# Two parts: Ear lenght, and grooming nicks.



## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Ear feather seemed to grow forever on Taylee and Tangee, but Teaka seems to have a set point where it just doesn't grow anymore (Timi's at just about as long at only a year old) of course having a nice ear leather gave her a good head start.
As for nicks,I would accept one, maybe one, every ten grooms. Even one time getting multiple nicks, I would find another groomer. Sorry, I know it isn't easy to change, but that is really unfair to your dogs...


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## sunshine (Jan 31, 2015)

If you band them, his ears will grow forever. lots of the ones I see either chew the bottoms off when they get caught in their mouth or the ends are broken off just from life/brushing. 

As for nicks, that sucks. I don't like leaving even one on the dogs that I groom. Sometimes accidents happen but it shouldn't be happening every time.


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## The Opera Poodle (Dec 19, 2012)

This was the worse of the three on Sherlock.


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## sunshine (Jan 31, 2015)

Ouch... 
Might be time to start looking for a new groomer. Ask around and see who your friends take their dogs to. Maybe take them in for face/feet and nails. It will give you a chance to take a peak at the place, watch the groomers work and talk about prices before booking a full groom.


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## Michelle (Nov 16, 2009)

I would think the ears would just keep growing...but I keep my boys ears short so I'm not too sure. Most poodles I groom like them at a certain length so we are always trimming them.

That many nicks would freak me out. While working in a shop for about a year and a half, plus 9 months grooming school, and 4 years of home grooming Atticus before that, I have maybe nicked 5 dogs (each once, not multiple nicks). And out those dogs I nicked most were little devils who made it nearly impossible not to nick them with the way they constantly fought/bit me, one was a 9F pelted maltese...the other was an old dog and I accidentally cut off a wart when shaving cocker spaniel ears. And the other 4 groomers I work with rarely nick a dog...its not all that common, but it does happen on occasion. 

It might be time to search for a new groomer if nicks are starting to be that frequent.


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## itzmeigh (Apr 28, 2014)

I could see a nick happening once or twice a year. I could understand a problem area being nicked every groom or almost every groom if I only took them in a few times a year. But several nicks on more then one dog on multiple visits? Nope. If you (the groomer) can't do better then that then it's time to close shop. 

I'd start looking around. I have 2 in the Houston area I'm about to try. I don't remember the name of the second one but it came as a recommendation from my breeder who's an extremely talented groomer who has competed in creative grooming. I'd (rather) make the 5 hour drive back to see her a couple of times a year but she closes shop on the weekends and I haven't been able to convince my hubby to take a vacation day for a dog grooming session. (He's close though!!)

So anyway, she passed me a recommendation Friday and I'm going to call and check it out Monday. I'll let you know who I go with and what I think tomorrow after I talk to them myself. 

If not then Hazel has an appointment at Demi's Dog House in midtown for some scissor work. We tried their day care and it was ok. I was a tiny bit turned off of the groomer when she said she was glad I can do neat feet because she doesn't like to do them but we shall see. The upside is they are like 3 minutes from my office and they will keep her all day if I need them to.


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## sunshine (Jan 31, 2015)

If she's sick enough to start cutting dogs and her finishing work has gone down hill... it also worries me that her handling skills and patience might not be what they use to be either. You didn't say anything about that, but I worry so I mention it.


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## ericwd9 (Jun 13, 2014)

It is possible your dog has warts/pimples or some other skin irregularity??? If not then do find another groomer. With good equipment skin nicks are rare unless you are having the dog shaved close 20-30F all over.
Eric.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

ericwd9 said:


> It is possible your dog has warts/pimples or some other skin irregularity??? If not then do find another groomer. With good equipment skin nicks are rare unless you are having the dog shaved close 20-30F all over.
> Eric.



I beg to differ on the idea of close shaves causing nicks - to the contrary, the teeth of the lower number blades are further apart and more likely to grab the skin between them.


