# So Sad He's Sick



## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

It could be sadness, or stress at the unusual disruption, or it could be something physical that just happens to coincide with your absence. I think I would get him checked by your vet if he doesn't improve very quickly.


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## Summerhouse (Jun 12, 2015)

Me and my son went away in the summer leaving our boy with OH who is home all day, work from home. He was taken to his Grans if OH had to go out. But he was sad and didn't eat for the first 3 days we were away. He did keep drinking water so wasn't too worried and would eat the occasional biscuit and drink bone broth.

He didn't eat properly until we got back a week later. Nothing else appeared wrong he was still happy to go on walks, meet other dogs, no temperature, no stomach upset, didn't seem in pain in any way but was very clingy.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

I just went out side with him and the stools he's left in the yard in the last day or two look normal. Plus his nose is cold and wet, so there's that. My son comes home tomorrow around lunch. Hopefully, he'll improve as the day wears on and he realizes we are following our normal routine.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I agree with fjm that while it is most likely he is off because of the disruption to his routine that he could really be sick and that a vet visit is in order if he is still under the weather tomorrow.

I hope it is no big deal.


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## poodlecrazy#1 (Jul 2, 2013)

He definitely sounds like he might be depressed/missing your son. The vomit sounds more like a reflux vomit from to much stomach acid and no food in his belly for it to work on. My girls get it quite often when they don't eat enough. Especially if everything else is normal. I would try and get him to eat, boil chicken or whatever type of meat he can eat if he can't have chicken. Anything in his stomach at this point will help with the acid. If he still seems depressed is there anyway you could contact your son and let him speak to Wrex or even video chat? Even though they say dogs can't comprehend video chatting my girls went crazy and were so happy when they video chatted with my brother when he was gone.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

Unfortunately, my son is at camp out in the woods with his 5th grade class, so I can't reach him unless there was an emergency. I tried bringing a blanket with my son's scent for him to lay with, but he got up and moved. Didn't want to sniff it or anything. Stubborn dog. I've left the food out but he still won't even glance at it. 

I've got some canned pumpkin, so I'll try giving him that as a treat and see if it helps. Good idea, Poodlecrazy!


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

Thank you so much Poodlecrazy #1!! I fed him a couple spoonfuls of pumpkin, then mixed in a bunch with his breakfast. He ate about 2/3 of it, making me very happy. I'll try to get him to eat some more in a few hours.


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## poodlecrazy#1 (Jul 2, 2013)

Yay! Glad he ate something. To bad you can't get a hold of your son. There are so many different types of technology nowadays I was hoping at least a phone call would be possible. Hopefully poor Wrex will be ok until he gets back.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

some dogs do "feel" abandonment. my lowchen male did. the first time i took him to doggy day care, when i picked him up, he lay down in the parking lot and refused to get in the car. strange, eh? but i think it had to do with the car taking him somewhere where he was left without me. he exhibited this kind of behavior at other times. once there was a large number of guests going in and out and i didn't want to risk the dogs getting out of the house. so i put them in my bedroom (where they slept every night, btw) with treats. it got late and when i went to get them, the room was dark. both dogs were waiting at the door to be let out. the female had no problems. but for months afterward the male hesitated to enter the bedroom ahead of me at night - worried about being abandoned, was my conclusion, because with the female in the same room, he certainly was not being left alone.

hopefully wrex will recover as he realizes you and your son do come back to him. it's good to hear that he is beginning to eat again, as that seems to be a signal his world is being put right. (that's another thing, my male dog was a total foodie, but he would refuse even the most desired treats if he was stressed.)


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## hopetocurl (Jan 8, 2014)

Poor Wrex. I can't believe you are having to bribe him to eat. He'll be better after a few days of everyone home.


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## MollyMuiMa (Oct 13, 2012)

Poor sad Wrex! I bet you'll be glad when your son gets home! LOL!


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## Poodlelvr (Mar 13, 2010)

I do hope Wrex recovers quickly and is only feeling sad. However, if this strange behavior continues, take him to your vet. I lost a 3 year old dog very suddenly. I do not want to be an alarmist, but I'd like to make sure all is well.


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

I hope Wrex has started to perk up. It's un-SPOO-like to be lethargic. Skipping a meal would not be unusual for Buck, but listless, would get my attention.


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

I don't want to be the alarmist either, but the first thing that popped into my paranoid mind was Addison's. Please keep this in the back of your mind if Wrex doesn't get better quickly. Addisonian dogs don't handle stress well, whether it is physical, or mental. I know Wrex had a lot of digestive issues in the past, so keeping my fingers crossed that he just has an upset tum. Keep us updated.


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## BeBe67 (May 13, 2015)

I am hoping Wrex gets better soon. It sounds like to me he is depressed. Luna our 8 month old poodle is so attatched to my daughter its crazy. Today my daughter walked out the door to go on an errand and Luna starts crying and yelping like somebody is killing her! When daughter is not home she will walk to her bedroom and cry and whine. My daughter is special needs and has been hospitalized twice since we brought Luna home. We have face timed her while we were in the hospital and the dog went crazy. She was so happy to see her and hear her voice! The dog gets sad and depressed when my daughter is not around, but it has not affected her appetite. It just seems so weird to me, I have never had such a sensitive poodle. 

I hope all is well when your son returns. I bet Wrex well spring right back to his normal self as soon as your son gets home!
BeBe


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

I appreciate all the well wishes. Unfortunately, Wrex is not better today. 


He skipped lunch and dinner on Wednesday and also breakfast on Thursday. Yesterday, as I posted, I was able to get him to eat a couple spoonfuls of pumpkin, so I mixed a bunch in with his 3/4 cup serving of lunch and he ate about 2/3 of it and it stayed down. He hasn't eaten since. (no dinner yesterday, no breakfast today). I've left his kibble out and he won't even look at it. I tried the pumpkin coaxing again and he's not having it. Last night I put him in his crate and gave him his dried turkey treat. He ate it, but when I went back a couple hours later to check on him, he'd brought it back up. A tiny little puddle that looked like pancake batter just before it's time to flip it. This morning I made some plain rice, thinking that it worked when he had upset digestion before, but other than a good sniff, not interested. 

I brought my son home about 1/2 an hour ago, and while Wrex is clearly happy he's back, nothing has changed. Wrex didn't drink at all Wednedsay evening, and while he's had "sips" here and there thursday and today, and is urinating a little, it's disconcerting. I fear his lack of food and water intake is just perpetuating his lack of appetite.

I've got a 1:20pm with the vet today. I'm sure they'll take my summary, do a physical, x ray the belly to make sure he didn't eat anything that's stuck in there and I don't know what else. Possibly give him fluids if he's in as poor a state as I fear.


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## marialydia (Nov 23, 2013)

oh dear. So glad that Wrex is going to the vet. Good luck, and hoping for a quick diagnosis of something readily fixable. Please let us know.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

Charmed- I will be specifically asking about Addison's after reading up this afternoon. He's always randomly vomited. Not frequently enough to think something's up, but that's not really very normal once they leave that young puppy stage. He's 16 months now.

***Although, the infrequent random vomiting is the ONLY symptom I recall him having up until this bought of lethargy and refusal to eat/drink.


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

Do let us know. I've been thinking about him.


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

We'll be keeping our fingers and paws crossed that Wrex gets better soon. He is such a sweetie I hate to see him so down in the dumps.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

*Post Vet Update*

I had to leave him with the vet overnight. Thank goodness our appointment wasn't any later. He really went downhill quickly after my son came home. 

