# Puppy has two Hereditary Disorders



## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

I'm so sorry you are going through this. It sounds like you did everything you could. I hope she is able to recover from both conditions.

Health testing for patellas should be viewable on the OFA databases. Can you look up the names of her parents and see if they have testing listed? In the case of L-C-P disease, you are right there is no genetic test. The tests for it simply mark whether or not the parents have the condition. If they don't, they are marked clear. But that doesn't mean they don't potentially carry recessive genes for it.

L-C-P Disease is believed to have a genetic component, and patellar luxation certainly does, but the latter can be influenced by environment and growth to a degree. I doubt that a spay at 6 months would cause luxation at that level. It's true that early spay doesn't help orthopedic disorders, but this effect would be rather extreme.

I think the breeder needs to know about this. Did your puppy contract give any guarantee against inherited diseases? Many contracts offer some sort of guarantee, though what happens in the case of disease can vary. Sometimes a breeder will compensate you up to the puppy's original price.


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## ShamrockPoodle (Jan 22, 2017)

Thank you so much Raindrops. I looked at the contract again. It states that the puppy has a two year guarantee for PRA(eyes) and Hip Dysplasia . She offers to replace the dog or give 50 percent of purchase price with vet verification. The dog must take NuVet vitamins for first two years or she will not consider that. Those must be miracle vitamins—the dogs don’t like them—I’m thinking I should take some myself lol ! She sent a six generation pedigree with OFA numbers for all. She also sent testing results for site and dam with results and numbers—same info I can pull up if I enter it. The sire and dam have been cleared for luxating patella and LCP. I am presuming that would have been vet xrays on hips and knees. She certainly provided me with all the information I could have asked for. I think the reason they are cleared for LCP would be that an X-ray was done to rule out hip dysplasia and if they had LCP it would have showed up on X-ray. I thought she was very professional at the time of purchase—and I did not anticipate having any problems at all. The puppy is just gorgeous and has a wonderful temperament. Anyhow—I love my little girl—would still have chosen her . The two poodles I have now are the first from show breeders. I have had poodles my whole life—rescues, home breeders, etc. I guess I’ve just lucked out. My minis always had some sort of patella issue—but not this severe. The last little old guy my daughter adopted would suddenly go from 4 to 3 legs for a couple of yards—then amazingly and quickly kick the leg to the back and straighten it out! I will post more later with pictures of both poodles . I could do a whole separate thread on my male poodle—he is a handful and quite the character! Thank you!


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## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

ShamrockPoodle said:


> Thank you so much Raindrops. I looked at the contract again. It states that the puppy has a two year guarantee for PRA(eyes) and Hip Dysplasia . She offers to replace the dog or give 50 percent of purchase price with vet verification. The dog must take NuVet vitamins for first two years or she will not consider that. Those must be miracle vitamins—the dogs don’t like them—I’m thinking I should take some myself lol ! She sent a six generation pedigree with OFA numbers for all. She also sent testing results for site and dam with results and numbers—same info I can pull up if I enter it. The sire and dam have been cleared for luxating patella and LCP. I am presuming that would have been vet xrays on hips and knees. She certainly provided me with all the information I could have asked for. I think the reason they are cleared for LCP would be that an X-ray was done to rule out hip dysplasia and if they had LCP it would have showed up on X-ray. I thought she was very professional at the time of purchase—and I did not anticipate having any problems at all. The puppy is just gorgeous and has a wonderful temperament. Anyhow—I love my little girl—would still have chosen her . The two poodles I have now are the first from show breeders. I have had poodles my whole life—rescues, home breeders, etc. I guess I’ve just lucked out. My minis always had some sort of patella issue—but not this severe. The last little old guy my daughter adopted would suddenly go from 4 to 3 legs for a couple of yards—then amazingly and quickly kick the leg to the back and straighten it out! I will post more later with pictures of both poodles . I could do a whole separate thread on my male poodle—he is a handful and quite the character! Thank you!


