# Best way to teach Bite Inhibition



## Rachel76 (Feb 3, 2014)

So I have watched Kikopups video on bite inhibition and it's the only video from her that I didn't %100 like. It seems she is teaching the puppy not to bite rather than have bite inhibition. 

Here is what personally makes more sense to me. 
"Teaching bite inhibition is a two-step process: first, the pup must be taught to inhibit the force of his biting behavior, so that he develops a soft mouth; and then second, to inhibit the frequency of his now gentler mouthing, so that the adolescent dog learns to keep his jaws to himself and never mouth any person, or their clothing." From Dogstardaily, Dr. Ian Dunbar.

Having been biten by dogs with bite inhibition and without I know what a difference it makes. ( I realize it sounds like I regularly antaganized dogs, I was working as a vet tech in a region with many unsocialized dogs)

So my question is: What have you done regarding teaching bite inhibition, your opinion, experiences...etc.? Or any other methods (positive please) that are out there?


----------



## RufflySpeaking (Jan 7, 2014)

I've never liked Dunbar's emphasis on the dog not using his mouth on people. It runs contrary to how the most successful working dogs are trained and even evaluated. I want an eight-week-old puppy tugging my pants, and I play hand-mouth games all the time with my dogs. 

Bite inhibition is something dogs teach each other better than we could ever teach them. So if possible, integrating the dog into a pack that is well socialized and calm is the best way. If that is not a possibility, then you need to teach it the way that dogs teach it: A hard mouth makes a good thing go away or a bad thing happen; a soft mouth makes good things happen.


----------



## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

I yipped and stopped playing for painful bites, and played on through less painful ones. Once the idea was established I used "Gently!" as a reminder, and still do if Poppy snatches at a treat, for example. I play lots of gentle wrestling and tummy tickling games with both my toys, so that "biting" at hands stays part of a gentle game. On one or two occasions when a nip really, really hurt I YELLED (like the time Poppy sneaked up behind me playing nip-Mum's-bum at the top of the stairs, and took me by surprise!).


----------



## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

i thought my dog was fine with bite inhibition until i brought a retired female show dog into the household. she saw him doing a fake (non-hurtful) "kill" on my hands after brushing him, which was, to my amusement, his usual way of saying, okay, now, i put up with all of that, where are the treats? the next thing we knew, he was pinned by the neck against the dresser by the female. i still can't recall her flying off the bed at him. all i know is one moment he was at my hands and the next he was up against the dresser panting with the female's muzzle against his neck - no teeth showing, by the way. just the implicit threat. he has never put his mouth on me again even though it's now been over eight years since the female had to be put to sleep. interesting, too, how he had no trouble getting the message re what he was doing "wrong" according to the female.


----------



## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Bite inhibition is best learned from other puppies as a puppy (not so easy to teach later in life or by a person). fjm's suggestion about "ouch, no play" works well as a reinforcer/training technique too. I think a well learned drop it or out and leave it can help with this issue of mouthing as well. 

RufflySpeaking, I don't think Ian Dunbar is saying that you should not let a puppy mouth people, but instead that you want to make sure that it will be with a soft mouth (first part of quote) and that then it should be put on a cue (i.e. you decide when it is ok, not the dog). Let's face it, dogs with failed bite inhibition are the first ones to be re-homed through all the various mechanisms behind that term (breed rescue, shelters, abandonment....euthanasia). The key is to know that a dog is reliably safe to be around all kinds of people and other dogs as well.

I know there are plenty of folks here on PF who have done great things with rescue dogs, but I also have first hand knowledge of a situation where a rescue dog is turning out to be very dangerous and problematic for a friend's family. This GSD mix (belongs to my friend's daughter and son in law), adopted from a shelter (background mostly a mystery) bit my friend very severely back in December. She required a full thickness skin graft. Until just the other day I thought that was the only known bit by this dog, but another friend who knows the daughter and son in law told me that this dog also bit the daughter and has jumped through a closed window (broke glass) to get at someone in the street. This dog is now a level four biter (using Dr. Dunbar's bite pathology scale) and is very dangerous. My friend's son in law is in lala land about all this since he thinks my friend did something to provoke the bite. The young couple is remaining childless until this dog (still young) is gone of old age. I'm not relaying this sad story to trash rescued dogs, but instead to illustrate how dangerously serious the consequences of failed bite inhibition can be.


----------



## CT Girl (Nov 17, 2010)

It does not have to be a rescue. My in laws had a cocker that would bite with no provocation. He bit me once on the nose when I was petting him. I then learned the small scar on my husband's sister's nose was from the same dog. He bit several different people but since he was a relatively small dog they laughed it off. Once I knew of his unpredictable temperament I urged them to visit the vet and then get the dog proper training. I was concerned for the grandchildren as well as everyone else. I was told I was overreacting. They did take him to the vet but did not peruse it further. Then he severely bit my mother in law. She drove him straight to the vet to be put down and then to the hospital. A couple do days later she had to be admitted to the hospital for a week as her wound became infected. I don't care what size a dog is biting should always be taken very seriously.


