# Grooming Reds?



## wolfcub81 (Feb 5, 2010)

What products are you using on her? I would use a shampoo thats made for giving texture/body like Nature's Specialties Almond Crisp or EZ Groom Structure. No conditioner. Then use texture/body products. I personally like to use Chris Christensen Thick n Thicker products. I use the mousse while wet and before drying and the spray after she is dry. Dry the coat against the grain and make sure you use heat at the end to make sure it is set. I don't have a red, but I have an apricot with crappy coat. Espree show line is decent too for thickening products.


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## NorthJerseyGirrl (Aug 15, 2011)

Thank you. I didn't know there were products to stiffen up the coat. How long does the effect last? (I'm guessing just a couple of days.)

Are there particular techniques or tools for clipping the hair in its normal (soft) condition? I kind of like it and since I've only had reds, it seems normal to me.


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## mom24doggies (Mar 28, 2011)

I use chris christensen Spectrum One shampoo, conditioner, and substance builder on my boys (poodle and Lhasa) when I'm going to scissor them. My poodle has lovely hair, but who doesn't want more texture right?! My Lhasa has good hair with nice texture as well, but since he's a drop coat it tends to want to lay down and the spectrum one helps lift it so I can get a good finish on him. I also like thick n' thicker Foaming Protein. A lot of people also use the TnT spray. 

As far as techniques....well, shorter hair stands up better. Make sure you cut the coat up (point your scissors up) so that you are cutting the hairs straight across rather than at a downwards angle which will encourage it to lay flat rather than stand up. When I do floppy topknots, I fluff the hair then tip the dogs head forward (pull the nose towards the chest) so the coat bends forward, then cut it with scissors pointed up. When the dog lifts his head, many times the coat is standing up better. I think it has to do with the angle the hair is being cut at. If you are using combs or blades, try reversing a couple of lengths up from what you want to get a smoother finish. So for example if you are using a 1/2" guide comb, you would reverse a 3/4" guide comb to get 1/2". Make sense? 

Are your dogs young/puppies? That would explain some of the softness, and will likely get better as they go through coat change.


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## NorthJerseyGirrl (Aug 15, 2011)

My dog is just over a year old and I *think* I'm dealing with her adult coat. I just did a quick groom with some of these comments in mind. I used a free sample of Chris C. Spectrum One shampoo that I had lying around and definitely found it made her coat stiffer. I tried to clip her topknot with scissors pointed up. I haven't tried the reverse-comb idea yet - so far the only clipper I've used is the Peanut and its combs simply didn't work on my dog's coat, hence the laborious hand-scissoring. 

Wolfcub, when you say to use heat at the end, I'm not sure what you mean. I am using a human blow dryer on low. Would I just give her a quick puff all over on high (from a safe distance)? 

Another question -- the rear legs. The hair there below the knee is perfectly straight... No body or curl whatsoever. So far it doesn't look good either short or long, but i haven't known how to shape it. Any suggestions?

Many thanks for the help!


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## wolfcub81 (Feb 5, 2010)

If you are using a regular hair dryer, it should be good as long as you are brushing while you are drying. My comment was refering to using a heated dryer to stretch dry the coat at the end if you were using a high velocity to dry most of it.


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## Carley's Mom (Oct 30, 2011)

This is new to me. I never knew that you wanted the coat to be stiff... I put the best softing conditioner I know of on Carley to make her coat soft. LOL No wonder when people touch her they are so surprised that she is so soft. Not sure I want to change, but I do have something to think about . Why do you guys want a stiff coat? I am new to this...


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## LoveMyDogs (Jun 13, 2012)

I had a little apricot baby girl who also had poor hair and I used a spray in conditioner ( no rinse kind) made for curly hair that left her coat looking fuller and helped to curly her fly away ends. I dried her with a hair dryer and then sprayed her until she was a bit damp with the conditioner. I then rubbed it in with my fingers. After she air dried, I lightly fluffed her up with the brush. After 12 years, I lost her on Easter day. Very sad day for us. She was such a little lover.


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## ArreauStandardPoodle (Sep 1, 2009)

Personally, I have never done anything different for the reds than I do for my black or did for my silver. Of all the reds I've know, only one had a fine sparse topknot and a little mousse would fix that quick.


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## NorthJerseyGirrl (Aug 15, 2011)

Carley's Mom said:


> This is new to me. I never knew that you wanted the coat to be stiff... I put the best softing conditioner I know of on Carley to make her coat soft. LOL No wonder when people touch her they are so surprised that she is so soft. Not sure I want to change, but I do have something to think about . Why do you guys want a stiff coat? I am new to this...


