# Walking a nervous 20 week old Spoo



## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

Puppies can walk for a long time, as long as you let them rest when you see signs of tiredness.

My tpoo is the most fearful / anxious dog there is. He never left the breeder's house before 16 months old before he came to me. He had never seen the sun, was doing his business inside.

I started walking him right away. At first he would jump 4 feet in the air at every noise, wouldn't walk past cars, cowered when he heard kids screaming, ect.

I started with small step, going one block away and then coming back, so he would see we go back to his safety (home) after a while. After maybe 1 week, I increased the distance. After a while, I noticed he was having fun and was looking to having his harness put on. When that happened, I started working on every fear : cars and trucks, kids, garbage cans, etc.

Within about 2 1/2 months of this, he was a lot better and now he loves his walks ! I always try to find a place where he can run free for a few minutes and he loves that ! He is still scared at night, because we don't walk much then. But he is soooo much better !

With a young pup, you will see even more progress in less time ! You need to set the example and be relaxed and having fun. Make sure it's a good experience for your dog.

Come back in 1 month and tell us how it's going and I am sure there will be a big change !


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

It sounds as if your pup missed out on early socialisation, and possibly has a rather nervous temperament as well - which means that you are playing catch up. Concentrate on giving her happy, positive experiences of the world. That may mean finding a bench away from the hustle and bustle and feeding her treats as the world goes by, or playing silly games out on walks, or sitting on the floor with her and watching the other dogs at the puppy class. I would avoid forcing her - praise and reward confident behaviour, and let her know that you will always step in if anything worries her. Poppy was around 13 weeks when she came to me, and very nervous. It took months of gentle encouragement and support, and often felt as if we were taking two steps backwards for each one forwards, but she got there - she still likes to check things out from the sidelines first, but she makes human and canine friends easily, and doesn't have a conniption if someone leaves a dustbin in an unexpected place.

On walks, the rule of thumb is 5 minutes per month of age, twice a day, so 25 - 30 minutes leash exercise is well within the guidelines. I would avoid jumping or a forced march on hard surfaces, but a half-hour sniff walk where she sets the pace sounds perfect to me. I can well imagine that the disapproving presence of the breeder made you - and thus your puppy - even more stressed at the class. I would try just observing for a while, with a comfy pad on the floor for you both to sit on, and lots of good treats. There is plenty of time for her to learn skills like Sit and loose leash walking - what she needs at the moment is to learn to relax around other people and dogs. Puppy class is ideal for that, if you forget the rest of the stuff!


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

It sounds like your breeder is a bitch. I'd take Fjm's advice with your pup. Best for you to steer clear of this woman. She obviously is the problem, not you. I'm sorry you had to endure such rudeness. You don't need that. Give your pup some time and do what's natural. Let her romp and run however she wants. It's the _repetitive_ exercise that needs to be watched and limited. No force. A little walk, lots of play in the yard. Lots of happy exposure to minimized stimuli...no over whelming. If she's afraid of something, make it less scary, further away, smaller, less loud, less visible. Baby steps and lots of pairing with fantastic treats. Give her time. She's got some developing yet to do.


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## jetta0127 (Aug 19, 2016)

Thank you Poodlebeguiled! I feel so much better reading the replies from everyone. Can't tell you how bad I felt thinking that I was inadvertently causing my puppy's nervousness and had also possibly caused her physical harm from taking her on walks! Thank you *fjm*for all the wonderful advice! We are going to sit and quietly observe our class next week, great idea! This is not my first puppy, but she is my first Spoo puppy, and although I have attended many different obedience classes over the years I have always owned Rotties and Labs and everyone keeps telling me how different poodles are. I was hoping to do obedience and agility with this pup, but not sure how she will do. I love my girl and want her to be happy!!!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I would limit pavement walking for any longer that the amount of time according to the formula fjm discussed. If it is possible to walk on a trail or other non-paved area you can go a bit longer as long as you watch for whether you pup wants to start.

It does sound like the breeder did an atrocious job socializing her. I brought all of my pup's home at about 8 weeks old. While I wouldn't recommend this for a small breed of pup I think it is fine for larger dogs. Javelin's breeder had their first round of immunizations done and then held them for a couple of days to make sure none of them had an adverse reaction and then had us pick them up over the next few days. Javelin was about 8 1/2 weeks old. The breeder's rationale was that each owner could do a lot better work socializing them than she could since there were nine puppies and that work takes lots of time and that there weren't enough hours in the day for her to keep moving their development along once they reached that age. I would take your breeder's comments with a huge grain of salt.

