# Study Evaluates Homemade Diet Recipes for Dogs



## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

DogAware.com News Archive: Diet-Related News

Boy! This is an eye opener. So far, everything I read that is a common deficiency, I think I've got covered as far as which foods contain what. I definitely feed a large variety of foods. HOWEVER...I'm still back to that old, nagging worry that makes me twitch. The amounts for my dogs. Gee wiz. 

Anyhow, I thought this is a very useful article to outline the foods that contain essential nutrients and for anyone feeding a homemade diet, to be sure you're including everything they need. Again though...I am quite concerned about getting the right amounts. It's no good to get too much or too little of many nutrients...vitamins, minerals etc. 

Read it over and see what you think.


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## Caddy (Nov 23, 2014)

Good article, I will be reading it over again tomorrow and taking a few notes. I do find I sometimes get in a rut preparing meals, but I do try to include most of what they talked about. It's so hard to know what's best.


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## nifty (Aug 2, 2013)

A very interesting article. Thanks!

I maybe do not worry enough -- I look at the recommendations and I am convinced that whole animal meals, which include bone, organ meats and tripe usually, will probably provide everything a dog needs to thrive, especially if there is plenty of variety in animal sources. 

I add some fish oil about once a week for extra omega -- I have a bottle of human grade capsules which I pierce and squirt over her food. Basically, I am pretty comfortable with her diet, as I feed Chicken, turkey, beef, lamb, pork, mutton, rabbit (though she doesn't care for rabbit much in raw form, so I am probably going to phase that out), muskrat when I can get it (she loves it!), emu (pricey but a treat 4 meals per month), duck and lake trout. I toss a few tinned sardines on top of an occasional meal, too. These whole animal coarse grinds are occasionally alternated with RMBs - although to be honest, I am not as confident about these bought at local grocers as I am with the grinds. I can get turkey backs sometimes, chicken backs also sometimes and other times I feed pork ribs or necks and chicken leg quarters or a thigh and a drumstick. Some days, I feed her beef heart at one of her two main meals (which is high in the choline mentioned in the article). She also gets raw beef trachea a couple of times per week, duck or turkey necks on other days. That is a midday snack, given after her brushing and teeth cleaning as a reward for being such a good girl!

When her meals are coarsely ground "whole" animal feedings (which are probably 70% or more of her diet), I prepare her meal with 1/3 cup of Honest Kitchen base mix to provide insurance and peace of mind regarding the trace minerals and extra vitamins.


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Very good article! Justfordogs.com is interesting to take a look at. They have a portion chart of dog weight to cups of food and sell the supplements if you want to DIY. I think as long as you add the supplements you'll be fine. That's the main concern of AAFCO et al, that your dog is missing the vitamins and minerals.


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

Thanks PBG- that's a great collection of articles!

I've been using the DIY kits from Just Food for Dogs after reading an endorsement in The Whole Dog Journal a while ago. It's a great company, the kits are easy to use and I don't have to worry about deficiencies or mucking around with supplements.

However, now that we've bought an RV, I've started thinking about the feasibility of home cooking all the time and have decided to "test drive" some prepared food. I'm feeding half Wellness kibble now and they're doing great. I'll transition them to 100% kibble for a while just to make sure we've got an alternative when traveling.
My dogs eat pretty much anything- so that's not an issue. With one exception- Max doesn't like Honest Kitchen. Thank you Max, it's too expensive anyway for three dogs!


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

The pre-made base mixes, such as Honest Kitchen' ingredients are dehyrated. I don't like that idea too much. Plus, how do I know they put those things in it? See...that's why I've turned into a die-hard anti-commercial food giver. lol. The other thing, I put more ingredients than they list in my dog's diet. Their veggies that are ever so slightly steamed and then broken down in my Vita Mix consist of: (one batch will vary slightly from another) Spinach, green beans, carrots, yam, broccoli, celery, blueberries, flax oil. Another batch might have mixed greens, carrots, celery, zucchini, cauliflower, butternut squash, chia seeds. 

