# Rats??



## Charmed

I had pet rats for about fifteen years. Males live longer and have fewer tumors. Females are livelier...skittery you might say. If you start with young rats and handle them daily they will be friendly to all people. I did not find this to be the case with dogs. Our rats were friendly to our dogs but were very nervous around dogs that they did not know. They would even get aggressive if the strange dogs came too close to their cage. Our dogs (spoos, rottweiller airedale) were all taught to leave our inside rats alone, but outside rats were fair game. Well, except the poodle, he would never hurt any rat. The outside rats did NOT like him anyway, ha-ha! We kept the rats in a central location in the house so they were always around us; they really are quite social. We had one male that lived six years; the hairless females didn't even make it one year. Some of our rats even litter box trained themselves.


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## Quossum

Though I don't have any right now, I have kept rats as pets many times. They are undoubtedly the best small animal pet, hands down. They enjoy being handled and are quite intelligent; yes they can be clicker trained. Mine were classroom pets and during the day were "loose" on a long, wide shelf / cabinet area behind my desk which was decorated with boxes and ladders and toys and such.

Rats and dogs...it's a difficult relationship. It my later years of rat ownership it was hard to have the rats out playing because the dogs were just *too* curious and very difficult to dissuade from harassing them. I understand the rats used in dog sports nowadays do get used to the barking and such and realize they're perfectly safe, but I still feel a little sorry for them.

The only drawback to the rats as pets is their very short life span. I think my oldest lived only 4 years or so. I agree with the assessment that the males are more laid-back and the female more active. There are some really cool colors and breeds, too! Check out the dumbos; they're supposed to have really great dispositions. I had a Siamese rat--very pretty.

Good luck!
--Q


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## poolann

OK so I'll start with my questions lol. Do rats nails need to be trimmed? Did you bathe your rats & if so how often? 

I ask about nails because sometimes I have to trim our cat's nails.


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## ArreauStandardPoodle

We have had two pairs at various times. They are so bright and so sociable and very affectionate. I think it would be very easy to train them, because they just want to please. I would look up a reputable rattery, because a well bred rat can live 6 to 8 years, where the poor little inbred buggers from pet stores generally end up with brain embolisms or strokes at 18-24 months.


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## poolann

Thanks Arreau. I'm in touch with a local rattery. I just don't like the idea of mass farmed animals. These babies are socialized daily & I'll trust the breeder to find good matches for me ;-) 

Just like a puppy!


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## ArreauStandardPoodle

Good luck and please keep us posted. I'd love to hear how the training goes.


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## Quossum

I never trimmed nails or bathed mine, though I'm sure it can be done.

You might want to check out AFRMA: 

American Fancy Rat & Mouse Association

I had a magazine subscription and everything! Lol

--Q


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## poolann

Well these two picked me, literally. The Rex girl (you can't really tell her hair is wavy in pics) climbed into my hand & started grooming me immediately. While I was holding her & checking out another the dumbo girl climbed my body. So now they are mine lol. They don't have names yet but the one with the blaze down her face is the Rex. She takes a treat & hangs out with you to eat it. The other one takes a treat & finds a place to hide & eat. Very different personalities. They were raised with dogs & cats. When they saw my dogs watching from the door they started climbing the cage & wrestling with each other to get a look. I think these ladies are going to be fun.


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## poolann

Oh yeah, I've added another baby gate because the dogs are extremely curious. I very much doubt they will ever roam together


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## Quossum

Congrats! You'll have a lot of fun with them. Nice cage, too!