When it was time to leave, I couldn't find Wrex, he wasn't in any of his "spots"; he was hiding in the back corner of my bedroom where he never goes. I had to practically drag him into the vet office and then I had to lift him up onto the scale. He weighed in at 52lb...a big drop from the 60lb he was in April. We sat down away from everyone else, and he began retching right away, bringing up a large puddle of bile. They saw us immediately after that. Wrex wouldn't get up off the floor. I had to lift him up onto his feet and he staggered into the exam room. It was very scary for me.

After relaying the history briefly, Wrex was whisked off to Xray. I did ask the vet about Addison's and she agreed that was possible, agreeing to run the initial blood work should the films come back clear. Well, those films did NOT come back clear. There is was a small amount of stool in his colon, and the intestines were GLOWING with gas. Then, there were the small difficult to discern white round things that appear to be an obstruction of some sort. His guts looked positively wretched.

The doc described the recommended course of treatment: at least 1 night over night at the hospital, anti-vomiting meds, catheter, IV fluids, antibiotics, intestinal parasite check, barium flush with follow up xrays to identify if the obstruction is something they can encourage to pass, or if it is something that needs to be removed. I was told that they could pump him up with subcutaneous fluids, anti vomiting shot and some barium if I wanted to take him home and see what happens, but that she recommended leaving him there. 

I had her give me an estimate of what we discussed and then notified DH. Not that we wouldn't do it, but we always talk about $$$ first.

So. Long story long. He's at the vet hospital for an intestinal obstruction of some sort. I should get an update call later this evening. And I can call in the morning after 9 to see how he is and what the x rays look like.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

so sorry to hear this. glad you took him to the vet and very much hoping for the best of outcomes for your lovely boy and your family.


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

Thanks for the update on Wrex. I'll keep him in my thoughts.


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## Muggles (Mar 14, 2015)

Oh poor Wrex! Thinking of you.


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## marialydia (Nov 23, 2013)

Well, the good thing about this so far is that Wrex is at the vet's where he needs to be. Let us hope that they figure out the obstruction and get to the solution as fast as possible. At the very least Wrex is getting symptomatic support (fluids especially). We are thinking of you and Wrex and hope that he will be well, and home, as soon as possible.


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## MollyMuiMa (Oct 13, 2012)

Thank goodness you took him to the vet!! Hope his obstruction is one that can be resolved without surgery...... poor Wrex! We'll say a puppy prayer for him!


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

Poor Wrex and poor you! Saying extra prayers for Mr. Wrex!


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Poor Wrex! Keep us updated. Fingers crossed the obstruction can be flushed out.


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## mom2Zoe (Jun 17, 2014)

Poor wrex!! Hopefully he will be on the bend and the obstruction will pass. I have been there twice as a puppy with Zoe.
The first time she ate the circle tip of one of my kids baseball caps.They did the same treatment and all passed.GL


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## AngelAviary (Aug 12, 2014)

Oh fingers crossed that he is up and at em tomorrow AM. Lots of love and healing prayers coming yours and his way! I will be thinking of him until you are able to update us on how he is doing!


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## Viking Queen (Nov 12, 2014)

Prayers are with you for your boy.

Vikifng Queen


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

*End of Day Vet Update*

Thank you, everyone for all your kind words and thoughts. I wanted to let you know that my stressed was eased a bit this evening when my vet called to update me on Wrex's status.

Dr Hillary says that Wrex is responding very well to treatment so far. The barium is doing a really good job of coating his intestines and his body is relaxing. She is hopeful that they will be able to offer him some food in the morning. It is a wonderful relief to know he is feeling better and able to rest.

The vet also mentioned that the do a brief electrolyte test before administering IV fluids to ensure they give the right mix. She said that his sodium/potassium ratio was 24:1 and that anything less than 27:1 is suspect for Addison's Disease. Once he gets back on track, we will have an ACTH test done (which they send to Michigan State for analysis) to begin checking for Addison's.

I'll have lots of reading to do this week. The brief amount I've gleaned so far suggests that Addison's could very well have something to do with his food sensitivity, random infrequent vomiting, constant hunger (from his hormones being out of whack and over compensating) and that combined with the stress of me and my son being gone this week, could have contributed to his current state.


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## Axeldog (Aug 29, 2014)

Sending good healing thoughts your way for Wrex. I am glad he is getting the help he needs at the vet. Keep us posted.


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

I am glad he is getting good care and responding well to treatment. I will be thinking of you and sending good vibes.


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## BeBe67 (May 13, 2015)

Wrex Get Well Soon---



BeBe


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## TrixieTreasure (May 24, 2015)

I just found this thread. My goodness, poor Wrex. So thankful he's at the vet where he can get the best care!


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

Just want to let you know that my Sailor has tested out as borderline for Addison's since he was six months old. I have him retested annually/or as needed. His results always bear watching, but did not require treatment. He has always had good food, the right amount of exercise and had plenty of mental stimulation . He has only had one crisis that, thank goodness, responded to intervention quickly. He will be ten years old in December and has led a very happy life. I know we've been very lucky because he never developed full blown Addisons, but it is a very treatable disease. If Wrex ends up having a borderline case like Sailor he will be able to do just about anything you want to teach him to do.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

poodlerick's penny has been diagnosed with addison's. according to rick, she is responding well to treatment and the future looks bright.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

cmarrie, I am so sorry to see that Wrex is really sick and wasn't just lonely. It sounds like the vet is doing a great job getting him rehydrated and settling his gut. I hope they will figure out an easy to manage diagnosis ASAP.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

patk said:


> poodlerick's penny has been diagnosed with addison's. according to rick, she is responding well to treatment and the future looks bright.


I'm reading through that now. I was unable to sleep and I'm trying to stay busy until I can call and see how Wrex is. Penny's crisis sounds so much the same...


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## Streetcar (Apr 13, 2014)

I'm very glad Wrex got to see the veterinarian and so sorry he fell ill. Your vet clearly took things seriously and there's no pooh poohing of concerns going on so that's a relief. All good thoughts for Wrex to have a full recovery.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

*Next Morning Update*

I spoke with the vet today and Wrex is doing well. They have some additional blood work to do, but it sounds like he will be able to come home this afternoon. The items that appeared to be an obstruction have moved to the colon, and so they will not need to do surgery today. That is great news! He is wagging his tail and at some point in the night chewed out his catheter and IV tubes. They are not sure when the fluids stopped, but he did eat this morning, and it stayed down.

It is looking more and more likely that Wrex has Addison's Disease. His sodium/Potassium levels are still out of whack. It could be because he stopped his fluids, but it is also an indicator for Primary Addison's. So, they pulled a blood sample and ran a baseline cortisol test, which came back at LESS than 0.5. Doc says that most dogs come in between 3-5. Based the information they have now, the doc says there's no reason to wait to run the ACTH test. They will pull the samples today. This will save us time in obtaining a diagnosis.

When Wrex comes home, he will have several medications to help recover from his current state, which includes some steroids and possibly some mineral corticoids. Those will have to continue until we receive a diagnosis. Should it come back confirmed for Addison's (which the more I read, the more I'm convinced that's what's wrong), we can begin the process of balancing Wrex's hormones & electrolites. 

While I'm waiting to get a call back from the doc about pick up times and medications, I should be jotting down a list of questions...problem is, my mind is blank!


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

I have had 2 PWDs with Addisons. Neeka is borderline and requires a little Prednisone every few days. My previous PWD Dasher had primary but lived a good life to almost 15 years. It is a relief with this type of dog to get them diagnosed and know how you can help them.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Well it is good to have some news and that it looks like you will have a manageable condition on your hands along with PF Addison's experts to guide you along the way!

I hope Wrex comes around fully once he's home. After all there is nothing better than being home is there?