LOL. That's how I feel, Carley'sMom! The reason (I think) is that the stiffness is what allows groomers to sculpt the elaborate clips and also what holds the shape longer. Fine, soft, straight hair is more limp and harder to clip, at least that is what my breeder told me about her reds. But I like it too. I'd rather keep the softness, but is it possible to get a good poodle look (even a simple pet clip) without stiffening the hair, and using clippers, not just scissors? 

LoveMyDogs, I'm sorry to hear about the loss of your precious pup. Thank you for the tips. I will try using more conditioner and rubbing it in.

Arreau, I am impressed! Now that you mention it, my last red dog also had more typical poodle hair. I didn't groom her myself and didn't really think about it. But my first and now third red both had/have straighter softer coats that are hard to shape. Mousse -- now there's a thought!


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## mom24doggies (Mar 28, 2011)

NorthJerseyGirrl said:


> My dog is just over a year old and I *think* I'm dealing with her adult coat. I just did a quick groom with some of these comments in mind. I used a free sample of Chris C. Spectrum One shampoo that I had lying around and definitely found it made her coat stiffer. I tried to clip her topknot with scissors pointed up. I haven't tried the reverse-comb idea yet - so far the only clipper I've used is the Peanut and its combs simply didn't work on my dog's coat, hence the laborious hand-scissoring.
> 
> Wolfcub, when you say to use heat at the end, I'm not sure what you mean. I am using a human blow dryer on low. Would I just give her a quick puff all over on high (from a safe distance)?
> 
> ...


 You may still be dealing with puppy coat in some areas...Trev just recently got rid of the last vestiges of his and he's 18 mo. I thought he was done too, and then when I clipped him down a few months ago his lower legs came back with much better texture and curl. 

Could it be your clipper? I'm not familiar with the peanut, but if it's really small it may not be powerful enough, those soft coats take a good clipper. I'm not sure if you want to use conditioner (spray on or rinse out) when you are going to scissor/clip them, but in between it would probably protect their coats.

IMO, it really isn't possible to get a good clip when the coat is all soft and limp...you need some texture and body to help. Once you have scissored or clipped them to your satisfaction, you can allow their coats to soften again if you like.


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## NorthJerseyGirrl (Aug 15, 2011)

Hmm - maybe she does still have some puppy fur. Your suggestions sound perfect. Thanks so much!


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## Carley's Mom (Oct 30, 2011)

Carley has a good coat. I do have trouble with her tail pom... Her breeder was so proud of her "show coat"... something she will never see again. lol


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## specie (Feb 27, 2014)

LoveMyDogs said:


> I had a little apricot baby girl who also had poor hair and I used a spray in conditioner ( no rinse kind) made for curly hair that left her coat looking fuller and helped to curly her fly away ends. I dried her with a hair dryer and then sprayed her until she was a bit damp with the conditioner. I then rubbed it in with my fingers. After she air dried, I lightly fluffed her up with the brush. After 12 years, I lost her on Easter day. Very sad day for us. She was such a little lover.


I always had standards and now have downsized to a 9 mo. old apricot mini. What a coat difference!! I am down to a #10 on her face, and she still gets clipper burn if I go against the grain at all. Plus the clipper lines show like crazy. Any hints to the face, or do I just get used to keeping it longer than my black (did her face w/a #30)? Also, my oster A2 seems too big for her delicate face. Would a Wahl moser arco work better? (can't use the moser mini if it only has one blade size and that's not a #10). lots of great info here!


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## Pamela (Sep 9, 2008)

hmmm - ginger used to be like that but now her coat is fairly thick and stiffer - she is 9.


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## ChantersMom (Aug 20, 2012)

ArreauStandardPoodle said:


> Of all the reds I've know, only one had a fine sparse topknot and a little mousse would fix that quick.


What kinds of mousse? People-mousse or is there canine-mousse?


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## loves (Jul 2, 2013)

Clippers with about a 5/8 comb attached would give you a nice finish on body and legs by going in reverse. The peanut clippers will not give you what you want on the body. Moser or Bravuras with the SS combs would probably work, and again you would have various lengths to chose from. I often take the body just a bit closer than the legs and blend it all together. For example, 5/8 reverse on legs and maybe 1/2" or 3/8" on the body. Poodle people do not really want "stiff" hair, but it is much easier to work with and get a nice finish, no matter if you scissor or clipper, if the hair has some body to it. That limp soft puppy coat just doesn't do anything besides lay there.


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