# Question about quality of poodle coats.



## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

Yes very much. Misha's coat is not ideal for conformation or grooming. It is light and more wavy than curly. On his back it is especially frizzy and difficult to get it to curl nicely. His neck probably has the best quality coat but it is SO dense (but not wirey) that it becomes difficult to brush when it is long. I think it has not always been so dense. It is now hard to get a comb through even when well brushed.

Here is his coat with my best attempts to get it to curl. I try to use plenty of leave in conditioners and wet it down. But generally I am dissatisfied so I tend to keep it blown out instead. His breeder said his brother has a very dense harsh coat while his sister also has a softer coat.


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## Dianaleez (Dec 14, 2019)

Normie's coat is soft. And you can see by his feet, very curly.


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## Spottytoes (Jul 28, 2020)

I haven’t been surprised because I knew very little when we got Bobby. I’ve learned a lot though. As a parti poodle his coat is all over the place. His body and upper tail are super thick, curly and wiry. His topknot is pretty thick, fairly curly but not as curly as some. The white areas on his body are softer and more wavey rather than curly. His lower legs and feet are thick but not very curly. 

Joey’s cream coat is thick, uniform and holds shape well. It reminds me of cotton candy. It will be interesting to see how his coat looks once he goes through his coat change. I’m anticipating a nice coat. We’ll see.


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## For Want of Poodle (Feb 25, 2019)

I'm surprised at how much Annie's coat wants to cord. If I don't brush her and especially if she gets wet without me blowing her out, it all forms little tiny twisted segments, with the guard hair winding around the undercoat. Maybe 1/4 or 1/2 as wide as a Puli's cords.Even her topknot starts segmenting itself. I don't get to the point where it matts and I can't see skin, it just naturally splits. I'd always thought corded dogs were difficult to start so this is very cool.

The only parts where this isn't strictly true are her tail and her ears and maybe her lower legs, and I suspect I could make them cord if I wanted to, since part of the tail naturally cords and the feet naturally clump - they may naturally be larger cords though, as those areas aren't quite as curly. Part of me wants to see what would happen if I just let it cord. I suspect the cords would be too thin to get very long.

She's got, I think, a great coat, now that she is an adult. Her breeder said her coat is nicer than her champion sisters Her topknot is 5-6" right now, and stands so long as I have brushed it in the last couple of days. Her coat is very dense and very curly, but hard to keep her brushed out if I let her get long - It doesn't matt to the skin, but it does twist up and get hard to comb and it's difficult to remove the twists even with a HV dryer It's fairly wiry with a soft undercoat . It's 'plush' for lack of a better word. If I pat her hair, it kinda springs back under my hand, rather than flattening.


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## Misteline (Mar 10, 2019)

Evelyn's coat is... difficult. It mainly tightly curls in the places that are likely to matt (elbows, armpits, around the base of the ears, and right above the tail), his tail is a bottle brush of guard hairs, and his topknot wants to cord. His ruff also has some curls but has more guard hairs than anywhere else besides his tail. The rest of him is mostly soft and wavy. His ears have been trying their hardest to matt from day one, but I have yet to lose the battle and have high hopes for the war. His feet appear to grow normally though for whatever that is worth.

There's a reason I shave him so short.


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## PowersPup (Aug 28, 2020)

Because Topper is my first poodle, I don't know what to expect so I can't really be surprised. At 16 months old, his ears are soft and wavy - more like a spaniel than I expected. The hair on his legs is more wavy than curly. His back, neck, topknot, neck and chest are curly and fairly soft. He's still pretty soft and straight on his underarms, tummy and inner thighs. We haven't had issues with mats, except behind his ears where the hair was long and curly. He is starting to clear to blue on his whisker pads, chin and hienie. He has an "angel's kiss" of blue on his forehead and a small streak of blue in his tail, too. He goes to the groomer on Friday - it will be interesting to see what he looks like with a fresh haircut!


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## TeamHellhound (Feb 5, 2021)

Simon is my first Poodle, so I don't really have a frame of reference other than Poodles I've met in the distant past, but at ten months old and after being stripped down with a #10 blade a couple of months ago, I think he's got a nice adult coat coming in. He's fairly curly, and feels soft, but crisp and springy. He's blue, and starting to clear, with lots of paler hair coming though, mainly on his legs and ears.