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## Streetcar (Apr 13, 2014)

Such good news, Cmarrie. And I say that because having a diagnosis permits everyone to move ahead and likely forestall possible future emergencies. Better to know what one is facing than not to. Wrex will be feeling much stronger very soon, I am sure.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

Wrex got sick again after they gave him the ACHT stimulant serum, so they put his fluids cath back in and wanted to keep him for a few more hours. I'm going to get him at 3:30 today. They are also going to begin treatment for Addison's with him before sending him home (mineralcorticoid shot and oral steroids) because the doc said "on the off chance he doesn't have Addisons, the worst side effect is increased thirst and urination. However, if he IS an Addison's dog, the risk of not treating him right away is very serious."

I'm feeling very anxious and stressed. Worried for my boy, worried about fitting medicine costs into the budget, and I ended up having to work this afternoon...even though I don't work Saturdays...because someone didn't train our new producer and now there's a mess to clean up if we are going to be on air correctly next week. 

I've been reading each message and reading through older Addison's threads here as well. *Thank you for every single one.* There is a wealth of information that I'm finding just a bit overwhelming today. I know I need to take it in steps: get on treatment, bring Wrex back to health, absorb test results, understand treatment, THEN look at options for cost reduction and routines. Right now, I just want to bring Wrex home to snuggle and then walk my human son around the neighborhood trick or treating with an adult beverage hidden in my travel coffee mug. Is that so much to ask?


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Well I hope by now you and your son are wandering your neighborhood and that he is getting lots of goodies and that you are enjoying your adult beverage.

It sounds like your vet is doing everything possible to avoid having Wrex suffer a deep crisis and that Addison's is the likely culprit. I wonder if some of his earlier issues could have been related. I hope he gets stable fast. I think once you get the crisis out of the way then you have pretty decent chances to scale back on some of the meds. Prednisone is pretty cheap as I recall from when one of my cats was on it for asthma.


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

I think it stresses an Addison dog to take the ACTH test. My dog Dasher stayed 2 days and nights at the vet hospital after the test and before I could take him home. Then he was weak but stable. Wrex should get better from this point out if Addisons is the main problem. He will have ups and downs but generally be ok.


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## Caddy (Nov 23, 2014)

So happy to hear Wrex is heading home, hope he continues to improve.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

*Wrex is Home*

I want to thank you, minipoo for your first-hand experience. It's comforting to know that he will feel better.

I brought home Wrex today around 4, after having a good long chat with the on-call vet who was with him all day today. I'm trying not to feel disappointed in his condition. Logically, I know that of course he isn't going to be well coming off his spell, and only a few hours after the first dose of medication. Still...I was hoping he would be better than he is. He had a little initial energy when he came home, happy to see us and following my son through the house, but...I could tell it was a struggle for him to do so. The vet said he ate at the clinic, but he's only barely nibbled the specialized canned food the vet sent home. He also kept spitting out his evening pills, so I had to open his mouth and stuff them into his throat. He didn't have the energy to fight me too much. 

We sat on the couch and he fell asleep for about an hour or so, breathing so deep I could hear it. Then he peed like crazy and had the tiniest bowl movement before hanging out in his crate while I took the son trick or treating. He's gone again twice since I've come home, but has refused any food or water. Instead, he's crashed out in a solid sleep for the bulk of the evening. I'm headed to bed, so I just transferred him back to his crate. I'm hoping all this rest will serve him well, sleep it off--and all that, and that he'll have a bit of appetite in the morning.

I can't express how much it bothers me that he won't eat or drink. If he refuses breakfast again, I will probably call the vet. I just don't see how he can get better if he has no nourishment. The fluids they gave him will only last so long, then we will be back to square 1 again, right?


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## Viking Queen (Nov 12, 2014)

May you all have a peaceful night and hope Wrex awakens with renewed energy and an appetite.

Prayers continue.

Viking Queen


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

It takes a while to get the right dosage of meds. Talk to your vet if Wrex is not eating tomorrow to see if you can increase the Pred. That is what we usually do when a dog with Addisons won't eat. Warming the food might help.

I hope he feels better tomorrow.


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## Muggles (Mar 14, 2015)

Poor thing. I hope he feels better in the morning.


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## MollyMuiMa (Oct 13, 2012)

Hoping tomorrow is better for both you and Wrex........we're saying our puppy prayers for you!


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## marialydia (Nov 23, 2013)

Wrex is really going through the wringer. Now that he is home, that should help his spirits enormously. He is clearly making an effort.

I know what you mean about not eating or drinking. It's very worrisome, and I agree it might be useful to call the vet. 
But going from not eating at all, to a full breakfast (with unfamiliar food) may be a bit more than his system can handle.

I'm sure you have your own strategies, but just to mention that with my ill and anorexic dogs I've found that forcing tiny amounts of water with a syringe (without the needle of course) may help a bit...tiny amounts of food in or on your hand, so they can lick it...using Wrex's favorite food (unless medically contraindicated) might also comfort him. Sometimes "priming the pump" will re-interest a sick dog in a bit of eating. There's also the superconcentrated nutritional pastes (nutrical is one) that an ill dog will sometimes lick.


Hecuba had Cushing's the last year of her life (she died at almost 16). I know it's the opposite physiologically, but she did have to get the ACTH test regularly, and quite a lot at the beginning, to get her meds right. Once they were adjusted she did very well.

Good luck, and know that we are thinking of you and Wrex and hope he recovers soon.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

I hope you are waking up to a better scene for Wrex this morning. At least you have him at home. That by itself should help.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

He seems ok this morning. Had a shadow of spring in his step when I took him out in the yard. Peed, then wandered off to the side yard and put his nose in the air to sniff the wind. We came in and he was responsive, almost alert, to his favorite key words: Food, Breakfast, Eat, Hungry. But, when it came down to it, even warmed, breakfast didn't even get a lick. I had to push his soggy pills down again. Not sure how many more times I can get away with that before he realizes his jaw is much stronger than the hands prying it open, LOL. I'll give it some time for the prednisolone to absorb, but if he's still not cooperating, I'll call the vet.

The vet said he sent Wrex home with a dose of prednisolone (a partially activated form of prednisone) that is twice his physiological need. I'm to give him a 5mg pill twice a day for the first 5 days, the 1x day. By then we should have our test results back. I have a follow up appointment scheduled with the doctor who admitted Wrex on Friday next week.

I expect Wrex will have lots of sleeping to do today. I encourage that because our bodies heal while they are sleeping.


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## Mfmst (Jun 18, 2014)

Thanks for the update cmarrie. Big hug from Houston! I know how worried you must be. Hope Wrex has a good rest and wakes with an appetite and a bit more bounce in his step.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Thanks for taking the time to update us. It sounds like there are glimmers of good signs there. I am sure the not eating thing is giving you agita and that you wish there were an easier way to give the meds. I have always put my hands in my dogs' mouths under the guise of the show me your snarly teeth game. None of mine is willing to eat their heartworm pills so I shove them way back into their mouths so they have no choice but to swallow. None of them loves it but it works. If that idea fails (and I wouldn't try to teach Wrex the game while he is feeling poorly) then there is always the hide it in something tasty strategy once his appetite improves.


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

Although you can't crush some pills, you can crush Prednisone. Then mix it with water, draw into a syringe and squirt between his teeth in the back of his mouth. I had to do this to one of our dogs who had stopped eating because she had IBD and she would bite me if I tried to put a pill down her throat.

