# Long and undocked tails on poodles



## Naira

Naira kind of has a longer dock if that's a thing. My mini poodle had a shorter dock which fit him and my toy poodle basically had a bunny tail. I don't like the bunny tail because I like them to express themselves with their tails. 

I have nothing against an undocked tail, but I do like the look of an erect poodle tail and not carried over the back. A fellow standard poodle owner I met at the dog park whose dog had a bunny tail once asked me if Naira was a doodle even though she was in a poodle clip similar to this one. I asked her why and she said "because her tail is so long." She thought all poodles had bunny tails so I kindly informed her that Naira's tail was actually docked and poodles naturally have very long tails!


----------



## MiniPoo

I do like the look of a long docked poodle tail, but I also like the look of cropped ears on Dobermans but would probably have natural ears rather than cropped if I were the breeder.

Up until the time that I went looking for a minipoodle last year, I actually did not realize that poodles naturally had long tails. When people looked at my PWDs and called them poodles, I would say, "No, Portuguese Water Dogs have long tails and poodles have shorter tails." I just had no idea that they were docked. Once I found out, I just liked the idea of having a natural undocked tail.

I would like the undocked tails to be more acceptable to the AKC so that breeders who might leave them natural would not be forced to dock them. Docking the tails just to be more competitive in the show ring is not a good reason to do so.

So while I love the look of a long docked tail. I just wish people wouldn't say, "Oh, his tail is gay." No, he was very much a macho poodle until he got neutered recently.


----------



## ericwd9

*Tail up*

I think it is a cruelty to dock a dog's tail for the sake of fashion. It is illegal here. Grace has a full tail which is held erect and does not curl over her back. Standard Poodle tails are the same shape and conformation as Greyhound/whippet tails. In fact, having owned sight hounds I believe standard poodles are sight hounds with long fur and retrieving instinct.
Eric.


----------



## Bizzeemamanj

I have to admit, I only came to learn about tail docking after I brought Cooper home. He has a nice tail, but if I get another poodle from my breeder, I will request she leave the tail intact. I just love the look of a long, undocked poodle tail.


----------



## BrooklynBonnie

MiniPoo said:


> ...
> So while I love the look of a long docked tail. I just wish people wouldn't say, "Oh, his tail is gay." No, he was very much a macho poodle until he got neutered recently.


I love the undocked look, having grown up with retrievers and huskies with long fluffy tails!

In your sentence above, I can't tell if you are joking or just don't know that "gay" is the correct term for a tail that curls over the back. Huskies are an example of a breed which is not permitted to have gay tails to show. Mochi has a very gay undocked tail - it curls in a perfect circle when she is standing/moving, but she lays it out flat most of the time when laying down to sleep/nap. 

One thing I would look forward to if docking of Poodle tails ended - the breeders could focus a bit on breeding straighter tails because I love the look of a high held, long tail. Like a beautiful banner waving behind as the dog moves.


----------



## BrooklynBonnie

*Some pics of Mochi's tail*

One shows her tail in its normal curl, (and her old winter coat that is too small) and the other how she stretches it out straighter when laying down.


----------



## twyla

BrooklynBonnie said:


> I love the undocked look, having grown up with retrievers and huskies with long fluffy tails!
> 
> In your sentence above, I can't tell if you are joking or just don't know that "gay" is the correct term for a tail that curls over the back. Huskies are an example of a breed which is not permitted to have gay tails to show. Mochi has a very gay undocked tail - it curls in a perfect circle when she is standing/moving, but she lays it out flat most of the time when laying down to sleep/nap.
> 
> One thing I would look forward to if docking of Poodle tails ended - the breeders could focus a bit on breeding straighter tails because I love the look of a high held, long tail. Like a beautiful banner waving behind as the dog moves.


A gay tail- 
Specifically, it refers to a tail that’s set a little higher at the point where it connects to the body, allowing the dog to carry it above the topline. If you follow the back, in other words, the tail’s angle departs from the flat line and goes uphill.


