# No more tear stains for Lumi and Amala!



## PammiPoodle (Jul 16, 2011)

I've been wanting to post this forever, just never had time to root up an old tear-stain picture of Lumi! And now that I have two dogs whose tear stains have gone away, I'm even more excited to let you guys know what's worked for them! : ) I've been giving Lumi and Amala a product called "Tidy Tears" by Primalix. I think it can only be bought online. I order it from a company called Natural Wonder Pets. If you search these names online it's easy to find, it's also for sale on Amazon and other places. I just like buying from the source, plus you can get a bulk savings if you buy a few bottles at once. My fellow discerning Poodle-people can read about the ingredients on the site, but I'll tell you what's *not* in it - antibiotics! That's what makes Angels Eyes work and most people who are giving that to their dogs don't even know that! Anyway, just wanted to share the results I've had with this product that has healthy and safe ingredients. It's a liquid that I drip over their food every day. 

I swear I'm not being paid to post this! : P I'm a groomer and I rave to my clients about it, too. I just want people to get their dogs off of perpetual antibiotics. Also, it seems to work because it boosts their immune system, so I love seeing my girls with bright white faces now! : )

Here's a before of Amala, taken a few weeks ago.



And this was taken last night.



Here's Lumi from last summer.



And here she is now.





I couldn't use a straight-on picture of her since her doughnut mustache hides half her eyes! : P With Lumi I've noticed she does occasionally get light stains. Over time, that's happened less often and when it does happen it's getting lighter and lighter. I figure I may see the same with Amala. It seems the longer they're on "the stuff" the clearer their tears are. It took a good two months (as advertised) to see any results from Lumi. Amala only took about a week, probably because she's so young that whatever problem causes stains hadn't really had time to take root. Ahh, youth!


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## frankgrimes (Nov 28, 2011)

Wow! That's awesome! Such a difference. Now you can see their pretty eyes!


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## Milo :) (Mar 10, 2013)

Wow! They both look great. This might be something I try.

I will admit that I tried Angels' Eyes before I knew too much about it. It worked (a little bit), but once I learned more about it I decided to get off of it.

I heard tear stains decrease with age? Is that true?

Anyway, how long did it take for you to see results in your girls?


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## CT Girl (Nov 17, 2010)

Those pictures are very convincing. I got sidetracked before but will definitely order this tomorrow. Swizzle's stains are mild; I hope this eradicates them. I will post when I see how it works for him.


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## Milo :) (Mar 10, 2013)

Another question...how does it taste? Is it bitter? If it is, how are you disguising it so your dogs will take it?

I may be going to school to learn human medicine right now..but my animal medicine etiquette needs improvement. Milo and I played the "spit it out" game this afternoon for a while :ahhhhh:


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## elem8886 (Sep 19, 2012)

Lumi and Amala look great!

I'm happy to hear about a product other than Angel Eyes. Tika used to have tear stains and I would have loved to be rid of them. Her tear stains did clear up with age, she was around 4 when she stopped staining. (She has little stains now and then because of eye irritation. It's really hard to keep her fuzzy/soft topknot out of her eyes unless I grow it out and band it. I wish there was something for that :rolffleyes


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## pgr8dnlvr (Aug 7, 2011)

The results look great, but I'd worry about the ingesting of tea tree oil. I work in a vet clinic and we are constantly warning people about the dangers of tea tree oils, just in case your dog ingests some, and now, here's a product they want you to specifically get your dog to ingest? 

Sometimes we have to take a grain of salt with "holistic" and "herbal". People seem to think that if these words are used the products are gentle or safe, however there are a heck of a lot of "natural herbs" that are down right toxic. 

Anyway, glad the product is working for you, Lumi looks absolutely PERFECT with her clean white face! Can't wait to see what colour she'll be sporting next!  

I just wish that breeders would spend more time concentrating on breeding those dang weepy eyes out of toy poodles, even if it means they can't be as small as they are now..

Rebecca


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## NorthJerseyGirrl (Aug 15, 2011)

The pups look great but I am still a little dubious about food additives for tear stains. I may try it, but meanwhile I hope you don't mind if I put in a plug for the shampoo below, Malaseb. It was prescribed for my other dog's dry skin (he doesnn't tear) but I thought I would try it on my red pup too and to my surprise it took away her stains and kept them away for about 3 days. That is better than any other product I have found. I use it as a spot cleaner between shampoos. Malaseb: Medicated Shampoo for Dogs - VetRxDirect.com


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## LauraRose (Dec 26, 2012)

Adding ACV to Lula's water did the trick for her tear stains. 


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## Marcie (Aug 2, 2011)

LauraRose said:


> Adding ACV to Lula's water did the trick for her tear stains.
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


What is ACV?


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## Indiana (Sep 11, 2011)

Wow! They look amazing!. ACV is apple cider vinegar, which seems to have so many uses! Good for digestion, good for skin...probably lots of other things too


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## Marcie (Aug 2, 2011)

LauraRose said:


> Adding ACV to Lula's water did the trick for her tear stains.
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


How much do you put in the water? Like 1 tbs per quart?


