# at my wits end!



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

I am at my wits end with my dogs barking - I had controlled Ginger with the ultrasonice signal thingie - but Teddy did not heed it! Now he has Ginger getting desensitized to it to - I dont' understand that they are obedient in everything BUT BARKING! why is that - they toally look right at me and continue to bark - at least Teddy does - its like he is trying to tell me there are people or dogs outside and he thinkgs I don't get it! He is a thorn in my side in this area - otherwise he is pretty good now except for his excitement issues - but Sat. morning when people walk early and are in their yards - oy! the barking drives me nuts!

honestly, I don't think even Cesar could stop them!:doh:


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

its embarassing that i can't control my dogs!


----------



## BlueSpoo (Mar 29, 2010)

Oh dear, you are not giving me much hope for Alf! In the crate, outside, oy. Unless at my side (or entertained enough by Pearl), or eating- YIP! YIP! (So yippy for a spoo! I should be glad his voice hasn't changed yet.)

Sorry I can only commiserate & watch the thread!


----------



## Stella (Apr 6, 2010)

I feel your pain. My male Shih Tzu (9) does the same thing!!:doh: He only does it when someone enters the house. It drives us crazy! 

I would love to hear suggestions for this problem. Thanks for this thread Pamela.:flowers:


----------



## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

We are working Olie with this - have you tried using a spray bottle? This worked for Olie until we had a showdown where I was holding it facing him and he looked at me and pissed on my living room floor lol - 

I just stay on him when he does it. I go to him and if i have to put him in sit and hold his muzzle. He is improving slowly. Good luck


----------



## Fluffyspoos (Aug 11, 2009)

I'm starting early to avoid this.. everytime Vegas barks or even tries to bark I clap my hands, sterny say no, or give a collar pop. My other dog is a barker and it's REALLY irritating, so far Vegas is really good about it and won't continue after being corrected.


----------



## WonderPup (Oct 26, 2008)

BlueSpoo said:


> Oh dear, you are not giving me much hope for Alf! In the crate, outside, oy. Unless at my side (or entertained enough by Pearl), or eating- YIP! YIP! (So yippy for a spoo! I should be glad his voice hasn't changed yet.)


That's funny. Saleen has a really high pitched "yippy" bark as well though every once in a while her big dog bark makes an appearance. 

Pamela, you ever thought about going back and trying the advice I gave you before you switched to the sonic thingy Yes it takes awhile, and Yes you have to be 100% consistant but it does work and works better in the long run than a correction type method. Honestly dogs WILL learn to ignore corrects, you can do all the collar pops and ear flicks and spraying with a spray bottle you like and a lot of dogs will just decide it is still worth it to bark b/c the barking is rewarding. Why not drop the dog whisper mindset and go back to what was working in the first place? REMEMBER that before a behavior completely go away it may suddenly get stronger and then it's extinct. It's called an extinction burst. If it is more rewarding NOT to bark the dog will choose a different behavior but if it's then why should the dog stop. Sure she may get into trouble but she still got to bark and that just might be worth it to her. 
Little side note on dog's learning to ignore certain things, they do the same thing with various training collars and harnessess. Eventually a lot of dog's learn that they can tolerate the pinch collar or the shock collar or the harness or the gentle leader. Yup, I have a dog who learned, thanks to John, to pull with her gentle leader on. It's important to remember that those are TOOLS as was the sonic thing not the actual training. 



Fluffyspoos, I WISH YOU LUCK with stopping the barking. Ugh, I know how hard it can be when you've already got a barker in the house. The tibbies are barkers which is kind of to be expected since they is what they were for but still. We have an older dog that has made sure the behavior trickeled down to all the younger dogs so when somebody walks in the house it's chaos. My mom isn't super consistent so the behavior is very very strong  When I moved away and took Howie and Wonder with me they were barkers but now two 1/2 years later they are MUCH better being away from Raven. Rav, also passes her fear of storms along. Mr. Wonderful has only been there right at a year now and he has turned into a barking, thunder fearing pain in the you know what. Wish I hadn't let her take him now. I thought about taking him back but he's going to be a bear to retrain and I just don't have the time until Nicholas is older.


