# Any trustworthy breeder in NJ,NY,PA are?



## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

The demand for toy breed puppies had definitely outpaced the supply recently. It's not just poodles; I've noticed some Bichon breeders aren't even taking applications for their waiting lists. It's like the pre-covid experience of trying to find a restaurant table in NYC on Saturday night: your best bet is to get yourself on a reservation list. You may get lucky with a show kennel. They often hold back a puppy for their show program and then release it if the puppy grows too large. Check out the entry lists in your local poodle club shows to see who is actively showing these days. Rodell, in Connecticut, is a breeder I would check out.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Yes check with Rodell and be prepared to wait. I would stay away from Craigslist and similar routes to finding a good breeder.


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## EpicQuestPoodles (Apr 29, 2021)

Ethical and responsible Toy breeders are VERY hard to find. Toys and miniatures are becoming a hard sought after breed lately and it's important to find one from a responsible breeder, not a BYB or puppy mill. 

Honestly, one of the only breeders I really know/have heard about through my contacts/mentors is Barbara Hoopes from Silvabirch Poodles. But she has a EXTREMELY LONG Waitlist so be prepared. https://silvabirchpoodle.com/

I went and looked at the top ten for UKC to see if any of my friends had any toy poodles, I see one on the top ten with a Mabilo tag, but I think it's from a European kennel. However, then I found Veroette Toy Poodles Veroette Toy Poodles so I would look into them as well. (Please make sure they health test, I didn't do that much research myself). 

If you are willing to do miniatures, I have far more miniature contacts then toys and could point you in the direction of a few.


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

Hi and welcome!

I don't know your general dog experience or specific poodle or selecting a breeder experience so here's some tips, some things to consider, and some things to avoid.

We often hear from folks that they just want a pet. What doesn't seem to be common knowledge is that the kind of quality, conscientious breeders I, for one, prefer to support are _always_ breeding for the very best poodles they can. It isn't pet puppy vs show puppy, it's lucky us, the ones wanting a pet who get the pups that have some small "fault" that might reduce their chances of winning competitions, but are flawless to us .

About reviews, a happy owner doesn't necessarily mean an informed owner. It's as likely they've just been lucky, so far. Review any negative comments carefully, if they're allowed to appear.

Getting a puppy from a quality, conscientious breeder is something like insurance. Their investment in the health, welfare, and soundness of all the dogs in their care including the puppies they offer to new homes is part of the reason you're not likely to find a less than $2000 USD puppy from them.

The saying is "pay the breeder or pay the vet". Price alone isn't the only thing to separate quality breeders from those less than. We've seen members quote as high and even much higher pricing for pups from parents not health tested, not proven to meet breed standards, sold as purebred when only a DNA test could determine that since they may be sold without registration papers.

Health testing of the breeding parents is a good indicator of a quality, conscientious breeder. The Breeder List has info on what to look for in the testing for each variety. Mentioning health testing on a site is nice but isn't proof. For proof, look for health testing results spelled out on the breeder's site, then verify for yourself by going to the site the results are published on. If you don't find any evidence of testing or can't find the info but the breeder appeals to you, contact them and ask where you might see the testing they do. Reputable breeders put in a lot of effort to make sure they're breeding the healthiest poodles and will be happy to talk about it and provide the info.

Look for and verify OFA/CHIC level testing at a minimum. There are also poodle specific DNA panels for those testable conditions. Those are companion testing with the OFA/CHIC testing.
Look Up A Dog | Orthopedic Foundation for Animals | Columbia, MO (ofa.org)


A caution that a health "guarantee" on a puppy doesn't have much to back it if the sire and dam were not given the testing for breed and variety. "Guarantees" without the testing often favor the breeder, more than the buyer.

Read thru any contracts that may be listed. If they rule out coverage for conditions that the breeding pair should or could have been tested for, consider that a caution flag. Otherwise, are the terms clear to you and can you live with them?

Conscientious breeders have a waitlist at the best of times and with pandemic puppy seekers, that wait is stretched well into 2021-2022. There have been more than a few serendipitous contacts between seeker and breeder, so don't be put off by the thought of a waitlist. Also, don't be put off if online sites aren't particularly updated. As often as not, breeders may prefer communicating by phone as well as email or text, and are busy with their dogs rather than keep a website updated.

When you start making contacts, let them know if you're open to an older pup or young adult.
Color preferences are understandable but keep in mind that you're limiting your options even further in a very limited supply of puppies. That beautiful color you fell for may not look the same in a few weeks, or months, or years.

