# Spinal problems ?



## Jenspoo (Mar 25, 2009)

For about a year now we've known something is wrong with my little guy (poodle bichon mix) So last month I took him to the vet and she said is was spinal deterioration. He had some lumps and hasn't been feeling weel so we had her check all that too. No testing or anything she said the lumps we're probly fine but to help him getting up or down off the couch/bed and not to let him jump in and out of the car by his self. So we've tried.

Sunday night when we got home he was shaking and I could tell he was in pain...so I called the vet Monday and asked if there was something we could give him for the pain. Then she said it sounded like a slipped disc and she need to know what it was before she gave him something...So this means she wants to charge be for another visit (ok but I was already in for this nad she said what she thought it was....) now she's saying it's sounds like it's something different? I don't want to go to the vet to run a bunch of tests that are all going to lead down the same road. SO now I'm thinking should I even take him in? He's acting 'normal' now. He's going on 8 years old so I know that he's now a spring chick anymore but I don't think he's in so much pain that he's ready to be put down either. Any advice? Anyone been through this before?


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## Sivaro (Sep 19, 2008)

Im sorry but that is cruel when a dog is suffering and you wont take him in to the vets. You cant pretend that the pain is going to go even if he may be having a good day and showing no pain. If his spinal problems are really bad do the kind thing and pts the dog. No dog needs to suffer. 

I know its a costly procedure to keep going to vets but with pet ownership you have an obligation to that dog. If you can find someone else to help you with the money for now that would be good. Find an honest vet that will tell you about the suffering this dog will endure, if it need to be on meds for the rest of its life, if the dog is going to get worse as he is ageing. 

Sorry but it irks me when ppl say they are bad one day and when they cant afford it then all of a sudden things are ok.


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## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

if he has deterioration of the spine it could cause a slipped disc - just thinking along the lines of us humans - one thing causing another. I woudl take him in - the vet may be able to splint him - and slipped discs can bother you one day and be ok the next but you need to have a complete diagnosis and pain meds for him. Good luck to the little guy!


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## spoospirit (Mar 10, 2009)

_It sounds like this poor little one has some serious, ongoing problems that will never get better. And, I agree with Sivaro. When you own a pet, you have a responsibility to it. Take him in to see the vet and at least get him on some medication to help him with his pain. But if he has no chance of living a life without chronic pain, I would definitely consider doing the kind thing for him._


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## Jenspoo (Mar 25, 2009)

Sivaro said:


> Im sorry but that is cruel when a dog is suffering and you wont take him in to the vets. You cant pretend that the pain is going to go even if he may be having a good day and showing no pain. If his spinal problems are really bad do the kind thing and pts the dog. No dog needs to suffer.
> 
> I know its a costly procedure to keep going to vets but with pet ownership you have an obligation to that dog. If you can find someone else to help you with the money for now that would be good. Find an honest vet that will tell you about the suffering this dog will endure, if it need to be on meds for the rest of its life, if the dog is going to get worse as he is ageing.
> 
> Sorry but it irks me when ppl say they are bad one day and when they cant afford it then all of a sudden things are ok.


Please don't flame me he's been to the vet several times this would be his 4th visit in 6 months....

I guess I miss represented myself, he has been to the vet several times as mentioned and I have mentioned this and that to the vet but NOTHING has ever come of it. Last year every great once and a while he started yelping if we picked him up wrong. First time we thought he pulled something. Happened in the fall and we took him to the vet she has just felt around on him and said he's fine. 
The appt the vet set from me calling Monday was today and he has seemed fine the last few days......I did cancel it. I think she's going to put me off again. When I took him last month I thought she was going to do something about the tumor but she just felt of it and said it's fine she doesn't think it's cancer she said she could remove it if it gets bigger. I'm just wondering if there is something otc to give him for the pain or when I can tell he is in pain....

This happened with my mom's dog too the dog had a liver shunt but every time my mother took him in he looked fine and the vet couldn't fine anything wrong until things went really bad. There really isn't anyone else around here except this creepy guy...

What is pts? (put to sleep?) I don't think it's that bad yet. Sunday night was the first time that he's shaked. The other thing the vet said was 'he's fine now but when he drags his paw then that's bad' That was last month. I have no idea what she's talking about.