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## Johanna (Jun 21, 2017)

For Want of Poodle said:


> I'm surprised at how much Annie's coat wants to cord. If I don't brush her and especially if she gets wet without me blowing her out, it all forms little tiny twisted segments, with the guard hair winding around the undercoat. Maybe 1/4 or 1/2 as wide as a Puli's cords.Even her topknot starts segmenting itself. I don't get to the point where it matts and I can't see skin, it just naturally splits. I'd always thought corded dogs were difficult to start so this is very cool.
> 
> The only parts where this isn't strictly true are her tail and her ears and maybe her lower legs, and I suspect I could make them cord if I wanted to, since part of the tail naturally cords and the feet naturally clump - they may naturally be larger cords though, as those areas aren't quite as curly. Part of me wants to see what would happen if I just let it cord. I suspect the cords would be too thin to get very long.
> 
> She's got, I think, a great coat, now that she is an adult. Her breeder said her coat is nicer than her champion sisters Her topknot is 5-6" right now, and stands so long as I have brushed it in the last couple of days. Her coat is very dense and very curly, but hard to keep her brushed out if I let her get long - It doesn't matt to the skin, but it does twist up and get hard to comb and it's difficult to remove the twists even with a HV dryer It's fairly wiry with a soft undercoat . It's 'plush' for lack of a better word. If I pat her hair, it kinda springs back under my hand, rather than flattening.


I suspect Annie has quite a bit of Wycliffe behind her. I have had several dogs from that background who tended to cord. I never wanted to do a corded coat because it is so much more trouble than a brushed one!


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## Pavie (May 4, 2021)

I haven't encountered that many poodles in real life to have a frame of reference. I've seen a few from strangers, so I haven't petted their coat. We used to have a neighbor with a standard poodle that we played with, but they moved when their dog was still an adolescent and still had puppy hair. His poodle puppy hair was really soft, much softer than Pavie's adult hair, though it started getting thicker the last time we saw them before they left. I've read many descriptions of poodle coat quality on the forum, but it's difficult to know what "thick" or "curly" or "proper" is, since different people may have different standards of "how thick is considered thick". It's also sometimes hard to tell from pictures, as a newly groomed and blow dried poodle will look different than a poodle that hasn't been bathed for a few weeks. 

Personally, I think Pavie's coat is quite thick and curly, especially the hair on his back. If I haven't cut it in a long time, his guard hairs grow out and make it feel extra thick. His belly, ears, and tail have straighter hair than the rest of the body.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Theo had a bath and a high velocity blow dry today. I got his body and legs nicely dried, but husband wanted supper and I am still cautious with the blow dryer around his face so the part behind his ears didn’t get completely dry and has curled. You can see how curly he is. It’s not the best picture because he was brushed and blown dry. I should have taken a picture before his bath. He was soaking wet yesterday from rain and dried naturally and was more curly. 

The neck and behind the ears are so thick. He has a thicker coat than his mother. I didn’t see his father who is used in competition grooming so I assume has a nice coat.

So far his coat has been easy to take care of and I hope it remains so…. If your poodle has hair like this is it easy to keep mat free? Or do you have to clip your dog short?


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## Click-N-Treat (Nov 9, 2015)

Noelle has hair a lot like Theo's. She never mats, or really tangles up much. The same open little corkscrews you see in his topknot is what Noelle's hair does, too.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Click-N-Treat said:


> Noelle has hair a lot like Theo's. She never mats, or really tangles up much. The same open little corkscrews you see in his topknot is what Noelle's hair does, too.


Thanks Click, that’s reassuring.


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## Click-N-Treat (Nov 9, 2015)

Behind Noelle's ear. Light in the room is purple, so the color is weird, but that's her texture.


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## Ren. (May 20, 2021)

A complete surprise. Ren was expected to have a typical shaggy, wavy doodle coat. It was disappointing, at first, when he started to get curly instead.
Ren’s coat worked out great for us in the end. It’s very soft to the touch and can stand up. His jacket still has some puppy fluff, but the puppy fur on his legs and poms is almost gone and starting to hold shape better. Ren never went through a visible coat change and there is no matting or knots as long as his coat is kept straight and fluffy. Usually, just brushing his coat when fluff-drying is enough until the next bath. Otherwise, line-brushing every other day is necessary to prevent tangles from forming. The one major downside, Ren’s fur lifts up too much for a terrier/doodle style beard.









