# How to Answer, "Why didn't you get a rescue dog?!"



## o0Melanie0o (Aug 4, 2014)

People are serious about their rescue dogs. We have cats (one purebred and one rescue) and we are in the process of finding a spoo within the next 3-6 months. Anyway, I KNOW that people are going to say something about getting a pure bred. Soo...

1-How do you deal with that question?

2-How do you respond to people when they ask you how much you spent on your spoo? How do you delicately say, "it's not your business" 

TIA


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## Lori G (Sep 19, 2014)

Oh! I am so glad you brought this up! Like you, we are planning to get a poodle in the next 6-9 months and we have family and friends that are very seriously involved in rescue programs. I am dreading their comments! I look forward to this discussion!


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## nifty (Aug 2, 2013)

My approach to this sort of rudeness (that's what I think questions like these are) is to let the questioner know how surprised I am at their breach of boundaries (you are right, it IS none of their business).

First response: "I beg your pardon?!"

If they persist: "What makes you ask something like that?"

It's very difficult to hang on and not react to this sort of judgmental or rude questoning, but I try very hard to remember -- do not justify, defend or explain. None of us owes anyone else an explanation for our decisions.

If there is still a persistence -- and/or a lecture on the importance of animal rescue, etc - then I would just say "Interesting. Excuse me>" and get busy with something else.

As for the question about how much was paid for a poodle, I think I would flash them a shocked look, again say "Pardon?!" and if they persist, I would probably say, "I can't believe you asked that question!" then I would move away and get busy at something else. Let the awkwardness stay with the rude inquisitor. It is not rude to walk away from such a boundary-crossing inquisition--- the person asking those kinds of questions has already done the rude damage.


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## Naira (Jan 9, 2015)

*How to Answer, &quot;Why didn't you get a rescue dog?!&quot;*

People will never be happy........ And your explanations will never be good enough for them....... 

Rescue dogs aren't for everyone. By supporting reputable breeders you are not contributing to the problem. Why? A reputable breeder will always, always, always take their dog back if extenuating circumstances presented. Your dog will not end up in a shelter or in a rescue. A good breeder is going to be enormously picky about who, if anyone, carries on their kennel name. Your dog improves the breed and does not contribute to the animal overpopulation problem. 

Vs a backyard breeding dog...most are not bred with care or thoughtfulness, good luck contacting the breeder for help or re homing with the breeder (probably have way too many dogs on their plate to deal with), these dogs are often sold, flipped and bred by more greedy breeders and puppy mills...which then contribute to the animal overpopulation. 

To be honest, if I had seen Naira in a shelter, I would have gotten her. But for my lifestyle I wanted a 100% standard poodle, and I didn't want her to get too big and I had some color preferences that I was willing to slide on. Also, I wanted a puppy. Not always easy to come across...but they are there. 

The short story for me was, I stopped caring what people think. I got a dog from a reputable breeder because I wanted up and that's good enough for me.


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

I don't know about the rescue question, but about how much I paid, I always answer the same way : it depends on the age of the dog, the reputation of the breeder and the quality of their dog. A puppy can go from 700$ to 900$ and up, an adult will be less (Just put in your numbers). 

It's an indirect answer but it's enough that they won't ask anymore. I never say how much I pay. If they were to ask more, which I doubt, I just say this is not information I share.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

why didn't you get a rescue dog: i woke up one morning and the idea was just there and i had to do it!

how much did you pay: that's something i may have to discuss with my dog if he/she stresses me out!


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## PoodlePossessed (Dec 8, 2015)

I would say: I have done my fair share of rescue, and still volunteer with our local shelter. This dog is ALL about me, and I am OK with that! 

It makes perfect sense to choose carefully since you are choosing a family member. I have loved my rescue dogs, but they can be complicated and unpredictable, both physically and mentally. That is not the ideal situation for many families. Just as not any dog could be a rescue dog or a therapy dog, not every dog is going to fit neatly into my lifestyle. Also, I have my other dogs to think about. I need a pup that is going to gel with them.

On top of feeling a need to apologize, I am surprised how many people assume that I am some kind of snob for having a poodle. That is one tired stereotype.


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## Coldbrew (Jun 17, 2015)

I'm able to use the hypo-allergenic reasoning a lot (which is true), as well as the fact that i looked for over a year for a spoo or non-shedding spoo mix at shelters within a 250 mile radius (also true). 

could I have waited until I found one at a shelter? yes. But who knows when that would have been!?!

as for how much I spent I always answer with: "much less than I should have for how perfect he is." which usually gets me an "awww" from the asker and ends probing questions into my personal finances. 

i do think the fact that i also have a 'rescue' dog makes those judgmental "adopt don't shop" people a little less critical of my situation.


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## Zhuhaibill (Jul 10, 2015)

I personally wouldn't give them any excuses because I don't think they deserve any and I shouldn't have to explain myself. 

I would start by saying that an "obnoxious question deserves and equally obnoxious answer" and say that I am an elitist with a straight face, and that "since I can trace my family lineage back 800 years I would want my dog to boast a stellar pedigree as well." Then I would ask, "And you, were you adopted from an orphanage?"

If they reply "yes" then the retort would be "then you probably will fit very nicely with a rescue dog" and if they say "no" then you can say, "there you are" and leave it at that. I bet they won't bring that matter up again.....but then again I've spent years perfecting my image as an Old Coot so I may be able to get away with remarks like this without losing friends.

Here in China it is common for people to ask how much something cost. Just a cultural thing...seems the more you spent the more face you have...I'm used to it now but it used to startle me in my first years over here. My usual reply when asked the cost of something is either "not much" or "a lot" depending on what kind of mood I'm in.


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## Viking Queen (Nov 12, 2014)

My reply is usually something like, "I have had many rescue dogs in my life....now it is time for me to have my dream dog...so here she is. I am so happy to have her." Then I walk away.

When asked about price I smile and say...Iris is priceless! Then I walk away. 

None of their D*** business for either question.


Go figure....some people have all the nerve ....

I AM lucky, I have my dream dog.

VQ


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

While I completely agree that where you get your dog is a personal decision, and no one else's business, I did consider a rescue when I first decided to get a dog - I even visited some. But I had done my research, and had a list of requirements: small, not a terrier, under 2 years old, safe with cats and children, no or minimal behavioural issues (I doubted my ability to cope), physically and emotionally healthy, and a couple more. Any dog like that in a UK rescue is reserved before they have done their statutory seven days... Once I decided that I really wanted a Papillon it was clear that the number of suitable rescue dogs was in single figures each year, with a dozen or more would be owners lining up for each one. And when it came to bringing home a second dog the need to ensure mutual compatibility was added to the list, plus the fact that I wanted a toy poodle...


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

It takes a specific kind of person to successfully "rescue" a dog or cat or horse or for that matter a child. Some are able to weather the bad behavior resulting from others mistakes or misconduct. Some are not. I have every respect for those who can. I can not and will not!
Eric


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## Sanic (Oct 22, 2015)

As others have said, it's none of their business. However, I have a family member who might confront me once she finds out that I'm getting a poodle from a breeder. I would be a bit nicer to her than I would a stranger but my answer would still be the same.


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## Poodlerunner (Jul 4, 2014)

nifty said:


> My approach to this sort of rudeness (that's what I think questions like these are) is to let the questioner know how surprised I am at their breach of boundaries (you are right, it IS none of their business).
> 
> First response: "I beg your pardon?!"
> 
> ...


This was really good advice. No need to justify your personal decisions.

pr


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## Poodlerunner (Jul 4, 2014)

If I had a family member or close friend that was devoted to rescue, I would feel the need to say something, just out of respect for them. I would hope that it would go something like this: ring ring: I am buying a purebred poodle from a breeder. I know how devoted you are to rescue work so I just wanted to reach out to you and let you know that this is what I decided to do. This in no way means I don't have the highest respect for what you are doing. Hugs.

I would hope the response would be: "Thank yo so much for the phone call. That was so nice of you to take my feelings into account" Hugs to you too... good luck!

pr


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## Indiana (Sep 11, 2011)

My answer would depend on who asked the question, and if they were genuinely interested or if they were just spouting the popular catchphrase of the day. I hate it when people take an opinion because it's what everyone else is saying. What would happen to dogs if no one bred carefully and thoughtfully anymore? Puppymills would take over. People love dogs, and they have to come from somewhere. You can contribute to rescues with your time or your money; it's as effective as taking a rescue dog. Only people close to me have asked how much I paid, and I told them; I have no issue with that.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

This is a very interesting thread! Thanks for posting.

I have never been directly asked the first question, but I did once have someone ask where I rescued Lily from. I replied that she was from a breeder, not a rescue. The person gave me a sort of nasty sneering look and walked away. If I felt inclined to answer the question as to why I didn't get a rescue dog my answer would be easy. I didn't want a pittie or pit mix. They account for almost all of the dogs in my local shelter.

My real reason for wanting poodles is to have reliable smart working performance dogs.

As to what I paid, nobody's business.


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## peppersb (Jun 5, 2011)

In this area, it is extremely difficult to find a rescue standard poodle who is healthy and does not have behavior issues. If you do happen to find such a dog, you can be quite sure that the are 10 other people who would love to have the dog. The demand for healthy, well-adjusted "rescue" standard poodles far exceeds the supply. I'm not sure if that is true everywhere, but it certainly is true in this area.

I also know a lot of people who are really in to rescue and I do respect that. At the dog park, I see some wonderful rescues (mostly mixed breed), but I also see some who sadly have all sorts of issues that were not apparent when the owner chose the dog from the shelter or rescue. I would just tell people that you wanted a poodle puppy and one that was healthy, well-bred and had been given a great start in life. And you might add that young healthy poodles are not generally available in rescue. (And if they are, there are more than enough families available to "rescue" them.)


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## marialydia (Nov 23, 2013)

Good answers to use in future!

I have been asked both questions, frequently. Like Naira, a "hypoallergenic" dog really suits me far better. But like Poodlerunner, I know some people ask because they also want reaffirmation for their rescue work...

Sometimes I've answered that I've had rescue dogs, and dogs from breeders, and this time I wanted a dog from a breeder. If they push it after that I get vague..."I dunno"...

Same thing with the cost, I generally "forget". Helps to have gray hair now, they actually are starting to believe me!


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## o0Melanie0o (Aug 4, 2014)

I love all of these great responses! 

I was thinking about it more last night and as to the cost questions, which you know people are curious, especially when they see what a beautiful dog you have, is to say something funny like, "More than your first car, I'm sure!" Cue laughing, then walk away. :laugh:

As for the breed rescue question I was definitely thinking about that too. But for us we really do need something so specific. We have two cats and two kids, so everyone getting along is of utmost importance. Oh and I cannot stand normal dog smell, so the dog has to have real hair, like me . And as someone else said, finding a well adjusted poodle in rescue is all but impossible!!! And having never owned a dog as an adult, some purebred rescues won't even place a dog with you!!! One other note, have you seen the dogs that go through purebred rescues, those are the puppy mill and BYB pups that have horrible confirmation and health issues anyway...

Also, someone mentioned that their local shelter is all pitt bull mixes, the same goes for AZ. Everything and I mean, EVERYTHING here is either pit, terrier or chihuahua mixed....Like three of my least favorite breeds...

Love this forum, everyone is so great and the discussions awesome :angel:


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## dogdragoness (Oct 18, 2015)

It would depend on who asked the question, if it was some random stranger, yeah ... no. someone I knew well, friend or family member, it would still depend on how they asked the question, LOL.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

lily cd re said:


> This is a very interesting thread! Thanks for posting.
> 
> I have never been directly asked the first question, but I did once have someone ask where I rescued Lily from. I replied that she was from a breeder, not a rescue. The person gave me a sort of nasty sneering look and walked away. If I felt inclined to answer the question as to why I didn't get a rescue dog my answer would be easy. I didn't want a pittie or pit mix. They account for almost all of the dogs in my local shelter.
> 
> ...



My experience has been similar to yours, and I would have the same choice of Pitties at my local shelter for large dogs, and for small dogs, I would have my choice of dumped seniors requiring 10-15 thousand dollars of vet care.
But if I were ever asked more directly why I did not rescue, my reply would be that since I could not find an appropriate dog for me in rescue, I did the next best thing - got my puppy from a responsible breeder, and say that if everyone took the time and trouble to determine what the perfect dog that they were certain that they could properly care for no matter how their life might change for the next 15 years or so was, then all of the rescues and shelters could shut down, there wouldn't be any need for them. And when that happened, all dog lovers such as US would all have to go to responsible breeders to find our dogs. Then I might say "Pardon me, I have to go now, my 13 year old dog has her Cardiologist appointment.
And around here, people really don't ask price - they pay 2-3 times the cost of a responsibly bred dog for their impulse bought mill puppies from local pet shops.


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

I guess all but 4 of mine were rescues. Pierre, Tiny and Cayenne came form excellent breeders, but I got all but Pierre at a great price. One had to many per zoning, the other was from a vet and to small to breed. Shotsie her owner passed away. The theperson she left him to and 18,000.00 did not want a poodle. The other 3 were BYB and my intention when I met them was to take those dogs out of there and not at the price they wanted, or we would have had a problem, so I got them cheap, or I was calling the police. They were happy to take my money, and 2500.00 in one day of my money later and 3 months, they were in great shape. So I tell people what I paid and I help them find dogs such as these, I negotiate for the new owner.


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

I have it easy. I just tell people that when the neighbors Pitt Bull killed my chihuahua and I got chewed up in the process, that the Pitt's owner said he would buy the puppy of our choice because he didn't want us to sue. So I found the most expensive puppy I could find and ended up with my Misha.


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## mom2Zoe (Jun 17, 2014)

I can answer question two although I have a toy. 

When people ask me how much I spent on Zoe I am always honest.
I simply answer 1,200 which is way too much for irresponsible breeding. ( (petshop) I use it as an opportunity to educate which I wish I"d have been given.


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

A problem I have found a lot of non dog educated people have is: They think all dog breeds are just dogs. Your pedigree carefully bred poodle who rarely needs veterinary care is just another dog. Why not rescue a rejected mix with health and behavioral problems? It's a no-brainer. While I have the greatest respect for those who rescue often at great expense, I have helped train rescue dogs (pro-bono) It is a long process and wearing on the rescuer.
Eric


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## mamalion (Aug 8, 2014)

I have never been asked the question in a hostile way. When I am asked, I explain that people have different ideas about what a dog is. That is why there are so many different types of dogs. If they persist, I say that I have a different idea about dogs. I like my dogs small, pretty, and smart.


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## aasteapots (Oct 6, 2013)

I always get asked where I rescued my dogs from. When I say they are from a breeder I get a lot of annoyed reactions. So my retort is always this. "I adopted two children. How many have you adopted?" That usually shuts them right the He** up!!!


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

aasteapots said:


> I always get asked where I rescued my dogs from. When I say they are from a breeder I get a lot of annoyed reactions. So my retort is always this. "I adopted two children. How many have you adopted?" That usually shuts them right the He** up!!!


just watch out you don't get asked by some of those folks to adopt their kids, too! :laugh:


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## aasteapots (Oct 6, 2013)

patk said:


> just watch out you don't get asked by some of those folks to adopt their kids, too! :laugh:


I think my reply would be..."Thanks for the offer but we are full!" :lol:


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## zooeysmom (Jan 3, 2014)

*1-How do you deal with that question? *

I've always rescued dogs and not one person asked me why I didn't rescue Maizie. I haven't gotten any negative judgment.

*2-How do you respond to people when they ask you how much you spent on your spoo? How do you delicately say, "it's not your business"  *

Well, it depends on who asks. If it's someone interested in getting a Spoo, I tell them. But if it's someone at, say, the dog park, I'll say something like, "Well, I would have paid a million dollars, but she cost much less." I think it's extremely tacky for people to ask, but sometimes they do.


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## AutumnLover (Oct 13, 2015)

Great responses everyone! I typically use the I wanted to support a quality breeder answer in addition to just being honest about being picky about dog behavior/training and wanting a puppy.

