# Help with biting



## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

I would recommend a puppy kindergarten class, and a session with a behaviorist (because their are children involved). Meantime, she should be dragging a leash/rope at all times, so that you can physically prevent her from going in on the kids. You might even consider tethering her to your waist, so she is next to you. Considering that you have only had her for a few days, I don't think she has earned the privilege of being free much in the house. I, personally, would stop the tug of war games until she has learned bite inhibition. You can google Animal Behaviorist, for your area, and they should pop up. Usually one session for a pup will really help you understand what is going on and how to deal with it.


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

*Land Sharks.*

Take a look here:

Poodle Forum - Standard Poodle, Toy Poodle, Miniature Poodle Forum ALL Poodle owners too! - Search Results for land shark









This Too Will Pass in time. It is a stage many dogs go through.
If the dog was not socialized a lot with humans and had only its siblings for company, it will treat its new human friends as it did its siblings. That means a lot of mouthing and biting. It takes time to train this out but puppy teeth are like needles and will tear skin easily. A search will show a lot of advice on this matter.

Eric


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## zooeysmom (Jan 3, 2014)

Neither of mine were too bad overall, but I did get one memorable bite during the land shark phase. Thank God it only lasts 2 or 3 months!


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## mommymunoz (Nov 4, 2017)

Charmed said:


> I would recommend a puppy kindergarten class, and a session with a behaviorist (because their are children involved). Meantime, she should be dragging a leash/rope at all times, so that you can physically prevent her from going in on the kids. You might even consider tethering her to your waist, so she is next to you. Considering that you have only had her for a few days, I don't think she has earned the privilege of being free much in the house. I, personally, would stop the tug of war games until she has learned bite inhibition. You can google Animal Behaviorist, for your area, and they should pop up. Usually one session for a pup will really help you understand what is going on and how to deal with it.




Thank you! That is very helpful! She has been free in the house some only because all she does is lay on the kitchen floor and sleep but I will definitely use your suggestions. 


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## mommymunoz (Nov 4, 2017)

zooeysmom said:


> Neither of mine were too bad overall, but I did get one memorable bite during the land shark phase. Thank God it only lasts 2 or 3 months!




Ouch! This is my hand right now. She got an ankle pretty good, too.










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## mommymunoz (Nov 4, 2017)

ericwd9 said:


> Take a look here:
> 
> Poodle Forum - Standard Poodle, Toy Poodle, Miniature Poodle Forum ALL Poodle owners too! - Search Results for land shark
> 
> ...




Thank you! I’m not sure what socialization she got while with the breeder. We got her from the family who purchased her from the breeder back in September. From what I understood, she was kenneled most of the day and their children had no interest in interacting with her. 


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Yes, this will pass. Lily was horrible when she was young and my hands looked like yours for many weeks. I can now stick my hand in her mouth and take away forbidden objects as she starts to swallow them.

The problem is those deciduous teeth which are purposefully like needles. When puppies play with and bite their litter mates it has to hurt so they learn to give inhibited bites. Your hand has not be purposefully or aggressively bitten. You have been mouthed by a pushy puppy who is using the tools she has at hand to figure out her new world.

Since your hand doesn't have puncture wounds that indicate an aggressive bite I don't necessarily think you need a behaviorist, or even a trainer. If you can find a puppy social (lots of Petco stores have them for free on weekends) take her there to rough house with the other puppies. She will get the needle teeth reminder to be careful with her own teeth. Teach her impulse control. If you play tug you must control the game. She must let go of the toy when you tell her to. You can also teach quiet attentive leave it impulse control by sitting on a chair with your puppy facing you on a sit. Take two small but nice treats and hold them in your closed hands with your hands on your knees. Let the puppy nose and paw at your hands to get the treats (yes it might be painful and involve gnawing). The puppy will stop, sit and look at you to figure out why you haven't given the treat. The instant that happens open one hand and let the pup get the treat while you tell her she was good> Repeat and repeat and repeat. It won't take long for the puppy to figure out that not molesting your hand is what gets the treat. As the puppy gets better and better you will up the ante as to what gets the treat. Sit and do nothing for three seconds, then five, then ten, then a minute. Offer the treat only in exchange for freely offered eye contact, just a few seconds at first and then longer and longer. I can now put delicious treats in the open on my knee and have two poodles sitting in front of me. Neither of them would dream of helping themselves and I can tell one to take one treat and make the other wait.