Scissored pom holding shape vs. ungroomed, floppy pom
















Ren's coat tightly curled vs. Ren's coat fluffed 
(Taken a week apart; his fur is the same length in both pictures.)


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

Poppy's coat was always soft and rather straight - toy apricot plush rather than classic wiry curls. On steroids it became even softer and very sparse. Since halving the steroid dose in the summer it has grown back over most of the balder patches, although her tail is still very bare. She is very much in need of a clip - every time I plan a full groom over a couple of days a human or canine emergency seems to intervene...


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Click-N-Treat said:


> View attachment 486452
> 
> Behind Noelle's ear. Light in the room is purple, so the color is weird, but that's her texture.


I first thought, what did you do to Theo’s hair turning it purple… until I read your comment that it was Noelle9s under a purple light. Color is definitely weird. Haha



Ren. said:


> Ren's coat tightly curled vs. Ren's coat fluffed
> (Taken a week apart; his fur is the same length in both pictures.)


Oh I adore Ren with a fluffed coat; just want to pet him all over with that fluff.



fjm said:


> Poppy's coat was always soft and rather straight - toy apricot plush rather than classic wiry curls. On steroids it became even softer and very sparse. Since halving the steroid dose in the summer it has grown back over most of the balder patches, although her tail is still very bare. She is very much in need of a clip - every time I plan a full groom over a couple of days a human or canine emergency seems to intervene...


I’m so glad most of her coat returned.

The fate of a poodle, always in need of a grooming and never enough time.


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## I_love_dogs (May 30, 2021)

The poodles I have gotten to pet before had thinner coats that were kept short. Loki's coat is really dense. He went through coat change at 6 months which seems to we way earlier than everyone else. When I give him a bath several weeks after a grooming, it is always funny to watch my big fluffy dog become this skinny dog. Then I blow dry his hair and his fluffy again.
His coat seems to have a nice curl. He already has a nice top knot. The ears are the only thing that seem strange. They are soft and straight.


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## Miki (Dec 25, 2021)

Spottytoes said:


> I haven’t been surprised because I knew very little when we got Bobby. I’ve learned a lot though. As a parti poodle his coat is all over the place. His body and upper tail are super thick, curly and wiry. His topknot is pretty thick, fairly curly but not as curly as some. The white areas on his body are softer and more wavey rather than curly. His lower legs and feet are thick but not very curly.
> 
> Joey’s cream coat is thick, uniform and holds shape well. It reminds me of cotton candy. It will be interesting to see how his coat looks once he goes through his coat change. I’m anticipating a nice coat. We’ll see.


My Tucker (RIP, silver mismark) had the same texture to his white tuxedo - it was very soft and, as you can see here, more wavy than curly. The rest of his coat was silver - and fabulous. He was a very pretty boy (and is greatly missed).


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## For Want of Poodle (Feb 25, 2019)

Johanna said:


> I suspect Annie has quite a bit of Wycliffe behind her. I have had several dogs from that background who tended to cord. I never wanted to do a corded coat because it is so much more trouble than a brushed one!


You are correct! I think she's about 40% Wycliffe. 

I also don't really want to do a corded coat, but I have always dreamed of owning a Komondor in the nebulous future when I own a couple of acres, so I feel like it might be a good reality check to let Annie cord. Still probably can't make myself do it. I like her topknot far too much.


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## buddyrose (Jul 27, 2011)

Ginger is almost 11 months old. Her red coat is all over in textures: soft, wavy in places, and curly. Her face has these sharp, stiff hairs. Her tail is still mostly straight hairs but beginning to curl. I don't know what to expect or how it will change when she's an adult. Except for the wiry hairs on her nose, I like it all.


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## 94Magna_Tom (Feb 23, 2021)

buddyrose said:


> Ginger is almost 11 months old. Her red coat is soft, both wavy and curly. Her face has these sharp, stiff hairs. Her tail is still mostly straight hairs but beginning to curl in places.
> View attachment 486459
> 
> View attachment 486458
> ...


Awwwwe! Ginger looks adorable with a snoot full of snow!