----------



## MollyMuiMa

I have a ??? If the tail is docked can you still show a dog in conformation in Europe since there, it is illegal to dock and a dog can be disqualified in an FCI show ? I do know CKC will allow undocked tails but that docked are preferred.......I just wonder how it works for European dogs to be shown here, and for American dogs to be shown in Europe? What about Intnl Championship titles, which I have seen on AKC pedigrees? How is it done considering the difference in docked tail requirements per each country?


----------



## Mfmst

I would like to ask our Canadian members if they see any trending towards undocked tails. The CKC allows both in competition. I know the FCI does not allow docked tails. I looked at the UK standard and was confused. They seem to allow both. I prefer the look of a docked tail, probably because that's all I had ever seen until I joined PF. If it was a decision I would have had to make once my puppy was home, I don't know that I would do it. Kind of an out of sight, out of mind phenomenon which was ethically convenient.


----------



## Muggles

MollyMuiMa said:


> I have a ??? If the tail is docked can you still show a dog in conformation in Europe since there, it is illegal to dock and a dog can be disqualified in an FCI show ? I do know CKC will allow undocked tails but that docked are preferred.......I just wonder how it works for European dogs to be shown here, and for American dogs to be shown in Europe? What about Intnl Championship titles, which I have seen on AKC pedigrees? How is it done considering the difference in docked tail requirements per each country?



Not sure about Europe, but in Australia where it is also illegal, docked dogs may still be shown provided they were docked legally (and can prove the dog was not simply taken elsewhere to be docked). 

And a cute undocked Rory for the picture component. ?


----------



## MiniPoo

twyla said:


> A gay tail-
> Specifically, it refers to a tail that’s set a little higher at the point where it connects to the body, allowing the dog to carry it above the topline. If you follow the back, in other words, the tail’s angle departs from the flat line and goes uphill.


I am not sure I understand your explanation but that is ok. Since Dakota's tail hits his back if I do not trim the hair closely, I figured he fit the "gay" tail definition. I was both joking and serious about not appreciating the term gay. Having a curly tail has its advantages: There are less burrs etc caught in it when he goes thru tall grass, it basically stays cleaner than my PWDs straight tails, and I never walk on it accidentally.

I hope.someone from Europe and also Canada can answer the questions Mfmnt and MollyMuiMa have asked.


----------



## twyla

cannot find a proper picture but from what I've always understood it's a tail that is tipped forward beyond 90 degrees towards the dog's neck, mom's old white tpoo poodle Mollie had a gay tail


----------



## MiniPoo

If Dakota's tail is not gay, it is pretty darn happy. It starts off about 90 degrees from the back then goes towards his head about halfway up.


----------



## Caddy

Abbey has an undocked tail and it doesn't curl over her back, but I can't say as I would mind if it did. When I see a docked tail I think amputated, not docked, but that's just how I see it and not meant to insult anyone. The province of British Columbia has just very recently banned the docking of ears, and I think it's just a matter of time before other provinces follow suit in both ears and tail. I think when it comes to showing poodles the standards make it difficult, from tails to show cuts. It sort of puts some of us amateurs out of the game completely. Many years ago we showed our yellow lab who got his Canadian championship in 9 months, but the best was we met such great people along the way and had such good fun. We are getting a second poodle (it's been decided), and just a couple of days ago my DH said maybe we'll show the next one (Abbey has white on her chest), but when I told him about the show cuts he changed his mind.


----------



## grab

MiniPoo said:


> So while I love the look of a long docked tail. I just wish people wouldn't say, "Oh, his tail is gay." No, he was very much a macho poodle until he got neutered recently.


I know you're joking, but until more recently, "gay' was most often used with the definition of lighthearted or carefree, which I'd guess is where the tail description came from


----------



## Streetcar

MiniPoo said:


> So while I love the look of a long docked tail. I just wish people wouldn't say, "Oh, his tail is gay." No, he was very much a macho poodle until he got neutered recently.


