# Question for breeders: how do you keep up with new info?



## Liz (Oct 2, 2010)

I'm not sure we have many breeders here anymore :-(


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## spindledreams (Aug 7, 2012)

Breeder is a dirty word these days. When you have to argue with your vet that your healthy dog should remain intact and get scorned for not altering them things have swung a bit too far. 
Anyway breeders are forming quite networks some of social media, some in person. People will keep up with research in one segment and make sure the group as a whole is aware of it. Then it can be discussed and the possible ramifications talked about. This includes everything from laws to breeding research to how dogs see colors. And there is some great research going on Day Blindness testing, VGL for more then poodles and most interesting for me new research and understanding of the how merle works.(my other breed has merle)


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## Vita (Sep 23, 2017)

spindledreams said:


> Breeder is a dirty word these days. When you have to argue with your vet that your healthy dog should remain intact and get scorned for not altering them things have swung a bit too far.
> Anyway breeders are forming quite networks some of social media, some in person. People will keep up with research in one segment and make sure the group as a whole is aware of it. Then it can be discussed and the possible ramifications talked about. This includes everything from laws to breeding research to how dogs see colors. And there is some great research going on Day Blindness testing, VGL for more then poodles and most interesting for me new research and understanding of the how merle works.(my other breed has merle)


I agree with all of this. Years ago there used to be many good breeders on PF, but conflict grew on what I call "rightism". People would harshly judge, or be harshly judged, for having a different opinion despite an overlap of the majority ideas they had in common. Eventually there was an exodus of nearly all breeders who were sick of being disrespected, and they simply stopped visiting. In many ways most forums are just a microcosm of society, similar to the divide this century over politics, and like previous centuries over religion. 

PETA did a lot of damage to purebreds too with their _'adopt don't shop'_ credo and belief that every dog should be sterilized until there are no more dogs in shelters. They take it too far, in my opinion. Lotsa luck minding your own business in the park with your fabulously groomed poodle and not having some busy body criticizing you for not getting shelter dog, and even more luck in finding one in a major city that isn't a pitbull mix. One can luck up on really nice rescues w/o behavior or health problems sometimes, but it's like finding a needle in haystack, and puppies are few and far between.



curlflooffan said:


> ...Breeding touches upon a lot of different fields, medical, genetic, behavioural, welfare. So how do breeders keep up to date?


I can recommend a private FB group called Standard Poodle Diversity. It's run by Rebekah Zurbrugg, of the BetterBred project that is educating others. 

I've also been impressed with the vast library shared by VCA Hospitals. Scroll down halfway and you'll see the categories of many topics. 

Curlfloofan, the VMD Technology website might be up your alley. It has also has this article, A Survival Guide to Veterinary Trade Publications. 

Good luck in your career pursuit.


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## curlflooffan (Mar 27, 2020)

That is indeed very unfortunate. Although I do understand how that can happen as I do believe that its important to be critical of breeding practices but its also very easy for those discussions to break down into something unpleasant and disrespectful. 

I don't think the anti-breeding rheotric is as wide-spread in Europe as it is in the US. Especially not in the north-western regions where we haven't really struggled with overpopulation in the same way. 

I find it very concerning that vets are reluctant to provide advice, because if I would be breeding I would want to have a vet with particular expertise on that. I know that all vets must have pregnancy and such as part of their training but I would imagine that if you spend most of your days working with altered adults that you might get a little rusty on the topic??

I have always been interested in breeding and showing. I have no immediate plans as there are about million 'life things' that I would have to sort out before I would even think about finding a foundation dog. So I don't want to be asking breeders for advice or mentorship at this point as it might be 20 years before I would actually get started. To put into context how far away I am from becoming a breeder, I don't even own a property, I rent an apartment with no garden. 

But I would really love to slowly get aquainted with 'the theory' aspects of breeding. I really like gathering information when I am not in a position to actually take action. Its a lot less stressful then trying to do research just as you want to get started. For example I decided on the toy/miniature poodle as my first dog as an adult around 7 years before I was actually in a position to get one. 

