# Is it true--'spaying-age' affects which way they grow?



## Purley (May 21, 2010)

I have heard that same theory, but I don't know that it has ever been proven.

I have always had my dogs spayed or neutered between 6-8 months of age because that is what the vets recommend around here. Part of it is to stop the pet reproducing. But I trust my vet enough that I am confident that he would not do it if it was detrimental to the pet. I guess if you are showing the dog and it matters on the size of the dog - then you wouldn't be doing it anyway.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

I would wait until maturity. I spayed at 5 months and I wish I had not. Reasons:

1) Spaying before growth plates close can lead to a "leggier", less "filled out" dog.

2) Spaying early, before hormones have had a chance to set in and "tighten things" can lead to spay incontinence.

3) If you have a standard poodle, you may wish to have a prophylactic gastropexy performed during the spay to lessen the likelihood of GDV (bloat with torsion). This needs to be done after maturity to ensure that the stomach remains attached to the ribs.

Now, as far as getting fat, I believe spaying can slow the metabolism of a female. This means her dietary needs may change and she can get fat if you don't adapt to her needs.

I will also mention that the partial spay is something I will be considering if I have a female in the future.


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## littlestitches (Dec 28, 2009)

What is a partial spay?

Paula


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## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

Olie was neutered shortly after being born. He is tall but I believe his parents were much bigger. He was very long and skinny and has just started filling in a bit more at 2 years. His build is nothing in comparison to Suri which was spayed at 18 months. Other than that I see no problems to date. 

I agree with above IF its possible to wait until 10+ months.


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## 3dogs (Nov 3, 2010)

Well why not wait? Do you let your dog run the neighborhood, do you put your dog out in the fence & not watch her, is she a kennel dog or attatched to a chain, do you go to a dogpark with intact males, do you have lots of intact males running free in the neighborhood, do you have intact males? I don't see a reason to spay/neuter early if you are responsible owner that doesn't have the above issues. In other Eurpean countries they s/n rarely & that is where I got my info from about my mixed breed dogs. It was an extensive study of many breeds that showed NOT neutering early was beneficial & spay was slightly beneficial. I was only reading for my mixed breed dogs that have 2 breeds in them that have high incidence of cancers that result in death & that not spaying them will give them a better chance of survival. 30 months seemed about the time that the data didn't support not spaying so I will spay my 2 bitches when they are about 30 months.

I don't know about Poodles since I wasn't researching the Poodles at that time but I my male Spoo from rescue is in the 3-5 range & got neutered at the rescue. He is about 23" & 36lbs.


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## Rayah-QualitySPs (Aug 31, 2010)

*Bone Density and Spaying*



Hey_j said:


> Yep, I read _somewhere _that if you spay a poodle* before* 6 months, (as in between 5 and 6 months)
> they will not get as fat but would, infact, be more inclined to be taller than wider!
> 
> Our vet says he spays in that time frame, between 5 and 6 months, but when I called the other day and said Callie
> ...


Here are two links that explain how early spay/neuter leads to decreased bone density, increased risk of certain cancers and may increase the risk of certain injuries:
Canine Sports Productions: Early Spay-Neuter Considerations for the Canine Athlete
http://www.coteaukennel.com/1-Final Neuter-spay.pdf

I would not spay a standard poodle before 9 months anymore. I would prefer them to be over 12 months.

Previously vets encouraged early spay/neuter because often time would fly by and your dog would come into heat and you would end up with puppies. I think some people may not be responsible enought to look after a poodle in heat. 

If this happens I know most reputable breeders would board them for the 3 weeks. VBG


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## Hey_j (Apr 27, 2011)

Wow--such good responses all of you! You've given me much to consider. I've never had a female _anything_ I didn't spay within 6 months. I have to say, all our previous dogs lived longer than 10 years with only the last one having any malignancy, though being a Lab, she was covered with those fatty cycst. She developed what the vet was pretty certain was a malignant bone tumor in her shoulder that was pushing it out and up and causing her pain!!

We've had a female German Shepherd--lived 10 years and died of an instant anurism in the brain, another mixed, described below--13 years, a beagle that lived 8 years (forgot she was less than 10--most likely from a puppy mill) and had problems that could not be identified without *great* expense etc.(definitely had hardened arteries) before we put her down, and now a Pap/Chinese Crested that's so far 3 years old, and now Callie our SPOO.