I believe the term "gay tail" is a very, very old one, and this seems to back that up: Someone Said My Dog Has a Gay Tail. What Does This Mean? .

It doesn't have anything to do with macho/not macho/feminine/gay (in today's day-to-day usage)/straight.

And just for the record, and with a friendly grin at ya, a great many gay men are *quite* thoroughly well and truly macho .

ETA, wasn't for sure if you were kidding or not, so answered a bit more seriously. No chiding intended .


----------



## kayla_baxter

Fletcher has an undocked tail and I don't like it at all. It curls over his back and leaves an indent in his coat. That paired with his fine coat gets me constant "mini doodle" questions from people. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Countryboy

Mfmst said:


> I would like to ask our Canadian members if they see any trending towards undocked tails.


In a word, ya... Tonka's breeder has been docking for years. She just stopped within the last year. Other breeders are taking the same route. Docked if you want... but undocked is the new norm. 

When it comes to moving with public sentiment, I believe the CKC is a little more flexible than the AKC so it wouldn't surprise me that undocked tails are allowed in the ring. 

Don't know for sure tho... you'd have to ask one of them Fancies.


----------



## MiniPoo

Thanks, Streetcar, for the url.to the article. Very interesting. I was mostly joking about all my references to gay genderwise and gay happywise. Perhaps I owe an apology to.any gay members who I have referred to in an unflattering way. Just know I meant no offense..

I.think I will just say Dakota is a happy dog with a very happy tail.


----------



## Caddy

Are undocked tail NOT ALLOWED in the show ring, I thought they were allowed but unlikely to win?


----------



## MiniPoo

kayla_baxter said:


> Fletcher has an undocked tail and I don't like it at all. It curls over his back and leaves an indent in his coat. That paired with his fine coat gets me constant "mini doodle" questions from people.


Perhaps.we.should put our dogs in a conti cut. Poodles with fancy clips are usually not called a doodle. I doubt a curly tail.would matter. With a shaved rear there should be a gap between the tail and back.

I think I will consider it next spring.


----------



## Countryboy

I did a google search and it brought me right back here... to an old post of Arreau's. Looks like natural tails are fine in the CKC. 

http://www.poodleforum.com/27-showing/48794-undocked-tails-akc.html#post577210


----------



## Dechi

I don't like undocked tails in poddles. Maybe if they were straight I would, but most are not. I wish they were just born like that, but it's not the case, unfortunately.

We get so accustomed to looking at dogs with the traditional standard that when they change it to allow undocking, it just feels weird, as if it were another breed. At least to me. I would feel the same about dobermans or any other breed. Although with dobes, I've seen so many beautiful dogs with the natural ears that they now appeal to me. But not the long tails...


----------



## JudyD

I feel like the Wicked Witch of the West admitting this, but I very much prefer the look of a docked tail. An undocked tail would be a deal-breaker for me.


----------



## MiniPoo

Most people like docked tails. For those of you who do, it will be a long time, if ever, in the US before undocked tails on poodles is the norm. So you should have nothing to worry about.


----------



## Streetcar

MiniPoo, I figured so . I seriously doubt you offended, though not being LGBT, maybe I shouldn't speak up. But you reminded me of a very dear former and late dance partner, so I piped up....


----------



## Naira

Delete


----------



## Caddy

I don't think it will be "a long time, or maybe ever" until North America joins the rest of the world regarding docking of tails and ears. Think about what you are saying when you prefer a docked tail, you are saying you don't like the poodle as it was born, but as YOU THINK it should have been created and look. I don't exactly love every part of my body, but I don't suction some parts and enhance others, and it's not anyone else's place to judge what I was born with or change. Dogs can't speak for themselves but I'm thinking a puppy was never born that thought, "cut off my tail cause people will like me better".


----------



## Dechi

It's not as WE THINK THEY SHOULD LOOK, but rather as IT WAS IMPOSED on us.

