# Housebroken...then suddenly not



## Girlnotboy (May 28, 2014)

with no change in routine.

We have a 11-month tpoo. When I posted my intro here, we were having trouble training her. Then Friday (6 days ago) out of the blue, she suddenly got it. She did her 10-14 pees & poos per day on pads and pads only. We pad trained her because we both work and cannot expect her to hold it for 10-12 hours at a time (although she can go a full 8. She's done it before) and because it is way too hot where we live to take her out multiple times a day. We tried that with no success. She got extremely distracted by every little thing and refused to go. We both got sunburned waiting 15-30 minutes each time. Anyway, we gave her tiny training treats for each successful pee or poo on pads. Soon she was not leashed at all and had the run of the house except for carpeted areas because it was clear she knew the rules. We did not even have to keep an eye on her because as soon as she did her pee or poo in the right place (pad), she would come to us for approval! What a smart dog! Success!

Not. Today she pooed twice. Each time, she made a big poo on the pad she doesn't usually use (we place 3 in a row) and a small poo a foot or 2 away from it. Why? THEN as I was cleaning the second off-pad poo, she peed on her floor pillow, which she plays and relaxes and sleeps on during the day and regards as her second den. Why?!

Other issues she has done in the near past and that we're afraid she'll repeat:

1. Step in poo and drag it. She has done this before and ruined her leash spinning around in it with poo.

2. Be afraid to pee or poo. I'm afraid since we said "NO!" to her multiple times and leashed her in her dog bed (which she otherwise loves), she will be afraid to pee or poo at all.

How is it that she could have been so consistent for 5 days and then today happens? She is not ill. She was vet checked twice recently. She MUST have understood it before because there is no way 10-14 pees and poos went on pads only for those days.

Should we stop giving her treats after successful pad pees and poos?

Should the cleanup be very fast? I can't tell whether she likes to be clean. Supposedly dogs like to be clean. If she does, why does she step in and smear her poo? Why does she step in her pee? Can she not avoid it?

I changed nothing in her routine for this to happen. I had to clean her poo with enzyme cleaner, so when that was soaking, I had to cordon off the area. It was right next to the clean pads. So every time she went sniffing there, I had to call her back. Then I noticed her spinning in circles on her floor pillow, which she regards as her other home (this is the very disturbing part--I thought dogs didn't like to soil where they live & sleep???), and before I knew it, she'd peed on the floor pillow. I was so frustrated I almost cried. But do you think she really had to go when the enzyme cleaner was soaking and went on the floor pillow ONLY because she thought she had nowhere else to? Even if that were the case, why soil her bed?!

Please advise what we can do. We love her ridiculous amounts and hate confining her. It is not even clear to us whether she understands why she's being punished. We want her to have the run of the noncarpet areas of the house again. Thank you so much.


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

The floor pillow incident could have been because you had called her away from the area she usually uses, and she was desperate, so used the nearest thing to a pee pad she could find. In general, I would say that she is nearly there, but needs more training - two weeks with no accidents would be my aim, and even then I would expect to have to do some work on reminding her if you ever need to change the position of the pads. I think I would teach her to go on demand - watch her, and as soon as she squats use your cue word or words, and then reward her for going. That way you can encourage her to use the pads while you are there to reward her, and transition to outside more easily when the weather is cooler.

I think you are sensible to try to avoid shouting at her if she goes in the wrong place - the last thing you want is her hiding away to do it! Perhaps a very large tray to hold the pads, set on a plastic sheet, would make it easier for all of you? Perhaps she feels she is in the right place when her front paws are on the pad, but not necessarily the rest of her...


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Spinning was her way of saying "gotta go, gotta go." Take advantage of the fact that she is giving you a signal. I have never housebroken a small dog so i think there are suggestions that small dog people here (like fjm) may have for you that I don't. Overall though, don't get discouraged. Sometimes there are setbacks with these things. Be consistent and positive and I am sure it will straighten out.