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## The Opera Poodle (Dec 19, 2012)

itzmeigh said:


> I could see a nick happening once or twice a year. I could understand a problem area being nicked every groom or almost every groom if I only took them in a few times a year. But several nicks on more then one dog on multiple visits? Nope. If you (the groomer) can't do better then that then it's time to close shop.
> 
> I'd start looking around. I have 2 in the Houston area I'm about to try. I don't remember the name of the second one but it came as a recommendation from my breeder who's an extremely talented groomer who has competed in creative grooming. I'd (rather) make the 5 hour drive back to see her a couple of times a year but she closes shop on the weekends and I haven't been able to convince my hubby to take a vacation day for a dog grooming session. (He's close though!!)
> 
> ...


Thank you all for your replies. And Itzmeigh - I look forward to hearing what you find.

I have no idea why it is so hard to find a good poodle groomer in the fourth largest city in the US. The really good ones are way out in the boonies or not taking new clients, (or dying which two of the top poodle groomers have done in the last four years.) When I am at the dog park or out and about with the dogs and meet other poodle owners one of the first questions is "where do you get them groomed." It seems everyone is looking.

Sherlock gets car sick on rides more than 15 or 20 minutes so that leaves me in the inner-loop. This woman surprisingly is at Petsmart on Kirby - I assume she is there for the benefits? It is a windowed high traffic area so the only place losing a temper would happen is back in the bath area. There is another groomer there who does a great job on poodles and did them when she was in the hospital, but he works minimum hours and is hard to book. Plus, I feel a sense of loyalty to this one woman since up until nine month ago, she had been great. And when I say loyalty, I only mean in the same shop. I know I have to make a change. I don't mind paying more - it was only $100 per dog this time + a $40 tip. I know I can't do it myself. When one of the dogs looks sad at me when I'm brushing them, I stop, get treats, beg for forgiveness... I get a quarter of a dog done and I feel like I am the torture squad at POW camp. 

I know my dogs are not perfect to groom. Shasta insists on licking the groomer and the clippers. And Sherlock - well most of you know Sherlock by now. When I sneak in to watch, he seems to be okay. But I know how high energy he is and I'm sure he is jumpy at time. The more I look at these grooms, the worse they are. Shasta's belly was not cut/clipped at all. She is shaved down but has this long tummy hair. Ugggg. I wish I wasn't so timid. I should go back and have a talk.

PS - it took her six and a half hours. It wasn't like she didn't have the time


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

Opera Poodle, could you please tell me where on the dog this nick was located (in the photo), I have tried to figure it out and just can't. Since I have always done my own dogs, I have no idea what is /isn't acceptable... but whatever that photo is a picture of is not what I would call a nick. To me, a nick is when you gouge a tiny piece of skin, usually because you did not hold the blade parallel to the dog. Nicks are easier to make on senior dogs because their skin is fragile... but I always think of nicks as being tiny, like a baby's finger nail clipping. I can see why you would be upset about your dog having"nicks" like the one in the photo. As difficult as it is, you will have to stop considering the feelings of the groomer and just take care of your dogs. Honestly, if the groomer is doing that kind of work because of health reasons she should be on disability.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

Charmed said:


> Opera Poodle, could you please tell me where on the dog this nick was located (in the photo), I have tried to figure it out and just can't. Since I have always done my own dogs, I have no idea what is /isn't acceptable... but whatever that photo is a picture of is not what I would call a nick. To me, a nick is when you gouge a tiny piece of skin, usually because you did not hold the blade parallel to the dog. Nicks are easier to make on senior dogs because their skin is fragile... but I always think of nicks as being tiny, like a baby's finger nail clipping. I can see why you would be upset about your dog having"nicks" like the one in the photo. As difficult as it is, you will have to stop considering the feelings of the groomer and just take care of your dogs. Honestly, if the groomer is doing that kind of work because of health reasons she should be on disability.



Yeah, that nick almost looks like it was made with scissors because the hair appears shorter in that spot - if it was done with clippers, the hair would still be the same length, and nicking with scissors is entirely unacceptable ever. Yes, in my 15 years of self-taught grooming on three poodles, I have given each of them a couple of clipper nicks or burns, but not once have I done it with scissors!


