# Looking for any info on Fort Frances (Ontario) toy poodle breeder



## Tessa's Dad (Jul 20, 2011)

We found an ad for Toy Poodles in Fort Frances, Ontario.

We used the contact link and spoke on the phone with the breeder. 

You know the saying: "If something seems too good to be true...."??

The prices discussed seem inordinately low and they include shipping. (At least within Canada)

This is good because it's an 1,850 KM drive - each way - between me and Fort Frances. Not exactly a day trip. 

So that "If something seems too good to be true" is kicking in for me. 

Has anyone here bought a puppy from this place or knows someone who did?






About | Toy Poodle CA







toypackpoodle.wixsite.com





Says he's been breeding Toy's for 18 years. Says everything you can think of except who they are. 
Seems it may have also been called "Home Love Poodle Puppies" based on two of their Testimonials.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

I didn't even dig beyond the first page, and the website suddenly switches to talking about bully breed puppies:










So I did a Google search for a random chunk of text from the website ("a Hall of Fame Breeder, Breeder of Merit and bred the Breed winner , Best of opposite winner") which took me to a website for French bulldogs that has been suspended:











Everything about this screams SCAM to me. Proceed with extreme caution.

What is the breeder's name? Not the kennel name, which seems to change often, but his actual name. Have you googled it?


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

I copied and pasted more text from the website into google and got more exact matches:






SHIPPING – Energetic Pitbull Home







energeticpitbull.com







chensiberianhuskypups.site


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Lastly, I copied and pasted some of the testimonial text. The results speak for themselves:











Good for you for trusting your gut and doing your homework. I'm so sad that websites like this exist. I can't imagine how many hearts they break and bank accounts they empty. I only hope real animals aren't involved.


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

As soon as I read this « The Home Love Poodles Kennel is a proud member of the Teacup Poodle Group » I knew it wasn’t a serious, ethical breeder. No poodle show breeder would use the word « Teacup « and even less be a member of a group with that name...

I think PTP has shown without a doubt it’s a scam. At least you walked away.


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## Tessa's Dad (Jul 20, 2011)

The ad was on one of the many "puppy finder" type of sites. None of them seem to have the ability to report scams like the larger "marketplace" type sites, such as Kijiji, Craig's List, etc. 

PTP I think nailed it with the "exact text" searches on Google. (I'm not sure why I didn't try that too but I wanted the question here on PF just in case anyone else might get burned by it.) and especially with the text comparisons on the shipping.because there are grammatical/repetitive bits that I didn't/don't think more than one person would come up with. IE:



> SHIPPING
> Your Siberian Husky puppy *travels in a climate controlled cabin area for pets*. He/she *travels in a climate controlled cabin area for pets*, in an airline approved carrier. Ahead of time...
> www.chensiberianhuskypups.site


 Lots of people might repeat something and you'll see it on ONE site or ad. But when it shows up on multiple sites for different breeds of dogs, word for word?

It's sad because right now with all the problems with Covid-19, puppy prices have gone insane on Kijiji (Canada) and litters are selling out in days even at those prices. 

On Kijiji there are as many ads for people wanting puppies (for $500 to $1000) when they are selling for up to $5000 (insanity IMO). These people are setting themselves up to be targets of scammers. 

PTP: I went with your idea of searching an exact match on Google for: *"puppy travels in a climate controlled cabin area for pets. He/she travels in a climate controlled cabin area for pets, in an airline approved carrier."*



"puppy travels in a climate controlled cabin area for pets. He/she travels in a climate controlled cabin area for pets, in an airline approved carrier." - Google Search



This gets 77 results on Google Canada with exact matches. Husky Pups. French Bulldog Pups. Siberian Husky pups. "Teacup Yorkie" pups. Etc. Etc. 



https://brianteacupyorkies.com/available-yorkies.php










Teacup Yorkies, $500 US, Registered, Free Shipping.....
I'm pretty sure this price says it's COSTING them to sell every dog. 
I know what shipping costs. It's not cheap. 

More on "Brians" site - "Shipping" Tab.....








Now the shipping page on "Toy Pack Poodles":Three paragraphs worded identical except for the work "yorkie" or "poodle".








Pretty much removes any doubt.

​


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

The clincher for me was the testimonial text, repeated across multiple websites, for different breeds (and even species!) with names changed. I'd laugh if it weren't so awful.

Have you tried reaching out directly to reputable breeders? Especially with the increased demand for puppies due to covid, I'd probably skip the classifieds altogether.


