# Beginning Agility



## LizzysMom (Sep 27, 2016)

Oops, also meant to ask about the closed tunnel, or chute. I was looking into making something to practice this, when I came across information that the AKC had eliminated it from their list of approved obstacles last year. However, when I read the regulations dated April, 2017, it's still listed. Can anyone clarify this for me? Also, I know there are agility organizations other than AKC - do they still use the closed tunnel? 

I found a video someone posted on youtube that was a very forceful argument for the closed tunnels elimination. After watching this video, I really don't want to train Lizzy on it. If it IS still part of most trials, I may be doing agility in my backyard for fun only!


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## galofpink (Mar 14, 2017)

So exciting that you are rocking the agility course so far. No guidance for you since I am no where even close to how far along you are, but enjoy the ride. Hopefully class will pick up for you next week!


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Kudos for all the preparation you've done - and clearly it has paid off.

I don't think any venues are using the chute anymore - I know AKC (suspended it's use), CPE, USDAA and Teacup has stopped using it. I don't know about United Kennel Club, they may still use it. We don't have UKC near me so I'm unsure of their requirements.Ask your instructors - where I live all the agility competitions do not use it. 

It's great that you're off to a good start. Where I train, they do not want the dogs on any apparatus except when the trainer is watching and teaching you that apparatus. This is a safety issue, they want to make certain that you and your dog are using the apparatus appropriately. For example, with jumps you want the dog jumping with it's head down, not just any old way they get over the jump. In addition, it's important that your dog doesn't learn to zoom in class, so you want to keep control and follow the instructors instructions rather than be too independent at the beginning. While waiting for your turn work on getting attention, or sit, down or stays. Or watch the other dog and handler - you might learn something from their mistakes.

What you will find is most of the learning is not actually teaching your dog the apparatus, but the handling - moving your dog in the correct pattern in the as quickly as possible and as accurately as possible from one apparatus to the next. It's amazing how your dog will watch your body language and very subtle movements could mean your dog went into the tunnel (oops) instead of the dog walk immediately next to it.


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

No more chute in AKC. It was a fun obstacle to watch, but tangles in the fabric and its labor intensive nature on the volunteers make it quite easy to say goodbye to it.

How long to be competitive depends greatly on you, your dog, and your goals. The dog must be at least 15 months old to even enter in AKC, so there's that. Some dogs are "ready" but green by then, enough so that their trainers are ready to give it a shot. This might only be a matter of months. Some enter FAST (a class which allows you to choose your course, so you can skip obstacles you're not ready for or practice others) as a test. Other trainers want their dog to be proficient in Excellent level challenges before even entering Novice. This could well take over a year!

Weave poles are usually the obstacle that really serves as the marker for being "ready" (given that the dog's attitude, etc. are okay, of course). It can take many months for a dog to be really proficient at weaving. While in Novice refusals and runbys at the weaves aren't counted, in Open one refusal is all you get, and if you "spend" it on the weaves, you aren't going to have much leeway elsewhere in the course. Then in Excellent no errors are allowed, so by that time your weaves need to be on point.

Sounds like your first class was fun, and the equipment you're getting at home will definitely help with her progress. Enjoy the ride!

--Q


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## Johanna (Jun 21, 2017)

Zoe is in a basic obedience class - mainly to solidify "come" and to learn sit and down stays.

My question to you agility experts is: what if I begin training weave poles (I have a set) now? She is 10 months old and I could work her on leash and with treats on a six-pole weave with the attachments that keep her in the pattern.

She has absolutely no problem with wobbly surfaces. My teeter-totter was in the back yard at one time and she loved to bang it down! I took the teeter out of the yard and stored it in the barn for now because I did not want her to get the idea she could bail off it at any point.

I do have some jumps I can set up. may have to re-drill the uprights since my last agility dog was a standard poodle so I may not have drilled holes at lower heights. My idea about jumping is to set up jumps at 4 inches since she is too young to be jumping full height.

I also have a tunnel that she loves, but it's not set up - I just bring it out from time to time and throw a ball through it. I could certainly start teaching the command "tunnel".

What do you think?


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## scooterscout99 (Dec 3, 2015)

Skylar said:


> What you will find is most of the learning is not actually teaching your dog the apparatus, but the handling - moving your dog in the correct pattern in the as quickly as possible and as accurately as possible from one apparatus to the next. It's amazing how your dog will watch your body language and very subtle movements could mean your dog went into the tunnel (oops) instead of the dog walk immediately next to it.


