# Redlands Poodles



## broodizt (Oct 17, 2013)

Hello,
I am new here and am trying to find out if a breeder by the name of Redlands Poodles in Redlands CA. is a reputable breeder. Has anyone heard of them?
They are close to home so I thought I would investigate a little. I am thinking of adopting another fur baby, but I'm not sure when I will be ready, as I just lost my 5yo yorkie Muffin. I am devastated, and am not yet ready to adopt, but I am doing my homework, so when and if I am able or ready to adopt I will have all the info at hand. I am going through terrible grief. My baby Cassie, is another yorkie, and I know she will miss her sister a lot. Any info on this breeder would be so appreciated. Thank you,
Shellie


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

hi, i have no direct knowledge of the breeder you're interested in, but just popped over to the redlands site. it looks kind of iffy, but that's just my impression. a breeder in vista, ca, sharbelle, has received some very positive comments here. you may want to check them out. use the search function at pf to look up comments.

and very sorry to hear that you lost your yorkie. i had to put one of my dogs to sleep a few years ago and i know how you must feel.

best of luck.


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## broodizt (Oct 17, 2013)

patk said:


> hi, i have no direct knowledge of the breeder you're interested in, but just popped over to the redlands site. it looks kind of iffy, but that's just my impression. a breeder in vista, ca, sharbelle, has received some very positive comments here. you may want to check them out. use the search function at pf to look up comments.
> 
> and very sorry to hear that you lost your yorkie. i had to put one of my dogs to sleep a few years ago and i know how you must feel.
> 
> best of luck.


Thank you so much. I appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions. I will certainly check out Sharbelle in Vista. Thank you again.
Shellie


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Just going to copy and paste what I wrote on your introduction thread -

No health testing mentioned.

Breeding females that are too small (if you want a smaller poodle, the proper way to find a healthy one is to wait for one to pop up from a breeding of full sized parents from a reputable show breeder - it does happen, but you may have to have a little patience - that is exactly what I am waiting for right now)~ In fact it appears that the focus of their breeding is small size, and color, which is not the most responsible thing to do.

Their home page says "AKC Champion Poodles", but not a single champion listed, and frankly, although not horrid, I don't believe that the dogs pictured have conformation good enough for the show ring. Not saying that I am an expert in evaluating poodles, but this fact seems pretty obvious to me.


And lastly, their "starting at $2,000" is way overpriced - for that money you could fly out to pick up a puppy from my breeder, one of the top, or the top show breeders in the country every year, and still have change left over!

***And a big red flag from the "health guarantee" - "Toy puppy sold with an adult weight projected to be (4) four pounds or less, will be exempt from any health guarantee. Tiny toys and tea cups are very fragile and require special care. We are unable to provide the warranty on a puppy to small in size. "


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## fuzzymom (Sep 19, 2013)

I found this about what makes an ethical breeder. It's long, but worth reading:

How do you define a ‘Breeder’? I will use the extremes to compare here: a ‘Breeder’ is a person for whom it is more important to perform a specific breeding of one special ‘right’ dog to a specific bitch, rather than a person who will breed any male of the same breed to their bitch in order to produce puppies. A Breeder doesn’t breed at a specific time of year for better puppy sales. A Breeder breeds for him or her self, because they are breeding to an ideal and not the "market". A Breeder may hold onto the puppies for longer than 8 weeks so that they are certain they have made the right ‘pick’ of which puppy to keep or to sell as a show dog, and by definition as a breeding animal. 
A Breeder goes through absolutely hellacious torment every time a puppy is shipped by air. A Breeder makes you justify just why you think you deserve a puppy. On the other hand, a non-breeder, in the case of the worst puppy mills, breeds any dog which looks like it may belong a certain breed to whatever specimen of the same breed they can pick up. A non- breeder doesn’t choose the ‘best’ male for a given female. A non-breeder ‘lets nature take its course’ rather than doing everything within their power to ensure that the mother and the father, and eventually the puppies, are healthy, so that the breeding will be successful, so that it won’t seriously affect the health of the mother, and so that the puppies will be robust and healthy. A Breeder will perform all necessary tests to ensure that the mother and father of a litter are genetically healthy, and free of inheritable diseases to the best of their ability to check. 
A Breeder will only register puppies with the correct pedigree. A puppy mill will use any set of ‘papers’ they can get their hands on, and which may not actually be the true pedigrees of the sire and dam. A Breeder will stay awake and with the litter for as many 24-hour days as are necessary to insure that no puppy is lost to ‘fading puppy syndrome’, or is squashed or misplaced by the new mother. A non-breeder will ‘let nature take its course’ - again.
A Breeder will handle every puppy several times every day, and help supplement the puppies feeding if necessary to save excessive drain on the dam. A Breeder will chart daily weights on the puppies, and identify each puppy in some way, so that they can keep track of each puppy’s rate of gain, so a puppy which is falling behind the others can be supplemented.
A Breeder will give the expectant mother Breyers Ice Cream, or pickles and peanut butter, if they are requested, and will sleep with her on their pillow, to reassure her she is special. A Breeder will stay home from work for as many days as necessary, in order to whelp the litter, help the bitch, and get the puppies off to a good start. A Breeder will supply the mother with a whelping box which keeps the mother and the puppies comfortable, and gives them a feeling of protection and safety. If the bitch chooses, however, she is allowed to begin the whelping process on the Breeder’s own bed, and to move to the whelping box once anxiety cools and the bitch is ready to keep at her job in another location. A puppy mill simply ‘harvests’ the puppies from wire bottomed cages like rabbit hutches when they appear to be about the age of consent for the airlines. 
A Breeder will skillfully interview all applicants for adoption, and will provide the new puppy owners with a healthy, well adjusted, well vaccinated and wormed puppy. I know I could go on about this for a couple more pages, but the impression I want to give, is that breeding a litter and whelping and raising and placing puppies entails tremendous sustained effort, education, money and a good knowledge of applied genetics. It is anything but a casual undertaking. A breeding undertaken without this kind of effort may produce healthy, sound puppies, or it may not. One has no way of predicting, since the deck wasn’t ‘loaded’’ as good Breeders try to arrange it. 
After selling the puppy, a good Breeder will follow up with all needed assistance to the new owner. A Breeder will be prepared to take a puppy or adult dog back into their own home if needed - for whatever reason. This means that a good Breeder must be able to provide for an extra dog or two at a moments notice, and inconvenience isn’t an admissible excuse. A good Breeder considers him or herself the "parent" of a puppy from birth to grave. The responsibility for bringing new puppies into the world includes making certain, to the extent possible, that these puppies will go on to have happy lives, and never become homeless. All contracts for puppy sales must include that any transfer should occur through the breeder, or be approved by the breeder. 
The bumper sticker proclaims that "A Puppy is for Life", and that’s true, for both the buyer and the breeder. While ‘back yard breeders’ may not be guilty of the sins of puppy mills, neither are they, by definition, cognizant of the procedures and efforts necessary to earn the title ‘Breeder’. 


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## fuzzymom (Sep 19, 2013)

Also things to watch out for in unethical breeders:

The "breeder" does not belong to any AKC recognized Poodle clubs and/or all-breed clubs. Club members follow a club's code of ethics. Backyard breeders and puppy mills are not bound by these rules.

The "breeder" produces many litters per year and almost always has puppies available because it is a source of income that they depend on.

The "breeder" breeds more than one variety along with parti-colors, phantoms, royals, teacups and possibly even "designer" mixed breeds.

The "breeder" lists "champion lines" but a closer look shows only champions far back in the pedigree.

The "breeder" takes credit cards or PayPal. Reputable breeders don't produce enough puppies to warrant credit cards or PayPal accounts.

The "breeder" allows and may even encourage the buyer to choose a puppy from a picture on the Internet on a first come/first served basis.