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## buddyrose (Jul 27, 2011)

94Magna_Tom said:


> Awwwwe! Ginger looks adorable with a snoot full of snow!


She was eating it. She will eat anything and everything. I have to watch her like a hawk. LOL


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## Starla (Nov 5, 2020)

I wish I could freeze Phoebe’s hair like it is now on her back. It is so soft and curly. It feels like a very expensive plush blanket. I believe it will end up harsher. I think I used the 1/4” guard a couple weeks ago? I’d have to look at my grooming calendar to say for sure.


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## Tulsi (Jun 8, 2021)

Dianaleez said:


> Normie's coat is soft. And you can see by his feet, very curly.
> 
> View attachment 486431


Eep Normie looks just like my Rusty. How lovely. R has soft baby texture fur on his back and curly on his neck. He is just coming up to 10 months old.


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## 94Magna_Tom (Feb 23, 2021)

Tulsi said:


> Eep Normie looks just like my Rusty. How lovely. R has soft baby texture fur on his back and curly on his neck. He is just coming up to 10 months old.


That must be normal then. The back of Elroy's neck is also his curliest area. He's a couple of weeks older than Normie is. He legs, below his hocks and ankles, seem to need the most brushing for mat prevention though.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

So many gorgeous poodles, not enough time to pet them all.  🐩


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

Merlin’s coat is soft, and not as dense as Beckie’s. He also is bothered by heat and cold. Beckie’s coat is better than Merlin’s but still not the perfect texture for the breed. She isn’t hot in summer and tolerates the cold okay for a small dog. I do like her coat a lot better than Merlin’s.

If I had another poodle, I would avoid apricots, reds and creams for that reason.


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## Bailey_Whiskey (Jan 18, 2021)

Whiskey has super dense and tight curls on his cheeks that mat if we don’t brush it out every other day. Otherwise, the rest of him is just a mess of (a little less) thick soft tight curls that makes me feel like I’m cuddling a giant teddy bear.
He starts curling up the day after his bath, but maybe it’s our humidity…


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## JaneOnWhidbey (Nov 6, 2020)

Raindrops said:


> Yes very much. Misha's coat is not ideal for conformation or grooming. It is light and more wavy than curly. On his back it is especially frizzy and difficult to get it to curl nicely. His neck probably has the best quality coat but it is SO dense (but not wirey) that it becomes difficult to brush when it is long. I think it has not always been so dense. It is now hard to get a comb through even when well brushed.
> 
> Here is his coat with my best attempts to get it to curl. I try to use plenty of leave in conditioners and wet it down. But generally I am dissatisfied so I tend to keep it blown out instead. His breeder said his brother has a very dense harsh coat while his sister also has a softer coat.
> 
> ...





Raindrops said:


> Yes very much. Misha's coat is not ideal for conformation or grooming. It is light and more wavy than curly. On his back it is especially frizzy and difficult to get it to curl nicely. His neck probably has the best quality coat but it is SO dense (but not wirey) that it becomes difficult to brush when it is long. I think it has not always been so dense. It is now hard to get a comb through even when well brushed.
> 
> Here is his coat with my best attempts to get it to curl. I try to use plenty of leave in conditioners and wet it down. But generally I am dissatisfied so I tend to keep it blown out instead. His breeder said his brother has a very dense harsh coat while his sister also has a softer coat.
> 
> ...


I love the center part on this happy poodle!


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## Misteline (Mar 10, 2019)

buddyrose said:


> Ginger is almost 11 months old. Her red coat is all over in textures: soft, wavy in places, and curly. Her face has these sharp, stiff hairs. Her tail is still mostly straight hairs but beginning to curl. I don't know what to expect or how it will change when she's an adult. Except for the wiry hairs on her nose, I like it all.
> 
> View attachment 486459
> 
> ...


Ginger's curls are irresistible.


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## Johanna (Jun 21, 2017)

Misteline said:


> Ginger's curls are irresistible.


The stiff hairs on her muzzle are whiskers. If you look at the muzzle of a dog with a short smooth coat you can see the whiskers easily. On a poodle, thoough, they are not as easy to see since the other type if hair hides them.