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

Catherine, I recommended a session with a behaviorist because of the children. I think the mom could use some specific advice on how to handle the dog/child interactions. Also, while her hands show puppy "scratches", that very "scratch" on a child's face could cause serious damage. Kids do not know that jerking away from a nip will cause more damage, and they will lay on the floor putting their faces at puppy bite level. I also would feel more comfortable with someone actually putting eyes on the situation. Mom said that she was starting to doubt herself. That is another indication for some intervention type help; to give the mom more confidence in dealing with Baby Shark, and to help her prevent her children from becoming child bite statistics.


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## Mufar42 (Jan 1, 2017)

She is a puppy and it is phase they go through until you teach them. My dog is a boxer but he also bit a lot as a baby. He was confined to his crate a lot while he learned potty training and to keep him safe from chewing inappropriate things. When we could supervise he was in a room with us, on our lap or playing on the floor when he would begin to get too bites we would leash him, take him out to potty and crate him. We did the no bite, yelping also but when that didn't work it was leash, out to potty-crate. (we didn't want to associate crate with punishment) It usually happened when he was over tired, and needed a nap. I find puppies to be like toddlers they have their melt downs when overly tired.
A friend of mine sprayed "bitter apple spray" on her hands, he learned not to mouth them. I haven't tried that - so I'm unsure -our dog has a very gentle mouth and will not under any circumstance put a hand into it. Be sure to give him plenty of chew toys and alternate them. No tug of war or wild play, or waving hands or arms.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Charmed, yes, I know there are children in the home, but a behaviorist could be hard to find and expensive. This is normal puppy behavior, not pathological biting and I think the OP needs to understand that their pupy is actually a normal puppy, not an evil dog in the making. If they decide to get a trainer or behaviorist that will take time to set up. In the meantime the training games I described can be instituted now and the children can be taught to play their parts in controlling this behavior too.


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## Mufar42 (Jan 1, 2017)

cd lilly just gave you some very good training advise, we have done the same with our guys and actually I've forgotten about it, lol, thanks for the reminder. I also see no need for a behaviorist, this is puppy behavior.


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## HeritageHills (Sep 4, 2017)

Good advice so far. I really don't consider that biting. It's like teething in a baby. Their teeth are going to be switching to the adult teeth and it probably feels really good, lol. Hurts us though.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I've just reread all of this thread since I think the issues here are important and making sure the discussion is complete will help others who search on this topic later on. There are a couple of points that should be reemphasized: a. this pup has not earned house freedom, she needs to be supervised especially around the children (crates and ex pens are puppy parents' best friends); b. everyone in the home needs to work with the pup to the level of their age for doing so, the children need to learn that the puppy is not a stuffed animal or other fuzzy toy (we want them to grow up loving dogs, not being afraid of them because their childhood dog was rude); c. this puppy does have bite inhibition, what needs to be learned is impulse control. 

An inhibited bite doesn't puncture skin. I see no punctures on the OP's hand. She has scratches from sharp puppy teeth. Adult teeth raked over a hand as seems to have happened here would leave no marks since they are not so pointy. Aggressive bites break skin deeply and leave puncture wounds. Here is a link to Ian Dunbar's bite scale. This puppy is a 1/2, nothing pathological other than impulsive mouthiness. https://s3.amazonaws.com/thinkific/...e_Scale_Original.pdf?__s=wzurhdyfkvqnmvsixavx

As to things seeming to be worse I think that is normal too. When a pup first arrives in a home everything is overwhelming and probably sort of scary so they are very cautious at the outset. Once they start to feel comfortable their characteristics emerge more readily. This is an exuberant puppy whose energy needs to be channeled into thoughtful impulse control. The game with the treats should be started by mom and dad. Have the kids watch and learn. Once the pup gets good at understanding the game have the children play it with the pup. I probably would lay off playing tug for now until there is some impulse control, but then use it to reinforce that control. Games end when we say they end. They start when we say they start. We own the toys. A flirt pole could be a good toy for this pup (but only for mom and dad to play with and kept close to the ground for now).


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

mommymunoz said:


> We have had our 16 week old standard poodle for 4 days now. Each day she has gotten progressively worse with biting. She bites me and my 7 year old daughter the most. She has not bitten my 4 year old at all. She bites my husband some, too. We are covered in bloody cuts and it’s very painful.
> 
> I have tried turning to ignore her, yelping, telling her no bite, giving her a toy. These all worked the first 2 days we had her. She knows sit and telling her to sit usually stops her from biting but anytime we try to move away she just comes back and bites harder. We have been taking her on 3 walks a day. We play tug of war and fetch. When she is not biting she is very sweet and calm but turns into a shark without notice. Today I have been putting her in her crate for a time out because she is starting to bite more often and not stopping when trying all of our tricks.
> 
> ...


