# Portuguese Water Dog or Standard Poodle?



## Ava. (Oct 21, 2020)

Any well bred dog should have not have behavior issues (anxiety). Both dog breeds are high energy dogs. Both bred for water work, both energetic and drivey.


----------



## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

This can vary significantly between breeding lines, and also within individual litters, but Peggy has solidly medium drive and energy. And we are careful not to build her stamina to such a degree that she will require more exercise than we can consistently give her.

I’m not sure if we have any PWD owners on Poodle Forum, but I’d be interested in hearing how the experience of owning one compares to owning a standard poodle. Hope someone with this knowledge chimes in. 

Speaking generally, though, I’d say yours sounds like a wonderful home for a poodle. I’d just want one from a breeder who matches puppies to appropriate homes based on temperament, to ensure yours doesn’t have a raging prey drive. Moderate to high prey drive is common among poodles, and could make life with a cat challenging. But I know lots of our members manage just fine.


----------



## Ava. (Oct 21, 2020)

here is a thread of somebody asking the same "PWD or poodle"









Portuguese Water Dog? Or a Poodle? And..


Hi all, I have a PWD and they are a wonderful breed. As adults. As puppies, they are insane. I want to get another dog now that my PWD is two and finally calmed down, but I can't decide on whether to get another PWD (and endure 2 years of insane puppyhood) or to get a poodle. Can someone tell...




www.poodleforum.com


----------



## Micori (Feb 21, 2021)

Thank you so much everyone. This has made interesting reading. Really appreciate your advice.


----------



## Liz (Oct 2, 2010)

I responded to the 2010 thread and can offer an update on my experience. 

A well bred poodle is calmer than even the best bred portie. You start to see it early on, but by 1 year the difference is pretty stark. Mia could settle indoors and focus, whereas the porties were still high strung, bouncy, and impulsive. Our portie friends come from arguably the top kennel in North America.

That said, you'll see more variability in poodles because there's more variability in breeders - poodles are subject to business breeding for a variety of reasons (including doodles and establishment of the breed), whereas porties are not (but just wait until people figure out they can have a Golden Water Dog). That broad range in poodles is what creates the overlap in temperaments with PWDs. But if you single out just well bred poodles, the difference in excitability becomes clear.

Another portie friend remarked to me recently, "the only reason to get a PWD is to compete in the water trials." I laughed at the truth in that statement, though I might also consider a portie if I lived on water and had ample acreage. With young kids, I would stick to a poodle.

Of course, the best way to judge for your family is to spend time with both breeds.


----------



## Micori (Feb 21, 2021)

I I’m


Liz said:


> I responded to the 2010 thread and can offer an update on my experience.
> 
> A well bred poodle is calmer than even the best bred portie. You start to see it early on, but by 1 year the difference is pretty stark. Mia could settle indoors and focus, whereas the porties were still high strung, bouncy, and impulsive. Our portie friends come from arguably the top kennel in North America.
> 
> ...


Thank you. This is invaluable info. The issue in the UK is there aren’t that many Porties around. My family have had a few poodles in the past, those being minature however. But they were lovely. I am on the lookout for a breeder in my area of a standard poodle and will see if I can have a chat with them to determine what sort of characters they have and what their puppies tend to be like. Someone suggested a poodle coat is no good in the countryside. But it can be washed so would you say there was any truth in that?


----------



## Liz (Oct 2, 2010)

I'm not sure what the person is referencing, but here's my guess. We are often out on the trails, and Mia gets filthy - muddy, stuck with burrs/riders, and caught on briars. You can really see the difference in clean up between Mia and her non-shedding friends. With a non-shedding short coat breed, you just wait for the mud to dry and brush it out. If you're lucky the mud comes off when the dog gives a good shake.

Mia needs a full wash, brush, and blow dry to clean up properly. I keep her trimmed short for most of the year. No fun poodle grooming, but easier to maintain given our lifestyle. Nowhere near the ease of a non-shedding dog, however.