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## Ladyscarletthawk (Dec 6, 2011)

The Opera Poodle said:


> I have no idea why it is so hard to find a good poodle groomer in the fourth largest city in the US. The really good ones are way out in the boonies or not taking new clients, (or dying which two of the top poodle groomers have done in the last four years).


Well I don't live in TX anymore lol! JK. It looks kinda like a oozy wart(black) or a sebaceous cyst really. Ive have seen that a lot.. One Sammie I groom had a sebaceous cyst on her back that I couldn't see till I started blowing her coat. There was a hole right where the scab was(scab was hanging on to the coat still), and I left it there so the owner could see I didnt cut her, not that I could cause I don't cut the coat there. If its soaked and gently massaged it will leave a hole, which is pretty gross. Also its possible that it clipper irritation that has been scratched at for a few days or week but the crusty is normally brown green.. basically a hot spot. Because its Petsmart you can always talk to the manager and let them know. Sometimes theres an issue and it can't be fixed unless they know about it. If she's actually nicking, the dogs could be giving her a hard time, or she is overbooking herself. I have a std poo that I groom once a month and I allow myself 3hrs to groom him start to finish, and I leave him 5/8" ao. It doesn't look like a cut per se, or you would have noticed that day. It would be wet and or red at pick up, from it oozing/bleeding and she would get in trouble for not getting a vet to look at it and bring it to the mgr attention.


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

If your dogs are jumping around on the grooming table, I can see how they could get nicked pretty easily. It sounds like they need to get some more practice holding still when being clipped. You can do this at home by reinforcing perfectly still standing for just a second and raising the criteria gradually, with frequent, rapid fire delivery of treats. Let your dogs know that holding perfectly still, not licking clippers or groomers will earn them high reward. 

Once they're well behaved on the grooming table, there shouldn't be any nicks. 

I am very amateur. I've only been grooming my dogs since I got them and they're not even 2 yet. I was sending Matisse to a groomer before shows. But now he's retired and I do him at home. Maurice, I've always done myself...never a groomer. I have nicked Matisse once on his leg where it curves up at the top...where it starts to go round and toward his belly...at the border between the front and back side of that part...(because both sides gets shaved) and is very thin skinned when I was maintaining his continental....using a #30 blade. I got his bum twice until I learned to not press so hard with the clippers. So 3 nicks in the time I've had him and none for quite some time. I've never nicked Maurice. But my dogs stand perfectly still on the table when I'm using scissors or clippers. 

I had a very good show groomer and Matisse never got nicked by her. I would think any groomer could compensate for some movement by the dog on the table and avoid most nicking. If your dog is very wiggly, then that needs to be worked on. If it's not too bad how your dogs wiggle, then maybe another groomer would be better OR do it yourself. It's actually pretty fun to groom I think. And it saves money. It's not that hard to learn....with some good tutorials on You Tube and some practice. It may not look perfect for a while but if you don't care about that, then go along...in time, it gets better.

I wonder if that groomer's blade was dull. (?) Does that cause nicking or just razor burn? I agree that a #30 blade isn't more likely to nick. If dull though, it can cause some pretty nasty razor burn. A #30 is the only blade I've used. I like a nice, clean and close shave. (on all my men) lol.

Oh! Ears. Yes, they'll just keep growing. Maurice had the most glorious ears...so long and pretty. But kind of getting out of proportion to his body. They were down past his shoulders. They got in his food, in his mouth to the point he was gagging on them sometimes. I went to trim them just a tad. Well, they wound up getting _way_ too short. I'm so mad at myself! First the left was shorter than the right. So I had to even it up. Then the right was shorter than the left and so it went. Grrrrrrrr! So short now. They seem to take a long time to grow.


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## Tiny Poodles (Jun 20, 2013)

OMG that has happened every time that I have tried to give ears just a little trim - more and more comes off as I try to get them even! That's why I almost never trim them !