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## Tessa's Dad (Jul 20, 2011)

List of sites to avoid as they all have the same "Shipping" page, and impossibly low prices for registered dogs, including shipping, vet checks and shots.. 









Siberian Husky Puppies For Sale Near Me


Siberian husky puppies for sale,PureBred Husky Puppies For Sale With One Year Health Guarantee. Contact Us Today.




www.starhuskypuppieshouse.net









Shpipping Policy | French Bulldog Pups







www.thecuteamazingzone.com




https://teacuppoodlepuppieshome.com/shipping.php (They forgot to change "boxer" to "poodle" in one place on the shipping page.


https://heatherteacupyorkiehome.com/shipping.php




https://healthygreatdanepups.com/







Terry T-cup Pom Puppies – Buy your poms on discount prices now!!







terrytcuppompups.com






https://www.prolificpupdachshund.com/




https://crestviewboxerpuppies.com/home/










poodle puppies for sale


poodle puppies for sale, poodle puppies, toy poodle for sale, poodles for sale, toy poodle puppies, teacup poodle for sale, standard poodle puppies, miniature




www.slayingpuphome.com












poodle puppies for sale


poodle puppies for sale, poodle puppies, toy poodle for sale, poodles for sale, toy poodle puppies, teacup poodle for sale, standard poodle puppies, miniature




www.slayingpuphome.com






https://tylersboxerhub.com/shipping.php







Shipping







pomeranianpuppiesnearme.com









Shipping & Delivery -Sunshine Shih Tzu Puppies


Your Shih Tzu puppy travels in a climate controlled cabin area for pets. He/she travels in a climate controlled cabin area for pets, in an airline approved carrier.




sunshineshihtzupuppies.com









furbabiespetsstore.com -&nbspfurbabiespetsstore Resources and Information.


furbabiespetsstore.com is your first and best source for all of the information you’re looking for. From general topics to more of what you would expect to find here, furbabiespetsstore.com has it all. We hope you find what you are searching for!




furbabiespetsstore.com






chensiberianhuskypups.site




https://www.andybeaglepuppies.com/delivery.php




https://www.luxorpartypomeranianpups.com/shipping.php







Guarantee & Shipping – Precious Beagle Puppies







preciousbeaglepuppies.com






https://www.marksondaschshundpuppyhome.com/shipping/




Maltipoopupsforsale.com




https://justinsgoldenretrievers.com/delivery.php




Sweetestpetshome.com







Shipping & Delivery - Marvel Shih Tzu Puppies


Your Shih Tzu puppy travels in a climate controlled cabin area for pets. He/she travels in a climate controlled cabin area for pets, in an airline approved carrier.




marvelshihtzupuppies.com






https://teacuppoodlepuppieshome.com/




https://blueraypuppies.com/shipping/







akcfriendlyhuskypups.com -&nbspakcfriendlyhuskypups Resources and Information.


akcfriendlyhuskypups.com is your first and best source for all of the information you’re looking for. From general topics to more of what you would expect to find here, akcfriendlyhuskypups.com has it all. We hope you find what you are searching for!




akcfriendlyhuskypups.com






https://pomeranianpuppiesnearme.com/



To be honest, this looks like organized crime if they are all connected in some way.


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## Tessa's Dad (Jul 20, 2011)

PeggyTheParti said:


> The clincher for me was the testimonial text, repeated across multiple websites, for different breeds (and even species!) with names changed. I'd laugh if it weren't so awful.
> 
> Have you tried reaching out directly to reputable breeders? Especially with the increased demand for puppies due to covid, I'd probably skip the classifieds altogether.


I was looking for a friend who wants a Toy Poodle. I only have fairly large Standards so it doesn't help him out. 

There are so many scam artists out there right now trying to take advantage of people. 


But this looks like more than just "a" scam artist. Not to mention the common wording you found in testamonials of different breeds, the number of sites with that identically worded shipping page, coupled with insane prices that always seem to include shipping (so you'll never actually get to meet the breeder or see where they are really located) will look very inviting to people on a tight budget that really want a dog. 

BTW, I looked to see if that might be a "boilerplate" shipping page on sites that offer website templates that include dogs/pets/breeders. I didn't find anything like what's on these sites.


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## For Want of Poodle (Feb 25, 2019)

Unfortunately these duplicate sites like these are really common. 
Here's a recent CBC article about one woman running one such scam 


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundland-labrador/nl-brittany-osborne-more-charges-sept-1.5741763


I recommend looking at the poodle club of Canada, Poodle Club of Ontario, and Ottawa Valley Poodle club. There's a great post in the breeder directory put together by one of our members with many reputable looking breeders listed.