I have never, ever seen an undocked poodle in my life, and I am 47 years old. So to me, the beauty standard for a poodle is a docked tail. Simple as that. In many, many years, our great grand children will have never seen a docked poodle (maybe not true, but let's pretend) and their beauty standard for a poodle will be with an undocked tail. And I'm sure when they see the odd poodle with a docked tail, they will find it odd, and probably ugly !


----------



## Streetcar

I don't know about Poodles, but a friend in Vizslak has said the tail docking in her breed has to do with damage caused to tails by field work. So maybe there is/was a practical reason behind it, not just cosmetics.


----------



## Coldbrew

Jasper's tail is docked and I had no say in it. Piper, being a doodle, has an undocked tail, and while she usually holds it curled over her back while resting, all other times she holds it very straight. I prefer her tail to Jasper's, both aesthetically and because it means she wasn't under a knife at a young age. 

While tail docking and ear cropping might have a purpose in the working field, nipping off bits of pet and show dogs seems a bit cruel to me. I do know the dogs don't remember things from a few days old though, so I'm aware I'm probably oversensitive, and totally understand that everyone has their own preferences for the way an animal should look. If only we could breed poodles that came with short tails naturally! 

However, Piper has her dewclaws as well, and they get caught on things often enough that I'm glad Jasper has his removed. That probably makes me a hypocrite - I prefer dogs to be "unharmed" unless it's convenient to me, but I also know Jasper will never suffer from the pain of a pulled dewclaw that Piper seems to get herself into every other week


----------



## Mfmst

I would feel a lot less conflicted (read guilty) about this topic, if American breeders were demanding that the AKC get on the same breed standard page as the rest of the world regarding cropping and docking. Maybe they are. It never occurred to me to ask my breeder for an undocked tail. Even though I stated my preference for the docked look, I spent some time admiring www.Poodles-in-Scandanavia.com I could have lived with a gay tail. I wonder how many Grand Champions in Canada have undocked tails?


----------



## peccan

FCI member reporting in.

I'm not sure how it goes in other FCI countries, but here in Finland:
short version:
- docking is illegal
- docked dogs may not show or compete in official events

detailed version:
- vets are not allowed to perform docking, cropping or dewclaw removal outside of acute medical reasons
- preventive operations are not allowed, unlike in Sweden where IIRC under some very specific rules puppies reserved for actively hunting owners may be eligible for a special permit for dewclaw removal/docking
- it is possible to import docked etc. dogs, and within the last 10 years or so I've personally seen a few docked dogs, perhaps four Dobies (two on same person) and one or two other breeds
- docked etc dogs born after 2001 cannot compete in any officially sanctioned events or shows -- unofficial events such as match shows are okay
- amputated dogs may be shown normally but must have proof sent to national kennel club that the amputation was necessary for the dog's welfare -- if the amputation was made shorter than necessary, the dog is considered docked and may not be shown
- the only exception to this rule allows foreign dogs to compete in the annual international main showing event

addendum:
- Sulo's typical non-specific-mind-state tail (almost straight)
- Sulo's typical running tail (arched, tip high)
- Sulo's typical mischief tail (tightly arched, tip low)


----------



## CharismaticMillie

MollyMuiMa said:


> I have a ??? If the tail is docked can you still show a dog in conformation in Europe since there, it is illegal to dock and a dog can be disqualified in an FCI show ? I do know CKC will allow undocked tails but that docked are preferred.......I just wonder how it works for European dogs to be shown here, and for American dogs to be shown in Europe? What about Intnl Championship titles, which I have seen on AKC pedigrees? How is it done considering the difference in docked tail requirements per each country?


Docked tails can't be shown in Europe. But undocked tails from Europe can be shown in the states.


----------



## CharismaticMillie

Caddy said:


> Are undocked tail NOT ALLOWED in the show ring, I thought they were allowed but unlikely to win?


They are allowed and will still win if the dog is of high quality.