My other pet peeve statement I have gotten variations from a few friends is "You must have gotten a poodle cause she's hypoallergenic". While that is a true statement, I normally have to hold my tongue about how much more to the breed there is than just being hypoallerengic dog. I totally understand those of you who use the excuse (or need this characteristic), but some people really have trouble seeing past the hype about non-shedding/reduced allergies to the other great characteristics that make poodles great pets. I typically just tell them that "its a great bonus, that I just love the breed" and move on.


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## Raven's Mom (Mar 18, 2014)

I like Peppersb could not find a spoo in rescue in my area. While I am thrilled with Raven now, I was dead set AGAINST getting a puppy at the time. I just had no other way to get a spoo. Like others mentioned Pitts/pit crosses abound in our area even though they are illegal to own in a neighboring city they are everywhere!


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## Sanic (Oct 22, 2015)

This is slightly off topic but it still involves people being rude haha.

People that know I'm getting a pup from a breeder actually have more of a problem with the fact that I'm getting a poodle. I've had people ask me why, tell me poodles are mean, and straight up tell me to get another breed (he said "don't get a poodle, get a great dane").

My circle of acquaintances has become smaller and I don't mind at all


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## Countryboy (May 16, 2011)

Look at them in disgust and say; A Rescue? Like... one that sheds?? Hair in the house??!! Ewwwwwww!!! How can you stand that?

At that point it's them that are on the defensive.


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## Granberry (Nov 17, 2014)

I think rescuing a dog is an honorable and wonderful thing to do, and I think I'd just respond like that. Then I'd tell them the true reason, which for me is basically that I just couldn't resist the face of a little puppy, and since this may be my last dog, I decided to get one from a breeder who does health testing so hopefully he/she'd live a long happy life.

As for price, I'd just tell them. People are interested. Heck, I'm interested. I always have to bite my tongue when I see people with new puppies! 

I don't think it's nice manners to compare the adoption of children from an orphanage or anywhere to the adoption of a rescue dog. Children from an orphanage are not "poorly bred" or inferior in any way; they're as precious of a gift from God as any prince or princess.


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## hopetocurl (Jan 8, 2014)

I was asked both. I responded with, "I wanted a toy poodle. I need a puppy to bond with." And, "She is worth a million to me."


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## Viking Queen (Nov 12, 2014)

Countryboy said:


> Look at them in disgust and say; A Rescue? Like... one that sheds?? Hair in the house??!! Ewwwwwww!!! How can you stand that?
> 
> At that point it's them that are on the defensive.


Brilliant! I will remember that one for sure! Thanks! VA


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## West U (Jul 30, 2014)

All animals and dogs need homes. We have given homes to successfull show dogs, our cat age 14 was from a feral litter, humane socety dogs, etc. Etc. Does it matter? If they are alive they need homes. I do have a problem when the wellmeaning person says "I want to have some puppies". Unfortunately those innocents lives will need homes too.


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## Bizzeemamanj (Apr 14, 2014)

I've only been asked one or two times. I simply explain that I wasn't a great candidate to rescue due to my lack of experience owning a dog. I greatly admire people who rescue, but I recognize I'm much too uptight to succeed in that scenario. I need as much control over a situation as I can get, and I can't imagine adding a dog to my family that came with so many unknowns. Going with a good reputable breed and a good reputable breeder allows you to control so many variables.

As for price, I have been asked that one! I always say - about what you would expect to pay for a pure bred dog from a small reputable breeder.  And he was worth every penny (and more).


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## aasteapots (Oct 6, 2013)

Granberry said:


> I think rescuing a dog is an honorable and wonderful thing to do, and I think I'd just respond like that. Then I'd tell them the true reason, which for me is basically that I just couldn't resist the face of a little puppy, and since this may be my last dog, I decided to get one from a breeder who does health testing so hopefully he/she'd live a long happy life.
> 
> As for price, I'd just tell them. People are interested. Heck, I'm interested. I always have to bite my tongue when I see people with new puppies!
> 
> I don't think it's nice manners to compare the adoption of children from an orphanage or anywhere to the adoption of a rescue dog. Children from an orphanage are not "poorly bred" or inferior in any way; they're as precious of a gift from God as any prince or princess.


The comparison is not between a child and a rescue dog. People who question you as to adopting/rescuing a dog are usually asking because they are on a soap box. If they want to be so high and mighty about saving the world they may want to look within themselves first. People in glass houses and so forth.


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

I've never come across anyone who asked me why I didn't rescue. I have run across people who are sure to let me know they rescued a dog, being so proud... and that's fine. It is _indeed_ an admirable thing to do. But if someone were nosy enough to ask me_ why _I didn't rescue, I think I'd say something about my feeling compelled to keep well bred purebred dogs from going extinct. (because that's what would happen if _all _anyone ever did was rescue sterilized dogs...we'd lose all our distinct and various breeds and in time, all dogs) I think there's a place for both rescuing and purchasing from reputable breeders. 

As far as how much the dogs cost, I have been asked that a few times and I had the feeling that they weren't trying to delve into my financial situation, which, in_ would_ be tacky and rude. I had the feeling they were genuinely interested and curious about what a good purebred dog runs. Perhaps they're thinking about purchasing a dog from a reputable breeder. So, being that it's most likely being asked for information purposes, I have no objection to telling them and also informing them that most well bred purebred dogs will run about the same in a given area. And I explain why if they seem to be wanting to discuss the matter more. Often they are just curious and interested. I have no problem with that.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

West U said:


> All animals and dogs need homes. We have given homes to successfull show dogs, our cat age 14 was from a feral litter, humane socety dogs, etc. Etc. Does it matter? If they are alive they need homes. I do have a problem when the wellmeaning person says "I want to have some puppies". Unfortunately those innocents lives will need homes too.


Yeah it bothers me too when people say "but I just want her to have one litter!" Do they have a clue what they are doing? Do they have homes lined up for those puppies or will they end up in rescue? I know someone with a nice girl who has a GCh title and performance titles. She keeps talking about wanting one litter, why, just why? She has no intention of a serious breeding program.


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## mamalion (Aug 8, 2014)

Dear Lily, I usuallly agree with what you write, but I am surprised that you are resistant to someone breeding a well-titled dog. 

I guess one of the issues is the size of the litter. A spoo litter of 10 has a different imprint than a toy litter of 2, where one is kept. Even so, I don't have a problem with someone responsibly breeding a litter. If the dog is a champion in a competitve venue and has performance degrees, if the owner has carefully studied and consulted with others, if the parents had genetic testing, I think breeding a litter is okay, a counter-balance to the ubiquitous pitbulls. Also breeding and raising a litter carefully is part of learning about purebred dogs, the breed, and training for performance. How does one know if one wants to be a breeder. if one never has a litter?


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

mamalion said:


> Dear Lily, I usuallly agree with what you write, but I am surprised that you are resistant to someone breeding a well-titled dog.
> 
> I guess one of the issues is the size of the litter. A spoo litter of 10 has a different imprint than a toy litter of 2, where one is kept. Even so, I don't have a problem with someone responsibly breeding a litter. *If the dog is a champion in a competitve venue and has performance degrees, if the owner has carefully studied and consulted with others, if the parents had genetic testing*, I think breeding a litter is okay, a counter-balance to the ubiquitous pitbulls. Also breeding and raising a litter carefully is part of learning about purebred dogs, the breed, and training for performance. How does one know if one wants to be a breeder. if one never has a litter?


What you're describing (in bold) is a reputable breeder, (well, almost...there's a little more to it) not someone who doesn't know what they're doing and just breeding so they can see the miracle of birth or to make money or some other equally selfish reason that has nothing to do with bettering the breed...improving on the last generation. I don't think most people here have any problem with* reputable *breeders breeding dogs. Titles are part of it but not the end all. There are more things to consider when breeding dogs I think.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Poodlebeguiled said:


> What you're describing (in bold) is a reputable breeder, (well, almost...there's a little more to it) not someone who doesn't know what they're doing and just breeding so they can see the miracle of birth or to make money or some other equally selfish reason that has nothing to do with bettering the breed...improving on the last generation. I don't think most people here have any problem with* reputable *breeders breeding dogs. Titles are part of it but not the end all. There are more things to consider when breeding dogs I think.



Yes, there is health testing. I admire that you had your Champion boy neutered when his knees went bad. Not all breeders are that ethical.
My favorite breeder had the same thing happen after she bought a dog from another breeder (for big bucks), spent a good amount finishing him with a handler. Then spent a few thousand having his knees repaired, then adopted him out for a couple of hundred dollars. She would rather take the financial hit than add bad knees to her breeding program!


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## Greenfoley (Jan 26, 2011)

For now my answers are easy. #1 I wanted a show dog so for papers alone I had to go to a breeder and #2 I was only interested in a puppy and am anti infant sterilization so my chances of getting an intact puppy from a rescue or shelter were exactly zero.

As far as price I have told a few people exactly how much I paid, most people I just say his price was reasonable given his bloodlines, the experience, dedication and love of his breeder and that while he was 4 figures, I'd gladly pay many times what I did to get such an awesome dog and a great RESPONSIBLE breeder as a friend.



patk said:


> just watch out you don't get asked by some of those folks to adopt their kids, too! :laugh:


I hate it when people offer me their children. My pat answer is "I've been battling infertility for 8yrs, don't offer me your child unless you sincerely want me to take it because I will in heartbeat" That usually shuts them up.


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## Granberry (Nov 17, 2014)

aasteapots said:


> The comparison is not between a child and a rescue dog. People who question you as to adopting/rescuing a dog are usually asking because they are on a soap box. If they want to be so high and mighty about saving the world they may want to look within themselves first. People in glass houses and so forth.


My comment was in response to an answer, now deleted, from someone who commented that they would answer that could trace their ancestry back 800 years, and then they would ask the person if they could do the same, or were they "born in an orphanage". The poster was from China; I suspect a cultural difference. But that's why I said there's no comparison between adopting a child and a dog.


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## Granberry (Nov 17, 2014)

Zhuhaibill said:


> I personally wouldn't give them any excuses because I don't think they deserve any and I shouldn't have to explain myself.
> 
> I would start by saying that an "obnoxious question deserves and equally obnoxious answer" and say that I am an elitist with a straight face, and that "since I can trace my family lineage back 800 years I would want my dog to boast a stellar pedigree as well." Then I would ask, "And you, were you adopted from an orphanage?"
> 
> ...



Oh, I take it back. It wasn't deleted. Old coot or not, I think this response to a question about a rescue dog would be inappropriate.


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## aasteapots (Oct 6, 2013)

Greenfoley said:


> For now my answers are easy. #1 I wanted a show dog so for papers alone I had to go to a breeder and #2 I was only interested in a puppy and am anti infant sterilization so my chances of getting an intact puppy from a rescue or shelter were exactly zero.
> 
> As far as price I have told a few people exactly how much I paid, most people I just say his price was reasonable given his bloodlines, the experience, dedication and love of his breeder and that while he was 4 figures, I'd gladly pay many times what I did to get such an awesome dog and a great RESPONSIBLE breeder as a friend.
> 
> ...


Im sorry people do that to you. It is rude and insensitive. I have never experienced infertility but when people find out we have adopted they offer us their kids as well. I know they are kidding but I can understand where it would be hurtful to you.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

mamalion I said nothing about what breed the dog was. It happens *not* to be a standard poodle, but instead a mini. I didn't even originally say it was a poodle at all, though it is. You made an incorrect inference about the dog. You also don't know the person or their motivations. I do and I don't see that this would necessarily be productive. The person is a very experienced dog person who I just don't think really wants to be a breeder. I think there are many other aspects of the dog world that hold the interest of this person much more strongly than breeding and showing. The dog I mentioned it the only one ever exhibited in conformation by this owner.


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

I couldn't stand the heartache. I've watched the miraculous transformation of rescue Golden Retrievers, back to fitness, expensively cured of obvious afflictions by my neighbor, only to have them die within a year or two. She was broken-hearted every time. She's such a hero. She always says at least they knew love for a few years. I don't have the emotional strength for that kind of challenge and risk.


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## Sanic (Oct 22, 2015)

Mfmst said:


> I couldn't stand the heartache. I've watched the miraculous transformation of rescue Golden Retrievers, back to fitness, expensively cured of obvious afflictions by my neighbor, only to have them die within a year or two. She was broken-hearted every time. She's such a hero. She always says at least they knew love for a few years. I don't have the emotional strength for that kind of challenge and risk.


This. My SO and I rescued our first dog together in December of last year who was so amazing and sweet. After only 7 months we ended up having to put him down because he just snapped one day and bit me and started snarling and trying to attack us. It got so bad we almost had to call animal control. It was absolutely devastating and the only time I've ever seen my SO cry.


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## IdahoLiving (Jun 20, 2013)

I have been involved in rescue for many, many years now and even I get that question. Shoot, I even ran the foster program as a paid employee at a large, regional humane society for years. But all three of my current dogs came from breeders.

When I get that question I just politely tell the person asking that the other part of rescue is supporting the good, responsible breeders. If we don't support rescue AND good breeders pretty soon the only people producing puppies will be the Craigslist bottom feeders and puppy mills. 

It is a two-pronged approach to address the serious pet overpopulation problem and it must include the good breeders out there that are doing a good job of preserving and improving their breed.
Sheilah


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Well said IdahoLiving!!!!


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## Shamrockmommy (Aug 16, 2013)

This is an interesting topic.

For me, I am DONE with rescues. I have tried to adopt from rescues on 3 separate occasion. First time I was "too young" (had to be 21, I was 20!). 
Second time my kids were "too young" (my kids were under 6, they required 6+) and last time, I found a gorgeous black/white parti mini poodle who "loves balls and kids!" but when I applied this time, my kids were STILL too young (must be 13+!!!!)
Now, I've been in dogs a long time. Trained several to obedience and conformation titles. Fostered dogs for a rescue in GA... none of this was good enough. The last rescue wouldn't even entertain a home visit to see how well my kids interact with my 3 1/2 pound 3 legged chihuahua! Or our 2 pound bunny, or 2 small gerbils! It made no sense, and they passed up, IMO, an excellent home in favor of some arbitrary rule. It irritates the heck out of me. 

Do they know they push people, who are trying to do the right thing, to go to breeders? Some so desperate they go to pet stores, and we all know where those dogs come from! 

Anyway, I have no problem telling people I will not adopt/rescue dogs anymore. I want a poodle that looks like a poodle! I was a groomer for many years and it is rare that poodles are conformationally correct in the pet side of things anyway. Most were short legged with very short tail docks and wide skulls and high ear sets. Call me fickle but I appreciate looking at a well put-together dog. 

Garsh this sounds cranky! I guess I'm a little miffed about the 3 rescue attempts, but I would have (and do, because I'm asked all the time if they are "rescues") no problem explaining why I don't "rescue" dogs. 

As an aside... I was once told off by a very haughty young woman when I had my 2 small kids with me that she would never, ever have a child of her own when so many are waiting to be adopted. Oy, a whole can of worms there. I couldn't find any words to say except give her a dumbfounded look and walk away! 

My next dog will be a silver mini from a reputable breeder. :act-up:


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## Chagall's mom (Jan 9, 2010)

*o0Melanie0o*, Going off on a bit of a tangent, but I want to share this thoughtful piece with you. It might have some relevance in helping you feel more at ease about answering those who question your choice and right to own and cherish a purebred poodle. With regard to those who ask how much I paid for my poodle, I freely share the information. Like others here I've posted the purchase price when someone has asked about it. I value Chagall beyond measure and I'm eternally grateful to his late breeder. Had I known how very dear he would come to be to me, I would have _insisted_ on paying his breeder more! _ha!_ Now I have to go give my purebred poodle who cost four figures his weekly bath and blowdry. :bathbaby:

ShowSight - The Dog Show Magazine.
"Neither Of My Dogs Killed a Shelter Dog"

A Facebook Status update by Michelle Gonsalves – Reprinted by permission.

