# Problems with teaching my poodle how to FETCH



## snmim (Sep 7, 2015)

My Mira is an impeccable dog, she is the the first canine ever to enter my family tree. She can sit, down, stand, jump over, stay, come, paw, leave it, speak, but no fetch. From day 1 since I got her at 9 weeks she was never interested in a ball. I've been trying so hard to teach her but for some reason she just shuts down once I start to train her. It's a very odd behavior that she does. I'll get my clicker and just start with getting the ball in her mouth rewarding with freeze dried liver. And then after a couple of repetitions with this she'll ignore the command, come real close and start to cuddle me! Every time! I don't know why she does this, I never ever yelled or hit her, I actually try to be very excited and use a happy voice, but it's like she just shuts down and wants to sit in my lap instead. She lowers her ears and her tail and presses her body against me. She's not even a cuddly dog. Today she did it again, I decided to stop the training and just wait. Well, she fell asleep on top of me.. :confused3:

I know some of you will say be careful what you wish for...but I was at a training center once and the trainer had her 2 border collies with her and we were playing a game of fetch. I was possibly stupidly amazed on how fixated they were at bringing the ball back. Mira was just running around them ignoring the ball completely, it actually weighed me down. I might be ranting about something that's not very important, but after so many repetitions of trying to teach this behavior I'm still failing. Standard poodles are supposed to be water retrievers, right?

I know she has a play drive. She likes to play with her toys by herself, and she'll play tug and drop it on command. There are times where I can throw a tug toy down the hall and run backwards and hide and usually she comes back with the toy. But after a couple of throws she quits and ignores it. Are there any ideas on why she shuts down when I'm trying to train her, and how better to teach her how to fetch? What are the steps? I've probably watched every fetch video there is, maybe you guys have some other ideas on what worked? Or should I give up and accept that my dog just isn't into this.


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## Viking Queen (Nov 12, 2014)

Some dogs just don't like to fetch. My girl will fetch a tennis ball all day and night and her stuffed ducky too. Her other toys live in the toy basket and no amount of playing will get her to play with them or fetch, but she LOVES her tennis balls. No other balls.

Her brother, Louis, who lives with another family, will not fetch anything, at all, but will play with more of his toys.

I like to think it is like a kid who likes to play football, but doesn't care about playing tennis, or baseball. They are all different in their likes and dislikes, I guess.

You have done really well with all of your other training. Keep it up.

Viking Queen


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## Naira (Jan 9, 2015)

Is there any toy she likes besides the ball? Can you teach her to "hold" a toy in her mouth and then teach her "come" and then "drop it" ? You can break it down when teaching her and then eventually it will all become one fluid event...and even better than teaching drop it is presenting another equally enticing toy!

I think I had to teach my mini to fetch like this ... It's been a while and I don't exactly remember. My standard Naira fetched from a very young age though .. Like 13 weeks. They are all different but your girl is more than capable of learning. 

Good luck she looks cute


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## nifty (Aug 2, 2013)

What a pretty girl Mira is! How old is she?

Did your breeder do the Volhard testing with Mira at 7 weeks? What was her score on the retrieving task?

The reason why I a asking these things is because it may be a question of age at this point, and also confusion. Her reaction to your attempts strike me as confusion - like she doesn't know what behavior you want her to offer, so she comes in close for a cuddle hoping that is the one?

My Dulcie also seemed like she wasn't going to be in to retrieving, even though at her 7 week Volhard test, she retrieved the toy and brought it back to the tester. For her first 5-6 months after I brought her home, she was totally uninterested in fetching the ball or a toy, except in circumstances like you describe (where you threw toy in the house and she brought it back a few times before losing interest). At the dog park or actually any park, she ignored anything that was lying around and was all about the other dogs. Totally.

Then, at around age 6-7 months, she began to play keep away at the park, so I decided to remove the park/dog park time from her exercise routine for awhile and concentrate on recall training. I decided to make a game of it using a Chuck It and ball. I really didn't have high expectations about the fetch element, but I hoped a bit of play while we trained for recall would make it more fun (Dulcie is not highly treat motivated, so my training efforts in the early months were challenging to say the least).

