# seminole-standard-poodles.com



## bigredpoodle (Sep 13, 2009)

I do not think that she tests her dogs? It looks like from her site that she breeds what ever to whatever. She breeds ****zus as well.


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## Locket (Jun 21, 2009)

I would look elsewhere. Paypal is NEVER a good sign. It looks like there are 3 litters on the ground right now, doesn't seem to do anything (show, agility, obedience) with their dogs, no sign of health testing. 
I'm sure other members can give you reputable breeder recommendations in or around your area.


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## Das (Sep 30, 2009)

bigredpoodle said:


> I do not think that she tests her dogs? It looks like from her site that she breeds what ever to whatever. She breeds ****zus as well.


I got AKC 4 Generation Pedigree for both DAM and Sire and also AKC registration certificate for both. Is this enough?.


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## Dogsinstyle (Sep 6, 2009)

Enough for what?


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## cbrand (Aug 9, 2009)

All dogs have a pedigree. A pedigree is simply a listing of the dogs in a family tree. 

What do the dogs in the pedigree look like? Do they have conformation titles before their names or performance titles after their names?

What testing has been done on the breeding parents of the litter you are considering? Is there testing behind the breeding parents? You can verify this on www.offa.org.

Personally, if I were in the market for a puppy, I would want to get on a waitlist long before a litter was ever bred. I think the apple never falls far from the tree so I like to see how a dam behaves at home and then out in public. Can the owner take her bitch to the park and throw the ball for her? Can she take her out in a public setting and let strangers pet her. Is the bitch good with strange dogs?


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## Dogsinstyle (Sep 6, 2009)

Here is the sire:
http://www.phrdatabase.com/cgi_bin/...andards&name=Elegant Razzle Dazzle Red&gens=5


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## Das (Sep 30, 2009)

cbrand said:


> All dogs have a pedigree. A pedigree is simply a listing of the dogs in a family tree.
> 
> What do the dogs in the pedigree look like? Do they have conformation titles before their names or performance titles after their names?
> 
> ...




I was told that the parents are not old enough for OFA and this is the first litter.


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## cbrand (Aug 9, 2009)

Das said:


> I was told that the parents are not old enough for OFA and this is the first litter.


Not old enough to test..... not old enough to breed. 


Besides, there are other tests besides hips. Breeding dogs should be tested for the following:

Hips
Eyes
VWB (or clear by parentage)
SA
Thyroid
NE (or clear by parentage)
Cardio (maybe)
Degenerative Myelopathy (brand new)

Edited to say..... I also like to see older breeding pairs because then I have some idea if they are free of things we can't test for like Addisons, JRD, Epilepsy


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## Das (Sep 30, 2009)

Dogsinstyle said:


> Here is the sire:
> http://www.phrdatabase.com/cgi_bin/...andards&name=Elegant Razzle Dazzle Red&gens=5


That's right, I don't know how you got that. And COI = 21.7%[10G,8F,545U,188C] looks right to me. 

- Das


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## Dogsinstyle (Sep 6, 2009)

Who is the dam?


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## bigredpoodle (Sep 13, 2009)

This is a problem in the making  Whomever sold this person FULL registration dogs was not very good at informing this person of what is right and what is wrong.... Shame on them ...


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## Das (Sep 30, 2009)

Dogsinstyle said:


> Who is the dam?


Seminole Lucy Bell Is Red


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## Das (Sep 30, 2009)

bigredpoodle said:


> This is a problem in the making  Whomever sold this person FULL registration dogs was not very good at informing this person of what is right and what is wrong.... Shame on them ...


Can you elaborate?. Please feel free through in some scientific reason 
- Das


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## Dogsinstyle (Sep 6, 2009)

Do you know her parents?


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## Das (Sep 30, 2009)

Dogsinstyle said:


> Do you know her parents?


who's parents?. I thought its all in their in pedigree info.


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## Dogsinstyle (Sep 6, 2009)

Seminole Lucy Bell Is Red's parents- I don't see her listed.


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## cbrand (Aug 9, 2009)

bigredpoodle said:


> This is a problem in the making  Whomever sold this person FULL registration dogs was not very good at informing this person of what is right and what is wrong.... Shame on them ...


But that's the thing.... the breeder who bred these dogs no doubt is the type where if you pay the extra fee, you get full registration. 

Didn't you know that it is the price the buyer pays that determines whether or not a Poodle is breeding quality? hwell:


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## bigredpoodle (Sep 13, 2009)

Das said:


> Can you elaborate?. Please feel free through in some scientific reason
> - Das


She is breeding untested dogs and producing high COI which in itself is a problem She has three breeding bitches right now with three litters on the ground and none of the parent is old enough. Is this a valid question ?