----------



## CharismaticMillie

MiniPoo said:


> I am not sure I understand your explanation but that is ok. Since Dakota's tail hits his back if I do not trim the hair closely, I figured he fit the "gay" tail definition. I was both joking and serious about not appreciating the term gay. Having a curly tail has its advantages: There are less burrs etc caught in it when he goes thru tall grass, it basically stays cleaner than my PWDs straight tails, and I never walk on it accidentally.
> 
> I hope.someone from Europe and also Canada can answer the questions Mfmnt and MollyMuiMa have asked.


Yeah, I'm not agreeing with that description so much either. What Twyla is describing is a high tail set, which a poodle should have. However, I've seen as many low tails sets that are gay in carriage as I've seen high tail sets that are gay in carriage.


----------



## Summerhouse

I have to confess I didn't know poodles tails were docked, they're still so long compared to some other docks.

Docking in England became illegal in 2006. Certain working dogs can be docked legally during the first 5 days and breeder has to prove they have been bred to work.

Legally docked dogs cannot be shown where members of the public have paid an entrance fee to a show. Same rules apply for docked dogs coming from overseas which is why you will not see a docked dog at Crufts unless it was docked before April 6th 2007.

I do see the need for working dogs having to be docked rather than having to have an amputation of a damaged tail. Pointers have really long whip like tails. Of course no one knew what type of tails previously docked breeds would have since no one had been breeding for tail type. I still do double take seeing Dobermans and Boxers with long tails.

Ear cropping however is purely cosmetic, banned in England in 1899. I don't agree with putting a young puppy under anaesthetic and several weeks of posting and bandaging until the ears set purely because a human wants it to look that way. 

My mini schnauzer has natural ears and undocked tail that curls lovely over his back. In US of course they are docked at around the 3rd bone I think making them really short. 

In miniature schanuzers in US show world docked tails still part of the norm but more with natural ears are in the show ring.


----------



## Dechi

peccan said:


> FCI member reporting in.
> 
> I'm not sure how it goes in other FCI countries, but here in Finland:
> short version:
> - docking is illegal
> - docked dogs may not show or compete in official events
> 
> detailed version:
> - vets are not allowed to perform docking, cropping or dewclaw removal outside of acute medical reasons
> - preventive operations are not allowed, unlike in Sweden where IIRC under some very specific rules puppies reserved for actively hunting owners may be eligible for a special permit for dewclaw removal/docking
> - it is possible to import docked etc. dogs, and within the last 10 years or so I've personally seen a few docked dogs, perhaps four Dobies (two on same person) and one or two other breeds
> - docked etc dogs born after 2001 cannot compete in any officially sanctioned events or shows -- unofficial events such as match shows are okay
> - amputated dogs may be shown normally but must have proof sent to national kennel club that the amputation was necessary for the dog's welfare -- if the amputation was made shorter than necessary, the dog is considered docked and may not be shown
> - the only exception to this rule allows foreign dogs to compete in the annual international main showing event
> 
> addendum:
> - Sulo's typical non-specific-mind-state tail (almost straight)
> - Sulo's typical running tail (arched, tip high)
> - Sulo's typical mischief tail (tightly arched, tip low)


I have to admit your dog looks great with its tail ! Just the perfect size and length. But it seems to me most are not as nice.


----------



## Reiko

*My Sentiments on Short vs. Long Tails*

I have no idea about the answer to the original question, but I would be happy for the dogs if we do stop cutting body parts off.

My sentiments are similar to those of ericwd9 and Caddy: I personally also feel that cosmetic changes to dogs who have no say in the matter are cruel. 

I used to like the Doberman's cropped ears look and tail. I used to like what I perceived as the more intimidating, powerful look. Then I learned they are not natural. Now I prefer Dobermans with natural ears and long tails.

A lot of times when I look at Zuki with his docked tail, I feel sad that it got cut off. He always wags his tail vigorously, I'm so glad it wasn't any shorter that he couldn't express himself as well as he does. Yet I admire his tail the way it is because it's part of who he is now. I just look at him or smile at him and he wags. He's such a happy furry baby!