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

Gracie is my first 100% poodle so I also did not have a frame of reference. Turns out she has a beautiful coat, dense, springy, doesn’t mat easy.Her groomer breeds poodles and says she has “a coat to die for.” Im very lucky that she very rarely mats but the water tends to bead off her when I bathe her, it takes forever to get her totally wet. I don’t brush her in between her baths, the once every two week bath and blow out seems to be enough.

FYI, I asked Gracie’s groomer what type of shampoo products she uses at her last groom. She laughed and said “ diluted Dawn or Palmolive dish soap, bet that’s not the answer you were looking for!“ She also said she doesn’t use conditioner. She shows her red, cream, white, and apricot Tpoos in conformation, quite successfully, they are gorgeous, sweet little dogs. So I‘m going to consider that…of course this question came after I spent 60 dollars on Isle of Dogs 😜


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## twyla (Apr 28, 2010)

Leonard's coat is nice very easy to deal with


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## buddyrose (Jul 27, 2011)

Johanna said:


> The stiff hairs on her muzzle are whiskers. If you look at the muzzle of a dog with a short smooth coat you can see the whiskers easily. On a poodle, thoough, they are not as easy to see since the other type if hair hides them.


I didn't know that. My last toy poodle, black, didn't have them. I thought Ginger had them because she's red. Human redheads have fewer strands of hair but the strands tend to be thicker and a coarse. I figured dogs were the same.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Carolinek said:


> she very rarely mats but the water tends to bead off her when I bathe her, it takes forever to get her totally wet. I don’t brush her in between her baths, the once every two week bath and blow out seems to be enough.


You are describing Babykins coat. I’m afraid to use dish detergent but maybe it would work better with that oil? I do start shampooing her before she’s completely wet. I wish I had one of those wands for dispensing water with shampoo in the bath that some professional groomers use. Shampoo breaks down the oil so the coat gets wet. 

Theo on the other hand Is soaking wet as soon as the water hits his hair X his bath goes so more quickly.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

buddyrose said:


> I didn't know that. My last toy poodle, black, didn't have them. I thought Ginger had them because she's red. Human redheads have fewer strands of hair but the strands tend to be thicker and a coarse. I figured dogs were the same.


All dogs have whiskers but maybe they blended better with a black muzzle and perhaps your dog was groomed more often or they grew more slowly.

When I shave Babykins face every two weeks I don’t notice the whiskers: if I wait a month, I can see them poking out.


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## Ren. (May 20, 2021)

Please be careful if you do try dish detergent. We used Dawn on Ren as a puppy. His puppy groomer told us his skin dried out from using it and recommended we switch over to dog shampoo.


Skylar said:


> I wish I had one of those wands for dispensing water with shampoo in the bath that some professional groomers use.


Do you have a 3D printer? I made a 3-way connector for a shower hose and waterpik/traditional shower head with an attachment for a two-liter bottle/squirt bottle of shampoo. I’d be happy to share the file, if you would like to print one.


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

Skylar- I wonder if silvers and blacks have very similar coats? There is definitely an oil to Gracie’s coat- maybe it hearkens to the retriever roots? She specifically said you need
To cut the oil in the coat. I haven’t tried it yet but when I do I’ll come back and let folks know how it works. She also said to make sure to just use baby shampoo near the face, I already do that.

Ren- perhaps the key is making sure it’s diluted enough? Or maybe some
Dogs are more sensitive. I know Gracie tolerates it as she has been expose to it for a couple years now without a problem. She doesn’t have any skin issues I know of. Thank you for the tip about the 3 D printer- not something I would have any clue how to do, but someone else here may!


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## Johanna (Jun 21, 2017)

Carolinek said:


> FYI, I asked Gracie’s groomer what type of shampoo products she uses at her last groom. She laughed and said “ diluted Dawn or Palmolive dish soap, bet that’s not the answer you were looking for!“ She also said she doesn’t use conditioner. She shows her red, cream, white, and apricot Tpoos in conformation, quite successfully, they are gorgeous, sweet little dogs. So I‘m going to consider that…of course this question came after I spent 60 dollars on Isle of Dogs 😜


To get her wet more quickly, mix a little shampoo with a large amount of water. Pour in a line down the top of the back from right behind the ears to the tail. Massage it in as you go. I have used dish detergent in years past, but I decided it dried the skin too much, so now I use Bio-Groom or BlackOut. I finish with conditioner most of the time. If I had light colored dogs I would use Bio-Groom shampoo for white dogs. It looks as if Chris Christenson has taken over BlackOut shampoo and the similar ones for other colors.