Lo and behold! When there were few other options, Dulcie decided that playing a game of fetch was better than boredom. After a few games of that (while I was actually focused on her recall) I began to realize that she was beginning to enjoy fetch. We started going to a nearby park and I stayed away from other dogs and just played fetch with her. No rewards of treats. The game was the reward.

Well, Dulcie caught on instantly and now is the fetch champion of our neighborhood. She will do almost anything for that ball. I have used the fetch game for a lot of her training. 

Now when we go to the dog park, I can get instant obedience just by holding up the ball. The downside is that she is now so focused on the ball that she is no longer interested in playing with other dogs unless there are NO balls in the dog park (which I prefer!). She is not unfriendly or aggressive with other dogs but she doesn't really play with them unless there is no ball in sight.

It sounds like you have made excellent progress with Mira's training. It is true that every dog is different and their desire and aptitude for fetching can be anywhere on the map. However, if Mira is still a puppy, it may be that her desire to socialize with other dogs is simply stronger right now than her focus on you or toys.


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

It seems to me she doesn't like it, for whatever reason, and she is trying to appease you. She doesn't seem to want to do it at all.

Is this very important to you ? If so I suppose there are ways to make her do it, but I don't know if she'll ever truly enjoy it.

On the other hand, a dog who is crazy about fetching can really get annoying after a few minutes... Maybe you have it good and you don't know it... ;-)


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

We had a Jack Russell that was ball obsessed. We taught him to drop it, push it where he pounced on the ball with both front paws right to u, and back up for after he dropped it. He would bring the ball, drop it at our feet, then look at the ball, look at the person, look at the ball, look at the person, push the ball and back up, and start over. He NEVER let up. We could take the ball away and try to hide it in a drawer and her would sit next to the drawer for hours on end, just staring at the drawer.

I probably threw that ball 300 times a day for 11 years.

We had a teenaged boy and all his friends hung out here. They ALL threw the ball over and over and over. 

Anyways, be careful what you wish for is right! lol

Now Misha LOVES to fetch, and my chihuahua has no interest. 

I think a lot of them either love it or they don't. But I'm sure they can be trained to do it.


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## MollyMuiMa (Oct 13, 2012)

Not all dogs are 'ball obsessed' but will enjoy fetching a favorite toy once in a while! My Molly is not much of a ball fetcher except for one very soft latex squeaky ball, it is the only ball she will chase and fetch. But only when she feels like it.....Mira sounds like that also. Does Mira have any prey drive? Molly is a huntress(LOL) and the way I taught her to fetch is to play tug with her favorite toy, then I would toss it across the room and tell her "GET IT" (I had to lead her at first) then when she would get it, I 'traded' her with a treat and the command "GIVE IT"..............she enjoys it now but only when she's 'in the mood' hahahaha!


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## snmim (Sep 7, 2015)

I really think she has the ability to learn. Naira, I’ve tried many times to try and teach her to “hold” an item but she second she puts it in her mouth she drops it. I could tell she wants the food in my hand and she listens to “get it” but she will drop it immediately. I don’t know of any other ways to teach hold.

Nifty, Mira is a week shy of 6 months old. I really wish my breeder did the Volhard testing, as I did not ask about it. I explained to her the temperament I wanted and she just said that her entire litter in general was pretty “calm” I’m not really complaining, there are no problems with my girl so far in terms of temperament. And now that I think about the fetch training part, maybe she was just trying to appease me. I jokingly thought that she’s lazy and doesn’t want to learn so she tries to be cute instead lol. I’m jealous on Dulcie’s focus on fetching! That’s what I want!!

Yes, I would really like her to retrieve an item. I’ve seen it in some dogs and I really admire it and want to teach that to my own dog. My neighbor has a sheltie who can fetch anything mobile or immobile just by saying the word “hand” and pointing at the item! Mira's a very good, obedient girl overall who really does anything I ask of her that she knows without any rewards. The only real problem that I know of is jumping at guests and getting too overexcited. She has a HIGH prey drive I think. She will chase lizards and squirrels all day if I let her. It’s slowly fading with “leave it” but I still make sure to let her off leash once there are no squirrels in sight lol so we can practice walking staying in my radius.