----------



## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

Whenever Teddy barks to alert me to something going on outside, I praise him for letting me know (i.e., doing his job). Then if he continues to bark after that, I say "enough" while pointing my finger at him and giving him a stern Mommy look. He usually gets it. Lately though, he hasn't even barked at the neighbors coming and going. 

I'm not trying to brag, I'm just trying to say that I'm finding positive reinforcement to be a much better training tool than punishment.


----------



## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

Marian said:


> I'm finding positive reinforcement to be a much better training tool than punishment.


I agree with this too - when they are quiet if even for a short while when they are typically barking - praise them - I do this as well


----------



## Purley (May 21, 2010)

My Shih-tzus always barked and barked when someone came to the door. I used the Cesar method. I said "hey" or made Cesar's noise and I touched the one that started it on the side. Then when he stopped, I went on to the next one -- touched him and said "hey". They still bark now, but at least I can stop them after a couple of barks and they now don't go on and on.

But I still have to say "hey" and touch Tyson. If Tyson stops then Sam does too.


----------



## yigcenuren (May 3, 2009)

My rat terrier Butter, barks when she has a buddy to bark with. Her original pal, Peanut, used to get her riled up terribly and when no one was home they'd bark for hours non-stop. The neighbors hated us. Now that Butter is alone she doesn't make a sound... literally. The last time she barked was early fall of 2009. I'm not suggesting you get rid of one of your dogs, and I'm not familiar with what you have tried, but have you tried separating them to see if it's easier to get one dog to stop barking when he/she is alone?
Just throwing out options for you. Hope you find a solution soon.

Monica


----------



## PolarBear (Mar 6, 2010)

My dog likes to bark too. I was watching a tv pet show the other day. Don't remember which one. Their solution to stop barking was to train your dog to bark on command and then show the bottom of your hand and say stop. This did appear to help. They showed the dog barking and responding to the stop command. I was thinking about tring that.


----------



## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

WonderPup said:


> That's funny. Saleen has a really high pitched "yippy" bark as well though every once in a while her big dog bark makes an appearance.


Teddy's big dog bark is so cute. He means business, buster, let me tell you. LOL


----------



## BlueSpoo (Mar 29, 2010)

PolarBear said:


> My dog likes to bark too. I was watching a tv pet show the other day. Don't remember which one. Their solution to stop barking was to train your dog to bark on command and then show the bottom of your hand and say stop. This did appear to help. They showed the dog barking and responding to the stop command. I was thinking about tring that.


I've been trying this for 2 years w/ Pearl.  Thankfully she isn't a barker anyway.


----------



## puppylove (Aug 9, 2009)

I don't tolerate barking at my house. I have fostered a number of dogs and they all learn early that barking for no good reason (and there is very little reason at my house) is a big no-no. I have had a lot of success with a squirt bottle. 

Of course, one method does not work for every dog. I have also used the coins-in-a-can or whacking a rolled-up newspaper across my hand to startle them. Popping when leashed sometimes works too. And always rewards for good behaviour!

My own dogs learn to speak and they learn Shh. Hoot is very good about Hushing. Jackson has pretty much learned to stop barking but he continuues to sort of growl (sounds exactly like Chewbacca!) and I'm having some trouble getting that to stop on command.


----------



## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

puppylove - I had to laugh about your Chewbacca comment because that's exactly the same noise Teddy is making right this minute (he's playing with the cat).


----------



## Birdie (Jun 28, 2009)

Saleen gave you some really excellent advice. If the barking is a serious behavioral problem for you, as it seems to be, I would definitely work with getting your dogs to ignore the distractions altogether through R+, instead of temporary ways to shut them up (like sonic things, squirt bottles, collar pops, etc). That's really the most rewarding way to do it, in my opinion. It takes a while, but is so great in the long run. 

However, I don't find sonic noises or squirt bottles to be all that bad for occasional use to get your dog's attention away from the distraction. At the daycare I work at, we use a squirt bottle on dogs who bark all the time, and it works like a charm. I would NEVER use it as a permanent solution though. It simply does not solve the behavior, just puts it on pause. 
Same with the sonic things, same with the loud noises, etc. They may work at the time, but it really is best to work with your dog to really get to the root of the problem. At work, I can't do this, as they are not my dogs, and I can't train with them, but if they WERE my dogs, I know a spray bottle would not be my main course of action. I think using them as a tool to control the dog to get it to focus on YOU for training is okay, still not what I would love to do, but some dogs do need that water in the face to "wake them up" a bit to get them to listen to you. 