----------



## Micori (Feb 21, 2021)

Liz said:


> I'm not sure what the person is referencing, but here's my guess. We are often out on the trails, and Mia gets filthy - muddy, stuck with burrs/riders, and caught on briars. You can really see the difference in clean up between Mia and her non-shedding friends. With a non-shedding short coat breed, you just wait for the mud to dry and brush it out. If you're lucky the mud comes off when the dog gives a good shake.
> 
> Mia needs a full wash, brush, and blow dry to clean up properly. I keep her trimmed short for most of the year. No fun poodle grooming, but easier to maintain given our lifestyle. Nowhere near the ease of a non-shedding dog, however.


thank you. I guess if you are fully aware their coats take a lot of maintenance and you’re prepared for that then there is no problem. Will do my research and see if I can find a good breeder in the area that has dogs with the sort of disposition I’m after.


----------



## Mufar42 (Jan 1, 2017)

Most standard poodles I have met have high energy and a prey drive. They are excellent retrievers and very intelligent. Temperament is not as predictable physical traits , coming from well bred lineage is helpful but keep in mind that temperament and behaviors are also shaped by raising and training.
There is much mouthing in either breed as puppies and this was very true of my spot, I can't speak for pwd as I've not owned one.
I've often look at this site Standard Poodles: What's Good About 'Em, What's Bad About 'Em
for various breeds and have found their descriptions to be pretty accurate. That being said I think a PWD would be higher prey driven than a ST. Poodle and need even more activities to be kept content.


----------



## For Want of Poodle (Feb 25, 2019)

Hardly unbiased, but knowing both I now prefer the poodle. I originally had both on my potential breed list. 

My poodle can easily outrun both the PWDs we know. She is taller and daintier, the same weight as a much shorter PWD. I really like her height which is convenient for training and her weight which means I can still pick her up. I like her hair better, it's curlier and denser and more pettable.

She is more agile and less inclined to run into people at full speed than the two PWDs I have met. Both the PWDs I have met have had poor manners with other dogs and poor obedience but that may be more of a reflection on the owners. Annie has a lot more self control than her Portie friends -again, could be human factors too. My coworker has one - I haven't met her dog but she sounds nuts. That being said, I don't know how much mental stimulation and exercise she gets. 

My only regret with my poodle is that mine won't swim. I suspect Porties may be more natural swimmers, and other lines of poodles may be more natural swimmers than mine.

Both breeds tend to have crazy adolescences and settle down more into adulthood. 

I am pretty active in the summer. Keeping less than an inch, preferably less than 1/2" of hair on the dog makes them significantly easier to look after with less burrs, pine sap, dirt, etc gumming up the fur. This is an issue with both breeds though


----------



## Spottytoes (Jul 28, 2020)

I’m having myself a little PWD memory here. I know virtually nothing about PWD’s other than the bit that I’ve read and the one that was in one our Obedience classes. There were 2 energetic young Spoos in the class, including Bobby, probably 3 Goldens, a Lab and a couple of mixed breeds. All were young teen dogs. Want to guess which one was seriously perfectly behaved, knew and performed all that was asked, attentive to its handler, calm and sweet, seriously the most “perfect” dog, at least in class...the PWD!!!
That dog, who was being trained for a therapy dog, was seriously the most amazing dog in any of the classes we have taken with Bobby. He was a couple of months younger than Bobby. I have never forgotten that dog. He was so handsome too. Beautiful curls. I was beyond impressed as was the instructor. Obviously the handler was amazing too.😉 The two of them as a team were so calm and in tune to each other. 
Then there was Highly Distractible Mr. Bobby Spoo. LOL!


