# Oh Lord No Ears Left



## Indiana (Sep 11, 2011)

You're right, the hair will grow back and just in time for spring. I just gave both my girls a very short hair cut all over, and even shaved Maddy's ears (Indy still has her very big fluffy ears and a scissored topknot). I've never done that before, but I am really enjoying it! I love their tails, they look like pointers. And they are so clean, and so warm and silky.


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## Muggles (Mar 14, 2015)

They look great! I think it'll grow on you - but of course will grow back soon anyway!


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## Caddy (Nov 23, 2014)

Well they look very cute no matter what, but I can understand how you feel. I've been thinking about trimming Abbey's ears but I love them long. It's not just the food, she's getting into the Wild rose thorns and they get so tangled up in here ears.


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

I keep Misha's ears short. Just so much easier to deal with. I like the look, I think it makes them look like puppies.


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

Awww, they look adorable ! Such cute faces...


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

I know you think they look bad, but I kept looking for the picture of the ugly just cut ears because I thought the picture I saw looked so cute!


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## Mysticrealm (Jan 31, 2016)

glorybeecosta said:


> Went to groomer a couple of days ago, and ask to have the ears trimmed so they do not get in the food and they leave them all one length and I ask her layer or feather them. Now they have hardly any left, I am sick, yes I know they will grow back, *but I cannot believe she did this. *See the difference in Cayennes color since I got her. Loved that red
> 
> 
> .
> View attachment 317458


The groomer did what she believed you were asking for. Sorry, but as a groomer this drives me nuts. Everyone loves to blame the groomer for everything. We try hard to do what the owner wants. We don't keep clients by doing whatever the heck we want and screw what the owner wants. So she did what she believed you were describing. Next time just go in and tell her that last time was too short and you'd like to grow them out more. If you have a pic of your dog or another dog with ears the way you like, bring that pic in to show your groomer.


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

Mysticrealm said:


> The groomer did what she believed you were asking for. Sorry, but as a groomer this drives me nuts. Everyone loves to blame the groomer for everything. We try hard to do what the owner wants. We don't keep clients by doing whatever the heck we want and screw what the owner wants. So she did what she believed you were describing. Next time just go in and tell her that last time was too short and you'd like to grow them out more. If you have a pic of your dog or another dog with ears the way you like, bring that pic in to show your groomer.



You're a little oversensitive, Mysticrealm... Glory is not accusing the groomer of murder, she's just saying she's disappointed that she cut the ears so short. It goes without saying that if she had understood what Glory said, she wouldn't have done it like that ! The responsability lies on both parts : the owner has to explain well, and the groomer has to make sure she understands well. I mean, who do we blame when we don't like the result, besides ourselves ? Not the plumber, right ?


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I don't think Mysticrealm is being oversensitive. I think there are probably lots of people (not here) who are not clear about what they expect and that they chew out the groomer for ruining the dog.

The same thing happens with vets. I have a number of friends who are vets and one of their biggest complaints runs along the following lines. Vet examines emaciated cat. Asks owner when did you notice that she wasn't eating. Owner: "oh she only stopped eating over the weekend." Bubble inside vet's head: "liar liar pants on fire." Vet faking a sympathetic facial expression: "oh dear well I think something must have been longer than just over the weekend. If you had noticed and brought her in sooner it would be a lot easier to do something for her." Same concept owner brings in short coated dog with a lump the size of an orange, vet asks when it was first noticed, owner just last week. Dog has cancer and dies days later. Could have been cured if caught early.

Same concept, someone brings in badly matted poodle or doodle or other hair coated dog and tells groomer it is important to save the coat when the most humane thing to do is to shave the dog nekkid.

Glorybee, I know you don't love the ears, but they will grow out. Next time take a picture showing what you want. If I didn't do my own grooming, that is what I would do. As it is if I don't like how they look I have only myself to blame.


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

I respect your opinion, Lily, but I don't agree. This is a shared responsability. I work in sales (this is a customer satisfaction issue) and it is rarely, if ever, only the customer's fault. When you provide a service, it is also your responsability to make sure you understand what is asked of you. That is why work ethics exist, and just because you're " only grooming dogs " doesn't mean you can discard those ethics.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I didn't say it wasn't a ideally a shared responsibility. When vets are asked to perform miracles on mortally ill or injured animals that have arrived in the condition they're in through neglect or abuse though they can't be blamed for poor outcomes. Then it is all in the ball park of the handler/owner. 

