# Free Feeding



## cliffdweller (Jan 31, 2011)

Pros & Cons ?

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## Fluffyspoos (Aug 11, 2009)

I'll never, ever free feed again after seeing my parents dog. She's a walking sausage. I see so many fat dogs at work, and if you're not stimulating your dogs body and mind your dog is going to get bored and could use eating as an outlet.

If I refilled the bowels ever time they were empty not only would my dogs eat until they threw up, but I would be BROKE after replacing their high quality expensive food over and over.

Vegas started out as picky, then he discovered that if he didn't eat in the morning he was hungry all day, and if he didn't eat in the evening he was hungry all night. I was strict that you finish your food when it goes down and you have 15 minutes.

Their food is gone in less than 1. Having food available all the time is like having a toy available all the time, it just loses value. Vegas gets his tennis ball at special times, just like he gets his food at special times, these things he holds HIGH value in.

If I grab a lounge toy he'll kinda look at it and whatever, he'll play if he wants, but if I bring out the tennis ball he is focused and ready to go at ANY time.


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## caboodles (Jan 7, 2011)

I AGREE!!

A dog, and many other species.. have a natural instinct to simply eat everything in front of them, because they do not know when their next meal will come along. So they stuff their bellies now just in case...

Not only can that lead to your dog getting bloat from over eating, it's also harder to monitor just HOW much they eat, leading to a "larger" dog.

Serving up meals twice a day (or even 3 times if you prefer), I find, has been great because then I can predict when they will have to go drop some kids in the pool. Basically, after they eat... 30 mins.. it's their time!! 

So, it makes it a lot easier when you have to leave the house, and you can know they've already done their business!!


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## CelticKitti (Jul 1, 2010)

Kodi used to be free fed. He was so skinny! My guess is he is picky and he learned that the food was always there so he didn't feel the need to eat it. I switched him over to feeding him twice a day about 2 years ago. It took a few days to get the idea that if he doesn't eat the food goes away. But he is now very happy eating twice a day and he is finally at a healthy weight.

If you think you will ever have 2 dogs I wouldn't free feed. To the best of my ability I can't get both my dogs on the same food. Between Kodi's allergies and what doesn't upset Mia's tummy I've come to the conclusion I have to buy 2 foods. Which is fine, but if I free fed I'd NEVER be able to keep them out of each others bowls. 

It also helps if someone happens to get sick and the vet asks when is the last time they ate you know. Because you put that bowl down. There isn't any guessing you know exactly when and how much they ate.


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

I have free fed toy puppies while they are very small, moving to three, then two, meals a day once they have reached a suitable weight. I am not sure I can see benefits for larger pups, or older dogs, though.


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## cliffdweller (Jan 31, 2011)

Thank you all for your replies. 

For the record, here is my experience with free feeding so far. Rain was a year old when she came to live with me. Her former owner had practised "free feeding". I have not changed this, since it appears to be working out just fine & Rain is the most relaxed dog I have ever owned when it comes to food. So, I've had her about 2 months and over that time (now _sans_ the Hook and Whip worms she had), she has gained 1 lb. She is eating 2-3 cups of Before Grain (Buffalo), several handfuls of jerky (treats - beef or duck), and a small amount of cooked chicken, daily. Occasionally I have given her a raw, meaty bone (1/2 turkey neck or beef rib). She has had no sign of gastro-intestinal upset since I've had her. She has very little tendency to scavenge when she's outdoors. 

Admittedly, she has frequent, _small_ bowel movements, but we apparently walk more frequently & she never needs to ask to go out.

She eats at her own times, usually 3 times a day: a little in the morning, sometimes a little in the afternoon, and, most of her intake, during the night.

Rain is a small Standard, about 21" at the withers; she weighs 45 lbs. If she starts to gain too much weight, of course, I will have to make adjustments. Presently, however, I am very pleased with this method of feeding.

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## ArreauStandardPoodle (Sep 1, 2009)

We schedule feed our puppies...food in, poop out. This way they are nearly entirely house broken by the time they leave us. But we free feed our five adults, and four of the five are far from overweight. They graze a little throughout the day, then after our dinner, we add veggies and canned food to the kibble and they enjoy a big meal. This meal they each get their own dish, but the rest of the day the bowl is out and full, and there is never any food aggression or rifts between the dogs. I have watched some schedule fed dogs eat and it turns my stomach. They inhale their food and I don't know if they even taste it.


