# Do you ever feel like a meanie?



## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

We had a bit of a rough afternoon, Teddy and I. We were out on a walk and it was as though he had forgotten everything he's been taught. When he ignores me and just walks on his merry way, I stop. He pulls on the lead and I just stand there. He maybe stubborn, but he's met his match in me. If he won't walk forward, I tug on the leash to make him move forward. Not violently or harshly or with any more force than is necessary to let him know that I mean business. I just want him to know who's in charge.

Sometimes I think I'm being too hard on him, considering he's still a puppy and sometimes he just wants to have fun. A couple of friends have said that I should "let him be a puppy". I'm being firm with him now because my goal is to have a well balanced, well behaved adult dog, who people won't mind being around and who will possibly make a good therapy dog. 

He does get to play--a lot, but when we're training or walking or walking and training, I expect him to give me his attention 100%. 

So what do those of you with more experience with this than I have think? Am I robbing him of his puppyhood and will he end up on a therapist's couch rambling on and on about how his mother ruined his life? Am I expecting too much from him at this age? (that would be partially his fault, since he's such a smarty pants)


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## partial2poodles (Feb 11, 2010)

oh man, I can see it now. He'll have his own reality show


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## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

LOL! Don't give him any ideas, please.


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## bigpoodleperson (Jul 14, 2009)

No, i think your fine. When on a walk i do not expect or demand 100% attention on me as the walk IS for him. I do expect and enforce good manners though when Ever we are out and about (including everything from walking, going in stores or even walking into the dog park from the car). I think it sets a good foundation. You arnt robbing him of anything. 
Personally, one of my biggest pet peeves is when dogs put on the brakes because they dont want to go somewhere (usually at work this is followed by the owners going to pick them up or beg them to walk). :doh:


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## frostfirestandards (Jun 18, 2009)

Marian said:


> We had a bit of a rough afternoon, Teddy and I. We were out on a walk and it was as though he had forgotten everything he's been taught. When he ignores me and just walks on his merry way, I stop. He pulls on the lead and I just stand there. He maybe stubborn, but he's met his match in me. If he won't walk forward, I tug on the leash to make him move forward. Not violently or harshly or with any more force than is necessary to let him know that I mean business. I just want him to know who's in charge.
> 
> Sometimes I think I'm being too hard on him, considering he's still a puppy and sometimes he just wants to have fun. A couple of friends have said that I should "let him be a puppy". I'm being firm with him now because my goal is to have a well balanced, well behaved adult dog, who people won't mind being around and who will possibly make a good therapy dog.
> 
> ...


If you aren't hard on him now, when do you start? LOL 

when I was a kid my friends always commented on how strict my mom was, but of all my friends I am the one who has it together now. 

with kids and dogs who are coddled or babied when they are young, when they grow up and you start being strict, then its like a total culture shock! 

Give Teddy a release word (I use OK) that means that he can walk where he wants, get the zoomies ect. Its nice for dogs and kids both to have free time (recess?) 
but I personally do not think you are being a meanie.


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## Fluffyspoos (Aug 11, 2009)

I don't think teaching good manners early on is bad at all. I was taught to say please my whole life, I never considered it to be a rough up bringing.

My parents called me a training nazi because I tell people not to pet Vegas until all four paws are on the ground. u_u I only want him to do this because he's going to be a big boy when he grows up and could knock someone over if he's really bouncy and jumpy when meeting someone. Really, who cares what people think? You know what's right for your dog and you know what you want to expect from him, and when he gives you what's expected he gets a party to see how fun it is to make mom happy. (At least that's what I do )


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## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

Oh gosh, I'm having so much trouble teaching Teddy not to jump on people! I try, but they encourage it--probably because he's so light, you can hardly feel it. He isn't even able to topple a toddler! LOL

He'll jump on someone and I'll give his leash a gentle tug and say, "off", and they say, "oh, it's alright" and they start petting him. See, Mom=MEANIE! 

But I know that when we start to get involved in therapy dog training and the CGC test, it will be important for him to know that he can't jump on anyone. He rarely does it to me, it's mostly when he's greeting strangers.

Actually, I could use some tips on how to train not to jump on people. I have an idea of how to do it, but if other people aren't going to cooperate, it's rather hard to do.


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## Rockporters (Jan 14, 2010)

What's up with that refusing to walk on a lead thing??!! Jasper has started this recently and it's driving me crazy. Occasionally when going out to potty he'll plant his butt at the top of the stairs in the most beautiful sit and won't budge. It's just occasional but, geesh, it's cold out. Let's keep this show moving LOL.

I am pretty strict, too, and occasionally feel like a Nazi Mom when everything is a learning experience. I just keep reminding myself how much more we'll enjoy him, and he'll enjoy us, later on if we're all on the same page behavior/manner-wise.