Like others here, for a long time I didn't know that poodle tails could be so long.. like my Bichon-Mochi's! I suspected it was longer, but not that much longer. I don't actually know if I _like_ the longer tails or not. I guess I am neutral/indifferent _in terms of appearance_. I'm just used to Zuki's docked tail.

I did look at one of the older threads MiniPoo included, and compared red mini Zuki to the red mini Buffy with an undocked tail. She and her tail do look nice.

If I ever got a puppy again, I would seek out a breeder who didn't cut tails due to personal ethics, not so much for appearance. I wouldn't turn away a foster (baby or adult) just because it had a docked tail already though.


----------



## MiniPoo

Peccan, Sulo is so beautiful. You could sell pictures of him. Thanks for all the good info.

While I think it is better not to dock tails and remove dew claws, I do not think it hurts the puppies too much to do it, especially the tail. The only time I get sad about it is when the person doing the docking did not know what he was doing and docked the tails like a Doberman's short tail. In fact, I feel more sorry for the breeds where it is common to dock the tail very short. Most poodle docks result in medium to long tails if done properly.


----------



## Manxcat

Hmmm, a tale of two tails!

Personally I am in the "don't mutilate nature" camp - well I have been since I was old enough to realise that it was a surgical procedure and that poodles (and dobes etc) don't come naturally with short tails! 

Pippin has a short-ish, high carried tail that curls over her back - we refer to it as her carrying handle... Pushkin's is longer and set slightly lower so looks more like a question mark. Both lovely, in my opinion.

And I guess as to the length of the tails, there's going to be variations from dog to dog.. like leg length and so on. Like in people, they're all different.

Dew claws are something I'm a bit on the fence about though. Pippin had hers done and I'm quite grateful as Pushkin has had no end of bother with his. But I would not cry foul if this was made illegal too here.

I'm not over-chuffed about lambs getting their tails docked either, but that's a whole other cause :wink:

I guess I just think that if it was a person that was being surgically altered just after birth then there would be a hue and cry... Lots of people with a finger or toe missing for "aesthetic" purposes?? Don't think so! So why do it to our dogs? Because they're "just dogs"??


----------



## JudyD

Wicked Witch of the West is back--how many posters here had their sons circumcised? That goes far beyond tail docking, but in parts of the US, it's almost routine. (And yes, my son is, but only because my husband insisted. That was 40+ years ago, though, and neither of my grandsons is.)


----------



## Summerhouse

JudyD said:


> Wicked Witch of the West is back--how many posters here had their sons circumcised? That goes far beyond tail docking, but in parts of the US, it's almost routine. (And yes, my son is, but only because my husband insisted. That was 40+ years ago, though, and neither of my grandsons is.)


Well the answer from UK will be hardly any lol


----------



## JudyD

Summerhouse said:


> Well the answer from UK will be hardly any lol


And good for the UK! The practice is becoming less common here, thank goodness. I was an OB nurse for years and assisted with many, many circumcisions. Believe me, it makes tail docking look absolutely benign.


----------



## Manxcat

Hah - I was going to mention circumcision, but decided to be circumspect...


----------



## JudyD

Manxcat said:


> Hah - I was going to mention circumcision, but decided to be circumspect...


Well, once a nurse, always a nurse. (Just ask my husband about the dinner conversation when two or more nurses are present. :biggrin1


----------



## Luce

I think the AKC is antiquated when it comes to the poodle. By no means am I an expert, just a regular citizen. IMHO and by observation it appears most dogs in the show ring go into the ring in a fairly "natural" state. Yes they are bathed, primped and pampered. But for the most part there doesn't appear to be unnatural "grooming standards" for most other breeds. 

Luce has a natural tail and dew claws.  Ricco has a natural tail and no dew claws. Luce has never damaged her dew claws so I don't have a problem with them. I love there tails - natural and curly!


----------



## MiniPoo

I guess on a dog forum where it is common to talk of pee and poo and how to leave hair on a dog's penis so it does not wet his front paws, talk of circumcision is not TMI.

