# Am I Over-Vaccinating?



## angelamdai (Jun 14, 2014)

Thanks in advance to anyone who reads this as it is a long-confusing post.

My toy poodle Oscar is 5 1/2 months old. At 4 weeks he received the Parvo vaccine and 7 weeks he was given a combo shot. A month later he received another one.

Fast forward last week I took him to the vet for the first time. My vet said the first shots were not effective as he was probably still on his mother's immunity. Thus he gave him a combo shot. He also gave him a vaccine for Canine Influenza and shots up the nose for Bordella. He scheduled another appointment for three weeks for a follow up combo shot and a Leptospirosis shot. I spoke with my breeder today and she flipped out. She said the vet was crazy and he was over-vaccinating Oscar, which could lead to death.

My question is does Oscar need a 4th round?

Does he need the Canine Influenza and Leptospirosis vaccines?

EDIT: Have I harmed him with the shots last week? Will there be severe damage from the next round in 3 weeks?

Thanks,
A Very Confused and Overprotective Mommy


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## LEUllman (Feb 1, 2010)

The short answer is yes, your vet appears to be over vaccinating. I'm sure others will weigh in with more information. 

I follow Dr. Dodds' minimal vaccination recommendations, which are here:

Dr. Jean Dodds' Pet Health Resource Blog | 2013 and 2014 Canine Vaccination Protocol - W. Jean Dodds, DVM

Excerpt:

2013 and 2014 Vaccination Protocol
Note: The following vaccine protocol is offered for those dogs where minimal vaccinations are advisable or desirable. The schedule is one Dr. Dodds recommends and should not be interpreted to mean that other protocols recommended by a veterinarian would be less satisfactory. It’s a matter of professional judgment and choice.

9-10 Weeks Old:
Distemper + Parvovirus, MLV (e.g. Merck Nobivac [Intervet Progard] Puppy DPV)

14-16 Weeks:
Same as above

20 Weeks or Older (if allowable by law):
Rabies

1 Year:
Distemper + Parvovirus, MLV (optional = titer)

1 Year:
Rabies, killed 3-year product (give 3-4 weeks apart from distemper/parvovirus booster)

Perform vaccine antibody titers for distemper and parvovirus every three years thereafter, or more often, if desired. Vaccinate for rabies virus according to the law, except where circumstances indicate that a written waiver needs to be obtained from the primary care veterinarian. In that case, a rabies antibody titer can also be performed to accompany the waiver request. See the Rabies Challenge Fund website.

W. Jean Dodds, DVM
Hemopet / NutriScan
11561 Salinaz Avenue
Garden Grove, CA 92843


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

My breeder follows the Dr. Jean Dodds vaccination schedule. I would share your breeder's concerns with the vet.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Don't freak out about what is in the past. I agree that there is too much going on here, mostly so far because the first shots were too soon. Also unless Oscar will be at doggy day care, boarded or at lots of show around other dogs I don't think you need Bordatella at all. I only just recently got Lily immunized for Bordatella for the first time very recently because she caught it at a trial back in February and gave it to Peeves. Additionally it is a required immunization for enrollment with the Yale Canine Cognition Center.

I would take the Jean Dodds protocol with you and have a talk with the vet before having anymore immunizations done. If this vet insists he is right, I would shop around for someone who is more conservative and to you liking in this area.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

i would say be prepared for the possibility that your vet will not accept dr. dodds' protocols. you may also want to check out the american animal hospital association guidelines https://www.aahanet.org/Library/CanineVaccine.aspx just for comparison and to help determine whether your vet is following those. if neither, i would ask what guidelines he is following.

lepto vaccination especially make me wonder. my dog was over a year old when he needed one to meet specific travel requirements (and this was an eon ago). my vet at the time refused to give it on the same day as the other required vaccinations. in addition, when she did administer it, we were required to wait around several hours to make sure there were no ill effects. okay, my vet was probably very cautious. i don't have a problem with that when it comes to my dog.


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

My poodle had a bad reaction to the lepto vaccine the 2nd time he got it. Since it was combined with another vaccine , we did not know which vaccine was causing the problem. So he did get another booster a year later by itself without another vaccine and that is when he really had a worse reaction. Of course, we never gave him.this vaccine again. Due to this experience, I give as few vaccines at a time as possible and never closer than 2 weeks apart. I never give bordatella unless the dog is taking a class or something.