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## buddyrose (Jul 27, 2011)

Skylar said:


> All dogs have whiskers but maybe they blended better with a black muzzle and perhaps your dog was groomed more often or they grew more slowly.
> 
> When I shave Babykins face every two weeks I don’t notice the whiskers: if I wait a month, I can see them poking out.


Thanks Skylar. I'm getting used to them.


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## Miki (Dec 25, 2021)

Johanna said:


> To get her wet more quickly, mix a little shampoo with a large amount of water. Pour in a line down the top of the back from right behind the ears to the tail. Massage it in as you go. I have used dish detergent in years past, but I decided it dried the skin too much, so now I use Bio-Groom or BlackOut. I finish with conditioner most of the time. If I had light colored dogs I would use Bio-Groom shampoo for white dogs. It looks as if Chris Christenson has taken over BlackOut shampoo and the similar ones for other colors.


My silver mismark Tucker took a long time to get thoroughly wet. I eventually just sprayed him with water to start, then used a very wet wash cloth with shampoo squirted on it, and scrubbed away. It worked for us. Rinsing was much easier once he had been soaped up. 

My Big Guy Mike's coat (black, but his sire was apricot) was very different - soft and curly and easily soaked. Still used the wash cloth but it was a lot faster.


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## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

Pogo and Snarky seemed to have the same hair texture when dry, but their coats behaved very differently when wet. Pogo's coat dried relatively quickly. Snarky's coat took forever. 
I don't yet have a good sense of how Galen and Ritter's coats will be. Galen's coat has been very thick and cottony up until now. (Exclamation I heard coming from the back room of the grooming shop, "I've never seen anything like this! He's like a doodle!"). However, at two years he seems to finally be emerging from the coat change period and getting more wiry; we shall see just how wiry the coat ends up. Ritter went through a period at about 8 months where his coat tangled a lot, but never like Galen's. I don't know if he just has an easier coat or if I should expect the other shoe to drop later this winter.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Ren. said:


> Please be careful if you do try dish detergent. We used Dawn on Ren as a puppy. His puppy groomer told us his skin dried out from using it and recommended we switch over to dog shampoo.
> 
> Do you have a 3D printer? I made a 3-way connector for a shower hose and waterpik/traditional shower head with an attachment for a two-liter bottle/squirt bottle of shampoo. I’d be happy to share the file, if you would like to print one.
> View attachment 486889
> View attachment 486890


Very clever Ren. I do have access to a 3d printer. But I’m washing my minipoos in the kitchen sink which has a sprayer. I looked and there’s no thread to screw on. I’m impressed with your creativity for problem solving.



Carolinek said:


> Skylar- I wonder if silvers and blacks have very similar coats? There is definitely an oil to Gracie’s coat- maybe it hearkens to the retriever roots? She specifically said you need
> To cut the oil in the coat. I haven’t tried it yet but when I do I’ll come back and let folks know how it works. She also said to make sure to just use baby shampoo near the face, I already do that.


Maybe it’s a black/silver thing, I don’t have enough experience. It’s shocking how hard it is to get her coat wet compared to Theo’s apricot coat. He’s soaking wet as soon as water hits. With Babykins I have apply shampoo to help break through the oils to get her wet. I run water, then use my hand with some shampoo in it to rub along her coat, then add more water and that’s when she starts to get wet. Once wet I can properly shampoo her fully. I use a lot more shampoo on her just trying to get her wet.

It’s interesting how much variation there is in poodle coats.


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

This thread certainly points out the variety in poodle coats!



Johanna said:


> To get her wet more quickly, mix a little shampoo with a large amount of water. Pour in a line down the top of the back from right behind the ears to the tail. Massage it in as you go. I have used dish detergent in years past, but I decided it dried the skin too much, so now I use Bio-Groom or BlackOut. I finish with conditioner most of the time. If I had light colored dogs I would use Bio-Groom shampoo for white dogs. It looks as if Chris Christenson has taken over BlackOut shampoo and the similar ones for other colors.


So I used diluted Dawn today and tried your tip Johanna, which worked well!

