# conversational and play barking?



## newazha (Jan 24, 2012)

Okay, quick question. Azha is my first spoo and by far the best dog I've ever had. She already comes when called and knows about 16 other commands as well as some agility training at 3 1/2 months old (plus she's just so lovey and sweet how can she not be wonderful?). There is, _however,_ a slight problem. She gets on little barking tirades and when she does, because she is a standard, her bark is already fairly deep and loud. The problem I have is it's hard to teach her not to bark since she doesn't bark _at_ things, it's more like she barks _to_ me and only when she's outside playing or inside playing, or sometimes it seems more like she's just talking, not really barking about any particular thing:blah:. It wouldn't be a problem as much except she goes to work with me and I can't have her "talking" all the time. I don't want to be too harsh since she is so young and so sensitive but I don't want her to develop a bad habit either :confused3:. I'd appreciate any ideas on what I can do


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

She sounds an absolute delight, and very, very bright! It is very typical excited puppy behaviour - look at me!; are you still there?; I am so excited I'm going to burst!; play NOW! I think I would make a game of it, and teach her to bark on cue. Then you choose how long to wait before giving the cue ... ! Don't reward barking with any attention unless you have asked her to speak, and especially don't join in by shouting back. If she gets noisy playing, pause the game until you get just a brief break in the noise, then be all fun again. And try to avoid frustrating her when she is excited - Poppy still tends to bark when I start getting ready to go for a walk, and then realise I desperately need to go to the bathroom first ... If you don't reward the barking, and don't let it become self rewarding (call her in if she is too noisy when she is outside alone, and release her to play again when she is quiet), she will probably grow out of it pretty quickly. Then she will find her warning bark in a few months time, and it all starts again (I've just had to break off to ask Sophy to settle down and stop answering the big dog next door!).

Even more importantly, if you intend to take her to work with you I would teach her Settle. Watch for moments when she is lying down calmly, praise her and drop a treat in front of her nose. At first this will probably make her bounce up looking for a game, but ignore that, and reward her again when she settles down. Once she has got the idea, add in the cue word. Lots of short exercises in frustration control will also help her to learn to wait politely for what she wants. Keep the waiting very short, and well within her capabilities, so that it is a fun game rather than a wind up, and as you say, remember she is still a baby. You are laying the foundations for the great dog she will grow into, and enjoying the puppy phase.


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## newazha (Jan 24, 2012)

Hey, thank you so much, I will have to try that. I hadn't thought of telling her when to bark to teach her when not to. However you mentioned keeping her waiting short because of her puppyishness so as not to go beyond her capabilities. That's sort of what I've been trying to figure out, exactly how much is too much to expect from them at this age? I swear she learns like an adult but she just doesn't have the attention span of an adult. So again, how much is too much to expect?


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

At 14 weeks I reckon a few seconds, at first at least, and keep training sessions to 5 minutes altogether. Several short sessions scattered through the day, with time for her to sleep and absorb the information in between, is the usual recommendation. I tend to think of pups as being rather like children, with 3 - 4 puppy weeks equating to one child year. So she is at the puppy equivalent of a 3 - 4 year old child - learning all about the world at a rate of knots, but still with a very short attention span and needing lots of sleep! The knack is to stop before it gets too much for her, and always end on a win, even if it means going right back to the beginning. That might mean getting it wrong a couple of times until you learn to recognise the body language that tells you she is losing concentration. The joy of reward training is that getting it wrong is easy to recover from.

There is a lovely explanation of the Training Conversation and not frustrating your dog by Susan Garrett here: Distraction Work in Dog Training: A Conversation Between Friends | Susan Garrett's Dog Training Blog
It made me realise why Sophy used to get so frustrated with my poor training skills!


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## newazha (Jan 24, 2012)

I appreciate the referance, I love reading articles since right now I am just trying to absorb as much info as possible and ultimately decide what I like and what works for me, so any books or sites you can think of would be great. I really enjoy training however I realised a problem when I got Azha and that is that I have never really worked with puppies before so it's a whole different process! which brings me to yet another question, (inquiring minds and all that  I have always known you can train dogs to stay for long periods of time and have been able to do this with my Corgi, Kenya as an adult. However I am curious to know how long a stay should be for a puppy. Azha can hold a stay for about about 2 minutes if she's focusing (i.e. no other dogs around) but should I wait till she's older to have her stay longer? and for an adult although I know some people say they're dogs will stay for hours(k9 dogs in vehicles, therapy dogs, etc) but how long would be unkind and at what age can you start getting them to stay for more than a 5-10 mins? or does it just depend on them?


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

Wow - tricky question! I rarely use Stay with mine - I use it to mean Stay in that position until I come back and tell you to do something else, and really don't find it terribly useful. Wait, on the other hand, I use all the time (Wait = Hang on a second until I tell you what to do next - so Wait at the door, Wait for a treat, Wait in the car until I have clipped the leash on, Wait to cross the road, etc, etc ). Have you looked at the Dog Star Daily puppy manuals: Dog Star Daily under Training Textbooks? And the very best training manual I have come across is Train Your Dog Like a Pro by Julia Donaldson. But I think that for such a young puppy 2 minutes is pretty phenomenal!


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## newazha (Jan 24, 2012)

Lol, yes I feel she is pretty phenomenal...not that I am in anyway partial . I too use wait A LOT and smart girl, she knows just what it means. 
I do, however, need her to be able to Stay well since she'll be with me with our livestock and sometimes I need her to just stay in one spot while I take care of something as well as when I take her backpacking or on the construction site when we do volunteer construction (she'll be a diversified puppy, though she won't be allowed in the official "construction zone" as that could be dangerous for her and others).
I completely forgot about Dog Star, thanks for reminding me. I love their come and heel training techniques. And I will definitely have to check out that book. Many thanks ^.^


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