# Tracheal Collapse: The Harness/Collar Question



## Hayley22 (Sep 21, 2011)

Hi guys! 

I did a search on tracheal collapse on the Poodle Forum, and I read what was said about it. (Thanks Rowan for the link!) But then I googled it, and it confused me a little. What doesn't seem to be clear is whether tracheal collapse can be caused by the collar, or whether the collar simply exacerbates a condition that already exists. As you know, I am welcoming a little toy poodle into my life in about a month, so I need to buy her puppy supplies. I was just wondering if everyone with mini's and toys uses a harness? It seems like a good idea, except for the fact that it encourages pulling. However, since I am going to be training my pup from a very young age to love the leash, I suppose it shouldn't really be problem...

Please let me know what you think! 

Thank you in advance


----------



## Chagall's mom (Jan 9, 2010)

Hello, there! Welcome to the forum and congratulations on soon becoming a poodle parent! I believe heredity plays a role in how strong or weak the cartilage rings in a poodle's trachea are, but you can strain and injury those delicate rings over time by allowing the poodle to pull hard against the collar. 

My vet does recommend a harness for toys and minis. I use one called the Easy Walk Harness which attaches to the leash in front, along the dog's chest, with a martingale type loop. In my experience this front connecting harness does not play into the dog's inclination to exhibit an opposition response and pull, rather it gently directs the dog sort of sideways and discourages pulling. You are right in saying the dog must be trained to walk nicely on a loose lead, whether you use a harness or a buckle collar.

My mini used to sometimes strain against the collar which caused him to cough/gasp. That alarmed me sufficiently to switch to a harness, which I had been resisting thinking it would encourage him to pull like sled dog. I found instead it helped immensely to teach him to heel and not pull, well, MOST of the time anyway! Good luck with your soon-to-be new pup!


----------



## Hayley22 (Sep 21, 2011)

Chagall's Mom: thanks so much for your reply. It definitely sounds like the harness is the way to go  On the topic, which method did you use to teach Chagall not to pull on the leash? I have been reading so much about positive reinforcement and I can't wait to start using these methods on my little poodle pooch! 

Did I mention Chagall is exquisite?


----------



## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

Welcome to the forum - and congratulations on being about to become a poodle mum! I walk mine in collars, but I am extremely careful to avoid pressure on the trachea, and their collars are wide and padded (in fact I am considering Italian Greyhound collars to ensure the collars are wide and soft enough). I would prefer to use a harness, but most of our walking is just a few hundred yards from the car to where they can be off leash, and putting them into a harness for such a short distance seems excessive. They have both been taught to walk on a loose leash, using treats, making-like-a-tree, and rapid changes of direction, so there is only very occasionally any pressure on their throats. I have seen choke chains and pinch collars sized for chihuahuas, though, as well as innumerable slip collars - the mind boggles at people who think they need them, and at the potential damage done!


----------



## Chagall's mom (Jan 9, 2010)

*Hayley22*: Thanks for you kind words on Chagall's looks!

Like_ fjm,_ I use positive reinforcement for training. Chagall is extremely food motivated, so that makes things pretty easy. As a pup he always wanted to be near me (still does!) so I used that to my advantage. I taught him "watch me," by holding a small piece of a meat treat up to my face and rewarding him for eye contact. He caught onto that in no time! Then, as he scurried along beside me, at first with no leash and then dragging his leash (safely on our property), I taught him to heel, also using treats, sometimes dropping them on the ground for him so he'd keep pace with me, and also rewarding him for a willing "heel." When he attempted to pull I would turn around quickly and he'd tag after me to catch up. When he tried to pull too far ahead, I stood still, like a cement pillar. There was a bit of a test of wills there for a while!!