Hmm that is odd that she only covers hip dysplasia and PRA. Hopefully that's not because she's had past issues with these same health problems. It does sound like you may have just gotten very unlucky. I would certainly still notify the breeder even if she isn't under contract to compensate. Any good breeder would take an issue like this _very seriously _and would take it into account when deciding whether or not to keep breeding the parents. She should be grateful that you're letting her know about it.

I also shy away from breeders that seem heavily into NuVet supplements. They seem very gimmicky to me. But I don't really know anything about them. I certainly think it's weird to require them on the contract.

I'm sorry. I wish I had something encouraging to say. I do think your dog stands a good chance of full recovery given her age and the surgical options. I will say that $3000 seems high for FHO. I nearly rescued a dog (long story) in the past that needed a FHO and I was told if I got it done locally it would be around $2k. So you may find a less expensive option, especially if you inquire at veterinary schools.


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## ShamrockPoodle (Jan 22, 2017)

Thank you so much Raindrops. I think at some point I may just send her a note so she can be aware of it. It seems like a breeder would want to at least keep records to track disorders to try and prevent them in the future. The vitamin thing did seem strange—and I did ask the vet about it. There was a suggested vitamin for my male poodle that I got from another breeder—but it was not part of the contract—and you could buy it from whoever you wanted to without the breeder’s code. The cost of the surgery is high—a regular vet could do it cheaper. A board certified pretty well known and respected orthopedic vet from Auburn Veterinary School is the one I decided on—he comes to my town in Florida to do special surgeries a couple of days a week. A couple in my neighborhood used them for their very large yellow lab—and they were pleased. After talking with him—I decided that was the way to go. He has recommended two physical therapists that work with his patients and take directions from him. One I would have to drive 45 minutes to and the other makes house calls. Have been researching them online and plan on calling them soon! I’ll try to post about the experience .


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## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

ShamrockPoodle said:


> Thank you so much Raindrops. I think at some point I may just send her a note so she can be aware of it. It seems like a breeder would want to at least keep records to track disorders to try and prevent them in the future. The vitamin thing did seem strange—and I did ask the vet about it. There was a suggested vitamin for my male poodle that I got from another breeder—but it was not part of the contract—and you could buy it from whoever you wanted to without the breeder’s code. The cost of the surgery is high—a regular vet could do it cheaper. A board certified pretty well known and respected orthopedic vet from Auburn Veterinary School is the one I decided on—he comes to my town in Florida to do special surgeries a couple of days a week. A couple in my neighborhood used them for their very large yellow lab—and they were pleased. After talking with him—I decided that was the way to go. He has recommended two physical therapists that work with his patients and take directions from him. One I would have to drive 45 minutes to and the other makes house calls. Have been researching them online and plan on calling them soon! I’ll try to post about the experience .


It sounds like you've done your homework and it sounds like a good plan to have a successful surgery. It will take some time for recovery but I'm sure she'll be feelings loads better. Do keep us updated!


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

My mini mix Gracie had an FHO. If you have any questions about recovery, or ever need some support, I'm here!

Hope the first surgery and physical therapy go smoothly. Thinking good thoughts for you and your girl.


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## ShamrockPoodle (Jan 22, 2017)

Thank you so much Peggy the Parti! I am glad to have you all for support!!!


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## ShamrockPoodle (Jan 22, 2017)




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## ShamrockPoodle (Jan 22, 2017)

This is my little princess Toula!!!


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## poodlelove01 (Sep 14, 2019)

She’s so pretty! I don’t have any experience with this, but if you haven’t already I would contact the breeder. It can’t hurt. I’m so sorry you and your puppy are going through this. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

What a sweetheart! Tell her that Peggy is rooting for her.