Like you, Nifty, I think I'm feeding a lot of variety of other things. Twice a week they get fresh sardines or mackerel...bones and all. They get raw egg pulverized with the shells maybe 2 or 3 times a week on their other food usually. There's beef, lamb, rabbit, turkey, duck, duck feet, goat, chicken, tongue, hearts and gizzards, liver from beef, chicken and lamb, kidney from lamb, spleen. There's tripe every day a little bit. I have venison and kangaroo but haven't used it yet. Haven't tried the goat yet either. We must go gradually with new introductions. I've probably forgotten something. And will probably find some new and wonderful thing to offer next visit to the Asian store or local farmer which I have yet to determine. On the days they don't get fish, they get a squirt of anchovy-sardine oil from Iceland. I give them all a little green lipid mussel powder once a day and a dash of turmeric. Jose`, because he doesn't chew up raw meaty bones gets a pinch of powdered egg shells that have been boiled and dried or about 1/8th tsp of bone meal. Those amounts are guess work. So that's a little scary. 

Here's a question for you. If a dog is getting all the nutrients mentioned in that article from the foods given and then you give something like Honest Kitchen or another brand's supplements, might it not be a possibility that there's an over dose of something somewhere? Caroline, I'm with you. It is very expensive, especially for 3 dogs. And if all those nutrients are included in their food, then do we really need it?

There are some people who feed what they call a prey model diet. They don't feed vegetables or supplements other than fish oil. They think what a dog would eat if he were wild would not include squash and green beans, which is true. So perhaps some of those things aren't necessary IF tripe is fed because those vegetables I think are suppose to mimic what has been digested from the vegetarian animal their prey fed on. And vegetables are not utilized very well. Hopefully, breaking them down is sufficient. It may not be. So I have come to believe that raw green tripe is essential to be fed often...regularly. It's the ultimate broken down vegetation and full of all kinds of amazing things. So, I'm like this religious tripe worshipper. LOL. :adore: But I still like the idea of giving a little veggies because there are more vitamins there as long as they can metabolize them.

So, do you think I ought to buy that expensive pre-made, processed (dehydrated) stuff to supplement what I'm feeding? I"m afraid it could make for an over dose. It's just the amounts of things that I'm unsure of. Now, those people on the raw food forum I go on insist that IF you're feeding a large variety, it's all covered, that I shouldn't worry about the math, making sure they get everything because they WILL if fed a large variety. I hope they're right. :ahhhhh:


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

PBG-I would bet you're just fine, especially because you're feeding raw, so right away they get the calcium. The mix from Just Food for Dogs made it easier and was convenient. But I used a variety of recipes before that and they did just fine.

I want to do the right things for my dogs too, but the bottom line is that dogs survived for centuries scavenging off our scraps- so I suspect there's a little wiggle room in those nutritional guidelines!


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

Yes, you are absolutely right and I must remember that. I had a debate with someone online somewhere else who insisted that commercial food was better than a complete raw diet. He was a vet apparently and not surprisingly. And his premise was that wild dogs don't necessarily live as long as our commercial fed dogs, that wolves don't live long lives etc etc. Of course, he failed to provide me with proof or studies eliminating all other variables besides food, such as predators, human interference etc. lol. And he forgot one simple truth that you referred to. Dogs and their ancestors had to have thrived to survive at least long enough to reproduce and pass on their survival genes. lol. They are one of, if not _the_ most successful evolutionary marvels on the planet. They didn't make it all the way into the 21st century being sickly and dying young. After he made that assertion that wild dogs are unhealthy because of what they eat and die young, I threw my hands up, looked heavenward and quit the discussion. lol.


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

How hard is it for the AAFCO to come up with a homemade raw diet that they would endorse? Or the Veterinarian professional organization? As the author of the article mentioned we are entrusted to provide our children with a balanced diet, surely we can do justice to our pets. Many people want more control over what we out in our mouths - organic, free range, grass fed, cage free, yada yada and that concern extends to our pets. I'm so belt and suspenders that I would feel obligated to add the supplements, hoping that any excess is excreted. Since I can barely manage a few home cooked meals for my DH and I per week, I'm relying on one meal of AAFCO approved kibble and chicken necks for the next. I have had a few email exchanges with the kibble company representative who claims that no company can claim that all of the kibble supplements are US sourced. Brrrrrr!


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

After reading the article, I actually felt pretty good about the raw diet my dogs got. It looks like I had most everything covered. The author pointed out that eggs, fish, vegetables and fruits, organ meats, raw bone, and a variety of muscle meats are necessary, and that's what I fed. I did use fish oil, in addition to sardines or salmon, and oat bran for...manganese, I think.