--Q


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## PoodleFoster

hello
My daughter lives in a tiny apt and dogs/cats are not permitted. She has 3 female rats and 2 beautiful goldfish. They keep her plenty busy.
I have 'rat sat' a few times when she went out of town. I have SPECIFIC instructions on how and what to feed them. NO feeding thru the bars! Handle DAILY!
BATHROOM play time REQUIRED...I dutifully carry them upstairs to the bathroom and watch them for about 20 minutes when they are at my house. I can't take much more than that because they get into everything and it's HARD to watch 3 going in opposite directions! They eat my handmade soap!!!
She just bought a nice cage for them from amazon.com. It is bigger than her previous cages and on wheels. It has levels and she has it all fixed up nicely. 
She lets them climb around in her bathroom every day. She's researched them and knows everything about how to care for them and is doing a great job. 
This is her second family of rats. The first were 2 females and then she rescued a male rat from our local shelter. He was SO pretty, looked like a siamese cat and was twice the size of the females. Unfortunately he was a senior rat when she got him and he didn't live too long, but she sure enjoyed him. YES, he was in a seperate cage, and got extra attention, NO mingling with the girls!
I'm getting adjusted to them, but still don't like the feel of the tails.
When they are here, my dogs don't have any experiences with them. I keep them separate.
ENJOY


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## poolann

Oh I think their tails feel cool!!


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## poodlecrazy#1

Experience with rats! Yes! I love rats, I've had them all my life. They are wonderful pets. I did attempt to clicker train one of my girls, I got her to learn her name and spin and that's pretty much it. I wasn't all that into the clicker training lol. They are very smart though and very trainable. Much more stubborn and intelligent than dogs though so keep that in mind. Girls are going to be more adventurous and hyper, boys like to lay around and are very cuddly. Not quite sure what barn hunt classes are, what are they? 

The Rex gene in rats is pretty difficult usually the coat is its most curly when they are babies and as they go through molts it becomes less and less curly and more relaxed. Males Rex rats usually have better coats than females. Usually with females by the time they are full grown the only way to know they are Rex is that the whiskers stay curly. Also not that you are going to breed but it's fun to know when a Rex is bred to a Rex it will produce a Double Rex,also know as a patchwork rat. They will eventually become mostly hairless and every two weeks or so will grow back hair in patches, shed it again, and then grow it back in different areas. They are fun to own but have a very short lifespan at about 18 months. 

I trimmed my rats nails only because I could and they would really scratch me up if I didn't. I just used cat nail clippers and snipped off the little tips. If you don't want to clip your girls nails you can try putting a clean rough rock of some sort under their water bottle and that should help sand them down. I always had a pee rock in my litter boxes and that helped sand them down somewhat. As for baths yes you can bathe them. Again I did with mine because I could and because the boys really get stinky and gross. The girls didn't get bathed as often because they were cleaner. My Tpoos love my rats and my rats love my tpoos. They had so much fun playing together. My GSD adored them too when she was alive. She loved to play with them and loved when they would clean her teeth. 

Here is a video of my Tpoo's playing with Flash (RIP). (yes I let her free range around the house ? she was a special girl.)
http://youtu.be/KQ92dxLR2FM


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## Michelle

Your rattie girls are adorable! I've always wanted rats but ended up with everything EXCEPT rats over the years. Although my chinchillas were AMAZING and I would get another pair in a heart beat if I had the proper place to take care of them (they require cool climate 70F and below...our a/c broke and my dad had no intentions of fixing it that summer so I had to find my babies a home before they died of heat stroke). That was many years ago, before I even had Atticus...but I sure do miss them. 

If my bf would ever allow I'd like to get a pair of female rats. How is the odor, is it bad? I remember my friend having 3 and that room of their house smelled awful...don't know if they didn't clean it enough or if that is their normal odor. Thats the only thing that has kept me from getting them.


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## poolann

Michelle said:


> Your rattie girls are adorable! I've always wanted rats but ended up with everything EXCEPT rats over the years. Although my chinchillas were AMAZING and I would get another pair in a heart beat if I had the proper place to take care of them (they require cool climate 70F and below...our a/c broke and my dad had no intentions of fixing it that summer so I had to find my babies a home before they died of heat stroke). That was many years ago, before I even had Atticus...but I sure do miss them.
> 
> If my bf would ever allow I'd like to get a pair of female rats. How is the odor, is it bad? I remember my friend having 3 and that room of their house smelled awful...don't know if they didn't clean it enough or if that is their normal odor. Thats the only thing that has kept me from getting them.