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## PoodlePaws (May 28, 2013)

Not sure how far you want to go. These people are in sugar land on hwy 6 / hwy 90 area. They do a really good job on my dogs. 
(281) 565-7722


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## The Opera Poodle (Dec 19, 2012)

Charmed said:


> Opera Poodle, could you please tell me where on the dog this nick was located (in the photo), I have tried to figure it out and just can't. Since I have always done my own dogs, I have no idea what is /isn't acceptable... but whatever that photo is a picture of is not what I would call a nick. To me, a nick is when you gouge a tiny piece of skin, usually because you did not hold the blade parallel to the dog. Nicks are easier to make on senior dogs because their skin is fragile... but I always think of nicks as being tiny, like a baby's finger nail clipping. I can see why you would be upset about your dog having"nicks" like the one in the photo. As difficult as it is, you will have to stop considering the feelings of the groomer and just take care of your dogs. Honestly, if the groomer is doing that kind of work because of health reasons she should be on disability.


I guess part of my problem is my terminology. I'm calling any cut to the skin - from what ever cause a nick. 



> Yeah, that nick almost looks like it was made with scissors because the hair appears shorter in that spot - if it was done with clippers, the hair would still be the same length, and nicking with scissors is entirely unacceptable ever. Yes, in my 15 years of self-taught grooming on three poodles, I have given each of them a couple of clipper nicks or burns, but not once have I done it with scissors!


I agree this was from a scissors.



> Well I don't live in TX anymore lol! JK.


Forgive my denseness. Are you a groomer here in Houston? If so, are you taking clients? Are you in the loop?



> It doesn't look like a cut per se, or you would have noticed that day. It would be wet and or red at pick up, from it oozing/bleeding and she would get in trouble for not getting a vet to look at it and bring it to the mgr attention.


I noticed it the minute we got home. It is so hectic with them being excited from pick up that I really get only a glance at the dogs. I instantly noticed it was a bad looking groom. When I got home and gave them treats, is when I noticed it. It looked like it was oozing a clear fluid. Sherlock's back leg's nick I noticed a few hours later. I was petting her while she laid by me and there was something stuck to her fur. When I picked it off, she started bleeding. I then noticed Sherlock licking his foot. I figured it was razor burn, but it is still bleeding today (see pic.) There is also a mark on Shasta's nose. I am assuming it was from her sticking her nose out of the crate, but it is the first time it has happened. 



> Sometimes theres an issue and it can't be fixed unless they know about it. If she's actually nicking, the dogs could be giving her a hard time, or she is overbooking herself.


Since it was Saturday and PetSmart, I bet they took in too many walk ins. 



> Once they're well behaved on the grooming table, there shouldn't be any nicks.


Every time I go pick them up, I am told how good they are. And I have hid and watched. Both dogs seem to do fine when I'm watching except with Shasta trying to lick the groomers face and hands all the time. They are still when I brush them but look at me like I'm killing them. Both dogs have been groomed more often than most because I take them in for baths, brushing, and nails every three weeks and grooming every six. I'm a neat freak when it comes to the dogs. I just assume it is the dogs being active - although now that I think about it, the dogs should be getting better and not worse. This problem has started since she was hospitalized. 



> Not sure how far you want to go. These people are in sugar land on hwy 6 / hwy 90 area. They do a really good job on my dogs.
> (281) 565-7722


Sherlock gets really sick if in the car too long. I am on the Eastside (Eado) of downtown. If I still lived in Sugar Land, I would have no problem. The people at Parkland Kennel never did me wrong. I understand there are good groomers out in the Pearland direction and then of course people at PRH would do a great job. But this would mean stressing out a dog from the long drive and leaving the groomer with a puking agitated animal. I could give him the pills for car sickness, but these make him sleepy and I'm not sure how thrilled they would be grooming a limp noodle.


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## sunshine (Jan 31, 2015)

Sucks that you're caught in this situation... are you going to find a new groomer for sure?


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## sunshine (Jan 31, 2015)

Pictures finally loaded on my phone..... OUCH! ...


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

Oh dear...nicks all over the place!!!!! Ouchie! Poor baby. Definitely don't go back. There's something wrong here. Either the groomer is careless and inept or there's something wrong with the equipment...which means the groomer is inept or uncaring. Just wrong, especially since you say they hold pretty still and all. You'll just have to find another groomer that comes highly recommended or just DIY. I heard a lot of horror stories about some groomers before I got my Poodles and decided right then and there that I would learn how to do it myself. But then I did wind up finding a few good show groomers who people in the Poodle club here use. Well, good luck. I hope your darling dogs heal up quickly.