Temperament and personality are lifelong traits.

Be prepared to spend in the range of $2000 to $3500 USD. Conscientious breeders are not padding pricing due to Covid.

Be prepared to travel outside your preferred area.

As a very general rule, websites to be leery of are those that feature cutesy puppies with bows and such, little or no useful info on sires or dams, the word "Order" or "Ordering" (these are living beings, not appliances) and a PayPal or "pay here" button prominently featured "for your convenience".


An excellent source for breeder referrals is your local or the regional or national Poodle Club. An online search for "Poodle Club of *___* (your city or state)" will find them. You can also go directly to the national club site.

Some Poodle Club links are in the Breeder List.


As a sort of checklist of things to look for or ask, this is my short version personal criteria:

My criteria need not be yours but I think it's important for a potential poodle owner to understand why these things matter in finding a conscientious breeder and to get a well bred puppy to share life with for many years to come. Simply being advertised as "registered" or even "purebred" doesn't mean that a puppy is _well bred._


Every one of these is a talking point a conscientious breeder will welcome, just not all at the same time 

My ideal breeder is someone who is doing this because they love the breed.
They want to see each new generation born at least as good as the previous, ideally better.
They provide for every dog in their care as if that dog is their own.
They will be there for the new family, and stand behind that pup for it's lifetime, rain or shine, with or without a contract.
They will know the standards and pedigrees of their chosen breed, health and genetic diversity of their lines, and breed to better them.
They will know of the latest studies in health standards for their chosen breed and variety and do the health testing of their breeding dogs.
They prove their dogs meet breed standards and are physically capable by breeding from sires and dams proven in competition or participating in other activities.
They do not cross breed.
They will have as many questions for me as I do for them.
They invest in their dogs. They don't expect the dogs to support them.

Be extremely cautious of puppies sold thru pet stores, or online marketplaces like puppyspot, puppyfind, kijiji, craigslist, classified ads, etc. Many of these puppies will be mill puppies and while you may get lucky, the odds are against you and that sweet puppy. Finding a breeder in the AKC marketplace isn't an automatic guarantee of them being a quality breeder, but should, at a minimum, mean they are selling pups who may be registered with the AKC.

One additional caution, be very wary of those very cute short legged poodles. That's a genetic mutation which may carry serious life-altering disease.

This is a link to a Breeder List that I've been compiling from recommendations from PF members. With the recommendation, I then go to the breeders site and also to OFA to verify any health testing. 

*🐩 Breeders Listed by Location 🐩 Plus Additional Resources 🐩*
GEOGRAPHICAL BREEDERS LIST AND ADDITIONAL RESOURCES PLEASE READ THIS FIRST What this list is NOT: This list is not an endorsement of any breeder by Poodle Forum This list is not a list to just go buy from without doing more investigation This list is not comprehensive What this list IS: This...


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## nycas21 (Dec 24, 2020)

EpicQuestPoodles said:


> Ethical and responsible Toy breeders are VERY hard to find. Toys and miniatures are becoming a hard sought after breed lately and it's important to find one from a responsible breeder, not a BYB or puppy mill.
> 
> Honestly, one of the only breeders I really know/have heard about through my contacts/mentors is Barbara Hoopes from Silvabirch Poodles. But she has a EXTREMELY LONG Waitlist so be prepared. https://silvabirchpoodle.com/
> 
> ...


Any standards and miniature poodles breeders u recommend in the ny nj pa ct area?


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## Danie57 (May 24, 2021)

Wow thank you so much for your responses! I am new to this forum and I learned a lot reading your posts.
My sister has a toy poodle that she found from a breeder in Virginia about 12 years ago. He is still very healthy and love him so much and now I'm trying to find a pup for myself!
My sister doesn't remember the breeder's name so that was a bummer.


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## MarCee (Jun 12, 2021)

cowpony said:


> The demand for toy breed puppies had definitely outpaced the supply recently. It's not just poodles; I've noticed some Bichon breeders aren't even taking applications for their waiting lists. It's like the pre-covid experience of trying to find a restaurant table in NYC on Saturday night: your best bet is to get yourself on a reservation list. You may get lucky with a show kennel. They often hold back a puppy for their show program and then release it if the puppy grows too large. Check out the entry lists in your local poodle club shows to see who is actively showing these days. Rodell, in Connecticut, is a breeder I would check out.


Rodell responded to my message on FB but then went silent and ignored my flollow up messages. Not sure how this can be called responsible.


