# gastropexy?



## fel (Jan 8, 2014)

As I mentioned in another thread, my spoo puppy is going to have surgery at 7.5 months to remove an undescended testicle. For an additional $450, I can get a gastropexy to prevent torsion from bloat. Would you folks do that? 

My lovely Kepler does seem to have a very deep chest, which is a risk factor. He eats mostly raw food but does have high quality kibble as training treats. 

Thanks!


----------



## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

It is a personal choice I guess, but were it me, I would opt to have the surgery.


----------



## Raven's Mom (Mar 18, 2014)

Raven is having a gastropexy in Aug with her spay. She will be 8 mo and I need everything done before I start school again on the fall. I have read too many horror stories to not have it done when they will be in there already.


----------



## Indiana (Sep 11, 2011)

Yup


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## PoodLuv (Apr 5, 2014)

What about the same question for a male during a neuter?


----------



## fel (Jan 8, 2014)

Just to clarify, Kepler is a male. Hence the issue with his testicle.


----------



## Manxcat (May 6, 2013)

Just read this on Wikipedia...

"Gastropexy is an effective preventive against death from torsion bloat in large dogs. In studies of dogs treated for bloat, of those with gastropexy, only 4.3% had a re-occurrence of bloat, compared to 54.5% of those dogs that did not have a gastropexy"

'Nuff said IMO.

I haven't got a spoo, but I'd definitely have it done


----------



## Countryboy (May 16, 2011)

In the event of bloat, emergency gastropexy costs $1800 up here.


----------



## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

After reading the "I almost lost my best friend" thread, I tried to figure out what percentage of SPOO's get bloat. I wish some breeders would comment or vets, if we have any as members. All deep chested dogs are at risk, food doesn't appear to make a difference, elevated dog bowls are useless. I did read that there may be a genetic predisposition. If it's the standard of care, I'll have it done. I'm just not certain that it is.


----------



## Eclipse (Apr 26, 2010)

I currently have 2 standards. I had my older girl gastropexied when she was spayed at 11 months. I plan to have my younger one pexied as well when I spay her. I lost my first standard to bloat and torsion at 13 and it was horrible. The gastropexy will not prevent bloat, but it should prevent torsion and will buy you precious extra time in getting to the vet to get the bloat addressed ASAP. If you dog bloats they will usually do an emergency gastropexy as part of the treatment anyway and at that time you are doing a major surgery on a dog that is already compromised and stressed. It is important to make sure your vet is familiar with the surgery, not all vets are or will do a pexy. My vet is also the director of my local animal emergency clinic and has done many of them. She was totally on board with me having the preventative gastropexy done.


----------



## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

Definitely would opt for it. It could save your dog's life some day.


----------



## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

I'm a big supporter of prophylactic gastropexy. Does the udescended testicle have to removed at 7.5 months or can you wait closer to a year? Reason being, I've read that a pexy has a greater chance of holding if it's done after most of the growing has finished


----------



## Raven's Mom (Mar 18, 2014)

Millie...How much more growth should I expect from my female spoo after 8 mo? She's about 22 inches and 45 lbs pretty close to her mothers size at 7 mo. I was trying to get her done this summer because I'm a teacher and everything gets harder to schedule after school starts.


----------



## fel (Jan 8, 2014)

I'm in the same boat as Raven's mom. August is a much slower time for me and it is easier to do the surgery then. Furthermore, local doggie day cares won't take Kepler until he is neutered. That will present difficulties in the Fall. 

I would also like to know what proportion of Spoos get bloat. I tried to find that information and could not.


----------



## frecklesdmk (Mar 27, 2013)

I lost my 7 year old spoo a little over a year ago. She had the surgery but had complications with her heart and we let her go. Her sister (not owned by me) bloated this year and survived the surgery. 

We had our new girl pexi'd with her spay. While it's not 100%, we felt it was better than not doing it. I'm so glad we did as our new girl is such a fast eater. There has been a few times she has gotten gas after eating and cries and exhibits milder behavior of the bloat symptoms. My heart stops when that happens. 