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## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

Same here. I don't have kids, but I would imagine it's the same kind of balancing act you do with them. On the one hand, you want them to be happy and have fun, but you want them to be safe and well-behaved at the same time. 

I'm hoping he's just going through a temporary teenage rebellion sort of thing. The other possibility is that it's because of that whole Gemini split personality thing. LOL


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## KPoos (Aug 29, 2009)

Oh there is this video on Leerburg that has the best training for teaching puppies not to jump up. I'll try to find it but basically you have some yummy treats, dog is off leash and you hold treats towards your chest. Puppy is focused on what you have and if puppy sits or keeps paws on the ground puppy gets a treat and praise. Move around, walk toward puppy, and if the dog jumps up at all you back off and don't give treats. The video is better than I'm explaining it. I also use "off" and will just turn and give my back and ignore the dog. Dogs jump up to get you to play with them and when they are excited. If you ignore it and show them your back as not being interested in this behavior, it helps to prove that you won't talk to, show interest in, or play with a puppy that's in that state of mind.


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## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

Thanks, KPoos


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## KPoos (Aug 29, 2009)

Found it! Here you go. I think this is a great bit of advice for that one issue.
http://leerburg.com/playem.htm?name=flv/1-18-10-news.flv


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## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

That's very helpful. Now I just need to figure out how to get _other_ people to participate...


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## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

frostfirestandards said:


> Give Teddy a release word (I use OK) that means that he can walk where he wants, get the zoomies ect. Its nice for dogs and kids both to have free time (recess?)


This is a very good suggestion because I can't always let him off the leash to run around like he really wants and needs to. That was why I bought the flexi-lead to begin with. I'm hoping that I can habituate him to walking calmly by my side in the city, and having a little more freedom when we're in our own suburban neighborhood. Those two places are very different looking, sounding and smelling, and I'm hoping he will be able to differentiate as time goes on. He seems smart enough to do that, and he's already showing signs of it.


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## Chagall's mom (Jan 9, 2010)

Oh Marian, I feel as though I wrote your post! Same thing going on in NJ today with my 10 month old angel Chagall; as if all of the sudden he thinks walking is supposed to be like the luge run! Actually, my "good boy heeler" started being not so good last week. Don't know if it's age, or weather or what! I have had him on leash and been training him since he came to us, at 9 weeks. I wear a doggy treat bag everywhere but to bed to be able to reward him when he's being a good boy and obeying, or just to mark behavior he initiates that I like. Anyway, on several occasions this past week he's pulled so darn hard that I was concerned he was hurting himself, he was making that choking/honking noise. Yesterday the vet told me to get a harness for him and use that. Well, I have one that I leave on when I put him on 50' tracking line to give him "freedom" when we're on out property (we live in a rural area on a wooded lot with some nice property). Teaching him to walk nicely on the harness is my new project. He "gets it" for a while, especially with a verbal reminder and food reward, but then he wants to launch! I don't know if it's that his prey drive is kicking in, that he's sensing spring in the air or his age, I just know I share your frustration and concern. I too and hoping to get him trained well enough to earn CGC and do therapy work, actually be a "reading dog" for children at our local library. I too have the jumping issue--he can spring up shoulder high--and trouble getting strangers to heed my request to ignore him until he sits politely for a greeting. Well, I guess no one said "poodle parenthood" would be easy! How old is Teddy? I'm going to feel real bad if you say he's a whole lot younger than Chagall, as though I'm the "lame mom of the year" who's done a bum job of training so far! We'll muddle through, all these good forum folks will help us. Good luck! "I feel your pain!!"


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## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

Good lord, woman, you're teaching your poodle to read?? 

Teddy is almost 9 months old. We actually live in NJ too (Bergen County). Maybe they've put something in our water. LOL

I feel for you too! Thanks.


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## Chagall's mom (Jan 9, 2010)

You just cracked me up good!! You know, I think I COULD teach him to read--he's a real smarty (pants!). I bet he'd learn to read and diagram sentences faster than learn how to walk consistently on a loose lead! Our local library has a wonderful program where well-behaved pet therapy dogs serve as the "audience" for youngsters who have difficulty reading. The children seem much at ease reading out loud to the dogs. It's really something to see. Right now there's a Greyhound, a St. Bernard, a Corgi, a Golden Retreiver and Border Collie mix in the audience, I think a Poodle would complete the group nicely! I give Chagall bottled spring water so I'm thinking it's something in the Jersey air that's making our poos little wild things lately. Thanks for commiserating! We're in Hunterdon County, if you ever want Teddy to run wild (but safely, on a long line), come on out!


