# Zeuter



## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

Never heard the term before....what is it?


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## twyla (Apr 28, 2010)

Chemical Neutering instead of surgery


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## Poodlerunner (Jul 4, 2014)

I never heard of this before. Just last night me and Danielle were worrying over the spay/neuter thing. (I have a girl, she has a boy). He does not have any annoying male habits like marking yet. I wonder if this might be a good option for him! Thanks.

pr


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

*Zeuterin/zeuter*

If you type the word in your search engine you should get the Ark Sciences information about the procedure. I need optimal muscle growth because Wilson is going to be a mobility /balance service dog. It is certainly an alternative worth looking into.


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## Poodlerunner (Jul 4, 2014)

Charmed said:


> If you type the word in your search engine you should get the Ark Sciences information about the procedure. I need optimal muscle growth because Wilson is going to be a mobility /balance service dog. It is certainly an alternative worth looking into.


I did google it. I can't wait to hear how it goes with Wilson. Poor thing... it doesn't sound like fun.

pr


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

Nike (Wilson's littermate), already had it done and he is back to herding the goats. He has also quit "harassing" the female dogs in his family. My daughter said the hardest part was keeping him confined and quiet for the few days after the injection. Nike was a bit dopey with the sedation, but not like anesthesia. I'll let you know how Wilson does here in California.


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## Shamrockmommy (Aug 16, 2013)

I don't know much about it except that it can be painful, make sure he's got pain meds. 

I let Jack stay intact 19 months before I could no longer stand it. He's much, much nicer to be around now. 
Let us know how it goes!


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## FireStorm (Nov 9, 2013)

Please let us know how it goes! I'm interested in it for Hans. He's just past the year mark, and he lifts his leg outside and went on a hunger strike when the neighbors' dog was in heat but that is the extent of his "male" behavior. We have been debating about leaving him intact but thought Zeuterin might be a good alternative. We haven't done anything yet just because he doesn't act like other intact males I've had so we thought maybe he is a late bloomer or something. I want to make sure he's fully mature.


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## sparkyjoe (Oct 26, 2011)

This is so funny, I literally just sent a note to the Zeuterin company asking if there were any vets in our area trained in it's use!

Our Fletcher is almost 7 months, and I had intended to wait to castrate him until he was 12 to 14 months old.

Zeuterin is currently only FDA approved in pups 3 to 10 months old and a vet must be trained in it's use before they can administer it.

I like that it doesn't seem to completely remove testosterone production, but does reduce it by about half.

I am very interested in how it goes for Wilson!


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

sparkyjoe, the nearest zeuter site to central Ohio is Worthington Animal Hospital. They have a website. I just so happen to still have my copy of the list.There are two other Ohio sites but they are not central (Wickliffe,Toledo) I tried for six months to talk my vet into taking up zeutering, but he said that he only does a handful of neuters a year...so wasn't interested. I am driving about sixty miles to get Wilson done.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Yikes! I know I would personally feel more comfortable having a dog neutered the traditional way. Can always wait a couple of years for maturity.


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## sparkyjoe (Oct 26, 2011)

I actually just stumbled across that information myself, Charmed!

I'm really interested in this option, but I generally hate to be on the cutting edge of things when it comes to our pup! I worry about any long term health concerns.

I guess they've got a few years of information for treated dogs, I'm just a worrier!


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## sparkyjoe (Oct 26, 2011)

I posted about Zeuterin on one of the FB poodle groups I'm in and got a few responses. 

One person mentioned that they worked at a vet's office and they had had to do a traditional castration on a few dogs that had been Zeutered at a local animal shelter. At least one of those dogs had ended up siring a litter of pups before being traditionally neutered. 

This was several years ago, when the drug was released under a different company. Ark Sciences acquired the formula, got FDA approval, and recently re-released it. I believe the biggest problem with the previous release was that it wasn't administered correctly causing adverse reactions. Ark Sciences has implemented a mandatory training course and intensive record keeping to increase knowledge for vets and reduce adverse reactions in dogs. 

I'm going to contact the local animal hospital that offers Zeuterin and get more information.