I hope the day gets better.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

marialydia said:


> But going from not eating at all, to a full breakfast (with unfamiliar food) may be a bit more than his system can handle.
> 
> I'm sure you have your own strategies, but just to mention that with my ill and anorexic dogs I've found that forcing tiny amounts of water with a syringe (without the needle of course) may help a bit...tiny amounts of food in or on your hand, so they can lick it...using Wrex's favorite food (unless medically contraindicated) might also comfort him. Sometimes "priming the pump" will re-interest a sick dog in a bit of eating. There's also the superconcentrated nutritional pastes (nutrical is one) that an ill dog will sometimes lick.





MiniPoo said:


> Although you can't crush some pills, you can crush Prednisone. Then mix it with water, draw into a syringe and squirt between his teeth in the back of his mouth. I had to do this to one of our dogs who had stopped eating because she had IBD and she would bite me if I tried to put a pill down her throat.


Of course, you are right, Marialydia. It is a lot to ask. Now I'm wishing I'd kept all those little medical syringes from when my son was an infant! I found a link in PoodleRick's thread about Penny that lead me to the Facebook group. They seem like a super knowledgeable bunch. Like you guys, they advise me to take it easy and not worry too much just now. That he will eat when he feels better. One, suggested all her dog would eat at first was his training treats...which in the short term is better than nothing. I pulled out Wrex's treats, just some plain ol' simple freeze dried turkey breast and you know what? He can't get enough of it! I had to put it away so we could let his belly settle. Don't want to stuff too much in. There wasn't much left of the bag, so I'll head out shortly and grab some more. I am also seeing in his thread that he was able to use deli meats to spark Penny's appetite. I think will try that as well. Certainly can't hurt. 

I think if I were only forcing down one or two pills, we'd be ok, but 4.5 right now is a bit much! I'm going to get a syringe when I'm out for meat and treats. Although, I'm hoping salty meats will encourage him to drink on his own.


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## Viking Queen (Nov 12, 2014)

Good advice here from all of the above. I might add that liverwurst, braunschweiger in the little tube in the lunch meat dept is nearly irresistable to all dogs. It is soft and sticky and has enticed many dogs to gulp pills. Wrap them up in it. First try a little wad of it as a treat to see if he will "snarf" it down, then try it wrapped on a pill. Just a thought. I find I get hungry for a good liverwurst sandwich following this proceedure!!

Prayers continue of course.

It is good to hear that Wrex is taking note of his surroundings, sniffing the air, eating his special treats. It's a good sign.

Fondly, Viking Queen


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## ArreauStandardPoodle (Sep 1, 2009)

I am sorry about your boy's diagnosis, but thankful it is something treatable and can allow him a normal, happy life once he is back on his feet. Wishing you both the very best!


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## marialydia (Nov 23, 2013)

So glad Wrex is eating his training treats! Progress! You are right to go a bit easy at the beginning. 

Just a note on syringe technique...Minipoo suggests in the back of the mouth, but I have always had success with making a small pouch between the cheek and teeth and squirting the liquid there. Gives them a chance to swallow properly but I have never had them spit it out.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

I plan to practice with plain old water before I start squirting in pills. With my luck I'll mess it up and waste medication!


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

*Wrex is Eating!*

I'm really excited, because Wrex is eating this afternoon! 

At the pet strore, they helped me find the dried turkey treats I wanted, and also sent me home with 6 sample pouches of Honest Kitchen. I came home, put a slice of plain deli turkey on a plate, and no sooner did I sit on the floor with it, than Wrex came over, snatched it off the plate and gobbled it down in 3 bites! Normally, such bad manners are not tolerated, but this one time I can make an exception. I put two more in his food dish and those were gone in a flash. So was the 4th one. I put a big spoonful of the canned food the vet sent home in his dish next. He wanted nothing to do with it, but kept eyeballing the fridge where I'd put the turkey. I removed the vet food and mixed up an HK Turkey sample instead, sprinkling the crumbs from the freeze dried turkey on it. He ate almost the entire serving. 

There is a lot of food in his long empty belly, Naturally, now he's clearly super sleepy. It might be time to take a nap on the couch while I read a book next to him.

I feel so much better that he's getting hungry again!


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

It is so good to hear that he is hungry - definitely now the monent to be insisting on good table manners! I found dilute unsalted chicken broth a good way of getting Sophy to drink when I was concerned that she was not taking enough, both on its own and added to her meals.


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Hungry, even if "rude" about showing it, is awesome!


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## Muggles (Mar 14, 2015)

Yes what great news! Keep recovering Wrex!!


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## Viking Queen (Nov 12, 2014)

Yaaaaay, Wrex!!


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## Chagall's mom (Jan 9, 2010)

Hearing Wrex has an appetite is wonderful!:eating: You're giving him great care throughout this scary ordeal. Counting on all going along better and better! Will be thinking of you both. :clover:


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

YOU GUYS! After his big long nap he walrnt outside and was RUNNING, and played a little ball with my son. I feel so happy. He came in and ate 3 pieces of turkey and drank a little water.

I think it will only get better from here.


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## Muggles (Mar 14, 2015)

Yay!!


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## Streetcar (Apr 13, 2014)

Hallelujia, and like you, I care not how his manners are just now, only that he ate !!


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

Thanks for the good news !!!


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

So glad for you and Wrex!


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

I was so excited when I posted last night I pressed all the wrong keys - "now" should have been "not"! So pleased to wake up to such good news - it sounds as if he is definitely on the mend.


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## hopetocurl (Jan 8, 2014)

Wow! I missed a lot on this thread. I just got caught up. I am sorry to hear that Wrex may have Addison's, but feel hopeful because it is treatable! I hope that he continues to eat and gets to feeling 100% very soon.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

Wrex is doing well today, other than being really skinny. I don't like feeling his spine so acutely on his back. 

He's eating that Honest Kitchen stuff with great enthusiasm, but is not interested in his kibble. I hope that returns in time, because if I'm working Addison's shots into the budget, there's not room for $100/mo food!!! (plus that stuff smells disgusting ). I won't rush the kibble issue. For now, I'll feed him what he'll eat and hand feed him a few kibbles at a time like treats. Once he's feeling 100% and at a healthy weight I'll start mixing things together and transition him back. Who knows, he might do it on his own. I've been leaving the kibble out for him to gnash on at any time he likes.

Also, deli turkey rocks. It's perfect for hiding pills. No more forcing them down!!!


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

Oh dear...I'm so late to this thread. I'm sorry that you've been going through this with Poor Wrex and that he's been so sick. But it is good you've got a Dx and it can be treated so successfully most always. But what a roller coaster you've been on. It is good to know he is finally eating and feeling a little better. Sending positive vibes that he continues to feel better and gains some weight back. 

With the pills, usually peanut butter has always worked well for me. But the first day I brought Matisse home from his surgery, he even refused that! So, I had some Pill Pockets I had almost forgotten about. And those have a really strong, smokey flavor. (probably really bad for them as a regular diet) But anyhow, that worked. He takes his pills fine with those. It may work for Wrex too. Good luck and I'm hopeful that things will level off and be fine.


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

cmarrie, how's Wrex?


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

Yes, I hope he is better and that you are now making adjustments for his medication regime and finding a new routine. Now we have Dulcie to worry about too. Too many sick poodles, too sad.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

He is doing SO WELL!! Pretty much back to his regular old self. He started back on his normal food Monday morning, has lots of energy, wants to be outside, is playful and happy. I'm giving him a little extra food, but because he didn't have any fat to lose when he lost his 8lb, it will take a little time for him to rebuild that muscle. 

