# Can I feed him a raw chicken wing and bone



## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

Hi!

Until someone with that knowledge drops by, have you looked thru this stickied thread? Links for Feeding a Homemade Raw Diet

I've not looked thru it, but there's a slew of links to look at.


----------



## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

Has he had bone in his diet already? Are you giving the bone for calcium content or to help with teeth health and teething?


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Raindrops said:


> Has he had bone in his diet already? Are you giving the bone for calcium content or to help with teeth health and teething?


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

I guess I’m doing it for his teeth health, teething and general health. Not all time. As he is 4/5 months old and never had one yet! He chews everything. I’ve given deer antler, chews.. all of it! 
And as a dog it’s a treat to have the occasional bone right!? So is it okay? He ate a bite and I threw the rest to see how he goes


----------



## Liz (Oct 2, 2010)

I feed raw, but my dogs are larger. Raw chicken bone is fine. However, there may be specific hazards due to the size of your dog or the specific cut of bone. You might check out preymodelraw.com or dogfoodforum.com (I'm not sure how active these forums are these days but you can search the archives).


----------



## Dechi (Aug 22, 2015)

Chicken wings wouldn’t be my first choice for a toy. They are safe in general but can definitely be tricky with a small dog. I like to be more cautious than not enough.

Do you brush his teeth ? If not, it’s time to start while he’s still a puppy.


----------



## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

For a tiny puppy I would personally go with chicken necks smashed with a hammer for safety. For chewing bones it is better to give them something large enough that they won't be eating it, just chewing the meat off recreationally. 

If feeding raw, please take care to feed a balanced diet either PMR or BARF model. Bone is a very important part of the diet and should account for 10-20% of the diet. But it must be something easily digestible. Chicken spine, ribs, and necks are better for a small puppy. Necks and spines can be crushed easily with a hammer.


----------



## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Be careful feeding chicken/turkey necks because you can cause dietary induced hyperthyroidism, also known as thyrotoxicosis. Dog's eating other animal's necks will naturally absorb the dead animal's thyroid hormones. The occasional treat is fine, but not as a regular diet.






Dietary Hyperthyroidism in Dogs


This blog is written specifically to serve veterinarians and veterinary technicians. Post deal with endocrine issues, education and research.




endocrinevet.blogspot.com













Can raw diets cause hyperthyroidism?


Is your pet’s raw diet at risk of causing adverse heart conditions, weight loss, and more?




therawfeedingcommunity.com


----------



## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

Skylar said:


> Be careful feeding chicken/turkey necks because you can cause dietary induced hyperthyroidism, also known as thyrotoxicosis. Dog's eating other animal's necks will naturally absorb the dead animal's thyroid hormones. The occasional treat is fine, but not as a regular diet.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's true, though chicken necks sold for human consumption should have the thyroid removed. But still I would vary it for sure.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Skylar said:


> Be careful feeding chicken/turkey necks because you can cause dietary induced hyperthyroidism, also known as thyrotoxicosis. Dog's eating other animal's necks will naturally absorb the dead animal's thyroid hormones. The occasional treat is fine, but not as a regular diet.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Yes thank you for that, I would have never thought. I haven’t feed my puppy anything like that. As they also have splintered into their little necks. So I tried a small amount of the wing. But was still nervous giving him that. 
Would the leg be better because it’s larger or a raw lamb bone?


----------



## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

Lisy Lou 41 said:


> Yes thank you for that, I would have never thought. I haven’t feed my puppy anything like that. As they also have splintered into their little necks. So I tried a small amount of the wing. But was still nervous giving him that.
> Would the leg be better because it’s larger or a raw lamb bone?


Raw bones do not splinter. Only dried or cooked bones do. If you don't want him to consume it then you need a larger bone. But you haven't mentioned if he gets bones in some form in his normal diet. Puppies need enough calcium in their diets so the bone is very important. You can't feed a raw diet without bone.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Raindrops said:


> Raw bones do not splinter. Only dried or cooked bones do. If you don't want him to consume it then you need a larger bone. But you haven't mentioned if he gets bones in some form in his normal diet. Puppies need enough calcium in their diets so the bone is very important. You can't feed a raw diet without bone.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Okay I never knew that. Yes I feed him raw chicken and meet at dinner and science diet biscuits at brekky. With a boiling egg occasionally. So I do need to give him bones too. If you can tell me the best ones for a toy poodle please. Thanks again


----------



## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Lisy Lou 41 said:


> Okay I never knew that. Yes I feed him raw chicken and meet at dinner and science diet biscuits at brekky. With a boiling egg occasionally. So I do need to give him bones too. If you can tell me the best ones for a toy poodle please. Thanks again


Sounds like you are feeding muscles - the meat off the bone such as chicken breast. Muscle has no calcium. Your puppy definitely needs calcium in a balanced amount in his diet. 