I am NOT ashamed to be the owner of two responsibly bred dogs. Neither of my dogs killed a shelter dog. Neither of my dogs took a shelter dog’s home. Neither of them added to pet overpopulation. If I didn’t have them, I just would not have a dog. Do you know what kills shelter dogs? Irresponsible owners kill shelter dogs. They kill them when they don’t do their research and add the wrong dog to the wrong household, then ditch it to die at a shelter when they can’t or don’t care to properly care for it. Let’s not forget that in many breeds, it was responsible breeders who started their breed’s national rescue club. Not to save their own dogs (which don’t need saving), but to save the dogs that they never bred. To save the ones that don’t have safety nets. Responsible breeders did that. They did that in IGs (Italian Greyhounds).

I was interviewed more intensely to buy my two responsibly bred dogs than I ever interviewed a rescue candidate. I had supervised visitation… Multiple times. I don’t even own them outright, they are on co-ownership, so that if anything ever happens to me they will go back to their breeder (yes, even the neutered one).

How do I know this will come to pass? I’ve seen her do it with another of her dogs when the owner died unexpectedly. And I saw her do it with my own dog when I nearly died myself. No questions asked, she opened her home to him for as long as I needed her to… Potentially forever, if it came to that. Because that’s what responsible breeders do. And trust me, I researched until I found a responsible breeder.

Added to that, I am PROUD of the responsible breeders in this country who work SO hard to preserve our wonderful breed. Without them, the IG would be an unsound, neurotic, unhealthy creature. Not the elegant, sweet, healthy blessing that I love so much. Without responsible breeders, we’d never have gotten the amazing genetic health tests for enamel hypoplasia, the vonWildebrand’s test, the cda test or the pra test that are on their way.Without breeders, the domestic dog would CEASE TO BE! I do not ever want to live in a world without dogs. What a terrible place that would be, yet so many professed animal lovers are campaigning through shaming to create just such a world. Because that’s what it means when you say things like “adopt don’t shop,” “don’t breed while shelter dogs die,” and “people who buy dogs from breeders should be ashamed of themselves.”What do you think will happen if we sterilize all dogs? What do you think will happen if all breeders stop breeding? You’d very quickly lose the rare breeds and the giant breeds FOREVER. Wait a bit more and you’d lose important genetic diversity, causing untold suffering for dogs that have to come from increasingly small gene pools. And then, the dog- man’s best friend- would become extinct. Gone the way of the Dodo. Gone forever. So shame on YOU! Shame on you for hating dogs!I am not ashamed of my dogs. I am not ashamed of their breeder, who is an amazing person who has given so much of herself for this and other breeds. I am not ashamed of my extended family all around the world in the sport of dogs. And I am not ashamed of myself for daring to want a responsibly bred dog that fits my lifestyle.

Blaming me for the death of shelter dogs is like blaming a parent for the death of orphans in Uganda because she chose to have a baby through pregnancy, rather than adopt one. I have never surrendered an animal in my life. I have never caused the death of a dog in all my life. So why don’t you focus your ire on the people who did– the people who dumped those dogs at the shelter. They are the ones who left those dogs to die. Not me.Stop bashing your allies. Stop the shaming. We ALL need to work together for the good of dogs. Because there are scary people out there who want your dog gone. Who want your cat gone. Who want the horse out of your paddock, the guide dog out of his harness, the chicken out of the coop and the cow out of the dairy. Keep shilling their slick propaganda and shaming your fellow animal lovers and you help Animal Rights militants erase your dog from your very own home.If anyone has a problem with that, feel free to unfriend me.


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## nifty (Aug 2, 2013)

IdahoLiving said:


> I have been involved in rescue for many, many years now and even I get that question. Shoot, I even ran the foster program as a paid employee at a large, regional humane society for years. But all three of my current dogs came from breeders.
> 
> When I get that question I just politely tell the person asking that the other part of rescue is supporting the good, responsible breeders. If we don't support rescue AND good breeders pretty soon the only people producing puppies will be the Craigslist bottom feeders and puppy mills.
> 
> ...


Important words to remember! I am filing that away in the TRUTH file.


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## nifty (Aug 2, 2013)

Although I agree with earlier posters that adopting a dog is in no way comparable to babies and children, I have learned a bit about how to handle intrusive questions from strangers thanks to being a mother of twins. The post I made earlier was to answer random strangers who insist on an answer/explanation - I would not always be so abrupt with people.

When I was a young mother with my toddler twins (and often another child or two with me as well), I was often approached by total strangers who would smilingly remark on the cute babies and pre-schoolers - which I always accepted with a friendly smile myself and would thank them for their kindness.

From time to time, though, I would be asked very personal questions about how my twins came to be. I had no idea how to handle these at first. Mostly, I again was friendly and just got away as soon as possible. 

Eventually, I started to see the humor that was possible in this situation and sometimes (if a random person at the park seemed to be meaning well but just oblivious to how intrusive it is to ask things like "Are they natural?" or "Did you have a C-section?"), I started employing a bit of humor. 

THem: Are they natural?

Me: (feigning shock and looking closely at my twins) My goodness! I think so! They have certainly always behaved like human babies!


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## dogdragoness (Oct 18, 2015)

mamalion said:


> Dear Lily, I usuallly agree with what you write, but I am surprised that you are resistant to someone breeding a well-titled dog.
> 
> I guess one of the issues is the size of the litter. A spoo litter of 10 has a different imprint than a toy litter of 2, where one is kept. Even so, I don't have a problem with someone responsibly breeding a litter. If the dog is a champion in a competitve venue and has performance degrees, if the owner has carefully studied and consulted with others, if the parents had genetic testing, I think breeding a litter is okay, a counter-balance to the ubiquitous pitbulls. Also breeding and raising a litter carefully is part of learning about purebred dogs, the breed, and training for performance. How does one know if one wants to be a breeder. if one never has a litter?


I dont have issues with someone breeding dogs with only performance titles, provided said dogs are properly health tested as per their breed's requirements, In fact, working or sporting titles on a dog says something about the dog, and the handler IMO. 



Shamrockmommy said:


> This is an interesting topic.
> 
> For me, I am DONE with rescues. I have tried to adopt from rescues on 3 separate occasion. First time I was "too young" (had to be 21, I was 20!).
> Second time my kids were "too young" (my kids were under 6, they required 6+) and last time, I found a gorgeous black/white parti mini poodle who "loves balls and kids!" but when I applied this time, my kids were STILL too young (must be 13+!!!!)
> ...


Here here, I have only had three dogs to date that were from breeders, the rest have either been adopted from shelters, or just found their way to us. 

The three dogs that were from breeders: First was Bear, the JRT, who has a lucrative career in the conformation and the sporting ring until I retired him at age 7, he is still with us, he is almost 16 years old.

Second was Izze, an ACD from a working ranch (breeder was an old rancher, health tested and worked his dogs but didnt show, only bred when he needed another working dog). Sadly, an unfortunate accident took her from me at the age of 10 (long painful story, we think someone who hated us did something to her, but we could never prove it).

the third is my current dog, Lincoln. he is from duel titled (conformation and sports father is a dock diver, mother is a flybal champ) he is proof of what good breeding and good genetics can get you, he is a sound, hardy dog with a great mind and a great work ethic.

the poodle will also be from a reputable breeder.


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

Off topic but funny. My daughter has twin girls. A friend of hers had boy and girl twins. Occasionally someone would gush over the cute little boy and the cute little girl and then ask "Are they identical?" Umm, no, the boy has a ...


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## dogdragoness (Oct 18, 2015)

Haha people can be so dumb ... identical twins are always the same sex.


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## Countryboy (May 16, 2011)

Shamrockmommy said:


> For me, I am DONE with rescues. I have tried to adopt from rescues on 3 separate occasion. First time I was "too young" (had to be 21, I was 20!).
> Second time my kids were "too young" (my kids were under 6, they required 6+) and last time, I found a gorgeous black/white parti mini poodle who "loves balls and kids!" but when I applied this time, my kids were STILL too young (must be 13+!!!!)


I have the same issues with rescues. They normally handle only problem dogs... or why were they surrendered... and they're too quick to dismiss potential homes for inconsequential reasons. Emotionally?? Breeders are prepared to handle dogs. Rescues are ruled by it.


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## Locket (Jun 21, 2009)

Here's my long winded personal reply:

I have a rescue dog, and have fostered/foster fantastic dogs for a great rescue. I plan on getting my next dog from a breeder, and have worried about what the rescue might say. 

If someone were to ask, I would explain that it is hard to find the breed of dog (let alone a puppy) I want in rescue, and because my current rescue dog has a hard time adjusting to new dogs in the house, I figure getting a puppy is the best way to help him deal with a new addition. It hasn't been easy to make the decision to go the breeder route, as I really do struggle with the idea of great dogs being put to sleep simply due to lack of a home. But that issue is much more complicated that only adopting rescue dogs.

At the end of the day though, I'm going to a breeder because I want to. I could easily find a dog that fits my wants and needs in rescue, no doubt about it, but I do not want a rescue. Maybe that makes me a bad person in their eyes, but that's okay, I have my reasons and I've made peace with my decision.


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## Viking Queen (Nov 12, 2014)

JudyD said:


> Off topic but funny. My daughter has twin girls. A friend of hers had boy and girl twins. Occasionally someone would gush over the cute little boy and the cute little girl and then ask "Are they identical?" Umm, no, the boy has a ...


This is HILARIOUS!

VQ


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## o0Melanie0o (Aug 4, 2014)

Great article, Chagall's mom!



Chagall's mom said:


> *o0Melanie0o*, Going off on a bit of a tangent, but I want to share this thoughtful piece with you. It might have some relevance in helping you feel more at ease about answering those who question your choice and right to own and cherish a purebred poodle. With regard to those who ask how much I paid for my poodle, I freely share the information. Like others here I've posted the purchase price when someone has asked about it. I value Chagall beyond measure and I'm eternally grateful to his late breeder. Had I known how very dear he would come to be to me, I would have _insisted_ on paying his breeder more! _ha!_ Now I have to go give my purebred poodle who cost four figures his weekly bath and blowdry. :bathbaby:
> 
> ShowSight - The Dog Show Magazine.
> "Neither Of My Dogs Killed a Shelter Dog"
> ...


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## mullyman (Oct 15, 2015)

When we were preparing for Opie I was getting a lot of crap from people about rescuing a shelter dog. My response was this...

First, I totally agree with rescuing a dog, buy, we're wanting a pure bred poodle, which you most likely won't find in a shelter, and we're also wanting a puppy, again, a pure bred poodle pup in a shelter, probably not gonna happen. Why do I want a poodle? First off, it's none of your F-ing business why I want a poodle, but if you have to know, my family has always had poodles. I'm comfortable with poodles. Poodles don't shed, which is a major factor since my wife has allergies. Toy poodles especially are low maintenance dogs, easy to get along with, etc... and, I just like poodles and, again, not really your business.

Then they hit me with the buying from a pet shop supports puppy mills. Look, I'm not supporting puppy mills. If you would like me to donate time and or money to help stopping that kind of thing, count me in. I don't see this righteous person out there doing anything about it by the way. With that said, the pet shop we're at has reputable breeders and they give us the breeders contact info. In no way, shape, or form do I personally support puppy mills.

Then, my last message to them is this. You want me to save a shelter dog so it doesn't get put to sleep. Well, when you say that, you're saying those poor pups in the pet shops don't mean anything. What do you think happens to them eventually? A shelter dog's life is no more or less important than those poor pups in the pet shop.

But again, none of your F-ing business.

If they don't like it, I really couldn't care less if I tried. hehe!!
MULLY


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

"Now I have to go give my purebred poodle who cost four figures his weekly bath and blowdry"

Baths should be banned!
Gracie:amen:


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

"How do I know this will come to pass? I’ve seen her do it with another of her dogs when the owner died unexpectedly. And I saw her do it with my own dog when I nearly died myself. No questions asked, she opened her home to him for as long as I needed her to… Potentially forever, if it came to that. Because that’s what responsible breeders do. And trust me, I researched until I found a responsible breeder."

How we all wish there were more responsible breeders of all breeds.
Eric:amen:


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## Locket (Jun 21, 2009)

mullyman said:


> When we were preparing for Opie I was getting a lot of crap from people about rescuing a shelter dog. My response was this...
> 
> First, I totally agree with rescuing a dog, buy, we're wanting a pure bred poodle, which you most likely won't find in a shelter, and we're also wanting a puppy, again, a pure bred poodle pup in a shelter, probably not gonna happen. Why do I want a poodle? First off, it's none of your F-ing business why I want a poodle, but if you have to know, my family has always had poodles. I'm comfortable with poodles. Poodles don't shed, which is a major factor since my wife has allergies. Toy poodles especially are low maintenance dogs, easy to get along with, etc... and, I just like poodles and, again, not really your business.
> 
> ...


I don't know...pet shops support puppy mills big time, and as you pointed out, pet shops put a major strain on shelters and rescues, due to their irresponsible ways. If those pet shops acted like a responsible breeder, they would not just dump their unsold puppies, their responsibilities, on someone else. In the future, please do not buy from pet stores. I understand the sentiment behind it, it's hard to see those adorable puppy faces stuck in a pet shop, but you are only contirbuting to the puppy mill industry.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

mullyman, are pet shops in Japan different in terms of where the puppies come from than here in the states? Here the puppies are pretty universally from millers and back yard breeders, but I know in Japan people love, love love their little poodles and can't imagine that all those pups come from mills.


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## zooeysmom (Jan 3, 2014)

lily cd re said:


> mullyman, are pet shops in Japan different in terms of where the puppies come from than here in the states? Here the puppies are pretty universally from millers and back yard breeders, but I know in Japan people love, love love their little poodles and can't imagine that all those pups come from mills.


Dog death row... Sunday Mirror investigation reveals 250,000 cats and dogs are gassed each year in Japan - Mirror Online


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Very horrible!


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## Countryboy (May 16, 2011)

ericwd9 said:


> "How do I know this will come to pass? I’ve seen her do it with another of her dogs when the owner died unexpectedly. And I saw her do it with my own dog when I nearly died myself. No questions asked, she opened her home to him for as long as I needed her to… Potentially forever, if it came to that. Because that’s what responsible breeders do. And trust me, I researched until I found a responsible breeder."
> 
> How we all wish there were more responsible breeders of all breeds.
> Eric:amen:


One thing I'm reassured by is that Diane would take Tonka back in a heartbeat if I could no longer look after him. He was her dog in the first place and I don't think that commitment would ever go away.


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## Spoos+Ponies (Mar 26, 2014)

Because I'm a computer ninny I can't seem to make this a link, but here's the address -https://www.facebook.com/InsideAmySchumer/videos/860202314049180/ - this is hilarious - Amy Schumer's video on rescues called 'Doggy Daycare'. The problem is not with rescue dogs, or people who choose to rescue dogs, the problem is when we allow ourselves to make our passion a religion and bash others over the head with it. When I get the question about why I choose to get purebred dogs, I just say that I would like to take advantage of hundreds of years of selective breeding which has resulted in the ideal dog for me. Pretty much the same answer I give to people who wonder why I didn't get a doodle - predictability.


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## Oliverthedog (Mar 10, 2015)

It is true getting a Poodle puppy in rescue is very difficult, but not impossible. My previous spoo Oliver was from a very good breeder. He had a lot of champions in his lineage and was an awesome dog. He did cost quite a bit. 

When Ollie died, I contacted breeders and started the process of purchasing a puppy. I also kept on eye out for a rescue. Finding a Spoo puppy in rescue was next to impossible, there were lots of doodles though. I was about to put a deposit on a blue spoo, when all of sudden an 8 month old black Spoo puppy appeared on Petfinder from a rescue only 10 miles away. There were lots of interest in him, the rescue received many applications, but we were chosen due to our poodle experience. Rocky's first eight months is unknown but we do know he was not properly cared for. He was wild and untrained, and at eight months old, he was in his difficult period too boot. In the state he was in, I don't think he would have lasted in many homes. 