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

Mfmst said:


> How hard is it for the AAFCO to come up with a homemade raw diet that they would endorse? Or the Veterinarian professional organization? As the author of the article mentioned we are entrusted to provide our children with a balanced diet, surely we can do justice to our pets. Many people want more control over what we out in our mouths - organic, free range, grass fed, cage free, yada yada and that concern extends to our pets. I'm so belt and suspenders that I would feel obligated to add the supplements, hoping that any excess is excreted. Since I can barely manage a few home cooked meals for my DH and I per week, I'm relying on one meal of AAFCO approved kibble and chicken necks for the next. I have had a few email exchanges with the kibble company representative who* claims that no company can claim that all of the kibble supplements are US sourced.* Brrrrrr!


This is true when there is a blend of supplements and vitamins that are sourced, they all come from China. I believe I read that in one of the many articles I've posted. I think it might have been one that talks about what awful things go into commercial food and how the AAFCO is pretty misleading as far as their worth. But I don't know for sure how accurate some of these sources are. I forget which that one was. I'd have to go back and check.

The problem is that not all vitamins are excreted through the urine, but instead stored in the liver, for instance in the case of vitamin A. Some of these things can reach toxic levels and cause grave consequences. So, if one is certain that their dog is getting adequate levels of the vitamins, minerals etc in what they're giving, it could be too much of certain things if more supplements are given. Selenium is another one that is dangerous if taken in excess. There are others. If you're only feeding chicken necks for the raw part, then yes, you would be wise to use that blend of essentials I think. With what I'm feeding and some of the others here and on that other forum I visit, it may well be just fine. I am always the type to worry about everything though.:nailbiting: But I'll keep digging for more information until I'm finally close to satisfied. lol. :bird:

I talked with a new vet today...the one my son and I took his dog to yesterday and I went too...actually same clinic, different vet. This one just called to report on the blood tests. After discussing my son's dog's case, I suggested a raw food diet for her like I'm doing with my dogs. He said that her blood work looked so stupendously good, that something is being done right. She's on TOTW and Kirland canned for a topper. (well, that's just one aspect...her blood work) I told him about Jose`'s remarkable improvement with his septic smelling breath, how it is completely gone now. I forgot to tell him how much more spunky he is and how less stiff and arthritic he's seeming. But anyhow, I launched into what all I'm feeding my dogs...in a sort of nutshell, leaving a few details out, but only a few. lol. Poor fella had to listen to me expound away.:blah: But anyhow, he either was quite open minded or he was just placating me. Maybe he needs a new customer. He said something to the effect, "don't let us vets discourage you." ROFLOL. But then he said that is sounds like I'm doing it right. LOL. He was super nice. :angel:


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

JudyD said:


> After reading the article, I actually felt pretty good about the raw diet my dogs got. It looks like I had most everything covered. The author pointed out that eggs, fish, vegetables and fruits, organ meats, raw bone, and a variety of muscle meats are necessary, and that's what I fed. I did use fish oil, in addition to sardines or salmon, and oat bran for...manganese, I think.



Judy, that sounds awesome. Oat bran! I gave my dogs some oat meal one or two times when I thought they needed some extra poof to their poop. lol. But manganese! I had to look it up to remind myself what all it does and what foods have it. This is cool! Manganese Requirements & Deficiencies in Dogs


And this: Look at all the many, many foods that supply manganese! Wow! I feed many of them.

manganese

Thanks Judy.


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

"Don't less us Vets dissuade you" is the crux. Don't worry, I know Buck's diet is a straddle, but it's worked. He's been eating necks since I got him and his teeth glow in the dark. His vet warned me of salmonella, discouraged the whole diet. I blew him off and followed my breeder. The raw is what Buck relishes and he is never bored with his prosaic chicken.


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## West U (Jul 30, 2014)

We were in Beijing, China last summer, my husband and I ate everything. My teenage sons, not so much. We are still alive, hopefully for a lot longer. My dogs and cat eat better than my kids. I just cannot get that worked up over what I feed my furry kids. From what I see, the vets still are under pressure from the pet food manufacturers. I had a young vet from A&M recently ask me if I would like to see a nutritionist from A&M. I said no, "but maybe my sons should". Raw feeder here...


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