The "breeder" does not include their dogs' AKC registration names so that you can access their health reports on http://www.offa.org

The "breeder" does not require a spay/neuter agreement in their contract for companion animals and often will just charge extra for a dog that can be used for breeding.

The "breeder" makes exaggerated claims about their dogs, and their breeding practices.

The "breeder's" dogs are seldom, if ever, shown and finished in AKC shows. Reputable breeders want to put championships on their dogs to validate their quality according to the breed standard.





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## broodizt (Oct 17, 2013)

fuzzymom said:


> I found this about what makes an ethical breeder. It's long, but worth reading:
> 
> How do you define a ‘Breeder’? I will use the extremes to compare here: a ‘Breeder’ is a person for whom it is more important to perform a specific breeding of one special ‘right’ dog to a specific bitch, rather than a person who will breed any male of the same breed to their bitch in order to produce puppies. A Breeder doesn’t breed at a specific time of year for better puppy sales. A Breeder breeds for him or her self, because they are breeding to an ideal and not the "market". A Breeder may hold onto the puppies for longer than 8 weeks so that they are certain they have made the right ‘pick’ of which puppy to keep or to sell as a show dog, and by definition as a breeding animal.
> A Breeder goes through absolutely hellacious torment every time a puppy is shipped by air. A Breeder makes you justify just why you think you deserve a puppy. On the other hand, a non-breeder, in the case of the worst puppy mills, breeds any dog which looks like it may belong a certain breed to whatever specimen of the same breed they can pick up. A non- breeder doesn’t choose the ‘best’ male for a given female. A non-breeder ‘lets nature take its course’ rather than doing everything within their power to ensure that the mother and the father, and eventually the puppies, are healthy, so that the breeding will be successful, so that it won’t seriously affect the health of the mother, and so that the puppies will be robust and healthy. A Breeder will perform all necessary tests to ensure that the mother and father of a litter are genetically healthy, and free of inheritable diseases to the best of their ability to check.
> ...


What a fantastic post!!!:adore:


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## spindledreams (Aug 7, 2012)

> The "breeder's" dogs are seldom, if ever, shown and finished in AKC shows. Reputable breeders want to put championships on their dogs to validate their quality according to the breed standard.


Umm can you change that to say AKC, UKC, Canadian Kennel Club or appropriate registry for their area.


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## fuzzymom (Sep 19, 2013)

spindledreams said:


> Umm can you change that to say AKC, UKC, Canadian Kennel Club or appropriate registry for their area.


I found this article on another breeders website. It was written by a veterinarian, not me, but yes I think we can infer that the reputable registry for your particular area can be added. 


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## spindledreams (Aug 7, 2012)

Not every good breeder will show in conformation but I do think they should have standards for evaluating their stock before breeding and proof from others that their stock meets that standard. Hunting title, obedience, rally or agility titles etc would be just as acceptable to me if I was looking for a dog to use in any of those venues but not necessarily in conformation. I like my breeders requirement that her dogs have at least a championship in UKC AND a novice title in a performance event.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

spindledreams said:


> Not every good breeder will show in conformation but I do think they should have standards for evaluating their stock before breeding and proof from others that their stock meets that standard. Hunting title, obedience, rally or agility titles etc would be just as acceptable to me if I was looking for a dog to use in any of those venues but not necessarily in conformation. I like my breeders requirement that her dogs have at least a championship in UKC AND a novice title in a performance event.


There should be at least one reason for breeding - other then profit!


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## poodlecrazy#1 (Jul 2, 2013)

I contacted this breeder through email when I was searching for my Tpoo Branna. I can't remember all of her response, but I do remember her answer to my question about health testing. She said that all the testing they do on their dogs is on the website and to go to the website for my questions. She did not answer any questions I had other than what puppies were available and the pricing on them. Obviously there is no info on health testing anywhere in the website, so I just took it as a big red flag and took this breeder off my list. 


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## Caniche (Jun 10, 2013)

I'd look at Sharbelle too. I've heard good things about them.


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