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## PammiPoodle (Jul 16, 2011)

*Milo,* it took two months to see results on Lumi, and for the next month or so it waxed and waned a bit to make me wonder if it was really working! : P Her face got consistently whiter, though, over time and now I almost never see stains on her. And when I do they're really light. With Amala they were gone in about a week and I haven't seen any sign of their return! Yes, it's smells a bit vinegar-y and at first Lumi, my once picky eater, would try to eat around it. I just mixed it into something really delicious, like peanut butter and nutritional yeast, and she started looking forward to it every day! Now I just drip it on her food, no frills, and she just eats it. But, she's not really picky anymore. Amala's too young to know that she even has options so she just eats what I give her! : P Haha No trouble getting her to eat it. And as far as tear-stains decreasing with age, I've heard of a lot of puppies who outgrew them once they got all their adult teeth in and their head stopped growing. I think it might have to do with the growing head structure, which is also crowded with the adult teeth growing under the surface, not yet having good drainage for the tears, so their eyes water more and the stains happen. Once the head takes proper shape and the teeth all settle in where they belong, everything can flow freely and the eyes stop watering so much. That's what I've heard, I'm no vet! : P With dogs who stop having tear stains later in their life, I'm always so curious as to what changed! I would love to know what really causes tear stains!!

*Pgr8dnlvr*, thank you for the word of caution! I'm taking the girls to the vet on Friday, and I'll bring the label with me and see what my vet thinks about it! : ) 

*NorthJerseyGirrl,* this is just a gut feeling so could certainly be wrong, but I feel like tear stains are an indicator of something amiss in a dog. Actually, I feel like Lumi should be tear stain free without the help of Tidy Tears, but that there may be something wrong in her life (not enough exercise?, too much stress?, too much or too little of something in her diet?). But, until I can find that missing puzzle peace, it seems to me that this product is meeting some need for her! : ) And, I *thought* it was safer than antibiotics, but now I have my worries! Even antibiotics, I think, can improve health when used responsibly, but I'm just not keen on the indefinite use to keep the stains away. I'm glad you found a shampoo to help, though! When Lumi was staining sometimes it would get so bad the stained hair would harden against her muzzle and I had to use skin-soothing shampoo on her face since her skin would redden under the stains. : ( And this was in just one or two days after a wash! Gah, you can see why I'm so glad to have them gone!

*LauraRose,* yes, how much ACV to water? My dogs have multiple bowls that get changed throughout the day (grooming shop, they get full of hair!), so I'd need to pre-measure and keep their ACV-water in a bottle for refills. : P


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## PammiPoodle (Jul 16, 2011)

Just to follow up, I did show the ingredients to my vet and asked her specifically about the Tea Tree oil and she wasn't concerned. The girls are continuing to do well on this stuff!


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## Smurfette's Mom (Jun 9, 2013)

I plan to give this a try. I'll keep you guys updated. 

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## NorthJerseyGirrl (Aug 15, 2011)

I have been using the apple cider vinegar that LauraRose recommended with very goid results. The tearing is not gone but much reduced. But around the same time I changed her kibble and her probiotic so I am not quite sure where the improvement comes from. I have a poodle friend trying the ACV now to see if we can isolate the cause. Also, my dog's "brother" toypoo loves to lick her eye gunk... but that alone was not doing the trick.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Tangee, my Apricot had great success with Eye Envy (and I like it because it's topical, not something that they ingest) - I lost her "before" pictures when the laptop that they were on died, but if you go to their website, you can see the before and after pictures that I gave them there.
Just an FYI, apparently it was her teeth that causes the staining that she had from the day I got her, because she had to have all but 5 teeth pulled this past winter, and immediately, her tear staining shut off like a light switch - no more Eye Envy needed...


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## pgr8dnlvr (Aug 7, 2011)

Which "eye envy" products did you use? How much was the monthly cost?
Do they label what the "natural herbal antibiotic" is?

Pammi, glad everything is good with your vet concerning the product you've been using! Is everything still going good with it?

Rebecca


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

pgr8dnlvr said:


> Which "eye envy" products did you use? How much was the monthly cost?
> Do they label what the "natural herbal antibiotic" is?
> 
> Pammi, glad everything is good with your vet concerning the product you've been using! Is everything still going good with it?
> ...


I always used the one that had to be refrigerated - a 2 ounce bottle would last a couple of months with several packages of the eye pads (very important to buy their pads, because they are very thin, and what they absorb is all the product that you need - if you use a regular cotton pad, you will just be wasting the product (and I did not soak the pads in product as they suggest, but just put a little on a clean pad right before using).
I did not like that they don't reveal their ingredients, but my Vet said that a topical antibiotic a few times a week would not be absorbed enough to cause a problem (after the initial week or so doing it daily, about 3 times a week was all that she needed). She used it for 9 or 10 years, and it was great, but like I said, since she had most of her teeth removed, the tear staining just shut off, so we don't need it anymore. My silver Teaka is from a different breeder then my apricot Tangee and never tear stained.


