# RMBs and Poodle with few teeth...



## Rowan (May 27, 2011)

My new addition Merlin (who will be 6 on August 6th) lost most of his teeth during his recent dental. (His former owner said he was on a raw diet and had eaten chicken necks the morning I picked him up. The little guy had Grade 4 periodontal disease--a mouthful of rotting teeth--so I'm not sure how he managed to eat anything, much less something with bones in it.) 

He was obviously in a lot of pain when I got him home. I could tell by watching him eat (I feed mostly cooked meats, rare meats and pulvreized veggie mix w/EFAs, probiotics, etc.). 

Thankfully, he saw the vet 2 days later for a pre-surgical screen and then had surgery a week later. He's feeling a lot better but as for teeth, he now has:

-- all 4 canines
-- half the incisors on top and bottom
-- 3 premolars on the bottom

Basically, he has no premolars or molars on the top, and few on the bottom. 

Can Merlin eat chicken necks and wings safely, or am I better off with one of the pulverized products, or just sticking to his current regimen (which he LOVES)??

Thanks!


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## Rowan (May 27, 2011)

Anyone? Bueller? 

**crickets** 

Thankfully I got a response on another forum--I plan to keep him on the current regimen as he's doing quite well. 

I was just thinking the chicken necks--with their small, softer bones--or possibly the wing tips (or whatever you call the end portion of a wing) might be okay for him (for the raw benefits, ie., enzymes, etc.). And because he loves to chew on things. 

So if anyone else encounters the same problem with a toothless or near-toothless rescue--please let me know. For now, my nearly-toothless silver boy will enjoy cooked meats and pulverized veg/fruit mix.


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## Olie (Oct 10, 2009)

Sorry I missed this post 

I would try the chicken necks and watch to see how it goes. They tend to chew with the sides and back teeth. I noticed my dogs pick a side it seems they like to chew most with. So where the most teeth are would be where he would likely go to especially eat a chicken neck .

I would personally give it a go and see how it goes but I personally have had no experience with what you have.


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## Rowan (May 27, 2011)

Thank you, Olie! 
The good thing is -- if only feed him the necks in the evening, I can watch him carefully.


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## Rowan (May 27, 2011)

I'm resurrecting this in hopes of gaining more insight. 

To correct my initial post: he has all four canines, two incisors, one premolar on right side of the lower jaw, and one premolar plus one molar on left side of lower jaw. 

I think his seasonal allergy / skin issues might be due to the diet change he experienced when moving to VA in July, so I want to try him back on a raw-based diet. But his lack of teeth presents a problem (and makes me really nervous).

Could I at least give him chicken and/or turkey necks if I chopped them up into 1/2" to 1" cubes, so he didn't have to do much chewing? I'd essentially be doing the chomping for him, and as he has so few teeth (which I brush), it's not a big deal he'll miss out on the dental benefits. I'm thinking he can also have some other boneless meats raw, but I don't want to end up with runny stools due to a lack of bone. 

I've tried the Primal Raw nuggets, but they're just not the same.


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## Rowan (May 27, 2011)

Never mind. 
I cut up the chicken neck and he was fine. 

Over and out.


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## CT Girl (Nov 17, 2010)

Sorry you did not get more of a response. I did not see it and I really don't know. I am glad you had success cutting up the chicken neck. As long as he does not gulp his food down it may be OK to give him larger pieces too. I think chicken and turkey necks probably are the best choice for him. I do know some commercial raw puts bones through a grinder so that would help stool. Poor guy - I can only imagine how much pain he was in with so many rotten teeth. Rowan you are truly his angel.


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

I just now saw this one, too. I had the same situation with my elderly Borzoi. Despite being on a raw diet most of her life, she developed bad teeth in her golden years and had to have several of them removed. After that, she still liked RMB,s, but struggled eating them. We went to Honest Kitchen (Embark) with her, and would put sliced up chicken breast or, at most, cut-up necks. These bits she could pick out of the soup and swallow whole, pretty much. She ate enthusiastically until the day she died.

Now, my oldest dog is The Dog Formerly Known as The Younger Borzoi. She, too, has bad teeth now (not as bad as Moxie's were, interestingly), and could stand to have a couple of them removed, though heart issues and extreme reactions to the anesthetic have kept that from happening. We have now switched her to the same regimen: Honest Kitchen with cut up chunks of RMB's (and joint supplements!). She eats very well; much better than she had before we switched, even.