I’ll try again tomorrow… The way of teaching I’m trying right now it to first “get it” (put object in her mouth) and then I’ll move backwards and reward for her following me with the item. Then I try to teach “touch” with object in her mouth. Problem with this is she will drop the item and then touch my hand so it never transitions to throwing item away and bringing it back to me. She will go the item, and bite it, drop it, then come to me. Sometimes she won't even get it where I threw it. I’ll keep trying.. It’s the number one thing I want to teach her since she got the rest down!


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## hkb (Oct 12, 2014)

Smudge wasn't interested in balls, playing fetch until he was over a year old. Now he is completely ball obsessed at the park, runs like a pocket rocket to retrieve the ball (the smallest chuck-it and the rubber chuck-it ball) and then for him part of the game is not giving it back! On occasion, he runs to a complete stranger in the park, drops the ball at their feet, sits looking expectantly up at them and as soon as they reach for the ball, he snatches it away! Then drops, sits looking all innocent and expectant and as soon as they reach - snatches it away. We had to tell one poor man that he was never going to get the ball to throw it for Smudge (after 5 repitions of drop, look, pick-up, drop, look etc) He is such a tease!


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

hkb said:


> Smudge wasn't interested in balls, playing fetch until he was over a year old. Now he is completely ball obsessed at the park, runs like a pocket rocket to retrieve the ball (the smallest chuck-it and the rubber chuck-it ball) and then for him part of the game is not giving it back! On occasion, he runs to a complete stranger in the park, drops the ball at their feet, sits looking expectantly up at them and as soon as they reach for the ball, he snatches it away! Then drops, sits looking all innocent and expectant and as soon as they reach - snatches it away. We had to tell one poor man that he was never going to get the ball to throw it for Smudge (after 5 repitions of drop, look, pick-up, drop, look etc) He is such a tease!


AS long as, the dog does not snatch the ball with TEETH from one who holds it. I have seen "ball mania" cause a few problems in my experience.
So long as you can take the ball away without problems all is fine. A bit of resource guarding comes in here. Take care and correct where needed.
Eric:angel2:


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

Neither of mine are interested in retrieving - and after walking a couple of ball obsessed dogs I would rather they had too little interest than too much! It is interesting that you say Mira likes chasing real live things - I suspect Sophy completely understands the difference between live squirrels and rabbits and the artificial "live" movement of a toy or ball, and they have both worked out that bringing something back to a human just means the human throws it away again, and therefore obviously didn't want it in the first place... Poppy did a most beautiful untaught retrieve of a sick baby rabbit once, but these days she carefully hides anything I throw for her to keep it safe. Sophy just ignores this strange human habit.

It sounds to me as if Mira is worried about displeasing you when playing this game, and is trying to placate you by cuddling. I would put it to one side, play games you both enjoy, and come back to it in a few months time. There is, however, one way that mine will play a sort of retrieve that might be fun to try, and that is Hunt the Toy. I use soft toys that I know they like, and pretend that the toy is hiding, or running behind me, building up to a game of chase and tug. When the dog is enthusiastic about getting the toy I toss it a short distance, and then play a gentle game of tug when the dog gets it, before reclaiming it to toss again. That makes it interesting enough for the dogs to play for quite a few minutes before they decide it would be more fun just to chew the toy's toes off...


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## mom2Zoe (Jun 17, 2014)

I would count your blessings. Lol
Zoe is obsessed can play fetch for hours with a ball or in the house she will drop a toy in your lap and expect you to throw it.It can become quite a nuisance


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## Naira (Jan 9, 2015)

Funny that you mention chasing live things. My mini who had to be coerced to fetch, had such an innate instinct to chase small live animals like squirrels... 