After you read up on vaccinations, you can tell the vet what you want to do. Rabies is the only vaccination required by law. It is ultimately your decision. You just need to figure out where you want to go from here.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

If it were me, I would not give any more puppy vaccines. I also wouldn't worry about what was already done. Personally, my dogs are not vaccinated for lepto or canine influenza and I never recommend it. 

I follow Dr. Dodds' protocol. At 1 year of age, I would personally still give a Distemper + Parvo booster at 1 year of age *or* have the dog titered. 

Try not to panic! Your pup will be just fine. It is a big deal that you care enough to 1) research, and 2) avoid over vaccinating in the future.


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## Spoos+Ponies (Mar 26, 2014)

I got my new puppy 3 weeks ago. She had been given parvo and distemper in separate shots. I am waiting until 16 weeks for second shot. I anticipate that will be it for life. I get titers done, and with strong immunity, my vet says they are protected forever and she will simply keep updating their letters - I love my vet! I will put off rabies for as long as possible, and would avoid lepto like the plague - lots of bad reactions. Bordatella is not particularly effective as a vaccine and I don't believe the possible reactions justify the risk, since it's generally not life threatening. If you search Dr. Schultz, his mantra is once and done. Difficult to do when the puppy arrives already vaccinated, but at least it will just be twice and done..... Most vets have their own titers done for rabies vaccine to avoid over-vaccinating THEMSELVES!


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## mom2Zoe (Jun 17, 2014)

My puppy is almost 5 months and she had a bad reaction to all her vax, especially the rabies. She also had lepto, didn't no it was a choice. I spaced them out because of her reactions. After having the rabies I refused the influenza and lime which were the last two.
She also had bordetella. I wish i had read up on vax before doing. I am switching vets after spay anyway. he pushed the influenza and lime.( which I dint do)


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## Aubrey (May 18, 2013)

All vaccines, except rabies, are legally optional(though some states might require distemper due to wildlife concerns). It isn't [generally] in your dog's best interest however, to forgo vaccination completely.
I do not vaccinate for lepto or Lyme's.

I personally wouldn't freak out too much, but I also would cancel the next appointment. I prefer my dogs to be vaccinated against Distempter, Parvo, and CAV2(adenovirus) about 7-8 weeks old, then two more times four weeks apart. Then, at 6 months vaccinate for rabies. Then, when the rabies is due for it's 1st booster, I re-do rabies and will either vax for the combo or run a titer(depends on where I am living). After that booster for combo, I do not give it again unless required by law.

Since we are active military and move all over the world, I cannot get around the global requirements for rabies/other vaccines. Not all countries allow for the 3 year rabies period. However, we are usually in one place for 4 years, so I stretch them out as far as I possibly can, without putting my pet's travel in jeopardy.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

My vet does not do Lyme or influenza at all as far as I know. He only did the bordatella for Lily because I asked for it since I had specific needs (Yale paperwork). We do give rabies as required and lepto (there is a lot of it in raccoons here and lots of raccoons) along with distemper. My vet is not a huge titering person, but I may talk to him about it the next time I see him.

One thing I would underscore is that immunization of dogs, cats, other companion and agricultural animals, _and people_ is an important public health measure in the effort to epidemiologically control and even eradicate all sorts of infectious diseases. We have immunization to thank for the greatly reduced incidence of rabies, the near total eradication of congenital rubella syndrome, measles, polio and the successful global eradication of small pox. With my students I notice that they lack a real understanding of immunization program maintenance. They think because no one they know ever had measles that it is gone and not to be concerned about any more. That complacency and ignorance sets up the circumstances that will allow for the re-emergence of infectious diseases like measles, rubella and human bordatella (whooping cough). We are already seeing the signs.

Whooping Cough Returns to California After Decades of Decline | PBS NewsHour

Whooping Cough Officially Epidemic in California: Public Health Department | NBC Southern California


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

My vet follows what I tell him/her to do when it comes to things like vaccines. After the DPV shot at 1 year, I have my vet run a titer three years after that, and then again every 1-3 years (depends on whether I need proof of immunity for training classes, etc. Titer generally only good for a year when used in lieu of a booster) I have my vet vaccinate every 3 years for rabies as the law requires.