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## cliffdweller (Jan 31, 2011)

ArreauStandardPoodle said:


> I have watched some schedule fed dogs eat and it turns my stomach. They inhale their food and I don't know if they even taste it.


My Weimaraners were like that. They ate two or three meals a day and always acted as though they had been starved for a week before the meal.

It always made me feel uncomfortable. Rain's eating habits are a pleasant change and I hope it will continue.

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## ArreauStandardPoodle (Sep 1, 2009)

nu2poodles said:


> My Weimaraners were like that. They ate two or three meals a day and always acted as though they had been starved for a week before the meal.
> 
> It always made me feel uncomfortable. Rain's eating habits are a pleasant change and I hope it will continue.
> 
> *~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~*


Do you free or schedule feed her?

My opinion is, if they were still in the wild, they would eat when they are hungry. They may kill something and have a big feed, then go back and nibble periodically on the remains. When I am hungry I am free to grab an apple or a cookie.


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## cliffdweller (Jan 31, 2011)

ArreauStandardPoodle said:


> Do you free or schedule feed her?


There is always a bowl of food available. She has her own schedule, but it seems fairly regular.



ArreauStandardPoodle said:


> My opinion is, if they were still in the wild, they would eat when they are hungry. They may kill something and have a big feed, then go back and nibble periodically on the remains. When I am hungry I am free to grab an apple or a cookie.


I agree. I think canids also do fair amount of browsing on wild fruits, etc. The Weims used to go crazy for Persimmons when they fell from the tree.

I am happy to know that you have had success with free feeding, since I have read many negative opinions about it and was a bit concerned. I love the lack of stress over food and don't want to change it.

Thank you for your comments !

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## northerndancer (Jan 27, 2011)

I have done both free-feeding and scheduled feeding. None of my animals that were free-fed were overweight.

Scheduled feeding helps regulate potty visits which is a significant benefit for many people. The other thing that I didn't think about with scheduled feeding that I like is that most of the time the only bowl on the floor is the water bowl.


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## Rayah-QualitySPs (Aug 31, 2010)

I free feed also. Not with puppies tho. I aways tell my hubby if I top up a bowl because he is mainly responsible for feeding.

The only thing is you still need to make sure the dog is eating appropriately. I met a lady whose dog was very sick. The lady free fed in her kitchen using a pail. When the lady got a new floor she was not aware the dog was not eating for over a week. The dog was scared of the slippery new floor.


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## ArreauStandardPoodle (Sep 1, 2009)

Very good point!


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## Jessie's Mom (Mar 23, 2010)

i don't free feed. i don't feed dry, only high quality canned mixed with either chicken or cooked organ meats, or raw medallions. i can't leave that food around for too long before it would spoil. jessie never did well with kibble so we have to go this route. she does not have a good gastro system. 

even if i had a choice don't know if i would free feed. i like to take her to the park to run and play and i wait at least 1 1/2 hrs before and after eating to do that. how could i do that if i were to free feed? i would be afraid of bloat (she's tacked, but still...)

my vet also feels that strick mealtimes allow for a full stomach and less chance of being overweight. she's 25" and almost 52 pounds which is perfect for her.


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## cliffdweller (Jan 31, 2011)

Jessie's Mom said:


> ... i like to take her to the park to run and play and i wait at least 1 1/2 hrs before and after eating to do that. how could i do that if i were to free feed? i would be afraid of bloat (she's tacked, but still...)


Rain eats very little during the day, though she does seem to eat a little in the morning and a little sometime in the afternoon. I don't think it is enough to affect any exercise we do. She is now in the water, chasing fish, about an hour and 1/2 daily, & we walk 3-4 miles a day (not all at once). 



Jessie's Mom said:


> ...my vet also feels that strick mealtimes allow for a full stomach and less chance of being overweight. she's 25" and almost 52 pounds which is perfect for her.


Time will tell here. I don't know whether Rain will tend to gain weight (especially once she's been spayed), and this certainly would change things. My primary reasons for wanting to leave things as they are (_viz_. free feeding): 1) so far Rain exhibits no sign of gastro-intestinal disturbance of any kind; 2) she is very relaxed about food; there is not the anxiety around "mealtime" that I have experienced with my dogs in the past. I think this lack of anxiety could benefit her health.