BF has worked in retail for decades, as did his mother. Yes the retailer has responsibility to respond to the customer's needs and the customer also has to be clear about what those needs are. There is no such thing as "just being a groomer in my book." I do my own and it is very hard work. When Lily was young and I took her out for grooming the groomer and I always had a decent conversation about what I was hoping for and the groomer had hands on her to evaluate what was realistic. She had a rough coat change and ended up naked along the way one time. I have all kinds of respect for groomers and all other retailers. BF eats his lunch standing up, assuming he has time to eat it at all. He works long hours and has his weekends broken up by working on Saturdays.


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## Countryboy (May 16, 2011)

Short Ears! Short Ears! Short Ears!

Hurray for Short Ears!! :cheers2:


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## Streetcar (Apr 13, 2014)

They are very sweet looking to me and look like a spring style .


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

N2Mischief said:


> I keep Misha's ears short. Just so much easier to deal with. I like the look, I think it makes them look like puppies.


N2Mischief, funny you said that as most of my girlfriends said they looked like puppies. The problem is Bella's flies back and the inside of her ears show all the time, unless I put them back down.


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

Mysticrealm said:


> The groomer did what she believed you were asking for. Sorry, but as a groomer this drives me nuts. Everyone loves to blame the groomer for everything. We try hard to do what the owner wants. We don't keep clients by doing whatever the heck we want and screw what the owner wants. So she did what she believed you were describing. Next time just go in and tell her that last time was too short and you'd like to grow them out more. If you have a pic of your dog or another dog with ears the way you like, bring that pic in to show your groomer.


Mysticrealm Stupid me did pull photos and forgot to take them with me, so I accept that. I have always taken photos if I want the tk longer, pictures of the body cut, pompoms everything, but forgot that day. What we discussed was taking them to almost to the skin (do not now what you call that) straight across and then feather so the hair was not all one length from where the tk was cut in. She cut the front and back hair on the ears to match the skin on the ear. If she had not trimmed the back and front the weight would have kept them from flipping back.


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## Michelle (Nov 16, 2009)

I think they look cute!!


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## HOTW (Aug 31, 2010)

When requesting ear trims and esp since you said it gets in their food etc, you should have shown her how much you wanted off and if you wanted a blunt cut a bevel or rounded etc. Its hard for a groomer to determine what you might want.Best to show by pulling the hair down between your fingers and shows the length you want taken off. An unfortunate misunderstanding. As a groomer I like it when people give very specific info so long as the dog is capable of being grooming in that trim!


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## Countryboy (May 16, 2011)

Let's face it Bee...  it's operator error... your fault. 

For your penance, two light slaps on the wrist and call it a seminar in Communicating With Groomers 101. 

Make sure you review today's lesson tonite over a glass of wine. 

A big step forward too. If you don't like it, now both of you know where NOT to go. Very helpful for a groomer!


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

HOTW said:


> When requesting ear trims and esp since you said it gets in their food etc, you should have shown her how much you wanted off and if you wanted a blunt cut a bevel or rounded etc. Its hard for a groomer to determine what you might want.Best to show by pulling the hair down between your fingers and shows the length you want taken off. An unfortunate misunderstanding. As a groomer I like it when people give very specific info so long as the dog is capable of being grooming in that trim!


Horw I told her I cut the bottom off a little but it needed shorter and I wanted them feathered, so they were shorter to stay out of the food and wanted them fluffy. Here is the cut I use on them and notie how th hair is not all the same length to end of ear, naturally I wanted the bottom shorter. Other

[/ATTACH] is just the ears


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## sidewinder (Feb 3, 2016)

I think they look adorable. I guess you might as well look at it as "lesson learned". BTW, if you don't like her ears to flip back, now's your chance to see just how much hair she needs to prevent that! Keep an eye on the growth and notice when it gets to the point that you like it. Also...only you know how short the ears need to be to keep them out of her food...groomer doesn't watch her eat.

One thing that always frustrated me as a pro groomer was when the person (my customer) wanted the dog (my client) to have some kind of look that the hair would never support. Your dogs look like they have good coats, but you'd be amazed at people coming in with poodles with thin, wispy straight coats (or matted to the skin) who wanted them to look like a show dog. I'd have to tell them (in a nice way) that my job was to take hair off, not put it on!