----------



## Micori (Feb 21, 2021)

Spottytoes said:


> I’m having myself a little PWD memory here. I know virtually nothing about PWD’s other than the bit that I’ve read and the one that was in one our Obedience classes. There were 2 energetic young Spoos in the class, including Bobby, probably 3 Goldens, a Lab and a couple of mixed breeds. All were young teen dogs. Want to guess which one was seriously perfectly behaved, knew and performed all that was asked, attentive to its handler, calm and sweet, seriously the most “perfect” dog, at least in class...the PWD!!!
> That dog, who was being trained for a therapy dog, was seriously the most amazing dog in any of the classes we have taken with Bobby. He was a couple of months younger than Bobby. I have never forgotten that dog. He was so handsome too. Beautiful curls. I was beyond impressed as was the instructor. Obviously the handler was amazing too.😉 The two of them as a team were so calm and in tune to each other.
> Then there was Highly Distractible Mr. Bobby Spoo. LOL!


Oh gosh this is so confusing! I’m reading such a different mix of opinions on the PWD! That’s so lovely to hear he was so good. I would love to know if they are all like that but I guess it’s breeding and training isn’t it? It’s so hard to make a decision as it’s such a big commitment. I want to get it right.


----------



## For Want of Poodle (Feb 25, 2019)

Best advice would be to meet or speak to breeders if you can - look for titles on the dog, meet dogs, see their program, see how they describe their dogs and if someone would be willing to match based on temperament not first come/first served, or colour and provide ongoing support. See what they do with their dogs.

Even as a spoo lover, I would prefer a PWD from an awesome breeder to a spoo from a poor breeder. My own dog's breeder I liked partially because she had children, meaning my dog was well exposed to kids prior to me bringing her home and if I had kids, I would have trusted the breeder to chose a dog that would be good with kids. 

I am considering a few different very similar breeds 
or a second poodle as a second dog - my decision will likely come down to which breeder I trust more.

Edit - oh, and if you are still worried, set yourself up for success by finding a good local trainer before you bring your puppy home, to help prevent any issues before they begin and support you through the sometimes challenging first year.


----------



## Spottytoes (Jul 28, 2020)

Micori said:


> Oh gosh this is so confusing! I’m reading such a different mix of opinions on the PWD! That’s so lovely to hear he was so good. I would love to know if they are all like that but I guess it’s breeding and training isn’t it? It’s so hard to make a decision as it’s such a big commitment. I want to get it right.


Sorry to add confusion. I really only meant to add a bit of humor and share a good PWD story. In all honesty, I think I remember the handler saying this particular PWD was from super good lines of PWD/therapy dogs and he wasn’t the first therapy dog to be trained in this home. He really was an exceptional dog with excellent training. I was just reminded of this exceptional dog when reading this thread.
It seems that both breeds are excellent choices when well bred and well trained.
It seems with those two thoughts in place, you will have a great dog with 
either choice.😊


----------



## NJ Bob (Jan 9, 2020)

Two great breeds, either way I’m sure you will be happy with your (well researched) choice.

All I can add to this discussion is that I have had two poodles and have no regrets.

Best of luck!


----------



## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

I agree with what's been said! I've heard Barbet is a better breed than PWD for those wanting a wavy coat texture and a more moderate energy dog. But they are not as common.

In regard to coat maintenance, my poodle picks up seeds like velcro if I let his coat get long. But when our peak burr season hits I usually shave him down pretty short. Then the burrs do not stick in his coat and baths are only 10 minutes with basically no coat maintenance. Eventually I miss the coat and let it grow back in. It's a cycle lol. So really the coat is only as difficult as you want it to be. If you take it down every six weeks it's pretty wash n wear. Here is a photo soon after a shave down.


----------



## Micori (Feb 21, 2021)

Spottytoes said:


> Sorry to add confusion. I really only meant to add a bit of humor and share a good PWD story. In all honesty, I think I remember the handler saying this particular PWD was from super good lines of PWD/therapy dogs and he wasn’t the first therapy dog to be trained in this home. He really was an exceptional dog with excellent training. I was just reminded of this exceptional dog when reading this thread.
> It seems that both breeds are excellent choices when well bred and well trained.
> It seems with those two thoughts in place, you will have a great dog with
> either choice.😊


Hehe it’s ok really! I appreciate the feedback. I think I have gone down a rabbit warren of almost too much research (if that’s at all possible!) and it gets a bit confusing. But that is a lovely memory and it goes to show that with the right breeder and temperament; you can have a wonderful dog.