Now he is an absolutely great dog and loves his family including his feline brother. His trainer is very impressed with his intelligence and his ability to be trained. 

I guess what I'm saying is, even if you have your heart set on buying a pet quality puppy from a breeder, think about keeping an eye out in the local rescues. You may find a diamond in the ruff(pun intended) that desperately needs experienced poodle people and can or will be as good as any dog that you can purchase at a breeder.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

zooeysmom said:


> Dog death row... Sunday Mirror investigation reveals 250,000 cats and dogs are gassed each year in Japan - Mirror Online



Well that is awful.
But are there any reputable poodle breeders in Japan?
From what I have heard people say, there may not be.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

Tiny Poodles said:


> Well that is awful.
> But are there any reputable poodle breeders in Japan?
> From what I have heard people say, there may not be.


smash poodles is japanese. i think they breed toys only. winning awards all over the world. but i have no idea about their breeding practices, just that american and european breeders are starting to incorporate them in their lines.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

*How to Answer, &quot;Why didn't you get a rescue dog?!&quot;*



patk said:


> smash poodles is japanese. i think they breed toys only. winning awards all over the world. but i have no idea about their breeding practices, just that american and european breeders are starting to incorporate them in their lines.



Wasn't there an article awhile ago that explained how smash was one big million dollar publicity machine? I think I remember something about dogs being bred elsewhere in there too.
Anyhow, even if there are some show breeders in Japan, that does not necessarily mean that there are enough of them producing enough puppies that there are "excess" non-show quality puppies to meet the publics pet demand.
Who knows, they might not even sell pet quality to the public - they might just sell them to pet shops? Opie looks like a very well bred poodle - NOTHING like what you would find in a pet shop around here.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

haven't really followed smash, as i'm not about to get a poodle from them, but every good breeder has dogs that have been bred elsewhere. you bring dogs into your line if you think they have something special to offer. the number of cats/dogs being put to sleep in japan doesn't mean all came from bad breeders, any more than it does in the u.s. americans dump their animals for all kinds of terrible reasons - too old, we're moving, my new boyfriend/girlfriend doesn't like my dog, etc. i imagine the japanese are not much different.

btw, the aspca claims we euthanize about 2.7m dogs/cats each year in the u.s. that's about 10 times the number in japan for a (declining) human population of about 127m versus a (growing) us human population of 300m. not that it makes a bit of difference to the animals being euthanized.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

patk said:


> haven't really followed smash, as i'm not about to get a poodle from them, but every good breeder has dogs that have been bred elsewhere. you bring dogs into your line if you think they have something special to offer. the number of cats/dogs being put to sleep in japan doesn't mean all came from bad breeders, any more than it does in the u.s. americans dump their animals for all kinds of terrible reasons - too old, we're moving, my new boyfriend/girlfriend doesn't like my dog, etc. i imagine the japanese are not much different.
> 
> btw, the aspca claims we euthanize about 2.7m dogs/cats each year in the u.s. that's about 10 times the number in japan for a (declining) human population of about 127m versus a (growing) us human population of 300m. not that it makes a bit of difference to the animals being euthanized.



Yes, most good breeders bring in other lines, but I think it was something odd that I read, like they don't breed at all, they only finish champions bred somewhere else?
Anyhow I have no idea, but I think that because of cultural differences show breeders might not even sell pet quality to the public? It seems like everyone who has posted on the forum from Japan has said that a pet shop was their only option to get a poodle...


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## Countryboy (May 16, 2011)

Lol for that Amy Schumer video. A funny lady! Thanks, AB. 

Adding a link to a PF post??? Do it thru the Earth and Chain Link icon. Click on it and paste your link into the pop-up window.


And it winds up like this... 

https://www.facebook.com/InsideAmySchumer/videos/860202314049180/


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## Spoos+Ponies (Mar 26, 2014)

Thanks Countryboy. Yay, I've already learned something new today : )


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## shell (Jul 10, 2015)

Because I didn't want one. Plain and simple. I have no problems being up front about this and I feel no remorse what so ever about it. I had no desire to get a rescue dog, I wanted a standard poodle puppy from a breeder and that is what I am getting.

Seriously I have more reasons than that but that is all anyone needs to know. It is wonderful that people have a passion for 'adoption' and good for them if that is where their heart leads-however-those of us who do not are not wrong for it.


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

This, and the subsequent article in The Bark, is an excellent discussion: “Responsible Breeding” an Oxymoron?


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## Carley's Mom (Oct 30, 2011)

I have a heart for rescue dogs. Most all my dogs have been rescues, re-homes, pound hounds, strays ect. But to anyone rude enough to ask that question, I would just say, because this is the dog that found me at this time in my life and move on.

Rescue dogs are not for everyone. They most often come with issues, but it is so rewarding to take another's castoff and show the world just how wrong they were about them. I take a lot of pride in my success stories. It is also wonderful to have the love and trust of a dog that has been so wrongly done in it's life. I am very thankful for all those people that get their hearts broken everyday in rescue.


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## aasteapots (Oct 6, 2013)

I had to chime in here again. Today I took Coal for her 1st vet check. The breeder likes it done within 5-7 days of bringing them home. So there I am with this beautiful black ball of fluff in my lap and doesn't the lady sitting across from me ask..... "Did you rescue her?" It took everything I had to not laugh. Instead I look at her with a big bright smile and said..... " ABSOLUTELY NOT!" :aetsch::lol::lol::lol: She didn't say another word.


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## o0Melanie0o (Aug 4, 2014)

aasteapots said:


> I had to chime in here again. Today I took Coal for her 1st vet check. The breeder likes it done within 5-7 days of bringing them home. So there I am with this beautiful black ball of fluff in my lap and doesn't the lady sitting across from me ask..... "Did you rescue her?" It took everything I had to not laugh. Instead I look at her with a big bright smile and said..... " ABSOLUTELY NOT!" :aetsch::lol::lol::lol: She didn't say another word.


HAHA!! Oh man, perfect response !!!


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## West U (Jul 30, 2014)

Okay one more response here also. I saw a couple of responses here that describes my feelings precisely on rescues "I just can't take it emotionally". I also appreciate a well put together dog. It scares me to think if I got a rescue it might not work out and have to return or find another home or worse yet one of our existing dogs gets hurt or worse.


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

No one has ever asked me this question, even when I owned mixed breeds. I suppose I would just say, "No. Why do you ask?"

There are lots of reasons why we get the dogs we do. I see no reason to explain them to a stranger. I would discuss them with a friend.


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## Luce (Mar 4, 2013)

Before Ricco came to us (I adopted him from a local rescue at an event in the local Petco), my only dog was Luce. She is my first dog as an adult, my family had 3 poodles over a 25 year period and we loved everyone of them. That is why I will only have a poodle.

Anyway, while making conversation with dog owners at the dog park the question always comes up! I tell it straight 

"Luce came from my neighbors who happened to have a male and female when OOPS! she's pregnant! I first met her at 5 weeks old and fell in love at first sight. We puppy sat for her a few times and got her at 8 weeks for a great price - $100!! What a deal! No she isn't registered, but that's fine, I'm not going to breed her so it doesn't matter. I couldn't believe I got a pure bred poodle for 100 bucks. If I ever get a puppy again I will go through a breeder. Why? My bargain puppy who I absolutely love and adore has had 3 surgeries on her hips from 16 months - 2 years old! She dislocated them and had FHO surgery. IF she had been from a reputable breeder, they would have done health testing and this would not have happened. Not just the money for the surgeries and the physical therapy, it's the time at the vet, the hospital and the after care. And yes, there could have been complications during surgery and the worry that goes with it. My bargain puppy of $100 dollars cost $3500 plus - I'm sure that is a lot more then a well bred poodle puppy. So, the next time I get a puppy I will go to a reputable breeder, paying a little more now is worth not only the cost but the emotional stress later."

When Luce and I met Ricco at Petco that day, he laid eyes on her and jumped to the top of the 3' expen from a standing position! I knew he had good hips

Ricco is also a great little dog. He has a couple of issues that are more annoying and I can't quite figure it out. Other then that he is great - playful, lovable, cuddly, gazes into my eyes as if to say "I loooove youuuu", and they play so well together. He has been a great physical therapist for her!


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## dogdragoness (Oct 18, 2015)

Luce said:


> Before Ricco came to us (I adopted him from a local rescue at an event in the local Petco), my only dog was Luce. She is my first dog as an adult, my family had 3 poodles over a 25 year period and we loved everyone of them. That is why I will only have a poodle.
> 
> Anyway, while making conversation with dog owners at the dog park the question always comes up! I tell it straight
> 
> ...


And they both are so cute, too <3

To me it doesnt matter where someone gets their dog, as long as they are good to their dog and love them, that's all that really matters. People shouldnt care, I mean it's THEIR money they are spending, not mine, or anyone elses that might have an opinion one way or the other.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Luce I know you to be a straight shooter and I think it is great that you give full disclosure to dog park people who ask about Luce's back story. The more we have this discussion, hopefully the less oops and BYB etc there will be. 

I agree with dogdragoness that what matters most is that a person loves their dog(s) well no matter their origins. In the meantime you are so wonderful to Luce, as I know first hand. I am also very happy that the two of you discovered Ricco. I just wish he could have come to Long Island on your last trip. Maybe someday...


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## dogdragoness (Oct 18, 2015)

I originally got my MAS as a breeding/showing prospect, but he didnt pan out, I even had people asking why I didnt return him and "try again". Because he is my boy and I am his person, and I love him more than I wanted to be a breeder LOL (because when I realized that being a breeder meant I would have to rehome dogs who didnt pan out, I realized it wasnt for me).

People even had opinions when I neutered him, that I was doing it too soon, too late, that I was doing it at all ... UGH.


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## Luce (Mar 4, 2013)

By the way, Luce isn't spayed yet either! After doing more research into it I discovered there is data supporting spay after 4 years old. It gives her the most protection from bone cancer. 

Almost every time we go to the vet, the ladies at the desk pester me about getting her spayed. The vet herself? She says not to worry about it yet, Luce is fine.

Of course I am very diligent about where she is about any given time. I will NOT take her to the dog park while in heat - that's a no brainer. do not have a fenced in yard, so she is never outside unleashed. 

It's not rocket science! lol


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## TeamPoodle (Aug 10, 2015)

People can be very fierce when it comes to the issue of adopting versus buying a dog. I rarely tell people that Riley is a rescue, because I hate the responses I get: "I'm SO glad you chose adoption", "Aren't rescue dogs simply the best??" etc. 

Riley is amazing, and fantastic, and we love him to death, but I don't think he's any "better" than a well-bred puppy from a good breeder, and I make sure to tell people that. (if anything, I've poured over the Illustrated Breed Standard and told Riley he's not a good representation of his breed  ) I also tell people that I don't believe adoption is the only way. If everyone adopted and no one bought dogs from breeders, eventually all that we would have to choose from are mixed breeds (from questionable backgrounds), and we specifically chose a poodle because of their temperament and personality. Even Petfinder search capabilities are based off breeds! People are seeking certain traits in their dogs, that have been bred for generations, and there is nothing wrong with that.

I ask people who have children why they didn't adopt kids instead of having their own? And I tell those people that you're basically asking me the same thing. There are some great dogs that through unfortunate circumstances ended up in rescues, but there are a lot more dogs with behavioral, psychological, or physical limitations in shelters and while they all deserve loving homes, those dogs aren't for everyone. When searching for our next family member, we had many different traits we were looking for and getting a puppy was the best way of making sure we got the best dog for us. We had the chance to mold his experiences and give him the best start to life. 

That being said, we didn't get a puppy, but a 1 year old rescue in the end, but that was because Riley checked off everything on our list. If he hadn't, we wouldn't have brought him home. When we got him, we were still visiting breeders. However, some things are harder with a rescue. Riley dislikes grooming, so we're working on that with short sessions and lots of treats. As a poodle, he's got a whole life of grooming ahead of him, so it is important he learns to tolerate it. That's just one example that it is a bit easier when starting with a young pup... they learn to accept it at a much younger age.


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## katbrat (May 8, 2011)

I have never been asked the first question. That being said, I don't think we would even be considered to be able to get a dog from rescue because we don't have a fenced yard. That being said, all our friends tell us they want to be a pet in our house! Lol!  I get asked all the time what we paid for Lexi. My standard answer is "I have only admitted that to a handful of very close friends," and have said no more, even when asked again.


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## mvhplank (Dec 5, 2012)

*Whew* I wish I had stumbled onto this thread when it started. I read all 10 pages before deciding to add my 2 cents' worth.

My rat terriers are rescues. Devlin was a freebie dumped at someone's farm, whose inoculations and neutering turned him into a fairly expensive free dog. Bridget was from a shelter, whose much more economical price included spaying. I love them both. But whether it's because they're rescues or terriers, they both had issues that limited their performance careers. That said, Devlin did top out in UKC rally, bless him. But it was a struggle, during which he taught me a helluva lot about both patience and training.

But my poodle is a dog obtained for a purpose--performance competition in obedience and rally. I really like his grandfather, who has a UD in CDSP and one UD leg in AKC. Neely is from health-tested parents of known temperament. 

He is confirming my decision by picking up 24 titles and awards from four performance venues this year (2015) alone. (Well, the UKC Award of Merit is actually a conformation award.) He's intact and has had the necessary tests and certifications to be honestly presented as a potential mate for a similarly endowed standard poodle bitch. I've even had tests for color genetics performed in order to answer questions like, "Does he carry brown?" (The answer is "no.") I have no interest in owning bitches, so I can't pretend to be a breeder.

When we're out and about, most people are so astonished at seeing a standard poodle in show trim that I don't get asked the "rescue" question. I have been asked the price question, and one answer that seems to satisfy is "not as much as you might think" or maybe "about two new car payments."

But if I'm ever asked why I didn't get a rescued dog, I think I'll answer, "Because I don't want good, healthy dogs to go extinct. You can't do that with shelter dogs, which are not in the gene pool."


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## Marcie (Aug 2, 2011)

All my dogs are rescue and my GiGi, the puppy mill dog, is the really the healthiest one. Sasha may be blind, which I don't consider as a health problem, but the doctor is always amazed when he does blood work on her because at 12 years old she has the blood work of a one year old dog.

I see no problem with someone going to a reputable breeder. A lot of the rescue dogs started out from reputable breeders but through no fault of their own ended up at a rescue. Their owner could have died and the family did not want the bother of a dog and turned it in to a rescue or the owner fell on hard times and turned her dog into to the rescue rather than dumping it or taking it to the pound .... there are so many reasons a dog ends up at a rescue. 

They are not throw-away dogs by any means, a lot of them are papered although you will not get the papers or know who the breeder was for privacy reasons.

I really never wanted to go through a puppy stage so I opted for rescue. There are a lot of breeders that turn their older dogs over to rescue for placement after they don't use them for breeding anymore. And there are a lot of breeders that will also sell off their older dogs as well. 

There are plenty of options. As long as you love the dog you have it does not matter if you paid $1.00 or $1,000,000.00 you will always know you have the best dog in the world!!!

If anyone asks why you did not rescue... Just say "Because I didn't want to". You can't argue with that. When someone asks why I didn't get my dogs at a breeder I just say "Because I didn't want to". Works every time!


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## mvhplank (Dec 5, 2012)

Marcie said:


> <snip>They are not throw-away dogs by any means, a lot of them are papered although you will not get the papers or know who the breeder was for privacy reasons.
> 
> I really never wanted to go through a puppy stage so I opted for rescue. There are a lot of breeders that turn their older dogs over to rescue for placement after they don't use them for breeding anymore. And there are a lot of breeders that will also sell off their older dogs as well.
> 
> There are plenty of options. As long as you love the dog you have it does not matter if you paid $1.00 or $1,000,000.00 you will always know you have the best dog in the world!!!<snip>


And some dogs the breeders let go are still young.

