor hair texture. (No offense to those with apricots. ) I've met/seen a few that did have nice hair but they are rare in my area. It makes me sad, because they are so pretty, especially if they have nice pigmentation. Outwest's Bonnie comes to mind.  

Sawyer'smama, have you ever tried a texturizing/volumizing shampoo? I like Terrier Touch from Pure Paws or Spectrum One from Chris Christensen. Pure Paws volumizing shampoo is good too. Another thing that helps is some mousse or gel, both PP and CC carry some good ones. They help immensely, especially if you use a stand dryer as you finish the blow dry. Not only do they add texture, they add body and make the coat feel "thicker", if that makes any sense.


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## hunny518 (Jun 5, 2012)

Indiana said:


> What does Isle of Dog products do? I'm thinking I need a really, really good conditioner for Indy.


I use their primrose oil shampoo no 16. I haven't tried their conditioner yet, but honestly I don't feel the need for it. Her hair is so soft and dries in half the time then other quick dry shampoos I've tried. It's extremely expensive (95.00 for the gallon without the VIP discount, 63.00 with the VIP membership) but I feel it lives up to its claims. It smells amazing!! And it really brightens her coat. I do use their vanity series conditioning spray for her everyday day brushing and it helps strengthen her coat and reduce breakage, and I have noticed her coat noticeably benefiting from that too. And then I also use the vanity series finishing spray that I like to use for scissoring and spraying up her top knot. Once again amazing! I highly recommend these products to anybody who shows or is a serious scissor groomer. 


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## tokipoke (Sep 3, 2011)

Not a curl in this boy's leg hair  The rest of him is curlier than the legs, but still not as curly as the poodles with nice coats!

Edit: you can see my Havanese next to his leg, and their hair texture looks similar lol


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## mom24doggies (Mar 28, 2011)

tokipoke said:


> Not a curl in this boy's leg hair  The rest of him is curlier than the legs, but still not as curly as the poodles with nice coats!
> 
> Edit: you can see my Havanese next to his leg, and their hair texture looks similar lol


 Now that I look at it tokipoke, I do wonder if you have some hope! Trev had soft/puppyish hair on his legs until I shaved him down....then it came in much nicer. Maybe once you clip him down it will come back in as adult coat.


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## Lou (Sep 22, 2012)

ok, I hope I don't offend or upset anyone with what I'm gonna say about my preference... and since I have never had a poodle before, I just dont know what a good coat is. 

*Can anyone post pictures of a great poodle coat, brushed and naturally curly?*

Lou has really soft hair at this time, its curly and shinny and the color is uniform throughout her body, including ears BUT she is 9 months old and I noticed a patch at the end of her back that is really dull (not shinny at all) and the texture on this patch is so coarse that it doesn't feel good to the touch, Im afraid that she may turn into that all over her body.... Of course it doesnt really matter, but i just love her hair the way it is now! Is good poodle hair supposed to feel that coarse? If yes, Im sure I will get used to it and use good products to make it more shinny

The pictures dont show the patch, but shows her coat now at 9 months
The last picture kinda shows it, near the base of her tail....


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## Indiana (Sep 11, 2011)

I don't know if all dogs are like my two Lou, but both my dogs got that bristly patch on their rump too but it didn't change that way everywhere. Their shoulders are bristly too, but their topknots and everywhere else is still soft. But the bristly hairs seem to make it easier to scissor. Of course what do I know, they're almost 2 and I think they're still in coat change; pretty sure they were supposed to be done before this! ETA, I ended up using Moroccan oil (Argan oil) on Indy. I think it helped in the matted areas, I was able to gently comb out quite a few after.


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## Lou (Sep 22, 2012)

*products to make coat shinny and soft to the touch (?)*



Indiana said:


> I don't know if all dogs are like my two Lou, but both my dogs got that bristly patch on their rump too but it didn't change that way everywhere. Their shoulders are bristly too, but their topknots and everywhere else is still soft. But the bristly hairs seem to make it easier to scissor. Of course what do I know, they're almost 2 and I think they're still in coat change; pretty sure they were supposed to be done before this! ETA, I ended up using Moroccan oil (Argan oil) on Indy. I think it helped in the matted areas, I was able to gently comb out quite a few after.


Thanks Indiana! And bristly is the exact word I was looking for to describe it!Good to know about your two *And I was wondering about products I could use to make her hair soft and shinny that she wont be allergic to or wont lick and get sick, you know? *I will look into argan oil, my mom uses it on her hair and it looks great! 

*If anyone else wants to suggest a few other affordable products.... (not $ and not $$$$$, maybe $$$? LOL)*


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## mom24doggies (Mar 28, 2011)

Sounds like Lou is going through her coat change. As Indianna said, different parts of her will feel differently. Usually the back/neck are the coarsest/bristliest parts, with the legs being a bit softer. I personally wouldn't oil her coat, unless she is matting or you are trying to grow it really long. It attracts dirt something terrible. I go to great lengths to keep Raven's oiled parts clean! Instead, use a conditioner with her bath. Not only will it soften the coat it will help with shine. I like Chris Christensen Day to day conditioner for softness and shine, Pure Paws h2o conditioner is a little heavier/oilier and really makes them soft too. Coat Handler is another one that makes them super smooth and shiny. Chris Christensen spectrum one too. These are some I can think of off the top of my head that aren't horribly expensive. 

I doubt the coarse parts of her will soften up much though, those guard hairs are really stiff! Only time will tell what the rest of her turns into!


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## Lou (Sep 22, 2012)

mom24doggies said:


> Sounds like Lou is going through her coat change. As Indianna said, different parts of her will feel differently. Usually the back/neck are the coarsest/bristliest parts, with the legs being a bit softer.
> 
> (...)
> 
> I doubt the coarse parts of her will soften up much though, those guard hairs are really stiff! Only time will tell what the rest of her turns into!


*Thank you very much for the info!* I was brushing her an hour ago and the patches dont seem as bristly, earlier it felt real coarse, now its just very curly/thicker than the rest , she is under a lamp now and those parts are dull but kinda blended in, :hmmmm2: Its not as bad as I thought I guess 

I will still make sure to write those names of products down and try to find one :act-up:

oh, and do you have pictures of what a good poodle coat looks like naturally curly? Id love to see what is desirable when it comes to standard poodles, thanks again


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## CT Girl (Nov 17, 2010)

I found the comment about apricots having a soft coat very interesting. Swizzle is silver and his coat is on the soft side. His groomer has said she finds this to be the case with silver poodles. It does not Matt and seems to hold a clip well so itdoes not concern me.


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