You have several choices. You can buy commercially made raw diet labeled as nutritionally complete which would include calcium. You can grind up egg shells to add to his current food or you can feed bones. Everything has to be balanced. You can’t randomly add any amount to his diet.

I don’t feed raw so I can’t help you. Hopefully someone who is knowledgeable can provide you more definitive information.


----------



## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

For a young puppy, I would feed premade complete raw food if you want to feed him raw and have no prior experience. It is possible to do it yourself (I do) but it is an immense amount of work and research and for a toy sized puppy you might as well just go with a premade. That way you will not have to worry about him getting the right nutrients. They really need a good variety of animal meat, bone, organ, and fish to meet nutritional requirements.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Skylar said:


> Sounds like you are feeding muscles - the meat off the bone such as chicken breast. Muscle has no calcium. Your puppy definitely needs calcium in a balanced amount in his diet.
> 
> You have several choices. You can buy commercially made raw diet labeled as nutritionally complete which would include calcium. You can grind up egg shells to add to his current food or you can feed bones. Everything has to be balanced. You can’t randomly add any amount to his diet.
> 
> I don’t feed raw so I can’t help you. Hopefully someone who is knowledgeable can provide you more definitive information.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Okay.. thank you for all the help. Yeah I could crush up the shell then. I started him on cooked chicken but he had smelly stools, then I went through talking to other people about what dogs should be on raw not cooked Meat and vegetables. Other then the science diet biscuits that is specially formulated by a vet. 
I found out with too much home cooked meat, which is what I originally had home on.. but too much turns out ruins their gut health, because apparently as dogs they hunted for their food, they ate the organs first and then fleshy meat. It was very interesting to learn all of this for myself. He has good breath, no smelling wind and is in good health. 
I guess the vet science diet contains calcium in their dry food. So I give him that morning and lunch and then a bit of the raw chicken breast of a night.

So I’ll add in the egg shells. Thanks 😊


----------



## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

Lisy Lou 41 said:


> So I’ll add in the egg shells. Thanks 😊


Please do consult with your veterinarian on this if you decide not to go with a commercially prepared raw formula. Puppies require a careful balance of minerals and nutrients for proper growth.

For example, like Skylar said above, it's possible to give too much or too little calcium (eggshell) if you don't carefully measure it.

Since toys eat so little, I imagine it's extra challenging ensuring all their needs are met.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

PeggyTheParti said:


> Please do consult with your veterinarian on this if you decide not to go with a commercially prepared raw formula. Puppies require a careful balance of minerals and nutrients for proper growth.
> 
> For example, like Skylar said above, it's possible to give too much or too little calcium (eggshell) if you don't carefully measure it.
> 
> Since toys eat so little, I imagine it's extra challenging ensuring all their needs are met.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Thank you I will do that 🙏


----------



## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

PeggyTheParti said:


> Please do consult with your veterinarian on this if you decide not to go with a commercially prepared raw formula. Puppies require a careful balance of minerals and nutrients for proper growth.
> 
> For example, like Skylar said above, it's possible to give too much or too little calcium (eggshell) if you don't carefully measure it.
> 
> Since toys eat so little, I imagine it's extra challenging ensuring all their needs are met.


Yes, calcium needs to be balanced with phosphorous within certain ratios. Otherwise you can have improper skeletal growth. That's why the percentages of bone in raw diets are quite strict.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Hill's Science Diet Puppy Chicken Meal & Barley Recipe


Supports healthy brain, eye, muscle, bone & immune system development in growing puppies




www.hillspet.com.au





This is from my vet it’s the best one with all the healthy ingredients 

Thank you


----------



## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

Lisy Lou 41 said:


> Hill's Science Diet Puppy Chicken Meal & Barley Recipe
> 
> 
> Supports healthy brain, eye, muscle, bone & immune system development in growing puppies
> ...


Is this what he's being fed now or is this what your vet is recommending?

****

Oh, I think I see now .

For breakfast and lunch he gets the Hill's Science Diet, then for dinner you feed some raw.

Is that right? If it is, then the majority of his diet is already balanced for you. The others will be able to advise you better on the raw portion of his daily diet with this information clarified.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Rose n Poos said:


> Is this what he's being fed now or is this what your vet is recommending?
> 
> ****
> 
> ...


