# Bordetella and another vaccine question



## caboodles (Jan 7, 2011)

I'm not an expert or anything, but I would definitely go for the bordetella (for the long run of your pup). You just never know WHAT he will encounter in the months to come, and in my opinion, it's just better to be safe than sorry, ESPECIALLY with a puppy because his immune system is weak and isn't able to fight things off.

I don't know about the parvo/lepto thing.. I'm sorry but I can't remember what I did with my puppies but I do have these two interesting articles about vaccinations, their endurance so you don't over-vaccinate and just an overview of the important ones you should have.


Vaccinations - Poodle

PETS DON'T NEED SHOTS EVERY YEAR


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

You may want to do a search on Dr. Jean Dodd's protocol. Ideally you will only have a single distemper and a single parvo shot given. Most vets carry the DHPP though. 

Personally, I would NOT get lepto. 

Also, Bordetella vaccine is relatively useless as it covers only a few of the many strains of the virus. Though, it is true that many places will require ut.


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## caboodles (Jan 7, 2011)

Dr-Dodds-ChangingVaccProtocol

That's a good point!! My naturopath rescued a german shepherd at the age of 9 and NEVER gave her any vaccines, except for rabies which was required for crossing the border.. Long story short, she lived an incredibly healthy 9 more years.. and it had me wondering that it must be due to TWO things: NO vaccines and a raw diet.

The only thing is if you ever need boarding.. all places require that your shots are up to date. ANDDD also, I don't think insurances will cover you if you don't remain on top either.

Personally, I plan on ONLY giving them their shots every three years. I know of another poodle who unfortunately developed IMHA, which is when your immune system turns on itself due to annual vaccinations. So there's obviously a lot of PROS and CONS no matter which path you choose... and there's no right or wrong way because clearly you love your poodle and are only doing the best thing for him!


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Caboodles - in your experience do places require ALL vaccines, or is distemper, parvo, bordetella and rabies enough?

Millie is getting her 1 year shots in a couple of weeks. This will be her final booster ever, hopefully- my vet is special ordering a 2-way DPV (distemper parvo) shot for me and she will only be vaccinated for these things, + bordetella (ONLY for boarding, daycare, agility, tracking and therapy work :/) + 3 year rabies. After this year, she will be titred as these places do accept titres in place of vaccines.

I have decided that I refuse to allow boarding kennels to dictate my dogs' health. It has been a long road of discovery for me, but I have pretty much decided that if a kennel will refuse to take my dog because she has only been vaccinated for distemper + parvo + rabies + bordetella, well, then I guess my only choice is to hire a pet sitter. I do hope that places will start to become aware of the research that suggests that only 4 sets of shots provides lifetime immunity.


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## PaddleAddict (Feb 9, 2010)

caboodles said:


> I'm not an expert or anything, but I would definitely go for the bordetella (for the long run of your pup). You just never know WHAT he will encounter in the months to come, and in my opinion, it's just better to be safe than sorry, ESPECIALLY with a puppy because his immune system is weak and isn't able to fight things off.


For what it's worth, bordetella vaccines guard against kennel cough and are a lot like flu shots. They cover some strains, but not all strains. Bordetella can be either viral or bacterial, or both. Unless a dog has some other serious health issues, kennel cough is not a serious threat to your dog's health.

I vaccinate for bordetella b/c our dog daycare requires it, but if not for that I woudn't get it. Of course, it all depends on your dog's lifestyle and the area where you live.

Lepto is not recommened unless you live in an area where lepto is a problem. I would ask your vet if he recommends it because it's a problem in your area. If not, you could skip it if you want to.

I tried to separate all of my dog's vaccines, I had the vet give distemper one day, then a week or two later we did parvo, then a month later rabies. I didn't want to overload his developing immune system with a ton of vaccines all at once.


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## PaddleAddict (Feb 9, 2010)

ChocolateMillie said:


> Caboodles - in your experience do places require ALL vaccines, or is distemper, parvo, bordetella and rabies enough?
> 
> Millie is getting her 1 year shots in a couple of weeks. This will be her final booster ever, hopefully- my vet is special ordering a 2-way DPV (distemper parvo) shot for me and she will only be vaccinated for these things, + bordetella (ONLY for boarding, daycare, agility, tracking and therapy work :/) + 3 year rabies. After this year, she will be titred as these places do accept titres in place of vaccines.
> 
> I have decided that I refuse to allow boarding kennels to dictate my dogs' health. It has been a long road of discovery for me, but I have pretty much decided that if a kennel will refuse to take my dog because she has only been vaccinated for distemper + parvo + rabies + bordetella, well, then I guess my only choice is to hire a pet sitter. I do hope that places will start to become aware of the research that suggests that only 4 sets of shots provides lifetime immunity.