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

Lily cd- I encounter the same attitude from my students about vaccination, and I agree that a lot of it stems from not understanding how horrible these diseases are...and believing the media hype about vaccine dangers. These are nursing students, so it is particularly important they understand epidemiology, because they will be educating the public, and have the power to change attitudes. My job is to make sure they go out with the right information, and it is sometimes a challenge to convince them that evidence based practice does trump what they read on xyz website  

That said- my Lily almost died from a vaccine reaction a couple years ago, and I now take a very minimalist approach, and found a vet that agrees with this approach. But before that, I didn't think much of it, and was over vaccinating my animals because I thought I was giving them the best care :angry: 

Don't feel bad. I should have known better and asked questions, but I didn't. It killed me because I usually question everything, but was very complacent about vaccines and trusted the vet's guidance. So unlike me to trust blindly, but it is what it is. 

The research is not widely available to most pet owners, and even after Lily's harrowing experience, my other vet did not offer an alternative regimen. I had to do my own research, and that's when I found Dodds and Schultz's work. When I brought it to his attention, he gave me a bunch of gobbledygook couched in scientific terminology that was obviously intended to make me think he was very learned on the subject. He did not know that I knew enough to see right through the terminology and know he talking through his &?$. I was mad! What arrogance. 

Good luck- the good thing is you realized this early.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Carolinek, most of my students want to enter nursing, PA or pharmacy programs, a few want to be MDs or VMDs, so their attitude about vaccines is sort of scary.

I certainly do agree that educating oneself about benefits and risks for oneself and companion animals is important. I also think it is unfortunate when professionals talk down to their patients/clients to talk them into things. I am lucky with my vet since we have know each other for about 20 years now. He knows exactly who I am and what my level of knowledge is, so no BSing.

Again for benefit of OP, don't worry over the past and go in armed with good info in future. You have good suggestions here.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

The thing is, the anti vaccine beliefs seen with some people is different from the growing understanding of over vaccination in our pets. Leading vaccine researchers like Dr. Schulz and Dr. Dodds always stress first and foremost the importance of ensuring our pets are protected. It's just that - annual or even triennial vaccinations really aren't necessary if the dog is already immune. Studies have shown a duration of immunity that is much longer than 1-3 years and can be checked with titer testing. This is important in breeds such as poodles where autoimmune issues are a known risk. And that science of not continuing to vaccinate once immunity is known/thought to be established already applies to humans. Now, forgoing core vaccines in dogs or humans is a totally different case.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Millie I don't disagree at all. We don't give annual rubella boosters to ourselves after all, but doing a titer for rubella on a young woman before she starts a family is in order so she can be boosted if her titer is low. It would be great if this idea would trickle over to veterinary practice more fully.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

And, to the OP, Bordetella is one vaccine that is really quite low risk. I don't worry if I need to give it, but I do always have it done as an intranasal vaccine. Bordetella, however, is one of few vaccines that _does_ need to be given every 6 months to 1 year to be effective. Immunity from a Bordetella vaccine does not last long term like it does with the viral vaccines. My dogs get it yearly *when required* for classes or boarding.


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

Years ago when I had a poodle who reacted badly to the lepto vaccine, I did decide to do titers for my dogs after that. Using the tests, I went 2-3 years before giving distemper but the protection for lepto seemed go away somewhere between 1 and 2 years. So I stopped doing titers and just had my dogs vaccinated with lepto every 1-1/2 years and distemper every 2 years. The titers never showed protection beyond those periods.

Perhaps I will start doing titers again with my 3 yo dog to see if I get the same results. When my dogs get around 10 years, I stop giving all vaccinations except for rabies. They don't get out as much and the risk is lower for them.

The history of vaccinations is very interesting. I saw an old movie about Louis Pasteur and how he vaccinated sheep against anthrax. Louis Pasteur was a chemist, not a doctor, and was ridiculed by doctors everywhere for his ideas on microbes contaminating operating rooms and child birth. One of the doctors challenged him to a public contest. Two chorales of sheep were used. One was vaccinated with Pasteur's vaccine, and the other not. Then they were all injected with anthrax. All of the unvaccinated died, but Pasteur's group lived. 

Then there was a real problem with rabies. Victims bitten by rabid wild animals always died. A boy from Russia was brought to Pasteur and treated with his vaccine and lived. Then other victims from Russia came to him for treatment. The idea of vaccinations was really taking off during Pasteur's lifetime in the 1800's.