My standard who fetched practically from birth...shows no interest in chasing squirrels or small animals. She will certainly play with dogs but her "prey drive" is extremely low 

Funny coincidence


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

Naira, that is funny, because my Jack Russell, who are BRED to go to ground....hunt rodents! had absolutely NO interest in critters. We held up a hamster and tried to tease him with it and get him interested...nope! We had a gopher hole in the front yard and I WANTED him to get it. The only interest he showed is when I told him there was a ball in the hole! lol


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

This is the day I brought my puppies home. This is Matisse. He fetched the first day. My daughter was here and she "taught" him. Actually, she just got him started and he was fetching within about 10 minutes. He's not obsessed in the least though. Jose`, my Chihuahua is a very good retriever...better than my Lab ever was. LOL. Go figure. But neither is obsessed at all. Jose` tires of it after about 15 throws across the livingroom. Maurice will fetch but not very well. I haven't really worked on it. He'll go get it but only come back a foot or two and then lie down and chew on it. It would take some work for him, where as Matisse and Jose` bring it right back to me. 

It can definitely be taught. I wouldn't over do it though for fear of it becoming a weird obsession. But I don't really know if that's what causes that or if it's something physiological...like something with the synapses in the brain that makes dogs develop these ocd behaviors.

Here's a Kiko pup video: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Nm4goEuBt4


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## snmim (Sep 7, 2015)

Poodlebeguiled said:


> This is the day I brought my puppies home. This is Matisse. He fetched the first day. My daughter was here and she "taught" him. Actually, she just got him started and he was fetching within about 10 minutes. He's not obsessed in the least though. Jose`, my Chihuahua is a very good retriever...better than my Lab ever was. LOL. Go figure. But neither is obsessed at all. Jose` tires of it after about 15 throws across the livingroom. Maurice will fetch but not very well. I haven't really worked on it. He'll go get it but only come back a foot or two and then lie down and chew on it. It would take some work for him, where as Matisse and Jose` bring it right back to me.
> 
> It can definitely be taught. I wouldn't over do it though for fear of it becoming a weird obsession. But I don't really know if that's what causes that or if it's something physiological...like something with the synapses in the brain that makes dogs develop these ocd behaviors.
> 
> ...




Thank you, I have watched that video multiple times. She did all the steps up until the part where she has to "touch" the item with my hand. It never transitions to throwing it away and bringing it back to me. I really don't think she will become "ball obsessed" if I teach her a retrieve. If she doesn't like a game of fetch, I can understand that. But what about teaching her how to retrieve an item for me? Like, bring me those shoes, bring me the keys, bring me that etc. Hell, there are service dogs that are actually TAUGHT to cuddle. Even if you don't like it, you can begin to appreciate it once you're taught. I'll try again today, we just went on a very successful off leash walk accompanied with some chicken. She was 100% focused on me and no squirrels!

Thank you everyone else for your replies, I appreciate the response. It may be true that she'll perhaps be more interested as she matures. But, she is such a smart girl who knows many commands already I am determined to teach a retrieve. Must be in her instinct somewhere.


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

If the game is worth it to her, she'll get onto it. I'll try to see if I can write something better later but I'm off to the vet's for Matisse's laser treatment. Anyhow, break things down into tiny, baby steps...make it easy for her to succeed. Ie: don't throw the item more than a foot or two away from you. If she makes the tiniest approximation of what you're looking for, click and treat. Then up the ante a little more. Be sure you use something she values highly for the smallest steps in the right direction.


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## hopetocurl (Jan 8, 2014)

I taught Willow to bring me the ball. I just started my rolling the ball on the ground a few feet...she's run over to it and pick it up. Then, I'd try to take the ball from her... she'd resist and I'd offer her a treat and the command, "Give me the ball." Then, she'd bring it back and tease me with it... so I'd wave the treat... she'd drop the ball and I'd pick it up, give her the treat and throw it. After a day or so, she figured it out... and she'd bring the ball to me for a treat. Maybe you are teaching her backwards?


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

Both of my dogs have a high prey drive, and I don't recall that we had to teach them at all, but they do have preferences. Blue loves to play fetch with a squeaky tennis ball in the house, but he ignores a ball outside. Jazz can't be bothered with a ball anywhere. Both of them, though, will catch and return a Frisbee over and over. Maybe your girl would like a Frisbee better than a ball.


