# Swimming Lessons



## 94Magna_Tom (Feb 23, 2021)

For those of you who's poodles swim, tell us about how their first swimming trials went. I definitely want to get Elroy to like swimming!


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## Liz (Oct 2, 2010)

Mia taught herself how to swim after jealously watching her friend Taffy, a terrier mix, swimming and retrieving gleefully. Some dogs naturally take to the water, like Taffy, and some dogs learn to enjoy it, like Mia. I'll never forget how Mia's face scrunched up with determination as she walked down to a partially submerged rock, then launched herself into the water for the tiniest circle back to the rock. She stood up, shook herself off, and away she went on a slightly larger circle. For 10-15 minutes she practiced, working her way up from tiny counter-clockwise circles to wide clockwise circles, to weaving left and right, until she was satisfied she had mastered swimming. All on her own, too. It was a really special moment for me to witness.


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## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

I think you are starting correctly by having Elroy enter from a shoreline with shallow water, good footing, and no waves. So far Pogo is the only one of my dogs which has been willing to enter the water from steps or from a dock. The rest were only willing to enter from a beach. 

Definitely avoid forcing them in. Snarky, Galen, and now Ritter all had accidents where they fell into deep water over their heads. I think these accidents set Snarky and Galen up to distrust water. It's still too early to tell how Ritter will react. 

The way I taught Pogo to swim was to make a game of it. He was a lean dog, so I put him in a life jacket to start. Then I threw his tennis ball into the water about two feet out. He could reach it if he put his front feet in the water. We played like this for about 30 minutes, just fetching from ankle deep water. Sometimes I would throw the ball a little further out, so he needed to wade in with all four feet. In this first session I didn't ask him to go deeper than his knees. In later play sessions I gradually threw the ball further out, so he was challenged to go into increasingly deeper water. In many of these sessions by husband stood in the deep water to act as life guard and emotional supporter.

The same strategy did not work with Snarky, who had fallen into a river before I ever got him, and who was not as obsessed with fetch as Pogo. Snarky retrieved the ball from the shallows with as little mouth contact as possible and an expression of complete disgust. After the third time I threw the ball he was done. I could go fetch my own soggy tennis ball from now on, in his opinion. He was, on occasion, willing to wade into water for amusement or to cool off, but he never wanted to swim.


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## Liz (Oct 2, 2010)

I went down memory lane above, but I can offer a few pointers from working with a friend's dog recently. First, I heartily concur with cowpony: don't force him, look for a gentle beach access. and start with light games of fetch (be prepared to fetch it yourself if you throw it too far!). Work until he's comfortable getting his feet wet without any hesitation.

Usually, it's around the point that the water gets chest deep that dogs start to think twice about going any farther out. If you can buy/borrow a swim vest, it's a good idea - male poodles in particular have trouble learning to hold their rear ends up in the water. Then don your own swimming suit, because you're going to go out with him.

I've had luck bringing treats that float to lure the dog out. I stand in the water at the depth where the dog would transition to swimming, with the dog closer to the shore, and toss the treats in between us. The treat should land just slightly ahead of the dog, so that he can walk out a step or two, snatch it up, and retreat to the safety of shallower water. Gradually - and Tom, I mean gradually! - work to a depth where Elroy has to swim a few strides. This might take three trips to the beach. Don't rush it. You want to build a positive experience around water so that he's a lifelong fan. You don't want to scare the bejezus out of him on Day 1, ensuring that he'll never be comfortable in the water again.

When you get him to swim for the first time, finish there. Give him a couple of treats to fetch in shallow water, then go do something else. Let him be successful. Give his brain time to process what happened.

One of the hardest skills for new trainers to learn is the art of ending early. You are so excited to see him swim, Tom, but you're going to have to restrain yourself for his benefit. Learn to recognize a win. Your first win will not look like Elroy swimming across Lake Ontario, but it may look like Elroy comfortably getting chest deep in the water.