Im a bit reluctant to bring this up with the breeder that I am getting my pup from in spring. I don't want her to think that I am planning on breeding her dog when I had asked for a pet quality.


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## Johanna (Jun 21, 2017)

How do I keep up? I regularly check the Poodle Club of America site; I check the OFA site looking for dogs related to mine; I read Poodle Variety; I do searches for poodle health issues on Google. I am doing a presentation for our local poodle club on things to consider if thinking about breeding. It was scheduled for August, but it will have to wait until we can meet again (other than Zoom meetings). Another source of information is the online group "Versatility in Poodles", a group that stresses poodle participation in a huge variety of activities.

Many years ago I bred or co-bred one or two standard poodle litters a year, but now I just have the one miniature poodle bitch. I plan to breed her just once unless she produces something spectacular.

Regarding information from my veterinarian - my poodle is the first well-bred dog she has ever had as a client. She asks me questions! However, I recently discovered that there is a veterinarian not far away


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## Fenris-wolf (Apr 17, 2018)

Vita said:


> PETA did a lot of damage to purebreds too with their _'adopt don't shop'_ credo and belief that every dog should be sterilized until there are no more dogs in shelters. They take it too far, in my opinion.


The people who work for PETA are monsters. Some animal rights group they are. They put down a high rate of the animals they get, and the dogs who are Pitbulls don't get a chance at all. It's really heartbreaking. They own a part of SeaWorld too.


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## FloofyPoodle (May 12, 2020)

Fenris-wolf said:


> The people who work for PETA are monsters. Some animal rights group they are. They put down a high rate of the animals they get, and the dogs who are Pitbulls don't get a chance at all. It's really heartbreaking. They own a part of SeaWorld too.


I don't like them at all either. Smile Amazon had them listed as an animal non-profit, and I was just--ha! Fat chance. If I'm donating money, I want it to be something that actually affects something, and I haven't ever seen any good things come out of them--just riling people up and general weirdness/horrible things. Although I'm sure somewhere, somehow, there have been PETA members that did something good.


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## Fenris-wolf (Apr 17, 2018)

FloofyPoodle said:


> I don't like them at all either. Smile Amazon had them listed as an animal non-profit, and I was just--ha! Fat chance. If I'm donating money, I want it to be something that actually affects something, and I haven't ever seen any good things come out of them--just riling people up and general weirdness/horrible things. Although I'm sure somewhere, somehow, there have been PETA members that did something good.


Of course Amamzon had them as an animal non-profit🙄😒 IRK?! Yeah, me too. I bet you're right about that. It's had to have happened somewhere.


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## spindledreams (Aug 7, 2012)

PETA has never had animal welfare as their goal. Their publicly stated intention is to end all animal ownership. I have used Amazon to donate to the service dog org I approved of and currently it goes to my terriers national breed club. 

When I started going to my first vet here in the late 80s the two main vets were breeders/exhibitors of show dogs. Jeanne is now gone and the other one is retired from practice. The young vets and their young front desk are very anti breeder. I found another practice with a great vet but that vet moved on and back to the breeders are vile creatures and you should accept everything we tell you... The current practice I am using has a performance exhibitor at the front desk and a bit of an understanding of where I am coming from. Just hope it lasts.

There are a number of groups on Facebook that have vet input and folks can suggest breeder friendly vets. The fact there is a need for these as well as the different dog repro groups is sadly a sign of the times. BUT there are also Puppy Culture and Avidog groups to help a newbie do their very best to get their pups off to a good start. As mentioned a good breeder is always reading and researching. Evaluating the information they are getting, deciding what works for them and what doesn't. But fewer and fewer people are breeding and those who do are under more and more restrictions. Long gone are the days of the road side signs Puppys for Sale or even just a Kennel sign proclaiming a person is a breeder at least in the US.


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