# Feeding Raw.... For Dummies!



## Clicker (Apr 28, 2012)

So I have been contemplating switching Bailey to Raw. I was looking at Nature's Variety Raw. I have no idea if this is all I have to do to feed a raw diet or not? I have been doing some research and the more I read the more I feel confused. I've heard of people feeding Tripe & I have no idea what that is? I thought when I first saw PMR that it meant Pre-Made-Raw! 

The whole 'Raw" thing seems very complicated & intimidating but, I don't know if that is the case? I know it will cost more to feed a raw diet (currently feeding Acana Pacifica) but, that is not my concern. My concern is, if I start feeding Bailey Nature's Variety Raw, what else do I need to do to make sure that she has a balanced diet? Can I go to the grocery store, buy some raw meat & give it to her? What do I have to add to it to balance it?

I want to give my little girl the best but, It just feels like there is TOO MUCH INFORMATION for a newbie! I know that there is a "sticky" on this Forum about raw diets but, I would prefer to hear from members of this Forum about where to start, things I may need before I start, when & how to start, etc.. etc.. :confused3: Any info would be appreciated. Thanks!


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## Sawyersmomma (May 28, 2012)

I'm so confused too! I'll be keeping a close eye on this thread!


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

I have fed raw for many, many years, and I don't see it as a complicated or difficult diet at all. Granted, I've been through many permutations of the diet, starting with the style that involved making up a "patty mix" for one meal which included ground veggies for one meal, and raw meaty bones (RMB'S) for the other. That was a bit complicated and time-consuming. Now I feed Prey Model Raw (PMR), feeding RMB's, organs (including green tripe on a regular basis), and fish. No grains, no veggies, no kibble, no fancy pre-made raw. 

Green tripe is the unprocessed stomach of a cow. Quite different from the clean white tripe you can sometimes find at grocery stores for use in Hispanic dishes like menudo, it contains the remnants of the partially digested plant matter of the cow's last meal, and is rich in enzymes. Dogs *love* it!

I don't obsess in the least about "balance," just focus on feeding an evolutionarily sound diet to my pet carnivores. I buy raw meat by the case from a pet-oriented retailer, but I also pick up meat from the grocery store when I can; chicken leg quarters are often on sale cheap cheap cheap, and the HEB nearby sells fish heads--yum! 

The only thing I add is fish oil sometimes and a joint supplement for my two oldest girls. There's nothing easier than this diet: open fridge, put [riblets, turkey necks, leg quarters, tripe, ground organs, whatever] in bowl, place bowl in front of poodle, say, "Get it!", and enjoy the sound of crunching. 

How to start? Most of the advice I read says to switch "cold turkey." What do you need to start? Some raw meat and a hungry dog!

Raw feeding isn't for everyone; some people just can't do it for whatever reason, and there's nothing wrong with that, so long as their dogs are healthy and happy. But raw works for me and I'll never feed another way. Please feel free to any me anything; I am completely devoted to this diet.

My siggie at the Dog Food Forum:








My gorgeous girl Flame, who lived to age 13 when the average life expectancy of her breed is 11, eating an ostrich leg.

Hope this helps! 

--Q


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

I found the advice here: DogAware.com: Homemade Diets for Dogs sensible and easy to follow. For my toys I have worked out a diet that they love, and that is easy for me. They don't much like raw offal, so I cook a mix of offal and mince that contains ground bone, sometimes adding some veg if I have it to hand. I buy frozen green tripe in chunks, chicken wings, and any other small boney meats I can find (riblets, chicken necks). I also bone out meat I am eating, being generous with the amount of meat I leave on the bone. Then they get one meal cooked mince, one meal RMB, one meal raw tripe - more or less! If they get bunged up, they get some extra offal. If they get the runs, some extra bone. As Quossum says, if you feed a variety and sufficient RMBs, balance takes care of itself.