As with all training, don't push it, and always end on a high note. One well-constructed five minute session is worth more than thirty pressure filled minutes in the water. Do not expect him to swim the first day or even the second. Expect that you will get more wet than Elroy. But if you don't pressure him, he'll be happy to swim by the fourth or fifth trip.


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## 94Magna_Tom (Feb 23, 2021)

I guess I'm on the right track then. We've been to the water several times already, I never forced anything on him, and to date, he's been in up to his chest. The time he went up to his chest, there were already other dogs in the water frolicking and swimming. I'm pretty sure the other dogs helped give him encouragement to go in! This was in a clean stream, so there were parts with rapid water currents, and parts with placid pools. The pictures above are in a reservoir portion of the Farmington River. Most beaches here in CT aren't dog friendly, still looking for a place to go to the beach with him.


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## TeamHellhound (Feb 5, 2021)

Some dock diving facilities offer swimming lessons. 

Personally, with all the alligators down here, I'm just as happy my dogs don't like swimming.


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## 94Magna_Tom (Feb 23, 2021)

TeamHellhound said:


> Some dock diving facilities offer swimming lessons.
> 
> Personally, with all the alligators down here, I'm just as happy my dogs don't like swimming.



We don't have that problem here. Worst-case, he just might have to fight his way out of a school of polliwogs!


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## Bailey_Whiskey (Jan 18, 2021)

I have a related question...how do y'all dry your poodles after a swim? While I want to teach Whiskey to swim, I cannot imagine putting Whiskey through a 3-4 hour groom session just because he went for a swim. Or do y'all just keep the fur short and allow to air dry?


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## Liz (Oct 2, 2010)

Bailey_Whiskey said:


> I have a related question...how do y'all dry your poodles after a swim? ... Or do y'all just keep the fur short and allow to air dry?


Yes, Mia is clipped short in the summer to avoid mats. I am admittedly puzzled when I see a photo of a show dog water retrieving, as I cannot believe the owner/handler allows it except the day of a full groom.


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## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

Bailey_Whiskey said:


> I have a related question...how do y'all dry your poodles after a swim? While I want to teach Whiskey to swim, I cannot imagine putting Whiskey through a 3-4 hour groom session just because he went for a swim. Or do y'all just keep the fur short and allow to air dry?


My guys get wash-n-wear short trims for summer.


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## 94Magna_Tom (Feb 23, 2021)

I pat him down if I can. Then I comb it and brush it later after it dries. Only a couple of times now, and not soaking wet yet, so I'm not a good source.


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## Starla (Nov 5, 2020)

We are at the beach this week and I have just used the HV dryer on phoebe when we get back to the house. It blows out the sand and dries her up. She’s still dirty, but dry and clean enough to live with.


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## Liz (Oct 2, 2010)

BTW Tom, I gave up on white clothing/bed linens/upholstery once I got my first dog.


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## Starvt (Nov 5, 2019)

Last summer we took Raffi to the cottage with us. It was right on the edge of the lake with a small beach. He was in the water multiple times a day, and even though he had moderate length poms and jacket, he didn't really mat up. I just let him air dry mostly, and brushed his poms and chest out in the evenings (with a detangler of course).
I figure the cleanness of the water and the lack of tangles beforehand make a difference? Not that he has a show cost by any stretch, but I can't imagine dealing with that even without swimming!
As far as actual swimming, Raffi loves going in as long as he can touch, and will even put his head under water to grab things. But the few times he has tried to actually swim, he can't keep his back and up at all and flails like a panicky human. 
I'm thinking of trying a life jacket to so he can learn.


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## 94Magna_Tom (Feb 23, 2021)

Liz said:


> BTW Tom, I gave up on white clothing/bed linens/upholstery once I got my first dog.


Lol! 
I didn't plan for that! My plush furnitures are off-whites (light beiges) and my bed-spreads, and linens are white. Time will tell


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## I_love_dogs (May 30, 2021)

What if your body of water is an in ground pool? It doesn't have beach access.


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## 94Magna_Tom (Feb 23, 2021)

I_love_dogs said:


> What if your body of water is an in ground pool? It doesn't have beach access.