I also like Marian's advice of praising the dog for barking once or twice for alerting, but only a bark or two. I do this with Desmond, who has recently discovered that barking at people is fun. Ugh, it gets on my nerves!! But if he barks twice then stops, he gets praise for controlling himself. If he barks territorially in an excessive manner, I move him away from the distraction (the door), and have him sit and focus on me.


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

Thanks for all the comments - now let me tell you HOW they bark - first of all - they run to the door or the window and bark like they are rabid attack dogs - they almost go through the door - they can't even hear me correcting them - they appear to be very vicous - which they are not. If outside - its the same thing - the people going by must be very scared - I would be! - Yesterday some people were walking by with their dogs and I was bringing mine in - Teddy was in and I was attempting to bring ginger in when Teddy got loose - he ran right over to the people and I thought he would attack or bite - but he didn't - he just barked and barked and finally came in. I could handle it if it were a yippy bark or a bark that is warning me someone is here etc - but this horrible barking like they are attack dogs drives me crazy.

Wonderpup - I was getting somewhere with Ginger you are right - but Teddy complicates things - I just can't handle them both - even on a walk - if no one comes along we are ok but if someone or a dog does - I can't control the two of them. I need two hands to correct Ginger like I used to be able to do and I know I can train her - but with Teddy along too its impossible. So should I just get out the treats when they start and see if they will come back to me to get a treat? Teddy would probably if he could hear me say 'treat' or smell it - lol - Ginger - I don't know - don't know what to do anymore. Unfortunately I wsnt finished training Ginger when I got Teddy so he just picked up her barking - if I get them in a sit Ginger will calm down - Teddy will jsut look at me and keep barking.


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

I feel so guilty thinking like this but sometimes I wish I had never gotten Teddy.


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

Oh not because he is a bad dog - its just the two of them together and she has enough issues I had to deal with already - he ws so quiet and gentle when he first cam (of cours he was very sick so that's prbably why lol) and each one alone I could handle. oh well - just at my wits end...


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

Oh PS I did try the spray bottle like the trainer told me to - but it doesnt work - they just run away and keep barking. Nothing distracts them - I will try the treats I guess.


----------



## spoospirit (Mar 10, 2009)

_So sorry to hear that you are having so much trouble with barking. I know it really annoys me too when dogs bark too much. Billy and Taffy are big barkers but they are protective of us and their space. They had started to bark our of control so I had to do something to stop it. When they got excited and started to bark I would ask them "What is it?" and go to the patio door to look. Then I would tell them "OK", praise them for alerting me, and then make them go lay down and be quiet. 

I had to do this for a while before it became routine for them and now they bark and look at me and when I say it is OK, they walk away from the door satisfied that they did their job.

I don't know if this will help you or not but I do hope you find a solution that works with your dogs and brings you peace of mind.
_


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

thanks - I tried this with Ginger and I think it was working - the problem now is Teddy gets so violent - that's the only word I can think of - he will trample me - just now on the porch someone walked by and he jumped right on top of my daughter-in-law who was laying on the chaise - I mean it was crazy and he could have hurt her - I know if I was on there I would have gotten some bruises! he's just out of control - don't know why


----------



## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

Is he getting enough exercise? 

I think I would keep him on a leash at all times, and when he barks, give him a verbal correction accompanied by a quick collar pop. I think maybe he has too much freedom, and you need to show him that it's your house, your rules.

I wish all the best with this. I can understand how it must be driving you crazy.


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

Thanks Marion - I had that thought also about keeping him on leash. No he doesnt get enough exercise but again, I have trouble walking the two of them - my foot has been hurting also - I wish I could get him to do the tread mill.


----------



## spoospirit (Mar 10, 2009)

Marian said:


> Is he getting enough exercise?
> 
> I think I would keep him on a leash at all times, and when he barks, give him a verbal correction accompanied by a quick collar pop. I think maybe he has too much freedom, and you need to show him that it's your house, your rules.
> 
> I wish all the best with this. I can understand how it must be driving you crazy.



