# At the end of the rope :(



## BorderKelpie (Dec 3, 2011)

You are not a failure and she is not a bad puppy (I know you know this). What you have is a very energetic, high spirited poodle. 
She sounds thrilled to see you come home, but as young as she is, hasn't the ability to control her impulse/happiness. Showing that she, at times, is obedient and respectful makes me think she has a LOT of energy and enthusiam and needs more exercise and possibly some mind games to help her learn to calm down and control herself. 

I know it's frustrating, especially after a looooong day at work to have to come home and exercise a canine terror, but the only way you and she will learn how to live together is to start there. 

When I have a drivey pup that acts like that, I have found that the schedule I need to have for him/her (usually a her for some reason - boys are easier, I think lol) is as soon as I get home from work, I change into 'play clothes' and take the canine demon spawn outside for helter skelter run amuck stuff and potty time. Then, we go into the 'formal' back yard (I have a seperate potty area for my guys - I hate mowing over landmines!) and do some sort of training and play. I have found that nose work/tracking teaches them to calm themselves and focus. So, often, I start with that and move onto obedience or something. End everything with a quick game of tug or fetch and head in for breakfast and crate time. (I tend to crate them for 30-45 minutes before eating and again after since I worry about bloat and my dogs have been known to be over the top active). Crating after outside time gives their food time to warm up and/or soak depending on what breakfast is for the day (I work nights). After that, it's potty time in the kennel and maybe a quick brush or just a cuddle session before I take my nap and start the doggie sillinesss again before work. 

It's a lot of work, but in the long run, it's worth it. Although, there have been many, MANY times I question my sanity for having dogs and puppies. LOL

I do hope you can find a way to learn to live happily together, she sounds like my kind of dog - happy, silly, full of life and high spirited. I do know also that those are the kind of dogs that can drive you insane.


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## outwest (May 1, 2011)

I am wondering if you have told her NO! She has been lazing around all day while you are at work and now you're home. It's time for zoomies and roughhousing! My two go at it zooming around the yard play fighting a couple times a day. For her, you are it. I suggest a firm NO! and mean it. Get a tennis ball, go in the back yard, sit on your duff in a chair and play fetch with her over and over. She clearly needs exercise and stimulation. And, she is a little out of control. She should never put a hole in any of your clothes and should be reprimanded for it, but she is doing for some reason.  You didn't say, but I wonder...is she crated all day? She needs a job to do. Poodles are smart. A puppy need a good amount of vigorous exercise every day. 

She does sound like a particularly active girl, but all puppies need training. Group classes are great.


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

Hang on - is she alone all day while you are out? Do you leave a 17 week old puppy alone all day, and expect to come back to a relaxing evening?! Unless there is someone else there to play with her, train her, take her out and keep her company,your pup has a whole day's worth of boredom, frustration, and loneliness to work off when you finally come through the door. In those circumstances, it's not really surprising that she is OTT and unable to listen to you! I would plan on training classes, but also to get a lot more exercise, stimulation and interest into her life during the day.


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## Carley's Mom (Oct 30, 2011)

When I first said out loud that I was going to get a St. Poodle, my sister, the dog trainer laughed...then she went on to tell me I was no match for a spoo pup. Of course, I already knew that and got a 7 year old retired dog and life was great. Then I rescued a 2 year old, untrained , clown named Stella...it has been a lot of work, but we are getting there. You will too. You can't expect a pup to be an adult dog, it takes time, and lots of training, love , exercise ect. Put in the time and you will be rewarded with years of loyal , unconditional love. There is no better breed, hang in there!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

lazydaisy, everything you've said reminds me of how things were when Lily was little. I have posted on my challenges with her elsewhere, so I won't go on too long here. I did have times where I questioned my sanity and my ability to do right by her, but now she is the light of my life. We have accomplished a lot together and every time I train or trial with her it pays out in how much fun and how relaxing she is to goof around with.

You don't have to embark on an obedience trail career with your pup, but you do need to take the advise of those who already gave you great advise here. I will add one more specific thing for you to work at (based on my own experience). When you get home, don't open the door if you are in a state of dread about what awaits you on the other side. Take a little walk if you need to, to get into a truly calm internal frame of mind. When you arrive tense your pup senses it and feeds off it. If you come home calm you will help her have a relaxed greeting. This revelation did wonders for me, not just with my dogs but with my general state of being.