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## Vee (Mar 2, 2018)

What a pretty girl! Sorry to hear this! Breeders don’t test for it here which is a big worry


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

I'm so sorry to hear that you and your lovely girl are going thru this. There is the Poodle Health Registry that you can also check, but it's only as helpful as the information provided by owners and breeders. Fyi, I've tried to register several times and don't receive the confirmation email. I keep forgetting to use the back up procedure listed.


Poodle Health Registry


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## Mufar42 (Jan 1, 2017)

Sorry you are going thru this with your poodle. Even with all the tests being done these things can happen. I would definitely let the breeder know and I would also let her know that it will be treated. If she is a reputable breeder she would definitely want to know when such thing crop up in her lines. My neighbor has a year and half old yorker, at 1 year she was diagnosed with two grade 4 lactating patellas and has had surgery and PT, she has recovered well.


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## twyla (Apr 28, 2010)

There are only orthopedic exams for Leggs Perth and Luxating Patellas for the parents.
Toys are more likely despite good breeding have patella issues and can damage their knees like an athlete, my girl girl had bi-lateral luxating patellas but she had crap knees from the go as a puppy.


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## Dogs4Life (May 27, 2018)

What a beautiful girl. I am so happy to hear she is in such a loving home, and I am so sorry to hear you are going through this. I hope that her treatment and recovery goes well.

I hope the breeder will help with expenses, and not breed one or both of these dogs again.


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## Dogs4Life (May 27, 2018)

double post


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## Dogs4Life (May 27, 2018)

.


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## twyla (Apr 28, 2010)

also there were no Physio therapists near me, so I did it myself with strengthening exercises and since my girl is little swimming in a tub


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## Eclipse (Apr 26, 2010)

You should ABSOLUTELY let the breeder know ASAP. If they are as responsible as you say they are, they will want to know that a dog they bred has such serious and debilitating issues and consider how that should affect their future breeding plans. I don't know if the breeder owns both the bitch and the stud, but if she used an outside dog, she should also let the stud owner know. You should also report these issues in the Poodle Health Registry so others doing their health checking in future can see what breeders/kennels have produced what issues and can be informed when speaking to a breeder. Health issues can crop up, even in dogs that come from generations of health tested lines, but it is how the breeder responds to it that is important. If you didn't have the money to have surgery, this dog would be crippled for life from a young age.


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## ShamrockPoodle (Jan 22, 2017)

Yes-thank you Eclipse. I am thinking I should let her know. Hopefully it will be well received. I believe she owns the dam—I think I have seen the sire used by one or two other breeders in the past—or featured on another breeders website for a period of time. Since I am not asking her for anything and just reporting it-hopefully she will document it and do further research.


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## ShamrockPoodle (Jan 22, 2017)

Thank you all for your posts and encouragement. The physical therapy will be an important element in her recovery from this surgery. That is funny you mentioned the bathtub water therapy Twyla. We have a garden tub that I think is deep enough—with a life jacket that has a handle perhaps. If I end up using the visiting therapist-I will ask about that!


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## twyla (Apr 28, 2010)

Life jacket is key, I did all kinds strengthening exercise to help re built the knees muscles, low levels agility dog jumps are good, they just need to be tall enough to make your dog lift her leg up and over 3" is what I used for my 10" toy Beatrice who also is a Cafe au lait


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

ShamrockPoodle said:


> Yes-thank you Eclipse. I am thinking I should let her know. Hopefully it will be well received. I believe she owns the dam—I think I have seen the sire used by one or two other breeders in the past—or featured on another breeders website for a period of time. Since I am not asking her for anything and just reporting it-hopefully she will document it and do further research.


How the breeder receives this will speak volumes about her commitment to the welfare of the breed, and her ethics. A reputable breeder would welcome this information so they can make informed decisions on future breedings. If it’s not well received, that’s a huge red flag....I would wonder about the accuracy of the information in the pedigree, and what has been swept under the rug in the past.

She is a sweet looking girl, and lucky to be with you! Let us know how it goes.


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