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## northerndancer (Jan 27, 2011)

Clearly there are pros and cons to different eating regimes. Not to say one is better or healthier than the other - its just whatever works for the dog and the dog owner.


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## Jessie's Mom (Mar 23, 2010)

nu2poodles said:


> Time will tell here. I don't know whether Rain will tend to gain weight (especially once she's been spayed), and this certainly would change things. My primary reasons for wanting to leave things as they are (_viz_. free feeding): 1) so far Rain exhibits no sign of gastro-intestinal disturbance of any kind; 2) she is very relaxed about food; there is not the anxiety around "mealtime" that I have experienced with my dogs in the past. I think this lack of anxiety could benefit her health.
> 
> *~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~*


i think you are absolutely correct - don't upset the system - it's working for her, for you. you can always re-visit this if you find it not working for her anymore. vets and other professionals can recommend many things, however, we, the owners, know our own dogs - at least we should. and if we are in tune to them, we will know what is best for them.


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## Trixie (Apr 13, 2011)

We also free feed and she is very dainty. I think it depends on the dog. My parents have two minis...one is very dainty as well, would be fine free feeding and is very relaxed about food--the other basically inhales any food whenever she gets a chance, and would become overweight because she doesn't know when to stop.


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## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

Several reason I do not free feed:

I had two picky dogs I did this for almost one year. One stayed under weight, the other got over weight. I got tough about it and scheduled their feedings and they eat two times a day. The under weight one is now much healthier and interested to eat. The other still needs to shed some pounds. With scheduled feedings I set limitations on what they intake. 

Also if your dogs are active at all - free feeding is NOT such a good thing. If I want to head out for a walk or go play chuck it in the yard or just be silly with the dogs I have to figure out did they eat? My dogs do not play or take long walks after eating, EVER.


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## 3dogs (Nov 3, 2010)

I do scheduled feeding so I know exactly how much measured food goes into my dogs. We have 6 & I have to feed at least 3 different foods. My small dogs get a measured amount so they don't gain weight, my pup get's measured so I know how much she is eating daily (so far not nearly as much as the bag say's), & my 3 larger dogs all get measured amounts 2x a day. As a groomer I see OBESE dogs ALL the time. The majority of these dogs are FREE fed. Of course the owners tend to be older & don't mind stuffing in extra treats into their dogs mouth when they are begging. The overweight small dogs that are fed a scheduled meal are usually feed 2x what they should be feeding their dogs. No wonder they are fat. The vets don't help either when they tell their clients the dog is just fine & they aren't. Not a rib, waistline, hip bone anything that can be felt at all. The look like sausages & some look like footstools.

I know when one of my dogs isn't feeling well, has a sore mouth because it effects their eating habit.


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## ArreauStandardPoodle (Sep 1, 2009)

3dogs said:


> I do scheduled feeding so I know exactly how much measured food goes into my dogs. We have 6 & I have to feed at least 3 different foods. My small dogs get a measured amount so they don't gain weight, my pup get's measured so I know how much she is eating daily (so far not nearly as much as the bag say's), & my 3 larger dogs all get measured amounts 2x a day. As a groomer I see OBESE dogs ALL the time. The majority of these dogs are FREE fed. Of course the owners tend to be older & don't mind stuffing in extra treats into their dogs mouth when they are begging. The overweight small dogs that are fed a scheduled meal are usually feed 2x what they should be feeding their dogs. No wonder they are fat. The vets don't help either when they tell their clients the dog is just fine & they aren't. Not a rib, waistline, hip bone anything that can be felt at all. The look like sausages & some look like footstools.
> 
> I know when one of my dogs isn't feeling well, has a sore mouth because it effects their eating habit.


OMG...that is funny! Footstools! I love it.


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## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

Attached is a good link on why in most cases its best to not free feed dogs.

Free Feeding Your Dog?

I read a lot of health and nutrition of dogs and have spoken to many poodle breeders that do not free food poodles. They feed scheduled high quality kibble and Raw or home cooked. They also recommend this. So I am bit surprised to see a breeder recommending this.

One big concern is bloat and torsion. Although there are NO exact reasons for bloat according to stats free feeding increases the risk because of having the food, water and playtimes mixing. NOT A GOOD MIX!! 

A lot of poodles are picky and I see many more issues on this and other forums of poodles NOT eating versus gulping their food. 