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## CraftyGirl (Jan 29, 2012)

I felt the same as you at first, but switching to raw was absolutely the BEST choice I've made for my dog so far. He is currently eating Primal (premade, frozen nuggets, very convenient, and a complete balanced diet). It comes in 8 or 9 different formulas and I switch up which ones I buy to give him variety. About twice a week he gets a raw chicken neck to help with teeth cleaning. I am using this method while I also learn more about making the jump to a full-on prey model. In the meantime, his coat is great, teeth are clean, poop firm and easy to pick up, and best of all, he ENJOYS his meals now!! Before when he was on high-quality kibble he would just pick at it and I stressed constantly over whether he was eating enough. Now he leaps and bounces into the kitchen when it's meal time! I say go for it! Good luck and I'll be learning with you!


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## faerie (Mar 27, 2010)

i'm all raw now, but not doing any RMBs as i've got 5 dogs and hard to feed them separately and monitor.. instead i do the ground w/bone. i'm contemplating purchasing a meat/bone grinder and grinding my own, but not sure about proportion of meat/bone and the whole pieces that i'll be grinidng.


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## lwm1984 (Apr 15, 2012)

I've been feeding raw for about a month, so I'm also a newbie. I went with Nature's Variety pre-made as well, and I take it that this is a complete balanced diet. I rotate between venison, lamb, beef, bison, and duck for some variety. In addition, I supplement this diet with chicken quarters and other RMB's for the dental benefits. It absolutely freaked me out the first time I fed raw, bone-in meat, as everyone I know always comments how "dogs shouldn't eat bones," etc. My spoo's breeder fed fresh raw venison during hunting season, so I knew she could handle the bones; she loves chomping on those things! The first time I followed her around all day thinking she'd have an issue, but now I'm more comfortable. It's amazing how much misinformation there is out there.

Her vet was initially trying to persuade me to go with kibble, citing some health risks due to contamination, etc. I take the necessary precautions for raw meat, and NVI uses high pressure processing (whatever that is, lol), so it sounds pretty safe. I've eaten steak tartare on a number of occasions (with a raw egg, no less), so if I can eat raw meat, I'm sure my spoo can handle it, too! After the initial, "go with kibble," her vet was more accepting. Luckily, there is another vet in the same office who is pro-raw.

I absolutely hate picking up huge poops, and after switching to raw, my spoo's poop is actually smaller and less smelly than my 14 pound shih tzu's used to be! Sorry if that's too much information, lol!


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## faerie (Mar 27, 2010)

oops. double post. sorry!


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## LEUllman (Feb 1, 2010)

Beau has been eating NV frozen raw for almost two years now. He loves it, and so do I. Only disadvantage is cost, but with one mini to feed, it's not a big deal. He started on chicken, but eventually started to get runny poops. I switched him to bison, and all is well. It's very rich, though, which means he only gets a 1/4 patty in the morning and another 1/4 for dinner. It's not much food, quantity wise, and he gobbles it literally in seconds. He's a couch potato kind of guy, and keeping his weight in check can be an issue. Doesn't help that he's a world champion moocher, and knows exactly how to get certain family members to dispense treats.


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## Carley's Mom (Oct 30, 2011)

I finally got Carley on a all raw diet. I felt the same way that you do and was worried about getting it all right... She is doing great. I am not feeding veggies either, but I do feed a canned tripe. I don't know if it is as good, but she likes it and it don't smell as bad as the other stuff . I try to rotate between chicken, turkey,raw eggs, fish and beef. I do feed both chicken and beef organ meat as well. 
Carley got biten by a spider! I took her to the vet and they ran some test, he told me that she was very healthy and her body was fighing the bite very well. He did not think she would have any problems! That was good to hear. 
Good Luck!
P.S. I was so scared at first about the bones. I read that you can get the same results from grinding them up before feeding if you prefer. I don't do that, but wanted to let you know.


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## Carley's Mom (Oct 30, 2011)

I thought of another thing that you may find helpful. You need to check out your dogs poo, if it is too runny, give less organ meat and more bone meals. If too hard, add pumpkin or organ meat ect. You will find you have much less waste and it is not smelly either.