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## Streetcar (Apr 13, 2014)

You say she is 11 months. If she is not spayed yet, along with the training the others described, maybe consider whether she might be coming into heat. That can mess with their house training somewhat.
I think wanting to keep everything about house training positive is a good idea, so as not to create a sneak eliminator. However, I'm no great shakes as a trainer, so others' advice in that area is much better than anything I could suggest. Jean Donaldson's Culture Clash is a great book and I love how she addresses house training.


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## Girlnotboy (May 28, 2014)

*Update--completely unhousebroken. What to do?*

Thank you all for your responses. I really appreciate your time. Although I don't post often due to my work schedule, I have read a LOT of posts about toilet training here and elsewhere. She was doing great for 2-3 weeks. Unfortunately, she regressed, and this is not a good update.

She was spayed about 3-4 months ago before formal potty training began. My uncle did the spay. No complications. Vet checked by 2 separate vets since.

I blame myself for the floor incident I described in my last post. I do know that spinning is a dog's way of saying "need to go," but it didn't occur to me that she needed to go again so soon after going. Also, just as often she spins to get comfy to sit or lie down. She has unpredictable pee/poo patterns despite very predictable feedings. I'm talking down to the 1/4 hour predictable. We free water because it's so hot here. The heat index was over 100 yesterday. As I said before, she was outside in the shade less than 10 minutes before her tongue was on the floor, and she was panting and heaving.

She made it 2-3 weeks without "accidents." I don't count the 1-episode diarrhea she had because she was ill. I had fed her a little plain yogurt thinking probiotics would be good for her. Big mistake. Plus she started in the right place just ended in the wrong places.

Part of the problem is she is in such a hurry to finish that she drips pee and drops the second piece of poo when running from the pads to find us to get her treat. If anyone has a way of remedying this I'd sure like to know because she always started right and sometimes (maybe up to 25% of the time) finished wrong. I've been observing her closely and know this is the problem because she always started spinning and squatting in the right place.

She won't go when she's being watched (can't blame her; I wouldn't want to either). She has actually stopped having a poo when I watched her. I only watch her to be able to time her praise and reward and cleanup IMMEDIATELY because she sticks her muzzle in it otherwise!

We were so proud of her. My mom came to visit and was amazed how well-trained poodle was. Pee on pad, come get treat. Poo on pad, come get treat. If we weren't there, she'd come find us. What a smart girl!

Fast forward to last week. Hubby steps in her pee right outside his door first thing after morning feeding. He's angry, but he chalks it up to possibly having missed a few of her pees and not rewarding her timely. She gets a "NO!" and a timeout on the leash. She goes back to being a good poodle.

Few days later, I find a dried puddle by the kitchen. It's in the same place where she pood 8 weeks ago (wasn't trained then but magically trained the very next day). There's no way we could've cleaned it any better with enzyme cleaner and vinegar. Again, "NO!" and timeout.

Last week I go out of town for 5 days for medical treatment. She is an angel while I'm gone (actually doesn't even notice I'm gone ). When I get back, all HECK breaks loose. She poos on pad, gets her treat, and immediately pees in the kitchen. I stepped in it. She gets "NO!" and timeout.

Today she did the same thing. Same punishment. As soon as I let her off the leash after 3 hours, she pees in the kitchen AGAIN. And AGAIN. Then she poos. Then she pees in a new place! She has had more accidents today than in the last month combined.

Her least favorite thing is to be leashed and away from "the action." She regards it as worse than thirst or starvation. So this is the worst punishment she could get. Why does she suddenly NOT get it? She got it way too consistently and way too long for it to have been coincidence.

She is 1 year old Saturday. We were planning a little party for her with plain homecooked chicken--her favorite. Now I am not sure I want to reward this behavior if it doesn't stop.

I can't think of anything that changed other than I left for 5 days, but even if that were the reason (and I don't think it is because she didn't even notice my absence), why would she be so bad after I return? She is not showing any signs of illness, now or recently or before this started happening, but she has a vet appointment just in case.

These are not tiny pees (the first one I stepped in was HUGE), and she's not constantly squatting with little result, so I don't think it's a UTI. What medical reason could cause this? We think it's behavioral.

We love her, but this toilet training undoing cannot go on! My mother is retired and loves her so much that she offered to train her for us since we don't have the 24/7 to put into her, but we think that even if my mom's successful, poodle may regress when she comes back to us.