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Oh yes I did say that at the start but then realised you may not know what the science diet dog biscuits were. They are only sold by your vet. And is the recommendation for a puppy. 
My original question wasn’t around this in his diet it was about is it safe to give bones and what type? As I have fears around them choking or getting caught in their little throats. 

I have his diet covered with all the Healthy stuff. I was getting confused I’m sorry. 

I just needed support around what bones are safe? I don’t believe in chicken necks big are other parts like wings and legs (the bones safe?) 
And how much is necessary in their diets? I can ask my vet in 6 weeks on his check up, to what’s necessary. 
Just thought I’d ask here so I didn’t have to wait. With his teething he really needs a good chew on something, so I thought a bone?? 

Thanks 😊


----------



## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

Lisy Lou 41 said:


> you may not know what the science diet dog biscuits were.


You did say that which is why I finally twigged when re-reading. What you're calling biscuits, I call kibble .

When I think of biscuits, coming from someone outside the US, I think crackers or, in this case, treats, so that was my misunderstanding.

So, if I'm still following you now, what you're really looking for is a chew primarily to help with the teething?

As a preface, I feed some cooked food as toppers, but I'm not versed in raw feeding at all. I mention that because I don't know if raw bones are recommended as a teething chew. I used commercial chews designed for puppies such a Nylabones or Kong toys, always supervised.

I'm sure you get additional info from the others.


----------



## Raindrops (Mar 24, 2019)

You can use raw bones for teething but I'm just not super sure about sizing for a toy poodle pup. Lamb ribs might be fine.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Rose n Poos said:


> You did say that which is why I finally twigged when re-reading. What you're calling biscuits, I call kibble .
> 
> When I think of biscuits, coming from someone outside the US, I think crackers or, in this case, treats, so that was my misunderstanding.
> 
> ...


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Yes I’m sorry I forget that we are on a global site here and have different language. 😆 

Great. Thank you for all your help with this. And yes I have the kong too, treats, big he still goes for the table legs to chew on! So trying avoid, stick, bark and table legs with other things.
I have been giving him turkey and beef chews/tendons. Things like that. 
However I’ll chat with my vet on bones I think. Cheers 🥂


----------



## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

To discourage chewing on not-to-be-chewed items, something like a bitter apple spray such as Grannick's Bitter Apple spray is an option. Not sure of the international availability of this brand but there should be something similar. This spray can be used to discourage chewing on things like table legs. It's colorless, odorless, non-toxic and usually non staining. 
It does have a terrible taste and when a pup tries to mouth or bite something sprayed with it, most will step back with a funny look, and usually leave the object alone. It's a tool to help keep the pup directed to appropriate chewing objects. 
This won't help with teething but it might help the table legs .


----------



## Rose n Poos (Sep 22, 2017)

I usually ignore the Recommended Reading list below the posts but in this case, there are two below that are short in length. One specifically address raw bones for toys








Raw Meaty Bones for Toys


Hey All, Just wondering what kind of RMBs people give to their toy poodles. Someone gave Gizmo a raw goat bone while he was staying with my parents for a weekend, so I'm not sure what happened exactly but apparently he threw up and had diarrhea. When I got him back he was really sick and after...




www.poodleforum.com





and the other mentions teething, but not the pup's size








for raw feeders: what exactly is a "raw meaty...


I've been trying to find out and have seen so many lists (Turkey Necks, Chicken Backs, Pork Necks, etc etc) but do I actually leave the meat on those bones? Or pull it off and give them the bones with only a bit of meat on them? Can other bones (such as pork ribs perhaps?) be given too, or are...




www.poodleforum.com





In the US, not many vets are onboard with raw feeding. I don't know if they might be more openminded elsewhere. Still, checking with your vet is a good idea. Could you possibly just place a phone call to ask? That way, you may not need to wait.


----------



## fjm (Jun 4, 2010)

I recommend dogaware.com as a very helpful site if you are feeding a homemade diet, whether raw or cooked. There are an awful lot of anecdotes, assumptions and pseudo-science floating around the internet, so it is always worth looking for information that is based on solid research.

To get back to your original question, I think your pup would be fine with half a chicken wing. I fed them to my toy dogs for years with no problems. They are fairly high in calcium, although less so than other chicken joints (around 2% on a dry matter basis), so if you feed half a wing for supper twice a week that would help to balance the lack of calcium in the plain chicken meat. Wings are soft, and non-weight bearing, so can be safely chewed. Avoid bigger, stronger bones - they can be too hard and can crack teeth - and never, ever feed cooked bones, of course.