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## Siskojan (Mar 13, 2011)

Sisko almost bloated in early 2012. He spent a night at the emergency vet under observation after being x-rayed and the bill was about $1900. Then there was the follow-up at our own vet's office. Fortunately we purchased a Trupanion policy when he was 9 weeks old and the visit was covered, and as Trupanion considered it as treatment of his near miss with bloat they covered his gastropexy 6 weeks later. I would advise getting it done, $450 extra seems very reasonable and there is nothing as good as peace of mind.


----------



## frecklesdmk (Mar 27, 2013)

Our Pexi, spay, and entropian surgery (all done at the same time) was $1,500. I believe the Pexi portion was close to $850. $450 for Pexi is very cheap. I would inquire what they are doing for the Pexi. Our vet said there are different ways of tacking and some are more effective than others. 

The total bill for the the dog we lost was $3,800


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## CharismaticMillie (Jun 16, 2010)

Raven's Mom said:


> Millie...How much more growth should I expect from my female spoo after 8 mo? She's about 22 inches and 45 lbs pretty close to her mothers size at 7 mo. I was trying to get her done this summer because I'm a teacher and everything gets harder to schedule after school starts.


There really still is a decent amount of growth that happens after 8 months. Not so much height, but lots of filling out and development.


----------



## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

Copied from previous post.
Spoos are prone to Bloat. Feed them their meals in stages 2-4 separate of smaller portions. Dainty slow eaters are OK but those who bolt their food should always have the rate of intake controlled. The usual cause is intestinal swelling causing blockage, usually at the hiatus.
Good that you were observant and he's a lucky dog.
Eric.


----------



## Rusty (Jun 13, 2012)

While I agree with some other posters that I'd wait until closer to one year old to have the surgery done (if possible), I'd definitely agree that the gastropexy is a good idea. And $450 is pretty inexpensive for the procedure.

We had a neuter and gastropexy done on our male spoo puppy when he was 11 months old, and it's great peace of mind.


----------



## Suddenly (Aug 8, 2013)

At what age can this procedure be done? Also is there an age when it is not a good time?


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

I've read that it's best to wait until the dog is nearly fully grown. Often recommended in conjunction with a spay/ neuter timing since the dog already is anesthetized. Perhaps,with a teeth cleaning if your dog is older. Keep in mind that an elective gastropexy is not just gold standard vet care, it's platinum care. If I owned a Great Dane, I'm 100% certain that I would do it. Standard Poodles are not the highest risk breed for GDV, if we can put any faith in these small sample studies with anecdotal and contradictory conclusions. See my post on the GDV thread. I'm still undecided for my own August puppy but I'm trying not to get hysterical and weigh the odds rationally.


----------



## SAS (Jun 16, 2013)

I did not do it at the time of my dog's spay. It ws not an easy decision but here is why.

First, I learned in talking to my vet that like many surgeries, there are different approaches. My vet said that our surgeon did a mid line tack (I think I have that right), and that should the dog every require surgery after that, the operating vet must be informed that this type of surgery had been done. Something about that sounded problematic to me. Second, I, as a human have never had a surgery that did not have some kind of side effect although the good outweighed the bad. With our pets, we don't know how it 'feels'. Third, my spoo had had some mysterious digestive problems that we had not been able to diagnose up til then and I thought, who knows if this surgery may in some odd way affect the action of the stomach in a way that exacerbates her problem.

Who knows if I made the right choice. Time will tell.


----------



## fel (Jan 8, 2014)

Thanks Everyone,

I am still on the fence here. I wrote to my vet asking "what sort" of pexi she was doing, and also asked about whether further growth would affect the outcome. She did not reply and it has been a few days. Perhaps she is tired of all the questions. We are doing the procedure in August because that is the best time to have our dog out of commission, and also we need him neutered to put him in occasional doggie daycare. 

Does anyone know the proportion of Spoos that get bloat?

Thanks!


----------



## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

See my post on the GDV thread. In a recent small sample study of 11 breeds 5.7% of all the breeds experienced GDV. SPOOs's are not the ones at the most risk, but no knows or has reported a breed by breed breakdown. If your dog is one of the unlucky 5.7%, it has a 28.6% chance of dying. That sounds so scary. But your dog is more likely in the 94.3%, unless it's a very anxious Great Dane. The Giant breeds had the highest incidence of GDV and anxiety is nearly always cited as a risk factor.