_I agree with Marian's advice. Keep him connected to you all the time so that you have control over him. It sounds like he has taken the position of pack leader and isn't showing any respect for you._


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

yeah I think you are right - he thinks he is in charge but not of Ginger - go figure!


----------



## bigpoodleperson (Jul 14, 2009)

I think you should start a Super Strict NILIF program with both dogs starting ASAP! They go outside seperatly to be walked or go to the bathroom On Leash (if they were mine i would also put a gentle leader on them both to give you more control, and when you pull up it shuts their mouth so they cant bark and you get control/focus on you)! They both need to go back to square one with their training. Can you play ball with him in the yard to get more exercise? You must find someway to get him the physical exertion he needs or all the training in the world wont help. It is going to take alot of work on your part, but in the end it will be so worth it! 
Do you have a fence? If you cant recall or control them then leashes on both. Also have them drag leashes in the house to control them window barking. I think gentle leaders would be ideal in your situation. 

I hate to say it, but maybe you should consider rehoming Teddy if you cant handle him. Im sure there is a poodle rescue who would take him and find him a home with someone who has experience dealing with a dog like him.


----------



## Desiree (Feb 14, 2010)

I'll offer a different approach to your problems. I'm not a treat/ clicker (great for pups) I'm assuming these are adult dogs with established behavior patterns. 

Your dogs do not respect you. They should come when you call them in even if they want to bark at the fence. I would have hauled them in by the scruff for not obeying my "here" command. They should not put their feet on or trample people in order to get what they want. It's rude! A pack leader would not let that behavior go unchallenged. Your dogs know when you are hurt and unable to correct them and will take full advantage if you let them. 

Exercise and obedience training is the key. The dogs must be trained to walk at heel individually on and off leash with distractions, then together. Do not let these dogs walk in front of you on leash without permission and then only for a few minutes and only one at a time. Every time I forget break this rule with my dogs they will slowly start barking at and then charging other dogs on the walk.

The barking must be controlled at all times. Don't the dogs have access to bark at people went your not at home. Confine them to crates or in a room where they can't practice this annoying behavior all day long. When you're home and they get started tell them Noooooooooo! in a *low* serious, growly voice. I usually take the dog by the sides of the face, front feet off the ground, and look them the eye while doing this. Then quiet. Release.Then praise good quiet. Then I might tell them "go lie down" and drop a chew toy to keep them busy. Again train them one at a time until you establish new behavior patterns.

Tether the dog while it outside on a flat buckle collar so it self corrects when he tries to fly at the fence. Change the length of the cord every so often so he doesn't know how much length he's got. He'll start learning to control himself and give to the collar. 

Sit, Stay, Heel, Here, Down, Quiet. These must be obeyed regardless of all distractions. And remember never give a command your cannot or will not enforce! Good Luck with your Poos!


----------



## Winnow (Jan 2, 2010)

How much exercise are they getting ?

I can tell how much Dima will be barking by the amount of exercise she gets
When she gets board she tends to bark more.
Its not that annoying and she does not just bark out just for the fun of it 
but instead of one or two barks when we have visitors it turns into 10 or so.


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

Desiree said:


> I'll offer a different approach to your problems. I'm not a treat/ clicker (great for pups) I'm assuming these are adult dogs with established behavior patterns.
> 
> Your dogs do not respect you. They should come when you call them in even if they want to bark at the fence. I would have hauled them in by the scruff for not obeying my "here" command. They should not put their feet on or trample people in order to get what they want. It's rude! A pack leader would not let that behavior go unchallenged. Your dogs know when you are hurt and unable to correct them and will take full advantage if you let them.
> 
> ...