If you are feeding homemade raw or cooked that is more than 15-20% of total calories you really need to do your research to ensure it is balanced, and meets your puppy's needs. The usual basic advice is 80% muscle meat, 10% bone, 10% offal (of which half, or 5% of the total diet, should be liver). If you don't feed any bone you need to balance the phosphorus in the meats by adding calcium - 1 level teaspoonful of finely ground eggshell per kilo meat, or a carefully calculated amount of an appropriate calcium supplement. If your puppy is happily eating the Science Diet I would just add a little chicken as a topper - about 10% would be enough to make it more interesting without upsetting the balance too much. I freeze it in ice cube trays, and just defrost the amount I need each day.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

fjm said:


> I recommend dogaware.com as a very helpful site if you are feeding a homemade diet, whether raw or cooked. There are an awful lot of anecdotes, assumptions and pseudo-science floating around the internet, so it is always worth looking for information that is based on solid research.
> 
> To get back to your original question, I think your pup would be fine with half a chicken wing. I fed them to my toy dogs for years with no problems. They are fairly high in calcium, although less so than other chicken joints (around 2% on a dry matter basis), so if you feed half a wing for supper twice a week that would help to balance the lack of calcium in the plain chicken meat. Wings are soft, and non-weight bearing, so can be safely chewed. Avoid bigger, stronger bones - they can be too hard and can crack teeth - and never, ever feed cooked bones, of course.
> 
> If you are feeding homemade raw or cooked that is more than 15-20% of total calories you really need to do your research to ensure it is balanced, and meets your puppy's needs. The usual basic advice is 80% muscle meat, 10% bone, 10% offal (of which half, or 5% of the total diet, should be liver). If you don't feed any bone you need to balance the phosphorus in the meats by adding calcium - 1 level teaspoonful of finely ground eggshell per kilo meat, or a carefully calculated amount of an appropriate calcium supplement. If your puppy is happily eating the Science Diet I would just add a little chicken as a topper - about 10% would be enough to make it more interesting without upsetting the balance too much. I freeze it in ice cube trays, and just defrost the amount I need each day.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Thank you tat is so helpful!
Yes I will do that in the ice cubes. 
And I’ve backed off a little of an evening on how much I’m giving him. Maybe him eat some Puppy supplement vet prescribed biscuits too.

Thanks again 🌻


----------



## PeggyTheParti (Sep 5, 2019)

To satisfy puppy Peggy's chewing needs, I offered her a wide variety of textures, and also had two clearly designated "chew areas." Maybe we just got lucky, but this approach seemed to work well.

Some examples:

Himalayan yak cheese chews
Frozen fruit (e.g. apple slice, banana chunk)
Frozen veggies (e.g. green bean, carrot)
Leafy veggies such as lettuce
Stuffed Kongs (frozen and not frozen)
Cardboard to shred
Nubby teething rings
Various stuffed animals
Old leather glove

Some of these require close supervision, of course. And you know your puppy best. Some, for example, could not be trusted to not consume cardboard. But I do strongly recommend variety.


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

PeggyTheParti said:


> To satisfy puppy Peggy's chewing needs, I offered her a wide variety of textures, and also had two clearly designated "chew areas." Maybe we just got lucky, but this approach seemed to work well.
> 
> Some examples:
> 
> ...


----------



## Lisy Lou 41 (Oct 4, 2020)

Thank you.
Yes I often give him the end of the toilet roll, which he plays with more so then I take it off him once his started dipping it up. But he loves this the best. 
There are always better alternatives to a table legs. His actually just stoped doing the legs. I also brought him a deer antler half. But still worrying with how hard it is and the teeth possibly cracking. I need someone to saw down the middle of it again so it’s completely open. So he can eat the marrow out.

So many things! But I know now bones aren’t a must if they are getting it in their dry food. 

Thank you.


----------



## My Girl Sophie (Mar 4, 2017)

Chicken allergy is common in dogs. My poodle has a very bad one.


----------



## Skylar (Jul 29, 2016)

Lisy Lou 41 said:


> I also brought him a deer antler half. But still worrying with how hard it is and the teeth possibly cracking. I need someone to saw down the middle of it again so it’s completely open. So he can eat the marrow out.


 my vet said not to give my dog anything hard such as deer antlers to chew because he has had quite a few dogs in his practice break their teeth. We have also had member whose dogs have broken teeth chewing bone (look up Mollymuima’s Molly). He said if I can’t dent something easily with a finger nail, don’t give it to my dog. Sadly there’s very little regulation or safety inspections with pet products which is why you see all kinds of inappropriate products sold. 