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## twyla (Apr 28, 2010)

Do you realize that breeders have real jobs, Rob for instance owns and runs a very busy dog grooming business. 
Because of the increase of pet ownership vets and groomers are swamped
Right now puppies from reputable breeders have long wait lists. 
My boy is a Rodell's pup.
I was very up front and concise about what I was looking for, health testing and all. 
I was second in line to get a 9 month old not long ago.
Right now it is hard to get alot of things because of high demand, but remember this is a living being and patience and persistence is essential.


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## MarCee (Jun 12, 2021)

twyla said:


> Do you realize that breeders have real jobs, Rob for instance owns and runs a very busy dog grooming business.
> Because of the increase of pet ownership vets and groomers are swamped
> Right now puppies from reputable breeders have long wait lists.
> My boy is a Rodell's pup.
> ...


Of course I realize that breeders as most of us do work. But is it normal not to reply after 1.5 months? This is what worries me given that there are so many scammers these days.
But I feel relieved that you did get a pup for Rodell! I will follow up a few times with them again. How long were you on their wait list? And if you don't mind, did you have to wait for 1.5 months until they replied to you? Maybe I am doing something wrong. But I did express clearly that I look for a healthy line with parental genetic testing and with good temperament. These are my only request. I am not picky about colors or gender or age, these are not important to me. Not sure what I am doing wrong.


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## twyla (Apr 28, 2010)

Truthfully I was never on a wait list because I am looking for an older puppy /adult. I have to respond quickly, call when requested and go visit at a specified time.
Plus FB messaging worked way better in getting a hold of Rodells.
My boy was 18 1/2 weeks old when I got him, he was a show fail as in too tall, the same with the second.
I wrote a message of exactly what I was looking for, same as you no specific color and sex but I also gave brief description how the dog would be spending its time. like I am home groomer, yep showed pics, also mentioned that I pretty much bring my dogs with me everywhere and even take them to work with me, and that I only do core vaccines, that I wanted a companion for me and play mates for my current poodles.

I am also following a rescue group Poodle Rescue of Connecticut because I want an older dog and they get no less than 50 to 100 applications lately per dog.


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

MarCee said:


> Rodell responded to my message on FB but then went silent and ignored my flollow up messages. Not sure how this can be called responsible.


Hi

I think some clarification is needed here.

When a breeder is referred to as "responsible", "ethical", "reputable", "conscientious", etc, it isn't communication skills being referred to.

It's all about their breeding practices and how they treat the dogs they have and breed.

Some breeders are great at keeping up communication, some are pretty lacking in that, and that's more than frustrating for the people, but it doesn't impact how they treat their dogs.

The reason that the focus is on the dogs is pretty simple. People can make choices. The dogs have very limited, if any, choices in what happens to them, Their health, their life and quality of life all depend on the breeder until they go to their new homes. This is why you want a breeder to be "picky" when choosing the new families.

It's not your situation, but we recently had a member who communicated with a (different) breeder and was told they were on a wait list. Communication was sparse, at best. Several months later the member was questioning here when they'd get notice of where they were with the breeder. Suddenly, the next post was a very excited note that their puppy was coming!

What method and how many communications between you and Rodell have there been and what was the status on your last communication? Were you two still just getting acquainted or had the talk gone to processes?


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

twyla said:


> I wrote a message of exactly what I was looking for, same as you no specific color and sex but I also gave brief description how the dog would be spending its time. like I am home groomer, yep showed pics, also mentioned that I pretty much bring my dogs with me everywhere and even take them to work with me, and that I only do core vaccines, that I wanted a companion for me and play mates for my current poodles.


Twyla makes a very important point here. 

In opening communications it helps to hit several high points. You want to describe why you're contacting this breeder, what you've heard about them or like about their dogs or their practices (proper health testing, showing, temperament, etc), what you want in a dog, and what you have to offer the dog. 

They work very hard to bring the best poodles to life and want to envision the life those pups will lead.


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## twyla (Apr 28, 2010)

Rose n Poos said:


> Twyla makes a very important point here.
> 
> In opening communications it helps to hit several high points. You want to describe why you're contacting this breeder, what you've heard about them or like about their dogs or their practices (proper health testing, showing, temperament, etc), what you want in a dog, and what you have to offer the dog.
> 
> They work very hard to bring the best poodles to life and want to envision the life those pups will lead.


Rose n Poos is right, it's kind of like a job interview and what you can bring to the table or in this case a poodle's life.


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

It's easy to fall into the idea of breeding being a "business" and all the expectations along with that. 

