# Breeder Questions



## Basil_the_Spoo (Sep 1, 2020)

Have you given any thought and consideration to kind of tempurment you want in a poodle? Like, what kind of family dynamics do you have? Are there any specific personality traits you want or need in your poodle?

That might help you narrow your search and make you stand out from other people looking for a puppy. The breeder is trying to feel you out as a good home just as much as you are them. Then, color and gender can be a secondary or tertiary factor - since it sounds like your flexible too.


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

Hi and Welcome!

A lot has changed since you last looked for a puppy. For the most part, what defines a good breeder is different to different people, but there are official guidelines.

Health testing of their breeding dogs is a very good indicator. This has become the norm for quality, conscientious breeders.

Many, most, folks on a purebred-focused forum will prefer breeders who follow the guidelines used by the official parent breed club. For poodles, that's the Poodle Club of America.

Excerpt
_As a Breeder, I_

_Plan each breeding selectively toward the goal on improvement of the Poodle, not purely for financial gain_
_Keep accurate records as per AKC rules and regulations_
_Test all breeding stock , as appropriate, for each variety’s genetic and acquired disorders_
_Remain abreast of new genetic testing available and readily participates in current genetic studies_
_Never intentionally allow a Poodle to be bred to any other breed_
_Screen prospective buyers or individuals with whom a dog is placed_
_Provide a written contract for all interactions involving the breeding, selling, co-owning, placing and rehoming of my stock_
_Sell puppies with individual records to include:_
_A Bill of Sale stating the conditions (terms) on which the sale was made_
_A Pedigree of at least 3 generations_
_Up-to-date health record_
_Proof of genetic/acquired condition testing_
_A reasonable time frame for a return_
_Never release a puppy before 8 weeks_
_Sell non-breeding quality puppies with limited registration_
_Require all non-breeding quality puppies sold to be neutered/spayed_

_Assume responsibility for the well-being of all dogs sold including taking back adults in emergency situations and finding homes for rescues that have been identified from my breeding when possible_
_As part of my selection as a member of PCA, I acknowledge the responsibilities inherit in that membership and pledge to follow the Code of Ethics of the Poodle Club of America. In addition, if I find I am no longer willing to abide by this document, I agree to submit my resignation form PCA._

Code of Ethics - The Poodle Club of America

Following these rules separates good breeders from the rest.

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This will seem counterintuitive but a breeder listing on the AKC marketplace means exactly nothing except they register their litters as purebred with the AKC. It should be something to rely on but all they have to do to stay in good standing is pass inspections and not be convicted of cruelty. 

_If an inspector finds minor deficiencies, the issues are noted and discussed with the breeder in an effort to help the breeder while at the same time meeting AKC’s requirements in the future. While the AKC does not have penal or regulatory authority, breeders who have major kennel deficiencies may lose AKC privileges (ability to register dogs or compete in events). In some cases, fines will be imposed, AKC privileges may be suspended and appropriate law enforcement authorities contacted. The standard penalty for anyone convicted of animal cruelty involving dogs is a 10-year suspension and a $2,000 fine._
That's all, oh, and pay the fee to list on the Marketplace.

There are very good breeders who list there and many who are simply selling AKC registerable puppies.

Inspections & Compliance – American Kennel Club (akc.org)

-----------------

I put these tips together for folks not familiar with what to look for in a quality breeder.

*We often hear from folks that they just want a pet.* What doesn't seem to be common knowledge is that the kind of quality, conscientious breeders many of us prefer to support are _always_ breeding for the very best poodles they can. It isn't pet puppy vs show puppy, it's lucky us, the ones wanting a pet who get the pups that have some small "fault" that might reduce their chances of winning competitions, but are flawless to us .

*It's not unusual to think that there are possibly thousands of breeders to choose from*. For quality, conscientious breeders, that number is more likely only in the hundreds in the US or Canada. A bottom line difference is between those who're breeding primarily for profit and those who're breeding because they feel not only love for poodles but an obligation to the entire breed. Each of their, usually infrequent, breedings are thoughtfully chosen to try to improve something in their lines and consequently the future of the breed.

*About reviews,* a happy owner doesn't necessarily mean an informed owner. It's as likely they've just been lucky, so far. Review any negative comments carefully, if they're allowed to appear.

*Getting a puppy from a quality, conscientious breeder is something like insurance*. Their investment in the health, welfare, and soundness of all the dogs in their care including the puppies they offer to new homes is part of the reason you're not likely to find a less than $2000 USD puppy from them.

The saying is "pay the breeder or pay the vet". Price alone isn't the only thing to separate quality breeders from those less than. We've seen members quote as high, and even much higher pricing for pups from parents not health tested, not proven to meet breed standards, sold as purebred when only a DNA test could determine that since they may be sold without registration papers.

If I knew the risks and have dedicated poodle health savings of several thousand dollars or pet insurance, knew that basically that the breeder and I would part ways as soon as the pup was in my hands because they're very unlikely to stand behind their pup and me thru the pups life, I might proceed with a breeder that doesn't meet my criteria.

But

I also wouldn't pay quality breeder prices, and over, unless I'm getting all the quality breeder perks.


