# HELP!! murphy is peeing out of ANGER



## Ava. (Oct 21, 2020)

I don't think he's angry, dogs don't feel spite for you.

Maybe hes anxious because you did something he didn't like? Its no biggie, he just needs to learn.


----------



## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Dogs don't get angry in any sort of human-like way that results in spiteful behavior as you described. Honestly that sounds like a pretty unusual bedtime routine and I suspect your poodle is very anxious as a result. I would have a behavior consultant evaluate the situation and help you figure out a better routine to reduce everyone's stress.

Why isn't the beagle sleeping in the house?


----------



## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

Most behaviorists would say that dogs don't vindictively pee. We are attributing human motivations to a dog when we say they do. This is unfair to the dog and makes it harder to solve the real problem. 

Dogs will pee simply because they need to pee. They will pee when they are over excited. They may even pee when they are nervous. It sounds like any of these, or a combination of all three, might have happened in your kitchen.

Dogs will also scent mark. If your dog keeps returning to pee on the same spot in the house, then you need to remove any trace of the last scent mark. Use an enzymatic solution to get the spot good and clean.


----------



## Basil_the_Spoo (Sep 1, 2020)

What if you take Murphy out to go pee before so his tank is empty? Is there any chance he had more salt then usual that caused him to hold more fluid?

I'm running through possible reasons that haven't been covered that could have caused him to pee sooner than you anticipated. Stress being the obvious factor.


----------



## Dianaleez (Dec 14, 2019)

What kind of relationship does Murphy have with the beagle?


----------



## Murphadoo6 (May 29, 2020)

Dianaleez said:


> What kind of relationship does Murphy have with the beagle?


murphy and our beagle cooper do not like each other very much


----------



## CieCie (Dec 27, 2020)

If he's thinking about this evening routine at all he's telling you he doesn't want to do it. The barking, jumping and growling is the tip off. Take him out first and don't make him participate (at least for now) in taking care of the beagle. Clean the kitchen floor well, take him out often so he's not tempted to go on the floor and leave him inside when you go out. Keep us updated.


----------



## Murphadoo6 (May 29, 2020)

lily cd re said:


> Dogs don't get angry in any sort of human-like way that results in spiteful behavior as you described. Honestly that sounds like a pretty unusual bedtime routine and I suspect your poodle is very anxious as a result. I would have a behavior consultant evaluate the situation and help you figure out a better routine to reduce everyone's stress.
> 
> Why isn't the beagle sleeping in the house?


our beagle doesn’t sleep inside because everyone in our house except me is extremely allergic to the hair and he sleeps in the pool fence and we have a pool house so he is safe and warm


----------



## Dianaleez (Dec 14, 2019)

Murphadoo6 said:


> murphy and our beagle cooper do not like each other very much


It does sound as though the problem lies in his possible fear of Cooper. Is this something that a dog trainer/behaviorist could help you with?


----------



## Murphadoo6 (May 29, 2020)

CieCie said:


> If he's thinking about this evening routine at all he's telling you he doesn't want to do it. The barking, jumping and growling is the tip off. Take him out first and don't make him participate (at least for now) in taking care of the beagle. Clean the kitchen floor well, take him out often so he's not tempted to go on the floor and leave him inside when you go out. Keep us updated.


yes I did not describe the situation appropriately murphy went out first and he was inside. we just take him out first so they do not meet each other but he peed while we were outside and he was inside


----------



## Click-N-Treat (Nov 9, 2015)

Spite isn't an emotion dogs are capable of experiencing. That requires higher order thinking. Change your nighttime routine. Crate the poodle, do what you gotta do with the beagle, take poodle outside to potty, return poodle to crate. To prevent soiling in the same area, clean with enzymatic cleaner.


----------



## Murphadoo6 (May 29, 2020)

Dianaleez said:


> It does sound as though the problem lies in his possible fear of Cooper. Is this something that a dog trainer/behaviorist could help you with?


I am not sure we have never had a problem like this before. but that might be the option to go with. cooper is actually scared of murphy and murphy likes to jump on him and bark at him nose to nose


----------



## Murphadoo6 (May 29, 2020)

Click-N-Treat said:


> Spite isn't an emotion dogs are capable of experiencing. That requires higher order thinking. Change your nighttime routine. Crate the poodle, do what you gotta do with the beagle, take poodle outside to potty, return poodle to crate. To prevent soiling in the same area, clean with enzymatic cleaner.


Okay thank you!


----------



## Murphadoo6 (May 29, 2020)

would anyone say he could be jealous? or can dogs be jealous?


----------



## reraven123 (Jul 21, 2017)

Murphadoo6 said:


> would anyone say he could be jealous? or can dogs be jealous?


Yes they can, but they would not express it in that way.