The girls are a little stinky. From what I've read the are not supposed to smell much. I'm attributing it to being house with several other rats & hoping it will dissipate. I'll get back to you on that 

Edit: Actually I just woke them for breakfast & they no longer smell! Hardly any odor at all. I found them curled up in a corner sleeping. It was so cute.


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## Charmed

We experimented with many types of bedding and litter box material to cut down on odor. Our cage was 18 by 24 by 36 high, and usually held a trio of rats. The boys' urine had a stronger odor than that of the females. Carefresh paper litter made a nice bedding on the bottom floor of the cage and alfalfa pellets (like cheap rabbit food)worked great in the litter pan. The alfalfa absorbed urine much better than the paper product. When the kids allergies were acting up I would quit using the Carefresh, as it is quite dusty, and would just use old baby receiving blankets. If the blankets were changed twice a week, the rats and their cage did not smell. The kids and I had cage cleaning down to a fine art, ha-ha! We did a thorough cleaning once a week and a quick wipe down in the middle of the week. Be warned that rats are quick to chew things up, so have some place safe to keep them confined while you are cleaning their cage. Oh, and don't have their cage close to anything. Over the years, my rats chewed door frames, wires, and a couple of towels. We had some Houdinis that would liberate themselves(usually involved a kid not latching the cage door correctly) and wreak havoc. My rat- loving poodle was always quick to locate the escapee. I did clip the rats' nails with human baby nail clippers because they would scratch me and I would get huge red welts. We did bathe them; sometimes the males got an oily secretion on their backs. Most of our rats really liked playing in warm shallow water... and then being cuddled in a towel to get dried off.


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## DreamAgility

I really wanted to bring the girls to that, but I don't even know if I can make that day. Kim is so freaked out its so hilarious. Good luck with those cuties!


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## poolann

I thought I'd give an update on the ratties. They are learning their names & I've started using a ball point pen to mark behavior as they were frightened by the clicker. Today Jingle figured out how to run through the 2ft PVC. I had placed cheese far enough inside to get her in. Once she figured it out she ran back & forth having a good time. Bell will put 3/4 of her body in but I'm confident she will get the game too. They are really funny & affectionate creatures. Here are some more pics


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## Charmed

Ah, cute yawn! Reminded me that we used to give our rats Greenies and the fruit flavored Nylabones so that they would gnaw down their big teeth. It was much easier than having to trim their teeth.


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## poolann

Charmed said:


> Ah, cute yawn! Reminded me that we used to give our rats Greenies and the fruit flavored Nylabones so that they would gnaw down their big teeth. It was much easier than having to trim their teeth.


I was just looking at a greenies type bone today wondering of it would work for that.


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## poolann

OK experienced rat folks. I would like to litter train these girls because I can't tell where they pee when if they go on the paper litter in the bottom of the cage. I changed the paper litter & cleaned the cage a couple of days ago. They do pee near their food bowl on the shelves. I had the "litter tray" wired in the bottom of the cage but they were still peeing on the shelves. I've moved it up to an area where they pee'd the most. I also moved their food dish. This is what I found this morning. Although it is very cute I don't want them sleeping in their "bathroom." Any tips on litter training?