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## georgie (Sep 26, 2013)

I have a puppy who has moments like this too so I feel your pain! Though he is a dwarf poodle so not as big (thankfully!). I find that what works for me is when I come home I calmly pet him and tell him what a good boy he is and the second he bites at me or my clothing I yell "ei!" (no in Finnish) and turn away and ignore him briefly (I mean like just a few seconds) and then I go back and calmly pet him and tell him what a good boy he is and I repeat this until he calms down. Then I take him to the dog park which is quite a walk from my house and let him romp around for an hour or so. We come home, play some tug of war, do some obedience training and then he is ready for a good nap. Sometimes when I come home all of this is the last thing I want to do but it is for the best! Hope this helps! Hang in there!! You're a great owner for wanting the best for your pup and reaching out for help.


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## hunny518 (Jun 5, 2012)

Your first step is asking for help and advice, which you have so you are headed in the right direction! I strongly suggest you do get her into classes, because it will help socialize and give her brain some work. Aria was not my first puppy, but was my first in about 7 years and my first large breed puppy in almost 20. I had forgotten how challenging they can be, but I kept her brain busy as much as I could. Our trainer taught us some games that were fun but also incorporated training techniques. Aria loved it and she was learning obedience at the same time. Like everyone else said, she has a lt of pent up energy and she doesn't know exactly how to control it. There were times through arias first weeks I began feeling like I was in too deep, but even though it felt like it was lasting forever, we got out of that stage quickly. Although, she is 17 months old as of yesterday and she still will get random bursts of energy that crack us up as she tears around the house out of the blue...


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

You've gotten some sage advice already. But I just wanted to share an article I love and can relate to after having a Doberman puppy. When he was young, he'd probably make your Poodle look rather sedate. I tell you, that puppy was hell on wheels. When I switched to using PR methods and stopped with the "No" "no" "no"...and gave him something TO DO. A LOT to do...lol, things turned around 180 degrees.

I love this article. And it's so true. Instead of trying to suppress that energy, channel it. My crazy Doberman gave me the fastest recalls, the most energetic sits...he'd throw himself into a down/stay with great exuberance. Everything he did, once his craziness was put into use was done with sharp precision, enthusiasm and joy. He matured in a couple years, cut out some of that unnecessary stuff... but he held onto that high spirit that I really love.

How to Train a "Crazy" Dog! | Karen Pryor Clicker Training


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Great article Poodlebeguiled. When I talked about being calm I didn't mean to suggest that the OP try to calm the spirit out of her dog, quite the contrary I love Lily's high spirits and view her upbeat personality as an asset to training her. But it does help for us to be relaxed and send a "crazy dog" energy that helps them settle themselves.


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

Sounds to me like no matter how much exercise she gets, she needs more.


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

lily cd re said:


> Great article Poodlebeguiled. When I talked about being calm I didn't mean to suggest that the OP try to calm the spirit out of her dog, quite the contrary I love Lily's high spirits and view her upbeat personality as an asset to training her. But it does help for us to be relaxed and send a "crazy dog" energy that helps them settle themselves.


Oh! My post and posting that article was NOT in reference to your great (I might add) post. Not at all. Of course we like them to be calm sometimes and hopefully re-direct that over-the-top energy that some dogs have so that they can have an outlet, but still learn self control in those times or situations we need them to. And we don't want to make them nervous or apprehensive with our own demeanor when we feel anxious.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Sorry poodlebeguiled, I didn't mean to imply that I took any exception to your comments. I had a poor start to the day and I guess I was foggy when I wrote what I did.

Both ends of the spectrum, calming when needed and taking advantage of the OP's puppy's lively personality, will both work to her advantage over the long run.


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

Yes, I'm dealing with a busy body myself...Matisse. lol. And then there's Maurice. Compared to the white boy, he's a sloth. LOL.

Don't worry about a moment of fogginess. I'm ALWAYS foggy. I think it's my cholesterol medicine. It's known to do that. And the thyroid med too...double whammy. Double excuse. Haha.:act-up:


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## Joelly (May 8, 2012)

lazydaisy,

Your spoo sounds like my tpoos (Charlie and Edison). They are both goofy, silly and the original energizer bunnies. Sometime I'd joke to my husband that luckily they are not spoo, otherwise he will probably move out.

Daycare becomes very important part of our life. Charlie and Edison go to daycare once a week sometime twice. This helps absorb that energy plus it helps them conquer separation anxiety.