I need to go back and look up who it was that posted the link to the Facebook group in Penny's thread so that I can send them a personal thanks. It is an AMAZING resource. It's basically a support group for people who have dogs diagnosed with Addison's Disease. The forum is moderated and administrated by several DVMs and highly experienced people. They are active in the group, answer all kinds of questions. Not all vets subscribe to the same types of treatment and many are resistant to newer advances in dosages. The doctors on this board encourage you to post test results for medication management education and advice so that we can advocate for our dogs. I've been reading and reading and reading until my brain is numb and my eyes dry out about this disease. We still don't have the test results back, but I feel educated, more confident, less overwhelmed and ready to have an intelligent conversation with his vet on Friday at the follow up appointment. 

Wrex has been quirking his nose at me like a rabbit this afternoon. It's probably a side effect of too much predisone, but it's still adorable. He's been showing other signs that it's time to cut back today too. I can't keep his water bowl full (so of course he wants to go out all the time), he's restless, his nose is runny and he's panting when he hasn't exerted himself. So, I'm going to skip his evening dose starting today, instead of tomorrow. I ran it by the vet just to be sure, but determining how much he needs on a daily basis will be something I'll need to do on my own once we've established a treatment plan.

This definitely isn't an ideal situation, and it will never be a budget-friendly condition, but Wrex has options and I feel like I can handle it. I'll have more information regarding his long-term situation Friday.


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

So glad Wrex is doing so well. I am keeping Neeka on a very very low dose of Prednisone. I asked the vet for 1 mg pills which are very tiny and easy to put in canned food. That way I can give her 1-2 mg doses without cutting larger pills and not getting a precise dose. I got a 100 pills at a very low cost. I give it to her every other day since she is borderline.

My other dog had primary and I had to give him pred every day but I tried to keep it as low as possible to avoid the side effects you are having now with Wrex. It is a juggling act that you have to figure out.


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## AngelAviary (Aug 12, 2014)

Oh this is such good news to read! I hope he continues to improve and you are able to cut his dose down with no set backs. Keep up the great work Mom, you are doing great! Keep getting better Wrex! Your too special to a lot of people!


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## JudyD (Feb 3, 2013)

Happy, happy news!! So glad for both of you!


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## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

Excellent news - so good to hear Wrex is much better, and you are feeling more in control of he whole thing. I hope all goes well at Friday's vet visit.


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## PoodleRick (Mar 18, 2013)

Late to this thread. Soon as I read lethargic and appetite loss after some stress the first thing I thought was Addison's. I know it's supposed to be a really rare disease but honestly I think a lot of dogs go through the lethargic/off their food cycle but then recover on their own. Maybe that's a really mild case of it. Anyway, sorry to hear he has it but it's a really manageable disease. It'll take a month or so for the vet to figure out if he'll need a shot every three week or four and to adjust the dosage of the pills. Penny is a one shot every four weeks and 1/4 of a 5mg tablet every other day. And the vet says that if a stressful situation is coming just pop another Prednisone and everything should be fine.

Rick


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## PoodleRick (Mar 18, 2013)

cmarrie said:


> He is doing SO WELL!! Pretty much back to his regular old self. He started back on his normal food Monday morning, has lots of energy, wants to be outside, is playful and happy. I'm giving him a little extra food, but because he didn't have any fat to lose when he lost his 8lb, it will take a little time for him to rebuild that muscle.
> 
> I need to go back and look up who it was that posted the link to the Facebook group in Penny's thread so that I can send them a personal thanks. It is an AMAZING resource. It's basically a support group for people who have dogs diagnosed with Addison's Disease. The forum is moderated and administrated by several DVMs and highly experienced people. They are active in the group, answer all kinds of questions. Not all vets subscribe to the same types of treatment and many are resistant to newer advances in dosages. The doctors on this board encourage you to post test results for medication management education and advice so that we can advocate for our dogs. I've been reading and reading and reading until my brain is numb and my eyes dry out about this disease. We still don't have the test results back, but I feel educated, more confident, less overwhelmed and ready to have an intelligent conversation with his vet on Friday at the follow up appointment.
> 
> ...


Yeah, it certainly wasn't cheap with Penny either. Especially when they tested her potassium level fairly early on in the process and she was low but still passed so there was test after test to find what was wrong with her. Then as a last resort they tested again and bingo, Addison's. Vet bill wound up around the 4-5k but we had insurance on Penny since the day we brought her home. Then there were the weekly visits for blood test to measure the potassium level as a guide to determine the amount of prednisone to give. So now finally we're at the once a month visit for the shot. We bought the bottle for around $200 and we are their only Addison's case so when we go for the shot it's only a visit charge of like 30 bucks or so.

Rick


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

PoodleRick said:


> Late to this thread. Soon as I read lethargic and appetite loss after some stress the first thing I thought was Addison's. I know it's supposed to be a really rare disease but honestly I think a lot of dogs go through the lethargic/off their food cycle but then recover on their own. Maybe that's a really mild case of it. Anyway, sorry to hear he has it but it's a really manageable disease. It'll take a month or so for the vet to figure out if he'll need a shot every three week or four and to adjust the dosage of the pills. Penny is a one shot every four weeks and 1/4 of a 5mg tablet every other day. And the vet says that if a stressful situation is coming just pop another Prednisone and everything should be fine.
> 
> Rick


I'm SO glad you popped in, Rick. Hearing that you and Penny are doing well 6 week or so after her diagnosis is so encouraging! I was just getting ready to search the forums for an update on you guys when your message popped up.



PoodleRick said:


> Yeah, it certainly wasn't cheap with Penny either. Especially when they tested her potassium level fairly early on in the process and she was low but still passed so there was test after test to find what was wrong with her. Then as a last resort they tested again and bingo, Addison's. Vet bill wound up around the 4-5k but we had insurance on Penny since the day we brought her home. Then there were the weekly visits for blood test to measure the potassium level as a guide to determine the amount of prednisone to give. So now finally we're at the once a month visit for the shot. We bought the bottle for around $200 and we are their only Addison's case so when we go for the shot it's only a visit charge of like 30 bucks or so.
> 
> Rick


The more I read, the more grateful I am that Wrex's episode was truly mild, as far as Addisonian crises go. I was able to bring him home after his clinic stay last week with a bill of just over $600. I expect to spend $300-$400 more in the next month in vet visits and blood work to monitor his electrolytes and figure out his LED (lowest effective dose). That's still a big strain for us, but I know we are lucky. I think we ended up avoiding more costs because on the advice of PF members, I asked my vet about checking for Addison's first thing at my initial appointment. They took me seriously and checked for preliminary signs right away. So thank you, PF community for your spot on advice! My checkbook thanks you too!!

I've spent hours this last week on this Facebook group Addison's Dogs-Canine Addison's Group They are a bit argumentative the last couple days, (I think with all the stress we are under with the diagnosis, people find themselves too easily offended) but if you can scroll past that, it is a treasure trove of information. Even if you never post yourself, it's worth checking out. 

Speaking of that FB group, I was wrong in where I found it. It was actually buried in a 2 yr old PF thread started by faerie when her spoo, Temperance, was diagnosed. CountryBoy shared that link and I will forever be grateful to him for it!

For now it's life as usual around here while we wait for Michigan State to send back the official results.


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## Chagall's mom (Jan 9, 2010)

You did everything right to care for Wrex. I admire your grace, vigilance and calm in dealing with his illness. Sorry your boy has joined the ranks of those with Addison's, but glad the path forward is manageable.:clover:


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## Wren (Jul 2, 2013)

*Poodle Rick*

If you or your wife feel like you could (or want to learn how) give Penny her shot, check with your vet. Maybe I'm wrong, but you strike me as the type of person that wouldn't have any problems giving a shot if need be. :nod: 

I have a friend who gives her poodle the shot every month.