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

Oh heavens get rid of that groomer, I have had such horrid cuts, but never a cut on my dog, if I did I would clean the entire place out. I decided to do it my self, at 100.00 every 3 weeks, no way, I just work on them every 2 weeks to keep it under control, and I do mess up, but not going to pay that kind of money, to have them look awful, and a nic or cut, I would be wild.

I went to petsmart, and it was awful, I went back the next day and ask for the manager, and said I want these dogs straighten up for what I paid and I do not want the same groomer, and they did it, still looked like hell from the first groomer, since then I will do it my self.

By the way thanks to all of you who recommended videos on grooming, I have sent about 14 hours watching them over and over, got the tk down, the body, face, but still rough with feet, but I will get it.


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## Viking Queen (Nov 12, 2014)

Oh, my! That's quite distressing. Yes, I would definitely be looking for a new groomer, as difficult as that is.

Let us know how that works out, and kisses to the kids for their boo boos!

Viking Queen


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## Carley's Mom (Oct 30, 2011)

I am not a groomer and I have never nicked a dog. I would forgive it once. One nick that is.


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## Indiana (Sep 11, 2011)

I'm a former groomer turned poodle owner (I had a Bedlington Terrier when I was a groomer but that's where I learned to love poodles), and I know that standard poodles are a groomer's biggest challenge, generally speaking. That is to say, a giant schnauzer or Bouvier is worse but they're pretty rare. However, any groomer who was feeling normal would feel really really bad about nicks and bring it to your attention and then try to compensate you somehow. But here's an idea; what if you got really really good equipment and just did a bit on your own? I promise it's way cheaper than paying $240 for 2 standard poodles to be groomed every 6 weeks, not that the money is your first consideration anyway, but great equipment is easier to do a good job with too. What if you got top-notch clippers, dryer and scissors and just start with a tidy up in between grooms? You MIGHT find that you like your own work better. Your dogs sound great to work with like mine are; I don't even have restraints and on a nice day I just do it in the back yard. They love the attention.


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## glorybeecosta (Nov 11, 2014)

I just started too groom mine, as I have had the groomers from HELL, since 2 of my main groomers past away. The best groomer in our area, has the door facing the main street and lets the dogs run loose in the shop, that is why I do not go there, one dart and your dog is in traffic. Actually, my grooming job was better than the last 2, but it took me over 6 hours, and they were not long or matted, I was just so scared. But I am ready as soon as they feel better to ready dive in, and try a couple of ideas, as they say the hair grows back, LOL


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## Ladyscarletthawk (Dec 6, 2011)

The Opera Poodle said:


> Forgive my denseness. Are you a groomer here in Houston? If so, are you taking clients? Are you in the loop?


No I was being facetious. I used to groom in Texas, but now groom in MS. I have a lot of poodle clients, mostly minis and toys, but a couple standards. If you see my "english saddle experts" thread you will see examples of my work. I wish I could help you there, I get a lot of clients that come to me after they had bad grooming jobs.



The Opera Poodle said:


> I noticed it the minute we got home. It is so hectic with them being excited from pick up that I really get only a glance at the dogs. I instantly noticed it was a bad looking groom. When I got home and gave them treats, is when I noticed it. It looked like it was oozing a clear fluid. Sherlock's back leg's nick I noticed a few hours later. I was petting her while she laid by me and there was something stuck to her fur. When I picked it off, she started bleeding. I then noticed Sherlock licking his foot. I figured it was razor burn, but it is still bleeding today (see pic.) There is also a mark on Shasta's nose. I am assuming it was from her sticking her nose out of the crate, but it is the first time it has happened.


I definitely would have brought it up to the managers attention, or now the groomer will keep possibly hurting other dogs unchecked. You could have also had the groom fixed or comped Thats a lot of knicks.



The Opera Poodle said:


> Since it was Saturday and PetSmart, I bet they took in too many walk ins.