A dear friend of mine has a thing for red dogs. Her most recent red Golden Retriever is an intact boy, under a year old, from a kennel that specializes in hunting dogs. He didn't work out (didn't like water retrieves or something), and he needed a home that would give him a job--my friend is an agility instructor and no newbie to high-energy dogs. She got full registration, I believe, and may also show him in conformation.

Her other red dog is an Australian Terrier from a very good kennel (Westminster dog show qualifiers), a retired breeding bitch, who earned her UKC Altered Championship and is working her way through rally trials as well as agility.

So yes, you don't have to buy a puppy from a breeder, but sometimes you do have to ask the right person at the right time to get what you want.


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## snmim (Sep 7, 2015)

I too have never been asked the first question. In fact, most everyone who comments on Mira either says "That's a show dog!", "That's an expensive dog!" or "You don't find those in shelters." It takes common sense to realize that a well bred standard poodle would be practically impossible to find in a shelter. I have never encountered anyone rude enough to ask me why I didn't get a rescue dog when I already have my beautiful dog by my side. I've met people with rescues on walks and they were all kind but their dogs always had a series of problems.

Now, if I were to be asked why didn’t I get a rescue dog? A TON of reasons.. I come from a very religious family, and it is within our culture to not have a dog. My entire family, generations of generations never had a dog and getting one was completely foreign to my parents. My parents, my brother, are all terrified of dogs, hence why we needed a puppy. A well bred, easy to train puppy. After having a cat for 14 years that shed everywhere, we also wanted a non shedding dog. Now, to find a non shedding PUPPY in a shelter would be practically impossible. Besides that, since we are first time dog owners we are no where near equipped to handle an adult sized dog who has baggage. I don't think shelters would adopt to us anyways with their strict criteria. Put all that together and that is why we got a healthy puppy from a reputable breeder. If someone rude enough were to ask me why I didn’t rescue, I’d say at least one of those reasons but really it’s none of their business. I’m a nice person, so I’d tell them anyways.


I have been asked the second question. It was a woman who used to have a spoo herself and I think she was honestly curious, so I just told her the price. If I were asked on any other random occasion I think I'd say, "excuse me?!" the first time, and if I were asked again I'd say “Mira is priceless!" and go on my way.

Note: After getting Mira, my whole family is now converted to the love of dogs... Mira instinctually walks at a perfect heel with my mother, better than walking with me. That is the power of a poodle


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## Raven's Mom (Mar 18, 2014)

I totally agree with Samrockmommy, were also passed over by rescues. I have told that story here before but that's how I ended up with a poodle puppy, because the rescues would not adopt to us. I never got an putright "no" from them but they just never called back even after ging through the home visits. I am an experienced dog owner with grown children. My yard is fenced, albeit tiny, and we do have stairs, but the least they could do is respond and not just drop all communication! I still would like to support rescue, but honestly, I was very unhappy with how I was treated by rescuers.


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

Raven's Mom I too got the same treatment as you from our humane society, and had had 5 poodles over the years. I would not try the humane society or a rescue again, I find my own. I still work and worked more hours years ago and raise the 5 others.


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## Countryboy (May 16, 2011)

I have a theory. Not valid in all cases but I'm betting it's valid in most.

Rescues - start initially from the heart... can't possibly abandon this dog... whatever dog. So they take it home.

Then it happens again... and again... more dogs. But by now they're up to the limit that their municipality will allow. So, in a attempt to 'save' more dogs, they call themselves a Rescue. When it's really an excuse to assuage their desire to Save Everything!

These people are borderline neurotic to start with. So it's easy for them to condemn anybody with a practical, realistic approach to dogs. 

I've watched Locket's rescue group from their founding to date. A supremely devoted bunch of ladies, once spending days and nites in order to locate, trap and rescue a Poodle(?)

They tend to deal with dogs that nobody else wants. The only real Poodle they ever rehomed was one that was STOLEN from a very sad but caring man who loved his dog. I'll never forgive them for that...


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## snmim (Sep 7, 2015)

Raven's Mom said:


> I have told that story here before but that's how I ended up with a poodle puppy, because the rescues would not adopt to us. I never got an putright "no" from them but they just never called back even after ging through the home visits. I am an experienced dog owner with grown children. My yard is fenced, albeit tiny, and we do have stairs, but the least they could do is respond and not just drop all communication! I still would like to support rescue, but honestly, I was very unhappy with how I was treated by rescuers.





glorybeecosta said:


> Raven's Mom I too got the same treatment as you from our humane society, and had had 5 poodles over the years. I would not try the humane society or a rescue again, I find my own. I still work and worked more hours years ago and raise the 5 others


If it's that hard to adopt a dog how do those dogs ever get rescued??? You both seem very experienced and qualified. Yesterday, I saw a neurotic poodle mix out with about 4 tiny children, they told me it's their first dog and he's a rescue. They didnt know how to handle the leash and he was going nuts trying to snap at Mira. Crazy!!

I do admire those who do rescue dogs and have the capability to do so. As long as you love your dog _and_ your dog loves you it does not matter where they came from. I still question the ethics of a handful of shelters due to what I see in the real world.


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

Mithy I was turned down because I worked full time with no fixed hours real estate. I would not be around for the dog and there would be no one else there. What they did not take into consideration for 25 years I work out of my house. Yes there are times I am gone for 10 to 12 hours, but my dogs were confined to the kitchen and dining room a large space with food water, toys and plastic on the floor with news paper on it, if I was more then 10 hours they went on it. My dogs many time go with me if the client is not riding in my car. That was also the human society, and I donate for all golf tournates fund raisers, we taking a $100.00 a pop, so I am a little discussed with their process. Never had a complaint for mistreating a dog, either. Sent a very well to do lady to the humane society to get a dog, a former best friend took there, totally qualified in fact sent 3 people to get the dog. It was found at a pet shop being sold for 300.00, that is not right, I know this dog would hace had a good home with any of the ladies, all over 50 and self supporting.


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## Luce (Mar 4, 2013)

When we first met Luce at 5 weeks old, I was not looking for a dog. After I met her, I wanted her - shocking, I know lol. The whole puppy thing had me worried so I went online looking for a poodle. The rescues had over the top requirements - do they really want to rehome a dog?? The ads on Craigslist were promising, but no one responded - let's face it, poodles get rehomed quick IF the person/group is serious about it. And the price from a rescue?? Much more then the asking price for Luce! Of course over the next 2 years I could have paid for 10 rescues for what she cost in hip surgeries!! 


While this was going on for a couple of weeks, we puppy sat Luce on 2 Saturdays - at 6 weeks old and 7 weeks old. It seemed as if Luce was destined to be mine and I'll just figure the puppy part out like everyone else.

Over the last couple of years being more aware of dogs, rescues, shelters, breeders etc., my choice for a puppy is a good reputable breeder. For an older dog I would go to the adoption events at Petco and Petsmart. The rescues there really do adopt the dogs out! I know since I have one of them too! If you want a specific breed - poodle - I would go on a regular basis and start a relationship with the rescue and tell them what I want. It may take time, but so does looking for a breeder for the perfect puppy!

Of course that didn't happen with me. Just like I wasn't looking for Luce, I wasn't "really" looking for Ricco! I started to think about getting a friend for her since Glenn went to a nursing home, and a few weeks later I met Ricco at an adoption event at Petco! I am a regular shopper there and have taken several training classes with Luce, so the woman who runs the rescue knows who I am and has watched Luce grow up. I could have taken him right then, but I wasn't sure, I had to think about it. I even tried to help them get him adopted by telling people what a wonderful dog a poodle is!! He needed a grooming and looked like a mop, I guess that scared people off.

The woman who fostered him named him Bob Marley! Fist the name went, then the hair! I think Ricco is a much better fit!


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## confetti (Apr 5, 2015)

I don't get asked why we didn't rescue, but I do get asked where we got him a lot. Regardless of wording they have the same intent as people who are blunt about it. If I was cheeky I would say something along the lines of "why didn't you adopt your children instead?"


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## o0Melanie0o (Aug 4, 2014)

Interesting story...the other day a woman on this community FB page I am a part of was looking for a breeder for another dog breed. People went nuts. The whole, ADOPT, don't shop!!! SOO many dogs need to be rescued, etc, etc. I finally private messaged her and told her to not worry about other people. If she got a dog from a REPUTABLE breeder (which I forwarded her the AKC breed contact website), she was in no way, shape or form contributing to the dog overpopulation problem. She was genuinely upset by all of the nastiness of these women. Anyway, funny how I asked the question and the great advice here allows me to help someone else!

On another note, I hear you about dog rescues and their strict requirements. We've thought about rescue too and I have to say, some won't let you get a dog if you've never had one before and many of the pure bred rescues (which in all reality, would be BYB or puppy mill dogs) have long waiting lists and again, want breed specific experience. It's all but impossible to get what you are looking for. I do have to say, you can always go down to county and find a pup, but you know absolutely nothing about those doggies and are taking a gamble (which I so appreciate those who do!).

Finally, I hope everyone has a very Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!!!


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

One time I was sitting in the Vet's waiting room with Tangee, who was obviously elderly and not well by then, and a woman across from me asked "is she a rescue?" I said "no, I have had this baby since she was 16 weeks old", she gave a half smile and looked away. Next she asked the person next to her, and bingo, she hit pay dirt. And off they went telling each other their dog's sad stories and congratulating each other on what heroes they were. 
So I guess that if I had dragged Tangee out of the shelter, spent a thousand dollars a month, and virtually every waking moment caring for her that I would have been a hero too, but I got no props for not being an ass who would dump their dog when times got tough, and seeing through the commitment that I made 13 years earlier. 
Well guess what heroes - even more than people like you, what dogs really need is more people like me! If everyone was like me, they wouldn't need shelters and rescues, and people like me would be the only hero that a dog ever needed.


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## Countryboy (May 16, 2011)

Tho I'm not a big fan of rescues, there are two that I do support. Carolina Poodle Rescue, and Poodle Rescue of Houston. Commonly known as CPR and PRH. *I had to transpose from the acronyms to remember their real names. lol*

They both know Poodles... and they've been around a long time. Long enuf to know their trade. CPR will take dogs maybe once a year to NYC, to some dog-fest(?) there. In a weekend they will find homes for over a dozen dogs.

PRH I think was close to the TX floods a year ago but made it thru.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Tiny Poodles I agree with you and oOMelanieOo about how sanctimonious many rescue people can be. I just don't get why they can't allow themselves to understand that if there was more support for responsible breeders, outright boycotting of BYB and mills and good early training and socialization then there would only be rare dogs in rescues and shelters (dogs whose owners died and the like).

Isn't that the ideal scenario we should all be working to attain?


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

lily cd re said:


> Tiny Poodles I agree with you and oOMelanieOo about how sanctimonious many rescue people can be. I just don't get why they can't allow themselves to understand that if there was more support for responsible breeders, outright boycotting of BYB and mills and good early training and socialization then there would only be rare dogs in rescues and shelters (dogs whose owners died and the like).
> 
> Isn't that the ideal scenario we should all be working to attain?



Yes!!! I think that they get so caught up in the endless supply of rescues - even if they have to go to other states or other countries to get them that they miss the bigger picture - breaking the cycle would have the greater impact for generations to come!


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## Granberry (Nov 17, 2014)

confetti said:


> I don't get asked why we didn't rescue, but I do get asked where we got him a lot. Regardless of wording they have the same intent as people who are blunt about it. If I was cheeky I would say something along the lines of "why didn't you adopt your children instead?"


I don't think you realize what a slam that is to adopted children or people who have adopted children. Humans are humans; dogs are dogs. No human is better than another because of "good breeding" because we aren't in the practice of breeding humans for certain traits any more, now that slavery is abolished. 

Adopt your dog from a breeder or adopt from a rescue. I don't care. But I sure wish people would stop slamming adopted children.


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## Granberry (Nov 17, 2014)

Tiny Poodles said:


> Yes!!! I think that they get so caught up in the endless supply of rescues - even if they have to go to other states or other countries to get them that they miss the bigger picture - breaking the cycle would have the greater impact for generations to come!


I don't think most of them miss the bigger picture at all. I just think they are helpless to change things, but they still want to help somehow. They have no way to convince BYBs to stop breeding, convince owners to be responsible for a lifetime, etc., but they CAN be the contact point for poodles in shelters. And once they've rescued the poodle, they have every right to be as picky as a breeder would be. I don't think it would be good business to be that picky for a poorly-bred dog, but if they have multiple offers for it, then they have that privilege.

The people who have the power to change things are people like you (and me) who keep our pets for a lifetime and make responsible choices when it comes to breeding (and usually don't breed).


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Granberry said:


> I don't think most of them miss the bigger picture at all. I just think they are helpless to change things, but they still want to help somehow. They have no way to convince BYBs to stop breeding, convince owners to be responsible for a lifetime, etc., but they CAN be the contact point for poodles in shelters. And once they've rescued the poodle, they have every right to be as picky as a breeder would be. I don't think it would be good business to be that picky for a poorly-bred dog, but if they have multiple offers for it, then they have that privilege.
> 
> 
> 
> The people who have the power to change things are people like you (and me) who keep our pets for a lifetime and make responsible choices when it comes to breeding (and usually don't breed).



Be as picky as a breeder would be? There are a lot of people here who will tell you that they were not "good enough" for a rescue, but good enough for a breeder. I have been good enough for five different breeders but not for a rescue. Because no dog can live happily without their own fenced yard you know. 








Central Park


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Granberry said:


> I don't think you realize what a slam that is to adopted children or people who have adopted children. Humans are humans; dogs are dogs. No human is better than another because of "good breeding" because we aren't in the practice of breeding humans for certain traits any more, now that slavery is abolished.
> 
> 
> 
> Adopt your dog from a breeder or adopt from a rescue. I don't care. But I sure wish people would stop slamming adopted children.



I don't think that the implication is that adopted children are not as valued a birth to child. I think she was saying it would be like asking someone "how could you have a child when there are children in the world who need to be adopted". One isn't better than the other, both are fine choices and everyone should be free to make either of those fine choices without having guilt imposed upon them. Society does NOT typically impose guilt upon those who choose to birth a child rather than adopt one, but they do constantly impose guilt upon those of us who choose to buy a purposely bred dog over adopting a homeless one.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Granberry said:


> I don't think most of them miss the bigger picture at all. I just think they are helpless to change things, but they still want to help somehow. They have no way to convince BYBs to stop breeding, convince owners to be responsible for a lifetime, etc., but they CAN be the contact point for poodles in shelters. And once they've rescued the poodle, they have every right to be as picky as a breeder would be. I don't think it would be good business to be that picky for a poorly-bred dog, but if they have multiple offers for it, then they have that privilege.
> 
> 
> 
> The people who have the power to change things are people like you (and me) who keep our pets for a lifetime and make responsible choices when it comes to breeding (and usually don't breed).



And you know what they could do, that is rarely done - help with vet bills in order to keep a dog in it's home - provide education and counseling to match prospective pets seekers with reputable breeders. How about instead of standing in front of Pet Stores with screaming "adopt don't shop", they stood out there and asked "what kind of puppy are you looking for?" here is a list of reputable breeders in this area, and here is a list of average expenses for puppies first year, and lifetime costs. And here are brochures for the top three pet health insurance companies, and a list of the best Vets in the area. And here is a schedule of puppy classes from the best trainers around here". And here is our phone number in case you have any problems or questions after you bring your new puppy home.


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## Granberry (Nov 17, 2014)

Tiny Poodles said:


> And you know what they could do, that is rarely done - help with vet bills in order to keep a dog in it's home - provide education and counseling to match prospective pets seekers with reputable breeders. How about instead of standing in front of Pet Stores with screaming "adopt don't shop", they stood out there and asked "what kind of puppy are you looking for?" here is a list of reputable breeders in this area, and here is a list of average expenses for puppies first year, and lifetime costs. And here are brochures for the top three pet health insurance companies, and a list of the best Vets in the area. And here is a schedule of puppy classes from the best trainers around here". And here is our phone number in case you have any problems or questions after you bring your new puppy home.