Gracie did dry pouffier than she does when I normally bath her, although not quite as nice as when she comes from the groomer. Her ears particularly are more voluminous when she comes from the groomer. 
I do have a force dryer, it's probably my novice technique. I used Bio Silk as a finishing spray, that may weigh it down. 

Here's the freshly bathed glamour girl, who would much rather be running through the mud and muck!


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## Johanna (Jun 21, 2017)

She looks really lovely - nice job!


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

She looks so fluffy, nothing like a freshly washed fluffy poodle, gorgeous.


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## Carolinek (Apr 2, 2014)

Thanks Johanna and Skylar! I do love that freshly washed look.


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## curlflooffan (Mar 27, 2020)

Evra is black and comes from a show breeder. She still has puppyfluff although I think coat change has slowly started. It is going to be interesting what her adult coat will look like because her puppy coat is sooo thick and wavy.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

curlflooffan said:


> Evra is black and comes from a show breeder. She still has puppyfluff although I think coat change has slowly started. It is going to be interesting what her adult coat will look like because her puppy coat is sooo thick and wavy.


Curl, I wonder too when do you know coat change is finished? Theo’s head and necks is so thick and has an adult finish feeling but the trunk of his body is still very soft and similar to his puppy hair. He’s 12 months, older than Evra.


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## curlflooffan (Mar 27, 2020)

Skylar said:


> Curl, I wonder too when do you know coat change is finished? Theo’s head and necks is so thick and has an adult finish feeling but the trunk of his body is still very soft and similar to his puppy hair. He’s 12 months, older than Evra.


I have no idea because Evra is my first poodle. I think it depends a little on the haircut, not that cutting the hair changes the texture. Just that when you cut them frequently you are taking that upper layer of puppy fluff, exposing the adults curls underneath. I would imagine that if you keep them long the coat change feels longer because the upper layers of fluff stays for longer. However, that is just from my experience of watching my mothers yorkie go through coat change. As that also includes changes in the colour it is more obvious. It was so freaky, we handed the groomer a black dog and she gave us a silver one back!  I could barely recognise him haha.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

curlflooffan said:


> . It was so freaky, we handed the groomer a black dog and she gave us a silver one back!  I could barely recognise him haha.


. Haha, I get this same reaction every time I do a full groom on Babykins. She’s silver but her guard hairs are black. Guard hairs grow faster than regular hair. When she’s freshly groomed she’s light silver in color. Over the next 2-4 weeks as the guard hairs grow, she turns medium silver. It’s always a shock to see her lighter color again.


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## Bigbark (Jan 9, 2021)

Skylar said:


> . Haha, I get this same reaction every time I do a full groom on Babykins. She’s silver but her guard hairs are black. Guard hairs grow faster than regular hair. When she’s freshly groomed she’s light silver in color. Over the next 2-4 weeks as the guard hairs grow, she turns medium silver. It’s always a shock to see her lighter color again.


No surprise, Remy's fur is just like Babykins fur. His silver is continuing to come in slowly. I absolutely must brush him every other day, and even then, his fur is knotted and it's difficult to get a comb through. I guess this is the price we pay for a show coat. To the touch, his fur is really soft and it's so thick that it's impossible to see his skin. His clip keeps its shape no matter how long it gets. I keep him clipped short since his fur is so dense.

I desperately want him to have bracelets. My groomer doesn't seem too anxious to do it. This summer, Remy will turn 2, so I thought about growing them out starting in the late spring. Are bracelets hard to maintain on a mini with this type of coat?


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Bigbark said:


> Are bracelets hard to maintain on a mini with this type of coat?


I have Babykins in a Miami so the only area I need to comb/brush regularly is her bracelets and puffs. I do need to brush and comb them every few days. If she gets a burr in them I have to comb them immediately to work the burr out before it tangles too deeply. I keep an emergency comb in the car for burrs. She doesn't get them often - but I have to be proactive when bracelets are long.

They can get serious icy snow balls if she plays in deep snow which isn’t often. I do keep hers very long - longer than most people. You can have short ones that would be significantly less upkeep. 

Sadly she got something very sticky in one - I have no idea what is was, my husband took her for a long walk. I had to cut her bracelet - I couldn't get this sticky stuff out. I couldn't leave her with a chunk missing, so today I shaved them all off. She's had them for 6 years. I miss them and will be regrowing them - however it's handy that we may have a mega snow storm tomorrow and I won't have to worry about ice balls.