Do I think it's as good for her as the prey model RMB's the other dogs eat? No. But heck, she's a 12 and a half year old Borzoi still in very good health, so we're happy to feed her whatever her murmuring little heart desires!

--Q


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## Rowan (May 27, 2011)

Thank you, CT Girl and Quossom. I appreciate the input because feeding raw is 'scary' enough when a dog has teeth. When they only have a few, it can be downright terrifying as I'm afraid he'll try and do what he's used to doing and that's a "crunch, crunch, swallow."

I set a couple of chicken necks out again today to take the refrigerator chill off while I watched GRIMM. Merlin pestered me the entire time. When I stood up, he bounced around, and after we made our way upstairs, he was doing that cartoon running back and forth on the hardwood floor. 

It breaks my heart as he loves his raw and just can't eat like he used to. So I cut up his chicken neck and threw in a bit of liver (etc.) and let him have it. I've never seen such a happy poodle. 

He loves his cooked food too but he goes bonkers when he knows there's raw meat on the counter. 

I think we just might be able to make this work! A modified raw diet. Thanks again!!!


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## Quossum (Mar 18, 2011)

We just watched the first three eps of Grimm on On Demand. Looks like it will be a fun series and I already have a soft spot for the Big Bad. =}

Oh, and even modified raw is better than no raw at all!

--Q


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## CT Girl (Nov 17, 2010)

Looks like we are all Grimm fans. I hope the modified raw does work for you. It is great seeing them get so much enjoyment from their food.


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## Rowan (May 27, 2011)

I love Grimm!  The big bad is a scene-stealer. (I love his one-liners.)

I think we need to start a TV show thread. I love all the supernatural / fantasy shows (Game of Thrones, True Blood, The Vampire Diaries, Secret Circle, Grimm, Once Upon a Time...and I loved Buffy:TVS, Moonlight, Hex, Blood Ties, and Charmed).

As for OP: I just felt like I was cheating Merlin because he knew when Alex had a chicken neck or a RMB. He _loves _his food. I think he likes Grimm too. LOL


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## Syl (Oct 24, 2017)

Thanks for this, my adopted 10yo Sammy had all of his teeth out on Friday and we are suddenly seeing him eating kibble instead of just the canned food. Yay! 

But I'm looking for food information and it's tough... he's capable of eating hard stuff now but I'm not sure how much is just chew chew, swallow mostly whole...

And I don't even know what healthy dog diets look like! Commercial foods have so much filler in with the meat... should it be mostly meat? In just a few weeks I have already noticed that the 99% meat canned food states much smaller volumes of feeding compared to the "meat and veggies filler". 

There's information online that feeding raw will damage your dog's health, etc. and then the information promoting raw! At this point we don't need to feed food that keeps the teeth healthy... but I'd like to feed him well anyway!!


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## kontiki (Apr 6, 2013)

I am quite sure that any information saying eating raw is unhealthy originates with kibble companies, or vets that were trained by them. I don't believe a word of it as my Spoo almost died from kibble. He has done super ever since i switched him to raw about 5 years ago. 

And he often doesn't chew his raw well at all, even if it has bones in it. I think his digestive system takes care of it. So teeth aren't the most important thing in my opinion.


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## kontiki (Apr 6, 2013)

I am apparently out of the loop. I do not have a TV. What is the GRIMM that folks are talking about? Is there a link that I can see episodes from my laptop? Feeling a bit like a dinosaur...


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## MollyMuiMa (Oct 13, 2012)

It's a TV series that when it first started was based on Grimm's Fairytails with the characters living in the present.........I watched the 1st season, but then the storyline just got way too convoluted for me... I want to watch and enjoy a story, and not have to 'think' when watching it! LOL! I'm at the 'Keep It Simple' stage of life Hahaha!!!

I think Amazon Prime has it............


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## kontiki (Apr 6, 2013)

I am trying to figure out the relation between Grimm and poodles. Somehow I must not be well enough educated to understand the relationship.


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## MollyMuiMa (Oct 13, 2012)

Hahaha! I see none unless they were somehow connecting "the big bad" to the raw meat thing......'Big Bad' is the 'good' bad wolf in the series............


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## snow0160 (Sep 20, 2016)

I’m loving raw but seeing them break up and hearing the flesh tearing off the bones creeped me out and they were once wild animals. Here is little happy with his chicken feet. It reminded me of a scene out of Gerald’s Game. That is some crazy expensive grass fed organic chicken feet lol. I finally found use for chicken feet... @5.99 per lb mmm chicken feet










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