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## Das (Sep 30, 2009)

bigredpoodle said:


> She is breeding untested dogs and producing high COI which in itself is a problem She has three breeding bitches right now with three litters on the ground and none of the parent is old enough. Is this a valid question ?


yes it is. CBRAND raised the same point . Ok my search for dark red male will continue. 


And thanks all. very helpful and well done.


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## Cdnjennga (Jul 30, 2009)

Locket said:


> I would look elsewhere. Paypal is NEVER a good sign. It looks like there are 3 litters on the ground right now, doesn't seem to do anything (show, agility, obedience) with their dogs, no sign of health testing.
> I'm sure other members can give you reputable breeder recommendations in or around your area.


Totally agreed, I was just thinking that yesterday! Paypal should be seen as another red flag when it comes to breeders.


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## plumcrazy (Sep 11, 2009)

In today's electronic payment age, I don't think offering the option of PayPal is a bad thing, (maybe it just doesn't need to be so prominently displayed - reminds one too much of eBay). As a buyer, it is comforting to me if I can use PayPal as it can protect the parties in the transaction in case of any dispute (disputes which could be minimized or eliminated by simply selecting a breeder very carefully in the first place!!)

Technology has come a long way and PayPal is just one facet of that. JMHO!


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## Harley_chik (Nov 7, 2008)

I don't see anything wrong w/ using paypal, but I don't think a breeder should *advertise* that they use it either. It seems like one of those things that should be discussed privately between the breeder and puppybuyer, like price.


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## T o d d (Sep 25, 2007)

PayPal is like saying we accept visa, mc, check, mo, like it or not paypal is HUGE now offline and on. 

It lets ppl who do not _regularly_ process cards process them, etc... it's a way to say "look I can take your money".

Nothing special or bad about it IMHO.


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## plumcrazy (Sep 11, 2009)

Harley_chik said:


> I don't see anything wrong w/ using paypal, but I don't think a breeder should *advertise* that they use it either. It seems like one of those things that should be discussed privately between the breeder and puppybuyer, like price.


IA! I think that all the "financial stuff" is best discussed privately (price, deposit, etc.) When I was doing my research for my own spoo baby, it kinda turned me off to see prices listed on websites underneath pictures of the babies (like someone else mentioned on another thread - akin to used car dealerships) and it was especially disconcerting when certain genders or colors were more expensive than others. When I ran across sites without prices, it gave me a chance to contact the breeder and ask pertinent questions and make that all important personal contact!!!


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## Cdnjennga (Jul 30, 2009)

I don't have a problem with Paypal as a payment method. It's when it's right there on the website featured prominently that I think it's a red flag.

IMO, the best breeders use their websites as a kind of "brag site", not as a puppy selling site. Usually you have to contact these breeders for information about their litters, etc. Discussion about payment and deposts (and paypal) doesn't come until the breeder is sure you're worthy of one of their precious pups.


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## Locket (Jun 21, 2009)

Cdnjennga said:


> I don't have a problem with Paypal as a payment method. It's when it's right there on the website featured prominently that I think it's a red flag.
> 
> IMO, the best breeders use their websites as a kind of "brag site", not as a puppy selling site. Usually you have to contact these breeders for information about their litters, etc. Discussion about payment and deposts (and paypal) doesn't come until the breeder is sure you're worthy of one of their precious pups.


Precisely my thinking!


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## Harley_chik (Nov 7, 2008)

Cdnjennga said:


> I don't have a problem with Paypal as a payment method. It's when it's right there on the website featured prominently that I think it's a red flag.
> 
> IMO, the best breeders use their websites as a kind of "brag site", not as a puppy selling site. Usually you have to contact these breeders for information about their litters, etc. Discussion about payment and deposts (and paypal) doesn't come until the breeder is sure you're worthy of one of their precious pups.


Couldn't agree more! The breeder I like has one pic of the litter they produced last year and the rest are of their dogs. The ones they've shown and live with. I like that in a site.


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## Moeman1955 (Jan 31, 2013)

*Seminole*

I will keep this short and sweet. When I first got on this forum I was still so ticked off I was going to really bad mouth this breeder because I was mad. But time has passed and I will state FACTS as they relate to our experience.

My son purchased a dog from this breeder. We had issues from the moment we got home. He called and even emailed several time and NEVER got a response. We finally had to turn the dog over to a poodle rescue as we could not handle the dog. It broke our hearts to do it and we cried going home. We even called to try and get the dog back and give it one more try but it is their policy to not return the dog and as time passed I understood why. It took them over a year to place the dog. 

Since then we have purchased two standard poodles from another breeder in Georgia and are very happy with Rossi and Lorenzo. I looked at the Seminole site just now and it appears there have been some issues with Facebook posts etc about them and an "investigation" is underway. Now there are good posts about this breeder too. But based on MY FAMILY's experience with this breeder I can not recommend her.


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