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## Jenspoo (Mar 25, 2009)

Another question.....is it the right thing to put them to sleep right when you find out something is wrong or do you wait....gosh now I'm really confussed...My husband doesn't feel it's time yet either.


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## roxy25 (Dec 18, 2008)

Jenspoo said:


> Please don't flame me he's been to the vet several times this would be his 4th visit in 6 months....
> 
> I guess I miss represented myself, he has been to the vet several times as mentioned and I have mentioned this and that to the vet but NOTHING has ever come of it. Last year every great once and a while he started yelping if we picked him up wrong. First time we thought he pulled something. Happened in the fall and we took him to the vet she has just felt around on him and said he's fine.
> The appt the vet set from me calling Monday was today and he has seemed fine the last few days......I did cancel it. I think she's going to put me off again. When I took him last month I thought she was going to do something about the tumor but she just felt of it and said it's fine she doesn't think it's cancer she said she could remove it if it gets bigger. I'm just wondering if there is something otc to give him for the pain or when I can tell he is in pain....
> ...


WOW I would find another vet asap ...... She sees a tumor like lump but does not run a test to see if its cancerous ????? I know the decision to do that is up to you but the fact that she did not tell you more about it is WOW 

IMO it sounds like your vet just waits till something gets worst to test the dogs. My gsd had a tumor like lump on her chest and it ended up killing her. 

has the vet xrayed you dog ? There is no way a vet can tell you something is fine with out some kind of imaging on the area. I know you can palpate the area but if it has to do with slipped disk or something with the bones an x ray is a must. 

There are Drugs that could be given to ease the pain but you need to have some test run on him to see what is really going on.


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## Sivaro (Sep 19, 2008)

Jenspoo said:


> Please don't flame me he's been to the vet several times this would be his 4th visit in 6 months....
> 
> I guess I miss represented myself, he has been to the vet several times as mentioned and I have mentioned this and that to the vet but NOTHING has ever come of it. Last year every great once and a while he started yelping if we picked him up wrong. First time we thought he pulled something. Happened in the fall and we took him to the vet she has just felt around on him and said he's fine.
> The appt the vet set from me calling Monday was today and he has seemed fine the last few days......I did cancel it. I think she's going to put me off again. When I took him last month I thought she was going to do something about the tumor but she just felt of it and said it's fine she doesn't think it's cancer she said she could remove it if it gets bigger. I'm just wondering if there is something otc to give him for the pain or when I can tell he is in pain....
> ...


Sorry hun, I just care for dogs so much it upset me when I see posts where ppl wonder if they should take their dogs to the vets or not. Most do know the answer and that is yes regardless if they seem fine for a few days. It is a major problem especially with the spinal problem he does have. Yes pts is put to sleep, that was only a suggestion as I dont know how bad the dog is. Its just an option if the dog suffers more but only you know that cause you can see what the dog is doing infront of you.

The other reason I get upset is cause I have told some of my customers (Im a groomer), when something was wrong with their dogs. Most ignore it, some listen to my advice. One particular lady had a cocker that was matted from head to toe and it took me hours just to clip all the coat off. When he was clipped off, there was a massive lump on his rump, I mean huge. The lady come to pick the dogs up and I said please take him to the vet cause if its was I think it is ............. She said she would. Months later she rang to bring him back for a clip, booked in a maltese shih tzu also. She fronted up the next day and only had the x with her. I said wheres the cocker, she said what you predicted months ago was right on the head. She was looking out of her kitchen window and the dog was sucking water back rather than licking it out of the bucket. She went out and the dogs tongue was missing. Raced it to the vet, and that lump I seen was infact cancer and she didnt bother taking the dog. It bursted and all the acid went throught he dogs mouth and burnt the tongue away. Painful bloody death and I really shot the woman down in flames. Ive mentioned alot of things to customers to whom havnt listen and their dogs suffered so I get upset.

Now again, Im only going by your post, and I cant profess to know what is wrong but it does sound serious. Us as human have to realise that a dogs pain tolerance is higher than ours so it takes quite a bit for a dog to complain and show pain, which is why I said this dog still need a vet. Shame you only have one though, a second opinion is always good.