It took some time to convince him _I_ was the one in "the driver's seat," and at times I found myself impatient so I had to break the training down into multiple short sessions, several times a day. It was always easy to get his attention because he obeys "watch me" so well. Then I upped the stakes and worked on distraction training. I took him to a dog park and practiced controlled walking outside the chain link fence. I also took him to kids' baseball and soccer games and tennis courts and did the same thing. I owe our success largely to liver treats!:biggrin:

Many people take their pups to socialization and obedience classes, but I trained Chagall at home, making use of some friends' dogs to socialize him and help him learn good doggy manners and play behavior. A lot of people clicker train, but after trying that myself I just felt more at ease with using the treats as a lure and reward. I phased them out over time, though not entirely. I still wear a bait bag everywhere we go and reward or surprise Chagall with a treat because, well, he's so sweet, and such a good boy! 

If you search the forum for teaching "heel" or "loose leash walking," you'll find other posts on the subject. What an exciting time for you, it's fun to be part of it and I can't wait for you to get your toy poodle!!:nod:


----------



## Ginagbaby1 (Aug 1, 2011)

Welcome to the forum. I use a harness with my mini for all his walks. Like the other posts, Casper learned to loose leash walk using positive reinforcements and also by making like a tree when he did try to pull in the begining. I think that what helped us too was consistency. We always use the harness so he learned to love it cause it meant he was going somewhere. He caught on pretty quick that I was the one on in charge. We also use our harness to "strap him in" in the car for safety. When we first got him he was so small (well to us) at 3 pounds and he was really squirmy and so excited about the car rides. I was afraid he'd fall or take a tumble.


----------



## Rowan (May 27, 2011)

I also use harnesses on all of my miniature poodles. (My vet also recommends them.) 

I also use positive reinforcement training and have used the Victoria Stilwell method to correct pulling (turn around and go in the opposite direction to redirect their focus). I've been lucky in that pulling has never been a problem with my poodles. When I was leash training them, I'd frequently make them stop and sit or do "down." They were always so focused on me they never really had time to pull. I also limited their stopping (wee breaks) to further keep them focused on me. I'd let them stop when they were walking quietly and always with a command. 

I think running with my poodles also helped. They naturally fell in line beside me! I must admit, I did teach them to "pull" me up hills though.


----------



## neVar (Dec 25, 2009)

I think if you have a dog who pulls (period) a collar is not the best option. the dog needs to not pull. 

Now a harness- will keep the pressure off of the trachea- but it doesn't prevent the pulling. (now a no pull style harness will). Head harnesses dontlet the dogs pull however often are hard to use on the small dogs IME


----------



## tokipoke (Sep 3, 2011)

I was debating whether or not to use the Gentle Leader head collar or their Easy Walk harness for my standard. He walks fine on the leash *sometimes*. He does respond well to positive reinforcement but all the training goes out the window once he sees a squirrel. Like others said, be consistent with the training, work on the "heel" command at home but slowly add more distractions to the walk, like kids riding bikes and skateboards, children and adults pointing and making high pitched noises, squirrels running around, neighborhood cats wandering, etc. 

I bathed Leroy couple of days ago and used a slip lead for his walk. For some reason he pulled HARDER with this type of leash. I guess he felt "freer" and wanted to take off ahead of me, but he was choking himself. After two days of this - lots of pulling from him and me trying to go the opposite way to redirect - it's made him gag to the point of throwing up. He never throws up anything, just spit - but this is a bad sign. I switched to his regular leash and collar yesterday, he walked much better but when I led him the opposite way again - he pulled hard the other way, and then started gagging and threw up spit again. I really hate that there's so much pressure being put on his throat, so will definitely switch to a different lead.


----------



## CT Girl (Nov 17, 2010)

I use a buckle collar for my toy Swizzle. He learned very quickly to walk on a loose lead so pulling is not really an issue. I have never had the gagging issue either. Perhaps it depends on the dog.


----------



## Hayley22 (Sep 21, 2011)

thanks for all the helpful comments! I definitely think harness plus positive reinforcement is the way to go then! I loved hearing all about your poodles


----------