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## hkb (Oct 12, 2014)

ericwd9 said:


> AS long as, the dog does not snatch the ball with TEETH from one who holds it. I have seen "ball mania" cause a few problems in my experience.
> So long as you can take the ball away without problems all is fine. A bit of resource guarding comes in here. Take care and correct where needed.
> Eric:angel2:


You don't get a chance to hold it - he snatches as soon as you make a move towards the ball lying on the ground, dances a couple of steps back, looks up at you and then drops the ball invitingly near you again.

When you are allowed to pick the ball up - you'll get barked at if you don't throw it fast enough, or you'll get paws on your legs letting you know that he's there an waiting, or a cold nose shoving your hand.

In the 4 years we've had Smudge he has never bitten anyone - including when he is surrounded by nephews and nieces (4 at once from my cousin - his first encounter with them he was 14 weeks and they were aged between 3 and 9, and 3 from my brother - he'll stand patiently while my niece brushes him better than for me!). As soon as his mouth/teeth touch skin he either licks or backs off.

When playing rough with him, I've been nipped once on my arm when he misjudged how loose my sleeve was - I yelped loudly and he dropped and belly crawled to me looking so ashamed.


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## snmim (Sep 7, 2015)

*One small step for Mira, One giant leap for a retrieve*

We've had a breakthrough! A very _tiny_ breakthrough, but still a very crucial one that'll help aid in a proper retrieve! 

I started all over from the beginning given that maybe she wasn't getting it, hence the cuddling act. I had her take it, and then I very quickly placed my hand under her bottom jaw from dropping the item. She caught on very quickly. I think I was getting frustrated over the months, and instead of starting in baby steps I was asking for too much too soon. She actually held the item until I released her, and did this with several different items including a ball :dance2:

She is taking the item from my hand, holding it, and then dropping it once I release. In the future I'll transport the item from my hand, to the floor and have her take it from there. Then, I'll start to ask her to touch my hand once again, given that she now knows the "hold" command so she can give it to me. I'll start to move distances, and in a perfect world name the items. I have to remind myself to take *baby steps*. This isn't fetch, but maybe it can altered to it once she knows the "give" command? She does like going after a toy, so.. we'll see! :desire:

Here she is doing this with an antler chew, and a rather heavy himalayan chew.


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

Great work ! I'm sure you'll continue progressing. Sometimes we just have to accept that slow is the way to go !


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## Naira (Jan 9, 2015)

She is so stinking cute.


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCU3W8RGQ_M

Watch this. Have your dog watch this! lol. :alberteinstein:


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## mullyman (Oct 15, 2015)

I apologize beforehand for not reading through this entire thread to see what responses you have received. I just wanted to let you know how I taught my buddy here how to fetch. He was playing it full on before turning 3 months, and I had only had him about a week at that point. Even our vet was surprised that he was doing it so early.

Anyway, I didn't do any conventional training with the clicker or anything, although clicker training is the way I want to be training him to do various things. Fetching was a whole different ballgame for me....no pun intended.

What I did was I laid down on the floor with him while he was chewing on his little rope. I grabbed the end of it and did a little tug of war with him, not a whole lot, just enough to let him know I was in the game. Once I got the rope from him I kept it just out of his reach every time he would go for it. Then, I would drop it at arm's length, so I could reach it without moving if he didn't go for it (haha), then once he grabbed it I did the tug thing with him again. I got the rope away and dropped it at arm's length again, and again, and again, until he got the idea that once he grabbed it I was tugging on it for him again. Once I was sure that he was getting the picture I'd toss it just a bit further, enough that I could roll over and get it.....I'm lazy, don't want to move too much. I just kept playing that game with him tossing it further and further. Now, he's closing in on 5 months old and I can toss anything across the room and he'll run and get it and bring it back to me. I don't know if this is good or not, but when he would bring it back, I would let him do his own thing with it. If he wanted to chew on it, fine, chew on it. When he got bored with that he'd bring it to me and drop it. Literally within 30 seconds or so.