You do have some catching up to do, but it won't be terrible to accomplish. Since she is young and still essentially a blank slate at least you are not undoing abuse or other things that could be hidden issues with some adult rescued dog, somewhat as described by Dechi. As said above you want all of her experiences to be positive, so keep going to puppy class but if you see her feeling nervous sit on the side and watch. when you see her interest perk up let her decide how to approach the other puppies. When you take her out in your neighborhood rather than thinking you need to make her walk to get exercise but instead engage her in thoughtful games that will be fun for her and therefore build her confidence. You might try tugging with her. If she is very engaged by tug she will ignore the things that she is afraid of and she will be fully engaged with you. Once she starts to really enjoy tug you can use it as a game that will develop her impulse control which is a life skill that will be very good for her to have as a way to disengage from things like another dog barking at her and the like. You can also do some of the focus and attention exercises like the five cookie came and others that I have described in my thread on training my boy to get performance ring skills. Here is a link for it. http://www.poodleforum.com/24-perfo...-hunting/205393-javelins-road-ring-ready.html

One other thing for you to do is to keep yourself happy in your interactions with her when you are out and about. If you fake that she will know and I think that makes the dog very confused. Here is what I see in the thought bubble over the head of a dog whose owner is smiling at them while grinding their teeth. "She looks happy and I want to be happy too, but she doesn't seem to match on the inside and instead seems really annoyed. I think I'll be annoying so she will leave me alone."


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

Introduce your puppy to everything including exercise slowly and at her own pace. Spoo puppies have boundless energy and can overreach their sensible limits playing games. Keep your excursions out of the home short. Have someone she knows meet you a _*short*_ distance from your home. When you meet them encourage her to socialize and have your assistant reward her (without a treat) reward her yourself. If she has learned "good girl" that might be enough if not a game of tug or a quick game of fetch is reward enough. Try to do the same with a friendly local dog. _*Slowly*_ make your excursions longer but make sure she is enjoying them. The same applies to the car. Find a place she loves to go to close by. Periodically take her there and make sure she enjoys the play there. She will soon associate the car with going to good places and the nervous reactions will cease. Time, consistency, patience and treats work wonders.
Eric.
PS. It is rare that a breeder knows too little about their breed but yours does and she knows less about people and good manners. Take no notice at all of her. She is ignorant of poodles and people. It is possible she knows this and is a critic of those who she has dealt with to protect her own ego at the expense of others.


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## Viking Queen (Nov 12, 2014)

I think by going slowly and introducing your pup to new environments like others have said, she will eventually come around. As long as you exhibit calm and happy demeanor and are not anxious for her she will do well.

The breeder is an idiot, IMHO, and did you no favors by criticizing you. But then, you already knew that.

Relax, enjoy your kiddo, Spoos are in a class by themselves and are very very special. You will enjoy the experience. :angel:

VQ

P.S.

We NEED pictures of the little darling


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

jetta0127 said:


> Thank you Poodlebeguiled! I feel so much better reading the replies from everyone. Can't tell you how bad I felt thinking that I was inadvertently causing my puppy's nervousness and had also possibly caused her physical harm from taking her on walks! Thank you *fjm*for all the wonderful advice! We are going to sit and quietly observe our class next week, great idea! This is not my first puppy, but she is my first Spoo puppy, and although I have attended many different obedience classes over the years I have always owned Rotties and Labs and everyone keeps telling me how different poodles are. I was hoping to do obedience and agility with this pup, but not sure how she will do. I love my girl and want her to be happy!!!


Okay, this is just me rambling. Don't feel you need to read it all. I'm just remembering stuff.

I had a lab, lab mix and Doberman among a few other breeds. I didn't have a Rottie but knew some and had one I worked with. That dog was very interested in learning and just needed some direction that the owners weren't giving her. She was of average "hardness." Not overly sensitive and not a ball of steel for sure. 

I found my lab to be a bit independent but not so much like some breeds...hounds for instance. My Doberman was VERY sensitive, just like my poodles are. Both breeds are very intelligent and imo do best with a progressive kind of training. (ie: positive reinforcement) One of my poodles is much more sensitive than the other, although they're both pretty soft. They've both turned into friendly, outgoing, brave little souls, who love to learn and try new things. They're both bonded to me as well as other visiting family members and love children especially....very affectionate and attentive and well behaved. These were two puppies from different litters from the same breeder, two days apart in age that I got at 8 weeks of age. They're now 3.5 years old and I couldn't ask for anything more.