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

sidewinder said:


> I think they look adorable. I guess you might as well look at it as "lesson learned". BTW, if you don't like her ears to flip back, now's your chance to see just how much hair she needs to prevent that! Keep an eye on the growth and notice when it gets to the point that you like it. Also...only you know how short the ears need to be to keep them out of her food...groomer doesn't watch her eat.
> 
> One thing that always frustrated me as a pro groomer was when the person (my customer) wanted the dog (my client) to have some kind of look that the hair would never support. Your dogs look like they have good coats, but you'd be amazed at people coming in with poodles with thin, wispy straight coats (or matted to the skin) who wanted them to look like a show dog. I'd have to tell them (in a nice way) that my job was to take hair off, not put it on!


I am lucky Bella ha a wire coat (I do not know how the shape he was in when I got her) I had a retired show groomer and he said he never expected her coat to be so nice as he groomer her from the time I got her she was 18 months old, now 8 years (my groomer passed away) I guess I expect the same work from the new ones.

As a groomer I have a question the going rate here is 45.00 my groomer charges 55.00, however, mine are shapooed every week, and brushed dailey (even though kept short) my friends take dogs in once every 6 or 8 weeks, some matted and I pay the same, that does upset me. She finishes mine in 2 hours, for both dogs (she has a shampoo girl) and my friend gets hers 3 to 4 after dropping it off. Why would you not charge more for a dog that is not kept up if you are a groomer


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## sidewinder (Feb 3, 2016)

"Why would you not charge more for a dog that is not kept up if you are a groomer" 

I always did! If a dog came in matted, I'd charge their regular grooming fee, and give them a choice...Cut the dog down or pay me an hourly rate for dematting, with a one hour minimum. I had a regular clientelle and a long waiting list, so my people usually did what I wanted. If the dog came in matted again, I'd make them either keep the haircut shorter, or else bring it in more often. But matted dogs got charged extra, yes siree! I

If the dog was dirty and not matted, it doesn't take more work than a dog like your little girlies, who are kept clean and brushed. They still have to be brushed out and bathed. It's the mat problems that take more time, or dogs that misbehave because they don't get groomed often enough to accept it as part of their routine.


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## Mysticrealm (Jan 31, 2016)

Like I said in another thread where you mentioned this, 6-8 weeks of growth is not gonna take pretty much any more time to groom than a 4 week dog. And they may have small tangles in the ears, but they are not likely to have matts in such a short period of time unless in very long hair cuts. Dogs that truly take more time, we do charge extra.
Just because the groomer keeps them longer doesn't mean they are working on the dogs for any longer, it just depends on how the groomer works her schedule.
And it doesn't matter if the going rate is 45. If she gets enough business to support her higher rate then she has no reason to lower it.


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## MollyMuiMa (Oct 13, 2012)

Glory.....I think your girls look cute! The shorter ears make them look like pups again LOL!

Heck..I wish my groomer only charged $55.00! Molly's groom costs me $85.00+ tip & I do all of Molly's grooming except the hand scissoring on her jacket, which includes daily brushing, (she's never had a matt) bathing every 7-10 days, clipping her body, feet and face, clipping her nails and painting her toenails......but because she has a soft cotton coat I need a groomer with 'magic scissors' and I pay the price! Molly is always done in 2 hours or less, so I figure her groomer is getting paid more than $40.00+ an hour!!!!! If only I could scissor........LOL!
My neighbor only pays $45.00+tip for her toy poodle but it's just trimmed in a short Miami type clip......................


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

I pay 35$ CAD and my groomer is a poodle show groomer. She doesn't bathe, dry or cut nails or anything else. She clips and scissors and it takes about an hour, maybe 45 minutes.

There is no one else I would let touch him. All we have around here are basic groomers who seem to do the same style to all dogs, no matter what breed they are.


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## sidewinder (Feb 3, 2016)

Mollymiuma and Dechi, you are paying for the expertise of the specialist groomer. Not just anybody could scissor that coat! I was taught that it takes 5 years to learn how to scissor properly, and an eye for "style" is not something just anybody can develop. It is talent. You are lucky to have her! Sounds like you know that! 

I was hired at the second place I worked (over some others) because I had art training. The groomer there was a wonderful mentor and teacher, and a former graphic designer. She had been trained in a Poodle show kennel and had raised show Afghans herself. I learned how to de-mat dogs painlessly, and how to scissor!