----------



## Phaz23 (May 31, 2020)

Im an outlier here in thinking dogs can feel many many “human-like” emotions. We are mammals and our complex emotions didn’t develop in a vacuum. Science is catching up every day to the complex emotions animals can feel. I absolutely believe dogs can experience jealousy, envy, and spite, though it is less complicated than it’s human counterpart.

That is probably not what is going on in this case but I do contest that the emotion can’t be felt by dogs (or even smaller mammals like rats for that matter. And oh lord if you have a cat, you know what spite looks like in an animal 😂)









Jealous dogs don't play ball


A dog is not immune to turning green with envy if it thinks other dogs are being treated better – and will even stop cooperating




www.newscientist.com














Rats Can Feel Regret Like Humans, Study Reveals | Sci.News


Rats can feel regret - a cognitive behavior once thought to be uniquely human.




www.sci-news.com













How Dogs Read Our Moods: Emotion Detector Found In Fido's Brain


Anyone who's had MRI knows how hard it is to lie motionless. But the dogs that participated in this brain-scanning experiment aced the test. Maybe the treats did it.




www.npr.org













Dogs’ recognition of human selfish and generous attitudes requires little but critical experience with people


There is some dispute regarding the role of experience in the development of dogs´ socio-cognitive abilities in their interaction with people. We sought to provide new evidence to this debate by comparing dogs with contrasting levels of experience with humans, in a task involving the...




journals.plos.org


----------



## For Want of Poodle (Feb 25, 2019)

I think this is all speculation without more information. Personally, if my dog peed before going into a crate I would be inclined to think they just desperately needed to pee or were scared. 

Would it be possible for you to better describe your routine? Step by step, and explain what both animals are doing?


----------



## Murphadoo6 (May 29, 2020)

For Want of Poodle said:


> I think this is all speculation without more information. Personally, if my dog peed before going into a crate I would be inclined to think they just desperately needed to pee or were scared.
> 
> Would it be possible for you to better describe your routine? Step by step, and explain what both animals are doing?


murphy plays every night for about an 1 hr to 1 hr and 30 min 
he eats at 7:00
goes out at 7:45
we play inside until about 8:30
he goes out again at 9:00 
just some free time tv time whatever
he goes out again at 9:55
goes to bed at 10:00


----------



## Murphadoo6 (May 29, 2020)

cooper runs around all day until about 10:00 then we put him in the pool fence so he can go into the pool house that way he doesn’t get caught by coyotes because we live in the country


----------



## For Want of Poodle (Feb 25, 2019)

How does that schedule relate to the growling, barking, peeing you described? Where does that fit in?


----------



## Murphadoo6 (May 29, 2020)

For Want of Poodle said:


> How does that schedule relate to the growling, barking, peeing you described? Where does that fit in?


someone asked about his schedule but he normally does this after we take him out and right before putting him in bed literally before we can get him in his crate someone will go to take care of cooper and he’ll start the barking and stuff


----------



## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

Murphadoo6 said:


> murphy plays every night for about an 1 hr to 1 hr and 30 min
> he eats at 7:00
> goes out at 7:45
> we play inside until about 8:30
> ...


Is Murphy still a puppy ? If so, he needs to go pee after playing. And he also needs to pee/poop right after eating. I think that’s why he’s peeing in the house : he’s not going out often enough and he can’t hold it anymore.


----------



## Starla (Nov 5, 2020)

So you have a yearish old standard poodle you hope to breed. An outside beagle (how old? Neutered?) that is sometimes inside but the family is allergic to. And they can’t be around each other? Does the poodle get outside time? IMO, you need a trainer and help ASAP.


----------



## Starvt (Nov 5, 2019)

It sounds like Murphy is specifically reacting to people/family going out to interact with Cooper. Is that what you are seeing? Are there other instances that he reacts when the family pays attention to Cooper?
Short term, the easy solution is to make sure he can't see it happening (like putting him in his crate before you go out).
I know my Raffi sometimes gets worked up (he whines and cries) if I take the other dog out without him- I jokingly refer to it as his FOMO issue. My best explanation is that it's somewhat related to separation anxiety but also possibly to resource guarding (the resource being attention, and he is 'guarding' it from the other dog).
I saw good improvement by working on a few things that help with separation, and also on making a positive connection towards leaving with the other dog. For example, putting the leash on Apple meant I was going to bring out a favorite chew for Raffi.
However, my dogs don't have any issues with each other. Given that you have other factors at play here in the relationship between the dogs, you might be best to get some professional insight.


----------



## Murphadoo6 (May 29, 2020)

Dechi said:


> Is Murphy still a puppy ? If so, he needs to go pee after playing. And he also needs to pee/poop right after eating. I think that’s why he’s peeing in the house : he’s not going out often enough and he can’t hold it anymore.


no he is a year and 5 months


----------



## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

Murphadoo6 said:


> no he is a year and 5 months


Then if he’s not fixed he might be marking territory. Keep a close eye on him because if it becomes a habit, it will be a lot harder to fix. And get him neutered.


----------