Charlie and Edison will be up playing fetch in the middle of the night if I let them. Just yesterday, my husband tugged Charlie, Edison and I in bed and a comment from me about something had make my husband laugh and this trigger the sleepy energizer bunnies to jump up and start looking for the rubber ball and ready to play right then and there. In response to this, I yelled "No Charlie! Edison! Sleepy time!! Now!!!" Then they will slowly (very very slowly) try to settle themselves down. I know Charlie didn't feel like sleeping but he must when I'm in bed, that's his routine. He gave in sometime but sometime I have to cuddle him to help him give in.

I think you did a good job by coming here and asking these questions. Definitely get into that group class for training and if you can't find a daycare around, find a big park and let her run free, plus invest in some mind game for her. Charlie loves the hide-a-treat game.

Charlie and Edison are not a puppy of course but they know my routine so they adjust to me a lot. It is very important to set a routine.

Since now you have a poodle, don't expect a quite evening just yet. Expect it after you exhaust her. The training will help you a lot. I love putting Charlie into a push-up puppy.


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## lazydaisy (Oct 19, 2013)

Thank You Everyone for your Posts and Replies. After melting down yesterday I seriously took a good look at what I was doing and what Daisy was doing. I think she is feeding off my emotions. I have been very anxious all week and I'm leaving tomorrow for a week to on vacation. Daisy will be home with my husband who take equal time with her as well. 
Daisy is never alone, she is always with one of us and if we even leave for the evening or go on an outing she is a part. I dont work, so normally she is right by my side, even when I am in the bathtub... LOL (i'm not kidding) Our routine starts like this . Daisy is crated from 12AM until 8Am, She sleeps all nite and doesnt make a noise, whimper and is a darn good girl ! At 8am my hubby gets up , gets dressed and takes her out to her potty spot on leash. She comes in , eats and then plays with one of her toys. I am up by 9am, she is there waiting on me with her tail wagging and then it starts, the jumping, the grabbing, mouthing, biting , nipping. Barking and growling at me and tugging at my legs or nite gown. At this point I am giving her commands and it goes in and comes our the other ear. Until finally I get a hold of her because she wont come to me and I place her in her crate until she mellows out for 5 or 10 minutes and then it may or may not start over again. After I am AWAKE, then I will go outside with her and we will play, giving commands and giving lots of praise and treats. Usually the rest of the day is pretty active with her until nap time and we go through supper. Then about 10pm, its hell on wheels again for about an hour or until I put her in her crate and she mellows. She is very affectionate, loving , and a very good puppy most of the time. Her social skills are above and beyond for her age. But for the life of me, its those certain times she just goes bezerk !


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## outwest (May 1, 2011)

Aaahhh...big hugs. After reading your routine it sounds like you are really doing things right. What were the personalities of the mom and dad of your puppy? It isn't normal for them to be that crazed... On the other hand, she is still such a young puppy. Please try a training class with her. It sounds like she isn't respecting you and wants to be the boss. Poodles are so smart you can't let her do that.


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## lazydaisy (Oct 19, 2013)

BorderKelpie said:


> You are not a failure and she is not a bad puppy (I know you know this). What you have is a very energetic, high spirited poodle.
> She sounds thrilled to see you come home, but as young as she is, hasn't the ability to control her impulse/happiness. Showing that she, at times, is obedient and respectful makes me think she has a LOT of energy and enthusiam and needs more exercise and possibly some mind games to help her learn to calm down and control herself.
> 
> I know it's frustrating, especially after a looooong day at work to have to come home and exercise a canine terror, but the only way you and she will learn how to live together is to start there.
> ...





outwest said:


> I am wondering if you have told her NO! She has been lazing around all day while you are at work and now you're home. It's time for zoomies and roughhousing! My two go at it zooming around the yard play fighting a couple times a day. For her, you are it. I suggest a firm NO! and mean it. Get a tennis ball, go in the back yard, sit on your duff in a chair and play fetch with her over and over. She clearly needs exercise and stimulation. And, she is a little out of control. She should never put a hole in any of your clothes and should be reprimanded for it, but she is doing for some reason.  You didn't say, but I wonder...is she crated all day? She needs a job to do. Poodles are smart. A puppy need a good amount of vigorous exercise every day.
> 
> She does sound like a particularly active girl, but all puppies need training. Group classes are great.