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## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

I just may have to take you up on that sometime! Teddy would love it.


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## Desiree (Feb 14, 2010)

Just to give ya'll a another perspective. I've been reading up on British retriever training methods and found that they expect their hunting dogs to be fully trained on and off lead by the time they are one year old! Anything less looks very bad on the owner! This includes all distractions, 20 min stays, no chasing rabbits or livestock, no barking or whining while on duty. I tried to train my current pup to these standards while remembering that spoos are a fast moving, bouncy, fun loving breed (love that!) that can get bored very easily. The first year of training was tough and quite often I looked like the meanie but the it was worth it I can take her anywhere and she has impeccable manners. Be firm and have fun!


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## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

That's a really good perspective, Desiree. I will definitely keep that in mind.


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## Leooonie (May 30, 2009)

people said that to me, but to be honest dog are like babies in that when they are young, they're like sponges, and when the teen years come around, often the rebel stage comes in. If you don't teach before that rebellious stage, the dog will have NO boundaries to even think about crossing.

Although you may feel harsh, it's better to teach them the manners in a positive way earlier, than having to correct later (which is harder - hence the number of 'teen' doggies in rescue!

Perhaps just make leanring a game. When he's done well on a walk, take him home for a play in the garden, remembering to teach him things whilst playing e.g bite inhibition.


Bigpoodleperson - I believe you're wrong when you say the walk is FOR him. It should be for YOU. the dog should do what you want, you should go where you want to go - so therfore its your walk?


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## bigpoodleperson (Jul 14, 2009)

> Bigpoodleperson - I believe you're wrong when you say the walk is FOR him. It should be for YOU. the dog should do what you want, you should go where you want to go - so therfore its your walk?


Umm, ok? I think flat out saying im wrong is a little harsh....

If you were to read my Whole post i did say that i expect manners and dont let the dog decide where to go. What i ment was that i dont expect 100% full attention (which *I* take as focused heeling) on walks. As long as the dog is not pulling, listening to my commands, and being a general good boy then i dont require attention. After all, the whole point of us being out there is for him. Im not the type to just take a walk without a dog, so yes, the walk is for him.


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## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

I think the walk is for both of us. I do agree with BPP. In a lot of ways, it would be much easier to demand 100% of his attention. What makes it hard is to ensure he's behaving while still allowing him to explore his world. That was something I was constantly having to remind myself about when he was much younger, when he would pull on the lead and want to go and check something out. It was all very new for him. I wanted him to get the full experience, but still be safe and obedient at the same time.


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## poodleholic (Jan 6, 2010)

It can be difficult to keep a puppy's attention focused on you, even when you've worked on "watch me" w/out distractions until he knows it, and then proofed the cue in diverse places with distractions. Walks are filled with all sorts of exciting distractions - FLBs, bikers, leaves blowing in the wind! lol Poodles are so smart, that it's easy to forget they're young (and don't speak English!), so our expectations are sometimes unrealistic, given the young age. (As for Poodles being smart, I sometimes feel like I need to go back to get an advanced degree, just to keep up! LOL)

I like to teach "watch me" to get (and keep) their attention before expecting them to to focus on me, and that's best done indoors, then in the back yard, front yard, down the street, in the park, etc. First train the behavior you want without distractions, and then proof in diverse environments. 

When my puppy would pull, I, too, stopped and stood still. I'd pat my leg, or click my tongue to get her attention back on me, or even do a little dance and hollar WaHoo - whatever it took, then praise her, and move along. The trick is to be more interesting than squirrels, scents, etc., and to remember that it's so exciting for the puppy to be away from home when out walking. It's really not a question of being willful or stubborn when they aren't behaving the way we want them to, but a matter of a puppy doing what puppies will do. We establish our role of benevolent leader, provider of all good things (attention, affection, food, toys, walks, etc.), in daily life, simply because we are in control of all the resources. By setting clear boundaries and being persistent and consistent, and above all patient, we earn their trust, and since dogs do what works, they come around to our way of doing things because THAT is what works - gets them what they want. Keep in mind, too, that emotions travel down the leash, so if frustrated or angry, the puppy will know it, but not understand what it's all about (that language barrier thing again!). 

So relax, you're doing just fine! The first two years involve a lot of time, energy, work and patience, but SO worth the happy, well-balanced, and confident dog we end up with. Keep up the good work!


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## Marian (Oct 20, 2009)

> When my puppy would pull, I, too, stopped and stood still. I'd pat my leg, or click my tongue to get her attention back on me, or even do a little dance and hollar WaHoo - whatever it took, then praise her, and move along.


ROFL! I do that, and it gets me some weird looks in the city sometimes. 

Thanks for the reply!


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