I give my dog pizzle sticks (aka bully sticks).


----------



## CT Girl (Nov 17, 2010)

I feed my toy raw. For bone I exclusively give him chicken neck. If you get chicken necks from the market or a good quality dog store they already have the thyroid removed. Chicken wings are too dense for my toy, duck and turkey necks are also too dense. Neck are the perfect size. I feed commercial raw. When I give Swizzle a neck I also give him a little muscle meat (usually ground heart and gizzard) so his stools do not get too hard. I have not heard good things about Science Diet. Most vets have little to no education on diet and what they do know is propaganda from dog food companies. I also will occasionally give him a chicken foot as the collagen is good for the patellas. I do not give him antler as I feel it is too hard and I don't want to have him chip a tooth. His teeth are beautiful - no tartar. The vet always tries to luxate his patellas - she said he was the only toy poodle she has been where his patellas do not luxate at all. Some vets will try and talk you out of raw. I had a somewhat heated (on his part) discussion as he spouted a bunch of old wives tales why Alpo and such is superior to raw. What a load of nonsense! It is akin to claiming MCDonalds is superior to a diet of fresh meat and vegetables. I would encourage you to feed exclusively raw commercial raw is what I choose so I don't worry that he is getting a balanced diet. Lots of bully's too to chew on. My dog is ten and he could do a toothpaste ad.


----------



## rock55 (Aug 31, 2019)

Lisy Lou 41 said:


> Can I give my 4.5 month old toy poodle a raw cut up chicken wing so he can have his first bone? I’ve been very nervous about giving him a raw bone but he needs this for the teeth.
> 
> he eats a raw meat diet anyway and is very healthy
> Thanks


That is fine as long as it is appropriately sized and done in moderation. Moderation esp at first if your dog has never had bone before.


----------



## kontiki (Apr 6, 2013)

My Spoo was eating raw bone in chicken at the age of 5 months. Make sure the chicken is as healthy as possible and very fresh. If you can get organic that is even better. Always read the ingredients. It has to be just chicken. If it says with retained water that is ok. But Never Ever with Solution which contains salt and sometimes other chemicals!

Never cooked bone, as it splinters. I would suggest starting out by holding on to one end of the bone, or wing, while your pup chews on it until they know what they are doing. Otherwise they might actually swallow it whole. (The first time I gave my Spoo pup a chicken leg without holding on to it he swallowed it whole and looked so surprised! I was shocked, but then he harked it back up and then carefully started chewing it up.) My Spoo has always choked on necks, so I no longer feed them, but does fine with wings, legs, thighs. When he got older, about a year, I gave him the entire chicken leg quarter, which is better because usually it is cut to include some of the back and part of the liver. I still always stay in the same room with him when he eats.

Because he has been fed bone in raw I never had any problem with him chewing on things he shouldn't, like shoes, or destroying toys, etc. He got plenty of chewing exercise by chewing on what he is intended to. He is 11 now and still has some of his first stuffed animals. They are looking matted and rather ratty, but no destruction.

Stick with one meat only for a few weeks until they have adapted to that meat. If you start feeding several raw meats at once and they have a problem with one of them you will not know which one it is. Chicken is a good starter. 

A lot of people claim their dog is allergic to chicken, but you will almost always find their dog ate chicken in kibble or in treats, or was feed CAFO chicken, or chicken with added solution. I have never met anyone yet who fed a dog healthy organic raw chicken instead to start with, or even just healthy chicken, that had a problem. After my vet one time insisted I feed him kibble made with chicken my dog became very ill. Never again.

*Study up on feeding raw from really good sources before you continue!!*

It is very rare to find a vet that understands raw feeding, so unless you have a good holistic vet in your area you are not likely to get any good advice on raw feeding from them. Most of them have been trained by the dog food companies and will claim all sorts of terrible false things will happen and insist you not feed them raw!

Fortunately there is one vet here that runs sled dogs and feeds them raw so they will be winners, so when I had a problem with my vet (that made my spoo very ill), I went to him for advice, and also back to my breeder who had even better advice. 

You have a lucky puppy with a parent who wants the best best for fur baby and is willing to learn the right way! 
If my spoo could talk to you, and to your little one, he would so highly recommend a raw diet !


----------

