# Looking for advice, ideas etc.



## reraven123 (Jul 21, 2017)

Don't let her focus on the other dog. Work on getting eye contact with you while the other dog is approaching. If she's treat motivated you could keep her attention that way, otherwise tap her on the head, tug her ear, ask her to do something like spin or offer a paw, whatever works. If she looks at the other dog get her eyes back on you until she is released to greet the other dog. This means you have to split your attention between her and the approaching people, which isn't always easy!


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

reraven123 said:


> Don't let her focus on the other dog. Work on getting eye contact with you while the other dog is approaching. If she's treat motivated you could keep her attention that way, otherwise tap her on the head, tug her ear, ask her to do something like spin or offer a paw, whatever works. If she looks at the other dog get her eyes back on you until she is released to greet the other dog. This means you have to split your attention between her and the approaching people, which isn't always easy!


Thanks. That is an excellent idea and going to be hard work since she’s so focused on the other dog. But you are correct, I want her focus on me and not the other dog.


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## reraven123 (Jul 21, 2017)

You're the one who's there, so you know best whether it is aggression or not, but in general it is not good to let dogs stare at each other. Good luck!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I agree with reraven that you should make sure you are keeping your dog's attention on you rather than letting her get involved with the approach of the other dog. I would be thinking as you are that this is not a behavior I would allow to continue or to deepen. Do some tricks, ask for focused attention and the like. And for sure hard eye contact with other dogs is never a good thing to allow. Most dogs find it rude or frightening to be stared at and it can provoke lots of problems. Last week I had a couple of new or irregular attendees at my novice class. There was lots of staring and a lot of me telling people to break the eye contact. I had Javelin out and he was not happy to be stared at by the new mini aussie. Good luck with it.


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## Click-N-Treat (Nov 9, 2015)

As some dogs age (but not all dogs) they stop wanting to make friends or greet strange dogs. The mentality makes a shift from we're all young, let's play, to pack ranking: how does this dog rank in relationship to me? It's a very different dynamic, one I saw vividly in my last dog when she was about three and a half. She stopped enjoying the dog park and clearly cared more about who was who, and far less about running around and being a nut. 

When I go for a walk with Noelle, I place all dogs in neutral mode, except for obviously aggressive dogs. Noelle has never socially met a strange dog on a leash. I want Noelle to look at a dog, notice the dog, shrug and continue walking with me. The signals Babykins is sending (and you are wiser than 99.99% of dog owners for noticing!!!) is telling you she's uncomfortable. Your plan of nope, no more saying hi, is wise. Also, add the look at that game to your practice.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Well back to basics - we played the Look at That game - the one that Click posted the video.

We also had a great walk on the block and she wasn't distracted by a couple of neighbors dogs that were outside, including the two out of control dogs that one neighbor was walking.

The park seems to be her trigger spot, so I'm going to take her there for short doses and work on the Look at That game.

I'm now questioning taking her once a week to her small dog social. She loves to go, she has a group of friends that she loves to run with and she's so excited to get into the room where the group meets that she pulls on the leash and I have to play the tree and wait for her to get back into heel before we go forward.

She also sees lots of dogs at class - I don't let her play with them although sometimes they do sniff each other if someone lets their dog get too close (there's not a lot of room where we wait).


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

LAT should help a lot. as to small dog social if she still is happy there I think you should keep going there. Many things with dogs are situational after all.


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## Click-N-Treat (Nov 9, 2015)

If she's happy at her small dog social, by all means keep going! The other dogs are all an accepted part of her family. She knows them, they know her, let's go run around and be super happy. My only concern would be if an new dog shows up. Watch her body language for signs of, "Hey, what are you doing here with us?" You'll know it if you see it, trust me. That's what my old dog started doing at the dog park. Sort of a gatekeeper posture, not threatening and aggressive, but not welcoming and open, either. As long as you're not seeing Babykins act like that, keep having fun at the social. Glad to hear Look at That helped. Man I love that game!


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Click-N-Treat said:


> If she's happy at her small dog social, by all means keep going! The other dogs are all an accepted part of her family. She knows them, they know her, let's go run around and be super happy. My only concern would be if an new dog shows up. Watch her body language for signs of, "Hey, what are you doing here with us?" You'll know it if you see it, trust me. That's what my old dog started doing at the dog park. Sort of a gatekeeper posture, not threatening and aggressive, but not welcoming and open, either. As long as you're not seeing Babykins act like that, keep having fun at the social. Glad to hear Look at That helped. Man I love that game!


Excellent advice. While there is a large core group of dogs that attend regularly, it's not unusual for a new dog to show up. Dolly is one of the first dogs to greet new dogs. Her approach seems friendly and once they get a little sniffing, she goes back to playing with her buddies and sometimes the new dog will join in and sometimes not. I always keep my eye on her, but I'll pay extra close attention to her behavior when a new dog arrives.

Do you have any links that show a dog's body language in that gate keeper posture?