Let us remember that it is not the AKC who sets the conformation rules for poodles, it is the Poodle Club of America. That is the antiquated organization that does not accept parti colored poodles at all and who encourages tail docking.


----------



## Luce

Thank you - I am corrected! I hop they join the 21st century soon!


----------



## CoffeeN'Cream

Both my human boys are all natural and so are my poodle boys. When I was getting Misha I purposely sought out a breeder who didnt dock or do dewclaws and before Balthazar was born we asked for him to be left natural as well and she ended up deciding to leave the entire litter natural which I was secretly happy about. I absolutely love a poodle with a natural tail and there are so many more options with grooming. 

Sent from my SM-N900P using Tapatalk


----------



## CoffeeN'Cream

Baby Balthazar 








Misha


----------



## Viking Queen

I am all for natural tails and uncropped ears in all dogs. While Iris' tail was cropped a tad short it is by no means a bunny tail. All her life, 13 years, she has been upset by people touching and messing with her tail. If you barely touch her tail it gets clamped down tight and she spins away with worry. I think this may have something to do with the tail docking so long ago. No amount of gentle rubbing, touching or treats has managed to make her less worried when we touch it, although it does not seem painful.

I do have a different dew claw opinion, however. I once had a little rescue beagle with loose and very floppy dew claws. She tore one horribly and we decided it needed to be removed along with the other one which was equally floppy. This is a fairly major proceedure and recovery was very uncomfortable for her. Dew claw removal in pups is a fairly benign proceedure compared to surgery to remove adult dew claws.

just my two cents here......

Viking Queen


----------



## zooeysmom

I admit, I like the looks of these cosmetic procedures, but I don't think it's worth it for the pain caused to the animals (or babies). If I were a breeder, I could never do cropping or docking or dewclaws.


----------



## kayla_baxter

I've had two cropped puppies. One was done by the breeder's vet three weeks before I got him and the other I had done myself. By the time the puppies are home from the vet they're back to playing like normal. Zephyr ran head first into a wall playing with the other dogs when he came home from his crop and didn't even acknowledge it. He loved getting his ears taped because I'd massage them and he'd fall asleep with his head in my lap. He was never in any pain after his crop, but he sure screamed bloody murder when he was microchipped. His neuter was much much harder on him. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## BrooklynBonnie

*Our story on choosing an undocked tail...*

I grew up with retrievers and huskies and LOVED long natural tails. So I had to convince my husband, who grew up with a docked Spoo, that undocked was the way to go. During this period, I had decided to search Youtube for videos of poodle puppy tail docking, thinking maybe I was being too sensitive about the subject. After all, so many breeder's websites mentioned that the puppies feel no pain at all during the procedure... I had to check it out.

I watched a few videos and had to stop because of all the screaming puppies. And in each one, the person performing the dock was calmly talking to the camera as they worked, and taking soooo loooong to do the job while the puppy is struggling all over the place and crying. This one lady was using dull scissors to cut the tail and took her time explaining when she realized, and poking around for a better pair and then showing them to the camera while the puppy is trying to crawl away with a clamp on it's tail...

The dewclaw removals were worse! I swear one video of a vet and technician doing a puppy's dewclaws was so heart-wrenching I was yelling at the computer demanding to know why the vet was taking so GD long? Instead of talking to the tech about how your other vet does things differently, just hurry up and stop tormenting that screaming, struggling little puppy! OMG. I told my husband after that that I didn't care how improper he thought an undocked tail was, no puppy we paid money for was going to be docked, LOL! Luckily, he is firmly against male circumcision, so I made a convenient comparison and he stopped arguing. Now he tells me almost daily he is so happy our Mochi has her natural tail. :amen: 

An aside, Mochi made not one peep during her micro-chipping. I was so amazed! She just looked like someone had poked her on the nose suddenly.


----------



## zooeysmom

I have seen those videos too, BrooklynBonnie--extremely hard to watch and makes me very sad.


----------