If a breeder's demand exceeds their supply of pups, that breeder can quite ethically raise their prices. But a rescue can't buy and resell for profit. If demand exceeds a rescue's supply, all they can do is be choosy. I think instead of writing them off as sanctimonious, I'm just going to be happy that the rescue industry is doing its job well enough to be so darned particular. 

I think the things you've suggested might well be effective in reducing the number of dogs that end up in shelters. More power to you if you're going to do them. But people help in different ways, and if someone's way of helping is to rescue from a shelter, train, groom, neuter, and rehome it, then I have to wish "more power" to them too.

So maybe if someone asked me why I didn't rescue, my answer would be, "I looked into it, but the poodle rescues were doing really well and didn't need to place. I really wanted a poodle, so I bought from a good breeder instead".


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

*How to Answer, &quot;Why didn't you get a rescue dog?!&quot;*



Granberry said:


> If a breeder's demand exceeds their supply of pups, that breeder can quite ethically raise their prices. But a rescue can't buy and resell for profit. If demand exceeds a rescue's supply, all they can do is be choosy. I think instead of writing them off as sanctimonious, I'm just going to be happy that the rescue industry is doing its job well enough to be so darned particular.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Actually they do raise their prices for the more in demand dogs - they wanted $800 for the 3 year old little black girl that I was interested in who couldn't live without a yard. They had her listed for adoption for 1-2 years.


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## Granberry (Nov 17, 2014)

Tiny Poodles said:


> I don't think that the implication is that adopted children are not as valued a birth to child. I think she was saying it would be like asking someone "how could you have a child when there are children in the world who need to be adopted". One isn't better than the other, both are fine choices and everyone should be free to make either of those fine choices without having guilt imposed upon them. Society does NOT typically impose guilt upon those who choose to birth a child rather than adopt one, but they do constantly impose guilt upon those of us who choose to buy a purposely bred dog over adopting a homeless one.


Your way of refining and interpreting the comment makes it more PC and less offensive, certainly, but I still can't accept it as a good response to the question, "why didn't you rescue your dog". It's just too risky to compare an adopted child to an unwanted shelter animal whose parent should've been neutered. Damage could be done to a vulnerable human - completely by accident, I am sure, as the person giving the answer probably wouldn't understand their answer was hurtful.

I have been a foster parent, and the anguish that can be caused by that answer is undoable. Every adopted child who is told, "you're special because we chose you" instinctively knows that that means someone else didn't want them first. It's simply not a good answer to the question the OP asked.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Granberry said:


> Your way of refining and interpreting the comment makes it more PC and less offensive, certainly, but I still can't accept it as a good response to the question, "why didn't you rescue your dog". It's just too risky to compare an adopted child to an unwanted shelter animal whose parent should've been neutered. Damage could be done to a vulnerable human - completely by accident, I am sure, as the person giving the answer probably wouldn't understand their answer was hurtful.
> 
> I have been a foster parent, and the anguish that can be caused by that answer is undoable. Every adopted child who is told, "you're special because we chose you" instinctively knows that that means someone else didn't want them first. It's simply not a good answer to the question the OP asked.



I honestly think that what I said is exactly what she meant by it, but I can certainly understand what you are saying that it could easily be taken the other way. It is not something that I would say.


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## Raven's Mom (Mar 18, 2014)

Tny, I have seen the same thing. I know they want a successful placement that does not involve ever getting the dog back, but I would think getting one placed in a reasonable period of time would count for something as well, keeping one in rescue for years looking for a "perfect" person seems counter productive. Some of there criteria is just over the top. Although I never go an answer as to why I I was passed over, the only thing I could deduce is that they did not like me saying I was not willing to take a senior dog. I had just lost two in rapid succession and was not willing to step right back into that role. However, they evidently did not believe I was capable of handling a young adult Springer....so now I am hand ing a young SPOO!!!


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

I found in rescue, if you wanted a dog, the best way was to foster. As a foster for the rescue I volunteered, I had first dibs on my foster dog. It was hard to find a younger healthy dog, so people would foster a few elderly dogs, then as soon as they had a chance to foster a young dog, they would adopt it. 

I fostered MANY, and I did keep one. She was one I was "in" on the actual rescue. We rescued a total of 7 that night and Irma stayed with me. She was only 9 months old when I took her in. They were trying to breed her, and she wasn't getting pregnant which upset the owner. She was WAY undersized. She was VERY poorly bred, horrible knees and teeth. I just couldn't part with her, but I kept fostering even after I kept her. BTW, I still payed all the fee's to the rescue.

But anyway, yes it was hard to get a young, healthy dog through our rescue. I was not involved in approving applications. I did do home checks, but didn't fail anyone. I had one family that had to make a few changes to get a dog....cover a pond (pugs can't swim well) and block access to horse stalls (didn't want pug stepped on). But never disqualified anyone.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

sometimes rescuers are sub rosa animal hoarders and that makes things more complicated. i'm glad you were out there, mischief, as i am sure more dogs and families were put together because of you.


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

PatK, you are right. I think the founder of our rescue was a hoarder in disguise. She used the rescue money to hire 2 full time workers to take care of all the pugs at her home. But there were SO many! It was kept very clean. But at one time the dogs kept at her home all came down with sarcoptic mange. We had to treat over 50 dogs!


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Raven's Mom said:


> Tny, I have seen the same thing. I know they want a successful placement that does not involve ever getting the dog back, but I would think getting one placed in a reasonable period of time would count for something as well, keeping one in rescue for years looking for a "perfect" person seems counter productive. Some of there criteria is just over the top. Although I never go an answer as to why I I was passed over, the only thing I could deduce is that they did not like me saying I was not willing to take a senior dog. I had just lost two in rapid succession and was not willing to step right back into that role. However, they evidently did not believe I was capable of handling a young adult Springer....so now I am hand ing a young SPOO!!!



Yes, while they were using a foster home for that dog for 1-2 years, that dog (who was identical in breed and size to others that I have cared for from cradle to grave) could have been living with me, and that home might have gotten twenty other poodle out of the shelter!
Oh well, at least our poodles can count themselves as one of the lucky dogs who will live out their lives in their first home - they needed us for that!


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## aasteapots (Oct 6, 2013)

as a parent with two adopted children I am not at all offended by the comment. I also think people need to stop being perpetually offended and sensitive about everything everyone says. I know I say it to imply that maybe the person asking the question shouldn't judge others choices.


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## Streetcar (Apr 13, 2014)

I read and thanked in this thread, thinking I had nothing to contribute. That first feeling was probably accurate, but piping up anyway.

No one has asked me why I didn't get a rescue. Instead, I've had to fend off people claiming I *did* get a rescue, or worse, that *I* rescued Oliver. He was a CL rehome albeit rather sudden (can you get him this weekend type thing) and a small amount of money was exchanged, so he was actually a purchase.

A *rescuer* is someone like Eldad, or like the animal control officer who went out in the cold last night and the kind person who contacted A/C about dumped bunnies (really happened) and both rounded them up and got them off the streets. Or a responsible breeder who learns of a dog of her/his breed in dire need and ensures that dog is taken in and rehomed responsibly (have seen it with my own eyes but can't claim to have been part of the rescue).

Someone who acquires a pet from animal control or a rescue organization is an *adopter* or even possibly a purchaser (in my opinion), depending on the nature and relative degree of 'retailness' of the rescue or 'rescue'.

At times it seems (to me) some want to print up gilt badges reading RESCUER and march knees high about town, chests puffed and wearing huge hats with the badges affixed high where all can see. All that glitters is not gold.


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## BeBe67 (May 13, 2015)

*I make no apologies*

I say because I wanted a pure breed poodle puppy, I will not apologize as to why I bought the puppy of my choice. How much did it cost? Well prices vary. Or look on the web, I am sure you can find out.

When we adopted our daughter via international adoption several years ago, people actually were ignorant enough to ask me "Why didn't you adopt a "white baby"? To which I would reply "Because I didn't want a white baby, I wanted a brown baby" That stunned them and they didn't know what to say. And yes people would actually ask me how much it "cost" to which I would say 'She is our million dollar baby and worth every penny" or I would just hand them a business card from our adoption agency and say "_______ adoption agency would be happy to discuss international adoption with you if you are interested." and just smile sweetly 

It's nobodies business as to why I choose to buy a pure bred dog and why I chose to adopt a non white baby. I make to apologies and I feel like I can have what ever breed of dog I want and whatever color baby I want. Sorry I will get off my soap box now. Touchy subject with me.

And our 2 cats and 2 of our dogs were rescues that people had just dumped off at our house and we kept. So its not like I am sob that only wants purebred pets. LOL---

BEBE


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

BeBe67 said:


> I say because I wanted a pure breed poodle puppy, I will not apologize as to why I bought the puppy of my choice. How much did it cost? Well prices vary. Or look on the web, I am sure you can find out.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



It does not make one an Sob to only want a purebred - it just might make someone a caring pet owner who wants to insure that the pet that they take on has traits that they are comfortable and capable of caring for for the next 15 years or so.
For my breathing it is important that I have a dog that does not shed, and for my lifestyle it is Important that I have a dog who can be carried on public transportation, is not subject to breed or size restrictions, of which they are many around here, and one who is confident and not reactive/barky in a crowded urban environment (there is a barking law here), and those are things that must be assessed by a breeder who has the opportunity to observe the puppy extensively.


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## TrixieTreasure (May 24, 2015)

BeBe67 said:


> I say because I wanted a pure breed poodle puppy, I will not apologize as to why I bought the puppy of my choice. How much did it cost? Well prices vary. Or look on the web, I am sure you can find out.
> 
> When we adopted our daughter via international adoption several years ago, people actually were ignorant enough to ask me "Why didn't you adopt a "white baby"? To which I would reply "Because I didn't want a white baby, I wanted a brown baby" That stunned them and they didn't know what to say. And yes people would actually ask me how much it "cost" to which I would say 'She is our million dollar baby and worth every penny" or I would just hand them a business card from our adoption agency and say "_______ adoption agency would be happy to discuss international adoption with you if you are interested." and just smile sweetly
> 
> ...


Since people are talking about children adoption, I hope it's okay that I share my story as well.
My little great niece ( well, she's not little anymore, lol, she's 9 years told) is adopted. She came from an unwed mother in India. It took my niece and her husband a little over 2 years for the whole adoption process to work its way through the legal system. Finally, their little girl was just right around 14 months old when she was finally ready to be with my niece and her family. The waiting was agonizing, mostly for the parents, but for all of us as well. But it all worked out and we were so excited when the time finally arrived and my niece and her husband flew to India to pick her up. 

I remember for more than 2 years, periodically keeping people informed on a Poodle forum that I was on, how things were going, and then finally letting them know when my niece and her husband were on their way to get their daughter. While everyone was excited for my family, there was this one person who just couldn't leave me alone about it. She kept saying that my family had no right to adopt an Indian baby, and even accused me of having a niece who would take a baby away from it's Indian heritage, saying that the child would grow up in our culture and never know anything about where she came from. It wasn't just her opinion either. She personally couldn't stand me, so that was the reason why she had such negative comments about it.

Neelima is a beautiful 9 year old who knows exactly where she came from, and knows all about her heritage. She knows how to speak the Indian language as well. She has two older brothers who love her dearly, and a lot of other relatives as well. So I say to people who would have the absolute gall to ask why a parent would choose a brown baby over a white baby, to just shut up. If certain people can't be happy for the family, then they really need to just shut up about it.


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

Good conversation here and interesting perspectives. One question I do have: TP- I have never seen a rescue charge $800 - what organization was that? I'd like to take a look at that organization's policies, as it seems very exorbitant, even in the metro area. 

As far as the original question-

I agree that where you acquire a dog is a personal choice, but we live in this crazy, confessional culture, and people have very loose boundaries, which leads to probing questions that would have been considered rude just a generation ago. I loved the suggestions that were given that will shut those questions down. Helps to have some responses on hand. Why should you be on the defensive? 

If you were so inclined though, you could look at it as an opportunity to educate, and help people understand that rescue and reputable breeding are really two sides of the same coin- both are dedicated to the welfare of the animal. When I have this conversation with people, I point out that breeders actually started the first rescue groups, and continue to carry the torch in breed specific rescue. The contracts that rescues use today are pretty much word for word from contracts breeders have been using for decades. These factions are not as separate as they seem.

If we want to advance the overall well being of our companion animals, we need to stop this infighting among breeders and rescue. It makes no sense, and the division creates a distraction that takes the focus away from the bigger picture- the fact that we all love our dogs and want the best for them. For some, that is perfecting a breed standard that ensures healthy, sound dogs. For others, it is providing sanctuary to homeless dogs. Both of these goals are wonderful and altruistic, albeit with different applications.

For sure, there are lousy rescues with black and white misguided policies that create barriers to adoption, and hoard dogs. There also are " reputable" breeders in the show circuit who have disturbing, inhumane conditions in their kennels. On the other hand, there are many, many breeders and rescues that do it right, and promote animal welfare in their own ways. 

This is a question that is near and dear to me, as I grew up in the show circuit but have spent my adult life involved in rescue. When a sanctimonious rescuer insults breeders- they are insulting my family. When a sanctimonious breeder insults my rescue dog (this happened at agility a few months ago) - they are insulting my canine family. They are both idiots, but I prefer to not let idiots rule my world. 

However you decide to handle the questions- never lose sight of the fact that you are providing a charmed life to a dog- and nobody should apologize for that!


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## Granberry (Nov 17, 2014)

@CarolineK, very well said!


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## BeBe67 (May 13, 2015)

oooops I made a typo I meant to say snob. I sometimes feel people think us poodle owners are snobby for wanting a poodle. I have had people tell me that poodles are "fru fru snippy little dogs" Maybe these people have never seen a well adjusted poodle ?
The non shedding is a huge reason we have poodles. Me and my daughters are highly allergic to dog hair. The poodle is the only dog I could have inside also.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

BeBe67 said:


> oooops I made a typo I meant to say snob. I sometimes feel people think us poodle owners are snobby for wanting a poodle. I have had people tell me that poodles are "fru fru snippy little dogs" Maybe these people have never seen a well adjusted poodle ?
> 
> The non shedding is a huge reason we have poodles. Me and my daughters are highly allergic to dog hair. The poodle is the only dog I could have inside also.



Haha, that is very different! Yes, I do think that some people think that (just the other day someone asked me if Timi was a "French Poodle", which I take to mean "fancy schmancy" poodle), but at the dog park, when they see how she runs and flys through the air, I think they see much more than fancy schmancy, and understand that there is way more to her than her looks?


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## nifty (Aug 2, 2013)

Tiny Poodles said:


> Haha, that is very different! Yes, I do think that some people think that (just the other day someone asked me if Timi was a "French Poodle", which I take to mean "fancy schmancy" poodle), but at the dog park, when they see how she runs and flys through the air, I think they see much more than fancy schmancy, and understand that there is way more to her than her looks?


This is something that often gives me great pleasure at the dog park. Usually the most athletic and fun dog in the park is my Dulcie -- and even her feats of athletic bravura are eclipsed by those of a toy poodle who comes in now and then!  I think these two lovely poodles have given a lot of people at least at our dog park food for thought and a new appreciation for poodles!


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

nifty said:


> This is something that often gives me great pleasure at the dog park. Usually the most athletic and fun dog in the park is my Dulcie -- and even her feats of athletic bravura are eclipsed by those of a toy poodle who comes in now and then!  I think these two lovely poodles have given a lot of people at least at our dog park food for thought and a new appreciation for poodles!



Oh yes,me too! There have been many times when all of the people on the big and small dog sides stop just to watch Timi run - it makes me so proud!
And around here, most any other poodle that we run into is a puppymill dog, there just is no comparison between them and Timi.