Thanks again - you know its funny - they obey me for every command except to stop barking - its like they don't think I know there is danger or something. If I am physically near them I can make them lay down - its that initial reaction - everything is quiet and all of a sudden they are up -especially Teddy - trying to find a window or door if inside or charging the gate in the fenced yard - and its so ferocious - like they would eat you alive - but they have never bit anyone - its weird - when people come to call I can control them - they are so obdient when walking in town - I know Ginger has fear issues and I guess she doesnt feel protected by me and Teddy has learned the behavior from her but is worse than she it. I will try what you suggest but its hard in two rooms with two dogs - Teddy has a crate - Ginger doesnt - I mean it was her crate before he came but he can't be left out when I am not there because he will eat the house - he had that separation anxiety. 

here is another thing - both my dogs are attached to me at the hip -to the point of almost being nerotic - i wonder if that has anything to do with this -


----------



## Desiree (Feb 14, 2010)

I understand the realties of living with 2 big, active dogs in a small space. I just moved from a studio apt to a 2 bedroom house. I found that you must get the dogs outside for, free running, retrieving, and/or training daily. On the days that I could not get them out, they a least got a car ride so they weren't so bored. It's a HUGE commitment in time and energy to them calm a happy in a small space. It was so much easier when I only had one dog. But now that their both trained it sooooooo much easier.

I forgot to mention that leave the radio on when you leave so its not so quiet while your gone, they'll be less reactive that way. But remember Poodles are very territorial dogs and will put on a big aggressive display if allowed. My 3 yr old male has just started barking at people and dogs when he is in the car. He's been quiet for 2 years. I've probably heard him bark 5 times max up till now. I'm going to have to teach the quiet command now, after he alerts me.


I cannot help with separation issues as I have never had to deal with that issue. One of my dogs is very clingy and likes to follow me around the house. I've just trained her to go to her bed in another room when this gets annoying. 

I can only suggest that training long out of sight stays (work up to 20 min.) first together as a pack and then individually as they develop more confidence. If you have a large fenced area to work it this it's great.

Sounds like you've got your hands full.


----------



## cbrand (Aug 9, 2009)

I think this is a hard habit to break because it is either a habit or the dogs legitimately think that this is their job.

I think you should get e-bark collars. Let the collar to the work for you.


----------



## Desiree (Feb 14, 2010)

I think you should get e-bark collars. Let the collar to the work for you.[/QUOTE]

Great idea! But if you decide to go that route make sure you get a good one. 
I had a Spoo that learned to time her barks so she'd only get a warning vibration. Then it started going off at weird times; don't get a sport dog collar.


----------



## BlueSpoo (Mar 29, 2010)

I had poor luck using the ebark collar on a golden lab- it never fazed her (much like e-fences, I assume. The only dog I've EVER rehomed- she went back to the breeder, after the mother bitch bit a child severely).

PS There were long-standing aggression issues in both dogs.


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

Today I had some success with the barking - we were on the pool deck and they heard someone going by - I was fortunate enought to grab both of them by the collar as they sped past me to climb the stairs to see and bark - I put them both in sit stay and made them stay with me until I knew the person was gone and then they ran to the stairs- saw nothing- and came and lay down. Up on the screen porch - again the same thing (only they can see better up there lol) I made them down stay and they actually did - so I dont know what's up except that we were up in our old stomping grounds (where we used to live). I know its going to be a hard road - I hope I can persevere! right now they are so good - both just finished eating and laying down on their beds in the living room while I am on the computer. I do have a fenced in yard and will have to get busy with the training - I just need the motivation and energy! lol


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

I think Teddy frustrates me on so many levels that he may have picked that up -like when I am fixing my supper (after he has eaten his) he stands around and begs for mine - when I tell him to lay down on his bed and point to it - he actually comes up and sniffs my finger in case I might have some food on it - I swear he is obsessed with food! This really annoys me - I don't know why but it does - I am a baaad mother. He is such an affecitonate dog and I just don't have it all the time for him - I feel bad - I do love him but sometimes I don't - not like I love Ginger - I wonder if he can tell, I mean when I pet her he comes too and I pet them both. Annoying - Ginger doesn't do that if I am petting him - he just have to have the same attention or even try to get my hand off her when I am petting him too. But he loves her.....dunno


----------



## Desiree (Feb 14, 2010)

Pamela said:


> I think Teddy frustrates me on so many levels that he may have picked that up -like when I am fixing my supper (after he has eaten his) he stands around and begs for mine - when I tell him to lay down on his bed and point to it - he actually comes up and sniffs my finger in case I might have some food on it - I swear he is obsessed with food! This really annoys me - I don't know why but it does - I am a baaad mother. He is such an affecitonate dog and I just don't have it all the time for him - I feel bad - I do love him but sometimes I don't - not like I love Ginger - I wonder if he can tell, I mean when I pet her he comes too and I pet them both. Annoying - Ginger doesn't do that if I am petting him - he just have to have the same attention or even try to get my hand off her when I am petting him too. But he loves her.....dunno


Pack leaders eat first! Put the dogs on a down stay and have your dinner then feed them. You don't have to pet them both or pet them at all when they demand attention. When I'm petting one of my dogs and the other comes and gets pushy for attention I tell the pushy one to go away and wait for their attention. This teaches the dog patience and clarifies that he won't get what he wants by being pushy with me/people; but by being patient and having self control good things will happen. 