I often see on this site and experienced it myself changing foods every couple months when I was trying free feeding - why? My dogs were over it. They might graze all day on the portion I left out and when I tried to feed them they had no interest.

Speaking of feeding dogs as they are in the wild - first of all dogs in the wild go days without eating, their bodies were conditioned for this. I feed Raw so I am all about feeding high quality  however, we have domesticated our dogs and do not need to go days at time. A la carte can be an open door to low performing dogs.


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## Jessie's Mom (Mar 23, 2010)

Olie said:


> Attached is a good link on why in most cases its best to not free feed dogs.
> 
> Free Feeding Your Dog?
> 
> ...


ollie - thank you for the article. that being said, i want do an update on some changes i made with jessie's food. i originally stated that i do not free feed because i feed high quality canned mixed with some cooked meat and raw. can't leave that around for too long. i don't free feed because i like to run her at the dog park and i won't do that 1 1/2 to 2 hours before or after a meal. i also don't free feed because jessie does not have a great gastric system so my vet said controlled feeding would be much better for her. i became very strict with this about 2 weeks ago. i have to tell you, i already notice the difference. the change i made was leaving the food down for even shorter time periods and elminating treats at night. her "treat" is now her raw marrow bones which she loves. for training purposes, i've been using cooked chicken breast. 

this change was hard for me because i was concerned about her building gas if she didn't eat. ironically, her stomach has been quieter than it's ever been and she has missed out an a breakfast or two while we battled our wills. 

i also like to knowing how much my dog is or is not eating.


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## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

Suri had bad stomach issues too thats when I started experimenting. We ended up going full throttle Raw 14 months ago and it is amazing the change.

I am glad things have improved jessie and good that you played with a good diet - it makes a world of difference. 

However Suri still has gas, I see that not changing but I can live with that as long as she is healthy.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Jessie's Mom said:


> her "treat" is now her raw marrow bones which she loves.


Careful with those. They can and do break teeth. You couldn't pay me to give my dogs a marrow bone. No way no how.


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## cliffdweller (Jan 31, 2011)

Olie said:


> ...
> 
> One big concern is bloat and torsion. Although there are NO exact reasons for bloat according to stats free feeding increases the risk because of having the food, water and playtimes mixing. NOT A GOOD MIX!!
> 
> ...


I agree that _big_ meals and playtime are a bad mix; but as I have described above, this is not what I am experiencing with Rain. (She eats most of her food during the night & _very_ _little_ during the day.) Remember, this dog was a year old when I adopted her, & she had been free fed for that first year. Since free feeding is not something I have practised in the past, I am seeking _cogent_ reasons why I should not continue this.

From the article you cited:


> The best comparison we can make is that free-feeding is like having a full buffet in your house, stocked with food 24 hours-a-day.


 Most of our homes _are _stocked with food 24 hours a day! You don't run to the grocery store for every meal do you? It's a _very_ weak, unconvincing argument.

I have given the reasons why I would like to continue free feeding; I am not claiming that it would be right for every dog in every circumstance.

I would like a reference to the studies you mentioned, concerning bloat/torsion & free feeding. 

I believe the argument from the habits of wild canids to be flawed, as some others here have also suggested. [See also: http://www.poodleforum.com/5-poodle-talk/4452-free-feeding-vs-scheduled-feedings.html#post54507 , e.g.]

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## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

This is a very debatable topic and you did read the part where I explained I DID do some free feeding right? Almost 2 years ago and with kibble which digest completely different than raw.

Did you also read where I stated its not for all dogs? If your situation is working for now, good and you should be seeking advise and other opinions - BUT because mine is not in total agreement with yours or what you want to hear - its really that much of an issue to you? 

The comment from the ARTICLE states the buffet example - _not mine_ but I will comment. If a dog has a meal laid out 24/7 - what would you compare this too in the form of humans then? 

And I shop every couple of days for meals mostly because my freezers are full of raw meat for my dogs - just a decision we make when we buy in bulk. 
AND because of my recent weight gain in the last year I sadly cannot keep as many foods in my cabinets or refrigerator - I TEND TO EAT EVERYTHING OTHERWISE LOL.

If you google bloat and free feeding it brings up many different resources Pros and Cons. The same with free feeding and weight gain, free feeding and low performing dogs..... As well this is* MY* experience with it.