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## Granberry (Nov 17, 2014)

Tiny Poodles said:


> Haha, that is very different! Yes, I do think that some people think that (just the other day someone asked me if Timi was a "French Poodle", which I take to mean "fancy schmancy" poodle), but at the dog park, when they see how she runs and flys through the air, I think they see much more than fancy schmancy, and understand that there is way more to her than her looks?


They may have meant "fancy schmancy"...or they may have just been my age and not very involved in the dog world. When I converse with my friends, every pug is a Chinese Pug, every poodle is a French Poodle, every shar-pei is a Chinese Shar-Pei, and every chow is a Chow-Chow Dog. It takes me a lot longer to finish my sentences than a lot of people.


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## vegas (Jul 5, 2014)

I grew up with a purebred mpoo, and we called her a French Poodle. I think that's what everyone called them at that time (the 60s and 70s). So I agree that age may be a factor in some of these conversations. Although that doesn't rule out the possibility that the speaker also thinks they are "fancy schmancy." In fact, one of the champions in our poodle's pedigree was named "Fancy Prancy." We thought that was a pretty funny name, which is why I remember it to this day.

A few years ago, when I told my niece I wanted to get a poodle, she simply asked "Why do you want a poodle?" I gave her my reasons, we had a nice conversation, and she was pleasant, warm, and supportive.

Her response impressed me, and I told her so. When she was younger, she almost certainly would have just made a face and said something dismissive about poodles being yippy or fru-fru. But at the time of this conversation, she had finished college and was preparing to enter grad school in Psychology. Her response made me realize that she was far more mature, sophisticated, and open to new perspectives than the youngster she used to be.

I think that the poodle prejudice typically comes from people who lack these characteristics.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

I don't know if the fellow who said French Poodle was even 30, so that's why I assumed it meant fancy schmancy rather than him being old school!


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## PlayfulPup (Aug 8, 2012)

vegas said:


> I think that the poodle prejudice typically comes from people who lack these characteristics.


I don't think the prejudice comes from people who lack those characteristics. It sounds like your niece, like me, started with a dislike of poodles, but was mature enough listen to another perspective. I don't know if she fell as madly in love with poodles like I did once I started talking to people with well bred poodles, but I doubt she still feels the same as before the convo. 

My BIL has a big poodle prejudice. He is a mature guy in most aspects, though brainwashed not to like them from his childhood by his older siblings. (They raised labs) He has several things he just does not like because of them. The siblings, older than him by 6-10 years, seem to keep not liking poodles as a joke and even had family wedding shower for them in a poodle theme. 

He has listened to why I want a poodle and pretty much just says labs are all that without being fru fru. I am pretty sure he will never say he likes poodles, but I know he will be able to admit he likes my poodle. I am actually getting started training my min pin to bikejor and my beagle to cart, so that when I get get my spoo my dogs will have already trained me  to do it well. Then I can impress him with the spoo' athletic ability while his lab drools on everything. Haha. (Their lab really is a sweet and the calmest lab I have known)


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## Greenfoley (Jan 26, 2011)

Tiny Poodles said:


> And around here, most any other poodle that we run into is a puppymill dog, there just is no comparison between them and Timi.


I had to laugh, in a way of course, at Linus' 6 month check up, the groomer for the clinic came in to meet him. He asked me where I got him and I answered that I went up to MI to pick him up from his breeder. He said something about he wondered if he was local or if I had to travel and my vet snorted and said "Yeah, no, they don't breed them like this around here, THIS is a GOOD Poodle" Proud momma moment there


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Greenfoley said:


> I had to laugh, in a way of course, at Linus' 6 month check up, the groomer for the clinic came in to meet him. He asked me where I got him and I answered that I went up to MI to pick him up from his breeder. He said something about he wondered if he was local or if I had to travel and my vet snorted and said "Yeah, no, they don't breed them like this around here, THIS is a GOOD Poodle" Proud momma moment there



Keep that Vet!?
When I was telling my Vet that I was concerned about Timi getting her rabies shot as I have heard of a lot of Toy Poodles have bad reactions to it, she said "oh no, I see hundreds and hundreds of poodles in my practice, and have never had a single one have a bad reaction", and I just glared at her and said "you don't see hundreds and hundreds of Toy Poodles like Timi".
Meanwhile, 9 months later, the lump from the rabies shot has still not completely gone away - not looking forward to the second one...


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## Countryboy (May 16, 2011)

Tiny Poodles said:


> Haha, that is very different! Yes, I do think that some people think that (just the other day someone asked me if Timi was a "French Poodle", which I take to mean "fancy schmancy" poodle), but at the dog park, when they see how she runs and flys through the air, I think they see much more than fancy schmancy, and understand that there is way more to her than her looks?


Another thought to that tho... I don't take French Poodle that way, 'specially from older people. At one time... '60s?? '70s??... that's what they were called. There's still one dear old woman at the park who constantly talks of her long-gone 'French Poodle'. Always 'French'. 

But when someone asks me that question, it generally occurs at the park, while both of us are looking at Tonka, and he's leaping around, lookin' like a fuzzy-muzzled, lanky Doodle basketball player, they can't possibly be thinkin' Fancy Schmancy. 

I love campgrounds in Quebec... where I get used to thinking of him as a Caniche Royale. That makes ME feel fancy schmancy! 

ETA - Ooooops TP! I've been out of this thread for a couple of days... missed some comments obviously.


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## nifty (Aug 2, 2013)

My experience matches Countryboy's. I am in my fifties and when I was a girl, poodles were universally called "french poodles". I thought that was actually the name of the breed and I think many other people thought so, too. While the name may have evolved from an attitude of "fancy schmancy" , I think for a lot of people in my earlier days simply heard it for the first time as the actual name.


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## nifty (Aug 2, 2013)

"He has listened to why I want a poodle and pretty much just says labs are all that without being fru fru."

I love labs - they are such dear dogs and when properly trained, outstanding companions and family dogs. Having said that, though, I don't agree that they are all that a poodle is except frou frou as your BIL says. For one thing, poodles don't shed and labs are shedding machines!


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## PlayfulPup (Aug 8, 2012)

nifty said:


> "He has listened to why I want a poodle and pretty much just says labs are all that without being fru fru."
> 
> I love labs - they are such dear dogs and when properly trained, outstanding companions and family dogs. Having said that, though, I don't agree that they are all that a poodle is except frou frou as your BIL says. For one thing, poodles don't shed and labs are shedding machines!


Agreed!


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## hellothereitsanna (Jun 7, 2015)

I like to be very honest with people, because even though these questions seem rude, the people who ask them are usually just as passionate/curious about their interests as we are about our poodles.

1. allergies. super easy answer. and even if you don't have allergies, I like to bring my dog everywhere I can and it's both more considerate and practical to have a dog who doesn't shed mountains of hair everywhere if you're planning on bringing them to friends' houses and public places all the time. (sometimes I wonder how other people can even handle living with shedding animals, allergy or not... but that's a discussion for somewhere else)

2. I tell people how much I paid for him, end of story. Most people in my area who ask are just curious and they're dog owners. Unlike a car with a price tag on the windshield, dog breeds are all over the map, and their appearance doesn't necessarily dictate the asking price. I have a friend who spent double what I did for Jasper on her english bulldog and if I saw Jasper and him side by side, aesthetically it's the equivalent of a ferrari parked next to an old ford pickup. Plus, I think telling people that poodles can actually be affordable helps to discourage the whole stigma of them being the "frou frou" dogs that some uninformed people still believe them to be. (don't even get me started...)


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

I have a friend who runs the vacuum cleaner over his lab's coat every day. The Lab loves it and he sheds very little!
Eric


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## Zea (Sep 23, 2014)

I realize what I'm about to say might come off as wrong and disagreeable, and that's not my intention at all! I just want to share my experiences, and why I ultimately decided to get my puppy from a breeder. So:

The term "rescue" bothers me a little. I adopted a dog, but I, in no way, rescued her from the brink of death. She was a young, cute dog that had been at the shelter for a few hours by the time I got there. Young and cute dogs are in high demand. If I hadn't adopted her, she would have been gone within the next few days. Certainly, there are animals that are rescued... but adopting an animal =/= rescuing an animal. But eh, it's just a bit of terminology, and is unimportant. 

I spent a little while volunteering at an animal shelter, and I learned a lot there. I want to be clear that it wasn't an entirely negative experience, but I came out with a much more negative view of the rescue world in general. It was fun working with so many animals, the kennel employees were amazing people, and I would adopt from there again, but the whole place had kind of a shady vibe.
First off - everyone _loves_ a sob story. That's why so many people ask where your dog came from, they want to swap stories and pat each other on the back. Rescuing a dog is such an easy way to make yourself look good. The sadder the story, the more adoptable an animal was. The shelter management would routinely lie about an animal's origins. We had a lab that was brought in because her owner was hospitalized for an extended time. She had clearly had a litter not too long ago, but was in good shape and generally a well-behaved dog. Her profile said something to the effect of: "she was from a puppy-mill and churned out litter after litter, and was kept in a kennel her whole life. Her neglectful owners got rid of her because she's too old to breed." Needless to say, her old owner was devastated. She actually made a full recovery and went and got her dog back, so it had a happy ending. But before that happened they were getting tons of inquires about this dog, the only reason she wasn't adopted sooner was because she had to be an only pet. 
Once a kitten with three legs came in and people were lining up at the door to adopt her. They had a cattery full of other kittens, but people were fighting to get this little girl, and leaving after she had been adopted. After all, a person who adopts a "broken" (yet perfectly healthy and functional) animal must be amazing, right? Meanwhile, the "normal" kittens would be put down routinely. Who wants a regular cat?
Animals would often disappear or be transferred to rescues that would then charge hundreds of dollars for a fully-vetted dog. Purebreds were almost never adopted out, under the excuse that they "might have a health problem." Instead, they were sent to breed specific rescues. Which, honestly, is probably for the best, since it cleared up room for other animals, but... it felt weird. 
Not to mention how downright rude some of the employees were to the volunteers. Most of them were great people doing their best in a stressful job, but some were crappy people doing what was required of them at a crappy job, if that makes any sense? I was frequently yelled at ("walk the dogs in the front!" "No stupid, you can only walk the dogs in the back!"), scolded ("you aren't allowed to talk to people" "why aren't you helping anyone?"), and frankly, some of the things they made me do seemed unsafe. I had to disinfect cages of animals who had parvo, and once clean out the cage of a dog diagnosed with rabies. I was terrified I wouldn't clean them well enough. 
I was recently looking for a puppy, and my first stop was petfinder. I don't really _need_ a show quality dog so I thought I'd take a look. The first dog I found who matched my criteria had an "adoption fee" of $950. Other rescues wanted more reasonable fees of $200-300, but required a fenced yard, no large dogs, no kids in the house or visiting regularly, etc.
So why didn't I go to a rescue? There are a lot of reasons, but really it had nothing to do with the dogs. To make a long story short, I didn't feel like dealing with rescue people.


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## Locket (Jun 21, 2009)

Thanks for sharing your experience Zea. People really do fall for the sob stories. It's too bad the shelter used that angle to gain more interest, especially lying about a dog's history.

My experience with rescue has been very positive, but as you said, it isn't the dogs that drive people away from rescue, it is the people.


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## TrixieTreasure (May 24, 2015)

nifty said:


> My experience matches Countryboy's. I am in my fifties and when I was a girl, poodles were universally called "french poodles". I thought that was actually the name of the breed and I think many other people thought so, too. While the name may have evolved from an attitude of "fancy schmancy" , I think for a lot of people in my earlier days simply heard it for the first time as the actual name.


Oh yeah, I totally agree! Back in the 1960's, I remember many a time hearing people refer to Poodles as "french poodles". It was just the way people described them in those days. So, of course as a kid, I thought that's what they were called. Even now, I still see greeting cards, and other poodle items out there which refer to poodles as french poodles.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Zea I don't think anything you said is off the mark. In fact, I think you brought up some very important points. As Locket (who has extensive rescue experience) noted it is the people who are often most challenging.

I guess we feel heroic when we take a dog from a bad situation or adopt the 3 legged kitten. I think is would be much more heroic for all of us who expect our dogs to have structure in their behavior and invest in training them to have fulfilling lives to rise up and point out that our goal should be a world where rescues are exceptional situations rather than regarded as an accepted aspect of the social order.

I am preaching to the choir, but train your puppies folks. Be realistic in what you want and expect and will accept in how your dog behaves and make it happen. Let's put rescues out of business by helping everyone to realize the potential present in nearly every puppy born through effective and consistent training.


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## o0Melanie0o (Aug 4, 2014)

Oh man, I got ripped a new one today for telling someone (on an online neighborhood forum I belong to) on how to find a reputable dog breeder. I got, "adopt, don't shop" multiple times and lots of people reporting me to the administrator of the group I answered a question in. Not only that, when I posted up about finding the golden retriever forum (the dog they want), I was tagged and told that they support breeders, those money hungry businesses, and that thousands of dogs are dying, so ADOPT!!! Holy cow, I just can't believe that these ladies will not listen to reason. You tell them that a purebred from a REPUTABLE breeder is not contributing to the problem but they tell you you're a liar and the only way to go is adopt. Had to vent, folks. I am the OP and jeez, I am glad that I have all of the responses on here to help me "defend" myself!!


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

o0Melanie0o said:


> Oh man, I got ripped a new one today for telling someone (on an online neighborhood forum I belong to) on how to find a reputable dog breeder. I got, "adopt, don't shop" multiple times and lots of people reporting me to the administrator of the group I answered a question in. Not only that, when I posted up about finding the golden retriever forum (the dog they want), I was tagged and told that they support breeders, those money hungry businesses, and that thousands of dogs are dying, so ADOPT!!! Holy cow, I just can't believe that these ladies will not listen to reason. You tell them that a purebred from a REPUTABLE breeder is not contributing to the problem but they tell you you're a liar and the only way to go is adopt. Had to vent, folks. I am the OP and jeez, I am glad that I have all of the responses on here to help me "defend" myself!!



A long time ago I concluded that a good percentage of the "Animal Rights activists" really have severe personality disorders, and animal rights, rescue etc just gives them a socially acceptable place to channel their pathological angst - if it wasn't for that they would be ranting about space aliens or whatever. So keep that in mind when you are attempting to reason with them ?


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## o0Melanie0o (Aug 4, 2014)

Tiny Poodles said:


> A long time ago I concluded that a good percentage of the "Animal Rights activists" really have severe personality disorders, and animal rights, rescue etc just gives them a socially acceptable place to channel their pathological angst - if it wasn't for that they would be ranting about space aliens or whatever. So keep that in mind when you are attempting to reason with them ?


LOL on the space aliens ! That sounds about right :laugh:


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## mvhplank (Dec 5, 2012)

Yeah, there's similar blind rivalry between the +R (positive reinforcement) proponents and the "balanced" (mix of +R and +P [positive punishment]) trainers, with the "balanced" trainers behaving in a markedly "unbalanced" way, making unsupported assertions about +R methods and unsupported anecdotes about how that method doesn't work.

Bless 'em, the +R folks quickly realize that it's futile to reason with them, any more than you can change a person's fiercely (and illogically) held political beliefs with reasoned arguments.

But, if you haven't given up on the "adopters" yet, you could say, "So, you want pet dogs to go extinct? If not, where do the healthy dogs come from?" But yeah, that won't fly far among the true believers.

M


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

OP sorry you got beat up by the rescue dogmatics, but it sounds like you did the best you could to provide them with evidence to support your case.

Tiny I agree with you about the rescue/rights personality disorders for many of those folks. Many years ago I had a student who I later became friendly with (she was older than most of my students and wanted to go to vet school). Her life revolved around having rescued a bunch of cats from a hoarding relative. While what she did in culling through who was too sick or crazy to rehome, getting homes for some and keeping about 5 or 6 of them for herself, her life became consumed by them. Her family was a mess (won't go into it here) but it seemed pretty clear that her horrible childhood and young adult life resulted in pathology related to the animals.