Okay..first..you say your puppy is biting. Aggressively biting? Fear biting? Or mouthing/grabbing/nipping from happy energy and excitement?

If it's the first two, you have a serious problem on your hands and should consult a behaviorist and soon.

If its just extreme puppy mouthing/nipping, you should know that this age is the WORST. Your puppy is teething. They are literally uncontrollably nippy at this age. If she's biting hard enough to cause bloody cuts, it sounds like her bite inhibition might not be ideal? I've had some wild nipping puppies (I have 2 relentless landsharks right now) but I've never had bloody wounds from them. Except maybe on my fingers from giving treats. 

It tends to be worse when they are: overexcited, overstimulated, or overtired. So, a nap in the crate is a fine solution. Redirect by throwing a toy, throwing a handful of treats onto the ground, engaging her brain with CALM training. It WILL get better. But maybe not for a little while. I have two 19 week old puppies and with the "busier" one, bless her heart, she just simply cannot control herself sometimes. Just hang in there and try to get through this time with the least damage.


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## mommymunoz (Nov 4, 2017)

lily cd re said:


> I've just reread all of this thread since I think the issues here are important and making sure the discussion is complete will help others who search on this topic later on. There are a couple of points that should be reemphasized: a. this pup has not earned house freedom, she needs to be supervised especially around the children (crates and ex pens are puppy parents' best friends); b. everyone in the home needs to work with the pup to the level of their age for doing so, the children need to learn that the puppy is not a stuffed animal or other fuzzy toy (we want them to grow up loving dogs, not being afraid of them because their childhood dog was rude); c. this puppy does have bite inhibition, what needs to be learned is impulse control.
> 
> An inhibited bite doesn't puncture skin. I see no punctures on the OP's hand. She has scratches from sharp puppy teeth. Adult teeth raked over a hand as seems to have happened here would leave no marks since they are not so pointy. Aggressive bites break skin deeply and leave puncture wounds. Here is a link to Ian Dunbar's bite scale. This puppy is a 1/2, nothing pathological other than impulsive mouthiness. https://s3.amazonaws.com/thinkific/...e_Scale_Original.pdf?__s=wzurhdyfkvqnmvsixavx
> 
> As to things seeming to be worse I think that is normal too. When a pup first arrives in a home everything is overwhelming and probably sort of scary so they are very cautious at the outset. Once they start to feel comfortable their characteristics emerge more readily. This is an exuberant puppy whose energy needs to be channeled into thoughtful impulse control. The game with the treats should be started by mom and dad. Have the kids watch and learn. Once the pup gets good at understanding the game have the children play it with the pup. I probably would lay off playing tug for now until there is some impulse control, but then use it to reinforce that control. Games end when we say they end. They start when we say they start. We own the toys. A flirt pole could be a good toy for this pup (but only for mom and dad to play with and kept close to the ground for now).




She is being supervised very closely in the house. I have taught my kids to be very calm around her and not run or jump through the house. I have also taught them to tell her no and hide their hands if she tries to bite. I involve them with her training and she will sit and lay down for them. We got her things to chew on and she will spend a couple hours outside chewing and still want to bite us. I know she is only trying to play and not being mean in any way. I am trying the crate approach with her but I am not sure how long is an appropriate time to leave her in there. I have been giving her a treat when she goes in so she won’t fight it in the future. It seems to only be the morning hours we have this issues. 80% of the time she is as sweet and calm as can be. I’m not sure if she is overstimulated and being naughty or not getting enough energy out? She’s impossible to walk when she is in shark mode. She is in her crate now because I felt an episode coming on and took her out to potty before crating her and she barked and growled and bit up my ankles pretty relentlessly. 


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

mommymunoz said:


> She is being supervised very closely in the house. I have taught my kids to be very calm around her and not run or jump through the house. I have also taught them to tell her no and hide their hands if she tries to bite. I involve them with her training and she will sit and lay down for them. We got her things to chew on and she will spend a couple hours outside chewing and still want to bite us. I know she is only trying to play and not being mean in any way. I am trying the crate approach with her but I am not sure how long is an appropriate time to leave her in there. I have been giving her a treat when she goes in so she won’t fight it in the future. It seems to only be the morning hours we have this issues. 80% of the time she is as sweet and calm as can be. I’m not sure if she is overstimulated and being naughty or not getting enough energy out? She’s impossible to walk when she is in shark mode.* She is in her crate now because I felt an episode coming on and took her out to potty before crating her* and she barked and growled and bit up my ankles pretty relentlessly.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Good job on seeing her energy going up and over the edge. Since the morning seems to be her bad time of day I would work on helping her burn some energy in the morning. Get a flirt pole and take her out in the yard and drag it around on the ground and let her chase it. When she gets tired refocus her on some static behavior (sit and down stay)  training and then work on the impulse control with treats as I described above. Your puppy sounds perfectly normal, but a bit high in the energy department. Later in life you will enjoy the joy in life that her energy brings to your family. I know it is hard to see that picture when she is chasing your feet, but it will happen. My Lily was at least as crazy as your pup and now she is a joy in all things.