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## Jessie's Mom (Mar 23, 2010)

i believe that you could make points on both sides of this discussion. i know breeders that free feed. there is no rule book concerning this. i think the things to consider are the following:
1. does it work with your schedule for your dog?
2. is it working for your dog's weight management
3. is it working with your dog's digestion?
4. are you around most of the day JUST IN CASE something should happen after eating? this point i bring up because a member of this forum who didn't actually free feed, did feed her dog in it's run then left for a while, came home and found her dog had bloated, torsed, and died. devastating for sure.

if you are comfortable with your answers to these questions, then don't change what is working. a former boss once told me that whenever we have decisions to make no matter how big or small, we just use the info we have at hand and make the best decision possible. if it doesn't turn out well, we can always alter or change it. i forgot how long you have rain, i know she was a year when you adopted her (lucky girl :five so maybe just let it ride for awhile. you received a lot of info here, dwell on it for awhile. i am confident you will make the right decision!


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## Jessie's Mom (Mar 23, 2010)

ChocolateMillie said:


> Careful with those. They can and do break teeth. You couldn't pay me to give my dogs a marrow bone. No way no how.


i understand, cm, but these are very thick marrow bones from the butcher. i've never known that to happen, however, now that you are bringing that up, i will talk to her vet about that. they do wonders for keeping her teeth clean and gums healthy.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Jessie's Mom said:


> i understand, cm, but these are very thick marrow bones from the butcher. i've never known that to happen, however, now that you are bringing that up, i will talk to her vet about that. they do wonders for keeping her teeth clean and gums healthy.


It is never a good idea for your dog to chew on something that is harder than their teeth. It is incredibly expensive to fix a broken tooth and I know far too many people who have had this experience and spent $500 + fixing the tooth. The general rule of thumb is to never feed a weight bearing bone from a large mammal. 

It's not if it will break teeth, it is when. Broken teeth can lead to painful infection. You're fine until it happens and by then it will be a lesson learned. There are far better and safer options for teeth cleaning. Beef and pork rib bones are better. 

To each their own, but I will not take the risk when there are far safer options for cleaning teeth.


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## PoodleMom (Nov 19, 2009)

I have been free feeding my toy poodle since i got her 15 1/2 years ago.....she is fine and healty.....I started my 20 month old standard the same way and she too is doing good with it...in fact the vet told me last week when she went in for her rabies shot that she was PERFECT for her weight and body figure......Now that I am planning on getting the new brown standard puppy, I will probably do the same for her as well......my dogs eat most of the food at night.


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## zyrcona (Jan 9, 2011)

re. free feeding and bloat: I understood the connection was the opposite to what was stated in the article the earlier poster linked. I read an article about a study done in a police dog facility where they found dogs were less likely to get bloat if they were free fed and more likely to get bloat if they only had access to one meal per day. However, dogs being fed meals at set times were found to be more attentive to their trainers. Sorry I can't find the link.

I feed my dog 3 meals a day, but my aunt free-feeds her small dog and my sister feeds her two large dogs one meal a day. There are pros and cons of free feeding vs. meal feeding. Each one varies in its appropriateness depending on the dog and the owner. Just use the one that works best for you and your dog.


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## cliffdweller (Jan 31, 2011)

zyrcona said:


> re. free feeding and bloat: I understood the connection was the opposite to what was stated in the article the earlier poster linked....


That was my understanding also & I did a cursory research during this discussion and still found that the majority opinion is that free feeding lessens the potential to bloat. I do not know how much really sound evidence there is for this opinion, howerver.


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## JE-UK (Mar 10, 2010)

I've done both, but I don't free feed now. There are lots of reasons to feed proper meals:

- you know precisely how much the dog is eating and can immediately correct for chubby tendencies or spot a potential problem if the dog is off food

- traveling is MUCH easier; it's hard to replicate free feeding when away from home

- if needed, you can USE those meals; dog is antsy, feed in a Kong. Dog needs some stimulation, hide the Kong first!

- as someone else said, scheduled meals = scheduled bowels, which can make life easier, and DEFINITELY helps with housetraining


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## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

As far as the bloat topic. This again is debatable. The reality is kibble swells when eaten - even grain free. If a dog is free fed, drinks and goes out on a long walk or plays vigorously like my two Spoos your dogs risk can be elevated. This can fit for some, but its not for all dogs......

Luckily most smalls dogs are not at risk of this as deep chested dogs.


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