The longest lived dog we had was a mix, probably border collie and German shepherd--he lived 13 years and we had to put him down, due to severe back problems and failing kidneys, loss of bowel control--just bad and way past time to let him go!! He was neutered at about 3 months, as I recall!

I have a Ragdoll cat that was neutered at 3 weeks!!! I couldn't believe that but the breeder was also a Vet! He's 9 years old, and the longest lived cat we had lived 17 years plus. Now--I don't do shots, other than rabies! The breeder cat had distemper but not Leukemia because they have a propensity to have very bad reactions, even death to that one, but since he came to us, NO SHOTS! I don't even want him exposed to other cats at a vets office. We do have access to a house-calling vet if I ever decide I need anything done to him.

I WILL continue to mull this all over and I look forward to any other information anyone is willing to take the time to share with me!!

THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!


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## sschoe2 (Mar 16, 2011)

I had Sari spayed right at 6 months. If they have even 1 heat cycle their chances for mammary cancer go up significantly.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

sschoe2 said:


> I had Sari spayed right at 6 months. If they have even 1 heat cycle their chances for mammary cancer go up significantly.


I suggest reading this article.

There are other risks associated with spaying early that are not necessarily worth the slightly elevated risk of cancer if a bitch is spayed after maturity. 

The risk of mammary cancer does not seem to increase exponentially until approx. 30 months of age. Also, spaying your dog before 1 year of age significantly increases the risk of bone cancer. It is a balancing act.

Your dog is an individual. It is wrong of vets to apply a single formula of when to spay/neuter dogs.

http://www.naiaonline.org/pdfs/LongTermHealthEffectsOfSpayNeuterInDogs.Pdf


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## outwest (May 1, 2011)

ChocolateMillie said:


> I suggest reading this article.
> 
> There are other risks associated with spaying early that are not necessarily worth the slightly elevated risk of cancer if a bitch is spayed after maturity.
> 
> ...


Hmmm. This is a topic of interest to me as I think we will spay Bonnie. I have a neutered male dog in the house and think having Bonnie in heat will be a pain. My vet recommends 6 months. We are taking her today for another round of puppy shots, so I will ask again about it.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

outwest said:


> Hmmm. This is a topic of interest to me as I think we will spay Bonnie. I have a neutered male dog in the house and think having Bonnie in heat will be a pain. My vet recommends 6 months. We are taking her today for another round of puppy shots, so I will ask again about it.


Most vets will push for early spay these days for various reasons. One being that they wish to keep the number of accidental litters down, which, for a truly responsible owner is not going to be a problem. Another being that they don't consider each dog on an individual basis. Spaying is not as simple as "if you spay before the first head there is a much smaller chance of mammary cancer." Yes, this is a true statement, but there is more. 

My vet talked me into spaying my girl at 5 months and I wish I had been firmer with my own beliefs.


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## PaddleAddict (Feb 9, 2010)

I asked my vet what she thought about early neuter causing the dog to grow too tall due to delaying the closure of the growth plates and she asked why that mattered since my dog was not a show dog. Well, it matters to me, I wanted my dog to be mature before neutering. Anyway, it became a moot point when he needed surgery to remove a retained baby tooth that was damaging his permanent tooth at 9 months old. I had wanted to wait until he was 12 months for the neuter but I didn't want to put him under anesthesia twice in a three-month period so he was neutered at 9 months, which I was definitely more comfortable with than an earlier neuter.

15 years ago when I worked for a vet I used to be pro early spay and neuter--I thought the earlier the better. My views have changed and many vets have also changed their opinions, especially in the females, but some vets still have the old school mentality of the earlier the better. I do think that in shelter situations it's better to go ahead and alter them early before they go to new homes since the shelters really don't know how responsible the new owners will be, but if you are responsible you can wait, prevent pregnancy and spay/neuter when the dog has matured. My dog was sold on a spay/neuter contract but breeder said to wait to neuter him until he was 10 to 12 months old (I guess the smaller dogs mature earlier than the larger dogs, like spoos).


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