Possibly, but the groomers have to constantly stop what they are doing to answer phones, check in and out clients, and much more, AND bathe/groom their dogs. Unfortunately there are no receptionists.. You wouldn't believe how many people go in or call on a Saturday. That's not an excuse, but sometimes it seems that people are overbooked, but they can control the client flow on the weekend. 



The Opera Poodle said:


> Every time I go pick them up, I am told how good they are. And I have hid and watched. Both dogs seem to do fine when I'm watching except with Shasta trying to lick the groomers face and hands all the time. They are still when I brush them but look at me like I'm killing them. Both dogs have been groomed more often than most because I take them in for baths, brushing, and nails every three weeks and grooming every six. I'm a neat freak when it comes to the dogs. I just assume it is the dogs being active - although now that I think about it, the dogs should be getting better and not worse. This problem has started since she was hospitalized.


Now I wouldn't always believe what people say about how a client's dog behaves. Being good is in the eye of the beholder lol. Some dogs have to be statues to be considered good, while other groomers feel as long as they don't go for the jugular they are good lol. Plus MANY groomers will tell a client that Kujo was good so as to not lose a client or make them mad. I want to slap them because then you get clients say Kujo has never bit anyone, when they have since they were puppies. Since you have watched your babies be groomed its obvious that aside from Shasta's licking they are fairly well behaved. BTW that licking can be dangerous as a tongue can get sliced if they lick at shears or clippers. That said, my recommendation would be to talk to the manager, and try either a different groomer in the salon or try somewhere else. She is nicking way too often in my opinion especially since this is a common occurrence on different areas of the body. Sometimes the manager will do a better job, but not always. Let us know how things go!


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## sunshine (Jan 31, 2015)

Mentioning tongue cuts made me cringe, those suck. I haven't caught one in a long time, and I hope I don't do it tomorrow just because I've said something, but it can happen so fast. One naughty little slurp on the scissors or poorly timed lick of the lips and that's all it takes... :ahhhhh:

Telling a client that their dog is less than perfect takes a bit of tact... I try to always have something nice to say about peoples dogs and if the dog is bad for something I'll let them know, nicely, people take what you have to say about their dogs the same way as their kids. Plus it reflects on the groomer. When the newest girl at our shop started 3 years ago she told almost every client that their dog was stubborn. I wanted so badly to tell her it was HER not the DOGS that were stubborn and inflexible, but I couldn't . My boss eventually had a chat with her and she's improved a lot since then.


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## Streetcar (Apr 13, 2014)

With the nicking, good to let the groomer know, because it may be the sharpener isn't doing a great job. Sharpeners can have an impact on grooms depending on their expertise (and the level of calibration of their equipment) with blades and shears.


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## cindyreef (Sep 28, 2012)

Oh my...I feel for you but I would never take my dog back if he had that many nicks. I may forgive one nick and only one...not one every groom!

I think you should take the advice above and try to do some yourself. But I admit it is a lot of work on my big spoo with long hair. Sometimes I will allow a groomer to bath and blow dry Dexter. That way Im not too exhausted and I go home and do the rest. I do ALL the scissoring and grooming. I just don't trust anyone in my area to have the patience and produce the cut I want. (He has the topknot, long ears and pom tail but the body and legs is more like a modern)They all want to do a puppy cut. It would be a dream to have the chance to take him to an experienced show groomer. But it is what it is. Big standards are not that common around here.

Try some yourself, it can be very rewarding. I have to admit I like it when people ask where I get him groomed and I say "I do". They always ask and we always get compliments. 




About ear length.... Dexter's keeps growing. They are 10" long now and I have to trim slightly. But sometimes if he is chewing on a twig or something the hair can get all caught up in his mouth. Yuk. I put his ears in a clip for messy meals.


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## Desiree (Feb 14, 2010)

I'm a pro groomer 25+ yrs. You need to find another groomer before your dogs are seriously injured. The clipper rash on the paws can be caused by too close cutting blade for a white/cream dog or a hot blade. Regardless of her health issues you need to find another groomer. You cannot use sharp instruments around live animals if your hands are not steady and/or your vision is impaired. The your dogs deserve better than that! Start searching! Good Luck!


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