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## poolann

Here's the pic


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## poodlecrazy#1

A litter box that connects to the cage bars is a good idea as well as one with a grate so it traps the litter in. Other wise they will just move the litter box and kick out the litter. This is the one I use 

Ware Plastic Scatterless Lock-N-Litter Small Pet Pan- Colors May Vary https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003SLICDA/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_Uzq1ub16YJW6S
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003SLICDA/ref=cm_sw_r_awd_Uzq1ub16YJW6S

Now the most important part litter training and probably the weirdest is a pee rock. Don't ask me why but it is the only thing that ever got my rats to actually use the litter box. For some reason rats just love to pee on the rock. If you search rat forum you will find everyone uses and recommends them as well. Basically you are just looking for a smooth river rock that is large enough to handle a rat standing on it and that they can't move it but small enough it fits in the middle of the litter box but leaves a bit of space around. I usually get ones that fit well in my hands. Also if you are using bedding in the cage make sure your litter is different than the bedding you use. You shouldn't have to do this forever, just while they are first learning. If they poop or pee around the cage scoop the accidents up and place them in the litter box so they get the idea that is the area they should be going. 

One more thing, I'm sure you probably know this and it doesn't look like you use wood shavings but if you ever decide to, never ever ever use cedar or pine! They have toxins that harms rats respiratory tract. Some people say pine is ok but it is not. Aspen is the only wood shavings that should be used and its really not more expensive. Maybe $1-2.


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## poolann

Thank you! The only litter boxes I found locally were either ferret size which seemed huge or really small like maybe for mice. I think maybe the shredded paper I attempted to use was just too comfy to nest in lol

Since that is white I may use it for the bottom of the cage so I can tell where they pee. The pulp litter I purchased is brown & I just can't tell. It's gross but I soaked up some pee with the paper shreds & also put poo in the tray. If they knew to go in a litter box it would make life easier.


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## poolann

An update on training 

The beginning of rat agility: http://youtu.be/gIhLo87P2NU


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## poodlecrazy#1

So cute!!! ???


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## Charmed

A chopstick makes a great target stick for the rats... and you can dip the end in peanut butter.


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## Poodlebeguiled

How cute they are Poolann. I had rats as pets when I was a teen ager and young adult. My kids had pet rats too. I agree they are the greatest for small animals. (We had Guinea pigs when I was a small kid) Anyhow, rats are really cool and smart. In animal behavior we had rats to train and pigeons besides other animals. And they're both a trip to train and hang out with. Have loads of fun with them. I found that among the various rodents, they're the quietest...I mean, if they get out, they don't skitter away too fast. They love sitting on your shoulder and snuggling in the crook of your neck. I had long hair back then and they'd kind of nibble on it. lol. Have fun!


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## cmarrie

I am in no way helpful on this topic. I don't even know what a Barn Hunt is, but I know there is a place locally here who does them.


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## poolann

I have to tell you guys, I had a scare tonight. Bell was humping Jingle & Jingle was enjoying it. She was lifting her tail & backing up to Bell for more. I freaked out! It very much resembled the way rabbits mate so quickly lol

The rattery assured me they were both female but I still googled how to sex rats. The good news is that neither have testicles & both have visible nipples so I believe I am safe. No way do I want a house full of rats!

I really am enjoying these girls (I hope girls)


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## poodlecrazy#1

Lol, yes females will hump each other to show dominance, or just because one might be in heat. I had a dominance humper and she got to be so ridiculous about it I had to separate her. 

Believe me you can tell the difference between boy and girl! Boys have nice sized testicles that they drag behind them right out in the open. Though they can be cryptorchid and do have an open inguinal canal so the can suck them up inside. The fool hardy way to be sure is similar to rabbits you can push down gently and the penis will come out of the sheath. Also females will have a vaginal canal right beneath the urethra (what can be mistaken for a penis at times). Of course neither the penis or vagina will be open until 4weeks old so this method can only be used in older rats. Even though this boy is about 4 1/2 weeks old you can see the fullness between his penis and anus. This is the testicles descending. They will become more obvious as he gets older. You can also see the lack of a vaginal canal under the penis as well.


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## poolann

Yes I'm thinking maybe one of them is in heat. They were acting odd tonight. Randomly biting my fingers & trying to take my socks off while chomping at my toes. Usually they will groom me but never really bite. They seem extra playful jumping higher in the air than normal.