So glad to hear Wrex is feeling better.


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## Poodlebeguiled (May 27, 2013)

Well, it's so good to read that he's pretty much back to his own self. Awesome. You sure did everything right to get him diagnosed and back on track. What an ordeal though. So glad he's feeling so much better.


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## N2Mischief (Dec 3, 2012)

We have a cat that when he has to be on antibiotics we can't do it orally, he goes ballistic. So the vet sends us home with injections and we do it ourselves. That would be great if your vet allowed you to do it!


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

I have given subcutaneous shots to my dog and even my husband when he had a blood clot in his leg. But when my vet showed me how to give my dog the mineral cortisol injection, they mentioned it was intramuscular and there was a nerve in the butt that I would have to be careful to avoid. Dasher did not have a lot of muscle in hs rear. So I chickened out.

So your vet would probably show you how to do the injection if you want to do it yourself and save a little money. It would also be less stressful for your dog not to go to the vets for the injection.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

*Diagnosis Confirmed*

Well, Wrex has an official diagnosis of Addison's Disease. The vet called this evening and left a message while I was cleaning up after dinner. His baseline cortisol was 0. They did a chemical stimulation of the adrenal gland (ACTH stim test), and waited 2 hours. His baseline cortisol was STILL 0. No wonder he vomited after the serum was injected. We are still on with the doc in the am to work out a treatment plan.

By the way, I've already messed up Wrex's meds. Somehow I neglected to give him his prednisolone this morning with his antibiotics. Around 3:30, I was wondering why he was acting so tired. After counting out pills, I gave it to him and yup, he perked right up. I'm going to pick up a pill box while we are out tomorrow that I can fill for the whole week. I'll keep it right in his kibble tub as an In My Face Reminder every morning when I feed him. DH does the morning routine every Wednesday, and my mom is supposed to come stay with the dog and kid later this month. This will be useful for them too.

Regarding giving shots myself: Not something I'm ruling out, but it's definitely not something I'm prepared to do anytime in the foreseeable future. Aside from the standard sort of nerves that come with that prospect, I have a terrible fear of needles and some medical procedures. For example, I get queasy and faint when the eye doc administers eye drops...I have varying levels of anxiety and panic when I need to take my son for shots, or when I need to have blood drawn. I always have to forewarn the technician that I'm likely to pass out or cry. I'll need some desensitization before giving shots myself is an option! LOL.

Time for bed. We shall see what the morning brings.


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## Charmed (Aug 4, 2014)

Just in case you need to hear this, Wrex is lucky to belong to you. You have always been so concerned about his well-being, and your concern certainly saved him this time. Give yourself a big pat on the back. You are doing a good job!


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## PoodleRick (Mar 18, 2013)

Wren said:


> If you or your wife feel like you could (or want to learn how) give Penny her shot, check with your vet. Maybe I'm wrong, but you strike me as the type of person that wouldn't have any problems giving a shot if need be. :nod:
> 
> I have a friend who gives her poodle the shot every month.
> 
> So glad to hear Wrex is feeling better.





N2Mischief said:


> We have a cat that when he has to be on antibiotics we can't do it orally, he goes ballistic. So the vet sends us home with injections and we do it ourselves. That would be great if your vet allowed you to do it!





cmarrie said:


> Well, Wrex has an official diagnosis of Addison's Disease. The vet called this evening and left a message while I was cleaning up after dinner. His baseline cortisol was 0. They did a chemical stimulation of the adrenal gland (ACTH stim test), and waited 2 hours. His baseline cortisol was STILL 0. No wonder he vomited after the serum was injected. We are still on with the doc in the am to work out a treatment plan.
> 
> By the way, I've already messed up Wrex's meds. Somehow I neglected to give him his prednisolone this morning with his antibiotics. Around 3:30, I was wondering why he was acting so tired. After counting out pills, I gave it to him and yup, he perked right up. I'm going to pick up a pill box while we are out tomorrow that I can fill for the whole week. I'll keep it right in his kibble tub as an In My Face Reminder every morning when I feed him. DH does the morning routine every Wednesday, and my mom is supposed to come stay with the dog and kid later this month. This will be useful for them too.
> 
> ...


I wouldn't mind doing it myself. We'll see what the vet says. I have no problem with the queasies. I begged, I mean begged, my surgeon to give me a local and let me watch the various surgeries he performed on me after my motorcycle wrecks but he wouldn't play along. :angry:

Rick


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

I've kept Wrex's breeder in the loop this week, because I would want to know if I were her. She doesn't have any experience with Addison's said she's only read about it and it sounds like this is the first of her puppies to have developed it. She asked several questions about the testing and medications, then this evening she sent me a note that if I were interested I could have one of her current litter. That I could either keep Wrex or return him to her but, "I don't give refunds." She also stated that she didn't think Addison's was genetic, but that she would offer me one of her pups anyway.

I was kind of...offended. Not that she would offer to uphold the Health Guarantee portion of the contract. I do appreciate that. I don't know, the way it was worded doesn't sit well. Hypoadrenocorticism isn't genetic? Then I guess all those universities are wasting their time researching a genetic test for it. Sorry. I thought reaching out to her was the responsible thing to do. Never did I ever say anything about costs or money or that I expected anything from her. I am not at all interested in starting over with another puppy. Even though I complain about Wrex being a pain all the time, I can't fathom returning him. Not when there's no warm and fuzzies...no "how's Wrex feeling?" or "I'm so glad the meds are working!" What is she going to do? Re-home a 16mo neutered male who comes with an uncurable disease that requires a monthly budget, owner education and commitment to ensure he stays well? That's not easy. Would he be put to sleep if I return him? No. 

Maybe I'm just being emotional, it's been a stressful week and I certainly don't want to bash anyone undeservedly. I haven't worded my response yet, but it will basically just say, thanks but no thanks. I thought you should know since Wrex is one of yours, but we love him and intend to keep and care for him as best we can. I appreciate your offer of a replacement puppy, but it's not neccessary.


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

The cause of Addisons may be genetic but I think it is still an unproven theory of genetic mutation causing autoimmunity that damages the adrenal gland. Other things like an infection or a tumor can cause Addisons. Just in case some dogs are Addisons-prone, breeders should take note when they produce puppies with this disease. I think Portuguese Water Dogs are prone to this disease for whatever reason since 2 of my 3 PWDs have had Addisons.

I can understand your negative feelings toward your breeder. You pay a lot for a dog and just don't expect to have to pay high medical bills for your carefully picked purebred puppy.


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## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

You've had a rough week, and it seems everyone disappoints you. Everyone that matters, vet, breeder. I would feel exactly the same.

As for the breeder, unfortunately I have often felt like they tend to take it very personal when something happens to a dog. Instead of being open and interested in knowing about the condition, she was on the defensive and on her guards. Which is keeping her from learning. I, too, would be really offended by the take back offer. No way in hell would I return a dog after so long. I couldn't return Merlin after two weeks !

Having said that, try not to take it personal. She is probably used to people wanting money from her when their dogs get sick, bringing the dog back or taking another puppy. A lot of people are like that. But not you. You're the real kind, the good kind.

You've done so good by this dog, don't let anyone make you think otherwise.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

MiniPoo said:


> The cause of Addisons may be genetic but I think it is still an unproven theory of genetic mutation causing autoimmunity that damages the adrenal gland. Other things like an infection or a tumor can cause Addisons. Just in case some dogs are Addisons-prone, breeders should take note when they produce puppies with this disease. I think Portuguese Water Dogs are prone to this disease for whatever reason since 2 of my 3 PWDs have had Addisons.
> 
> I can understand your negative feelings toward your breeder. You pay a lot for a dog and just don't expect to have to pay high medical bills for your carefully picked purebred puppy.