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## Sivaro (Sep 19, 2008)

Jenspoo said:


> Another question.....is it the right thing to put them to sleep right when you find out something is wrong or do you wait....gosh now I'm really confussed...My husband doesn't feel it's time yet either.


hun If the vet thinks its serious enough to do it then do it. Some vet will lie and take your money regardless so I hope you have an honest vet. Just keep your eye on whats going on, if you see the pain is really bad and there is no hope for the dog, its kinder to pts.


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## Sivaro (Sep 19, 2008)

roxy25 said:


> WOW I would find another vet asap ...... She sees a tumor like lump but does not run a test to see if its cancerous ????? I know the decision to do that is up to you but the fact that she did not tell you more about it is WOW
> 
> IMO it sounds like your vet just waits till something gets worst to test the dogs. My gsd had a tumor like lump on her chest and it ended up killing her.
> 
> ...


Good advice


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## WonderPup (Oct 26, 2008)

I can understand the relectance to shell out more cash with this vet. I might ask for a second opinion from a different vet, since you're going to have to pay the office visit fee either way. Just go and collect a copy of his medical reccords, the office staff should have NO problems providing you with this, and take those with you to the new vet. That way they will have all the information. 

I think the choice to let your baby go is up to you, but if a condition can be treated and managed then why not do that?


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## FUZBUTZ (Aug 23, 2008)

I agree with Pamela. If the vet said that your little guy has a spinal deterioration, I think that it is probable that he now has a sliped disc, since it would be hard for the spine to hold the disc in place, and I would bet that it would cause him a lot of pain. My hubby has spinal deterioration and has had some of his discs removed due to terrible pain and still has a lot of pain in his back and legs, because where the discs were, he has now grown scar tissue, that is causing the same type of pain that the discs originally did. The thing is, a person can tell you about his pain. Sometimes just by looking you can't tell how bad of pain a person in in. Just think, our poor fur friends can't talk and tell us how bad that they are actually hurting, but by the way you have described how he has acted on and off, I would guess that he is hurting pretty bad. Yes, he needs to go back to the vet, at least some vet, and you should tell them that you want to know what is wrong with your pet, and then do what ever seems right for your friend and companion, no matter what that might be.


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## spoospirit (Mar 10, 2009)

_I had to let my baby go about a month ago and know the agony and uncertainty of it. It is a very lonely place to be and I am glad that your husband is working through this with you and is helping to make the decisions. If the day comes that you feel you have to make that decision, you will know it in your heart and will be there for each other. 

Until then, get another vet as the others have suggested. Maybe a vet who actually cares about your little one will find a way to make his life more comfortable with treatment and medication that will control his pain. It is difficult to see a loved pet suffering and you have my sympathy._


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## FUZBUTZ (Aug 23, 2008)

Very well said Spoospirit. I agree totally with everything you have said.


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## Purple Poodle (May 5, 2008)

I agree with finding another Vet, we humans want a second opinion all the time when we are sick but don't ever think of that with our pets. 

I hope you can get something for his pain and find out what the lump is.


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## Jenspoo (Mar 25, 2009)

I'm going to try her one more time.....I don't think she's out to get my money. I think she's putting off telling me he's going to die. Which I already know. I know we'll at some point have to put him to sleep. He's still barking at the mailman and running to bark at stuff outside so I don't think he's there yet. BUT in the mean time if he's having a bad day and I can tell it I would like to ease the pain up. 
The tumor is the size of a quarter it's not that big it's hard to feel the groom has said nothing about it, but I was expecting to get the needle (whatever it's called) When I set that appoint. I asked how much and it wasn't even that much like 10 bucks so I have no idea why she didn't do that...


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## passion4poodles (Apr 11, 2009)

I am sorry to hear about your little one, and I have read all the post and it is all very good advice. I would want to find a diff vet.....good luck


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## spoofan (Dec 11, 2008)

Jenspoo said:


> Another question.....is it the right thing to put them to sleep right when you find out something is wrong or do you wait....gosh now I'm really confussed...My husband doesn't feel it's time yet either.