*Health testing of the breeding parents is a good indicator of a quality, conscientious breeder.* The Breeder List has info on what to look for in the testing for each variety. Mentioning health testing on a site is nice but isn't proof. For proof, look for health testing results spelled out on the breeder's site, then verify for yourself by going to the site the results are published on. If you don't find any evidence of testing or can't find the info but the breeder appeals to you, contact them and ask where you might see the testing they do. Reputable breeders put in a lot of effort to make sure they're breeding the healthiest poodles and will be happy to talk about it and provide the info.

*Look for and verify OFA/CHIC level testing at a minimum.*
There are also poodle specific DNA panels for those testable conditions. Those are companion tests with the OFA/CHIC testing, not in place of.
Look Up A Dog | Orthopedic Foundation for Animals | Columbia, MO (ofa.org)


*A caution that a health "guarantee" on a puppy doesn't have much to back it if *the sire and dam were not given the testing for breed and variety. "Guarantees" without the testing often favor the breeder, more than the buyer.

*Read thru any contracts that may be listed. *If they rule out coverage for conditions that the breeding pair should or could have been tested for, consider that a caution flag. Otherwise, are the terms clear to you and can you live with them?

*Conscientious breeders have a waitlist at the best of times* and with pandemic puppy seekers, that wait is stretched well into 2021-2022. There have been more than a few serendipitous contacts between seeker and breeder, so don't be put off by the thought of a waitlist. Also, don't be put off if online sites aren't particularly updated. As often as not, breeders may prefer communicating by phone as well as email or text, and are busy with their dogs, 9-5 paying job, and family, rather than keep a website updated.

*When you start making contacts, *let them know if you're open to an older pup or young adult.

*Color preferences are understandable but* keep in mind that you're limiting your options even further in a very limited supply of puppies.
That beautiful color you fell for may not look the same in a few weeks, or months, or years. Most poodle colors fade.

*Gender preferences* will also limit your options.

*Temperament and personality* are lifelong traits.

*Be prepared to spend *in the range of $2000 to $3500 USD. Conscientious breeders are not padding pricing due to Covid.

*Be prepared to travel *outside your preferred area.

*As a very general rule, websites to be leery of* are those that feature cutesy puppies with bows and such, little or no useful info on sires or dams, the word "Order" or "Ordering" (these are living beings, not appliances) and a PayPal or "pay here" button prominently featured "for your convenience".

One additional caution, be very wary of those very cute short legged poodles. That's a genetic mutation which may carry serious life-altering disease.

*An excellent source for breeder referrals is your local or the regional or national Poodle Club. *An online search for "Poodle Club of *___* (your city or state/province)" will find them. You can also go directly to the national club site.

Some Poodle Club links are in the Breeder List.


*As a sort of checklist of things to look for or ask, this is my shortlist criteria.*

My criteria need not be yours but I think it's important for a potential poodle owner to understand why these things matter in finding a conscientious breeder and to get a well bred puppy to share life with for many years to come.
Simply being advertised as "registered" or even "purebred" doesn't mean that a puppy is _well bred._


*Every one of these is a talking point a conscientious breeder will welcome, just not all at the same time *

My ideal breeder is someone who is doing this because they love the breed.
They want to see each new generation born at least as good as the previous, ideally better.
They provide for every dog in their care as if that dog is their own.
They will be there for the new family, and stand behind that pup for it's lifetime, rain or shine, with or without a contract.
They will know the standards and pedigrees of their chosen breed, health and genetic diversity of their lines, and breed to better them.
They will know of the latest studies in health standards for their chosen breed and variety and do the health testing of their breeding dogs.
They prove their dogs meet breed standards physically and temperamentally, and are sound by breeding from sires and dams proven in competition or participating in other activities.
They do not cross breed.
They will have as many questions for me as I do for them.
They invest in their dogs. They don't expect the dogs to support them


This is a link to a Breeder List compiled from members recommendations thru the years. Start here and look thru some websites randomly, to get a feel for what you should see from a breeder.

Then when you start looking for yourself, don't skip the Multi-listings and definitely contact Poodle Clubs within your travel distance and look for their breeder referral people.

(10) 🐩 Breeders Listed by Location 🐩 Plus Additional Resources 🐩 | Poodle Forum


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Welcome, Michael! It would be highly unusual to find a miniature poodle puppy ready to go right now from a good breeder. You’re probably better off shopping around for a breeder than a puppy. The puppy part comes next.  Maybe that “good breeder” is Crews Happy Acres. I’m not sure. I’ve never heard of them. But Rose has given you some fabulous advice above to help guide your search.


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## Johanna (Jun 21, 2017)

Burnside said:


> Hi folks,
> 
> I would really appreciate any feedback you might have for me and my family. I have had three miniatures in my life but it's been about 20 years since I found my last one, Jack, who passed away several years ago.
> 
> ...


Contact the poodle clubs in Virginia for help in finding a reputable breeder. Here is the information for each of them:

Washington Poodle Club - based in Alexandria - Breeder Referral: 
Nina Selvaggi | 703-237-2643

Tidelands Poodle Club of Virginia - based in Chesapeake - Breeder Referral: 
Doug Chezem | (757) 467-9494 | Sherry Bryant | [email protected]

This is by far the best way to find someone who is ethical and who raises quality dogs.

Best wishes,
Johanna


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