Standard Poodles and Great Danes, and I think Wheaten Terriors too.

I don't blame my breeder for Wrex being sick. I know it happens. It's not like you can plan a litter to guard against it the way you can with other conditions. I just wasn't expecting such cold response, I guess.


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## patk (Jun 13, 2013)

i think it would be helpful to read this thread, especially the most recent posts: http://www.poodleforum.com/2-member-introductions/176465-addisions-poodle-graphic-line-2.html

it may be the thread that cmarrie referred to earlier where she learned about the facebook group. in any case, a very important point is made by charismatic millie about addison's being "set" in the breed and not necessarily being predictable in terms of appearance (though scientists are working on it). 

given that we now have at least three spoos of active pf members - penny, wrex and probably dulcie - with addison's, i hope all are reporting their cases to the vgl diversity study mentioned in the 15th post in that thread. i assume the more we know, the better the chances are of improving the lives of your spoos.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

Dechi said:


> You've had a rough week, and it seems everyone disappoints you. Everyone that matters, vet, breeder. I would feel exactly the same.
> 
> As for the breeder, unfortunately I have often felt like they tend to take it very personal when something happens to a dog. Instead of being open and interested in knowing about the condition, she was on the defensive and on her guards. Which is keeping her from learning. I, too, would be really offended by the take back offer. No way in hell would I return a dog after so long. I couldn't return Merlin after two weeks !
> 
> ...


You are right, Dechi. Thank you. I hadn't thought about her having to deal with whiny, blameful owners. I haven't much of a relationship with her this whole year, so how can I expect her to know my motives don't have a hidden agenda.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

patk said:


> i think it would be helpful to read this thread, especially the most recent posts: http://www.poodleforum.com/2-member-introductions/176465-addisions-poodle-graphic-line-2.html
> 
> it may be the thread that cmarrie referred to earlier where she learned about the facebook group. in any case, a very important point is made by charismatic millie about addison's being "set" in the breed and not necessarily being predictable in terms of appearance (though scientists are working on it).
> 
> given that we now have at least three spoos of active pf members - penny, wrex and probably dulcie - with addison's, i hope all are reporting their cases to the vgl diversity study mentioned in the 15th post in that thread. i assume the more we know, the better the chances are of improving the lives of your spoos.


Actually, no. The link came from Faerie's thread about Temperance in 2011. I've started my PHR Database registration and emailed Nancy about the UC Davis study info. Thanks, Patk!


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## lily cd re (Jul 23, 2012)

cmarrie I understand feeling disappointed in the breeder's response, but Decchi hit on an important idea in that it is probably somewhat understandable that a breeder might feel defensive. I think your planned reply is very diplomatic.


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## PoodleRick (Mar 18, 2013)

cmarrie said:


> I've kept Wrex's breeder in the loop this week, because I would want to know if I were her. She doesn't have any experience with Addison's said she's only read about it and it sounds like this is the first of her puppies to have developed it. She asked several questions about the testing and medications, then this evening she sent me a note that if I were interested I could have one of her current litter. That I could either keep Wrex or return him to her but, "I don't give refunds." She also stated that she didn't think Addison's was genetic, but that she would offer me one of her pups anyway.
> 
> I was kind of...offended. Not that she would offer to uphold the Health Guarantee portion of the contract. I do appreciate that. I don't know, the way it was worded doesn't sit well. Hypoadrenocorticism isn't genetic? Then I guess all those universities are wasting their time researching a genetic test for it. Sorry. I thought reaching out to her was the responsible thing to do. Never did I ever say anything about costs or money or that I expected anything from her. I am not at all interested in starting over with another puppy. Even though I complain about Wrex being a pain all the time, I can't fathom returning him. Not when there's no warm and fuzzies...no "how's Wrex feeling?" or "I'm so glad the meds are working!" What is she going to do? Re-home a 16mo neutered male who comes with an uncurable disease that requires a monthly budget, owner education and commitment to ensure he stays well? That's not easy. Would he be put to sleep if I return him? No.
> 
> Maybe I'm just being emotional, it's been a stressful week and I certainly don't want to bash anyone undeservedly. *I haven't worded my response yet, but it will basically just say, thanks but no thanks. I thought you should know since Wrex is one of yours, but we love him and intend to keep and care for him as best we can. I appreciate your offer of a replacement puppy, but it's not neccessary.*


I'd word it just like that. I think that says it all, and maybe some links to Addison's and genetics and treatments.


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## Chagall's mom (Jan 9, 2010)

cmarrie said:


> ... The link came from Faerie's thread about Temperance in 2011...


Just to encourage you along, *faerie*'s girl became a UKC Champion in September 2015. So you_ know _Temperance, a/k/a CH Tintlet Petite Fluer Bleue, is doing _really _well. Best wishes for Wrex to!:clover:


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## Click-N-Treat (Nov 9, 2015)

I'm new to PF but not new to Addison's. Our weimaraner has had it for ten years. She's almost 13. We use prednisone several times a week, and a shot of Percorten v once a month. April's only crisis was at diagnosis. Other than that, she's been a normal, happy dog. We give April an extra prednisone during stressful experiences, like fireworks or thunderstorms. (Yes, April is a gun dog. Yes, she is afraid of loud noises. Yes, we do laugh about it. Thanks for asking.) 

I hope everything turns out well for Wrex and all the other Addison's poodles. Just wanted to let you know you have my support. If I can help in any way, let me know.


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## Beaches (Jan 25, 2014)

Cmarrie,
I've been following your thread, heart in my mouth a few times, and blessed relief at others. So glad that Wrex is feeling better and starting to enjoy food again. I can't imagine what you've gone through this past couple of weeks. Let's hope that moving forward gets easier. So glad you have some resources to tap when you have questions. 
Give your boy a hug from Ontario!


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

Chagall's mom said:


> Just to encourage you along, *faerie*'s girl became a UKC Champion in September 2015. So you_ know _Temperance, a/k/a CH Tintlet Petite Fluer Bleue, is doing _really _well. Best wishes for Wrex to!:clover:


She did? That's Awesome! Thank you. I love to hear happy stories like that.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

Click-N-Treat said:


> I'm new to PF but not new to Addison's. Our weimaraner has had it for ten years. She's almost 13. We use prednisone several times a week, and a shot of Percorten v once a month. April's only crisis was at diagnosis. Other than that, she's been a normal, happy dog. We give April an extra prednisone during stressful experiences, like fireworks or thunderstorms. (Yes, April is a gun dog. Yes, she is afraid of loud noises. Yes, we do laugh about it. Thanks for asking.)
> 
> I hope everything turns out well for Wrex and all the other Addison's poodles. Just wanted to let you know you have my support. If I can help in any way, let me know.


Welcome to PF! and I'm glad you jumped in with your experience. I was just reading your post in my vet thread when I saw there was activity here too. I'll be sure to reach your when I need support. 10 years of no crisis! That's wonderful! How much extra pred do you give April when you need to? Did you automatically give extra to her for certain situation off the start, or did you wait and see how she reacted first? Were there other situations you discovered where she needed a bit extra, that you didn't expect? What sort of behaviors/symptoms do you see in her that signals you she might need a little extra? Do you not have problems with up & down days giving it only every other? How soon after April's crisis did you move from every day pred to every other? Please don't be sorry you offered to help. I promise I won't always have a zillion questions!


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

Beaches said:


> Cmarrie,
> I've been following your thread, heart in my mouth a few times, and blessed relief at others. So glad that Wrex is feeling better and starting to enjoy food again. I can't imagine what you've gone through this past couple of weeks. Let's hope that moving forward gets easier. So glad you have some resources to tap when you have questions.
> Give your boy a hug from Ontario!