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## schnauzerpoodle (Apr 21, 2010)

I found this document created by Clarion Poodles to be very helpful for beginners.

http://www.clarionpoodles.com/download/Diet_and_Feeding_Instructions.pdf


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## caroline429 (Mar 5, 2012)

Clicker said:


> So I have been contemplating switching Bailey to Raw. I was looking at Nature's Variety Raw. I have no idea if this is all I have to do to feed a raw diet or not? I have been doing some research and the more I read the more I feel confused.


Feeding any kind of a homemade diet is pretty scary when you've never done it before. I've fed a homemade cooked diet to my dogs for the past 15 years and I have to tell you I was terrified when I started! My vet at the time told me I'd kill my dog if I switched her to a homemade diet but the poor dog was suffering from such terrible food sensitivities and IBD that I figured she couldn't get any worse on homemade than she was on kibble!! The homemade diet turned her around and, yes, she did die eventually but at the age of 13 1/2 which was a really, really long life for her breed.

If you want to go raw, I think NV would be a good place to start. It is a complete and balanced diet, you don't have to add anything at all. Raw diets do, as a rule, tend to be higher in fat and protein than kibble, so I'd do the switch slowly over a period of a couple of weeks, starting with just a little bit of the NV and gradually increasing the amount of the NV and decreasing your kibble, just to make sure there isn't any digestive upset.

If you get to a point where you'd like to make the food yourself but are worried about not doing it properly, there are some excellent booklets available at Individualized Nutrition For Your Dogs. There is one with cooked recipes and one with raw recipes. All recipes are based on the weight of your dog and are complete and balanced. 

Some people are comfortable winging it and some people like a more structured approach to a homemade diet. I'd say do whatever feels right for you.


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## faerie (Mar 27, 2010)

if you all do a search for my threads. i started out wanting to COOK for my dogs with meat/veggies and some grains and no raw bones.

now i'm doing raw, very little veggies except as treats
and i'm giving them raw bones ... except i'm giving them the raw bones ground w/ muscle meat.

so right now this is where i am. i'd love to get my nerve up to offer whole bones but with 5 dogs eating in 3 locations, i'm just not ready ... and part of me knows it will be okay ... 

however, i'm looking at getting a grinder (i'm going to start a new thread) and buying chicken necks and backs to grind and maybe leg quarters. 

so it's exciting. my dogs all look great and love their meal times.


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## Clicker (Apr 28, 2012)

caroline429 said:


> If you want to go raw, I think NV would be a good place to start. It is a complete and balanced diet, you don't have to add anything at all. Raw diets do, as a rule, tend to be higher in fat and protein than kibble, so I'd do the switch slowly over a period of a couple of weeks, starting with just a little bit of the NV and gradually increasing the amount of the NV and decreasing your kibble, just to make sure there isn't any digestive upset.


Thanks caroline. Most of the research I've done so far has suggested that I not feed her Bailey for at least 12 hours, then just switch "cold turkey". No pun intended. Do you think this is a bad idea? Her food now has 33% protein & min. 18% fat. Also, how long can I feed NV raw? Can this be ALL I feed Bailey if I wanted to?


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## caroline429 (Mar 5, 2012)

Clicker said:


> Thanks caroline. Most of the research I've done so far has suggested that I not feed her Bailey for at least 12 hours, then just switch "cold turkey". No pun intended. Do you think this is a bad idea? Her food now has 33% protein & min. 18% fat. Also, how long can I feed NV raw? Can this be ALL I feed Bailey if I wanted to?


I have always proceeded slowly when switching any of my dogs to a new diet. It probably comes of having owned a couple of Rottweilers with incredibly sensitive stomachs....believe me, cleaning up after a Rottie with digestive upset takes a whole lot longer than cleaning up after a mpoo. 

I don't know if Bailey's digestive tract is touchy or not, but you're not going to hurt her by approaching it this way, in fact, the NV website recommends this is how you should do it FAQ's - Choosing a Food | Nature's Variety 

You may have some people tell you that you shouldn't feed kibble and raw together because it digests at different rates and ferments or sets up toxins or something that will harm the dog. This is a myth that has no basis in reality. I know more than one dog who's eaten raw and kibble mixed together and lived to see another day, my Cali included. 