Any suggestions, advice, comments, etc. are most appreciated. Thanks so much again.


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## Desiree (Feb 14, 2010)

IMO 10 -12 hours alone is to long for a young dog to be alone. You may need to spend more time with the dog. 12 hrs of work and 8 hrs of sleep means 20 hrs of boredom for the dog. And if you count going out and taking care of the daily cores of life that doesn't leave much time for dog training.

I would also train the dog to potty outside in a shaded area/run if needed not inside on pads. Standing outside waiting for the dog to get a clue is part of the process. The time spent outside lessens when the dog begins to understand what it's there for. If it gets too hot place it in a crate inside to cool off then take it back outside to try again. 

If still you instill on indoor pads you need to understand that many poodles do not like their poo or pee on them so you may need to change the pads after every potty time, liquid or solid. And make sure the area is big enough to satisfy the dog. She may want to find her choice spot.

That said, most people give small dogs too much space in the house for potty training. One large room is all that's needed until a small dog trained. Many of my clients with large houses never get their little dogs trained at all. Good Luck!


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

I noticed you are punishing her way after the fact. After finding it by stepping in a puddle or finding a dried spot. She is a dog, no matter how smart, she is not going to associate you telling her no with a dry pee spot to the act of peeing. Also giving her a party is not going to reward the behavior. She simply cannot associate the two. It is not like a human child that you can say, "I'm sorry, you broke a rule so you get no party". 

It sounds to me like she is getting too much freedom. You were ver close to getting there, but then it sounds like some of the vigilance waned and she regressed.

Personally I would use the tethering method and be very strict with it. The tethering is NOT a punishment but rather a way to set her up for only success.

ETA: of course urinalysis and complete vet exam would be the first step!


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## Lisa75 (Jul 16, 2014)

Unless you catch her in the act telling her no is not going to do anything. Time outs won't do anything for potty training either. If you catch her starting to go in the wrong place you can say uh uh or no and pick her up to go in the right spot. Good luck! It sounds like your best bet is to restrict her freedom until she's more reliable.


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## Beaches (Jan 25, 2014)

Please make this a misunderstanding on my part and say that you didn't give her a 3 HOUR
time out for a pee on the floor.


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

Have I understood you? You know she won't pee or poo when you are watching her, but then keep her on a leash for three hours and are surprised that she toilets everywhere the moment she is free?! Poodles are intelligent, but they are dogs. They associate immediate consequences (I pee on pad, find human, get reward), but are completely unable to think out the sort of cause and effect you are inflicting. As far as she is concerned you found a mark on the floor, got cross and punished her. All that is going to do is to undermine your relationship.

Remember that you are leaving a very young dog for very long hours. During that time no training is happening, or rather she is getting the immediate reward of a relief of discomfort for peeing and pooing wherever she happens to be. There is no benefit to her in holding it, or in doing it in the "right" place as you are not around to praise and reward her. The only reason for her to use the pad is habit (research has shown that it takes humans about 30 days to establish a new habit, and most give up after about 14...), and because it has become so thoroughly associated with good things following that it becomes rewarding in itself. 

I would go right back to basics. Lots of supervision (NOT as a punishment, but so that you, or someone you trust, is around to read her body language and make sure she is in the right place at the right time), lots of praise and treats, and a suitable puppy pad container in a private place. If she will accept somewhere that is enclosed on three sides, then you could gradually narrow the entrance, and then add in a right angled turn, which should slow her down enough to solve the dribble problem. Although Poppy always poos in stages...

I think it is certainly easier to housetrain when there is a clear message Outside Good, Inside Not; think of how you can make the area that you want her to use as obviously different as possible. And please, stop punishing her long after the event. The advice of keeping a rolled up newspaper to hand, and each time the pup or dog has an accident using it to hit YOURSELF over the head whole chanting "I must be more vigilant!" holds good!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

fjm you said what I was thinking very well. I won't add much other than to say that the OP should view this as a start from scratch housebreaking and be very careful about the positive associations of doing it right. No punishments ever for this pup in this matter. Hire someone trustworthy to help if you can't be home enough to help the pup be successful.


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