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## mommymunoz (Nov 4, 2017)

lily cd re said:


> Good job on seeing her energy going up and over the edge. Since the morning seems to be her bad time of day I would work on helping her burn some energy in the morning. Get a flirt pole and take her out in the yard and drag it around on the ground and let her chase it. When she gets tired refocus her on some static behavior (sit and down stay) training and then work on the impulse control with treats as I described above. Your puppy sounds perfectly normal, but a bit high in the energy department. Later in life you will enjoy the joy in life that her energy brings to your family. I know it is hard to see that picture when she is chasing your feet, but it will happen. My Lily was at least as crazy as your pup and now she is a joy in all things.




Thank you! That is definitely the goal and I’m willing to put in the time and do what it takes. I just want to do it the RIGHT way. I know she will be an amazing dog. About how long did they stage last with Lily? She was crated all day with her previous owners and she was not ever off leash outside so maybe that contributed to the craziness. I know she is happier having a chance to run and play and not be alone all day in a crate. 


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I almost hate to tell you how long Lily was crazy. I will be honest with you though since I want to help you succeed. Think about it like potty training with your kids. Some days go great and you think they have turned a corner and then the next day can be a disaster. She was pretty awful for most of her first 6-9 months. I had a revelation somewhere in there about my part in getting her amped up. I figured out that I was sending her mixed messages about being happy to see her when I got home when I was really dreading the greetings (her worst moments). She must have been very confused (I love mommy and she seems to love me too, but why is she so tense when I try to tell her I am happy to see her?). One day when I got home I st in my truck for a few minutes and decided I couldn't deal with how nutty she was so I went for a walk down the block and did some calming deep breathing and then made sure I carried that into the house. I was greeted by a much more relaxed happy pup. I should add that she did have a crate but wasn't usually in it when I got home because BF was home as the puppy raiser and he usually let the pups out in the afternoon before I got home. Once your pup sheds her deciduous teeth in the next couple of months things will get a lot easier since the adult teeth are not so sharkish. Doing the impulse control work will transform how she uses her energy too.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Being crated all day may have contributed. If it taught her that coming out of her crate was too much of an exciting thing. Or, it could be that she simply lacks experiences that could have helped her control her mouthiness a little. Or it could be that she is just a really mouthy puppy and nothing would have made a difference. Exercise is critical to the mental, emotional and physical development of a pup. Do you have any places where you could go for an off leash walk? While leashed, forced exercise at this age isn't good (max of around 15-20 min), off leash exercise can go on for quite a bit, I have hiked with mine for 1-2 hours but I pick them up or turn around if they get tired. Which doesn't often happen.  And I take lots of breaks. But all of the exploring and wandering really tires them out mentally and physically. 1-2 hours of that and they are usually good for the rest of the day.


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## mommymunoz (Nov 4, 2017)

CharismaticMillie said:


> Being crated all day may have contributed. If it taught her that coming out of her crate was too much of an exciting thing. Or, it could be that she simply lacks experiences that could have helped her control her mouthiness a little. Or it could be that she is just a really mouthy puppy and nothing would have made a difference. Exercise is critical to the mental, emotional and physical development of a pup. Do you have any places where you could go for an off leash walk? While leashed, forced exercise at this age isn't good (max of around 15-20 min), off leash exercise can go on for quite a bit, I have hiked with mine for 1-2 hours but I pick them up or turn around if they get tired. Which doesn't often happen.  And I take lots of breaks. But all of the exploring and wandering really tires them out mentally and physically. 1-2 hours of that and they are usually good for the rest of the day.




We live in a neighborhood so we have to take her on leashed walks but she does really well when she’s not crazy and biting her leash. My parents live on 80+ acres and we took her out there over the weekend and she ran and explored with their 2 dogs and she was worn out the whole rest of the day. 