I know the movie was a dramatization, and there were others of Pasteur's time who were also working on vaccines. Pasteur was working with modified live virus vaccine and another man was working on dead virus, but these people really made a difference in the fight against these diseases.

Now that vaccines are common place, I think the push back against them is because we went the other way and tend to overvaccinate. It is all about finding that middle ground, giving protection against these diseases while not overcoming the immune system. Like everything in life, we need to keep ourselves informed so that we can walk that middle ground.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I love that movie, The Story of Louis Pasteur, with Paul Muni and it isn't that much a dramatization as one might think.

But I have to say that immunizations do not "overcome the immune system." One of the most common misunderstandings about vaccines and immunity that I encounter in my teaching is that vaccines weaken the immune system. In fact, they provoke active responses that result in the ability to have a rapid memory based response, which is why they work. The other part is that they provoke lasting circulating immunoglobulins which are what are detected when one does titers. If detectable immunoglobulins (antibodies) are present then the individual is protected against what those antibodies are specifically able to recognize.

When an individual has an adverse reaction to an immunization it is usually a response to adjuvants or preservatives (such as thimerasol which used to be in human measles vaccine) in the stock, rather than to the actual microbial antigens. There is lots of active research on how to reduce these problems through changing adjuvants and preservatives as well as changing delivery routes (such as intranasal as opposed to injected).


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Minipoo, Lepto is another bacterin vaccine and, like most bacterin vaccines, has a fairly low duration of immunity. Distemper and Parvovirus vaccines, being viral, both have a very long duration of immunity lasting significantly longer than two years. The Lepto vaccine has a higher correlation with vaccine reactions than many other vaccines. It also only covers a small number of serovars. For this reason, I find it to be more appropriate with my personal dogs to avoid the Lepto vaccine and be aware of the symptoms of Lepto.


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

CharismaticMillie said:


> Minipoo, Lepto is another bacterin vaccine and, like most bacterin vaccines, has a fairly low duration of immunity. Distemper and Parvovirus vaccines, being viral, both have a very long duration of immunity lasting significantly longer than two years. The Lepto vaccine has a higher correlation with vaccine reactions than many other vaccines. It also only covers a small number of serovars. For this reason, I find it to be more appropriate with my personal dogs to avoid the Lepto vaccine and be aware of the symptoms of Lepto.


Very interesting, CM. I find it hard to keep track of what is a virus and what is a bacterial type of disease. That would explain the difference in titers.

I understand that there are adjuvants and preservatives in many vaccines, but are you saying that when dogs have a reaction to any vaccine, be it lepto or rabies, it is because of these additives only? Is that what vaccinosis is?


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

MiniPoo said:


> Very interesting, CM. I find it hard to keep track of what is a virus and what is a bacterial type of disease. That would explain the difference in titers.
> 
> I understand that there are adjuvants and preservatives in many vaccines, but are you saying that when dogs have a reaction to any vaccine, be it lepto or rabies, it is because of these additives only? Is that what vaccinosis is?


No, it is not just the additives only.

Here is a quote from Dr. Schulz, leading vaccine researcher:

"Vaccines themselves do not cause autoimmune disease, but in genetically predisposed animals they may trigger autoimmune responses followed by disease – as can any infection, drug, or a variety of other factors. "

We know that for a variety of reasons, poodles are predisposed to autoimmune disease. It is present in all lines and I think that it is not unreasonable to consider that any poodle is potentially genetically predisposed. That's why a focus on finding that balance between providing protection but avoiding overvaccination is so important.


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

I find it hard to keep track of what is a viral and what is a bacterial type of disease. Lepto being bacterial and distemper being viral would explain the difference in titers. Thank you, Lily and CM, for clarifying this.

Sorry about duplicate post. I didn't think the first one took.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Here is another quote from Dr. Schulz, this one in regard to Lepto:

"Interestingly, as opposed to the viral vaccines, immunity from bordetella and lepto vaccines often lasts less than one year because they are bacterial diseases. And neither actually prevents the disease, but rather manages the disease and its severity. Lepto vaccines are the most reactogenic of all the vaccines, even more so than the rabies vaccines. "

ETA: Minipoo, OP, anyone else: here is a nice article: http://www.americanwaterspanielclub.org/pdf/Health and Genetics/What_Everyone_Canine_Vaccines.pdf


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

Lily cd- it is scary to think that new health care professionals may not understand the importance of vaccines. I have an uncle who contracted polio- he lived, but has lower extremity paralysis ....and now post- polio syndrome. The millennials do not have the same memories. Time has faded the effect.