As to how long can you feed NV, you can feed it forever if you want and, yes, it can be the only thing you feed. It is balanced to AAFCO recommendations for vitamins, minerals, etc. These are the same standards kibble is balanced to so it contains exactly the same balance of nutrients that kibble does, just in a fresher form of food.


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## Arborgale (Dec 11, 2011)

*More Raw Diet Options*

OK, last month Rosie got her last shot and check up by her vet. After much encouragement by our vet, breeder, and forum members, I finally began feeding Rosie some raw meals. We started with hamburger, which she loved. We then moved on to chicken necks. The first chicken neck took her about 45 minutes to eat, as she explored what she could do with it. She is a little quicker now that she knows what to do. 

I have now created a raw snob. She won't eat her kibble at all, to the point where she is now picking it out of the raw hamburger and putting it beside her bowl.  It's funny! She is so excited to be fed when I feed her the raw. She seems very disappointed when it is cooked meat with kibble. 

My questions...as was picking up more chicken necks this week, I noticed chicken feet, pig ears and pig tails. Has any one fed these to their poodles? Are they ok to feed? Rosie is 8 months old. Is there anything I should be concerned about if I feed her any of those things? 

Thanks for your support!


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

Chicken feet are great; they're like the best dog treat ever. Pig tails are both fatty and bony, a little too rich for some dogs, though mine did fine with them. 

Of all the weird things I've fed, I've never fed pigs' ears, though I can only think that fresh ones from the supermarket would have to be better than the dried ones you can get at pet stores.

Congrats on taking the plunge!

--Q


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## Arborgale (Dec 11, 2011)

*Chicken feet * 
Are the claws still on the feet? Is that ok for Rosie to eat or should I cut them off? 

Should I chop the feet up a bit, or will she be able to hack through them? 

Is this a meal or a snack or just an addition to a meal? (like french fries.) 


*Pig Tails*

When you say rich, are you saying that it would make her sick or should it only be a n occasional treat?



*Pig Ears*

Should the pig ear just be a treat every once and a while and NOT a meal? 

Also, they are frozen, would you suggest thawing it or would it be a better challenge to keep it frozen. 

*Wild animals*, like rabbits, squirrels, birds, etc. -- If we catch them are they ok to feed? Is there any part she should avoid? 

Should I be concerned with parasites with the wild animals?


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

Ha--no need to cut the claws off the feet; they can eat them whole. In fact, I just happen to have a couple of pics of Pixie and the nose of my lovely late Flame chomping down on some feet.

















So, if a nine pound IG can get through them, no need to hack them up for any dog, unless you're doing it for training treats. I hack up chicken necks for that, and I imagine that feet would be nice for that, too. Since they're mainly just skin and bone, I imagine feet as lovely treats, like potato chips for dogs. Mine adore them. They can be fed as a light meal, as a snack, as a treat. Strangely enough, the guy who sells holistic treats and food at the shows in my area has dried, smoked chicken feet...which have the toenails neatly lopped off. I have no idea why!

Pig tails = rich, as in they might give some dogs the runs, so I wouldn't feed them every meal. They do have some meat and bone in them, so they're not terrible by any means; I'd just intersperse them with meatier, less fatty meals.

I would consider pig ears a treat. There's not much to them, frozen or not. I haven't fed the fresh ones, but it seems like they might actually be more fun thawed than frozen.

Wild game: This comes up every once in a while on the raw lists and the raw forum I visit. Some people say yes, after a long period of freezing the game solid. Some people say no, due to various diseases that can affect wild animals. I feel a little too paranoid to say an unequivocal yes! Though I know that many people feed whole domestic rabbits (as in, the fur, guts, and etc. are still on / in the bodies). I haven't tried that yet!

Hope this helps!

--Q


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## outwest (May 1, 2011)

I don't feed raw for a number of valid reasons, but would do it if I could. Reasons not to are having an elderly parent in the house and also being a nurse that comes in contact with compromised immune system people daily. The risk for me outweighs the benefits to my dogs.