I like bringing home puppies at around 8 weeks of age, regardless of their size as long as they're healthy, weaned and ready to go and that includes my toy poodles here. That way I can get going on their socialization the way I want to, the way they need to in order to get along in our life style. Too late and you miss that doggone early, critical, socialization period. So if this breeder of yours didn't hop to it soon enough and well enough, that could be part of the shyness or it could be the temperament or both. It is difficult to regain that window of time if it has been missed. BUT there are plenty of dogs that can improve with careful, systematic socialization nevertheless. I recommend the book, Culture Clash. She describes a very good, well planned out socialization protocol and why exactly all this is so very vital. Great book. 

I like most of their running to be done on grass or a dirt trail. It's better for all of us, regardless of age. I use to hike with my Dobe when he was pretty young...he went longer than recommended because he neeeeeeeeeeded it. He waaaaaanted it. lol. He demanded more exercise than the typical formula. He did things he wasn't suppose to, like leap off the front porch, skipping all 4 steps and landing on the concrete. He leaped over fallen logs in the woods. This is when he was about 5 or 6 months old. I thought...omg! You're going to get pano. But he never did...no skeletal problems, but I guess it's good to be more restrictive if you can. (if your dog will allow it. lol)

Of course, various breeds have their own traits that they've been selected for. But I don't think everything can be chalked up to breed. There are a lot of characteristics people mention about a certain breed and I think...hmmm, that's a dog thing, not a breed thing. Or...that's an individual thing, not a breed thing...at least to some extent. So take all that with a grain of salt and gentle your little one along and let her choose her own pace with just a little nudging from you. See her individual ways and make allowances. Don't try to make her fit a mold. Enjoy your puppy and don't stress. She'll be fine. My Doberman's breeder said to me, "let your puppy be a puppy." And I've always loved that and it really struck me and stayed with me. Very good sentiment I think. So in other words, don't stress. Just let things roll, learn a little, remember a little from your past puppies and enjoy this time.


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## Kassie (Apr 7, 2016)

I didn't know you had to limit walks of SPoo pups? Is it because? I don't know why...why? I would have thought you take them out and not jog or run, but get them out. I've never heard of this before. Hmm? We don't do that with colts. Never heard that for the tpoo? I take my fella out and socialize him. I guess, I thought I was socializing him, but I kept him to the back woods and trails. He is crazy for people. Nuts. In agility class, he goes gaga over people. Jumps like a pogo stick. Now, at lunch I walk him at the sea front on the boardwalk. There he sees oodles of folks, boats, seaplanes etc. He was better in agility class this week. More focused on the game, than the people around. Every pup is different. 

Empathy and persistence and patience. Slow baby steps. Your SPoo will get there, just takes time. Hugs. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Kassie the limit is on how much hard pavement walking/running to do for any puppy or younger adolescent dog. Otherwise walking on trails and similar activities on soil are fine as long as you don't end up with a dog who is so tired you have to call for a ride or carry them home, would not be fun with a 30 or 40 pound sack of sleepy potatoes worth of a dog.


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Repetitive pounding exercise like jogging isn't recommended for young dogs' joints. I see nothing wrong with a walk, lots of new things to name and smell. Just be confident, patient and encouraging as you are, and your puppy will be fine. Your breeder should have been more encouraging too. Some tips for a sensitive, intelligent puppy like you've gotten on PF.


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## Caddy (Nov 23, 2014)

I think you will do fine with your puppy, patience and kindness. You already have had lots of great info here, so good luck and can't wait for updates!
Ps. Your breeder sounds like a turkey!


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## dogfriend (Oct 9, 2016)

Your experience reminds me so much of my own. I brought Mabel home at 12 weeks and she is now 21 weeks. For the first month it was pretty rough. She was so scared of the world outside our home. More recently, though, she has really turned a corner. She loves her walks, she enjoys new people, she loves dogs. She plays fetch in the park. She barks at pumpkins--rather than cowers.

But again: SO MUCH of what you've said reminds me of my own experience. Mabel was very scared in puppy class. She ran from strangers. She would not walk down the street--and would duck and hide at every opportunity. It took patience and little else. She found her footing. Now she bounds around and is very happy and increasingly quite confident. 

Teaching her tricks has really helped. It seems like something extra and needless, but she is very smart, and being able to learn the tricks quickly and do them on command has obviously augmented her confidence. She lives to perform! Any time visitors come over she wants to shake their hands and roll over. It's quite the change from hiding under the couch! 

I'll close by saying I agree with the sentiment that we should all get our puppies around 8 weeks regardless of size. My breeder was fine and did try to actively socialize, but she lives in the country and Mabel now lives in NYC. Nothing short of being here with us could have prepared her for the sights and sounds that now fill her days.