When I started digging and realized how inappropriate the yearly vaccination schedules were for dogs, I was astounded that my vet kept following it. Might have been greed, might have been just an unwillingness to change....hard to say. It is a big multiple vet practice- scary to think how many animals are subjected to outdated practices there.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Change is slow, but hopefully as we become more enlightened we will help our vets' practices to change too.

I had a colleague who had had polio and was mobility impaired most of the time I knew him. He eventually succumbed to post-polio syndrome. You would think that with all of the instantaneous news about emerging diseases young folks would understand about the "old" scourges too, but it is very hard to make them understand. Carolinek, you and I will just have to keep trying to get them to see the light.


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## Aubrey (May 18, 2013)

This young person does! But I want nothing to do with the medical field, or teaching, or children lol.


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## mom2Zoe (Jun 17, 2014)

I really appreciate this thread and all the knowledge I am receiving. It is funny because with my children I was pro vax, but really spaced out their vaccinations and never did more than one at the same time.Even before this was ever heard of doing.
i feel guilty because I should have been just as proactive with my pup, but trusted the vet. i guess live and learn


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## Aubrey (May 18, 2013)

Don't feel bad! We are taught that vets know all, and we all want the best for our poos.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

lily cd re said:


> You would think that with all of the instantaneous news about emerging diseases young folks would understand about the "old" scourges too, but it is very hard to make them understand.


I think that's an awfully strong generalization that, while it may be your personal experience, is not universally true.


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## poodlecrazy#1 (Jul 2, 2013)

mom2six said:


> I really appreciate this thread and all the knowledge I am receiving.



Ikr! Sometimes I learn more things on here than I do in my classes and I'm in a pre vet program! I love discussions on vaccines and nutrition here, because in my classes many times it's just the same mumbo jumbo stuff we are finding out is not 100% correct. 


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

CM- I agree it's important not to make sweeping generalities- but I am seeing the same trend the last few years. The possible link with autism is often brought up, even though that has not been proven. I don't know- maybe that belief is more prevalent in this area.

Aubrey- too funny! Dogs are definitely easier!


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## angelamdai (Jun 14, 2014)

*Thank you!*

Thanks to everyone for their wonderful insight and for sharing your personal experiences. It really means a lot to me that everyone is so friendly and willing to help.

I've decided to cancel the follow up appointment and take Oscar to get his rabies shot at 6 months at Petco.

The ironic thing is I was contemplating just using the LuvMyPet program for Oscar's vaccines but I read the thread on here and decided to go with the consensus of going to a vet for a first appointment and building a relationship with a vet. I just wanted the best for Oscar, which I know most of you share the same sentiment for your pets. Over-vaccinating was just the last thing on my mind.

After the appointment I felt odd and ignorant about the vaccines the vet was referring to and decided to do some research. The more I read, the more confused and concerned I felt. Having such a community of fellow poodle lovers to turn to for help is amazing.

Thank you all for your input.

EDIT: I just wanted to add that in society we are so conditioned to just turn to the professionals for help and assume they know best but as I've gotten older I've realized that professionals don't necessarily know more than you if you do your research and you can't trust them to have your best interest at heart. It's sad but I guess that's a lesson for me to remember.


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

"_The ironic thing is I was contemplating just using the LuvMyPet program for Oscar's vaccines but I read the thread on here and *decided to go with the consensus of going to a vet for a first appointment and building a relationship with a vet*. I just wanted the best for Oscar, which I know most of you share the same sentiment for your pets. Over-vaccinating was just the last thing on my mind._"

I hope you won't give up on finding a vet and establishing a relationship. Over the years you will need someone who knows your dog and is familiar with his medical history. I went to one vet for years and was happy with their treatment of my dogs, but over time decided we had different opinions on vaccinations and I wanted to be present when my dog received most of his treatments. So I searched around, visiting 3 or 4 vets, until I found a place that has 2 vets, both of which share my values of minimal vaccinations and they never pressure me to do something I feel uncomfortable about.