You see, when Teddy nearly trampled the girl the other day he was being pushy. He's just testing the waters to see how pushy he can be before he must accept his position in your family. This is normal dog behavior; being patient is a learned skill. From British retriever training books I've learned that no dog is naturally patient. This is something a dog must be worked on regularly, some more than others depending on disposition of the dog. 

Have fun, your on the path to learning true pack leadership, its very exciting to see even the smallest success. Keep working at it! If you try to reflect on the number of times he's being pushy/demanding each day, you may surprised how many times he gets to be successful each day using this strategy.


----------



## neVar (Dec 25, 2009)

i love me some spray collars kiah does not quite get it (So much hair being an aussie) but it still corrects here. new dogs n my house house gthe spray coller on the minute they try to bark in house. 

mylittle dog WILL be quiet at command but you gotta keep at him. big dog is pretty good0 he barks in the yard but if you tell him to shush he will. 

The big thing is when they are running aronud like loons barking you don't have their attention why WOULD they listen (it'd be like asking them to SIT at that moment) you need to be able to get their attention before the command. And yes sometimes an e coller will be the only answer if they are loose the throw can might work to grab their attention rather then a shhh i'd call them for a sit and a reward IF it was me. 

The other way to approach this is to teach them to bark0 then you can teach a 'shhh' command . However still yo need to have their attention for the shhh to work


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

Desiree said:


> Pack leaders eat first! Put the dogs on a down stay and have your dinner then feed them. You don't have to pet them both or pet them at all when they demand attention. When I'm petting one of my dogs and the other comes and gets pushy for attention I tell the pushy one to go away and wait for their attention. This teaches the dog patience and clarifies that he won't get what he wants by being pushy with me/people; but by being patient and having self control good things will happen.
> 
> You see, when Teddy nearly trampled the girl the other day he was being pushy. He's just testing the waters to see how pushy he can be before he must accept his position in your family. This is normal dog behavior; being patient is a learned skill. From British retriever training books I've learned that no dog is naturally patient. This is something a dog must be worked on regularly, some more than others depending on disposition of the dog.
> 
> Have fun, your on the path to learning true pack leadership, its very exciting to see even the smallest success. Keep working at it! If you try to reflect on the number of times he's being pushy/demanding each day, you may surprised how many times he gets to be successful each day using this strategy.


You are right about Teddy being pushy - he almost knocks me over sometimes because he wants to be first. I have had some success with him but he seems to forget so easily - he has a puppy mentality and sometimes I think he is a little slow that way. He doesn't always understand what I am telling him. Its a miracle that I have gotten as far as I have with him so that measn I must persevere right? lol I think you are on the right track - I just hope I can do it. I always fed them first to get them out of the way lol but it doesn't get him out of the way anyway - he is obsessed wtih food. Ok soooo if he is like a puppy I must train as such right? Thanks!


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

Oh PS - when he breaks the rules I get frustrated and yell - I know I must not do that if I want to be successful. Calm assertive - calm assertive - calm assertive - lol its hard with him!


----------



## Desiree (Feb 14, 2010)

Ok soooo if he is like a puppy I must train as such right? Thanks![/QUOTE]

I don't how old this dog is, I assume he's an adult at least 18 months old. If he is, and you've throughly trained him, then he may just be pretending to forget. My boy does that sometimes, its an avoidance response because he doesn't want to do what you want: he wants to do it his way. As if you didn't know all ready Poodles are SMART and like all dogs; they do what works. So you'll see all kinds of creative avoidance responses with Poodles.