----------



## Rusty (Jun 13, 2012)

The lifetime probability of gastric dilation-volvulus (GDV) for standard poodles is 25.3%, according to this article:
Ward, M. P., & Patronek, G. J. (2003). Benefits of prophylactic gastropexy for dogs at risk of gastric-dilation-volvulus. Preventive Veterinary Medicine, 60, 319-329.


The same article states that the probability of GD occurring in a dog with gastropexy was assumed to be 0.01.


----------



## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Rusty, thank you SO much for the citation. Table I does list a GDV Lifetime Risk for SPOO's at 25.3%. They derive that number by taking the median life expectancy of Standards (12) and a 2.4% Annual GDV Incidence rate (sample size 132) from pet insurance claims to come up with 25.3%. Their confidence in that number is expressed as between .07 to 40.2%. GDV Lifetime Mortality for SPOO's is 6.2%, confidence is 0.2% to 10.1%. 

What I really liked about this article was setting up decision tree analysis factoring in cost of a gastropexy, breed risk factors, genetic data and the emotional quotient. They also see this elective procedure as an ethical issue for vets. "Our decision tree suggests that prophylactic gastropexy will decrease mortality in all five breeds but is likely to be cost effective only in dogs with a lifetime risk of >34%.


----------



## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

I wish I could have provided a link to PF folks for the full text of this article. I had to buy mine


----------



## Rusty (Jun 13, 2012)

Mfmst, I'm glad the article was helpful (and hopefully worth the cost of buying it!). Thanks for providing a better summary of the spoo-related statistics for the benefit of forum members.


----------



## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Just adding this to my August puppy expenses! I picked up Gas-X today too!


----------



## frecklesdmk (Mar 27, 2013)

It's a choice. There is no absolute right or wrong. It doesn't mean that you are a better pet owner for making a choice either way. 

It's been over a year since I lost my Brandy and I still miss her so much. For me, because of my experience, I needed to have it done for our new girl Lexi. It allows me to enjoy her without having non-stop worries about it. 




Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Frecklesdmk you are absolutely right. No one should or really can judge because every decision tree is different. Owner anxiety is one of the factors that an ethical vet is advised to consider. That anxiety could be from prior experience like yours, distance from a good animal ER, having a specially trained service animal etc.etc. You and your vet decided that this was the appropriate course in Lexi's case.


----------



## fel (Jan 8, 2014)

I wanted to add to this thread that we got the elective gastropexy on Weds., and now Kepler has a post-op infection. His incision is much larger than I expected and he is not being cooperative about taking it easy for 2 weeks to heal. We are told to just keep him in the crate for the whole period, but he gets riled up in the crate when not with his humans. 

Just a consideration for those of you who are thinking about preventative gastropexy. I wish now we hadn't done it -- I feel I may have traumatized or even endangered the life of my sweet puppy.


----------



## o0Melanie0o (Aug 4, 2014)

fel said:


> I wanted to add to this thread that we got the elective gastropexy on Weds., and now Kepler has a post-op infection. His incision is much larger than I expected and he is not being cooperative about taking it easy for 2 weeks to heal. We are told to just keep him in the crate for the whole period, but he gets riled up in the crate when not with his humans.
> 
> Just a consideration for those of you who are thinking about preventative gastropexy. I wish now we hadn't done it -- I feel I may have traumatized or even endangered the life of my sweet puppy.


I'm sorry to hear he's having a rough recovery . I hope he starts cooperating and that he's able to heal quickly from here on out. Hugs!!


----------



## marialydia (Nov 23, 2013)

So sorry to hear you are going through a terribly rough patch. It's overwhelming to try so hard to do the best for our beloved dogs if it seems that our choice caused some suffering. I hope the infection comes under control fast and that healing is rapid.


Jupiter my 12-year-old mini poo had a lipoma removed in May. The vet had said that normally at his age they don't do anything about lipomas but I felt it was hindering his movement and growing fast, so I urged the vet to do it when he was under anesthesia for a dental. The lipoma was half a pound which is a lot if you weigh 17!

When they brought him out to me at the vets I was horrified at the incision, which also had a drain. Jupiter was in pain the first two nights and I wondered what I had done to him. But now he is absolutely fine, moves very well, and I am glad we did the surgery. I so hope the same for you and Kepler, and when you get through this, you will not have to worry about bloat.


----------