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## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

Hi 

I hope you don't mind if I drop my personal criteria for selecting a breeder in case you're looking now. 


My criteria need not be yours but I think it's important for a potential poodle owner to understand why these criteria are important in choosing a conscientious breeder and to get a well bred puppy to share life with for many years to come.
Every one of these is a talking point a conscientious breeder will welcome, just not all at the same time 


My ideal breeder is someone who is doing this because they love the breed.
They want to see each new generation born at least as good as the previous, ideally better.
They provide for every dog in their care as if that dog is their own.
They will be there for the new family, and stand behind that pup for it's lifetime, rain or shine, with or without a contract.
They will know the standards and pedigrees of their chosen breed, health and genetic diversity of their lines, and breed to better them.
They will know of the latest studies in health standards for their chosen breed and variety and do the health testing of their breeding dogs.
They will have as many questions for me as I do for them.
They invest in their dogs. They don't expect the dogs to support them.

Breeding Program
! to maintain, improve, strengthen the breed
by breeding to standard, for health and genetic diversity,
and will prove their dogs meet these standards by showing or competing
or by breeding from titled parents. It's not the title, but what it shows
! focus is on quality, never quantity
! they do not cross breed
! they limit breeding to one to two breeds
! they limit breeding to only a few litters per year *

Breeding Parents
! registry information available
AKC Registry Lookup
https://www.apps.akc.org/apps/store/search/dog_lookup.cfm?returnpage=undefined&_=2770 
! not too old or young for breeding
! not overbred
see https://www.poodleforum.com/threads/asking-questions-from-a-breeder.273579/post-3294246 
and https://www.poodleforum.com/threads/frequency-of-breeding-a-bitch.20388/ 
! genetic health testing done appropriate to breed and variety
! other health testing by exam such as annual eye, hips, patellas
! results of testing on own website, OFA site or testing lab
see http://vipoodle.org/health/health-related-publications/ 
and OFA Lookup Look Up A Dog | Orthopedic Foundation for Animals | Columbia, MO

Living Conditions
! in home with family
! breeder allows, even encourages home visits

Puppies
! routine and urgent vet care, immunizations, dewormings
! socialization
! first groomings
! registry papers
! they will not require spay/neuter before physical maturity
! health "guarantee" generally favors the breeder, not the buyer.
health guarantee is no replacement for health testing of dam and sire.
does the contract/guarantee/warranty rule out covering conditions the parents should have been tested for
do you fully understand the terms of any contract/guarantee/warranty and can you live with them
beginning housetraining is a bonus
temperament testing is helpful

Advertising
! individual website to detail history of breeder, goals for their program
! information on dams, sires, puppies
! no trend pricing for color, gender or size,
! no marketing gimmick terms like "teacup" "royal"


! Anything not found on a public online site should be provided by breeder before buying.

* Many people prefer small scale breeders because they feel the puppies will have better socialization and it's very unlikely to be a puppy mill-like operation.
This doesn't mean that larger scale breeders can't do things right. The breeder of record may not be hands on with every pup or poodle on the place but they should make sure that all the quality of life and attention are paid to all their dogs.

If a breeder wants me to believe that they believe in their dogs, they won't stop the investment when it comes time to find the new families. If they want to cut costs by using free advertising sites like craigslist or listing on retail marketplaces like puppyspot or puppyfind, or other classified ad sites such as newspapers, I wonder what else they've cut costs on.

Contact a few breeders to introduce yourself. Even if they don't have or don't offer what you're looking for, it can be a close knit community. They may know where to refer you.


If you are looking, and you look thru the Breeder Llist, review the Health information (great strides there in the science), then don't skip the multi state listings, and particularly don't skip the Poodle Club of America Breeder Referral for your region (or search "Poodle Club of ___"). 

Conscientious breeders have a waitlist at the best of times and with pandemic puppy seekers, that wait is stretched well into 2021. There have been more than a few serendipitous contacts between seeker and breeder, so don't be put off by the thought of a waitlist. Also, don't be put off if online sites aren't particularly updated. 

Be prepared to spend in the range of $1500 to up to $3000 at the top end. Conscientious breeders are not padding pricing due to Covid.


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## Brownie_mom (Dec 1, 2020)

When I started looking for a poodle first I was looking at the toy. Then decided to go to mini (toys looked to small for us). While searching for toys I came across a breeder in Florida that I really liked. I was at her home and liked what I saw. I know it is way too far from Ontario and I do not know if she ships her puppies. Cypress Toy Poodles Home 
Good luck with your search.


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