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Skylar, Brenda Aloff has a book on canine body language. there may be some related material online too.


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## asuk (Jan 6, 2017)

Click-N-Treat said:


> As some dogs age (but not all dogs) they stop wanting to make friends or greet strange dogs. The mentality makes a shift from we're all young, let's play, to pack ranking: how does this dog rank in relationship to me? It's a very different dynamic, one I saw vividly in my last dog when she was about three and a half. She stopped enjoying the dog park and clearly cared more about who was who, and far less about running around and being a nut.
> 
> When I go for a walk with Noelle, I place all dogs in neutral mode, except for obviously aggressive dogs. Noelle has never socially met a strange dog on a leash. I want Noelle to look at a dog, notice the dog, shrug and continue walking with me. The signals Babykins is sending (and you are wiser than 99.99% of dog owners for noticing!!!) is telling you she's uncomfortable. Your plan of nope, no more saying hi, is wise. Also, add the look at that game to your practice.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EdraNF2hcgA


you always have the BEST game suggestions! i tried your "you win a prize" game with milo and it worked like a charm. i have been doing a variation of this game, "look at me" and it has work too. he is a friendly dog, wanting to greet every single person and dog that we encounter on walks. but this has taught him very good impulse control in that respect. so thank you!


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## Click-N-Treat (Nov 9, 2015)

You win a prize is hilarious, isn't it? It gives you something to do instead of have your head explode off your shoulders. For those who missed it, here's a link. http://www.poodleforum.com/23-general-training-obedience/257777-how-stop-jumping.html#post3106753

OK, now back to the gatekeeper posture. You will know it instantly. And I do mean instantly. Your dog goes from tail fast wagging and body wiggling, to tail up and slow wagging. A slowly wagging tail is not a friendly posture. Tail wagging at quarter speed, standing very still and as tall as possible, leaning slightly forward, head still, eyes focused like a laser on a newcomer. This is NOT a dog to pet, by the way. This is a dog on alert and suspicious. That's what I call gatekeeper posture. Here's a series of infographics on dog body language. https://barkpost.com/discover/dog-body-language-charts/


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Thanks everyone, I love that I can come here and get the best advice.

Catherine my library doesn't have the Brenda Aloff book, however I've been googling and finding images such as the ones Click added the link too so I better understand what I'm looking for.

And my library did have 2 books by Patricia McConnell "For the love of a dog : understanding emotion in you and your best friend" and "The cautious canine : how to help dogs conquer their fears" which I ordered and will read when they come in.

Working LAT as well.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

*update*

We've walked in the park several times since I posted this and instituted changes. I'm happy to say that we haven't had any stalking.

Most of the time I've been able to keep her 100% focused on me. There have been a few times when she kept looking back at the dogs but eventually, as the dogs moved away, she stopped. I did need treats part of the time.

We've also been in the situation of walking on the path as we passed a dog - and she was fairly calm. I moved her to my left putting myself between her and the other dog.

I really tested her this morning - we have one super leash reactive dog that all the dogs in the neighborhood react to. I worked across the street and was able to keep her focused on me, using treats.

I've also started asking her to do heads up heeling for part of our walks - whether in the neighborhood or in the park. I think it's helping to remind her to focus on me and not on other dogs.

Someone in my CD class suggested having asking new people in class and at competition, if our dogs can meet. I've had other people ask me this. I'm on the fence if this is a good idea or not.

I've borrowed For the love of a dog : understanding emotion in you and your best friend
by McConnell, Patricia B. from my library.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Thanks for the update. I am glad that you are making clear progress.

I do not let my dogs interact with other dogs in training classes. I also prefer particularly that the dogs in novice class don't interact with each other. When both handler and dog are very green the handlers are often too casual about what their dogs are doing, how much eye contact they are making and often don't really read body language as well as they should. If I were you I would go with what I think your gut is telling you, which is to say no that you are there to work and not for socializing. You will be doing yourselves as a team a favor this way. I would be very sad to see that a dog had done something that set back all the great work you have done to be so close to ring ready. At trials more than anywhere there is no socializing. My dogs are to only have eyes for me there.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

lily cd re said:


> Thanks for the update. I am glad that you are making clear progress.
> 
> I do not let my dogs interact with other dogs in training classes. I also prefer particularly that the dogs in novice class don't interact with each other. When both handler and dog are very green the handlers are often too casual about what their dogs are doing, how much eye contact they are making and often don't really read body language as well as they should. If I were you I would go with what I think your gut is telling you, which is to say no that you are there to work and not for socializing. You will be doing yourselves as a team a favor this way. I would be very sad to see that a dog had done something that set back all the great work you have done to be so close to ring ready. At trials more than anywhere there is no socializing. My dogs are to only have eyes for me there.


Thanks for your sage advice. What I have been doing is allowing Babykins to meet and sniff dogs outside the building on the grass - when she is sniffing and pottying, but I don't allow her to sniff and greet inside the building. Inside means business. I think I will continue.


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