Oh No, I am not at work all day. I dont work. My husband & I are both retired. He is 73 & I am 50. I can just be gone for a while, or If I have a task to be done and come home. I might even be home and it happens when I get up from bed and she has already been up with my hubby. He gets an amazing amount of attention, and play time everyday. We have 7 acres and she hunts and plays all the time. So as far as exercise and stimulation , she has it , everyday. The word NO come out of my mouth at least 10,000 times a day as she is trying to get away with her puppy sneaky activities, she also gets a time out for a couple of minutes. She is given commands and can graciously do them and then gets praise and treats as well. If she needs a job, I dont know what that would be yet, but I am up for any suggestions. Thanks again for your reply  Carrie


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## lazydaisy (Oct 19, 2013)

fjm said:


> Hang on - is she alone all day while you are out? Do you leave a 17 week old puppy alone all day, and expect to come back to a relaxing evening?! Unless there is someone else there to play with her, train her, take her out and keep her company,your pup has a whole day's worth of boredom, frustration, and loneliness to work off when you finally come through the door. In those circumstances, it's not really surprising that she is OTT and unable to listen to you! I would plan on training classes, but also to get a lot more exercise, stimulation and interest into her life during the day.


NO Way ! I would never do that to a puppy, ever. I have raised dogs / Puppies my entire life. However, this is my first Spoo. As a matter of fact, I didnt even know there were Spoo's up until 9 months ago and I seen my first spoo at an event and went ga ga over him. Then I started researching and reading everything I could get my hands on. So I finally found the Spoo of my recent dreams. LOL Daisy is 17 weeks old and I purchased her from a good breeder when she was 9 weeks old. I am retired and my husband is as well. We are home with her all day. We live on a small farm, and she gets play time at least 2 a day and gets to hunt , play and work on training. Everyday. But..... there are times she just goes into "FREAK" mode and all hell breaks loose. Its like she doesnt even see me ! I can give commands and she just keeps going nuts ! Over stimulated ??? Carrie


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

I have old toys, not standards, however as I remember, when my girls were young they needed to run and play to the extent that they had their tongues. hanging out panting ( from exercise, not from heat) an absolute minimum of 4 times a day, preferably more. I realize that you are keeping her very busy, but is she getting activity to that intensity?
Also, I know that you did not ask this, but a side effect of all of the wonderful attention that she is getting could be the development of severe separation anxiety - you may want to do some work to prevent that by leaving her alone in her crate with a stuffed kong while both you and your husband leave. Begin with just a few minutes, and slowly increase the time. There are always times in life that come up where you will need to. Leave her alone and it can become quite a disaster if she has never been alone before!


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

So you tell her "no" thousands of times a day. It's not working is it? Giving commands that go in one ear and out the other. Remember, cues do not drive behavior. Consequences do. So show her what you DO want her to do and reinforce within a couple seconds. Mark that what she does that you like with a clicker or a special word like "Yessssss!" and then treat. Give her what she loves. It may not be food at every instance. If she wants to go out the door to run, ask for a sit or some other skill she's learned first. If she wants to greet you, sit first. Try not to focus on what you don't want, but instead focus on things she does that you do like, even if they're miniscule baby steps toward what you do want. Shape that behavior. When you see your dog behaving in a way you like, reinforce that, even when it's spontaneous. Watch for steps in the right direction. Don't expect perfection in order to reward. You can build it up better gradually. 

I recommend you get yourself a few good books. One of my favorites is Culture Clash, by Jean Donaldson. She spells it out in no uncertain terms. It's short yet chalk full of good stuff. Read some Karen Pryor, really, the queen of clicker training. Patricia McConnell, Ian Dunbar, Pat Miller, Leslie McDevitt. There are lots more but those are a few off the top of my head.

Here's another good one: Guidelines for Teaching Self Control | Suzanne Clothier

She's only 17 weeks old. That is still a VERY young puppy. This is what a high energy puppy is like. She needs more _effective_ training it sounds like. Remember to have her earn what she likes and needs, at least in most things. 

The more tricks, obedience skills etc she learns, the more those things will fill up her mind and those obnoxious things will fade away more and more as she matures. Stop trying to stop all the obnoxious behavior. Install what you do want, reinforce, keep her very busy with the things she learns and remember reinforcement will drive the behavior you want.


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

You have loads of feet left in your rope. So, hang in there. Your puppy is very young and high energy. I know things will turn around. Bigger dogs take longer to mature. My Doberman and my last GSD were both very rambunctious puppies and they didn't get completely civilized until they were at least 2 years old...better by 2.5 or 3 yrs. old. My Lab was pretty laid back from the get go. And my two Chi's...very easy. I have one Poodle that is quite active...not so much as yours it doesn't sound like, but mine's a toy and one other one that is a much lower activity level. They're both about 24 weeks old. Any dogs before those mentioned, I don't remember much about how they were. I'm old. lol.