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## mommymunoz (Nov 4, 2017)

CharismaticMillie said:


> Okay..first..you say your puppy is biting. Aggressively biting? Fear biting? Or mouthing/grabbing/nipping from happy energy and excitement?
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Not aggressive or fearful at all. Just VERY rough play. She draws blood almost every single time. I’m leaning towards her being overstimulated or overexcited. The crate is helping me for sure but she sometimes comes out with the same behavior again. When that happens I am putting her outside with toys to chew and trying again after 30 minutes. She seems to enjoy being outside even if we aren’t out there. 


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

mommymunoz said:


> We live in a neighborhood so we have to take her on leashed walks but she does really well when she’s not crazy and biting her leash. My parents live on 80+ acres and we took her out there over the weekend and she ran and explored with their 2 dogs and she was worn out the whole rest of the day.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


YES. Any place you can take her for off leash exercise is going to be exponentially more beneficial to her than leashed walks. Think of leashed walks as training, and off leash as true mental, physical, emotional exercise.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

mommymunoz said:


> Not aggressive or fearful at all. Just VERY rough play. She draws blood almost every single time. I’m leaning towards her being overstimulated or overexcited. The crate is helping me for sure but she sometimes comes out with the same behavior again. When that happens I am putting her outside with toys to chew and trying again after 30 minutes. She seems to enjoy being outside even if we aren’t out there.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Okay, good. So she is just a normal puppy.  That is a good thing! Outside time is fine, but just be careful that there isn't anything she can get into...especially if she isn't supervised. Don't feel bad about crating her either, because that is good settle time. Hang in there. This too shall pass. But it isn't necessarily quick to pass so you do need a game plan to survive in the meantime.


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## mommymunoz (Nov 4, 2017)

CharismaticMillie said:


> Okay, good. So she is just a normal puppy.  That is a good thing! Outside time is fine, but just be careful that there isn't anything she can get into...especially if she isn't supervised. Don't feel bad about crating her either, because that is good settle time. Hang in there. This too shall pass. But it isn't necessarily quick to pass so you do need a game plan to survive in the meantime.




I’m an figuring out a game plan thanks to all the help I am receiving! It is MUCH appreciated. 


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

I would add the Captain Obvious of long sleeves and sturdy jeans in addition to the good advice you’ve gotten so far.


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## mommymunoz (Nov 4, 2017)

lily cd re said:


> I've just reread all of this thread since I think the issues here are important and making sure the discussion is complete will help others who search on this topic later on. There are a couple of points that should be reemphasized: a. this pup has not earned house freedom, she needs to be supervised especially around the children (crates and ex pens are puppy parents' best friends); b. everyone in the home needs to work with the pup to the level of their age for doing so, the children need to learn that the puppy is not a stuffed animal or other fuzzy toy (we want them to grow up loving dogs, not being afraid of them because their childhood dog was rude); c. this puppy does have bite inhibition, what needs to be learned is impulse control.
> 
> An inhibited bite doesn't puncture skin. I see no punctures on the OP's hand. She has scratches from sharp puppy teeth. Adult teeth raked over a hand as seems to have happened here would leave no marks since they are not so pointy. Aggressive bites break skin deeply and leave puncture wounds. Here is a link to Ian Dunbar's bite scale. This puppy is a 1/2, nothing pathological other than impulsive mouthiness. https://s3.amazonaws.com/thinkific/...e_Scale_Original.pdf?__s=wzurhdyfkvqnmvsixavx
> 
> As to things seeming to be worse I think that is normal too. When a pup first arrives in a home everything is overwhelming and probably sort of scary so they are very cautious at the outset. Once they start to feel comfortable their characteristics emerge more readily. This is an exuberant puppy whose energy needs to be channeled into thoughtful impulse control. The game with the treats should be started by mom and dad. Have the kids watch and learn. Once the pup gets good at understanding the game have the children play it with the pup. I probably would lay off playing tug for now until there is some impulse control, but then use it to reinforce that control. Games end when we say they end. They start when we say they start. We own the toys. A flirt pole could be a good toy for this pup (but only for mom and dad to play with and kept close to the ground for now).




Wanted to give an update on Luna- we have been doing the game with her! Myself and my 7 year old daughter work with her every morning. She caught on fast! She is super smart. We can already set the treat in front of her and she will not take it until we say “go”. We have tested this up to 10-15 seconds at this time. She is still nipping but crating her for a few minutes when she does it has helped tremendously and she is definitely inhibiting the strength of her bite as we have not received any more bloody cuts from her. 


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I am thrilled for you. Keep it up and in no time you will have a pup with exemplary and super reliable manners. Kudos to your daughter too.


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