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

Yup, you are correct. As with traditional neutering, the sperm is viable for several weeks after the injection. Also, you will note that they have a very specific age limit. I can't find literature, but I do know that the zinc injection has been used in Europe for many years. If I am not happy with Wilson's behavior after he is fully mature, I can always have him traditionally neutered. He will, by then, have attained my goal of optimum muscle growth. I am more comfortable dealing with half the testosterone while initiating service dog training, than I would be with "full on raging hormones on four legs". Of course, now the little stinker has a rose thorn stuck in his front leg, and even though I got it out.... it left a red spot. I hope it doesn't matter. Oh yeah, the worrying begins... I hope they don't cancel the shot because of his thorn... why did I let him run in the big yard? Why?


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## sparkyjoe (Oct 26, 2011)

Oh no! Can you all and check if the thorn wound would be a big deal?

I just got off the phone with the local Vet who does the Zeuter procedure.

He was very nice, answered all of my questions and was very open about the "failures" that they've had. Out of the 20 or so dogs he's done, approximately 2 had "behavioral issues" that necessitated traditional neutering after a successful Zeutering. He also confirmed that if there is some sort of complication, they can still do a traditional castration if needed.

They can also do a test, a few months after the procedure, to check for viable sperm to verify that the procedure worked.

BTW, he's going to check for me because he thought that the age limit had been raised. It's possible that he's mistaken and/or mis-read a memo; I believe that the company is trying to get the age range widened.

I'm not 100% sold, but very open to the idea.


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## Dolly's Mom (Feb 14, 2014)

So glad I check out this forum cz I was so concerned that you didn't know it was 'neutered' lmao. I've learned something new today!


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

Well, you never know, I do make a lot of typos...


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## sparkyjoe (Oct 26, 2011)

Is tomorrow Wilson's big day or did you have to postpone???


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

We're going tomorrow; his leg looks pretty good. If they do postpone, there is another zeuter day in late December. Turns out there's a grant and it is only going to cost $50. My regular vet is running about $500 for a neuter... so, I am hoping the zeuter works out for us. Poor Wilson has not been allowed to run crazy among the rose bushes, and he is a bit perturbed with me. He keeps running to the gate and executing a picture perfect sit... which is what he has to do before I will open the gate and let him run. He keeps giving me the stink eye, too. I am sure he thinks I am a bit mentally challenged and have forgotten my training, ha-ha.


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

It's done! From check in to check out took less than an hour, and I paid the extra nine dollars for pain meds (thanks Shamrockmommy). Wilson walked out and would have jumped into the van if I hadn't stopped him. He isn't supposed to run or jump for three days. Oh lordy, that is going to be tough. Right now he is dopey from the sedation. I peeked at his tattoo; it's a green Z to designate that he has been zeutered. He also has a tag to put on his collar. I'll let you know how Wilson does in the next few days. Oh yeah, three separate people wanted to know if he was an Afghan.


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## sparkyjoe (Oct 26, 2011)

So glad it went well for Wilson!

Yes, the vet I talked to said that they also do the tattoo, and that they use pain meds.

The three days would be hard on little Fletcher, but it wouldn't be the end of the world.

Please let us know how he does over the next few days, weeks and months!

We still have about 3 months before we have to make the decision for our little guy so I want to gather all of the information I can in that time!


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

I'm really glad to have seen this thread. I've been trying to decide what to do about neutering Blue. This sounds like a perfect alternative, so I'm going to look for a vet who will do it for me. As much as I love our regular vets, they aren't exactly cutting edge--I doubt they're doing zeutering, but maybe they can refer me. Thanks, Charmed, for the info. Glad Wilson did well.


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

JudyD, there are no zeuter clinics in West Virginia. There are clinics in Roanoke, Gordonsville and Centreville in Virginia. Not sure if you are closer to NC or some other state. My sister and daughter drove to Roanoke from Tn. to get their pups' done.


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

Charmed said:


> JudyD, there are no zeuter clinics in West Virginia. There are clinics in Roanoke, Gordonsville and Centreville in Virginia. Not sure if you are closer to NC or some other state. My sister and daughter drove to Roanoke from Tn. to get their pups' done.