Ditto what Skylar said. Some of the top national/international handlers (who hold seminars in my area) spend the first nearly 2 years of their dogs’ lives with handling skills, body awareness, attention. The contacts are taught just before they are planning to go to trial, o/a 2 years.

It has been quite the adventure for me transitioning from a mellow beagle-X to an energetic and driven spoo. I am still challenged at the subtleties of the signals that he requires to navigate the course. With the exception of weave poles, which are still a work in progress, he conquered all other obstacles easily. But navigating the course error free is a much greater task. He has a solid start line stay from basic obedience in the living room, which is also where he learned a contact pause . . no contacts required to teach that indoors, just a raised surface.

Susan Garrett wrote about fun exercises that can be done with little to no equipment while waiting for your dog to grow.

While Waiting Until He Grows Up . . . | Susan Garrett's Dog Training Blog

The most beneficial tool for me has been access to a training building and finding a group of like-minded handlers to train with. We help each other out and it is easier to set the equipment up! For those with their own gear, perhaps you could host an agility practice group.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I am glad you had such a nice first class and that the class is small enough for you to get good instruction. I think most of your questions have been answered by others, but will say that it took Lily quite a while to really get good at agility and for me to get good at handling. She understood all of the obstacles, but getting her from place to place was hard. Don't worry that you didn't do all of the equipment (especially the teeter) the first night. You have to be careful to teach it and the dog walk safely.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Johanna said:


> Zoe is in a basic obedience class - mainly to solidify "come" and to learn sit and down stays.
> 
> My question to you agility experts is: what if I begin training weave poles (I have a set) now? She is 10 months old and I could work her on leash and with treats on a six-pole weave with the attachments that keep her in the pattern.
> 
> ...


where I train they don’t want dogs jumping till they are a year or the are fully grown so as to not stress joints. They have the dogs walk through with either the pole on the ground or near enough to the ground that the dog walks over the pole. Similar with weave poles - not too early. With the 2x2 method they start that with a young dog but don’t start moving the angles where the dog has to twist it’s body until the dog has matured. 

I used the 2x2 method and I never needed to use the attachments on the weave poles. My dog barrels through the poles as close to the poles as possible naturally. I do see some people using them, and I’m glad I didn’t need them because I don’t think my dog would love weave poles as much.


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## Johanna (Jun 21, 2017)

Thanks, Skylar. Our obedience club also is very strong on no jumping until the dog is fully grown. I wish I could convince Zoe on that subject! She leaps off furniture with wild abandon!

I was thinking that weave poles are OK for a mini poo much earlier than for a large dog simply because they do not have to bend so much.

I need to learn the 2x2 method - I've heard so many good things about it.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

My at home weave poles are channel weaves so I started getting dogs moving between the poles without having to wiggle through. As they got better and musculoskeletally mature we closed the channels. I also have taught jumping behaviors with the bars on the ground then just at 4 or 8 inches. Both my spoos are 24" jumpers for agility although Lily jumps 22 for obedience.


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Johanna said:


> Thanks, Skylar. Our obedience club also is very strong on no jumping until the dog is fully grown. I wish I could convince Zoe on that subject! She leaps off furniture with wild abandon!
> 
> I was thinking that weave poles are OK for a mini poo much earlier than for a large dog simply because they do not have to bend so much.
> 
> I need to learn the 2x2 method - I've heard so many good things about it.


The jumping up and down on furniture with wild abandon is healthy and natural - when she wants to jump she can and when she is tired, she will stop. The problem is with training and repetitive motion - they want you to avoid that until your dog's bone structure is fully mature.


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## Mysticrealm (Jan 31, 2016)

It really depends on the dog when they're ready to compete.
When my mini was 2 I took about 5 (single) classes on agility. We didn't take any more agility classes till he was 11. We took maybe 2 full rounds of classes (about 4 months worth of once a week) and started competing and he got qualifying rounds in beginner category at NADAC the first weekend (only competed one day). Titles by the second weekend (again only competing one day) and by his 3rd weekend he had an title at a more advanced level.
This video is from our first weekend ever competing 





My pom started agility when he was a little over a year old. And with him as well, we did about 2 full rounds of classes and started competing. He has done 2 weekends (one day each only) and has beginner titles.
This was at his first agility competition





My standard poodle? We've taken probably 6 full rounds of agility (one 'pre agility') and he's no where NEAR ready to compete. If I were to compete with him he'd be the dog just doing zoomies around the ring. It's going to be a WHILE before we step foot in the ring and even then I think it will take a while to get him somewhat consistent.
This is one of our better rounds from our last agility class. And this is in a very 'known' environment with virtually no distractions.