I still wanted to throw out there that ethnic markets often sell all manner of things for a lot less money than the regular grocery store. I have been going to a large ethnic market near me and am astounded how inexpensive 2 pounds of chicken hearts are or sheeps testicles or intestines and the like. I was looking at the package of cow eyes the other day and envisioning fetch (LOL, sorry...). I wish raw was something I could do because it looks like it would be no more expensive when looking at the available meats there than the grain free kibble and canned I currently use.


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

Outwest, thank you so much for that tidbit; it is so true. Ethnic markets abound in my area, both Asian and Hispanic, and in both you can see types of food that might not be available in "mainstream American" stores.

In fact, in some chain stores located in ethnic hubs, you might well find "odd" food. I've seen pig's heads (yep, the whole freakin' head) at an HEB, and goat meat at a Wal-Mart. Once I was looking at turkey tails in a supermarket, and the woman standing next to me started telling me how to prepare them. Maybe I need to expand my own food horizons! :biggrin:

Near a fairgrounds which is often the site of agility shows in my area, there is a place where you can purchase a live goat...which they will slaughter and prepare for you on the spot. I'm tempted...

--Q


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## Arborgale (Dec 11, 2011)

Oh my gosh!!!! Outwest, you had me laughing so hard envisioning fetch! 

Thanks so much Quossum & Outwest for your patience with my ignorance and many stupid questions. I never thought of the ethnic market. I'll have to go there. 

So all these things at the ethnic market are ok to feed? I am just afraid that if I give her something, it might harm her because of my ignorance. "Like oh no, you gave her intestines or eyeballs. Didn't you know you were supposed to boil those or else they are toxic." I feel like if I run it by you all and get all the info, then it must be ok. I just need reassurance.

I have not tried organ meat yet, but am moving in that direction this week. I know that is a hole in her diet right now. When you feed organ meat, is that all you give them at that meal? Ok, here's a pile of chicken hearts. Eat up!?? Or should you give something else along with the organ meat? I assume I do not need to grind it or anything.

Can you feed them several different organs at the same time? 

Is there any body part or animal that should be off limits? I hear you all talking about fish. Can she have the whole fish, guts, bones and all? Should the fish be gutted, but she can still eat the bones? 

Thanks again! I'm going to add the chicken feet, pig ears and tails to my shopping list. I'm even going to visit Global Foods this coming week to see what gross thing I can come home with. I'll keep you posted.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Word of caution about raw fish. Dogs can get salmon poisoning (fatal) from certain types salmon. I personally avoid feeding any salmon uncooked to be safe. Not even smoked salmon. I thoroughly cook any salmon I will feed.

Salmon Poisoning Disease


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

I am so glad if I can help in any way to keep anyone working through the raw diet. It's the best thing you can do for your dog. Remember, "ignorance" is a temporary condition and there are no stupid questions! :biggrin:

Think of it this way: if wolves kill some animal, they will eat freakin' everything off that animal. The head, the eyeballs, the lips (someone on the raw forum just mentioned those!), the everything!

As far as organ meat...I am fortunate enough to have a store in town that sells "organ grinds" consisting of hearts, kidneys, livers, etc. of the designated animal, all ground up together. Personally, I do feed this stuff as a meal every few days or so (my adults eat one meal a day; the pup is on two meals a day and is thin and fit as a teenager right now!). My hubby's corgi, Gimble, is the only one who sometimes gets a bit runny after an "all-organ" meal, so I try to throw in bone for her, too. The other three, no problem whatever. I know that some people mix a little bit of organs with each RMB meal. Either way works. You do not have to grind the organs. Some people feed a "side" of organ meat with their RMB's.

Dogs can eat the whole fish. I've fed mine whole mackerel (I have photos!), and just the other day I fed the some severely freezer-burned salmon (my husband almost wept) complete with bones, no problem whatsoever.

Keep at it, the more bizarre, the better! Take pictures! Lol

Good luck!

--Q

(As CM mentions: thoroughly freeze any salmon!)


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