So I do hope you will look for a vet that you feel you can trust. That doesn't mean you have to do everything the vet recommends, but you should feel that your vet respects your wishes even if they are not what they recommend. There are vets like that out there. I looked and found 2 such vets.


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## angelamdai (Jun 14, 2014)

Thanks. I just feel a little discouraged at the moment. I will be looking into other vets as Oscar needs to be neutered in a bit. I hope I have better luck next time. I found the vet I went to on the AKC website


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

I can totally understand your discouragement. I had a dog that needed to have treatment every month and I did not like the vet I had been using for years. So I made an appointment at different vets each month to speak with the vet and see how he treated me and the dog. As I said before, I went to 4 different places and ruled them all out. I finally found the vet I am at now just when my older dog needed to be put to sleep. The vet at this new place handled the whole thing in the best possible way for us and the dog and was very kind to us. Since then I have had very open and candid conversations with each of the attending vets. Sometimes I go to one for some procedures and the other for other procedures, but I basically trust them both to do what I ask and to give me the facts so that I can tell them what I want to do.

Both vets have researched certain ailments my dogs have had (one being Addisons Disease) and they presented me with their findings so that I could make a decision. They did not charge me for their research and phone conversations. I know some vets will charge for every little minute they spend with you.

I am sure you can find a vet you can trust. It might just take a few visits to find one. Now that you are an aware dog owner, you will know what questions to ask the vet to see if he is the right one for you.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

When you are out and about ask people who have dogs where they take them for their healthcare. If you find someone who is enthusiastic about their vet you will have a good lead.


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## SusanG (Aug 8, 2009)

I'm no expert, but I was advised that leptospirosis shots can be fatal. My breeder advised against it and the vet agreed. I'd be careful with that one unless you plan on letting your dog spend time in the woods and drinking out of puddles where wild animals have been. At least that is what the vet told me.
Also, this year I had Callie titer tested for distemper. She's three. She was still immune and did not need a shot. I plan to titer test every year before getting needless immunizations. I did break down and get her the Lyme disease shot though. I was so scared of her getting ticks and getting sick. However, the AdvantixII has kept them off her completely so I will re-think whether to get her one next year.


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## PoodlePaws (May 28, 2013)

My girls had 4 sets of shots. They also received lepto, flu, and brdetella as well as Lyme. Never had a reaction to any vaccines. Also on trifexis and haven't keeled over yet ?


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## Streetcar (Apr 13, 2014)

angelamdai said:


> Thanks to everyone for their wonderful insight and for sharing your personal experiences. It really means a lot to me that everyone is so friendly and willing to help.
> 
> I've decided to cancel the follow up appointment and take Oscar to get his rabies shot at 6 months at Petco.
> 
> ...


Angelamdai, I have such sympathy for what you have said here. My wonderful vet of many years retired from the practice about a year before I got my Tpoo, and frankly I was and am yet a bit adrift. The same practice tried (briefly) to get me to over-vax my indoor only middle-aged cat, and I decided based on that and some other information they weren't the same place as before.

Oliver's care has been pretty split up and while it's nice to have met (and ruled out a few) new-to-me veterinarians, I appreciate having options with wonderful doctors and staff. It's still not the same as having a fully local veterinarian who sees him/herself as a partner, not a ruler or a better.


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## PoodleDuo (Jun 14, 2014)

Personally I do the distemper/parvo combo & bordatella at 8,12,16 weeks than rabies at the 16 week appointment. Then I will do a final distemper/parvo at 20 weeks along with leptospirosis. Then bordatella every 6 months and updated vacs everybyear. My dogs are extremely social and go to daycare and dog parks but I've always done this.

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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

angelamdai said:


> Thanks to everyone for their wonderful insight and for sharing your personal experiences. It really means a lot to me that everyone is so friendly and willing to help.
> 
> I've decided to cancel the follow up appointment and take Oscar to get his rabies shot at 6 months at Petco.
> 
> ...


I think it's a balance between finding someone you can trust and building a knowledge base that lets you have a dialogue with the vet about an appropriate plan. Easier said than done! I feel your pain, as I was in the same position...and when I switched vets I did a lot of research and calling around. But I'm comfortable with my choice now.

We're all busy and it's hard to find the information you need.... But this forum does help a lot! Lots of experienced, knowledgeable folks here.


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