It also depends on if the dog finds the act of agility self rewarding. If they do it cause they want to obey, but don't find the actual act rewarding you have to build that into them and do a lot more rewarding on course. So you don't want to be trying to do full courses with no food/toy reward at a competition until they learn to have a desire to do it. If you have a dog that finds doing it it's own rewarding you can move it a bit faster.
My mini likes it, but also has a STRONG desire to please me. My pom finds competing to be self rewarding (he actually is more motivated while competing than he often is training). My standard's desire comes and goes. Sometimes he seems to think it's super fun and awesome (which can be a struggle itself due to the high energy output). and sometimes he's a bit 'meh' and needs additional rewarding.


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## LizzysMom (Sep 27, 2016)

Thanks for the responses. I'm glad to know that the chute is not going to be an issue for us. I can't find that video I saw to share it, but it was definitely scary to watch!

And, I do realize I'm getting a little ahead of myself. It just took me so long to find a class that worked for my schedule, I can't wait to find out if Lizzy is going to do as well at agility as my DH and I have always thought she would.  But, even so, I wouldn't have sent her through that tunnel if we hadn't already done a little tunnel work with the other trainer (I don't think). I know there's a lot to be learned from watching the other dogs work, but we were specifically told to move around (walking through the jumps), so I wasn't really given the option of doing that. 

MysticRealm, I'm happy to learn that some dogs appear to be ready to compete without too much training time. I realize that may not be the case for Lizzy (or, more likely, for ME!), but I'm glad to know it can be done. I've been reading a YEARS old agility thread on here, and realize that this could turn into a VERY expensive hobby. I'll have to decide if my disposable income is best spent this way long term. (I have 3 grandchildren, and more on the way, and hate to think I'd have to shortchange them in order to finance Lizzy's career. ;P )

Which leads me to another question...this training facility offers a membership once you've been trained to use the equipment safely. Members can come in and use the facility anytime there is not a class or an event going on. Is it possible to train to a somewhat competitive level withOUT going through formal training classes? There's an awful lot of instructional videos on-line.


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

I did 2x2 weaves all the way. Here's a very short video of the learning process:






Obviously this was long ago, but to this day Sugarfoot's weaves are really nice.

If you go this route, get the video, go step by step, and be sure to do all the variations from all the angles. This method is all about hitting that entrance and weaving until there are no more poles!

--Q


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## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

LizzysMom said:


> I've been reading a YEARS old agility thread on here, and realize that this could turn into a VERY expensive hobby. I'll have to decide if my disposable income is best spent this way long term. (I have 3 grandchildren, and more on the way, and hate to think I'd have to shortchange them in order to finance Lizzy's career. ;P )
> 
> Which leads me to another question...this training facility offers a membership once you've been trained to use the equipment safely. Members can come in and use the facility anytime there is not a class or an event going on. Is it possible to train to a somewhat competitive level withOUT going through formal training classes? There's an awful lot of instructional videos on-line.


it can be very expensive especially if you are driven to compete at the highest levels. I’m not driven to this, for me it’s fun and I know my dog loves it. 

I don’t think you can train completely from videos but they can help. I do believe you need the basic level classes to get started. Maybe you don’t need to keep taking the advanced handling classes once you know enough flatwork to move your dog around the ring. I’m a member of my 2 clubs so the fees are half price and all teachers are volunteers so the money goes towards maintaining the building, facilities and activities. 

OTOH some of this money may be well spent keeping grandma healthy and mentally active. It’s not the only way, but it gets you up and out of the house meeting new people, going places. You’re moving with your dog while having to solve the puzzle of how best to move your body around the course so you move your dog efficiently and effectively around the course. A happy, fit, healthy grandma is a side benefit. 

And sometimes grandkids need time and love spent with them, going to the park or a weekly trip to the library or exploring a nearby nature area in the different seasons etc. You know the situation best so you are the best one to decide if this makes sense for you.


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