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Dechi said:


> I pay 35$ CAD and my groomer is a poodle show groomer. She doesn't bathe, dry or cut nails or anything else. She clips and scissors and it takes about an hour, maybe 45 minutes.
> 
> There is no one else I would let touch him. All we have around here are basic groomers who seem to do the same style to all dogs, no matter what breed they are.



Oh, I would absolutely love that - that part of grooming that takes talent is what I need help with!


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

MollyMuiMa said:


> Glory.....I think your girls look cute! The shorter ears make them look like pups again LOL!
> 
> Heck..I wish my groomer only charged $55.00! Molly's groom costs me $85.00+ tip & I do all of Molly's grooming except the hand scissoring on her jacket, which includes daily brushing, (she's never had a matt) bathing every 7-10 days, clipping her body, feet and face, clipping her nails and painting her toenails......but because she has a soft cotton coat I need a groomer with 'magic scissors' and I pay the price! Molly is always done in 2 hours or less, so I figure her groomer is getting paid more than $40.00+ an hour!!!!! If only I could scissor........LOL!
> My neighbor only pays $45.00+tip for her toy poodle but it's just trimmed in a short Miami type clip......................



Think of it this way - a hair stylist could do 2-3 cuts in an hour and make much more than 40 bucks. Grooming is labor intensive work! Not to mention that they must be watchful of the health and safety of a possibly uncooperative client!


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## MollyMuiMa (Oct 13, 2012)

A real 'poodle groomer' is really hard to find! I know when I was looking for Molly's it was pretty easy to figure out who 'knew' poodle clips....all you have to do is ask if they know how to do a 'Scandinavian' .........I even called a grooming school here and they didn't know what I was talking about !!! It was only when I talked to Judy (my groomer) and she asked me if I wanted a 'show puppy clip' or a 'European' show puppy clip that I knew I found a groomer....... hahaha! 
And her shop is only 3/4 of a mile away from me!!! I feel lucky to have her!!!


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

MollyMuiMa said:


> A real 'poodle groomer' is really hard to find! I know when I was looking for Molly's it was pretty easy to figure out who 'knew' poodle clips....all you have to do is ask if they know how to do a 'Scandinavian' .........I even called a grooming school here and they didn't know what I was talking about !!! It was only when I talked to Judy (my groomer) and she asked me if I wanted a 'show puppy clip' or a 'European' show puppy clip that I knew I found a groomer....... hahaha!
> And her shop is only 3/4 of a mile away from me!!! I feel lucky to have her!!!



Yup, best thing to do is ask them what personal dog they have - if they have one or more poodles of their own, then it is a pretty sure bet that they are very into poodle clips!


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## TrixieTreasure (May 24, 2015)

glorybeecosta said:


> Went to groomer a couple of days ago, and ask to have the ears trimmed so they do not get in the food and they leave them all one length and I ask her layer or feather them. Now they have hardly any left, I am sick, yes I know they will grow back, but I cannot believe she did this. See the difference in Cayennes color since I got her. Loved that red
> 
> 
> .
> View attachment 317458


The ears look great! I know you like them the other way, but they look cute the way they are, and I think a change now and then is good. If it really bothers you, just talk to the groomer and make sure she doesn't do it like this again. But really, glory, they are soooo adorable!!


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

My neighbor only pays $45.00+tip for her toy poodle but it's just trimmed in a short Miami type clip...................... 

That is what mine are trimmed in also, every 4 weeks


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

My groomer owns a GS and it is trained for drugs and rescue, big dog, what is funny she is 4'10" and I bet she does not way 100 pounds, and when I see her with the dog, she would have to have it trained or she would be flying in the air behind it if it decided to take off. She has no small dogs but grooms many


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## Shamrockmommy (Aug 16, 2013)

Aw dang! As a groomer, I always feel terrible when I misinterpret the owner's wants! That's why I LOVE pictures of what the client wants or them physically showing me just exactly how much to take off. 

Now that said, I'm kinda mad at MYSELF for taking Jack too short! He's in a fairly fluffy modern, but I took it down the other day with a #0 snap on (leaves about 1/2"). I love him extra super fluffy, and I don't know what got into me!

So now we have to wait for it to fluff up and grow  Even his head hair is too tight up to his skull. Blah. 

I'm fired!!