One thing I don't do is allow him to instigate the game with me. If he just brings me something out of nowhere and drops it in front of me I ignore it. I wait until he starts playing with it himself then I'll jump in. The other thing I do is finish the game when I want to finish, not when he wants to finish. Basically I give him 10 - 15 throws and that's it. I just want him to know that *I* am the boss here. We play when I say we play.
MULLY

BTW, the phrases I use in this game are "Go get it" "Go get your _____" and "Bring it to Daddy"....and of course a butt ton of "Good boy"s when he brings it back.


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## snmim (Sep 7, 2015)

I thought I'd give one last update on this. Mira is finally retrieving :angel: She's been doing so for about a week now. I'm very proud of our success. She is not ball obsessed in the slightest, I keep our sessions short rewarding with treats or a game of tug. Perhaps when she matures and there are less interesting things in her life we can play a real game of fetch with a ball outside, but I am quite content on how she is retrieving various items anyhow. She even picks up plastic bags and envelopes and carries them when I go to another room!

Here's a video, please do not feel inclined to watch it as it is rather long and boring.. But here she is retrieving a foam toy, chewy, antler bone, himalayan chew, ball, and a measuring cup! Click the picture to watch.
IMG_1972 by Mithy M, on Flickr

Here I am proofing the "hold". She picks up an item, sits, shakes her paw, then gives it to me.
IMG_1977 by Mithy M, on Flickr

So there you go, if anyone has a dog that doesn't play fetch, they can certainly learn. As you can see, Mira's getting more and more excited about the game. Thank you to all who helped.


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## dogdragoness (Oct 18, 2015)

I feel you on that, I had a heck of a time teaching my boy how to fetch, it took him almost a year to get it lol. Its not that he was dumb are stubborn he just didn't have that much interest in it. 

What I finally ended up doing was taking our older dog who was a very dependable fetcher out with me and when he did not bring the ball back I would send her to go get it. I used his marker words for being a good boy on her, they did not mean anything to her, but they did mean something to him and it made him start using his mind as to how he could get praised so he started bringing the ball back. 

Now he brings it back 90% of the time and when he doesn't I give him a reminder and he goes back and gets it and brings it back.

I love doing this because it is hard for him since he does not enjoy it so he has to work his mind.


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## aasteapots (Oct 6, 2013)

Our Spoo LOVED to fetch but never a ball. We bought a chuck it but she had no interest. BUT if we took one of her other toys to the park and threw it she would fetch all day long. Coming to that realization was a blessing. I thought for sure she was "broken"  I mean really what dog doesn't like a game of fetch? It was just the ball. Not her cup of tea. On another note: Our Spoo would catch all day long but our Yorkipoo will watch things fall to the floor then pick them up be it food or toys. No matter how hard I tried to teach my little one to catch she won't have any part of it.


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

Awesome!!! Congrats! You did it so well!!!! She's adorbs.


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

Mithy, I have been following this thread with much interest because I am stuck at the "hold an object in mouth" stage. On a positive note, I have all three of my dogs at the same place, even the ever bouncing Jack Russell. On a less positive note, I don't seem to be progressing past this step. And for irony, my cat now retrieves items that he chooses... over and over. I have even thrown the darn toy on a sleeping dog (really, it was by accident!) The cat had no qualms about walking on the poodle to get the toy. I suspect that I am the weak link in the process, and that I have just not devoted enough time to the "pick it up" step. I have noted that the successful people are doing more than just verbal rewards, so I will up the ante. I get lazy because my guys respond so well to praise that I often forget they may need a bit more incentive for new tasks. Thank you for posting about this; all the answers have given me insight as to what I am not doing and most importantly what I need to do.


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## nifty (Aug 2, 2013)

Hooray for you and Mira! I tried to watch your video but for some reason it would not play when I clicked on it (just a still picture). HOWEVER, that focused look at the object is exactly what Dulcie does and so I predict that in time, you will have a very happy fetcher indoors and outdoors - with the game itself being self-rewarding.


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## dogdragoness (Oct 18, 2015)

I hope my next dog is a fetching fiend, because having a do with not much toy drive is a challenge LOL


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