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## mother4 (Jun 8, 2014)

*update?*

Lazy Daisy, you sound like such an ideal owner, and you were having such problems with your pup... scared me a bit but I'm still going ahead, getting a standard male pup on friday...

What's happened since your last post? How is it going?


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## Sabrina (Feb 14, 2014)

*Sounds like an ADD child*

With all due respect, being locked in a cage all day can be frustrating for your poor baby. Is there a neighbor that can check on your baby during the day? Sometimes that is all it takes to calm them down. I hope that things work out for you!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Sabrina this is an old thread from last fall, not sure that OP has looked at it in a while. The other post from mother4 asked for an update. If there isn't one, hopefully it means she has worked out her problems.


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## GeriDe (Mar 2, 2014)

I have a high energy standard poodle. I also have a job that takes me out of the house from 7:45 until 4:45 every day.

I'm no awake at 5am - I feed and walk Khaos then do about 1/2 hour of command training and reinforcement then off for a tromp in the woods. When we get home, he's peed, poo'd and has let out a lot of his energy. When I say "Mommy's going to work" he goes in his crate and waits for his special treats (those that are only given when he goes in his crate)

I come home at lunch for an hour and that time is devoted to him. Same routine as 5am. 

I come home in the evenings and the first hour is his, all his. After that - there's just a few walks when he goes to the door to do his business.

He USED TO run amok in the house until I figured out - he's the puppy and needs the routine.

Having a puppy is one of the most reflective exercises in life. Always looking at yourself. They don't know any better but WE DO. 

I also live a very calm life. No kids, no husband - I chill and am laid back when I'm home - I think that is a reflection on how he can just lay at my feet when we're outside and I'm engaged in conversation with neighbors or how he'll lay in the grass just to watch traffic or eat clover or how he'll sit next to me and watch TV.

I think they feed off us and are often a reflection of how we live our lives. Not everyone has the luxury I have - the calm - the solitude but I think my pets love it.


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## lizzy_8 (Mar 21, 2014)

I too have lost clothing to my baby Spoo as he jumps and bites at me with excitement.
I too have felt inadequate with this pup whom I love and adore so much.
Attending a training classes, speaking to my trainer will help me learn how to train my pup to be the well mannered, well behaved boy that he deserves to be.
I have had poodles all of my life but never a Spoo, what a learning experience this is.
Harder work than I ever imagined but worth it.


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## mother4 (Jun 8, 2014)

Also she makes it clear elsewhere in the thread that she and her husband are home all day, have a big property, give her lots of exercise and attention - she's an experienced dog owner...


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

*Spoo Shark.*

To be full of energy and wanting all your attention, on your return, is normal behavior. Biting and mouthing with her sharp baby teeth is also normal. She treats you as a litter mate. I never had a young dog yet that did not have a mad moment or six soon after a feed. 
All dogs need to be conditioned not to bite and mouth period.
Those that are so small and placid that this important part of training is not carried out may well later snap and bite when handled or fed.
Whenever she bites or mouths say in a loud, growling and low pitched voice "NO BITE" if she takes no notice pull your hand from her mouth and repeat "NO BITE" while delivering a light but surprising slap to the side of her mouth. The "NO BITE" broken record repeated training will take a while. A few puppies might pick it up in a week. Previous Spoo's I have had took 3 or four weeks. The girl I have now took 4 months to learn this. All the clothing I wore during her training was ruined. I believe that because she was a part of two large litters (in together) and had too little socialization with humans, she would treat me as a litter mate and wanted to bite and mouth me constantly. At 18 months she will still mouth my ears whenever she thinks she can get away with it. Then out comes the "NO BITE" again. Good Luck. This basic type of training has to be carried out by yourself. A trainer can advise you. But at the end of the day it is you who will have to have the patience and time to accomplish this.
Also when her sharp little baby teeth fall out her new ones will be more friendly.
Eric.


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## Tulsi (Jun 8, 2021)

I had a collie (rescue came to us at 9 weeks old). She was a little maniac! I called in a trainer for a 1 to 1 session and she did some tricks with Tass and talked to me about routine and brain games.

That was over 10 years ago now. Tass turned into the best dog ever. I gave her commands in a soft voice and she was always attentive and responsive. 

Hope the op has a beautiful relationship with her clearly well loved spoo.


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## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

This is an older thread, so I'm locking it. Great information and links in it, though!


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