# Extinguishing behavior?



## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

Jazz loves to play catch with a saucer toy, so every morning Rich and I take turns throwing it for her. She figured out very quickly that we wanted her to alternate who she returns it to and doesn't require any cues to do that. There's a problem, though. 

She barks after she brings it back and drops it on the ground at our feet. She may bark once or twice, or not at all, when she brings it to me, but she barks and barks when she takes it to my husband. This isn't an excited, yippy bark, this is serious noise that echoes slightly off the hillside. She looks us in the face while she barks, as if she means for us to respond somehow. We've dealt with it by leaving the toy on the ground until she's quiet, and dropping it immediately if she barks after we pick it up to throw it. She barks in the house only if she sees or hears something outside and stops immediately when we tell her to. Telling her "no bark" does no good in the meadow. She's smart, and I expected her to realize that barking delays the next throw. Clearly she's getting something else out of this, especially when she takes it to Rich, although I can't see anything in his behavior that would encourage it. Any suggestions?


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

has he tried just turning his back to her when the insistent barking starts? i know humans think of it as signaling disapproval, but dogs do turn their backs as a way of calming another dog. either way one takes it, it might work...


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

patk, we tried the back-turning, and it did diminish the number of barks. Even better, when we turned back to face her, there was no more barking. Much better response than we've been getting with our method. 
Can it be that easy? Thanks!


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

glad it worked. when i took my then-youngster dog to doggy day care, he would rush to the fence (this was all indoors) when he saw me and started leaping up and down and barking. probably i could have lived with the barking, but the jumping was a no-no. so i did the only thing i could, having had it inculcated in me that raising my voice to a barking dog was just going to make the dog think i was joining in, i turned my back. happened about twice. then the behavior stopped. i was kind of amazed, too. but if your dog is focused on you, i guess body language can really work!


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

The first time I turned my back, she walked around me and tried to look in my face--pretty funny, really. I'm really curious to see what she does in the morning. I'll let you know.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

omg! she is so smart! okay - here's what patricia mcconnell has said - you can send a message of non-engagement by turning your head and not looking at your dog. according to turid rugaas, that is actually a calming signal among dogs. but patricia mcconnell says dogs have to learn self-control in order to be able to handle frustration and that is the body language she suggests. 

yes, please do report back. i am fascinated to hear what jazz does. she is super smart!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I actually just use the look away as I have gotten the ok I'll come around to look at you thing. If I look up and away it definitely says settle it down to Lily. 

I have also seen Lily use the look away as a way to disengage from dogs whose vibe she didn't like. The first time was with a Rottie next to her for novice sits and downs. Even before the judge ordered us to leave she had disengaged from this dog and was distinctly looking away from him. He shifted his weight and made all sorts of noise during the sit. My heart was in my throat worrying that I was going to go back to a headless mangled poodle the whole time. when I returned she leaned into my leg. When I put her onto the down she shifted her whole body so that she was angled in front of my left foot. I had to zig around her to leave. She actually seemed pretty relaxed since she went over on her hip for the down. The Rottie never broke that day, although he had almost gotten up during the sits the day before (we weren't near him that time though). The most recent time she did it was this evening went the four of us went for a neighborhood walk. A woman was coming towards us with a mixed breed who was ok and and a crazy pomeranian lunging around at the end of its leash. We had both Lily and Peeves sit when they passed and the pom settled down a bit as they went by us.


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

I'll try the look-away tomorrow, see how that works, compared to the back-turning. I'm really encouraged with her behavior this afternoon. The barking certainly isn't aggressive, but it is annoying. She seems to be trying to get us to do something...by shouting at us. As I said initially, the Frisbee doesn't get thrown while she's barking, and I'm sure she's smart enough to understand that, so I can't figure out what she's trying to achieve.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Lily gives us that bark that means play with me all the time! Good luck with look away tomorrow. I'm sure Jazzie will figure it out in a flash.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

lol! she's mimicking people - you know, you don't understand what they're saying, so they repeat it louder and louder? you threw her for a loop by speaking dog so she went around to look at your face to see if you really knew what you were doing! (oh, anthropomorphizing is so much fun!)


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

patk said:


> lol! she's mimicking people - you know, you don't understand what they're saying, so they repeat it louder and louder? you threw her for a loop by speaking dog so she went around to look at your face to see if you really knew what you were doing! (*oh, anthropomorphizing is so much fun!*)


Yes it is! Silly humans for thinking they are the only ones who know what's going on! ;-)))


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

I'm afraid she may be smarter than I am. She certainly seems to think I'm dull for not grasping what she's clearly saying to me, and I have to admit, she understands considerably more English that I do dog-speak.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

most dogs are smarter than humans. look who's always on cleanup committee and who never gives it a thought!


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

We didn't play Frisbee this morning. The huntress caught a baby bunny before we got out of the yard, carried it to the meadow, ate it, and resumed hunting. We'll try this afternoon.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

uh oh.


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

Here's the afternoon report: We tried the head turning. It changed the dynamic even more than the back turning, or maybe two days of being avoided made an impression. She barked, but only once with each retrieve. The second time she brought it to Rich, she barked, he averted his eyes and looked up, as he had done the first time. She looked up at him, picked up the Frisbee, and brought it to me, as if to say, "He must not want to play." I sent her back to him, he threw it, and instead of bringing it to me, she took it to him again. Maybe she was mending fences? Anyway, it was interesting. We didn't play long--it's hot, and we have other plans this evening--but there's no question her behavior has improved dramatically in just two days. Thanks to both of you for the advice!


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

to quote "the a team" - i love it when a plan comes together! i was sure she would be off hunting bunnies, but frisbee love and family prevailed yayyyy!


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## Rachel76 (Feb 3, 2014)

I use the nose in the air look away behavior with Hemi when she is being a piranha puppy on walks. Works wonders 90% of the time. 

I have to wonder how you managed not to laugh when she came atound to look at you. :adore: I think I might have cracked up. :laugh:


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