Edit: I wanted to point out that these were not aggressive or painful bites. More of a playful nip. I have mouthy rats lol


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## poodlecrazy#1

Yes they will be different while in heat. And rats go into heat every 5 days! Or they can spontaneously ovulate if stimulated correctly! I guess that is why they are such good reproducers just like bunnies ?. I totally understand the bite thing. There are so many variations in rat bites and very rarely is it aggressive. In the 20 years I have been dealing with rats I have actually never been bitten by one. Rats are like babies they have very poor vision so they explore with their mouth and have very accurate pressure senses. They can tell the difference between a nail and flesh. My rats favorite thing to do was clean out underneath my fingernails. And in a rats mind forget about having bandaids on your fingers! Those things are an alien substance that has no purpose being on their human! They are the best bandaid removers ever! I just love little rat grooms! It is a special bonding time to share with them.


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## Quossum

Haha--yeah, there is absolutely no way you wouldn't know it if you had a male! They are, *ahem*, significantly endowed in the testicular department. I tended to keep males because they're mellower, and yeah, there were some "teachable moments" when my students would say, "What are those things under his tail?" :afraid:

--Q


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## poolann

Quossum said:


> Haha--yeah, there is absolutely no way you wouldn't know it if you had a male! They are, *ahem*, significantly endowed in the testicular department. I tended to keep males because they're mellower, and yeah, there were some "teachable moments" when my students would say, "What are those things under his tail?" :afraid:
> 
> --Q


Lol!!!! Too funny Q


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## Charmed

My daughters referred to the boys' appendages as "torpedoes"... even the four year old could tell the males from the females. And yes, the females in heat get the zoomies; they squeal and jump around like popcorn popping. Have you seen the rats "boggle" their eyes yet? You might be able to find a video of it on youtube; it is the funniest thing, even better than happy bruxing!


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## poolann

The ladies had apples for snacks today. I think they enjoyed them!


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## PoodlePaws

We had a female rat named Riley. I never remember her ever going into heat. Lol


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## ericwd9

During recent hunting for rats (wild and feral) Grace has told me she thinks they are just as smart as she is!!! Boy do they learn Quickly.
Eric.


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## PoodlenPrada

I kept 2 males rats for about 6 years . They were both neutered at a young age and were wonderful little companions. The dog I had at The time was also male but I think he was mother Teresa in his past life because any small animal that came in The house he immediately took over their care and rearing Lol. He and the ratties got along just great and you'd often times find them all piled in a sleep ball in his doggie bed. 

Litter training was a bit difficult initially and they would potty all over The cage, it was a very tall cage with multiple levels, and they sometimes would sleep in The areas they'd use The bathroom in.... which I didn't Care for at all since theyd crawl all over me when they were out. What worked for me wasThe rat version of "crate training." I blocked off all The upper levels of the cage and only gave them access to The ground floor. The only things one The bottom level were The litter box on one side and on The opposite side their food, Water bottle, a hanging sleep hammock and some cage toys. The Floor of all the levels were covered with a sheet of coroplast. As they got used to using only The litter box and not pooping/peeing in other places on The floor I opened up The next level to give them access until finally They had The entire cage to run around in. After opening the next level If we had a lot of set backs I'd close off The level again and wait a week or so until They were consistently using The little box again. It took some time but eventually all was Good and They were consistently using only The litter box and The death of The cage remained pee and poop free. Also, I never used any shavings, litter pellets or anything like that, I only used white butcher block paper in The bottom of The litter box. It was actually suggested to me by The breeder where I got them. Her reasoning was so That you Can keep a monitoring of what's coming out of your ratties and catch any potential illnesses early......things that might go unseen in pellets or other litter bedding. As I mentioned earlier My boys were both neutered At a young age so I think potty training was a little bit easier because they didn't have The instinct to mark all over everything and everyone. 

I bathed My ratties regularly and did clip their nails with human baby clippers. I'd let them play in The bathtub in an inch or so of water with some toys and baby carrots. I don't think They ever really realized It was bath time....just a wet play activity Lol.