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Shamrockmommy said:


> Aw dang! As a groomer, I always feel terrible when I misinterpret the owner's wants! That's why I LOVE pictures of what the client wants or them physically showing me just exactly how much to take off.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That's why I started doing my own grooming, so I have nobody to be mad at but myself. I think I am going to be really mad at me after Timi's next haircut, she is looking like a hairy beast, and I am itching to take her way down.
But the only thing I won't do is trim ear feather, I know from past experience that I m totally incapable of that lol!


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

I think my groomer way under-charges. For small dogs, shihtzu, yorkie, toy poodle, etc, she charges $25 which includes haircut, bath, nails, etc. For just a bath FFT she charges $15.00. My daughter works for her and keeps telling her she needs to raise prices! She has been there for 35 years and just refuses to charge more. She has great clients and does not accept new clients. She only does small, well behaved dogs. I pay her $35.00 for full groom, and I feel guilty. This woman was once a show groomer for standards (many years ago) and she is very talented. She also very rarely charges people extra who bring in matted dogs. As she ages and with my daughters encouragement, she has started to charge extras a little more often. Someone brought in a dog last month that was a "once a year" dog. Horribly matted. Pam was "in a mood" lol, and told them it would be $110.00 figuring they would go elsewhere. The people payed without a second thought. I think it is abuse to let a dog go that long and they should be made to pay more, not just for the extra work, but because of the abuse. But then, would they go even longer in between...who knows?


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## Mysticrealm (Jan 31, 2016)

Everyone needs to remember that it really doesn't matter what one person pays over what another person pays. Costs vary WILDLY depending on where you live, just like real estate.
$150,000 where I live with get you a crappy 1 bedroom apartment
$150,000 in some places can get you 5 acres and a 4 bedroom house and a barn

And they are based on what someone will pay. If a groomer keeps as busy as they want to be even though they charge 10 dollars more than the other groomers in the area, then they are gonna keep charging that price. If they try charging that price and are not able to keep as busy as they want, then they would have to look at changing something (either adding something to their grooms to encourage people to think it's worth it, or lower the price).

What I would say is that if you resent your groomer for any reason (cost, style, bedside manner, etc.) then it's likely best to go to a different groomer as it's never gonna be a positive relationship.


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

Mysticrealm said:


> Everyone needs to remember that it really doesn't matter what one person pays over what another person pays. Costs vary WILDLY depending on where you live, just like real estate.
> $150,000 where I live with get you a crappy 1 bedroom apartment
> $150,000 in some places can get you 5 acres and a 4 bedroom house and a barn
> 
> ...


Yes your are right about real estate, here you would almost get a tent for 150,000. But is also a area that is non union so wages are low and the only jobs, are real estate, waitress, insurance, office, house keeper and care givers, etc., not heavy industries, as it is a retired area, and most are quite wealthy. The amazing part as an example to come in and feed 1 dog, walk it 3 times a day is 65.00 additional 30.00 for more than one. When I pay a secretary 15.00 an hour (the average is 9 to 10) I resent some of the fees here in the area, geared for the wealthy, not the working person.

I did not resent my groomer, but I am disappointed and as I said part my fault as I did not take a photo, this time, but always have in the past and she has been doing them for over 12 months, so she should realize a little bit of all the photos I have given her prior. As I said I previously over the past 30 years have had 2 retired show groomers, and other than those I have not had good luck with groomers. since.


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## Mysticrealm (Jan 31, 2016)

glorybeecosta said:


> I did not resent my groomer, but I am disappointed and as I said part my fault as I did not take a photo, this time, but always have in the past and she has been doing them for over 12 months, so she should realize a little bit of all the photos I have given her prior. As I said I previously over the past 30 years have had 2 retired show groomers, and other than those I have not had good luck with groomers. since.


I meant more that you have brought up the cost and frequency of your dogs' grooms as compared to your friends' dogs multiple times and seem very unhappy about it.
I find that if you are unhappy with one thing about a place/person, that other things, even small things, that they don't seem to do quite right can seem like much bigger things because you are already unhappy about something and this just adds onto it.


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## Indiana (Sep 11, 2011)

I took our dogs to a master groomer who bred and showed toy poodles in the city where we used to live....and took her for granted!!!! I even thought, (gulp) "gee she is pretty picky and charges quite a bit!" Now, I would kiss the ground she walks on because where we live now we have no groomers, much less one who knows poodles. Appreciate what you have got!!!


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## Arya's Toys (Feb 24, 2016)

I cant wait to see how my babies look in different groom styles :act-up:


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