----------



## Micori (Feb 21, 2021)

Raindrops said:


> I agree with what's been said! I've heard Barbet is a better breed than PWD for those wanting a wavy coat texture and a more moderate energy dog. But they are not as common.
> 
> In regard to coat maintenance, my poodle picks up seeds like velcro if I let his coat get long. But when our peak burr season hits I usually shave him down pretty short. Then the burrs do not stick in his coat and baths are only 10 minutes with basically no coat maintenance. Eventually I miss the coat and let it grow back in. It's a cycle lol. So really the coat is only as difficult as you want it to be. If you take it down every six weeks it's pretty wash n wear. Here is a photo soon after a shave down.
> 
> View attachment 473996


Thanks Peggy. And your dog is gorgeous! That’s a really good idea to take it right down and then let it grow through. I think all non shedding breeds have lots of maintenance with coats and I’m prepared to put in the work!


----------



## Micori (Feb 21, 2021)

NJ Bob said:


> Two great breeds, either way I’m sure you will be happy with your (well researched) choice.
> 
> All I can add to this discussion is that I have had two poodles and have no regrets.
> 
> Best of luck!


Thanks so much. Poodles do seem lovely.


----------



## Micori (Feb 21, 2021)

For Want of Poodle said:


> Best advice would be to meet or speak to breeders if you can - look for titles on the dog, meet dogs, see their program, see how they describe their dogs and if someone would be willing to match based on temperament not first come/first served, or colour and provide ongoing support. See what they do with their dogs.
> 
> Even as a spoo lover, I would prefer a PWD from an awesome breeder to a spoo from a poor breeder. My own dog's breeder I liked partially because she had children, meaning my dog was well exposed to kids prior to me bringing her home and if I had kids, I would have trusted the breeder to chose a dog that would be good with kids.
> 
> ...


I have found a breeder but she doesn’t have children...

Also thanks for all the tips. I think that’s a good idea to line up some help in advance. I’ll definitely research someone out when I know I’m getting a puppy. I think it’s also down to finding the right breeder isn’t it.


----------



## Meganf1027 (Oct 22, 2018)

My brother has a 4 year old PWD and I’ve had Poodles all my life, have a mini currently. I would say the PWD is more stubborn and has an almost “crabbiness” to him.. we call him a grumpy old man! He’s very nice and is a well bred portie. I would say he was a difficult puppy as well, I remember my brother spending hours trying to wear out his energy. Also with a PWD, be prepared for them to want to jump into any body of water they see! Including water fountains! 
The poodles seem to have more of an off switch, and were eager to learn as puppies (as well as when older). My poodle is not very vocal. They are up for anything too! My vote would be a poodle but I may be a little biased


----------



## kontiki (Apr 6, 2013)

Raindrops said:


> In regard to coat maintenance, my poodle picks up seeds like velcro if I let his coat get long. But when our peak burr season hits I usually shave him down pretty short. Then the burrs do not stick in his coat and baths are only 10 minutes with basically no coat maintenance. Eventually I miss the coat and let it grow back in. It's a cycle lol. So really the coat is only as difficult as you want it to be. If you take it down every six weeks it's pretty wash n wear.


I agree! I keep my Spoo in a pretty short coat (#5, then #7 in the summer and fall when there are more stickers and burrs). We live near the woods and are out on the boonies at least 5 times a week. He is very easy to maintain. 

I am so sorry to have to give this report. My sister got a Portuguese Water Dog from an excellent breeder. That dog was nasty. I have never known a dog I was afraid of. Nor had I ever been bitten before. That dog not only bit me, totally unprovoked, but also other people and even their own son when he crawled across the floor to change the TV channel. They had the dog on prozac. One time I was there the dog actually went out in their back yard and attacked bushes and shredded them. 