My dog will also pretend to forget when he is overwhelmed by the task. Then he starts to get loose, bouncy and goofy. Unfortunately he spent the first 10 months of his life in a kennel and while he's overcome much of his less than desirable start; he will probably always find certain tasks (like water retrieves) too complex and stressful. So I have to except his limitations and enjoy him as is. He's a great cuddle bug!

So break everything down to its basic components and teach; then expect compliance but if he has lack of socialization issues or no complex learning chains before 4 months of age; he may have problems with complex tasks. But good leadership and hard work with lots of repetition and positive reinforcement will get most dogs through basic obedience/ manners with no problems.

And no yelling, woman's voices are too high pitched and tend to excite dogs. Sounding like a squealing prey animal will not get you dog's respect.  Calm down and teach, teach, teach; there will be ups and downs. There is no such thing as perfection; not for dogs or humans.


----------



## BlueSpoo (Mar 29, 2010)

Desiree said:


> And no yelling, woman's voices are too high pitched and tend to excite dogs. Sounding like a squealing prey animal will not get you dog's respect.


My youngest squees & I have told him the DOGS DON"T RESPECT SQUEEING!
They're sure he wants to play, sigh. I can't wait for his voice to change-'leave it!' high enough to break glass isn't doing it!

Oh, PS Alf is barking much less crated now, he has been so good! I have just tried to be consistant & patient, no big breakthroughs.


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

yes - no yelling - its hard for me - I forget sometimes when he frustrates me! lol but he is doing better the last couple of days. I make him sit and stay before he goes out and let Ginger out first - i have done this before and he does forget - I will probably always have to remind him to sit. Although on the walk when I halt - he sits - somehow he got that - funny - I think he does have some retardedness though - I can't teach him what a ball is - you know I tell Ginger get the ball and she gets the ball - poor Teddy just looks around and looks around like he doesn't know what to do - I did teach him to catch it - at first it just hit him in the face - soft ball - and he will fetch it but not know where to put it when he comes back - he usually drops it a few feet from me. He really is like a puppy but he will be 4 this year - we think - 

He is smart with some things like = he knows how to open a door - he is an escape artist - but he likes his crate now and feels safe in it so even though he has broken most of the latch it seems to hold him for now. i bought a new gate to it but it didn't fit - my crate is old.

He knows sit stay lay down heel halt and he comes when I call him - not that independent - just like a really big pup. when I am calm he is fairly calm but is a very very excitable dog. - has a bundle of energy - I have been letting them run free in the yard near the pool for the last couple of days and made him swim with me for a bit - even though he just wants to get out! funny they dont' run and play that much in their oversize nice fenced yard but if you let them out in a smaller space they run - go figure!


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

The first two years of Teddy's life I think he was mostly on his own with a lot of other dogs - they told me he was very skinny when they took all the dogs from this old woman who couldnt handle them anymore - she was a breeder - there were several poodles and a whole litter of labradoodles. Teddy is probably fixated on food because he had to fight for it then - I guess - the dogs must have opened the doors to go out and such - I wish I knew more - He is a very affectionate dog and absolutely great with children - I think he likes it that Ginger is his only palymate although he loves it when the minis are upstairs and he gets to play with them. Maybe he doesn't like any strange dogs because he doesn't want it to be the way it was the first two years - I don't know - Cesar says dogs live in the now so I don't even know if he remembers it.

The advice I am getting here is being very helpful. I am remembering that I need to stay calm and speak low and authoriative and they do respond. the issue of barking at stangers will probably always be one - I mean I am glad that they do that because I feel safe alone in the house with them but I just want them to responsd to my command to stop. So work work work thanks a lot for all the words of wisdom!


----------



## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

I am wondering if the woman was a breeder or a back yard breeder because I notice the lines in Teddy are not like Ginger - at first I even thought he might be a doodle but don't now. He has a certain something with his back leg too - sort of slightly crooked and weal but he runs like a greyhound - can't catch Ginger though lol but he is smart enough to know where she will come out and he takes the shortcut and waits for her to emerge from the woods. funny doggie - I wish i could teach him what a ball is - he looks so perplexed when Ginger fetches for me and brings the toy back. or she gets the ball for me when I tell her. I feel I can communicate better with her - but he is loveable and he is just Teddy. I am very encouraged by the last couple of days.


----------