Thanks, Charmed! Looks like we could go to Worthington, Ohio in about two and a half hours or to Roanoke in about three and a quarter hours. We're familiar with both drives. Virginia may be the better option--less interstate traffic that way. Would you mind to give me the name of the clinic in Roanoke? Incidentally, I'm surprised VPI, in Blacksburg, doesn't zeuter. They've got a big vet teaching hospital there.


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

JudyD, the Roanoke clinic is Angels of Assisi (540) 344-8707.


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## sparkyjoe (Oct 26, 2011)

I spoke to the doc at the Worthington, Ohio clinic and he seems nice. He has (only?) done the procedure about 20 times. I'm not sure how that rates with other clinics, but it's something to think about.

And I would have thought that Ohio State's Vet Hospital would also offer it, but they're not on the list.


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## sparkyjoe (Oct 26, 2011)

How is Wilson doing today?


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

sparkyjoe said:


> I spoke to the doc at the Worthington, Ohio clinic and he seems nice. He has (only?) done the procedure about 20 times. I'm not sure how that rates with other clinics, but it's something to think about.
> 
> And I would have thought that Ohio State's Vet Hospital would also offer it, but they're not on the list.


My husband said he'd rather go to Ohio than Virginia, so I sent a message via Worthington's website, asking someone to contact me about the zeuterin procedure. Twenty times doesn't sound like a lot, does it? Did he mention any problems or complications? I'll call the Roanoke clinic tomorrow, too. It sounds to me like they're primarily a spay/neuter facility, so maybe they will have had more experience with zeutering. It is surprising the vet hospitals don't do this. Maybe I'll also call VPI and ask why not.


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

Wilson is back to normal, although he is still content to be crated... so not quite up to his rambunctious self. The place I took Wilson to was a Humane Society that does spay and neuters; they were only on their fourth month of zeutering and do about 20 zeuters one Saturday per month. I had talked to my regular vet and he only does about two spay/neuters per month now. Most of his clients adopt pups from shelters and the pups are already altered when they get them. He said that it made no sense for him to learn a new neuter technique when he did so few. I was glad that I had talked to him about it because then I didn't feel so "disloyal" for going elsewhere for the zeuter. In order to zeuter, the vets have to undergo training and then have to perform a minimum number of zeuters per year(?) or they have to go to training again. This may deter some vets, as well as the low profit margin... and some male vets are squeamish about the injection site. No one in all of San Diego county does the procedure, nor does the vet school at Davis. Most zeutering locations do seem to be places with an emphasis on altering. By the way, the dog that got zeutered right before Wilson did not have as good an experience. The reason was NOT the zeuter itself. He was poorly socialized and had to be carried away from his owner as he refused to walk, he weighed twice what he should, and had never been crated in his life. He was so upset that he released his anal glands all over himself. What a shame! The lack of a few hours training would have made the little guy's life so much easier.


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## sparkyjoe (Oct 26, 2011)

I'm so glad Wilson is feeling OK, even if he's not quite back to himself yet. His "self limiting" his activity should hopefully make the play restriction a little easier to deal with? 

Compared to your experience, Charmed, it sounds like the Worthington vet is a novice, but hopefully he gets enough experience to be efficient.

I will discuss the Zeutering option with our vet, just to make sure they're on board with the option. 

That's so sad about that poor unsocialized pup. You're so right that just a little time and training can make so much difference in their lives!


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## sparkyjoe (Oct 26, 2011)

I was wondering how Wilson was doing??


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

Zeuter-wise Wilson is fine. We weren't having any problems with marking, but he had started mounting other dogs...that behavior has ceased. By the third day after the zeuter Wilson was back to normal, but about a week after the zeuter he ended up having to get the embedded thorn in his leg cut open and has sutures. He is down to three more days until suture removal... and finally can run to his heart's content. The thorn wasn't even slowing him down, however, he had stained his fur red from licking it, so it must have been irritating.He doesn't know that I, too, am counting down the days... until I can give him a much needed bath. I saw this zeuter campaign that is going on in Hawaii and it made me laugh... Zeuter (Sterilize) Your Dog for $60.00 (Kapolei)


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## sparkyjoe (Oct 26, 2011)

Glad Wilson is doing well with the Zeuter, just wish that nasty thorn hadn't interrupted his fun!


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