Thank you so much, Beaches. I certainly will! Wrex is still doing well and enjoying all the varied nuances of his kibble three times a day. Sadly, last night was the last of his antibiotics, so there won't be "sprinkles" on it anymore. LOL


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## Click-N-Treat (Nov 9, 2015)

No such thing as too many questions! Cmarrie, you are in this for the long haul and I am here to help in any way I can. First off, the every other day prednisone routine started out as an every day prednisone routine. Then we tapered back to every other day. I think it took a few weeks. April needed to get a level of cortisone in her blood that was stable and helpful. Then we backed off. So, too much is better than not enough, in the beginning. If your dog has good day, horrible day, good day, horrible day, Wrex may need more prednisone, not less. 

Percorten was dosed by weight, I think. And it was adjusted via blood work. Then April stabilized. It didn't happen instantly. There were some adjustments in the first few months, but after that she was back to doing normal April stuff. Like, opening cupboards and stealing stuff. Do weimaraners have opposable thumbs? They must.

We never waited to see how April would respond to a stressful situation. We gave the extra prednisone ahead of time. So, on the 4th of July, extra pred. New years Eve, extra pred. If severe storms were predicted, we gave April an extra pred ahead of time. Waiting until you see how your dog responds to stress might be a mistake. Our dogs don't have natural stress hormones and need us to replace them. So, assuming they will be stressed and giving prednisone to help, works better than waiting. 

As far as unexpected things, you'll get to know Wrex better over the years. You'll be able to tell when he needs a boost. Being lethargic is our sign that something is off. It's a day-to-day thing. Watch your fur kid, get to know things that upset him. Loud noises? Too many guests in the house? Traveling? Fireworks? Thunderstorms? Watch your furkid and see what things upset him.

I hope this helps. I'm in chemotherapy land today and I'm not sure if I'm making sense. I just didn't want you to think I abandoned you. I'll be more with it tomorrow and I can answer more questions then. I'm too ill now. Sorry. Gentle hugs.


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## Naira (Jan 9, 2015)

Just caught up. I'm glad Wrex feels better and is acting more like himself now. I know we don't want our dogs to have any issues but in thankful he has a very treatable issue. Wishing you guys the best


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## MiniPoo (Mar 6, 2014)

I really think Click-n-Treat explained how to deal with a dog with Addison's very well. I especially like his point about giving extra Prednisone BEFORE a known stressful situation instead of waiting to see how they do. Just going to the vets office was very stressful for my dog Dasher, so I always gave him extra Pred before vet visits. With Neeka, it is grooming, especially a bath and dry, that stresses her. So I give her just a little Pred the morning I plan to bathe her or I schedule the bath on days she is due for a Pred dose. She can take some grooming situations well without extra Pred if I keep the sessions very short.

So learning to live with a dog with Addison's is learning what causes them stress, then either avoiding that situation or limiting the exposure to those stressful situations, and giving them extra Prednisone before stressful situations you already know about.


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## cmarrie (Sep 17, 2014)

Click-N-Treat said:


> I'm in chemotherapy land today and I'm not sure if I'm making sense. I just didn't want you to think I abandoned you. I'll be more with it tomorrow and I can answer more questions then. I'm too ill now. Sorry. Gentle hugs.


First of all, CNT, I'm sorry you have to go through chemo. That you would take time out of your day when you surely feel rotten to help me out is above and beyond. Thank you for your thoughtfulness. Know that you have good wishes for strength and resilience coming from Michigan.



Click-N-Treat said:


> Percorten was dosed by weight, I think. And it was adjusted via blood work. Then April stabilized. It didn't happen instantly. There were some adjustments in the first few months, but after that she was back to doing normal April stuff.


AH HA! And so we get to the crux of it!! What you describe is precisely what I want, but is NOT what my current vet does. They don't do any blood work or adjust the dosage at all. You just get your (in Wrex's case, by weight) 2ml of Percortin every 26-28 days and off you go. Maybe 2ml will be what he ends up needing. Maybe it's too much or too little, but how would they know unless they keep an eye on the electrolytes for the first few months as he settles into treatment to see how it effects him? I'd rather not wait until he gets sick again to figure it out. And THAT'S why I'm looking for a new vet. 



Click-N-Treat said:


> We never waited to see how April would respond to a stressful situation. We gave the extra prednisone ahead of time. So, on the 4th of July, extra pred. New years Eve, extra pred. If severe storms were predicted, we gave April an extra pred ahead of time. Waiting until you see how your dog responds to stress might be a mistake. Our dogs don't have natural stress hormones and need us to replace them. So, assuming they will be stressed and giving prednisone to help, works better than waiting.
> 
> As far as unexpected things, you'll get to know Wrex better over the years. You'll be able to tell when he needs a boost. Being lethargic is our sign that something is off. It's a day-to-day thing. Watch your fur kid, get to know things that upset him. Loud noises? Too many guests in the house? Traveling? Fireworks? Thunderstorms? Watch your furkid and see what things upset him.
> 
> I hope this helps.





MiniPoo said:


> I really think Click-n-Treat explained how to deal with a dog with Addison's very well. I especially like his point about giving extra Prednisone BEFORE a known stressful situation instead of waiting to see how they do. Just going to the vets office was very stressful for my dog Dasher, so I always gave him extra Pred before vet visits. With Neeka, it is grooming, especially a bath and dry, that stresses her. So I give her just a little Pred the morning I plan to bathe her or I schedule the bath on days she is due for a Pred dose. She can take some grooming situations well without extra Pred if I keep the sessions very short.
> 
> So learning to live with a dog with Addison's is learning what causes them stress, then either avoiding that situation or limiting the exposure to those stressful situations, and giving them extra Prednisone before stressful situations you already know about.


MiniPoo, Click-N-Treat,
I can't thank the two of you enough for your practical advice. I'm feeling so much better. What you guys are telling me confirms what I've been reading, resonates with what feels right to my logic and gives me confidence that my decision to find a new vet is the correct one. Things are looking good in that department too, but I'll post about it in the Vet Thread. Today has been a good day for Mr. Wrex-A-Roni.


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## Click-N-Treat (Nov 9, 2015)

Glad Wrex is having a good day. Thank you for the well wishes. I am a permanet chemo patient, so it is part of my normal week to feel horrible. Then I perk up and feel better. I am on my way back to the surface. Frankly, I was more concerned about Wrex than myself. Glad he is on the mend. 

Please find a better vet, one that realizes all dogs are different and will tailor Wrex's treatment to match his unique body. Your instincts are spot on. Trust yourself and trust Wrex. You can do this. I am with you, promise.


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## Click-N-Treat (Nov 9, 2015)

MiniPoo said:


> I really think Click-n-Treat explained how to deal with a dog with Addison's very well. I especially like his point about giving extra Prednisone BEFORE a known stressful situation instead of waiting to see how they do. Just going to the vets office was very stressful for my dog Dasher, so I always gave him extra Pred before vet visits. With Neeka, it is grooming, especially a bath and dry, that stresses her. So I give her just a little Pred the morning I plan to bathe her or I schedule the bath on days she is due for a Pred dose. She can take some grooming situations well without extra Pred if I keep the sessions very short.
> 
> So learning to live with a dog with Addison's is learning what causes them stress, then either avoiding that situation or limiting the exposure to those stressful situations, and giving them extra Prednisone before stressful situations you already know about.


Minipoo is spot on. And each dog finds different things stressful. We have to watch for our dog's triggers and act ahead of time.


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