She had called the breeder, and the breeder really wanted her to give the dog back, but my sister wouldn't give it up. I warned her that they should never leave the dog alone with their 10 year old son. She just said the dog loved their son and would never hurt him. That was before the TV incident. I refused to even visit her for the remaining 10 years she had it unless the dog was locked in a kennel either in their garage, or their outbuilding. I am literally surprised they were never sued.

I have a gentle mild mannered super intelligent Spoo that absolutely loves all people and other dogs. He is my Service Dog, and is amazing. He gets along with dogs that their owners say don't get along with most dogs. I vote Spoo! I have had many wonderful dogs of several breeds including German Shepherds, none of them aggressive. But if I ever get another dog it will again be a Spoo from an excellent breeder!

Oh yes, if hasn't been mentioned much but Spoos (actually poodles) are one of the two most intelligent dog breeds. Definitely a plus

I agree, before you get the dog find an awesome trainer, learn all you can, and start having your dog trained the very week you get them. Hoping you find an amazing and lovable one for sure !


----------



## Poodle2021 (Mar 14, 2021)

Perhaps I’m too late to be of assistance, but here is my perspective: 

I’ve lived with PWDs for 25 years, since I was a child, as we got our first in the early 1990s. My most recent PWD died in 2019 and I still miss him terribly. I have met dogs from a wide variety of lines over the years in a lot of different settings. The one constant across all PWDs is their intensity - they wake up at dawn, ready to move & think & work in the strongest sense of the word, until bedtime. They wake the next day, ready to repeat, every day, rain or shine. From 2-5 my dog needed a daily 5 mile run, and at 9 years old considered a 10 mile hike a ‘warm up’ to the rest of the day’s activities. We competed in obedience, agility, and water trials. All PWDs I’ve known are this way. There are very few people to whom I’d recommend a water dog. If you are seriously considering one, you can get the most accurate idea of the breed by attending a PWD water trial to watch how they act in their favorite environment - you can find a list of trials near you at the PWDCA website. If you have small children, know that they are very mouthy and might scare younger kids.

I knew my current phase of life required a less demanding, more easy-going dog. My 1 year old standard poodle is energetic, smart, and loves adventure. He also enjoys the water, is mouthy, and is over enthusiastic with kids while he’s maturing. In contrast, though, he sleeps in until 8 or 9 (!) and is happy to nap after a 1 hour walk. He has been a breeze to house train. His level of intensity overall is much more manageable for the average owner. We have a lot of fun but there is a point at which he wants to chill out and nap.

I love PWDs and poodles - they both are perfect dogs for the right homes. I strongly believe that most homes are suited to a life with a poodle more than a life with a PWD. The PWD’s need to do work - real, exhausting, mental and physical work - on a daily basis, is unrealistic for most typical families. Their fluffy coat covers a tough, demanding, true working dog. The poodle’s lower level of intensity and drive fits better into all the other demands of life while also being fun, athletic, and non-shedding. 

I hope this helps, and am happy to answer more questions about this topic if you have them.


----------



## Micori (Feb 21, 2021)

Thanks so much for your reply. I’ve sent you a message!


----------



## Poodle2021 (Mar 14, 2021)

Hi Micori -- thanks for the message! I'm glad to hear that my answer helped you make a decision, and wishing you the best in your search for a puppy!


----------



## kontiki (Apr 6, 2013)

Hi Micori! So curious to know what your decision is Cheers.


----------



## Micori (Feb 21, 2021)

kontiki said:


> Hi Micori! So curious to know what your decision is Cheers.


----------



## Micori (Feb 21, 2021)

Hello. Sorry about the delay in replying; I didn’t see your question. After a lot of deliberation and research we have gone for the Barbet dog breed. They are quite rare over here but I read a tonne about them, and met some the other day and we are completely smitten. It may take a while to get a Barbet due to there not being that many of them here in the UK, but we are happy to wait until the right one becomes available ☺.


----------