It depends on many aspects.
You need to have a good talk with your vet.
Ask many questions.
Take a good,long,hard look at the prognosis.
Consider your financial situation.
What quality of life will your pup have?
And mainly....forget about yourself and think ONLY what's the best choice for your pet.
Making the decision on your pet's behalf to allow them to depart without pain and with dignity is the very last give of love you can give them.
Wishing you strength in this difficult time.


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## KamelotMom (Mar 28, 2009)

Jenspoo - If your only vet choice is the one that seems to be doing nothing, I would suggest that you write a list of questions for her. Remember YOU are the one who is paying HER money. So "he with the gold makes the rules" (my dad's saying). Don't let her walk in do a cursory exam and walk out the door. Go through your questions and, right in front of her, check off each time she gives you an answer until all your questions are answered. I know I hate when people who are effectively my employee (because I am paying for a service) just rush me through like I'm a piece of meat and they have more meat to push through the pipeline. Take your husband with you if you need backup when pushing her to actually use her brain and try and figure out what is wrong with your baby. She may still try and rush you through her "pipeline" but in the long run you will stand out to her and she should treat you with a little more respect. 

btw - On an aside... My shoulder surgery surgeon (done 1/15/09) tried rushing me through. About the 3rd time I noticed he was doing this and I still had questions I made him come back into the room and answer them. I figure... How many times have I had to wait because a doctor was "behind" for one reason or another. It was my turn to be the reason. Now when I see him he has a genuine smile and takes more than the original 3min I got the first 2 times I saw him.

Good luck and I hope everything gets better with your baby.


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## Jenspoo (Mar 25, 2009)

KamelotMom said:


> Jenspoo - If your only vet choice is the one that seems to be doing nothing, I would suggest that you write a list of questions for her. Remember YOU are the one who is paying HER money. So "he with the gold makes the rules" (my dad's saying). Don't let her walk in do a cursory exam and walk out the door. Go through your questions and, right in front of her, check off each time she gives you an answer until all your questions are answered. I know I hate when people who are effectively my employee (because I am paying for a service) just rush me through like I'm a piece of meat and they have more meat to push through the pipeline. Take your husband with you if you need backup when pushing her to actually use her brain and try and figure out what is wrong with your baby. She may still try and rush you through her "pipeline" but in the long run you will stand out to her and she should treat you with a little more respect.
> 
> btw - On an aside... My shoulder surgery surgeon (done 1/15/09) tried rushing me through. About the 3rd time I noticed he was doing this and I still had questions I made him come back into the room and answer them. I figure... How many times have I had to wait because a doctor was "behind" for one reason or another. It was my turn to be the reason. Now when I see him he has a genuine smile and takes more than the original 3min I got the first 2 times I saw him.
> 
> Good luck and I hope everything gets better with your baby.


Thanks....

This is what I'm going to do...write the list with all his problems and my questions. First I don't want to put him down if it's something we can contol for a while but I also don't want to keep him alive in pain. So I scheduled another appt with her on Monday. My gut tells me right now most days he's ok but there are days that he's not. 

You know this is my first dog and I have enjoyed him very much couldn't ask for a better pet but this part of his life it is very difficult. I wish it was easier.


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## FUZBUTZ (Aug 23, 2008)

Jenspoo, I really feel for you. I know how scary it must be for you right now. I sure hope that your gut feeling is correct and that your baby has many more good days then bad and that you can get something for him to help him on his not so good days. I know you'll do whats right when that time comes, because I can tell that you love your fur baby a whole bunch. Good luck at the vets Monday, and please keep us posted as to what you find out.


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## Jenspoo (Mar 25, 2009)

*update*

Well we went to the vet and I feel much much better now.....she took an x-ray and there is a slipped disc, so she gave me some pain pills for it only if I can tell he's in pain. She said her husband has a slipped disc too and the pain comes and goes and this is what I think is happening with Toby. There are days that he seems like it hurts and then days like today where he's 'normal'. But now I have peace of mind about it....


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## FUZBUTZ (Aug 23, 2008)

Jenspoo, Thank you for your update. Glad yo hear that you got something to help your little guy with his pain on his not so good days. Heres hoping that there are a lot more good days then not so good. Glad to hear that you are feeling better too.


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## passion4poodles (Apr 11, 2009)

I am so glad to hear he is doing well, and you were able to figure out what was wrong...keep us posted!


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