After all, it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, but in this case, and for those ethical, responsible, reputable, conscientious breeders it's_ not_ a duck. it's a calling (ok, little pun there). 

They feel obligated to the poodles in their care and to the poodle breed as a whole, to bring the very best poodles into the the world that they can. 

The closest quick analogy I can think of is the storied old country doctor. Profit was not why they went into medicine, desire to help people was.


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## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

MarCee said:


> Rodell responded to my message on FB but then went silent and ignored my flollow up messages. Not sure how this can be called responsible.


A bit late to the comments, but I agree with what others have said. Buying from a puppy mill or a pet shop is like buying from a used car salesman. They just want to move product. They won't mention or will brush off the bent frame and the corrosion around the electrical grounds. They act like your best friend until they have your money. Then, well, the problem isn't theirs any more. 

Buying from a good breeder is more like buying a '67 Corvette from an enthusiast at a car show. They are in the business because they like the showing and the tinkering, not because they love sales. You are buying the object of their affection, not a product. They put a lot of work into to that baby, and they want it to go to someone who loves it like they do.


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

cowpony said:


> Buying from a puppy mill or a pet shop is like buying from a used car salesman. They just want to move product. They won't mention or will brush off the bent frame and the corrosion around the electrical grounds. They act like your best friend until they have your money. Then, well, the problem isn't theirs any more.
> 
> Buying from a good breeder is more like buying a '67 Corvette from an enthusiast at a car show. They are in the business because they like the showing and the tinkering, not because they love sales. You are buying the object of their affection, not a product. They put a lot of work into to that baby, and they want it to go to someone who loves it like they do.


⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐

Best relatable analogy _ever _for capturing this! Hope you don't mind if I quote you in the future!


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## Danie57 (May 24, 2021)

Hello all, I'm still in search for my puppy. Unfortunately people that have replied to my messages said their waitlist was filled and others just have been hard to get in touch with. I've reached out to Rodell and still awaiting his response  I came across KCPoodlesofPA. does anyone here have experience with them?


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

Danie57 said:


> I came across KCPoodlesofPA. does anyone here have experience with them?


Take the time to read thru this short thread








Any experience with this breeder?


Does anyone have any experience with this breeder?: Cerberus Poodles or KC Poodles of PA?: KC POODLES OF PA The Cerberus website isn't very active, but they're active on Facebook. There isn't much or any information on health testing or registration on the parents. The breeder says that the...




www.poodleforum.com





and then this thread









Hello from PA


Hello. We are currently in the process of trying to add a new miniature or toy poodle to our family. Any advice on breeders in the tri-state area would be greatly appreciated. Has anyone ever had any experience with KC Poodles of PA, Light and Lively Poodles from Staten Island, or Eriand...




www.poodleforum.com


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Just because you are on a waitlist with a fantastic breeder, doesn’t necessarily mean an eternity. People drop off all the time, or they HAD to have a specific gender or color. I would stay happily on a Rodell list... Craigslist is a hard, had pass! You will get a lovely puppy if you’re patient and stick with name brands.


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

Danie57 said:


> Hello all, I'm still in search for my puppy. Unfortunately people that have replied to my messages said their waitlist was filled and others just have been hard to get in touch with. I've reached out to Rodell and still awaiting his response


If you want a well bred puppy you're going to need to do two things.

Expand your geographic search to open your choices of quality breeders and then accept and understand that it's possible but very rare to happen to find the right breeder for you who also has unspoken for puppies on the ground at the time you make contact.
Expect to be on a waitlist for a while.

Have you contacted the local or regional Poodle Clubs for breeder referrals? 

Just for curiosity, would you consider copying one or two of your initial contact notes?

Maybe we can advise something to get these breeders to respond better.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Rose n Poos said:


> Just for curiosity, would you consider copying one or two of your initial contact notes?


I was going to suggest the same thing. Want to make sure you’re starting off on the right foot.


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

Another way to expand your search is to consider a miniature.

I love a toy but there are some additional physical hazards related to their smaller size that are less of an issue with the miniatures.


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## Streetcar (Apr 13, 2014)

Yes... IMHO, CL can be good if you are doing a private re-home from one to another of an adult pet. It can also work for finding a rescue pet, if careful, just not to buy a puppy or kitten.

My Oliver was a CL re-home. We met at a BART station. Never visit a stranger's home.

It's better to go with a planned, well-bred puppy from a responsible breeder or to get a Poodle from one of the known Poodle rescues.


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