I wish you the best!


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## jetta0127 (Aug 19, 2016)

Thank you for sharing your experience dogfriend. Great to hear about the happy outcome for you and your puppy! I'm sure NY was quite the culture shock for your pup after life in the country. I'm going to continue getting my girl out and will incorporate some of the great suggestions posted by everyone. I'm sure she will improve, we are going to take it slow...and I don't live in an area half as busy as NY!! Lol It has been wonderful reading all of the helpful and supportive replies to my post; I am so appreciative that so many took the time to help!!!


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

Obedience and agility can be very helpful with building confidence, as long as you take things at her pace. The predictability of obedience ("I know this one! And this one!") can be very reassuring, just like the trick training dogfriend describes, and agility really helped Poppy when she was old enough to do it. She got whole hours of my undivided attention, treats for doing fun stuff, and when we reached the stage of running courses sat on my knee till it was her turn to show off - with all that bliss she stopped worrying about big bouncy dogs and people in strange hats!


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## blueroan (Dec 28, 2015)

I can totally relate to the frustration. We brought Honey home as an 8 week old, but my family didn't allow her out at all. When they realized you cannot keep a young mpoo cooped up in the house without driving everyone bananas, then they allowed me to walk her. Since she now missed that early socializing, she is nervous.

She is much better than she was now, but at the beginning she would freeze at anything she thought scary, try to bolt, or pull as hard as she could to go home. Now though she really enjoys her walks, still gets nervous about things but it is steadily improving all the time.

You can do it!!!


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## jetta0127 (Aug 19, 2016)

Good to know *fjm*[/B] Looking forward to participating with my girl! The other issue I'm having is finding something that motivates her. She is not an eater and is not really interested in treats, especially when she is outside the home (I've even tried steak!). Not much interest in toys either..whew! Thanks for all of your help! *Blueroan* thank you for passing on your experience..and for the motivation! My pup doesn't pull to go home once we are out she is fine on walks. She just doesn't want to go out the door!!lol


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I really would not mind if I had a dog that wasn't treat driven or toy driven, but it can make things hard if neither of those kinds of things is motivating. It is probably easier to get a dog to be toy motivated than food motivated, especially poodles, who often are particular about food.

I would try throwing a ball, but make it motivational. Have your pup by your side. show the ball and pretend to throw it several times while saying "look what I have, want it, want it!!!" then throw it as you say go get it. If the puppy doesn't take off after it then run out and clap your hands, call her name. when you get to the ball if you get there before her, pick it up and make a big deal out of the idea of going to get it. Toss it around a bit and then repeat the whole process until you get her going after the ball. To turn that into fetch with a return get a second matching ball to show and when she has picked up the ball call her and she should return with the ball she just picked up. Get her to drop it into your hand and then throw the other one.

You can do similarly with a tug toy. Show it while wiggling it around and excitedly asking the dog if they want the toy. Once they show some interest, drag it along the ground and try to get the pup to follow. Let him catch it and then face the pup and gently pull and wiggle it. This should activate prey drive that will build tugging. Alternatively you can do the same with a flirt pole, but don't make a puppy jump for the flirt pole when they are young. 

I've been lucky that all of my dogs are happy to get treats and they are easily put into prey drive when I need it as a motivator. Tugging is a great motivator and reward to them, but they had to be taught to tug. The poodles both are also fabulous retrievers, as any spoo worth their salt should be.


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## jetta0127 (Aug 19, 2016)

Thank you *Lily cd re*! I really think my girl will like this! She does go after the ball now and sometimes brings it back, but usually she runs to the ball, sniffs it and walks away. She will chase the ball every time that I throw it though, so I will work on getting her to pick it up consistently. As far as the tugs go, she shows some interest but does seem to prefer the ball. We'll work on both! Really appreciate the help!! I think I might look for a good private trainer in my area, one that we can continue to work with as she matures, but still plan on attending group classes also, as she needs to get out and about. Thanks again!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I am glad to hear that you think you can get her revved over some good interactive toy play.

If you do decide to get a private trainer to work with you, I suggest you look at the trainer directory of the Association of Professional Dog Trainers. https://apdt.com/

Additionally if you can find someone with either a CPDT-KA or CDPT-KSA certification you have the assurance that they have a good skill set and knowledge based on an objective external examination and that they do continuing education. I am currently working on accruing the documentation of the 300 hours to sit for the CPDT-KA exam. How to choose a dog trainer - CCPDT


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