CM, I know that the Camp Bow Wow chain accepts titers in place of vaccines for everything but bordetella and rabies. I am sure they are not the only boarding facility to do so.


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## caboodles (Jan 7, 2011)

ChocolateMillie - 
I actually haven't boarded any of my poodles so far, and I don't think I ever will either. I love them to pieces and just can't stomach the idea of leaving them at the vets office, with people they and I don't know very well... I would rather leave them with family or friends, or even other poodle neighbours who know the level of care they need.

I do know that the friend of mine whose poodle developed IMHA was stopped from receiving future vaccines in order to help his recovery. As a result, when he had FINALLY overcome the disease and they were going away for a while, they had wanted to board him at the vet's office and their OWN VET told them no because he did not have his vaccines, even though they were the reason why he developed IMHA to begin with. But, I'm pretty sure they require ALL of those you listed to be current and up to date.

I know how you feel.. I COMPLETELY disagree with the vets who constantly push annual vaccines. Obviously, they're only caring about their revenue and not the longevity of their animals' lives. Research even shows that poodles are one of the four breeds who are likely to develop IMHA with annual vaccines year after year. That's why I don't believe in vets simply giving a recommendation for DOGS, when their research should focus on BREEDS individually. 

Hopefully somedayyy....


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## Sookster (Apr 11, 2011)

I'm with the others. I would only do Bordetella if it is required by the puppy class that you are attending. The vaccine isn't THAT effective, and kennel cough isn't THAT big of a deal unless your dog is not healthy for other reasons. 

Whether you decide to go with Lepto or not, I would not give it on the same day as the parvo. One shot per visit is more than enough for your baby's immune system to juggle. If you want to go ahead with the lepto, wait a week or two and then go back for it.


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## Theo'sMom (Mar 23, 2011)

Thank you for all of your responses which I am reading carefully. 
One sad thing is that the vet's dog came down with lepto- a strain not covered by the vaccine-even though the dog was vaccinated. (the dog is fine now)
So she is strongly recommending the lepto vaccine, despite the fact that the strain in the area right now seems to be one not covered by the vaccine.


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## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

coconutgeordie said:


> Thank you for all of your responses which I am reading carefully.
> One sad thing is that the vet's dog came down with lepto- a strain not covered by the vaccine-even though the dog was vaccinated. (the dog is fine now)
> So she is strongly recommending the lepto vaccine, despite the fact that the strain in the area right now seems to be one not covered by the vaccine.


Also, FWIW, Lepto vaccine is one that does cause some pretty bad side effects in many dogs. It doesn't cover every strain (like you said) and I personally am not convinced the vaccine is worth it. I have heard some accounts of poodles reacting pretty terribly to the vaccine.


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## PaddleAddict (Feb 9, 2010)

coconutgeordie said:


> Thank you for all of your responses which I am reading carefully.
> One sad thing is that the vet's dog came down with lepto- a strain not covered by the vaccine-even though the dog was vaccinated. (the dog is fine now)
> So she is strongly recommending the lepto vaccine, despite the fact that the strain in the area right now seems to be one not covered by the vaccine.


If I were in your shoes, I would call a few other vets in your area and ask if they recommend the lepto vaccine. If it's generally recommended for your area, that's one thing, but if your vet just had a bad experience and is recommending it for emotional reasons, that's something different.

Due to the bad reactions associated with the vaccine, I would really weigh the risks and benefits.


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## CT Girl (Nov 17, 2010)

I did not have Swizzle get the lepto shot considering the risk/benefit. He did get Bordetella as it was going around and as a puppy toy I felt I should err on the side of caution. We live in an area loaded with ticks (I picked two off him today and one off me) so he has Lyme, distemper/parvo and rabies. I only let him get one shot at a time so I made several trips to the vet. My vet was very aware of the vaccination issue and we discussed every shot that Swizzle would get. The Bordetella was iffy but it was going around at the time. She also discussed the Lyme with me but considering the area I insisted on it. I know several dogs and people in my immediate area who have contracted Lyme. Fortunately my vet after my initial visit only charged for the shot but she is a sucker for Swizzle and always checked him out to see how he was doing. My vet said she is pushing for the state to accept titred as she sees over vaccination as a big problem.


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