If I had an in ground pool, I think it would be much easier to train Elroy to swim. I'd start him wading in at the steps, and work towards holding him up while he dog paddles, then eventually let him swim. Since there is usually only one set of steps, it'd be especially important to train him where the exit is.


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## Liz (Oct 2, 2010)

Mia never took the pool. IIRC we managed to coax her on to the first step, but she resisted going deeper or swimming. You'll have to work hard to build a positive association to overcome that natural dog instinct to avoid steep descents into water. OTOH, you might get lucky with a dog who naturally loves dock diving and doesn't mind jumping in.


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## 94Magna_Tom (Feb 23, 2021)

I find it interesting that a breed that was initially bred to be a water retriever/strong swimmer no longer has an instinct to swim. Show dogs don't swim much so I'm guessing the instinct to swim has been bred out of them.


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## For Want of Poodle (Feb 25, 2019)

94Magna_Tom said:


> I find it interesting that a breed that was initially bred to be a water retriever/strong swimmer no longer has an instinct to swim. Show dogs don't swim much so I'm guessing the instinct to swim has been bred out of them.


Tell me about it. 

One of the reasons I wanted a poodle was as a swimming buddy. Nobody told Annie she is a water retriever. She hates swimming.


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## cowpony (Dec 30, 2009)

94Magna_Tom said:


> I find it interesting that a breed that was initially bred to be a water retriever/strong swimmer no longer has an instinct to swim. Show dogs don't swim much so I'm guessing the instinct to swim has been bred out of them.


I read an interview with a hunting poodle breeder who was complaining of exactly that - the difficulty of finding breeding stock that still has an innate love of water. Yeah, I was able to teach Pogo to swim and play in the water, but it was definitely something he had to LEARN. Totally unlike a baby Lab or baby Golden that makes a beeline for the first large body of water it sees.


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## 94Magna_Tom (Feb 23, 2021)

For Want of Poodle said:


> Tell me about it.
> 
> One of the reasons I wanted a poodle was as a swimming buddy. Nobody told Annie she is a water retriever. She hates swimming.


Sorry for the disappointment on that aspect. I still have hope for Elroy. [emoji17], [emoji120]


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## For Want of Poodle (Feb 25, 2019)

cowpony said:


> I read an interview with a hunting poodle breeder who was complaining of exactly that - the difficulty of finding breeding stock that still has an innate love of water. Yeah, I was able to teach Pogo to swim and play in the water, but it was definitely something he had to LEARN. Totally unlike a baby Lab or baby Golden that makes a beeline for the first large body of water it sees.


If I get a second poodle, I am considering a hunting dog breeder with that hope.


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## Asta's Mom (Aug 20, 2014)

Asta doesn't even like to put his foot outside when it has rained. I too was hoping for a dog that loved water and a retriever. Still that's okay since he helps me so much.


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## Starvt (Nov 5, 2019)

I read somewhere that poodles were used for retrieving in shallow marshy water, and that it's not necessarily natural for them to actually swim. Not sure of the accuracy of that but it fits Raffi!
I've also heard that their body type has been modified over the years to be more lean and deep chested, perhaps the ergonomics make swimming more difficult for them and that plays a part too.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

94Magna_Tom said:


> I find it interesting that a breed that was initially bred to be a water retriever/strong swimmer no longer has an instinct to swim. Show dogs don't swim much so I'm guessing the instinct to swim has been bred out of them.


Someone mentioned here that poodles are marsh dogs, not deep water swimmers. Wish I could recall the thread where I read that. Makes sense.

Peggy is a champion wader, but has no interest in going over her head and I have no interest in going out after her if she gets herself in trouble! So that works out just fine for us.


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## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Starvt said:


> I read somewhere that poodles were used for retrieving in shallow marshy water, and that it's not necessarily natural for them to actually swim. Not sure of the accuracy of that but it fits Raffi!
> I've also heard that their body type has been modified over the years to be more lean and deep chested, perhaps the ergonomics make swimming more difficult for them and that plays a part too.


Lol! We’re on the same wavelength today. @Starvt


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