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## liljaker (Aug 6, 2011)

Adding ACV (a few drops) in the pup's water is a good overall preventative and it also works for dogs who have allergies and get itchy ears, etc. and it helps from the inside out. I pretty much added it to Jake's water all the time once he transitioned to raw, and felt good about it. ACV has so many uses. For best results, get the unfiltered with the "mother" in it. You will see the link below takes you to an article that mentions tear staining specifically.

Bragg is a very good brand. http://bragg.com/products/vinegarPets.html


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

I just wish that breeders would spend more time concentrating on breeding those dang weepy eyes out of toy poodles, even if it means they can't be as small as they are now..

Rebecca[/QUOTE]

My favorite breeder's dogs never tear stain - even the extra tiny ones, and she says that's because they have correct eye structure (my tear stainer is from a different breeder). 
It always shocks me when I see pictures of other breeder's champions that have tear stains - apparently the show world does not care about it, so it's no surprise that many of us pet poodle owners continue to struggle with the issue.


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## PammiPoodle (Jul 16, 2011)

I love the ACV idea for it's simplicity! Seems so healthy and natural! My girls just have so many water dishes that are changed so frequently due to hair accumulation (we have a grooming shop in our home) that it'd be tricky to measure out the ACV so often. Maybe some day when we have a different setup going on we can try it!

*Pgr8dnlr,* I took them both off of the Tidy Tears about 3-4 weeks ago as a test, and now Lumi is starting to get staining again. She's going back on it! Amala still does not have stains, so I might hold off longer with her. 

*Tiny Poodles* and *Pgr8dnlver,* I also think staining can be influenced by breeding, as well as general health and well-being. It seems to me that so many people (including breeders, judges, and vets) think it's just a normal state and not indicative of a problem. Therefore it's "acceptable" and many people will not even look for a solution. Maybe they're right. But I look at it the same way as dry skin, excessive tartar build-up, a dull coat, or brittle nails. Genes will predispose dogs to different issues, but in an ideal state of health, none of these things are chronic or constant. But, unfortunately for some dogs, the genetic hand they're dealt may be too much to overcome without the use of "big guns" like antibiotics, steroids, etc. My goal is to find the right diet and lifestyle to keep my girls in that ideal state without the extra immune boost from Tidy Tears, but if they do end up needing it forever, I'm okay with that. After all, I don't know if being naturally stain-free is possible for them on a genetic level. Emotions also have a huge effect on body chemistry, which determines whether or not the yeast can thrive in bodily fluids such as tears. So I'm always working on building their confidence and making sure their life is as fun and worry-free as possible. Amala is one happy-go-lucky girl, though Lumi still has some demons. : P So I'll keep trying to take Lumi off the Tidy Tears every few months as she conquers more of her fears. : ) That might be the final puzzle piece for her!


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## CT Girl (Nov 17, 2010)

I just wondered if you continue to have good results with tidy Tears PammiPoodle. If so I will order it.


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## PammiPoodle (Jul 16, 2011)

*CT Girl*, yes, the girls are still on it it and tear-free! Sorry I took forever to respond - haven't been on in a long time! Here's a picture of them from about a week ago. Did you try it already, or try something else? How's it working out?


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## Manxcat (May 6, 2013)

Hey welcome back! The girls are looking really lovely


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## PammiPoodle (Jul 16, 2011)

Manxcat, thank you! I've missed my fellow Poodle addicts!! : ) I'm putting together a "catching up" picture thread for some of the 'dos and cute moments since I posted last. I can't believe it was all the way in September! Is Pushkin new!? Congrats!!! Your sig picture reminds me of my two; the older Lumi is usually standing at attention looking at me, and Amala is usually in a play bow trying to get someone to play with her. Seems there are a lot of similarities, no matter the size! : P


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

Nice to see you back! I missed seeing Pink Lumi in your sig!


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## Chagall's mom (Jan 9, 2010)

:wavey:Been wondering how you and the girls are were doing, *PammiPoodle*! I thought maybe you were on a very _loooong_ walk!  Really nice to see you posting again. The girls look_ adorable! _Glad they're tear-free, and fear-free for walks still, I trust? It will be great to catch up with you three. I'll be watching for your photo thread update.


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## Manxcat (May 6, 2013)

PammiPoodle said:


> Manxcat, thank you! I've missed my fellow Poodle addicts!! : ) I'm putting together a "catching up" picture thread for some of the 'dos and cute moments since I posted last. I can't believe it was all the way in September! Is Pushkin new!? Congrats!!! Your sig picture reminds me of my two; the older Lumi is usually standing at attention looking at me, and Amala is usually in a play bow trying to get someone to play with her. Seems there are a lot of similarities, no matter the size! : P


Will check out your thread! Pushkin is a 3 year old mini we adopted at the end of Sept from a couple in the town, so he's actually a year older than Pippin, but she's the boss! He's a sweet, dim cuddlebug


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## CT Girl (Nov 17, 2010)

We have missed you, welcome back. I did not order as I was unsure but now I definitely will now. The proof is in your girls that it works.


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## Carley's Mom (Oct 30, 2011)

I try to bring this thread up every once in awhile. So an oldie, but a goodie.


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