Marguerite I agree with you too about a lot of +R only trainers. Most of them that I have met don't have a very good understanding of the scientific basis of learning theory which does have four quadrants, not only +R. Recently a handler at my novice class who uses a clicker as her marker was clicking her dog literally every couple of seconds during the down stay. It was so distracting it made one of the other dogs (whose owner doesn't use a clicker) so nervous he couldn't stay. How is it instructive to click 20-30 times per minute, with food almost every click? That is just bribery. 

I think it is fine for people to want to be +R if they know how to make it work, but don't be a zealot and tell me I am an abuser for balancing my methods.


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## mvhplank (Dec 5, 2012)

lily cd re said:


> <snip>
> Marguerite I agree with you too about a lot of +R only trainers. Most of them that I have met don't have a very good understanding of the scientific basis of learning theory which does have four quadrants, not only +R. Recently a handler at my novice class who uses a clicker as her marker was clicking her dog literally every couple of seconds during the down stay. It was so distracting it made one of the other dogs (whose owner doesn't use a clicker) so nervous he couldn't stay. How is it instructive to click 20-30 times per minute, with food almost every click? That is just bribery.
> 
> I think it is fine for people to want to be +R if they know how to make it work, but don't be a zealot and tell me I am an abuser for balancing my methods.


That does sound like the clicker person doesn't understand how it works. The +R trainers who understand that "positive doesn't mean permissive" use "punishment" but not "aversives." You already know, but for the benefit of someone who hasn't gotten into the 4 quadrants, punishment is defined as adding or doing something designed to decrease the rate of a behavior. For example, Denise Fenzi (whose blog is worth following) uses "a cheerful interrupter" that redirects the dog without causing fear or anxiety. And she even admits to using the word "no."

I would be very surprised if your training involved techniques that cause pain, fear, or anxiety, so I don't think you're a "balanced" trainer. Fenzi and others I respect are the first to say there's no such thing as "positive-only" but they are very judicious in their selection and employment of "punishments." One other example is, if the dog isn't interested in working, quietly crate the dog and then, in view of that dog, work and play with a second dog (or even an imaginary dog) before checking back in to see if the first dog is ready to engage with the handler when asked again.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

But Marguerite you know that many people who don't understand this too well would say that physical corrections of any sort are not +R (btw I do properly use pinch collars on all my dogs).

The person who overuses her clicker is a +R zealot who thinks a martingale collar is an inappropriate tool and works her dog wearing a harness instead of a collar.


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## mvhplank (Dec 5, 2012)

lily cd re said:


> But Marguerite you know that many people who don't understand this too well would say that physical corrections of any sort are not +R (btw I do properly use pinch collars on all my dogs).
> 
> The person who overuses her clicker is a +R zealot who thinks a martingale collar is an inappropriate tool and works her dog wearing a harness instead of a collar.


That's a shame--that is, becoming a zealot without fully understanding what you're zealous about. It's drinking the Kool-ade--blindly following a path without checking first to see if it's based in reality.

Under the topic of "even a stopped clock is right twice a day," all my martingales are adjusted so the loop closes before the dog is choked. My ratties are notorious collar-slippers and this works to keep them safe. But I see way too many martingales adjusted so you can strangle the dog before the loop closes. (In many cases, it's the collar design that's at fault.) In my mind, that makes it an inappropriate tool--at least for my purposes. 

Harness? Just for tracking, thank you. I don't use pinch collars, but that's a personal choice and there are valid uses for them, if in the right hands. I use a black rope slip collar in the conformation ring and a rolled leather buckle collar everywhere else. If he gets really out of hand from excitement, I'll loop the leash under his chest and back through itself, improvising a harness, and the tightening when he pulls makes an effective, non-abusive +P when it's really needed.


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## sunshine (Jan 31, 2015)

I'm lucky in no one really questions why I would want a poodle.


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## TrixieTreasure (May 24, 2015)

sunshine said:


> I'm lucky in no one really questions why I would want a poodle.



Same here. In all of the years I've had Poodles, the only thing I've ever gotten was how cute they were, and how old they were, and what their names were. I even had people ask me how I came to want a Poodle. And of course I was always happy to explain. ?


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## Luce (Mar 4, 2013)

When I am asked "why a poodle"??

I tell them I am a self proclaimed terrible housekeeper and don't want pet hair all over the place. I will not vacuum or sweep twice a day - just not me

Luce is not from a reputable breeder, but most people don't know it! Even after 3 hip surgeries and no ball joints in her hips, she can still keep up with the others at the dog park, even the Italian Greyhounds! She's a natural retriever and when I had her in a Conti last year? Most people exclaimed "what a beautiful show dog!!"

Why a reputable breeder? Without pet insurance my $100 puppy cost over $5000 in hip surgeries and physical therapy within a ten month time period, from 1year and four months to two year 2 months old. With the insurance I still paid over $3000 since I didn't have insurance for the first hip which needed 2 surgeries and physical therapy.

Has anyone here paid that much for a pet quality puppy? 

That is why if I were to get another puppy in my life it will be from a reputable breeder. I want a loving companion to share my life with, I don't need to be called a hero or held in high regard for "rescuing" a dog.

I am far from rich, but when I purchased Luce there was a non written contract I agreed to - to take care of her, to provide love, enrichment, good nutrition and of course medical care. I go without the extras I "want" so I can provide for the lives I volunteered to take care of.

In case something should happen to my where I am incapacitated or worse and can not care for them, I have verbal agreements from 2 friends who will care for them, and if they can't my sister in NY will take them. They will not end up in a shelter and they will stay together.


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## Marcie (Aug 2, 2011)

Countryboy said:


> I have a theory. Not valid in all cases but I'm betting it's valid in most.
> 
> Rescues - start initially from the heart... can't possibly abandon this dog... whatever dog. So they take it home.
> 
> Then it happens again... and again... more dogs. But by now they're up to the limit that their municipality will allow. So, in a attempt to 'save' more dogs, they call themselves a Rescue. When it's really an excuse to assuage their desire to Save Everything!


I tend not to agree, but everyone has their own opinions. Poodle Rescue of Houston is a 501(c)(3) non-profit organization chartered by the state of Texas you can check them out at Poodle Rescue of Houston - Home 

This rescue was started by a professional obedience trainer and the owner of a prestigious boarding kennel who raises and show standard poodles. It is a nice facility and is able to have a small hospital as well as a full time groomer. 

They adopt to people in state, out of state, people that live in apartments, and people that live on ranches. One dog I know of that got adopted went to Alaska and then there were two that went to Germany. They adopt to people that are poor and people that are rich. 

They do background checks with your vet and if you have a good record with your vet i.e. regular check-ups and keeping your dog on heartworm, flea medication, if you guarantee that it will not be living outside and that you will give it attention and love, you will probably get approved. You will also be observed during your interaction with the dogs and how you react to them and how they react to you. 

There are other rescues in the area that don't specialize in any one specific breed and don't have the facilities that PRH has but they foster the dogs (only a specific number) in their homes. They screen potential adopters and place a lot of dogs in loving homes. 

I believe there are more true 501(c)(3) rescues that actually play by the rules than those that just call themselves rescues.

The only reason I know is because I was in the approval process at PRH while volunteering. I have approved and disapproved applicants and never once did I veto an applicant because they didn't have a fenced yard or that they lived in an apartment.

Dog parents still call to let me know how their baby is doing and how much they love him/her and don't know how they ever lived without him/her. 

Rescues are not all bad.


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## CT Girl (Nov 17, 2010)

My sister in law recently visited a rescue and adopted a rat terrier mix. She already had two dogs. This dog has bitten people and her other dogs, is not potty trained and came with giardia which he promptly infected her other dogs with. They just found out he also has heart worm. I have nothing against rescue but I think this one was very shady placing an aggressive dog with all these health issues especially as they represented that the dog was fully vetted. Just as you need to research breeder if you are buying a pure bred puppy you must also investigate the rescue organization if you are adopting.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

CT Girl your SIL's story points out the need to know who you are dealing with whether buying a puppy or adopting a rescue. Marcie I don't think anyone ever said that all rescues were bad, but clearly from CT Girl's post we can see that there are some shady folks involved with rescue. When you are dealing with a well known 501(c)(3) rescue organization I think it is much harder for the organization to go off the rails from its first and ongoing mission than if you find a rescuer who is operating as an independent. Many of those people rescue animals and then either can't give them up because they just can't (in their minds) find homes that are "just right." These folks are hoarders and have deep psychiatric issues. If they aren't hoarders and are adopting out animals they often don't have the resources to do the right testing for health, temperament evaluations and to generally make good matches between adopters and adoptees.


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

Marcie you are lucky to have a facility like that, it is different here totally and very had to adopt, I know I have tried. No fenced yard and I work full time in real estate. 

I am happy to hear that they also adopt to out of state, non here does that, most they will do is out of County. 

I know a lot of people, rich and not rich which would have given a dog a wonder home and lots of love.


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## MollyMuiMa (Oct 13, 2012)

When I was looking for a dog, I looked everywhere to 'adopt' and was very put off by most of the rescues ..........here, there are many and some are just puppy flippers! Most small dogs here are very desirable and unless it's a Chi you won't find one in our shelter! It's very easy to get 501 status here and puppy flippers and hoarders posing as 'rescuers' are common! The legit ones are almost too strict for most most ie; no small kids, no apts., must show your lease or deed to prove you are allowed pets, fenced yard etc etc etc !!!
So even though I didn't get a purebred, I didn't rescue either.........Molly was from a neighborhood 'oops' litter who was lovingly raised by a wonderful handicapped young man! ( I got her at 16 weeks) 
Here is part of a local Rescue's ad and it's pretty much the same all over San Diego. I think it's ridiculous that they charge more for a purebred and that they insist they be on the dog's Micro-chip!


P.S. $350 is a standard amt for a mix breed, but we have a few of the very well known publicized organizations
charging in the $500-600 range! A BIG difference than San Diego Animal Control or SDHS who adopts out dogs for less than 100.00 spayed/neutered chipped and shots!


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

Marcie- I'm glad you chimed in. I have also been very fortunate to be involved with a reputable rescue (all breed) and see how it should be done. They adopt 500+ dogs a year,and do it well. Been in existence since 2004 and are a well oiled machine. 

I was involved at pretty much every phase: interviews, vet checks, processing online applications, cleaning poop, writing grants, fostering,cleaning poop, picking up transports, giving vaccines, cleaning poop, inserting micro chips, removing sutures, cleaning poop, deworming, vet visits, and did I mention cleaning poop? There is no end to the work- or the poop- especially those puppies!

I did tons of interviews and would start off by saying "I'm going to ask you a lot of questions that may seem invasive, but bear with me because all we really want to know is that you are going to care for this dog appropriately until it leaves this earth. If that is your goal too- we'll be Ok"" It was a little comic relief that helped set a light tone, and people relaxed. Our requirements were pretty reasonable, but we did require a basic obedience class for most dogs under two. That sometimes was a bone of contention- but I liked that requirement. 

The fenced yard always seems to come up in these conversations, and I'm not quite sure why. I don't really see it as a definitive requirement with rescues in this area and almost all of the time, I didn't require it. BUT there are instances where it is necessary. We had a couple breeder seizures of litters of husky puppies- they were all adopted with that requirement- and a six foot fence to boot. Some puppy mill survivors need it- doesn't matter if they're 4 lbs., but it depends on the dog. Some puppy mill dogs are real flight risks because they don't walk well on a leash and if they get loose- they're gone. Those are exceptions. Most dogs don't need it, and may actually have a better quality of life because they get walked more often! 

So- I was fortunate to find a good rescue, but I originally investigated a different small breed rescue- the only one around here who occasionally gets poodles. But they were strange and I didn't get a good feeling and I've since heard unsavory rumors about hoarding. I also looked at a regional poodle rescue but they wouldn't let me foster, or even adopt because I have a doggy door. Didn't matter how much I explained how and when I close it off - it was just "no". But then you look at PRH and Carolina Poodle Rescue- they are both so awesome. My son recently moved to Austin Tx and I will be checking out PRH sometime- just got to see them! 

I backed off from rescue a couple years ago though. Partly because I was very busy, but also because I was emotionally spent and needed to walk away at that point. I'll probably get involved again someday, but not to the level I once was. But I know I had a part in saving many dogs that would have been killed in a shelter. That's an unbelievably good feeling, and I still keep in contact with a lot of the adopters. Hearing from them always makes my day! It is so wonderful to save those lives. Of course there's always the poop too

As involved as I was with rescue, my next dog will be from a reputable breeder, my mini parti poodle :dance:As I stated before- I don't see the goals of breeders and rescue as being all that different and I won't spend one moment apologizing for that pup- or my sweet rescue misfits!


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## blueroan (Dec 28, 2015)

I get it...we were going to get a rescue but then we thought again and decided on a purebred. Our reasons are simple: my mom is allergic and not many poodle or crosses out there in our area. Not every cross is hypoallergenic. 

Second reason was our dog was 7mths when we got him and he was totally unsocialized so I was unable to do most of the normal stuff like walking him or doing anything that had a possibility of another dog in the area. So with the new one, we want to start FRESH, clean slate, so we're going for an 8wk old puppy!


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## Marcie (Aug 2, 2011)

Carolinek said:


> My son recently moved to Austin Tx and I will be checking out PRH sometime- just got to see them!
> 
> I backed off from rescue a couple years ago though. Partly because I was very busy, but also because I was emotionally spent and needed to walk away at that point. I'll probably get involved again someday, but not to the level I once was. But I know I had a part in saving many dogs that would have been killed in a shelter. That's an unbelievably good feeling, and I still keep in contact with a lot of the adopters. Hearing from them always makes my day! It is so wonderful to save those lives. Of course there's always the poop too
> 
> As involved as I was with rescue, my next dog will be from a reputable breeder, my mini parti poodle :dance:As I stated before- I don't see the goals of breeders and rescue as being all that different and I won't spend one moment apologizing for that pup- or my sweet rescue misfits!


I hear where you are coming from. Rescue is a hard thing to do, fostering is even harder, I know I failed twice and now have 4 dogs. If you do get to come down to visit your brother in Austin and decide to drive down to Houston, let me know and I will meet you and show you around PRH. We really are proud of our facility. Every one that adopts from us is from that day forward, family.

As you know, at a rescue facility there is a lot of physical work as well as a lot of cleaning up poop, and/or vomit, feeding, watering, washing bedding and food dishes, washing wounds, changing bandages on broken legs, checking incisions on the dogs that have been spayed or neutered, making sure everyone of them gets their monthly heart worm medication, (the dogs that are heart worm positive have to have limited activity until they are though their treatment and are under constant care), there is medicating and bathing the mange dogs, holding the frightened ones and trying to reassure them, and crying for the ones to far gone that you just can’t save. Rescue is an emotionally draining activity and not for everybody. 

Most people who adopt do not see the work that goes into each and every dog at the rescue or how much each and every one of them is loved by the volunteers. When you handle these dogs you begin to know them and it is hard to let them go unless you know for sure they will be loved and taken care of. They joy of placing the right dog with the right owner is priceless!

I don’t berate anyone for going to a reputable breeder or to a rescue to get their dog, they just need to love it and care for it forever!


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

Marcie- I'm actually sitting in Albany Airport right now waiting for a flight to Austin to visit my son! We'll only be down for 5 days, so not a lot of extra time, but in future trips- no time on this trip for a trip to PRH, but it is definitely in future plans.


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## Marcie (Aug 2, 2011)

Carolinek said:


> Marcie- I'm actually sitting in Albany Airport right now waiting for a flight to Austin to visit my son! We'll only be down for 5 days, so not a lot of extra time, but in future trips- no time on this trip for a trip to PRH, but it is definitely in future plans.


Next Trip!!! You will like Austin and the surrounding area. I have a sister that lives just outside Austin in Dripping Springs, TX.


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