----------



## IthacaSpoo (Jan 22, 2014)

I've got an 11 week spoo and I'm struggling with this a bit. Not all day, but a few times a day, NOTHING works. He seems to want to play but it begins with nips that hurt. So I wondered if those of you who raised spoos can tell me around when they should be getting the message. I think we are going to be fine, but I would love to know what to expect for the light at the end of the tunnel, or alternatively if we have an issue.


----------



## PoodleRick (Mar 18, 2013)

IthacaSpoo said:


> I've got an 11 week spoo and I'm struggling with this a bit. Not all day, but a few times a day, NOTHING works. He seems to want to play but it begins with nips that hurt. So I wondered if those of you who raised spoos can tell me around when they should be getting the message. I think we are going to be fine, but I would love to know what to expect for the light at the end of the tunnel, or alternatively if we have an issue.


I'm kinda right there with ya. Penny doesn't do it too much to me and when she does what ever we were doing ends and I go away and come back in a few minutes or less even. But my wifes' hands and clothes are her favorite chew toy, even when she still wearing them. Luckily my wife has the patience of a saint. The evidence is she hasn't thrown me out, yet. . Our first Spoo was Roxy who we got at 8 months and had been on the show circuit but not happy there so she was well past the biting thing. I don't remember our second Spoo, Beau, being much of a biter to begin with so this is a bit new to me also. I do like kikopups approach but would like alternatives also.

Rick


----------



## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

with puppies, i think it's important to give verbal feedback that it hurts. my hairdresser's maltese (very small and totally adorable) was at the teething stage when i first met her. so of course she wanted to put her teeth into everything. i just yipped like crazy until she got up and walked away! walking away oneself is one signal, but i really think the yipping that puppies recognize immediately from experience (assuming they were left with their litters long enough) is a very clear message (non-forceful positive punishment, if you will) about pain. of course if the pup is at the teething stage, then an appropriate chew toy is a good diversion. but it's not a substitute, at least imo, for the message that putting teeth in people hurts and is not going to be accepted by them.


----------



## MollyMuiMa (Oct 13, 2012)

I too believe bite inhibition is taught within a litter and that it should be reinforced when you bring your puppy home. I also did the 'if you bite me I will not play' I also used the "ah ah" as a distraction sound. I also avoided really rough playing and getting her 'over threshold' ....with my G-Kids! Molly is totally soft mouthed on humans, but if you're a rodent , look out!


----------



## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

IthacaSpoo once teething is over it should be lots better. In the meantime let your pup know that if it hurts you will not play and give the loud ouch and act hurt routine to help your baby dog understand. PoodleRick Penny's approach to your wife sounds a lot like the way Lily was with me. You are a lucky man to have such a patient partner. I hated it when Lily was all over me and she was my dog more than BF's (and she never did stuff like that to him).


----------



## Chells_Aura (Dec 7, 2012)

Chell has always been super mouthy, but I described bite inhibition very carefully to the 3 people who would play with her very carefully and we all yelped anytime it was too hard.
I had a good example that our work paid off about a month ago.
She was being terrible with harassing the cats so we had her on leash. Something scared the crap out of her and she cried out and tried to divebomb under the ottoman I have in front of my chair (keep laptop on it) that freaked me out and I went to calm her down. In her fear she reacted to bite me but it was sooo gentle because of her bite inhibition. Poor thing then sat in my lap until everyone calmed down. We still don't know what happened!
We've started now trying to teach her when it's okay to bite!
But yeah we worked hard on bite inhibition and it's worth it.


----------



## Rachel76 (Feb 3, 2014)

Chells_Aura said:


> Chell has always been super mouthy, but I described bite inhibition very carefully to the 3 people who would play with her very carefully and we all yelped anytime it was too hard.
> I had a good example that our work paid off about a month ago.
> She was being terrible with harassing the cats so we had her on leash. Something scared the crap out of her and she cried out and tried to divebomb under the ottoman I have in front of my chair (keep laptop on it) that freaked me out and I went to calm her down. In her fear she reacted to bite me but it was sooo gentle because of her bite inhibition. Poor thing then sat in my lap until everyone calmed down. We still don't know what happened!
> We've started now trying to teach her when it's okay to bite!
> But yeah we worked hard on bite inhibition and it's worth it.


*Thank you all and Chells_Aura* this is exactly what I mean by bite inhibition! When the dog is frightened/angry/in pain and they do bite, then it is a soft bite and not harmful. I think it could save a person and definitely a dog's life. 

I think I will be using the yelping and then immediatley stopping play technique.


----------