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## PoodlenPrada

Quossum said:


> Haha--yeah, there is absolutely no way you wouldn't know it if you had a male! They are, *ahem*, significantly endowed in the testicular department. I tended to keep males because they're mellower, and yeah, there were some "teachable moments" when my students would say, "What are those things under his tail?" :afraid:
> 
> --Q


Isn't that The truth Lol. Aside from the fact that neutering My boys just added a better quality of life for them and for me (NOT being scent marked all The time), That dragging the boy bits behind them Is not visually pleasing to me. I only wanted males because of their more mellow and cuddly personalities so I had to opt for The neutering.


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## poolann

Thanks for the tips! They have a litter box & were pooping in it the first week. Now I'm finding it all over again. They are not taking to the pee rock at all. Only one has peed on me & it was when I came home after being gone for a week. I guess it was her way of welcoming me back ha ha


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## poolann

Just an update on Jingle & Bell. I set up a new cage for them today & we're enjoying the fresh air for just a bit. No luck with the litter training so I've given up in it lol. They're doing well with barn hunt & I've gotten the 2nd cage because I might be getting 2 more babies soon.


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## Charmed

Yeah, some of my triplets litter trained themselves right away, some did it gradually and some never caught on. I never really had any success in teaching them. I did keep their alfalfa pellets only on the very bottom of their multi leveled cage and they all preferred to poop in the pellets. Pee was the issue that varied. For some reason they loved anointing their old tshirt bedding. If I changed that out twice a week, their cage stayed fresh smelling until the weekly cleaning. Like I said, I never did teach any of me sets of rats to be litter box trained; they did it themselves...or not. How do the rats act after a barn hunt? We used to take our ratties for car rides and they loved to go, but were so tired when they got home. Next day, they would run to their cage door, ready for another outing!


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## poolann

Charmed the rats are looking for a yummy snack when barn hunt class is over. I have class from 11:30 to 12:30 & we get to come home for a break. Then we go back from 6-8 or so. They seem to enjoy it & not get overly tired.


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## Charmed

I figured they would; rats are such social creatures!


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## poolann

I haven't update this in a while. I now have 4 girls & put them in the same cage just this week. They have 2 hammocks but prefer to sleep all together.


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## PoodleFoster

Hello Poolann
I have been caring for my daughters 3 female rats for several months. I'm learning a lot! she comes several times per week to check on them but keeps telling me I'm doing a good job. Whew!
She has them in a nice big ferret cage and she put down plastic shelf liner on both levels. I keep them in the basement, away from our poodles.
We have made multiple hammocks and you are right, they all seem to sleep together. One week they like the blue hammock and next week, maybe the green one.
I have enjoyed giving them frozen peas in a cereal bowl, filled with water. Have taken many pictures and I think their little hands are so cute when they hold food. 
WE have a pee rock and that works nicely but someone pees elsewhere too.
They have a litter pan and this works most of the time.
They enjoy their pellets, black sunflower seeds, cheerios and sometimes coconut for a treat. 
I have only left the bottom cage door open once when rushing upstairs to get something to clean with. They weren't interested in the downstairs then so it wasn't a problem. 
they are cute and cuddly and I've gotten over their scaley tails. 
OH, my daughter lives in an apt with a no pet policy. Fish are ok. She and her husband hope to move by spring 2016 when their lease is up. Then the rats go back....


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## Charmed

Thanks for the update. They are cute little things. Please let us know when they go on more barn hunts. When my rats got past the five year mark I would let them have all the bad things for special treats... like Hersheys kisses and M&Ms. It was really cute when they held the big kiss in their "hands" and dove into it.


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## Quossum

They had Barn Hunt at the Houston World Series of Dog Shows this weekend, and I saw someone with a "Rat Wrangler" t-shirt! :biggrin: Looks like a fun event. They say the rats are pretty cool about the whole thing.

--Q


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