It's a shame your groomer doesn't listen to your requests. The fun of having a poodle is we can play with different styles.


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## Bailey_Whiskey (Jan 18, 2021)

We used to struggle with baths because it took so long to get Whiskey wet. Then doubly long to get him dry. 
Then we found out that we could use a car wash nozzle on the gentlest setting. Strong enough to soak him through, yet gentle enough to not hurt. Plus if you get the kind with the soap bottle attachment, soaping goes way faster and you use less soap 😉


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## Happy'sDad (Jul 4, 2020)

I can't believe I've missed this thread. Happy's hair is extremely fine and soft. Her topknot holds ok, but I need to continually brush her ears, poms and tail puff to keep them looking nice. I wouldn't change a thing though; her softness is what make her so cuddle-able.



Skylar said:


> I couldn't get this sticky stuff out. I couldn't leave her with a chunk missing, so today I shaved them all off.


It's not the end of the world. I take Happy's poms off for the winter and bring them back for the spring. I love the way they look, but they pick up too much debris and moisture in the fall through winter.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Happy'sDad said:


> It's not the end of the world. I take Happy's poms off for the winter and bring them bake for the spring. I love the way they look, but they pick up too much debris and moisture in the fall through winter.


This is probably a smarter plan.


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## Bigbark (Jan 9, 2021)

Skylar said:


> I have Babykins in a Miami so the only area I need to comb/brush regularly is her bracelets and puffs. I do need to brush and comb them every few days. If she gets a burr in them I have to comb them immediately to work the burr out before it tangles too deeply. I keep an emergency comb in the car for burrs. She doesn't get them often - but I have to be proactive when bracelets are long.
> 
> They can get serious icy snow balls if she plays in deep snow which isn’t often. I do keep hers very long - longer than most people. You can have short ones that would be significantly less upkeep.
> 
> ...


How long will it take to grow out her bracelets? Even without them, Babykins always looks fabulous.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Bigbark said:


> How long will it take to grow out her bracelets? Even without them, Babykins always looks fabulous.


Thanks. I’m guessing it will take several months to get a respectable length, but I think others may have more experience with this.


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## Happy'sDad (Jul 4, 2020)

Skylar said:


> Thanks. I’m guessing it will take several months to get a respectable length, but I think others may have more experience with this.


 It takes Happy's poms about three months to go from about 1" to full glory ( maybe 3.5"). They come back quicker than you think.


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## Bigbark (Jan 9, 2021)

Happy'sDad said:


> It takes Happy's poms about three months to go from about 1" to full glory ( maybe 3.5"). They come back quicker than you think.


Thanks! Given his thick coat, they will probably nice. I'm going to give it a try.


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## SusanG (Aug 8, 2009)

Skylar said:


> It’s not a surprise that my silver minipoo Babykins has a different texture coat texture compared to her minipoo apricot brother Theo.
> 
> Babykins has the coat poodle people want in conformation. I know several people who show poodles in conformation and a groomer who competes in competition grooming (not creative grooming). They have all expressed how fabulous her coat is. The competition groomer has begged to use her in competition. I would if she enjoyed grooming. She has a thick wire coat that holds a shape, keeps a long top knot standing up straight etc.
> 
> ...


I have the same thing. Both my girls come from champion backgrounds but their coats couldn't be more different. Molly is silver and she has a heavy heavy curly coat that is so thick a sheep would be jealous. Its soft but much coarser than Callie's. Molly always looks good, even days after grooming an she is easy to groom.
Callie is apricot and has the softest coat I have ever felt. Although it is thick (or was when she was younger) it isn't super curly and is very fine hair. Half the time she looks like an unmade bed regardless of how often I bathe and groom her. Grooming is soooooooo hard to do because her coat is so soft. (I've heard groomers hate to do reds and apricots for that reason. But she has such a lovely color and beautiful face even if her topknot gets a little wonky.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

SusanG said:


> Grooming is soooooooo hard to do because her coat is so soft.


I have to do a lot of scissor work so my apricot’s hair looks properly groomed. I'm thankful he has so much hair on his topknot that he never has a wonky top knot. However I knew that wonky top knot with my tpoo.


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